On 5/4/2021 5:12 PM, paul wrote:
> hounslow3@yahoo.co.uk wrote on 03.05.2021 20:18
>
>> See subject line.
>
> Apple keeps forgetting to test iOS for actively exploited security holes.
>
> If You Updated Your iPhone Recently, You Need To Do It Again, Stat
> https://www.insidehook.com/daily_brief/personal-tech/apple-ios-14-5-1-update
>
> "It was just a few days ago we were discussing why Apple users should update
> to iOS 14.5 for privacy enhancements (and there have been some non-critical
> issues with that - we'll get there). And a few weeks before that, we urged
> you to update to iOS 14.4.2 as part of a security fix.
>
> Unfortunately, you'll need to take a few long minutes to update again, and
> this one is, once again, a security issue."
>

iOS security issues (and ASODs/iOSODs) becoming far worse/more frequent
than WinOS issues (and BSODs) ever were.

On 5/4/21 5:46 PM, News wrote:
> On 5/4/2021 5:12 PM, paul wrote:
>> hounslow3@yahoo.co.uk wrote on 03.05.2021 20:18
>>
>>> See subject line.
>>
>> Apple keeps forgetting to test iOS for actively exploited security holes.
>>
>> If You Updated Your iPhone Recently, You Need To Do It Again, Stat
>> https://www.insidehook.com/daily_brief/personal-tech/apple-ios-14-5-1-update
>>
>>
>> "It was just a few days ago we were discussing why Apple users should
>> update
>> to iOS 14.5 for privacy enhancements (and there have been some
>> non-critical
>> issues with that - we'll get there). And a few weeks before that, we
>> urged
>> you to update to iOS 14.4.2 as part of a security fix.
>>
>> Unfortunately, you'll need to take a few long minutes to update again,
>> and
>> this one is, once again, a security issue."
>>
>
>
> iOS security issues (and ASODs/iOSODs) becoming far worse/more frequent
> than WinOS issues (and BSODs) ever were.

Yeah, so I guess we should all bag our iPhones and iPads then buy clunky
Android devices instead ;-)

--
Why is it that the people who want more government control over your
life are the same ones who want you to be disarmed?

Wade Garrett wrote on 04.05.2021 22:18

> Yeah, so I guess we should all bag our iPhones and iPads then buy clunky
> Android devices instead ;-)

Speaking of clunky iOS - at least Android doesn't have to update the entire
operating system every single time Google forgets to test any one component.
--
(If you understand that statement - you're probably somewhat intelligent.)
(If you don't understand it - then you're clueless of how clunky iOS is.)

paul <nospam@nospam.invalid> wrote:
> Wade Garrett wrote on 04.05.2021 22:18
>
>> Yeah, so I guess we should all bag our iPhones and iPads then buy clunky
>> Android devices instead ;-)
>
> Speaking of clunky iOS - at least Android doesn't have to update the entire
> operating system every single time Google forgets to test any one component.
>
How long before you start babbling like a lunatic about your Lists of Apple
Apologists broken down into categories?

paul <nospam@nospam.invalid> wrote:
> Wade Garrett wrote on 04.05.2021 22:18
>
>> Yeah, so I guess we should all bag our iPhones and iPads then buy clunky
>> Android devices instead ;-)
>
> Speaking of clunky iOS - at least Android doesn't have to update the entire
> operating system every single time Google forgets to test any one component.

Wow. iOS is a super lean OS then as the last update was 135MB on my phone.
:^)

Chris wrote on 05.05.2021 13:13

>> Speaking of clunky iOS - at least Android doesn't have to update the entire
>> operating system every single time Google forgets to test any one component.
>
> Wow. iOS is a super lean OS then as the last update was 135MB on my phone.

You don't seem to realize "lean" is missing the point entirely Chris.
It's not about iOS being "lean" - it's about iOS being designed poorly.

Could you imagine if any other operating system was as atrociously designed
as iOS is what would happen to their user base Chris?

*Billions of Linux users wouldn't put up with the poor design of iOS.*
*Billions of Windows users wouldn't put up with the poor design of iOS.*
*Billions of Android users wouldn't put up with the poor design of iOS.*

Think of it.

Every single bug in Windows (which is week after week after week) billions
of Windows users would be forced to re-install the entire operating system.

Only iOS users would put up with an operating system designed that poorly
that the entire operating system has to be re-installed for every bug.

It's amazing that iOS users *LOVE* the poorly designed iOS so much that they
gloat that they get to update their entire operating system almost weekly.

Nobody else is that stupid but iOS users Chris.
Think of what I'm explaining before you respond claiming iOS is "lean".

On 5/5/2021 12:37 PM, paul wrote:
> Chris wrote on 05.05.2021 13:13
>
>>> Speaking of clunky iOS - at least Android doesn't have to update the entire
>>> operating system every single time Google forgets to test any one component.
>>
>> Wow. iOS is a super lean OS then as the last update was 135MB on my phone.
>
> You don't seem to realize "lean" is missing the point entirely Chris.
> It's not about iOS being "lean" - it's about iOS being designed poorly.
>
> Could you imagine if any other operating system was as atrociously designed
> as iOS is what would happen to their user base Chris?
>
> *Billions of Linux users wouldn't put up with the poor design of iOS.*
> *Billions of Windows users wouldn't put up with the poor design of iOS.*
> *Billions of Android users wouldn't put up with the poor design of iOS.*
>
> Think of it.
>
> Every single bug in Windows (which is week after week after week) billions
> of Windows users would be forced to re-install the entire operating system.
>
> Only iOS users would put up with an operating system designed that poorly
> that the entire operating system has to be re-installed for every bug.
>
> It's amazing that iOS users *LOVE* the poorly designed iOS so much that they
> gloat that they get to update their entire operating system almost weekly.
>
> Nobody else is that stupid but iOS users Chris.
> Think of what I'm explaining before you respond claiming iOS is "lean".
>

And the iPad still ASODs / iOSDs almost daily, sometimes more
frequently, since 14.x...

In message <s6um4d$p9m$1@dont-email.me> Dipshit <News@Group.Post> wrote:
> On 5/5/2021 12:37 PM, Areleen The Troll wrote:

[idiotic nonsense]

> And the iPad still ASODs / iOSDs almost daily, sometimes more
> frequently, since 14.x...

Liar.

--
I desire the things that will destroy me in the end.

On 5/5/2021 3:00 PM, Lewis wrote:
> In message <s6um4d$p9m$1@dont-email.me> Dipshit <News@Group.Post> wrote:
>> On 5/5/2021 12:37 PM, Areleen The Troll wrote:
>
> [idiotic nonsense]
>
>> And the iPad still ASODs / iOSDs almost daily, sometimes more
>> frequently, since 14.x...
>
> Liar.
>

Curb your disbelief

"paul" <nospam@nospam.invalid> wrote in message
news:s6uhjl$mkb$1@gioia.aioe.org...
> Chris wrote on 05.05.2021 13:13
>
>>> Speaking of clunky iOS - at least Android doesn't have to update the
>>> entire
>>> operating system every single time Google forgets to test any one
>>> component.
>>
>> Wow. iOS is a super lean OS then as the last update was 135MB on my
>> phone.
>
> You don't seem to realize "lean" is missing the point entirely Chris.
> It's not about iOS being "lean" - it's about iOS being designed poorly.
>
> Could you imagine if any other operating system was as atrociously
> designed
> as iOS is what would happen to their user base Chris?
>
> *Billions of Linux users wouldn't put up with the poor design of iOS.*
> *Billions of Windows users wouldn't put up with the poor design of iOS.*
> *Billions of Android users wouldn't put up with the poor design of iOS.*
>
> Think of it.
>
> Every single bug in Windows (which is week after week after week) billions
> of Windows users would be forced to re-install the entire operating
> system.
>
> Only iOS users would put up with an operating system designed that poorly
> that the entire operating system has to be re-installed for every bug.
>
> It's amazing that iOS users *LOVE* the poorly designed iOS so much that
> they
> gloat that they get to update their entire operating system almost weekly.
>
> Nobody else is that stupid but iOS users Chris.
> Think of what I'm explaining before you respond claiming iOS is "lean".\

Fuck off Arlen.

Lewis wrote on 05.05.2021 19:00

>> And the iPad still ASODs / iOSDs almost daily, sometimes more
>> frequently, since 14.x...
>
> Liar.

The fact remains correct even as you don't like the fact that iOS must be
updated in its entirety every time any bug anywhere in the OS is found.

Name another common consumer operating system that is designed that poorly.

In article <s6uvfi$1i2a$1@gioia.aioe.org>, paul <nospam@nospam.invalid>
wrote:

>
> The fact remains correct even as you don't like the fact that iOS must be
> updated in its entirety every time any bug anywhere in the OS is found.

false.

nospam wrote on 05.05.2021 23:38

>> The fact remains correct even as you don't like the fact that iOS must be
>> updated in its entirety every time any bug anywhere in the OS is found.
>
> false.

Billions of users must update the *ENTIRE* OS for each critical bug found.

It's such a poor design no modern operating system would think of using it.

No modern consumer OS forces users to do what Apple forces its users to do.

In article <s6vied$lc0$1@gioia.aioe.org>, paul <nospam@nospam.invalid>
wrote:

>
> >> The fact remains correct even as you don't like the fact that iOS must be
> >> updated in its entirety every time any bug anywhere in the OS is found.
> >
> > false.
>
> Billions of users must update the *ENTIRE* OS for each critical bug found.

no they don't.

ios updates are deltas that contains only the changed parts, thus the
name delta.

the actual contents of the update will vary based on which device the
user has and what version is currently installed.

those updating to 14.5.1 from 14.5 would see the smallest update.
earlier versions of ios would have larger updates.

paul <nospam@nospam.invalid> wrote:
> Chris wrote on 05.05.2021 13:13
>
>>> Speaking of clunky iOS - at least Android doesn't have to update the entire
>>> operating system every single time Google forgets to test any one component.
>>
>> Wow. iOS is a super lean OS then as the last update was 135MB on my phone.
>
> You don't seem to realize "lean" is missing the point entirely Chris.

Yup. Which is that you haven't got a clue. The sad thing is you don't
realise it.

Chris wrote on 06.05.2021 06:22

>>> Wow. iOS is a super lean OS then as the last update was 135MB on my phone.
>>
>> You don't seem to realize "lean" is missing the point entirely Chris.
>
> Yup. Which is that you haven't got a clue. The sad thing is you don't
> realise it.

Ah. Thanks. I agree I didn't get what you had meant by "lean" until I
realized you're likely speaking about the 'delta updates' in iOS.

As you may know, the upcoming iOS operating system updates are downloaded to
/var/MobileSofwareUpdate/softwareupdate.xxxx where xxxx presumbably is the
build/release number. Each software update contains an image of the root
filesystem but not the entire version of iOS is included.

Only the files that have changed from the version the user is currently on
need to be replaced and so only those files are included in the update
package. The method for finding these changes is likley to be the same as
with iOS apps, where checksumming finds changes in the files.

However Apple's algorithm doesn't send the differences between two
individual files but sends the entire updated file. Apple's rather
simplistic 'algorithm' just looks for _any_ change (even that of a single
bit) between the last version and doesn't look for the actual change itself.

This is proven by the fact that in OTA update packages the complete files
are available and not just a log of the changes.

It's good iOS has delta updates as Windows has had "express installation
files" since XP days and Android has had "smart updates" since Android 2.3.

Linux is a bit fragmented on delta updates in that Fedora has had them by
default in RPM seemingly forever but in Debian it's much less ingrained.

Still you must be aware that Android is way ahead of just delta updates in
that the user can update roughly about half the operating system completely
independently of the maker of the device.

This is impossible on iOS but it's what Linux/Windows users do all the time.

The bulk of OS updates on Windows & Linux bypass the device maker while
every single OS update on iOS _requires_ Apple to be _wholly_ involved.

And of course Android is also way ahead of Apple iOS in terms of open
sourcing those operating system components so that these operating system
components can be updated completely independently of the operating system
itself and in most cases they can REPLACE the equivalent part of the
operating system from Google (e.g., microg).

In summary while iOS is clearly lacking in modern OS update capabilities
it's good to know that iOS has had the concept of delta updates at least.

nospam wrote on 06.05.2021 04:30

> ios updates are deltas that contains only the changed parts, thus the
> name delta.

The iOS "delta update" mechanism is a joke compared to the modern updates of
Android in that with Android the user can _independently_ update roughly
about half of the Android operating system completely _independently_ of the
manufacturer of the Android device.

Better yet, since most of those Android core OS components are open sourced
by design, the user can REPLACE the Google components he feels like
replacing with open source equivalents (e.g., microg) for full functionality
which aids even further in support for ancient devices.

Such modern operating system update functionality is impossible on iOS.
> the actual contents of the update will vary based on which device the
> user has and what version is currently installed.

Again you must be joking in that the sophomoric method Apple uses is so
simplistic that it forces a replacement of the entire file if only a single
bit in that file has changed (see my response to Chris with more detail).

> those updating to 14.5.1 from 14.5 would see the smallest update.
> earlier versions of ios would have larger updates.

With a modern operating system such as with Android the user doesn't need to
change the operating system sub version just to update the over two dozen
core Android OS modules completely independently of the device manufacturer.

In a modern operating system the core OS modules are updated asynchronously.

--
We're talking unrooted/unjailbroken devices here.

In article <s72fo6$eih$1@gioia.aioe.org>, paul <nospam@nospam.invalid>
wrote:

> With a modern operating system such as with Android the user doesn't need to
> change the operating system sub version just to update the over two dozen
> core Android OS modules completely independently of the device manufacturer.

false.

> In a modern operating system the core OS modules are updated asynchronously.

no they very definitely aren't.

nospam wrote on 07.05.2021 21:52

>> With a modern operating system such as with Android the user doesn't need to
>> change the operating system sub version just to update the over two dozen
>> core Android OS modules completely independently of the device manufacturer.
>
> false.
>
>> In a modern operating system the core OS modules are updated asynchronously.
>
> no they very definitely aren't.

*You get _all_ your Android OS information _only_ from the Apple web site.*

What does your very pretty Apple web site (with all its seductive graphics)
say about how these core Android OS components are updated via Google Play?
1- adbd com.google.android.adbd (APEX)
2- Android Neural Network API Runtime com.google.android.neuralnetworks (APEX)
3- Captive Portal Login com.google.android.captiveportallogin (APK)
4- Cell Broadcast com.google.android.cellbroadcast (APEX)
5- Conscrypt com.google.android.conscrypt (APEX)
6- DNS Resolver com.google.android.resolv (APEX)
7- Documents UI com.google.android.documentsui (APK)
8- ExtServices (APEX) com.google.android.extservices (APEX)
9- ExtServices (APK) com.google.android.ext.services (APK)
10- IPsec/IKEv2 Library com.google.android.ipsec (APEX)
11- Media Codecs com.google.android.media.swcodec (APEX)
12- Media Framework Components com.google.android.media (APEX)
13- Media Provider com.google.android.mediaprovider (APEX)
14- Module Metadata com.google.android.modulemetadata (APK)
15- Network Stack Components com.google.android.networkstack (APK)
16- Network Stack Permission Configuration com.google.android.networkstack.permissionconfig (APK)
17- Permission Controller (APEX) com.google.android.permission (APEX)
18- Permission Controller (APK) com.google.android.permissioncontroller (APK)
19- SDK Extensions com.google.android.sdkext (APEX)
20- Statsd com.google.android.os.statsd (APEX)
21- Telemetry Train Version Package com.google.mainline.telemetry (APK)
22- Tethering com.google.android.tethering (APEX)
23- Time Zone Data 2 com.google.android.tzdata2 (APEX)
24- Time Zone Data com.google.android.tzdata (APEX)
25- Wi-Fi3 com.google.android.wifi (APEX)
26- Android Runtime (APEX) converts Java bytecode to native machine code

What does your very pretty Apple web site (with all its seductive graphics)
say about how low level firmware from chip makers is updated in Google Play?
https://www.androidauthority.com/gpu-driver-updates-phones-1096423/

What does your very pretty Apple web site (with all it's seductive graphics)
say about how these key Android Google apps are updated via Google Play?
27- Android Auto
28- Contacts
29- Files by Google
30- Find My Device
31- Gboard
32- GMail
33- Google
34- Google Assistant
35- Google Calendar
36- Google Chrome
37- Google Docs
38- Google Drive
39- Google Maps
40- Google Pay
41- Google Play
42- Google Play Music
43- Google Text-to-Speech
44- Messages
45- YouTube
(this list of key Google apps might go on for a while)

What does your very pretty Apple web site (with all it's seductive graphics)
say about how all those Android OS components are updated via Google Play?