0

https://www.yahoo.com/news/gop-rep-lauren-boebert-calls-130015902.html

(I don't have to criticize every single lawmaker who does this.)

It sounds like you are trying to damage vaccination efforts. Your words as a lawmaker could put American lives at risk; it sounds like you are trying to weaken vaccination efforts. Even if you don't do it this time, your signal that it is OK to criticize scientific efforts to save lives, and the Republican Party's failure to immediately stop you and others from making these remarks, signals that you and Republicans care only about winning elections, not about assisting your constituents.

Perhaps Republicans might point out that this apathy is characteristic of many Democratic lawmakers, too. I didn't say that's false. It is still not an excuse for you to do it.

(I will not say how important this post is, compared to others like it, according to my understanding. It is fine for me to make posts like this when they are not absolutely necessary; I am being careful not to create high risk of harm to positive interests, and I should be.)

On 7/9/2021 5:39 AM, DV wrote:
>
> 0
>
> https://www.yahoo.com/news/gop-rep-lauren-boebert-calls-130015902.html
>
> (I don't have to criticize every single lawmaker who does this.)
>
> It sounds like you are trying to damage vaccination efforts.

If one has antibodies because they were previously infected, should they
still get the vaccine?

[...]

On 7/9/2021 4:10 PM, Chris M. Thomasson wrote:
> On 7/9/2021 5:39 AM, DV wrote:
>>
>> 0
>>
>> https://www.yahoo.com/news/gop-rep-lauren-boebert-calls-130015902.html
>>
>> (I don't have to criticize every single lawmaker who does this.)
>>
>> It sounds like you are trying to damage vaccination efforts.
>
> If one has antibodies because they were previously infected, should they
> still get the vaccine?
>
>
> [...]

Yes.

--
Copyright 2021 Pete Olcott

"Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre
minds." Einstein

On 7/9/2021 2:14 PM, olcott wrote:
> On 7/9/2021 4:10 PM, Chris M. Thomasson wrote:
>> On 7/9/2021 5:39 AM, DV wrote:
>>>
>>> 0
>>>
>>> https://www.yahoo.com/news/gop-rep-lauren-boebert-calls-130015902.html
>>>
>>> (I don't have to criticize every single lawmaker who does this.)
>>>
>>> It sounds like you are trying to damage vaccination efforts.
>>
>> If one has antibodies because they were previously infected, should
>> they still get the vaccine?
>>
>>
>> [...]
>
> Yes.
>

Can there be a possibility of "antibody" overload? If that even makes
sense...

On 7/9/2021 4:16 PM, Chris M. Thomasson wrote:
> On 7/9/2021 2:14 PM, olcott wrote:
>> On 7/9/2021 4:10 PM, Chris M. Thomasson wrote:
>>> On 7/9/2021 5:39 AM, DV wrote:
>>>>
>>>> 0
>>>>
>>>> https://www.yahoo.com/news/gop-rep-lauren-boebert-calls-130015902.html
>>>>
>>>> (I don't have to criticize every single lawmaker who does this.)
>>>>
>>>> It sounds like you are trying to damage vaccination efforts.
>>>
>>> If one has antibodies because they were previously infected, should
>>> they still get the vaccine?
>>>
>>>
>>> [...]
>>
>> Yes.
>>
>
> Can there be a possibility of "antibody" overload? If that even makes
> sense...

I don't think so.

--
Copyright 2021 Pete Olcott

"Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre
minds." Einstein

On 7/9/2021 2:20 PM, olcott wrote:
> On 7/9/2021 4:16 PM, Chris M. Thomasson wrote:
>> On 7/9/2021 2:14 PM, olcott wrote:
>>> On 7/9/2021 4:10 PM, Chris M. Thomasson wrote:
>>>> On 7/9/2021 5:39 AM, DV wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> 0
>>>>>
>>>>> https://www.yahoo.com/news/gop-rep-lauren-boebert-calls-130015902.html
>>>>>
>>>>> (I don't have to criticize every single lawmaker who does this.)
>>>>>
>>>>> It sounds like you are trying to damage vaccination efforts.
>>>>
>>>> If one has antibodies because they were previously infected, should
>>>> they still get the vaccine?
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> [...]
>>>
>>> Yes.
>>>
>>
>> Can there be a possibility of "antibody" overload? If that even makes
>> sense...
>
> I don't think so.
>

Well, have they did any trials where a test subject was injected with
say, five times the normal dose?

On 7/9/2021 4:23 PM, Chris M. Thomasson wrote:
> On 7/9/2021 2:20 PM, olcott wrote:
>> On 7/9/2021 4:16 PM, Chris M. Thomasson wrote:
>>> On 7/9/2021 2:14 PM, olcott wrote:
>>>> On 7/9/2021 4:10 PM, Chris M. Thomasson wrote:
>>>>> On 7/9/2021 5:39 AM, DV wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 0
>>>>>>
>>>>>> https://www.yahoo.com/news/gop-rep-lauren-boebert-calls-130015902.html
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> (I don't have to criticize every single lawmaker who does this.)
>>>>>>
>>>>>> It sounds like you are trying to damage vaccination efforts.
>>>>>
>>>>> If one has antibodies because they were previously infected, should
>>>>> they still get the vaccine?
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> [...]
>>>>
>>>> Yes.
>>>>
>>>
>>> Can there be a possibility of "antibody" overload? If that even makes
>>> sense...
>>
>> I don't think so.
>>
>
> Well, have they did any trials where a test subject was injected with
> say, five times the normal dose?

Probably not. They did find that 1/4 the normal dose is still quite
effective.

--
Copyright 2021 Pete Olcott

"Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre
minds." Einstein

On 7/9/2021 3:10 PM, Chris M. Thomasson wrote:
> On 7/9/2021 5:39 AM, DV wrote:
>>
>> 0
>>
>> https://www.yahoo.com/news/gop-rep-lauren-boebert-calls-130015902.html
>>
>> (I don't have to criticize every single lawmaker who does this.)
>>
>> It sounds like you are trying to damage vaccination efforts.
>
> If one has antibodies because they were previously infected, should they
> still get the vaccine?
Why would you ask such a question in comp.theory? Try asking your doctor
or call a public health hot line. If that doesn't suit you, at least ask
in a medical forum. As I understand it, the answer is more complicated
than yes/no. The answer might involve your prior medical history - all
of it -- not just the one data point you hypothesized.

You've scored several replies from PO, a proud ignoramus, troll, and
fool. I don't think any other participant in this newsgroup would take
his advice on shoe polish let alone a medical issue. Ask elsewhere
unless you are simply trolling. If you are, continue your exchange with
PO but don't take anything seriously. My guess is that he knows about as
much on medical topics as he does about computer science, foundations,
and math. In other words nothing! And he vets web site information with
the same accuracy as a man with hemorrhoids evaluates toilet paper.
--
Jeff Barnett

On 7/9/2021 5:12 PM, Jeff Barnett wrote:
> On 7/9/2021 3:10 PM, Chris M. Thomasson wrote:
>> On 7/9/2021 5:39 AM, DV wrote:
>>>
>>> 0
>>>
>>> https://www.yahoo.com/news/gop-rep-lauren-boebert-calls-130015902.html
>>>
>>> (I don't have to criticize every single lawmaker who does this.)
>>>
>>> It sounds like you are trying to damage vaccination efforts.
>>
>> If one has antibodies because they were previously infected, should
>> they still get the vaccine?
> Why would you ask such a question in comp.theory? Try asking your doctor
> or call a public health hot line. If that doesn't suit you, at least ask
> in a medical forum. As I understand it, the answer is more complicated
> than yes/no. The answer might involve your prior medical history - all
> of it -- not just the one data point you hypothesized.
>
> You've scored several replies from PO, a proud ignoramus, troll, and
> fool. I don't think any other participant in this newsgroup would take
> his advice on shoe polish let alone a medical issue. Ask elsewhere
> unless you are simply trolling. If you are, continue your exchange with
> PO but don't take anything seriously. My guess is that he knows about as
> much on medical topics as he does about computer science, foundations,
> and math. In other words nothing! And he vets web site information with
> the same accuracy as a man with hemorrhoids evaluates toilet paper.

I figured out that a P100 mask protects you from the covid-19 virus
almost as good as your own private air tank. It protects you 167-fold
better 99.97% protective than an n95 mask 95% protective against 300 NM
particles. It also offers very good protection against 5 NM particles
(one per half hour) whereas covid-19 particles are 50 NM.

Because no one else knew this P100 masks were always very easy to get.
I adapted mine so that the exhalations were forced through a surgical mask.

--
Copyright 2021 Pete Olcott

"Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre
minds." Einstein

On 7/9/2021 4:38 PM, olcott wrote:
> On 7/9/2021 5:12 PM, Jeff Barnett wrote:
>> On 7/9/2021 3:10 PM, Chris M. Thomasson wrote:
>>> On 7/9/2021 5:39 AM, DV wrote:
>>>>
>>>> 0
>>>>
>>>> https://www.yahoo.com/news/gop-rep-lauren-boebert-calls-130015902.html
>>>>
>>>> (I don't have to criticize every single lawmaker who does this.)
>>>>
>>>> It sounds like you are trying to damage vaccination efforts.
>>>
>>> If one has antibodies because they were previously infected, should
>>> they still get the vaccine?
>> Why would you ask such a question in comp.theory? Try asking your
>> doctor or call a public health hot line. If that doesn't suit you, at
>> least ask in a medical forum. As I understand it, the answer is more
>> complicated than yes/no. The answer might involve your prior medical
>> history - all of it -- not just the one data point you hypothesized.
>>
>> You've scored several replies from PO, a proud ignoramus, troll, and
>> fool. I don't think any other participant in this newsgroup would take
>> his advice on shoe polish let alone a medical issue. Ask elsewhere
>> unless you are simply trolling. If you are, continue your exchange
>> with PO but don't take anything seriously. My guess is that he knows
>> about as much on medical topics as he does about computer science,
>> foundations, and math. In other words nothing! And he vets web site
>> information with the same accuracy as a man with hemorrhoids evaluates
>> toilet paper.
>
> I figured out that a P100 mask protects you from the covid-19 virus
> almost as good as your own private air tank. It protects you 167-fold
> better 99.97% protective than an n95 mask 95% protective against 300 NM
> particles. It also offers very good protection against 5 NM particles
> (one per half hour) whereas covid-19 particles are 50 NM.
>
> Because no one else knew this P100 masks were always very easy to get.
> I adapted mine so that the exhalations were forced through a surgical mask.
But did it halt?
--
Jeff Barnett

On 7/9/2021 8:28 PM, Jeff Barnett wrote:
> On 7/9/2021 4:38 PM, olcott wrote:
>> On 7/9/2021 5:12 PM, Jeff Barnett wrote:
>>> On 7/9/2021 3:10 PM, Chris M. Thomasson wrote:
>>>> On 7/9/2021 5:39 AM, DV wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> 0
>>>>>
>>>>> https://www.yahoo.com/news/gop-rep-lauren-boebert-calls-130015902.html
>>>>>
>>>>> (I don't have to criticize every single lawmaker who does this.)
>>>>>
>>>>> It sounds like you are trying to damage vaccination efforts.
>>>>
>>>> If one has antibodies because they were previously infected, should
>>>> they still get the vaccine?
>>> Why would you ask such a question in comp.theory? Try asking your
>>> doctor or call a public health hot line. If that doesn't suit you, at
>>> least ask in a medical forum. As I understand it, the answer is more
>>> complicated than yes/no. The answer might involve your prior medical
>>> history - all of it -- not just the one data point you hypothesized.
>>>
>>> You've scored several replies from PO, a proud ignoramus, troll, and
>>> fool. I don't think any other participant in this newsgroup would
>>> take his advice on shoe polish let alone a medical issue. Ask
>>> elsewhere unless you are simply trolling. If you are, continue your
>>> exchange with PO but don't take anything seriously. My guess is that
>>> he knows about as much on medical topics as he does about computer
>>> science, foundations, and math. In other words nothing! And he vets
>>> web site information with the same accuracy as a man with hemorrhoids
>>> evaluates toilet paper.
>>
>> I figured out that a P100 mask protects you from the covid-19 virus
>> almost as good as your own private air tank. It protects you 167-fold
>> better 99.97% protective than an n95 mask 95% protective against 300
>> NM particles. It also offers very good protection against 5 NM
>> particles (one per half hour) whereas covid-19 particles are 50 NM.
>>
>> Because no one else knew this P100 masks were always very easy to get.
>> I adapted mine so that the exhalations were forced through a surgical
>> mask.
> But did it halt?

It kept me safe when I had to see my oncologist.

https://www.nejm.org/doi/10.1056/NEJMc2004973?fbclid=IwAR3GywoTgWCEeNv5ktFDxr0G5uKCoohST1Ufr2CMaXTjUyUFDi_ck5FJXZ8

My rule of thumb to stay safe was don't go inside where anyone else has
ever been. This was based on the fact that the virus remains infectious
in stagnant indoor air for four hours (See above nejm link)

The six foot distance model was based on the flu virus and does not
apply to covid-19 in aerosols.

Several cases of covid-19 infection have been documented from more than
25 feet away.

--
Copyright 2021 Pete Olcott

"Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre
minds." Einstein

On 7/9/2021 3:12 PM, Jeff Barnett wrote:
> On 7/9/2021 3:10 PM, Chris M. Thomasson wrote:
>> On 7/9/2021 5:39 AM, DV wrote:
>>>
>>> 0
>>>
>>> https://www.yahoo.com/news/gop-rep-lauren-boebert-calls-130015902.html
>>>
>>> (I don't have to criticize every single lawmaker who does this.)
>>>
>>> It sounds like you are trying to damage vaccination efforts.
>>
>> If one has antibodies because they were previously infected, should
>> they still get the vaccine?
> Why would you ask such a question in comp.theory? Try asking your doctor
> or call a public health hot line. If that doesn't suit you, at least ask
> in a medical forum. As I understand it, the answer is more complicated
> than yes/no. The answer might involve your prior medical history - all
> of it -- not just the one data point you hypothesized.

A great answer! I also wonder about people taking immunosuppressants.

> You've scored several replies from PO, a proud ignoramus, troll, and
> fool. I don't think any other participant in this newsgroup would take
> his advice on shoe polish let alone a medical issue. Ask elsewhere
> unless you are simply trolling. If you are, continue your exchange with
> PO but don't take anything seriously. My guess is that he knows about as
> much on medical topics as he does about computer science, foundations,
> and math. In other words nothing! And he vets web site information with
> the same accuracy as a man with hemorrhoids evaluates toilet paper.

I was just wondering what he thought about the previously infected
getting vaccinated. I can see new types of interesting spike proteins
developing during mutations, so, my guess is that its going to be like
the flu where people get vaccinated every year.

On Friday, 9 July 2021 at 22:16:31 UTC+1, Chris M. Thomasson wrote:
>
> Can there be a possibility of "antibody" overload? If that even makes
> sense...
>
It's never been demonstrated. As computer scientists, we know that there must
be some limit to the number of antigens the immune system can recognise,
but that might be so high (limited by the number of anti-body producing cells in
the body) that no amount of natural infection or vaccination will overwhelm it.

On 09/07/2021 23:23, Chris M. Thomasson wrote:
> On 7/9/2021 2:20 PM, olcott wrote:
>> On 7/9/2021 4:16 PM, Chris M. Thomasson wrote:
>>> On 7/9/2021 2:14 PM, olcott wrote:
>>>> On 7/9/2021 4:10 PM, Chris M. Thomasson wrote:
>>>>> On 7/9/2021 5:39 AM, DV wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 0
>>>>>>
>>>>>> https://www.yahoo.com/news/gop-rep-lauren-boebert-calls-130015902.html
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> (I don't have to criticize every single lawmaker who does this.)
>>>>>>
>>>>>> It sounds like you are trying to damage vaccination efforts.
>>>>>
>>>>> If one has antibodies because they were previously infected, should
>>>>> they still get the vaccine?
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> [...]
>>>>
>>>> Yes.
>>>>
>>>
>>> Can there be a possibility of "antibody" overload? If that even makes
>>> sense...

No, it does not make sense as such.

There is a possibility of antibodies clumping together to form a blood
clot, which is a plausible explanation for why there have been
occasional instances of unexpected blood clots in connection with some
of the vaccine types. But the risks involved are lower than the risks
of communing to work every day, so it is not something to be concerned
about.

>>
>> I don't think so.
>>
>
> Well, have they did any trials where a test subject was injected with
> say, five times the normal dose?

They do plenty of tests for toxicity or other possible problems. You
can be confident that the people making the vaccines, and the people
testing and certifying them, know vastly more about this sort of thing
than you, me, or other random people off the internet. Few things in
life are ever /entirely/ risk-free, but the vaccines are as safe as
possible. The virus, on the other hand, is very far from safe.

On 10/07/2021 05:18, Chris M. Thomasson wrote:
> On 7/9/2021 3:12 PM, Jeff Barnett wrote:
>> On 7/9/2021 3:10 PM, Chris M. Thomasson wrote:
>>> On 7/9/2021 5:39 AM, DV wrote:
>>>>
>>>> 0
>>>>
>>>> https://www.yahoo.com/news/gop-rep-lauren-boebert-calls-130015902.html
>>>>
>>>> (I don't have to criticize every single lawmaker who does this.)
>>>>
>>>> It sounds like you are trying to damage vaccination efforts.
>>>
>>> If one has antibodies because they were previously infected, should
>>> they still get the vaccine?
>> Why would you ask such a question in comp.theory? Try asking your
>> doctor or call a public health hot line. If that doesn't suit you, at
>> least ask in a medical forum. As I understand it, the answer is more
>> complicated than yes/no. The answer might involve your prior medical
>> history - all of it -- not just the one data point you hypothesized.
>
> A great answer! I also wonder about people taking immunosuppressants.
>

If your situation is complicated, ask a doctor. All you can get in a
general forum is a general answer.

And the general answer is "get the vaccine". That applies whether you
have had Covid or not.

>
>> You've scored several replies from PO, a proud ignoramus, troll, and
>> fool. I don't think any other participant in this newsgroup would take
>> his advice on shoe polish let alone a medical issue. Ask elsewhere
>> unless you are simply trolling. If you are, continue your exchange
>> with PO but don't take anything seriously. My guess is that he knows
>> about as much on medical topics as he does about computer science,
>> foundations, and math. In other words nothing! And he vets web site
>> information with the same accuracy as a man with hemorrhoids evaluates
>> toilet paper.
>
> I was just wondering what he thought about the previously infected
> getting vaccinated. I can see new types of interesting spike proteins
> developing during mutations, so, my guess is that its going to be like
> the flu where people get vaccinated every year.

No, the spike proteins are not changing much - there are other aspects
of the virus that mutate more. No, it is not like the flu - each year,
we see different flu variants, which are different viruses, not
mutations of the same virus. It is unlikely that we will need new
vaccines for Covid every year, but it /is/ likely that we will need
boosters to get high immunity rates for a while.

People who have had the virus are likely to have some immunity, but it
will depend on the severity of their infection (amongst other things).

Immunity from having had the disease is probably less effective against
mutations than some of the vaccines, especially the mRNA ones which
target the key proteins that vary less. But any immunity, from
infections or any of the vaccines, is better than nothing - and it is
particularly useful in reducing the risks of serious infections and
hospitalisation or long-term effects (including, but not limited to, death).

And no amount of vaccination is ever 100% effective, either against you
getting the disease, or against you spreading it to others.

So get any vaccine you can, ask your doctor if you are unsure, and
continue to take appropriate precautions (primarily social distancing
and masks where distancing is impossible, and hand hygiene) regardless
of your own immunity.

On 7/10/2021 7:24 AM, David Brown wrote:
> On 10/07/2021 05:18, Chris M. Thomasson wrote:
<snip>
>> I was just wondering what he thought about the previously infected
>> getting vaccinated. I can see new types of interesting spike proteins
>> developing during mutations, so, my guess is that its going to be like
>> the flu where people get vaccinated every year.
>
> No, the spike proteins are not changing much - there are other aspects
> of the virus that mutate more. No, it is not like the flu - each year,
> we see different flu variants, which are different viruses, not
> mutations of the same virus. It is unlikely that we will need new
> vaccines for Covid every year, but it /is/ likely that we will need
> boosters to get high immunity rates for a while.

Tell us what is the difference between a "mutation" and a "different"
virus. Different ones might just be mutations several generations ago.
Is there a sharp distinction?

>
<snip>
> So get any vaccine you can, ask your doctor if you are unsure, and
> continue to take appropriate precautions (primarily social distancing
> and masks where distancing is impossible, and hand hygiene) regardless
> of your own immunity.
Probably great advise.
--
Jeff Barnett

On Saturday, 10 July 2021 at 17:36:48 UTC+1, Jeff Barnett wrote:
>
> Tell us what is the difference between a "mutation" and a "different"
> virus. Different ones might just be mutations several generations ago.
> Is there a sharp distinction?
>
For sexually reproducing organisms, you say it is the same species
if a male and a female can produce fertile offspring. But viruses are
not sexually reproducing, and so there's no sharp distinction in theory
between a "species" and a "variant". In reality viruses observed
in nature don't form a continuum, but tight clusters, and so we still
talk of species and variants.

On 7/10/2021 6:24 AM, David Brown wrote:
> On 10/07/2021 05:18, Chris M. Thomasson wrote:
>> On 7/9/2021 3:12 PM, Jeff Barnett wrote:
>>> On 7/9/2021 3:10 PM, Chris M. Thomasson wrote:
>>>> On 7/9/2021 5:39 AM, DV wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> 0
>>>>>
>>>>> https://www.yahoo.com/news/gop-rep-lauren-boebert-calls-130015902.html
>>>>>
>>>>> (I don't have to criticize every single lawmaker who does this.)
>>>>>
>>>>> It sounds like you are trying to damage vaccination efforts.
>>>>
>>>> If one has antibodies because they were previously infected, should
>>>> they still get the vaccine?
>>> Why would you ask such a question in comp.theory? Try asking your
>>> doctor or call a public health hot line. If that doesn't suit you, at
>>> least ask in a medical forum. As I understand it, the answer is more
>>> complicated than yes/no. The answer might involve your prior medical
>>> history - all of it -- not just the one data point you hypothesized.
>>
>> A great answer! I also wonder about people taking immunosuppressants.
>>
>
> If your situation is complicated, ask a doctor. All you can get in a
> general forum is a general answer.
>
> And the general answer is "get the vaccine". That applies whether you
> have had Covid or not.
>
>>
>>> You've scored several replies from PO, a proud ignoramus, troll, and
>>> fool. I don't think any other participant in this newsgroup would take
>>> his advice on shoe polish let alone a medical issue. Ask elsewhere
>>> unless you are simply trolling. If you are, continue your exchange
>>> with PO but don't take anything seriously. My guess is that he knows
>>> about as much on medical topics as he does about computer science,
>>> foundations, and math. In other words nothing! And he vets web site
>>> information with the same accuracy as a man with hemorrhoids evaluates
>>> toilet paper.
>>
>> I was just wondering what he thought about the previously infected
>> getting vaccinated. I can see new types of interesting spike proteins
>> developing during mutations, so, my guess is that its going to be like
>> the flu where people get vaccinated every year.
>
> No, the spike proteins are not changing much - there are other aspects
> of the virus that mutate more. No, it is not like the flu - each year,
> we see different flu variants, which are different viruses, not
> mutations of the same virus. It is unlikely that we will need new
> vaccines for Covid every year, but it /is/ likely that we will need
> boosters to get high immunity rates for a while.
>
> People who have had the virus are likely to have some immunity, but it
> will depend on the severity of their infection (amongst other things).
>
> Immunity from having had the disease is probably less effective against
> mutations than some of the vaccines, especially the mRNA ones which
> target the key proteins that vary less. But any immunity, from
> infections or any of the vaccines, is better than nothing - and it is
> particularly useful in reducing the risks of serious infections and
> hospitalisation or long-term effects (including, but not limited to, death).
>
> And no amount of vaccination is ever 100% effective, either against you
> getting the disease, or against you spreading it to others.
>
> So get any vaccine you can, ask your doctor if you are unsure, and
> continue to take appropriate precautions (primarily social distancing
> and masks where distancing is impossible, and hand hygiene) regardless
> of your own immunity.
>

Got it because I have asthma.

On 10/07/2021 18:36, Jeff Barnett wrote:
> On 7/10/2021 7:24 AM, David Brown wrote:
>> On 10/07/2021 05:18, Chris M. Thomasson wrote:
>    <snip>
>>> I was just wondering what he thought about the previously infected
>>> getting vaccinated. I can see new types of interesting spike proteins
>>> developing during mutations, so, my guess is that its going to be like
>>> the flu where people get vaccinated every year.
>>
>> No, the spike proteins are not changing much - there are other aspects
>> of the virus that mutate more.  No, it is not like the flu - each year,
>> we see different flu variants, which are different viruses, not
>> mutations of the same virus.  It is unlikely that we will need new
>> vaccines for Covid every year, but it /is/ likely that we will need
>> boosters to get high immunity rates for a while.
>
> Tell us what is the difference between a "mutation" and a "different"
> virus. Different ones might just be mutations several generations ago.
> Is there a sharp distinction?

No, there is no sharp distinction. And of course variations within a
species, just like different species themselves, are the result of a
summation of mutations over time.

I make the distinction here because for the flu viruses, there is a
specific pattern of variants. Very roughly speaking (and I can
guarantee the details here are wrong because I am writing from
unreliable memory - you can read Wikipedia for more accuracy), there are
two major proteins on the surface of a flu virus. Each of these could
be one of several different proteins - let's guess six types each. This
gives 36 different flu variants. For each of these, you need a specific
flu vaccine that targets the particular variant. Those vaccines will
also have a significantly lower but still useful effect against flu
variants that match on one of the proteins but not the other.

Mutations within a flu virus can mean approximately the same proteins,
but with minor differences. Think of proteins as words or sentences,
made up of an alphabet of amino acids. A "variant" is a different word
or sentence, a "mutation" is a spelling mistake or change in a letter.

How effective acquired immunity is in the face of a new variant or
mutation depends on which proteins of the original pathogen the immunity
is targeting, and how much these have changed for the new pathogen. To
a large extent, immunity as a result of having had an infection is a
matter of luck - your body's immune system latches on to one protein or
protein combination in the pathogen (virus in this case) and makes
antibodies to it. Anything with that combination, or close to it, will
get stopped in the future. A virus variant or major mutation that has a
different combination will get through.

Vaccines made in the traditional manner from weakened pathogens give a
similar effect to having had the infection - there's luck involved in
how effective it will be when faced with a mutation. Modern vaccines
usually only use part of the pathogens, which gives a more focused
antibody reaction - this means vaccines are often better than immunity
acquired from having an infection. And the new mRNA vaccines are much
more specific, targeting the peculiar "spike" protein in Covid that is
so essential to its success in infecting us. Thus they give stronger
immunities despite mutations, because they target the specific dangerous
part of the virus that sees fewer mutations.

In all cases, additional vaccines or boosters help keep the immune
system alert to the threat, and improve long-term immunity.

>
>>
>    <snip>
>> So get any vaccine you can, ask your doctor if you are unsure, and
>> continue to take appropriate precautions (primarily social distancing
>> and masks where distancing is impossible, and hand hygiene) regardless
>> of your own immunity.
> Probably great advise.