OpenVMS 8.4, TCP/IP 5.7 ECO 5

Is there a way to force the SFTP server to execute a LOGIN.COM (or even SYS$SYLOGIN) for that matter?

When a user uses SSH to log into 'interactively', the SSH server will execute the normal SYS$SYLOGIN and any LGICMD specified in AUTHORIZE.

When the same user uses SFTP to transfer files, the SSH server doesn't execute the SYS$SYLOGIN or LGICMD specified; it appears they are totally ignored.

Am I missing something obvious?

Thanks

Kenneth Randell <kennethnospam.randell@gmail.com> wrote:
>When a user uses SSH to log into 'interactively', the SSH server will execute the normal SYS$SYLOGIN and any LGICMD specified in AUTHORIZE.
>
>When the same user uses SFTP to transfer files, the SSH server doesn't execute the SYS$SYLOGIN or LGICMD specified; it appears they are totally ignored.
>
>Am I missing something obvious?

sftp doesn't execute anything at all. It is for file transfer only. On a
unix system, there is no login shell.
--scott
--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."

On 2/9/2022 5:40 PM, Kenneth Randell wrote:
> OpenVMS 8.4, TCP/IP 5.7 ECO 5
>
> Is there a way to force the SFTP server to execute a LOGIN.COM (or even SYS$SYLOGIN) for that matter?
>
> When a user uses SSH to log into 'interactively', the SSH server will execute the normal SYS$SYLOGIN and any LGICMD specified in AUTHORIZE.
>
> When the same user uses SFTP to transfer files, the SSH server doesn't execute the SYS$SYLOGIN or LGICMD specified; it appears they are totally ignored.
>
> Am I missing something obvious?
>
> Thanks
>

Ran into this in the past.

If interactive, ie; running from a terminal, SFTP will allow an interactive
login. However, if running it in say, a batch command file, or any non-terminal
situation, SFTP will not allow the login. (I guess it thinks one should not be
hard coding usernames and passwords in a command file.)

The only solution I found was to set up the automated login stuff. IT's been a
while, I could try to re-discover the set-up, but it's documented.

--
David Froble Tel: 724-529-0450
Dave Froble Enterprises, Inc. E-Mail: davef@tsoft-inc.com
DFE Ultralights, Inc.
170 Grimplin Road
Vanderbilt, PA 15486

In article <1a89d9e6-1a4b-498c-baa1-bdbd0b4913c7n@googlegroups.com>, Kenneth Randell <kennethnospam.randell@gmail.com> writes:
>OpenVMS 8.4, TCP/IP 5.7 ECO 5
>
>Is there a way to force the SFTP server to execute a LOGIN.COM (or even SYS$SYLOGIN) for that matter?
>
>When a user uses SSH to log into 'interactively', the SSH server will execute the normal SYS$SYLOGIN and any LGICMD specified in AUTHORIZE.
>
>When the same user uses SFTP to transfer files, the SSH server doesn't execute the SYS$SYLOGIN or LGICMD specified; it appears they are totally ignored.
>
>Am I missing something obvious?

Perhaps.

First, welcome back. i have seen a post from you in eons.

Why would you want the SYLOGIN.COM or LOGIN.COM to be executed? SFTP is NOT
an interactive session, it's a file transfer function. The only commands it
can or will recognize are the SFTP commands; there's no DCL.

--
VAXman- A Bored Certified VMS Kernel Mode Hacker VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)ORG

I speak to machines with the voice of humanity.

On Wednesday, February 9, 2022 at 9:25:59 PM UTC-5, VAXman- wrote:
> In article <1a89d9e6-1a4b-498c...@googlegroups.com>, Kenneth Randell <kennethnos...@gmail.com> writes:
> >OpenVMS 8.4, TCP/IP 5.7 ECO 5
> >
> >Is there a way to force the SFTP server to execute a LOGIN.COM (or even SYS$SYLOGIN) for that matter?
> >
> >When a user uses SSH to log into 'interactively', the SSH server will execute the normal SYS$SYLOGIN and any LGICMD specified in AUTHORIZE.
> >
> >When the same user uses SFTP to transfer files, the SSH server doesn't execute the SYS$SYLOGIN or LGICMD specified; it appears they are totally ignored.
> >
> >Am I missing something obvious?
> Perhaps.
>
> First, welcome back. i have seen a post from you in eons.
>
> Why would you want the SYLOGIN.COM or LOGIN.COM to be executed? SFTP is NOT
> an interactive session, it's a file transfer function. The only commands it
> can or will recognize are the SFTP commands; there's no DCL.
>
> --
> VAXman- A Bored Certified VMS Kernel Mode Hacker VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)ORG
>
> I speak to machines with the voice of humanity.

Thanks for the responses - as for WHY, basically I want to mimic the behavior of FTP where a login script can set a default directory for files transfers which is different than the user's 'home' directory that would contain log files which just further confuses matters. I realize it's just as simple for the user to issue a CWD command during the SFTP file transfer session, but there are those who will simply say 'SFTP doesn't work the same way as FTP did' and it gets old trying to explain this over and over again.

On 2022-02-09 22:40:34 +0000, Kenneth Randell said:

> OpenVMS 8.4, TCP/IP 5.7 ECO 5
>
> Is there a way to force the SFTP server to execute a LOGIN.COM (or even
> SYS$SYLOGIN) for that matter?
> ...
> Am I missing something obvious?

Maybe aim them at FTPS, and leave them folks running the disaster that
they know? Doc for that feature is sparse, but V5.7 ECO5 is the minimum.

--
Pure Personal Opinion | HoffmanLabs LLC

On 2/10/2022 7:22 AM, Kenneth Randell wrote:
> On Wednesday, February 9, 2022 at 9:25:59 PM UTC-5, VAXman- wrote:

>> Why would you want the SYLOGIN.COM or LOGIN.COM to be executed? SFTP is NOT
>> an interactive session, it's a file transfer function. The only commands it
>> can or will recognize are the SFTP commands; there's no DCL.
>>
>> --
>> VAXman- A Bored Certified VMS Kernel Mode Hacker VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)ORG
>>
>> I speak to machines with the voice of humanity.
>
> Thanks for the responses - as for WHY, basically I want to mimic the behavior of FTP where a login script can set a default directory for files transfers which is different than the user's 'home' directory that would contain log files which just further confuses matters. I realize it's just as simple for the user to issue a CWD command during the SFTP file transfer session, but there are those who will simply say 'SFTP doesn't work the same way as FTP did' and it gets old trying to explain this over and over again.

I can see a need, such as when the user has some $ DEFINE commands in
login.com to create names for directory trees they may wish to access.

On Wednesday, February 9, 2022 at 5:40:36 PM UTC-5, Kenneth Randell wrote:
> OpenVMS 8.4, TCP/IP 5.7 ECO 5
>
> Is there a way to force the SFTP server to execute a LOGIN.COM (or even SYS$SYLOGIN) for that matter?
>
> When a user uses SSH to log into 'interactively', the SSH server will execute the normal SYS$SYLOGIN and any LGICMD specified in AUTHORIZE.
>
> When the same user uses SFTP to transfer files, the SSH server doesn't execute the SYS$SYLOGIN or LGICMD specified; it appears they are totally ignored.
>
> Am I missing something obvious?
>
> Thanks
Kenneth,

You may be remembering the DECnet Remote File Access mechanism, and the associated utilities.

A "NETWORK" login does result in running the SYLOGIN and other LOGIN scripts, hence the presence of the F$MODE conditionalization in the standard template files.

And yes, those using the mechanism also often use it to define all sorts of logical names.

I have not tried it, but if your entire group is using the same basic logical names, putting them in the GROUP logical name table might do the trick. I would experiment, but am on a bit of a deadline at the moment.

- Bob Gezelter, http://www.rlgsc.com

On Thursday, February 10, 2022 at 5:23:28 AM UTC-7, Kenneth Randell wrote:
> On Wednesday, February 9, 2022 at 9:25:59 PM UTC-5, VAXman- wrote:
> Thanks for the responses - as for WHY, basically I want to mimic the behavior of FTP where a login script can set a default directory for files transfers which is different than the user's 'home' directory that would contain log files which just further confuses matters. I realize it's just as simple for the user to issue a CWD command during the SFTP file transfer session, but there are those who will simply say 'SFTP doesn't work the same way as FTP did' and it gets old trying to explain this over and over again.

Do you control the trigger to start sftp? IOW, can you send an email or provide a script that uses the extended server syntax

sftp jchimene@example.co:/tmp
Connected to example.co.
Changing to: /tmp
sftp>