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devel / comp.sys.acorn.networking / Re: BT and the Copper Wire dump in favour of the Cable

SubjectAuthor
* BT and the Copper Wire dump in favour of the CableDave
+* Re: BT and the Copper Wire dump in favour of the CableChris Hughes
|+* Re: BT and the Copper Wire dump in favour of the CableNigel Reed
||`* Re: BT and the Copper Wire dump in favour of the CableChris Hughes
|| `- Re: BT and the Copper Wire dump in favour of the Cablecharles
|`* Re: BT and the Copper Wire dump in favour of the CableDave
| +* Re: BT and the Copper Wire dump in favour of the CableTheo
| |`- Re: BT and the Copper Wire dump in favour of the CableDavid Higton
| +* Re: BT and the Copper Wire dump in favour of the CableChris Hughes
| |`* Re: BT and the Copper Wire dump in favour of the CableSteve Fryatt
| | `* Re: BT and the Copper Wire dump in favour of the CableChris Hughes
| |  `* Re: BT and the Copper Wire dump in favour of the CableDave
| |   +* Re: BT and the Copper Wire dump in favour of the CableChris Hughes
| |   |`* Re: BT and the Copper Wire dump in favour of the CableDave
| |   | +- Re: BT and the Copper Wire dump in favour of the CableDoug Webb
| |   | +- Re: BT and the Copper Wire dump in favour of the CableDoug Webb
| |   | `- Re: BT and the Copper Wire dump in favour of the CableMartin
| |   `* Re: BT and the Copper Wire dump in favour of the CableSteve Fryatt
| |    +- Re: BT and the Copper Wire dump in favour of the CableDave
| |    +- Re: BT and the Copper Wire dump in favour of the CableDoug Webb
| |    `* Re: BT and the Copper Wire dump in favour of the CableDave Plowman (News)
| |     `* Re: BT and the Copper Wire dump in favour of the CableDavid Higton
| |      `* Re: BT and the Copper Wire dump in favour of the CableRussell Hafter News
| |       +* Re: BT and the Copper Wire dump in favour of the CableDavid Higton
| |       |+* Re: BT and the Copper Wire dump in favour of the CableTheo
| |       ||+- Re: BT and the Copper Wire dump in favour of the CableChris Hughes
| |       ||`* Re: BT and the Copper Wire dump in favour of the CableRussell Hafter News
| |       || `* Re: BT and the Copper Wire dump in favour of the CableSteve Fryatt
| |       ||  `* Re: BT and the Copper Wire dump in favour of the CableDoug Webb
| |       ||   `* Re: BT and the Copper Wire dump in favour of the CableTheo
| |       ||    `- Re: BT and the Copper Wire dump in favour of the CableDoug Webb
| |       |`- Re: BT and the Copper Wire dump in favour of the CableChris Hughes
| |       `* Re: BT and the Copper Wire dump in favour of the CableDave Plowman (News)
| |        `- Re: BT and the Copper Wire dump in favour of the CableDavid Higton
| `- Re: BT and the Copper Wire dump in favour of the CableTim Hill
`* Re: BT and the Copper Wire dump in favour of the CableChris Newman
 `* Re: BT and the Copper Wire dump in favour of the CableSteve Fryatt
  +* Re: BT and the Copper Wire dump in favour of the CableMartin
  |`* Re: BT and the Copper Wire dump in favour of the CableDave
  | +- Re: BT and the Copper Wire dump in favour of the CableDave
  | `- Re: BT and the Copper Wire dump in favour of the CableSteve Fryatt
  `* Re: BT and the Copper Wire dump in favour of the CableDave Plowman (News)
   +- Re: BT and the Copper Wire dump in favour of the CableTheo
   +* Re: BT and the Copper Wire dump in favour of the CableChris Hughes
   |`- Re: BT and the Copper Wire dump in favour of the CableDave Plowman (News)
   `* Re: BT and the Copper Wire dump in favour of the CableSteve Fryatt
    +- Re: BT and the Copper Wire dump in favour of the CableDave Plowman (News)
    `* Re: BT and the Copper Wire dump in favour of the CableChris Newman
     +- Re: BT and the Copper Wire dump in favour of the CableMartin
     +- Re: BT and the Copper Wire dump in favour of the CableBob Latham
     `* Re: BT and the Copper Wire dump in favour of the CableSteve Fryatt
      `* Re: BT and the Copper Wire dump in favour of the CableRussell Hafter News
       `* Re: BT and the Copper Wire dump in favour of the CableSteve Fryatt
        +- Re: BT and the Copper Wire dump in favour of the CableMartin
        `* Re: BT and the Copper Wire dump in favour of the CableRussell Hafter News
         `* Re: BT and the Copper Wire dump in favour of the CableSteve Fryatt
          `- Re: BT and the Copper Wire dump in favour of the CableDave

Pages:123
BT and the Copper Wire dump in favour of the Cable

<598bd51238dave@triffid.co.uk>

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https://www.novabbs.com/devel/article-flat.php?id=132&group=comp.sys.acorn.networking#132

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From: dav...@triffid.co.uk (Dave)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.acorn.networking
Subject: BT and the Copper Wire dump in favour of the Cable
Date: Mon, 15 Nov 2021 16:01:02 +0000 (GMT)
Organization: TLP
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 by: Dave - Mon, 15 Nov 2021 16:01 UTC

G'day folks,
I've been trying to read up about the BT move (Now in action) to dump
copper wire connections and only have cable, but the info I've read is not
very illuminating.

I'm wondering if anyone here can illuminate a couple of points for me?

1) If they use FTTC and the BT cabinet is some way down the road as it is
here, How do they then connect to my house?

2) If they connect FTTP and bring the cable right to the wall of my house,
what happens from their (I guess junction box) to connect inside the house
to the Networking Router and phones?

Thanks
Dave

--

Dave Triffid

Re: BT and the Copper Wire dump in favour of the Cable

<bfb8d68b59.chris@mytarbis.plus.com>

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From: new...@noonehere.co.uk (Chris Hughes)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.acorn.networking
Subject: Re: BT and the Copper Wire dump in favour of the Cable
Date: Mon, 15 Nov 2021 16:19:03 GMT
Organization: A noiseless patient Spider
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 by: Chris Hughes - Mon, 15 Nov 2021 16:19 UTC

In message <598bd51238dave@triffid.co.uk>
Dave <dave@triffid.co.uk> wrote:

> G'day folks,
> I've been trying to read up about the BT move (Now in action) to dump
> copper wire connections and only have cable, but the info I've read is not
> very illuminating.

> I'm wondering if anyone here can illuminate a couple of points for me?

> 1) If they use FTTC and the BT cabinet is some way down the road as it is
> here, How do they then connect to my house?

Exactly the same as now, the only difference will be that your phone
service if you choose to keep it will be supplied as VoIP (Voice over
Internet Protocol), and in the majority of cases you should be able to
retain your existing phone number. So basically it means your phone calls
go via the internet instead. (longer term is that your phone number
including what was called your STD code will stay with you even if you
move to another part of the UK, so its been said)

If you do not want broadband at all, they will supply a very basic VoIP
service with a 0.5Mb internet connection via your existing line.

> 2) If they connect FTTP and bring the cable right to the wall of my house,
> what happens from their (I guess junction box) to connect inside the house
> to the Networking Router and phones?

They fit what is called ONT to your property and your fibre router with
VoIP facility is connected to that (there will be a digital VoIP socket on
the router to plug your phone in to).

If its Virgin Cable its done bit differently.

--
Chris Hughes

Re: BT and the Copper Wire dump in favour of the Cable

<20211115104427.6b7798db@wibble.sysadmininc.com>

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From: sys...@endofthelinebbs.com (Nigel Reed)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.acorn.networking
Subject: Re: BT and the Copper Wire dump in favour of the Cable
Date: Mon, 15 Nov 2021 10:44:27 -0600
Organization: End Of The Line BBS
Message-ID: <20211115104427.6b7798db@wibble.sysadmininc.com>
References: <598bd51238dave@triffid.co.uk>
<bfb8d68b59.chris@mytarbis.plus.com>
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 by: Nigel Reed - Mon, 15 Nov 2021 16:44 UTC

On Mon, 15 Nov 2021 16:19:03 GMT
Chris Hughes <news13@noonehere.co.uk> wrote:

> In message <598bd51238dave@triffid.co.uk>
> Dave <dave@triffid.co.uk> wrote:
>
> > G'day folks,
> > I've been trying to read up about the BT move (Now in action) to
> > dump copper wire connections and only have cable, but the info I've
> > read is not very illuminating.
>
> > I'm wondering if anyone here can illuminate a couple of points for
> > me?
>
> > 1) If they use FTTC and the BT cabinet is some way down the road as
> > it is here, How do they then connect to my house?
>
> Exactly the same as now, the only difference will be that your phone
> service if you choose to keep it will be supplied as VoIP (Voice over
> Internet Protocol), and in the majority of cases you should be able
> to retain your existing phone number. So basically it means your
> phone calls go via the internet instead. (longer term is that your
> phone number including what was called your STD code will stay with
> you even if you move to another part of the UK, so its been said)
>
> If you do not want broadband at all, they will supply a very basic
> VoIP service with a 0.5Mb internet connection via your existing line.
>
> > 2) If they connect FTTP and bring the cable right to the wall of my
> > house, what happens from their (I guess junction box) to connect
> > inside the house to the Networking Router and phones?
>
> They fit what is called ONT to your property and your fibre router
> with VoIP facility is connected to that (there will be a digital VoIP
> socket on the router to plug your phone in to).

Keep in mind if the power goes out, you need to have your ONT on
battery backup otherwise you have no phone service, and your days of
calling bulletin boards is over and done. Modems do not work well over
voip.

--
End Of The Line BBS - Plano, TX
telnet endofthelinebbs.com 23

Re: BT and the Copper Wire dump in favour of the Cable

<f741dc8b59.chris@mytarbis.plus.com>

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From: new...@noonehere.co.uk (Chris Hughes)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.acorn.networking
Subject: Re: BT and the Copper Wire dump in favour of the Cable
Date: Mon, 15 Nov 2021 17:19:31 GMT
Organization: A noiseless patient Spider
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 by: Chris Hughes - Mon, 15 Nov 2021 17:19 UTC

In message <20211115104427.6b7798db@wibble.sysadmininc.com>
Nigel Reed <sysop@endofthelinebbs.com> wrote:

> On Mon, 15 Nov 2021 16:19:03 GMT
> Chris Hughes <news13@noonehere.co.uk> wrote:

>> In message <598bd51238dave@triffid.co.uk>
>> Dave <dave@triffid.co.uk> wrote:
>>
>>> G'day folks,
>>> I've been trying to read up about the BT move (Now in action) to
>>> dump copper wire connections and only have cable, but the info I've
>>> read is not very illuminating.
>>
>>> I'm wondering if anyone here can illuminate a couple of points for
>>> me?
>>
>>> 1) If they use FTTC and the BT cabinet is some way down the road as
>>> it is here, How do they then connect to my house?
>>
>> Exactly the same as now, the only difference will be that your phone
>> service if you choose to keep it will be supplied as VoIP (Voice over
>> Internet Protocol), and in the majority of cases you should be able
>> to retain your existing phone number. So basically it means your
>> phone calls go via the internet instead. (longer term is that your
>> phone number including what was called your STD code will stay with
>> you even if you move to another part of the UK, so its been said)
>>
>> If you do not want broadband at all, they will supply a very basic
>> VoIP service with a 0.5Mb internet connection via your existing line.
>>
>>> 2) If they connect FTTP and bring the cable right to the wall of my
>>> house, what happens from their (I guess junction box) to connect
>>> inside the house to the Networking Router and phones?
>>
>> They fit what is called ONT to your property and your fibre router
>> with VoIP facility is connected to that (there will be a digital VoIP
>> socket on the router to plug your phone in to).

> Keep in mind if the power goes out, you need to have your ONT on
> battery backup otherwise you have no phone service, and your days of
> calling bulletin boards is over and done. Modems do not work well over
> voip.

If you are on the ISP's vunerable users list, you will be provided with a
backup battery (ofcom requirement I understand), otherwise you have to
provide your own.

They have assumed if the line goes down you will have a mobile to carry on
with.

--
Chris Hughes

Re: BT and the Copper Wire dump in favour of the Cable

<598bdfcf9dcharles@candehope.me.uk>

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From: char...@candehope.me.uk (charles)
Subject: Re: BT and the Copper Wire dump in favour of the Cable
Newsgroups: comp.sys.acorn.networking
Date: Mon, 15 Nov 2021 17:58:21 +0000 (GMT)
Message-ID: <598bdfcf9dcharles@candehope.me.uk>
References: <598bd51238dave@triffid.co.uk> <bfb8d68b59.chris@mytarbis.plus.com> <20211115104427.6b7798db@wibble.sysadmininc.com> <f741dc8b59.chris@mytarbis.plus.com>
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 by: charles - Mon, 15 Nov 2021 17:58 UTC

In article <f741dc8b59.chris@mytarbis.plus.com>,
Chris Hughes <news13@noonehere.co.uk> wrote:
> In message <20211115104427.6b7798db@wibble.sysadmininc.com>
> Nigel Reed <sysop@endofthelinebbs.com> wrote:

> > On Mon, 15 Nov 2021 16:19:03 GMT
> > Chris Hughes <news13@noonehere.co.uk> wrote:

> >> In message <598bd51238dave@triffid.co.uk>
> >> Dave <dave@triffid.co.uk> wrote:
> >>
> >>> G'day folks,
> >>> I've been trying to read up about the BT move (Now in action) to
> >>> dump copper wire connections and only have cable, but the info I've
> >>> read is not very illuminating.
> >>
> >>> I'm wondering if anyone here can illuminate a couple of points for
> >>> me?
> >>
> >>> 1) If they use FTTC and the BT cabinet is some way down the road as
> >>> it is here, How do they then connect to my house?
> >>
> >> Exactly the same as now, the only difference will be that your phone
> >> service if you choose to keep it will be supplied as VoIP (Voice over
> >> Internet Protocol), and in the majority of cases you should be able
> >> to retain your existing phone number. So basically it means your
> >> phone calls go via the internet instead. (longer term is that your
> >> phone number including what was called your STD code will stay with
> >> you even if you move to another part of the UK, so its been said)
> >>
> >> If you do not want broadband at all, they will supply a very basic
> >> VoIP service with a 0.5Mb internet connection via your existing line.
> >>
> >>> 2) If they connect FTTP and bring the cable right to the wall of my
> >>> house, what happens from their (I guess junction box) to connect
> >>> inside the house to the Networking Router and phones?
> >>
> >> They fit what is called ONT to your property and your fibre router
> >> with VoIP facility is connected to that (there will be a digital VoIP
> >> socket on the router to plug your phone in to).

> > Keep in mind if the power goes out, you need to have your ONT on
> > battery backup otherwise you have no phone service, and your days of
> > calling bulletin boards is over and done. Modems do not work well over
> > voip.

> If you are on the ISP's vunerable users list, you will be provided with a
> backup battery (ofcom requirement I understand), otherwise you have to
> provide your own.

> They have assumed if the line goes down you will have a mobile to carry on
> with.

Rash assumption. I rely on my mobile picking up my wifi to get a connection
indoors. Yes, I could go outside to find a signal, but that's not much use
for incoming calls.

--
from KT24 in Surrey, England
"I'd rather die of exhaustion than die of boredom" Thomas Carlyle

Re: BT and the Copper Wire dump in favour of the Cable

<598be5c758dave@triffid.co.uk>

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Path: i2pn2.org!i2pn.org!news.swapon.de!fu-berlin.de!uni-berlin.de!individual.net!not-for-mail
From: dav...@triffid.co.uk (Dave)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.acorn.networking
Subject: Re: BT and the Copper Wire dump in favour of the Cable
Date: Mon, 15 Nov 2021 19:03:31 +0000 (GMT)
Organization: TLP
Lines: 59
Message-ID: <598be5c758dave@triffid.co.uk>
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 by: Dave - Mon, 15 Nov 2021 19:03 UTC

In article <bfb8d68b59.chris@mytarbis.plus.com>,
Chris Hughes <news13@noonehere.co.uk> wrote:
> In message <598bd51238dave@triffid.co.uk>
> Dave <dave@triffid.co.uk> wrote:

> > G'day folks, I've been trying to read up about the BT move (Now in
> > action) to dump copper wire connections and only have cable, but the
> > info I've read is not very illuminating.

> > I'm wondering if anyone here can illuminate a couple of points for me?

> > 1) If they use FTTC and the BT cabinet is some way down the road as it
> > is here, How do they then connect to my house?

> Exactly the same as now, the only difference will be that your phone
> service if you choose to keep it will be supplied as VoIP (Voice over
> Internet Protocol), and in the majority of cases you should be able to
> retain your existing phone number. So basically it means your phone
> calls go via the internet instead. (longer term is that your phone
> number including what was called your STD code will stay with you even
> if you move to another part of the UK, so its been said)

> If you do not want broadband at all, they will supply a very basic VoIP
> service with a 0.5Mb internet connection via your existing line.

Thanks Chris,
There's a pole in the pavement about 50 metres down the road from which a
copper cable runs to my front Gable, so you are saying with FFTC (The
cabinet is way down the road) the connection will continue through that
Copper cable as it now is?

We already have broadband (Not BT) that comes down the copper cable as
does the phone...

We do not have any Fibre cable stuff at all.

> > 2) If they connect FTTP and bring the cable right to the wall of my
> > house, what happens from their (I guess junction box) to connect
> > inside the house to the Networking Router and phones?

> They fit what is called ONT to your property and your fibre router with
> VoIP facility is connected to that (there will be a digital VoIP socket
> on the router to plug your phone in to).

Mmnnn! The front of the house is where the copper cable comes inside to
the master socket, the office is at the back of the house and the copper
cable runs under the floors for 18 metres where its socket is connected to
the phone and Modem Router (TP-Link Archer VR2800).

How will the office modem router connect to the whatever, where the fibre
cable comes into the front of the house and ONT?

Thanks
Dave

--

Dave Triffid

Re: BT and the Copper Wire dump in favour of the Cable

<bPf*QAlzy@news.chiark.greenend.org.uk>

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From: theom+n...@chiark.greenend.org.uk (Theo)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.acorn.networking
Subject: Re: BT and the Copper Wire dump in favour of the Cable
Date: 15 Nov 2021 22:09:45 +0000 (GMT)
Organization: University of Cambridge, England
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Originator: theom@chiark.greenend.org.uk ([212.13.197.229])
 by: Theo - Mon, 15 Nov 2021 22:09 UTC

Dave <dave@triffid.co.uk> wrote:
> Thanks Chris,
> There's a pole in the pavement about 50 metres down the road from which a
> copper cable runs to my front Gable, so you are saying with FFTC (The
> cabinet is way down the road) the connection will continue through that
> Copper cable as it now is?
>
> We already have broadband (Not BT) that comes down the copper cable as
> does the phone...
>
> We do not have any Fibre cable stuff at all.

There are two things currently going on:

1) On FTTC, replacing the analogue voice connection with VOIP. This means
instead of plugging a phone into your wall socket, you plug it into your
ISP's router. That means you have to use your ISP's router (unless you move
to a third party VOIP service). You're still using the copper wire for
broadband.

2) Replacing the copper wire with an optical fibre into your house - that's
FTTP.

Both are happening - BT, Sky and others are moving FTTC customers en masse
to VOIP, while FTTP is getting installed in select areas (on a street by
street basis). There are also various third party companies ('altnets')
installing FTTP on their own terms, not via BT/Openreach.

> Mmnnn! The front of the house is where the copper cable comes inside to
> the master socket, the office is at the back of the house and the copper
> cable runs under the floors for 18 metres where its socket is connected to
> the phone and Modem Router (TP-Link Archer VR2800).
>
> How will the office modem router connect to the whatever, where the fibre
> cable comes into the front of the house and ONT?

This is a tour of the Openreach FTTP installation process. It's a bit long
but the details may be of interest:
https://www.ispreview.co.uk/index.php/2021/06/video-virtual-tour-of-fttp-broadband-with-bt-and-openreach.html
(the domestic part is at the end, at about 32 minutes)

In short, they won't necessarily use the existing cable run. There will be
a wire drop off the pole, probably to your gable. It'll run down the house
to the ground, where there's an inspection cover (so they can fix faults
from outside your property). Then a fibre pigtail will run inside to the ONT.

You'll need to find a site for the ONT, typically on an internal wall, which
will require a nearby power socket. You can:

a) mount the ONT somewhere near the fibre ingress, and then run ethernet
onwards to your router.

b) ask Openreach to run the fibre cable on the outside and come in the rear

c) accept a), and then buy your own fibre extension cable and unofficially
extend the fibre internally. Be prepared to put things back to how they
were installed if you have a fault.

You can pay for a 'premium' install for an extra £40 and they will do more
internal wiring etc - IMHO this is well worth doing:
https://www.ispreview.co.uk/index.php/2020/08/openreach-launch-new-uk-fttp-premium-connection-service.html

Theo

Re: BT and the Copper Wire dump in favour of the Cable

<e57ffb8b59.DaveMeUK@BeagleBoard-xM>

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From: dav...@davehigton.me.uk (David Higton)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.acorn.networking
Subject: Re: BT and the Copper Wire dump in favour of the Cable
Date: Mon, 15 Nov 2021 23:00:46 GMT
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 by: David Higton - Mon, 15 Nov 2021 23:00 UTC

In message <bPf*QAlzy@news.chiark.greenend.org.uk>
Theo <theom+news@chiark.greenend.org.uk> wrote:

> There are two things currently going on:
>
> 1) On FTTC, replacing the analogue voice connection with VOIP. This means
> instead of plugging a phone into your wall socket, you plug it into your
> ISP's router. That means you have to use your ISP's router (unless you
> move to a third party VOIP service). You're still using the copper wire
> for broadband.

Our service was changed over exactly like this a week or so ago. Very
anticlimactic, as it should be - just unplug the phone cable from the
wall socket and plug it into the back of the router instead. The land
line works as it always did, with the caveat mentioned elsewhere about
loss of phone service if/when mains power is lost.

David

Re: BT and the Copper Wire dump in favour of the Cable

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From: new...@noonehere.co.uk (Chris Hughes)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.acorn.networking
Subject: Re: BT and the Copper Wire dump in favour of the Cable
Date: Mon, 15 Nov 2021 23:10:51 GMT
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 by: Chris Hughes - Mon, 15 Nov 2021 23:10 UTC

In message <598be5c758dave@triffid.co.uk>
Dave <dave@triffid.co.uk> wrote:

> In article <bfb8d68b59.chris@mytarbis.plus.com>,
> Chris Hughes <news13@noonehere.co.uk> wrote:
>> In message <598bd51238dave@triffid.co.uk>
>> Dave <dave@triffid.co.uk> wrote:

>>> G'day folks, I've been trying to read up about the BT move (Now in
>>> action) to dump copper wire connections and only have cable, but the
>>> info I've read is not very illuminating.

>>> I'm wondering if anyone here can illuminate a couple of points for me?

>>> 1) If they use FTTC and the BT cabinet is some way down the road as it
>>> is here, How do they then connect to my house?

>> Exactly the same as now, the only difference will be that your phone
>> service if you choose to keep it will be supplied as VoIP (Voice over
>> Internet Protocol), and in the majority of cases you should be able to
>> retain your existing phone number. So basically it means your phone
>> calls go via the internet instead. (longer term is that your phone
>> number including what was called your STD code will stay with you even
>> if you move to another part of the UK, so its been said)

>> If you do not want broadband at all, they will supply a very basic VoIP
>> service with a 0.5Mb internet connection via your existing line.

> Thanks Chris,
> There's a pole in the pavement about 50 metres down the road from which a
> copper cable runs to my front Gable, so you are saying with FFTC (The
> cabinet is way down the road) the connection will continue through that
> Copper cable as it now is?

yes you will use the current configuarion, until they get round to do the
full fibre to your premises at some point in the next few years

> We already have broadband (Not BT) that comes down the copper cable as
> does the phone...

Does not matter which ISP you with, they will/are already moving over to
the new system in some parts of the UK already.

> We do not have any Fibre cable stuff at all.

The fibre you have currently will be from the exchange to the cabinet
hence why its called (F)ibre (T)o (T)he (C)abinet

>>> 2) If they connect FTTP and bring the cable right to the wall of my
>>> house, what happens from their (I guess junction box) to connect
>>> inside the house to the Networking Router and phones?

>> They fit what is called ONT to your property and your fibre router with
>> VoIP facility is connected to that (there will be a digital VoIP socket
>> on the router to plug your phone in to).

> Mmnnn! The front of the house is where the copper cable comes inside to
> the master socket, the office is at the back of the house and the copper
> cable runs under the floors for 18 metres where its socket is connected to
> the phone and Modem Router (TP-Link Archer VR2800).

The Master socket will be redundant when you get FTTP and also redundant
when you get VoIP either way. The will install the ONT inside your
property (needs to be close to a power socket) and might well be prepared
to run fibre to your back office.

> How will the office modem router connect to the whatever, where the fibre
> cable comes into the front of the house and ONT?

via a fibre cable normally and ethernet cable

--
Chris Hughes

Re: BT and the Copper Wire dump in favour of the Cable

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From: new...@stevefryatt.org.uk (Steve Fryatt)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.acorn.networking
Subject: Re: BT and the Copper Wire dump in favour of the Cable
Date: Tue, 16 Nov 2021 00:31:04 +0000
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 by: Steve Fryatt - Tue, 16 Nov 2021 00:31 UTC

On 15 Nov, Chris Hughes wrote in message
<466cfc8b59.chris@mytarbis.plus.com>:

> In message <598be5c758dave@triffid.co.uk>
> Dave <dave@triffid.co.uk> wrote:
>
> > We do not have any Fibre cable stuff at all.
>
> The fibre you have currently will be from the exchange to the cabinet
> hence why its called (F)ibre (T)o (T)he (C)abinet

Unless Dave's on ADSL -- which is quite possible -- in which case he won't
currently have fibre anywhere between his house and the exchange. I'd assume
that the upgrade would then be to FTTC unless the street has been fibred.

> > Mmnnn! The front of the house is where the copper cable comes inside to
> > the master socket, the office is at the back of the house and the copper
> > cable runs under the floors for 18 metres where its socket is connected
> > to the phone and Modem Router (TP-Link Archer VR2800).
>
> The Master socket will be redundant when you get FTTP

....but not FTTC...

> and also redundant when you get VoIP either way.

Surely with FTTC, the whatever-the-modem-bit-is-called will still plug into
the master socket?

> The will install the ONT inside your property (needs to be close to a
> power socket) and might well be prepared to run fibre to your back office.

They'll run fibre to wherever they put the ONT, and no further: the ONT
turns fibre into CAT5 (or whatever), which then runs on to where you need
it. How far from the point of ingress they'll put the ONT is a matter for
"negotiation" with the installer, and may depend on what installation
package you've gone for.

That said, remember that the fibre is fragile and doesn't like being formed
into tight curves around corners. Keeping the internal run short and
switching to CAT5 early on is probably advisable. If there's a longish run,
through walls or under floorboards, I'd have thought that CAT5 (ie. after
the ONT) would be easier for that. That's certainly the approach here:
there's about 50cm of fibre to the ONT at the front of the house, then the
CAT5 runs off under the floorboards to the back of the house where the
"office" is.
> > How will the office modem router connect to the whatever, where the
> > fibre cable comes into the front of the house and ONT?
>
> via a fibre cable normally and ethernet cable

The fibre goes into the ONT, which is a box in and of itself. There will
then be CAT5 ("ethernet cable") from the ONT to your ISP's router, which is
a second box.

If you currently have a modem/router for ADSL or FTTC, an FTTP router may
not be the same box as the one that you currently have: the modem has to be
disabled (or absent) so that the router can pass internet-bound data to the
ONT instead.

I've got FTTP here (there's over a mile of often waterlogged copper between
me and the FTTC cabinet, let alone the exchange, so ADSL and FTTC speeds
aren't good), and the router is a specific model that has the required
functionality. It does have an RJ11 socket for copper pair, but that is
turned off in the config and the ONT plugs into port 1 of the four ethernet
ports -- so the LAN only has three network ports on it, instead of four.

--
Steve Fryatt - Leeds, England

http://www.stevefryatt.org.uk/

Re: BT and the Copper Wire dump in favour of the Cable

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From: new...@noonehere.co.uk (Chris Hughes)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.acorn.networking
Subject: Re: BT and the Copper Wire dump in favour of the Cable
Date: Tue, 16 Nov 2021 09:37:17 GMT
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 by: Chris Hughes - Tue, 16 Nov 2021 09:37 UTC

In message <mpro.r2n2rn02jv2m70484.news@stevefryatt.org.uk>
Steve Fryatt <news@stevefryatt.org.uk> wrote:

> On 15 Nov, Chris Hughes wrote in message
> <466cfc8b59.chris@mytarbis.plus.com>:

>> In message <598be5c758dave@triffid.co.uk>
>> Dave <dave@triffid.co.uk> wrote:
>>
>>> We do not have any Fibre cable stuff at all.
>>
>> The fibre you have currently will be from the exchange to the cabinet
>> hence why its called (F)ibre (T)o (T)he (C)abinet

> Unless Dave's on ADSL -- which is quite possible -- in which case he won't
> currently have fibre anywhere between his house and the exchange. I'd assume
> that the upgrade would then be to FTTC unless the street has been fibred.

Agreed that is my understanding as well.

>>> Mmnnn! The front of the house is where the copper cable comes inside to
>>> the master socket, the office is at the back of the house and the copper
>>> cable runs under the floors for 18 metres where its socket is connected
>>> to the phone and Modem Router (TP-Link Archer VR2800).
>>
>> The Master socket will be redundant when you get FTTP

> ...but not FTTC...

I was answering the point re FTTP, but yes its still needed for FTTC.

>> and also redundant when you get VoIP either way.

> Surely with FTTC, the whatever-the-modem-bit-is-called will still plug into
> the master socket?

Not once the analogue phone service (PSTN) is switched off, it will then
be via your router for example the Smart Hub 2 has a VoIP socket for
digital voice (VoIP), until that time then the master socket is still used
for the old Phone (PSTN) service.

[snip]

--
Chris Hughes

Re: BT and the Copper Wire dump in favour of the Cable

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From: dav...@triffid.co.uk (Dave)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.acorn.networking
Subject: Re: BT and the Copper Wire dump in favour of the Cable
Date: Tue, 16 Nov 2021 14:37:08 +0000 (GMT)
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 by: Dave - Tue, 16 Nov 2021 14:37 UTC

In article <59c6358c59.chris@mytarbis.plus.com>,
Chris Hughes <news13@noonehere.co.uk> wrote:
> In message <mpro.r2n2rn02jv2m70484.news@stevefryatt.org.uk>
> Steve Fryatt <news@stevefryatt.org.uk> wrote:

> > On 15 Nov, Chris Hughes wrote in message
> > <466cfc8b59.chris@mytarbis.plus.com>:

> >> In message <598be5c758dave@triffid.co.uk>
> >> Dave <dave@triffid.co.uk> wrote:
> >>
> >>> We do not have any Fibre cable stuff at all.
> >>
> >> The fibre you have currently will be from the exchange to the cabinet
> >> hence why its called (F)ibre (T)o (T)he (C)abinet

> > Unless Dave's on ADSL -- which is quite possible -- in which case he
> > won't currently have fibre anywhere between his house and the
> > exchange. I'd assume that the upgrade would then be to FTTC unless the
> > street has been fibred.

> Agreed that is my understanding as well.

> >>> Mmnnn! The front of the house is where the copper cable comes inside
> >>> to the master socket, the office is at the back of the house and the
> >>> copper cable runs under the floors for 18 metres where its socket is
> >>> connected to the phone and Modem Router (TP-Link Archer VR2800).
> >>
> >> The Master socket will be redundant when you get FTTP

> > ...but not FTTC...

> I was answering the point re FTTP, but yes its still needed for FTTC.

> >> and also redundant when you get VoIP either way.

> > Surely with FTTC, the whatever-the-modem-bit-is-called will still plug
> > into the master socket?

> Not once the analogue phone service (PSTN) is switched off, it will then
> be via your router for example the Smart Hub 2 has a VoIP socket for
> digital voice (VoIP), until that time then the master socket is still
> used for the old Phone (PSTN) service.

> [snip]

I give up, I'm now more confused than I was before asking the two original
questions. :-(

Dave

--

Dave Triffid

Re: BT and the Copper Wire dump in favour of the Cable

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From: new...@noonehere.co.uk (Chris Hughes)
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Subject: Re: BT and the Copper Wire dump in favour of the Cable
Date: Tue, 16 Nov 2021 16:20:56 GMT
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 by: Chris Hughes - Tue, 16 Nov 2021 16:20 UTC

In message <598c513901dave@triffid.co.uk>
Dave <dave@triffid.co.uk> wrote:

> In article <59c6358c59.chris@mytarbis.plus.com>,
> Chris Hughes <news13@noonehere.co.uk> wrote:
>> In message <mpro.r2n2rn02jv2m70484.news@stevefryatt.org.uk>
>> Steve Fryatt <news@stevefryatt.org.uk> wrote:

>>> On 15 Nov, Chris Hughes wrote in message
>>> <466cfc8b59.chris@mytarbis.plus.com>:

>>>> In message <598be5c758dave@triffid.co.uk>
>>>> Dave <dave@triffid.co.uk> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> We do not have any Fibre cable stuff at all.
>>>>
>>>> The fibre you have currently will be from the exchange to the cabinet
>>>> hence why its called (F)ibre (T)o (T)he (C)abinet

>>> Unless Dave's on ADSL -- which is quite possible -- in which case he
>>> won't currently have fibre anywhere between his house and the
>>> exchange. I'd assume that the upgrade would then be to FTTC unless the
>>> street has been fibred.

>> Agreed that is my understanding as well.

>>>>> Mmnnn! The front of the house is where the copper cable comes inside
>>>>> to the master socket, the office is at the back of the house and the
>>>>> copper cable runs under the floors for 18 metres where its socket is
>>>>> connected to the phone and Modem Router (TP-Link Archer VR2800).
>>>>
>>>> The Master socket will be redundant when you get FTTP

>>> ...but not FTTC...

>> I was answering the point re FTTP, but yes its still needed for FTTC.

>>>> and also redundant when you get VoIP either way.

>>> Surely with FTTC, the whatever-the-modem-bit-is-called will still plug
>>> into the master socket?

>> Not once the analogue phone service (PSTN) is switched off, it will then
>> be via your router for example the Smart Hub 2 has a VoIP socket for
>> digital voice (VoIP), until that time then the master socket is still
>> used for the old Phone (PSTN) service.

>> [snip]

> I give up, I'm now more confused than I was before asking the two original
> questions. :-(

What is your current broadband service ADSL, FTTC (VDSL) or are you lucky
enough to have full fibre.

End of day nothing to worry about at the moment, unless you are changing
ISP in the next year and even then they will help explain your options

A couple of useful URL�s:
https://www.draytek.co.uk/support/guides/kb-openreach-sogea
https://www.zen.co.uk/blog/posts/zen-blog/2020/03/30/sogea-our-industry�s-next-great-shake-up

explains some of it mainly regarding impact on FTTC

--
Chris Hughes

Re: BT and the Copper Wire dump in favour of the Cable

<mpro.r2ogcz00sk0y4032w.news@stevefryatt.org.uk>

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From: new...@stevefryatt.org.uk (Steve Fryatt)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.acorn.networking
Subject: Re: BT and the Copper Wire dump in favour of the Cable
Date: Tue, 16 Nov 2021 18:22:16 +0000
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 by: Steve Fryatt - Tue, 16 Nov 2021 18:22 UTC

On 16 Nov, Dave wrote in message
<598c513901dave@triffid.co.uk>:

> In article <59c6358c59.chris@mytarbis.plus.com>,
> Chris Hughes <news13@noonehere.co.uk> wrote:
>
> > Not once the analogue phone service (PSTN) is switched off, it will then
> > be via your router for example the Smart Hub 2 has a VoIP socket for
> > digital voice (VoIP), until that time then the master socket is still
> > used for the old Phone (PSTN) service.
>
> > [snip]
>
> I give up, I'm now more confused than I was before asking the two original
> questions. :-(

It doesn't help that Chris's response above appears to have assumed than
when I wrote "whatever-the-modem-bit-is-called", I actually meant to write
"phone" -- when I definitely meant "whatever-the-modem-bit-is-called".

In summary, unless you go for FTTP, then after the removal of the POTS
service you will be on ADSL or FTTC, you will still have a modem/router just
as you do now, and that will still plug into a master socket, just as it
does now.

The difference will be that your home phone will plug into that modem/router
if the latter supports that, or into another box that you will connect to
your local network. Or, if you use cordless DECT phones, you could get a
modem/router that contains a DECT base station.

If you go for FTTP, then the fibre comes into your home and terminates in an
Optical Network Terminator (ONT). In my setup here, there's no pluggable
connection and the fibre is one solid length from the top of the telephone
pole, through the house wall and in to the ONT; Theo suggests that Openreach
might be improving on this, though (my installation is from 2018).

Old FTTP installations might have a copper pair alongside for the POTS
service (mine does) terminating in a standard master socket, but presumably
this will be withdrawn. Otherwise, the phone will plug into your ONT, your
router, or a box on your network -- just as for ADSL/FTTC. Or it will use
DECT, again as for ADSL/FTTC.

Hopefully that's clearer.

--
Steve Fryatt - Leeds, England

http://www.stevefryatt.org.uk/

Re: BT and the Copper Wire dump in favour of the Cable

<598c671bc0tim@invalid.org.uk>

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From: tim...@invalid.org.uk (Tim Hill)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.acorn.networking
Subject: Re: BT and the Copper Wire dump in favour of the Cable
Date: Tue, 16 Nov 2021 18:36:08 +0000 (GMT)
Organization: timil.com
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 by: Tim Hill - Tue, 16 Nov 2021 18:36 UTC

In article <598be5c758dave@triffid.co.uk>, Dave <dave@triffid.co.uk>
wrote:
> How will the office modem router connect to the whatever, where the
> fibre cable comes into the front of the house and ONT?

My internet router ended up in the kitchen where my cable enters and it's
connected to a homeplug; the gigabit switch in my study is connected to
another.

Re: BT and the Copper Wire dump in favour of the Cable

<598c6b3a21dave@triffid.co.uk>

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From: dav...@triffid.co.uk (Dave)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.acorn.networking
Subject: Re: BT and the Copper Wire dump in favour of the Cable
Date: Tue, 16 Nov 2021 19:21:08 +0000 (GMT)
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 by: Dave - Tue, 16 Nov 2021 19:21 UTC

In article <00bb5a8c59.chris@mytarbis.plus.com>,
Chris Hughes <news13@noonehere.co.uk> wrote:
> In message <598c513901dave@triffid.co.uk>
> Dave <dave@triffid.co.uk> wrote:

[Snip]

> > I give up, I'm now more confused than I was before asking the two
> > original questions. :-(

> What is your current broadband service ADSL, FTTC (VDSL) or are you
> lucky enough to have full fibre.

AFAICR. It's ADSL, and as mentioned in a previous posting, we have No
fibre cabling to or in this house.

> End of day nothing to worry about at the moment, unless you are changing
> ISP in the next year and even then they will help explain your options

Orpheus is our ISP and unless something happens at Richard's end, we'll be
with them long term.

> A couple of useful URL#s:
> https://www.draytek.co.uk/support/guides/kb-openreach-sogea
> https://www.zen.co.uk/blog/posts/zen-blog/2020/03/30/sogea-our-industry#s-next-great-shake-up

> explains some of it mainly regarding impact on FTTC

Thanks for the URLs.

I was out looking at things today, the FTTC is 100 or so yards along the
road, from where earlier this year the BT vomit men (Open Reach) ran a
fibre cable in the under pavement conduit to the manhole beside the 50
yard pole I previously mentioned, the cable then goes up the pole.

At the top of the pole the fibre cable goes into a new largish rectangular
black box.

Dave

--

Dave Triffid

Re: BT and the Copper Wire dump in favour of the Cable

<598c74d9cadave@triffid.co.uk>

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From: dav...@triffid.co.uk (Dave)
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Subject: Re: BT and the Copper Wire dump in favour of the Cable
Date: Tue, 16 Nov 2021 21:06:17 +0000 (GMT)
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 by: Dave - Tue, 16 Nov 2021 21:06 UTC

In article <mpro.r2ogcz00sk0y4032w.news@stevefryatt.org.uk>,
Steve Fryatt <news@stevefryatt.org.uk> wrote:
[Snippy]

> In summary, unless you go for FTTP, then after the removal of the POTS
> service you will be on ADSL or FTTC, you will still have a modem/router
> just as you do now, and that will still plug into a master socket, just
> as it does now.

> The difference will be that your home phone will plug into that
> modem/router if the latter supports that, or into another box that you
> will connect to your local network. Or, if you use cordless DECT phones,
> you could get a modem/router that contains a DECT base station.

> If you go for FTTP, then the fibre comes into your home and terminates
> in an Optical Network Terminator (ONT). In my setup here, there's no
> pluggable connection and the fibre is one solid length from the top of
> the telephone pole, through the house wall and in to the ONT; Theo
> suggests that Openreach might be improving on this, though (my
> installation is from 2018).

> Old FTTP installations might have a copper pair alongside for the POTS
> service (mine does) terminating in a standard master socket, but
> presumably this will be withdrawn. Otherwise, the phone will plug into
> your ONT, your router, or a box on your network -- just as for
> ADSL/FTTC. Or it will use DECT, again as for ADSL/FTTC.

> Hopefully that's clearer.

> Steve Fryatt - Leeds, England

Yes that makes it much clearer.

Thanks
Steve

Appreciated.

Dave

--

Dave Triffid

Re: BT and the Copper Wire dump in favour of the Cable

<107e798c59.dougjwebb@btinternet.com>

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From: doug.j.w...@btinternet.com (Doug Webb)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.acorn.networking
Subject: Re: BT and the Copper Wire dump in favour of the Cable
Date: Tue, 16 Nov 2021 21:56:57 GMT
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 by: Doug Webb - Tue, 16 Nov 2021 21:56 UTC

In message <598c6b3a21dave@triffid.co.uk>
Dave <dave@triffid.co.uk> wrote:

> Orpheus is our ISP and unless something happens at Richard's end, we'll be
> with them long term.

As I understand it from talking to Richard at the London show Orpheus will
be launching a Voip phone service so can have everything under one roof
:-)

--
Experience the future using ARM Technology - ARMBook,BeagleBoard -xM,
PandaBoard,Raspberry Pi,iMX6/ARMX6,IGEPv5 & Titanium powered by RISC OS
5.28.

Re: BT and the Copper Wire dump in favour of the Cable

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Newsgroups: comp.sys.acorn.networking
Subject: Re: BT and the Copper Wire dump in favour of the Cable
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 by: Doug Webb - Tue, 16 Nov 2021 22:02 UTC

In message <598c6b3a21dave@triffid.co.uk>
Dave <dave@triffid.co.uk> wrote:

> I was out looking at things today, the FTTC is 100 or so yards along the
> road, from where earlier this year the BT vomit men (Open Reach) ran a
> fibre cable in the under pavement conduit to the manhole beside the 50
> yard pole I previously mentioned, the cable then goes up the pole.

> At the top of the pole the fibre cable goes into a new largish rectangular
> black box.

Sounds like they are full fibring up your area, as they run fibre from the
cabinet to the distribution points along the network, so when it is live
then I guess a talk with Orpheus is called for as well.

--
Experience the future using ARM Technology - ARMBook,BeagleBoard -xM,
PandaBoard,Raspberry Pi,iMX6/ARMX6,IGEPv5 & Titanium powered by RISC OS
5.28.

Re: BT and the Copper Wire dump in favour of the Cable

<598c7b9717News03@avisoft.f9.co.uk>

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From: New...@avisoft.f9.co.uk (Martin)
Subject: Re: BT and the Copper Wire dump in favour of the Cable
Newsgroups: comp.sys.acorn.networking
Date: Tue, 16 Nov 2021 22:19:51 +0000 (GMT)
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 by: Martin - Tue, 16 Nov 2021 22:19 UTC

In article <598c6b3a21dave@triffid.co.uk>,
Dave <dave@triffid.co.uk> wrote:
> In article <00bb5a8c59.chris@mytarbis.plus.com>,
> Chris Hughes <news13@noonehere.co.uk> wrote:

[Snip]

> > What is your current broadband service ADSL, FTTC (VDSL) or are
> > you lucky enough to have full fibre.

> AFAICR. It's ADSL, and as mentioned in a previous posting, we have
> No fibre cabling to or in this house.

FTTC does not require fible cabling anywhare near the house. It is
only fibre up to the Cabinet, and the copper pair from there to the
house. If your download speed if less than about 20Mbit/sec then it is
likely to be ADSL, if faster then likely to be VDSL (ie FTTC)

[Snip]

> I was out looking at things today, the FTTC is 100 or so yards
> along the road, from where earlier this year the BT vomit men (Open
> Reach) ran a fibre cable in the under pavement conduit to the
> manhole beside the 50 yard pole I previously mentioned, the cable
> then goes up the pole.

> At the top of the pole the fibre cable goes into a new largish
> rectangular black box.

That sounds like preparations for FTTP.

Martin

--
Martin Avison
Note that unfortunately this email address will become invalid
without notice if (when) any spam is received.

Re: BT and the Copper Wire dump in favour of the Cable

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From: doug.j.w...@btinternet.com (Doug Webb)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.acorn.networking
Subject: Re: BT and the Copper Wire dump in favour of the Cable
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 by: Doug Webb - Tue, 16 Nov 2021 22:35 UTC

In message <mpro.r2ogcz00sk0y4032w.news@stevefryatt.org.uk>
Steve Fryatt <news@stevefryatt.org.uk> wrote:

[snip]

> Hopefully that's clearer.

That about covers it very well.

> Old FTTP installations might have a copper pair alongside for the POTS
> service (mine does) terminating in a standard master socket, but presumably
> this will be withdrawn

Yep, but it seems they still add in further confusion in some areas
depending on if it is a greenfield or brownfield deployed FTTP...

https://www.ispreview.co.uk/index.php/2020/09/clearing-up-confusion-over-the-bt-fttp-digital-voice-transition.html

Hopefully things have moved on since that article as they move to a full
stop sell of the old PSTN service by September 2023 ahead of full
withdrawal by December 2025.

In essence they will move you when your contract comes up for renewal or
you say move house post the September 2023 date so accelerating the move
across.

They will also stop sell before that date in Full Fibre areas once the 75%
penetration threshold is hit.

--
Experience the future using ARM Technology - ARMBook,BeagleBoard -xM,
PandaBoard,Raspberry Pi,iMX6/ARMX6,IGEPv5 & Titanium powered by RISC OS
5.28.

Re: BT and the Copper Wire dump in favour of the Cable

<598c889fb6dave@davenoise.co.uk>

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From: dav...@davenoise.co.uk (Dave Plowman (News))
Newsgroups: comp.sys.acorn.networking
Subject: Re: BT and the Copper Wire dump in favour of the Cable
Date: Wed, 17 Nov 2021 00:42:13 +0000 (GMT)
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 by: Dave Plowman (News) - Wed, 17 Nov 2021 00:42 UTC

In article <mpro.r2ogcz00sk0y4032w.news@stevefryatt.org.uk>,
Steve Fryatt <news@stevefryatt.org.uk> wrote:
> If you go for FTTP, then the fibre comes into your home and terminates in an
> Optical Network Terminator (ONT). In my setup here, there's no pluggable
> connection and the fibre is one solid length from the top of the telephone
> pole, through the house wall and in to the ONT; Theo suggests that Openreach
> might be improving on this, though (my installation is from 2018).

Next door went full fibre recently. She says they simply plugged their
existing house phone wiring into the new router, so all their cordless
base stations (4, I think) worked as before. The problem would likely be
with older phones that needed 48v DC and ringing volts.

--
*I'm not a complete idiot, some parts are missing *

Dave Plowman dave@davenoise.co.uk London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

Re: BT and the Copper Wire dump in favour of the Cable

<6ca4568d59.DaveMeUK@BeagleBoard-xM>

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From: dav...@davehigton.me.uk (David Higton)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.acorn.networking
Subject: Re: BT and the Copper Wire dump in favour of the Cable
Date: Thu, 18 Nov 2021 14:12:29 GMT
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 by: David Higton - Thu, 18 Nov 2021 14:12 UTC

In message <598c889fb6dave@davenoise.co.uk>
"Dave Plowman (News)" <dave@davenoise.co.uk> wrote:

> Next door went full fibre recently. She says they simply plugged their
> existing house phone wiring into the new router, so all their cordless
> base stations (4, I think) worked as before. The problem would likely be
> with older phones that needed 48v DC and ringing volts.

All analogue phones, and all DECT base stations that connect to analogue
phone lines, require the 48V DC and the ringing voltage. The DC is
required to signal on/off hook; the ringing voltage is to, well, cause
the "ringer" to "ring". So there's no difference, and no problem.

David

Re: BT and the Copper Wire dump in favour of the Cable

<598e0bbc44see.sig@russellhafter.me.invalid>

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From: see....@russellhafter.me.invalid (Russell Hafter News)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.acorn.networking
Subject: Re: BT and the Copper Wire dump in favour of the Cable
Date: Fri, 19 Nov 2021 23:10:31 +0000 (GMT)
Organization: Russell Hafter
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 by: Russell Hafter News - Fri, 19 Nov 2021 23:10 UTC

In article <6ca4568d59.DaveMeUK@BeagleBoard-xM>, David
Higton <dave@davehigton.me.uk> wrote:
> In message <598c889fb6dave@davenoise.co.uk> "Dave Plowman
> (News)" <dave@davenoise.co.uk> wrote:

> > Next door went full fibre recently. She says they
> > simply plugged their existing house phone wiring into
> > the new router, so all their cordless base stations (4,
> > I think) worked as before. The problem would likely be
> > with older phones that needed 48v DC and ringing volts.

> All analogue phones, and all DECT base stations that
> connect to analogue phone lines, require the 48V DC and
> the ringing voltage. The DC is required to signal on/off
> hook; the ringing voltage is to, well, cause the "ringer"
> to "ring". So there's no difference, and no problem.

I have been trying to get my head around this too.

I understand that in future I can plug a phone into an
adaptor that plugs into the router (it does not have its own
adaptor built in).

How, though, do I connect the rest of the phone sockets in
the house to the system? I much prefer the sound quality of
a wired handset over a DECT one.

Another point that just seems to be completely ignored:- the
battery backup for router, adaptor, etc is, I believe,
considered to be OK if the power is off for just one hour.
Here we routinely have planned power cuts with the mains
power off for a full working day - 6 hours. Mobiles are
unusable for voice calls inside the house.

I have my own UPSs - but they usually do not last for
anything like 6 hours.

--
Russell
Russell Hafter
E-mail to russell at russellhafter dot me dot uk
Need a hotel? <http://www.hrs.com/?client=en__blue&customerId=416873103>
Friendly web hosting <https://www.xencentrichosting.uk/billing/aff.php?aff=7>

Re: BT and the Copper Wire dump in favour of the Cable

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From: dav...@davehigton.me.uk (David Higton)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.acorn.networking
Subject: Re: BT and the Copper Wire dump in favour of the Cable
Date: Fri, 19 Nov 2021 23:47:49 GMT
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 by: David Higton - Fri, 19 Nov 2021 23:47 UTC

In message <598e0bbc44see.sig@russellhafter.me.invalid>
Russell Hafter News <see.sig@russellhafter.me.invalid> wrote:

> In article <6ca4568d59.DaveMeUK@BeagleBoard-xM>, David Higton
> <dave@davehigton.me.uk> wrote:
> > In message <598c889fb6dave@davenoise.co.uk> "Dave Plowman (News)"
> > <dave@davenoise.co.uk> wrote:
>
> > > Next door went full fibre recently. She says they simply plugged their
> > > existing house phone wiring into the new router, so all their cordless
> > > base stations (4, I think) worked as before. The problem would likely
> > > be with older phones that needed 48v DC and ringing volts.
>
> > All analogue phones, and all DECT base stations that connect to analogue
> > phone lines, require the 48V DC and the ringing voltage. The DC is
> > required to signal on/off hook; the ringing voltage is to, well, cause
> > the "ringer" to "ring". So there's no difference, and no problem.
>
> I have been trying to get my head around this too.
>
> I understand that in future I can plug a phone into an adaptor that plugs
> into the router (it does not have its own adaptor built in).

I'd like to read some information about such an adaptor.

> How, though, do I connect the rest of the phone sockets in the house to the
> system?

That's a purely mechanical problem.

> I much prefer the sound quality of a wired handset over a DECT one.

I'd be interested to know if the up-market DECT handset that BT offer
can actually provide sound quality better than an analogue phone. It's
entirely possible, since BT tell you to pair it with the router (which
has a DECT base station in it), and it is in theory possible to get an
end to end connection via (for example) G.729a. DECT has a bandwidth
of 32 kb/s, so, *IF* it's not tied to the old ADPCM codec traditionally
used by DECT, that's enough for high quality audio.

Like I say, it's theoretical. I'd like to know if it can be done in
practice.

David

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