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computers / comp.sys.mac.vintage / Re: Posting on my LC 475, What are you running? Follow up

SubjectAuthor
* Posting on my LC 475, What are you running?denodster
+* Re: Posting on my LC 475, What are you running?Jolly Roger
|`* Re: Posting on my LC 475, What are you running?Denodster
| +* Re: Posting on my LC 475, What are you running?Your Name
| |`* Re: Posting on my LC 475, What are you running?nospam
| | `* Re: Posting on my LC 475, What are you running?Eli the Bearded
| |  +- Re: Posting on my LC 475, What are you running?nospam
| |  `* Re: Posting on my LC 475, What are you running?Your Name
| |   `- Re: Posting on my LC 475, What are you running?nospam
| `* Re: Posting on my LC 475, What are you running?D Finnigan
|  `- Re: Posting on my LC 475, What are you running?Denodster
`* Re: Posting on my LC 475, What are you running?philo
 +- Re: Posting on my LC 475, What are you running?nospam
 +- Re: Posting on my LC 475, What are you running?Your Name
 +- Re: Posting on my LC 475, What are you running?Denodster
 `* Re: Posting on my LC 475, What are you running? Follow upphilo
  `* Re: Posting on my LC 475, What are you running? Follow upnospam
   +* Re: Posting on my LC 475, What are you running? Follow upDavid Kennedy
   |+* Re: Posting on my LC 475, What are you running? Follow upnospam
   ||`* Re: Posting on my LC 475, What are you running? Follow upDavid Kennedy
   || `* Re: Posting on my LC 475, What are you running? Follow upnospam
   ||  `- Re: Posting on my LC 475, What are you running? Follow upDavid Kennedy
   |+* Re: Posting on my LC 475, What are you running? Follow upDenodster
   ||`- Re: Posting on my LC 475, What are you running? Follow upnospam
   |`* Re: Posting on my LC 475, What are you running? Follow upphilo
   | +- Re: Posting on my LC 475, What are you running? Follow upnospam
   | `* Re: Posting on my LC 475, What are you running? Follow upScott Alfter
   |  `* Re: Posting on my LC 475, What are you running? Follow upnospam
   |   `- Re: Posting on my LC 475, What are you running? Follow upScott Alfter
   `* Re: Posting on my LC 475, What are you running? Follow upphilo
    `* Re: Posting on my LC 475, What are you running? Follow upnospam
     `* Re: Posting on my LC 475, What are you running? Follow upphilo
      +* Re: Posting on my LC 475, What are you running? Follow upDenodster
      |+- Re: Posting on my LC 475, What are you running? Follow upphilo
      |`* Re: Posting on my LC 475, What are you running? Follow upnospam
      | `- Re: Posting on my LC 475, What are you running? Follow upEli the Bearded
      `* Re: Posting on my LC 475, What are you running? Follow upnospam
       `* Re: Posting on my LC 475, What are you running? Follow upphilo
        `* Re: Posting on my LC 475, What are you running? Follow upnospam
         `* Re: Posting on my LC 475, What are you running? Follow upphilo
          `* Re: Posting on my LC 475, What are you running? Follow upnospam
           `* Re: Posting on my LC 475, What are you running? Follow upphilo
            `* Re: Posting on my LC 475, What are you running? Follow upnospam
             `* Re: Posting on my LC 475, What are you running? Follow upphilo
              `- Re: Posting on my LC 475, What are you running? Follow upnospam

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Subject: Re: Posting on my LC 475, What are you running? Follow up
From: nospam
Newsgroups: comp.sys.mac.vintage
Organization: A noiseless patient Spider
Date: Fri, 12 Nov 2021 01:00 UTC
References: 1 2 3 4 5 6
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From: nos...@nospam.invalid (nospam)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.mac.vintage
Subject: Re: Posting on my LC 475, What are you running? Follow up
Date: Thu, 11 Nov 2021 20:00:16 -0500
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In article <smkbdd$1pae$2@gioia.aioe.org>, philo <philo@privacy.net>
wrote:


I have an adapter that will work with my Quadra but nothing for the SE

sounds like an aaui adapter:

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/b/bd/Asante-aaui.jpg

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/d/dc/Apple_AAUI_tr
ansceiver_and_cable.jpg/1024px-Apple_AAUI_transceiver_and_cable.jpg>

quadras were the first macs to have onboard ethernet, with choice of
cabling via an apple aui adapter.

at some point, the industry and apple went 10base-t.

there are other options for the se, but if you don't have any, it's
moot.


Subject: Re: Posting on my LC 475, What are you running? Follow up
From: nospam
Newsgroups: comp.sys.mac.vintage
Organization: A noiseless patient Spider
Date: Fri, 12 Nov 2021 01:00 UTC
References: 1 2 3 4 5
Path: i2pn2.org!i2pn.org!eternal-september.org!reader02.eternal-september.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail
From: nos...@nospam.invalid (nospam)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.mac.vintage
Subject: Re: Posting on my LC 475, What are you running? Follow up
Date: Thu, 11 Nov 2021 20:00:18 -0500
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In article <smkbb5$1pae$1@gioia.aioe.org>, philo <philo@privacy.net>
wrote:



One drive was HFS+ but one was the original  Mac FS.

none were the original mac fs, known as mfs. that was for 400k floppies.

you probably mean hfs, which replaced mfs to support the larger
capacity 800k floppies and hard drives, before the mac se was released.

some very, very early hard drives were mfs only because the predated
hfs and were mostly a clusterfuck to use.

hfs+ came much later, with mac os 8.1, which won't work on a mac se.




gparted (on my linux machine) could recognize HFS /HFS+ drives but the
one SE had a drive that gparted could not identify.

is it readable on the mac? if not, it could be corrupted.

I assume it must have been MFS   (FWIF, it's 20 meg)

it is not mfs.

mfs, aka macintosh file system, was a flat file system, which wasn't an
issue with 400k floppy disks because they were too small to hold very
many files for it to be a major limitation. mac os at that time could
create folders, but they were just an illusion.

mfs was very short-lived and soon replaced in late 1985 with hfs, aka
hierarchical file system, with the 800k floppy disk and the apple 20
megabyte hard drive. hfs was a true hierarchical file system, thus its
name.

formatting 400k floppies defaulted to mfs.
formatting 800k floppies & hard drives (apple or third party) was hfs.

it was possible to override that and format an 800k floppy as mfs or a
400k as hfs, but there was no reason to do so, other than testing
purposes.

hard drives were always hfs, until 1998 when hfs+ was introduced.

I guess I've got a real collector's item

unless it's a clear case, no.

https://technabob.com/blog/2010/12/03/rare-transparent-macintosh-se/
  From what I can tell, only about 10 of these machines were ever
  made, and they lived within the walls of Apple. Now, if you¹ve got
  deep enough pockets, you could be the proud owner of one of
  these extreme rarities. Apparently, these machines were built for
  the Macintosh R&D team at Apple to verify the placement of internal
  components, and never were intended for production.

  This particular see-through Mac SE is being offered over on eBay with
  a starting bid of a whopping $25,000 (USD). For that price, you could
  buy a pretty nice car. Or 50 iPads. And this transparent Macintosh
  doesn¹t even boot up properly. The guy selling it says it¹ll boot off
  of the 800k floppy drive only. And being such a rarity, I¹d doubt
  that cracking it open and fixing the hard drive would be good for
  its resale value.


Subject: Re: Posting on my LC 475, What are you running? Follow up
From: David Kennedy
Newsgroups: comp.sys.mac.vintage
Organization: Not Likely
Date: Fri, 12 Nov 2021 11:45 UTC
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Subject: Re: Posting on my LC 475, What are you running? Follow up
Newsgroups: comp.sys.mac.vintage
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From: davidken...@nospamherethankyou.invalid (David Kennedy)
Organization: Not Likely
Date: Fri, 12 Nov 2021 11:45:57 +0000
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On 11/11/2021 17:20, nospam wrote:
In article <WI6dnfWwq8T-0xD8nZ2dnUU78fWdnZ2d@brightview.co.uk>, David
Kennedy <davidkennedy@nospamherethankyou.invalid> wrote:


I remember having them; the rest blurs into the mists of time now...

it does, but it's fun to reminisce to a time when things were much
simpler.

And a 20Meg HD was the business...

I do recall how bloody useful it was when it came to returning to the office
and simply plugging into everything with the Mac Portable!

the mac that had the wrong name...

Still got it somewhere, wonder if it still works?

the battery is almost certainly dead.

it was a lead-acid battery, much like the ones in a modern ups.

the mac portable was designed to run off the battery, even when
connected to mains, which only served to charge the battery, not power
the unit, so a dead battery is going to be a problem.

i'm not sure where you can find a replacement battery, but you can
always connect an external battery, making the non-portable mac even
less portable. be sure to get the correct voltage.


Once I find it I'll give t a try


Subject: Re: Posting on my LC 475, What are you running? Follow up
From: Scott Alfter
Newsgroups: comp.sys.mac.vintage
Organization: USS Voyager NCC-74656, Delta Quadrant
Date: Fri, 12 Nov 2021 22:18 UTC
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Newsgroups: comp.sys.mac.vintage
Subject: Re: Posting on my LC 475, What are you running? Follow up
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From: sco...@alfter.diespammersdie.us (Scott Alfter)
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In article <smkbdd$1pae$2@gioia.aioe.org>, philo  <philo@privacy.net> wrote:
On 11/11/21 10:04 AM, David Kennedy wrote:
On 11/11/2021 15:36, nospam wrote:
In article <smjav8$5tq$1@gioia.aioe.org>, philo <philo@privacy.net>
wrote:

I also have some SE's but no networking on them.

yes they very definitely do.

*every* mac ever made has networking and in fact, macs were the first
mainstream computers include it, without any additional hardware.

localtalk is built in. ethernet cards were an optional extra, either
with an internal pds card or via an external adapter or network bridge.

I'm fairly sure I can remember needing appletalk adaptors when trying to
network three Apple Plus machines round about 1987 ish...

I have an adapter that will work with my Quadra but nothing for the SE

I don't know how easy they are to find now, but I've used a Cayman GatorBox
CS to bridge an Apple IIGS and a Color Classic to Linux servers running
netatalk.  I think I even had them talking to a G4 Mac mini when the Mac was
running Tiger.  Other LocalTalk-to-Ethernet bridges might work, but the
trick with getting older hardware talking to newer hardware is EtherTalk
support.  Linux still supports EtherTalk if you have the right kernel
modules compiled, but IIRC Mac OS X dropped EtherTalk support after 10.4.

  _/_
 / v \ Scott Alfter (remove the obvious to send mail)
(IIGS( https://alfter.us/          Top-posting!
 \_^_/                              >What's the most annoying thing on Usenet?



Subject: Re: Posting on my LC 475, What are you running? Follow up
From: nospam
Newsgroups: comp.sys.mac.vintage
Organization: A noiseless patient Spider
Date: Fri, 12 Nov 2021 22:46 UTC
References: 1 2 3 4 5
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From: nos...@nospam.invalid (nospam)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.mac.vintage
Subject: Re: Posting on my LC 475, What are you running? Follow up
Date: Fri, 12 Nov 2021 17:46:16 -0500
Organization: A noiseless patient Spider
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In article <5LBjJ.49931$SR4.6229@fx43.iad>, Scott Alfter
<scott@alfter.diespammersdie.us> wrote:


I don't know how easy they are to find now, but I've used a Cayman GatorBox
CS to bridge an Apple IIGS and a Color Classic to Linux servers running
netatalk.  I think I even had them talking to a G4 Mac mini when the Mac was
running Tiger.  Other LocalTalk-to-Ethernet bridges might work, but the
trick with getting older hardware talking to newer hardware is EtherTalk
support.  Linux still supports EtherTalk if you have the right kernel
modules compiled, but IIRC Mac OS X dropped EtherTalk support after 10.4.

or just use a vintage mac. :)


Subject: Re: Posting on my LC 475, What are you running? Follow up
From: philo
Newsgroups: comp.sys.mac.vintage
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Date: Sat, 13 Nov 2021 02:26 UTC
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From: phi...@privacy.net (philo)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.mac.vintage
Subject: Re: Posting on my LC 475, What are you running? Follow up
Date: Fri, 12 Nov 2021 20:26:55 -0600
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On 11/11/21 7:00 PM, nospam wrote:
In article <smkbb5$1pae$1@gioia.aioe.org>, philo <philo@privacy.net>
wrote:



One drive was HFS+ but one was the original  Mac FS.

none were the original mac fs, known as mfs. that was for 400k floppies.

you probably mean hfs, which replaced mfs to support the larger
capacity 800k floppies and hard drives, before the mac se was released.

some very, very early hard drives were mfs only because the predated
hfs and were mostly a clusterfuck to use.

hfs+ came much later, with mac os 8.1, which won't work on a mac se.




gparted (on my linux machine) could recognize HFS /HFS+ drives but the
one SE had a drive that gparted could not identify.

is it readable on the mac? if not, it could be corrupted.

I assume it must have been MFS   (FWIF, it's 20 meg)

it is not mfs.



To correct my typo in a previous post of mine, the only drives I had that would boot on the SE's were 20 meg 40 meg or 80 meg



Both of the SE's I have work fine and I am using drives that have OS-7.1 or OS 7.5

I can read most of the drives on my Linux machine using gparted and all but one are identified as HFS or HFS+

One drive however is not recognized by gparted nor is it recognized on my Windows machine with various utilities for reading Mac drives.

Since it is evidently not an HFS or an HFS+ drive I surmised that it was MFS>

If you say it is not MFS...my question however is what file system is on it?


Ergo:

I surmised the drive was MFS as it was NOT HFS or HFS+


MFS supports hard drives up to 20 megs.
The drive was 20 megs.
(all other drives were 40 meg or 80 megs)


MFS support was removed with OS7.6.1
All the machines were OS 7.1 or 7.5



snip,


Subject: Re: Posting on my LC 475, What are you running? Follow up
From: Denodster
Newsgroups: comp.sys.mac.vintage
Organization: A noiseless patient Spider
Date: Sat, 13 Nov 2021 04:09 UTC
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From: denods...@gmail.com (Denodster)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.mac.vintage
Subject: Re: Posting on my LC 475, What are you running? Follow up
Date: Fri, 12 Nov 2021 23:09:25 -0500
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In article <smn7pg$1qht$1@gioia.aioe.org>, philo <philo@privacy.net> wrote:

snip


One drive however is not recognized by gparted nor is it recognized on
my Windows machine with various utilities for reading Mac drives.

Since it is evidently not an HFS or an HFS+ drive I surmised that it was
MFS>

If you say it is not MFS...my question however is what file system is on it?


did ever have a machine set up to run apple unix? I believe that had it's
own filesystem.


Ergo:

I surmised the drive was MFS as it was NOT HFS or HFS+


MFS supports hard drives up to 20 megs.
The drive was 20 megs.
(all other drives were 40 meg or 80 megs)


MFS support was removed with OS7.6.1
All the machines were OS 7.1 or 7.5



snip,


Subject: Re: Posting on my LC 475, What are you running? Follow up
From: philo
Newsgroups: comp.sys.mac.vintage
Organization: Aioe.org NNTP Server
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From: phi...@privacy.net (philo)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.mac.vintage
Subject: Re: Posting on my LC 475, What are you running? Follow up
Date: Fri, 12 Nov 2021 23:48:41 -0600
Organization: Aioe.org NNTP Server
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On 11/12/21 22:09, Denodster wrote:
In article <smn7pg$1qht$1@gioia.aioe.org>, philo <philo@privacy.net> wrote:

snip


One drive however is not recognized by gparted nor is it recognized on
my Windows machine with various utilities for reading Mac drives.

Since it is evidently not an HFS or an HFS+ drive I surmised that it was
MFS>

If you say it is not MFS...my question however is what file system is on it?


did ever have a machine set up to run apple unix? I believe that had it's
own filesystem.





The machine was not running apple unix

BTW: After having been using Linux for over 20 years, I did get to try some real Unix.
Had to do a data recovery from an SCO server.
That was sure fun!


Ergo:

I surmised the drive was MFS as it was NOT HFS or HFS+


MFS supports hard drives up to 20 megs.
The drive was 20 megs.
(all other drives were 40 meg or 80 megs)


MFS support was removed with OS7.6.1
All the machines were OS 7.1 or 7.5



snip,



Subject: Re: Posting on my LC 475, What are you running? Follow up
From: nospam
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Date: Sat, 13 Nov 2021 17:43 UTC
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From: nos...@nospam.invalid (nospam)
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Subject: Re: Posting on my LC 475, What are you running? Follow up
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In article <smn7pg$1qht$1@gioia.aioe.org>, philo <philo@privacy.net>
wrote:


To correct my typo in a previous post of mine, the only drives I had
that would boot on the SE's were 20 meg 40 meg or 80 meg

that's because those were common capacities when the se was released.

the se, as well as other macs of that era, supported up to 2 gig hard
drives, unless it's running 7.5, where the maximum was 4 gig.




Since it is evidently not an HFS or an HFS+ drive I surmised that it was
MFS>

it is definitely not mfs. full stop.

mfs was not suitable for hard drives for several reasons, mainly that
it was a flat file system, did not scale well and that hfs was better
in every way.

If you say it is not MFS...my question however is what file system is on it?

hfs if it was used with a mac.

if it's an external drive, it could have been used with a different
computer platform and be another format, but then it wouldn't be usable
with the mac, at least not easily.

if you have a disk utility with the ability to read raw disk blocks,
post the first 64 bytes of the first 4 blocks (0..3). they're 512 byte
blocks, but only the beginning of each one is of interest.




MFS supports hard drives up to 20 megs.

technically true, but that doesn't change anything.

mfs was *not* used for hard drives (with one exception, see below).

mfs was designed for and used for floppies, specifically, the 400k
floppy in the original 128k and 512k macs.

mfs was replaced with hfs in late 1985, roughly 1.5 years after the mac
was first introduced, when apple released their 20 mb hard drive and
800k floppy drive.

mac hard drives were always hfs, up until 1998, when hfs was replaced
by hfs+ in macos 8.1, which could not run at all on a mac se.

the sole exception were a couple of third party hard drives in 1984-85,
designed for the original mac 128k/512k, before hfs existed. they used
a 5.25" mechanism, were 5-10 meg in capacity. they were also large,
noisy, and very, very slow due to mfs, shitty drivers and a slow
hardware interface. floppy disks were faster (seriously).

those drives were not compatible with a mac se, so it's not your
situation.

the only good thing was a truly massive power supply (5a, maybe more, i
don't remember) that could be used for all sorts of other projects,
long after the drive was useless.

the entire left side of the enclosure was the power supply:
http://www.peterjsucy.com/History/1985/EarlyHardDrive.jpg

The drive was 20 megs.
(all other drives were 40 meg or 80 megs)

as i said, that was a common capacity when the se was a current model.

MFS support was removed with OS7.6.1

significant limitations to mfs support began with system 7.0.

mfs became read-only in system 7.6.1, with all support removed in macos
8.

https://web.archive.org/web/20071012140146/http://docs.info.apple.com/a
rticle.html?artnum=9502>

All the machines were OS 7.1 or 7.5

that definitely means it's hfs. see above.


Subject: Re: Posting on my LC 475, What are you running? Follow up
From: nospam
Newsgroups: comp.sys.mac.vintage
Organization: A noiseless patient Spider
Date: Sat, 13 Nov 2021 17:43 UTC
References: 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8
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From: nos...@nospam.invalid (nospam)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.mac.vintage
Subject: Re: Posting on my LC 475, What are you running? Follow up
Date: Sat, 13 Nov 2021 12:43:42 -0500
Organization: A noiseless patient Spider
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In article <denodster-1211212309250001@192.168.2.200>, Denodster
<denodster@gmail.com> wrote:


did ever have a machine set up to run apple unix? I believe that had it's
own filesystem.

it did, however, a/ux was not supported on a mac se.


Subject: Re: Posting on my LC 475, What are you running? Follow up
From: philo
Newsgroups: comp.sys.mac.vintage
Organization: novaBBS
Date: Sat, 13 Nov 2021 23:38 UTC
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Date: Sat, 13 Nov 2021 23:38:51 +0000
Subject: Re: Posting on my LC 475, What are you running? Follow up
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If the drive is HFS , why does Gparted and all the Mac reading Windows utilities say the partition type is unknown?

The drive is working.



Subject: Re: Posting on my LC 475, What are you running? Follow up
From: nospam
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Date: Sun, 14 Nov 2021 00:25 UTC
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From: nos...@nospam.invalid (nospam)
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Subject: Re: Posting on my LC 475, What are you running? Follow up
Date: Sat, 13 Nov 2021 19:25:50 -0500
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In article <37cdbba28f957500d95f5677f424b5f2@news.novabbs.com>, philo
<philo@news.novabbs.com> wrote:

If the drive is HFS , why does Gparted and all the Mac reading Windows
utilities say the partition type is unknown?

without seeing it, i can only guess.

is it readable on a mac??

if not, it's most likely directory corruption. it could also be
unformatted. it's *not* mfs.

post the first 64 bytes of the first four blocks.


Subject: Re: Posting on my LC 475, What are you running? Follow up
From: Eli the Bearded
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Date: Mon, 15 Nov 2021 00:27 UTC
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From: *...@eli.users.panix.com (Eli the Bearded)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.mac.vintage
Subject: Re: Posting on my LC 475, What are you running? Follow up
Date: Mon, 15 Nov 2021 00:27:10 -0000 (UTC)
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In comp.sys.mac.vintage, nospam  <nospam@nospam.invalid> wrote:
Denodster <denodster@gmail.com> wrote:
did ever have a machine set up to run apple unix? I believe that had it's
own filesystem.

It was not the usual HFS filesystem, but I'm pretty sure it was a
fairly standard (for the day) Unix "UFS" filesystem.

it did, however, a/ux was not supported on a mac se.

Not a plain SE, no. SE/30 was the minimum. A/UX required a 68030 with
coprocessor or a 68040. The list of supported devices is here:

https://archive.org/details/bitsavers_applemacaulationGuide1992_3096342/page/n13/mode/2up

Although you have to know that at the time that was written, there were
only two Quadra models (700 and 900). A/UX 2.x did not work on the
Quadras. A/UX 1.x I think only ran on the II / IIfx.

I've run A/UX on IIsi and IIci, and I still have an image of my A/UX
hard disk.

When I tried to mount the disk on Linux, the "mount" command succeeded,
but the files were not readable. I suspect more "Linux support for the
filesystem has issues" than "filesystem was odd" issues.

   mount -t ufs -o ro,ufstype=old /dev/sda3 /mnt/mo

Looks good in syslog:

   Feb  7 16:19:19 miniq kernel: ufs_read_super: fs is active

But then, trying to copy files I got a slew of filesystem errors in syslog
(lines wrapped, first few errors only):

    Feb  7 16:20:42 miniq kernel: UFS-fs error (device 08:03):
        ufs_readdir: bad entry in directory #3635, size 42949673472: reclen %%
        4 != 0 - offset=512, inode=611254264, reclen=9838, namlen=65532
    Feb  7 16:20:44 miniq kernel: UFS-fs error (device 08:03):
        ufs_readdir: bad entry in directory #3644, size 25769804288: reclen %%
        4 != 0 - offset=512, inode=1314258944, reclen=12078, namlen=16
    Feb  7 16:20:46 miniq kernel: UFS-fs error (device 08:03):
        ufs_readdir: bad entry in directory #3650, size 47244640768: reclen %%
        4 != 0 - offset=512, inode=1069135, reclen=22607, namlen=24632
    Feb  7 16:21:04 miniq kernel: UFS-fs error (device 08:03):
        ufs_readdir: bad entry in directory #8971, size 38654706176: reclen %%
        4 != 0 - offset=512, inode=1853126944, reclen=28518, namlen=2637

Elijah
------
archive.org search does not like "a/ux" (use "a ux" with quotes)


Subject: Re: Posting on my LC 475, What are you running? Follow up
From: philo
Newsgroups: comp.sys.mac.vintage
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From: phi...@privacy.net (philo)
Newsgroups: comp.sys.mac.vintage
Subject: Re: Posting on my LC 475, What are you running? Follow up
Date: Sun, 14 Nov 2021 18:44:21 -0600
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On 11/13/21 6:25 PM, nospam wrote:
In article <37cdbba28f957500d95f5677f424b5f2@news.novabbs.com>, philo
<philo@news.novabbs.com> wrote:

If the drive is HFS , why does Gparted and all the Mac reading Windows
utilities say the partition type is unknown?

without seeing it, i can only guess.

is it readable on a mac??

if not, it's most likely directory corruption. it could also be
unformatted. it's *not* mfs.

post the first 64 bytes of the first four blocks.




I think I have it figured out, and you are right, it has to be HFS.

I just pulled the machine back out of storage and booted it up.

It was not running OS-7   it's running OS 6.0.4



What I did not know was that there were two versions of HFS prior to HFS+


This evidently is the first version which supports up to 2 gig drives. The 2nd version starting with OS 7.5 (I believe) supports 4 Gig drives.


What I have therefore surmised is that the Linux and Windows Mac-reading utilities must simply not recognize early HFS.


The drive is not corrupted because I just now ran a diagnostic and it checked OK





Subject: Re: Posting on my LC 475, What are you running? Follow up
From: nospam
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Date: Mon, 15 Nov 2021 02:02 UTC
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From: nos...@nospam.invalid (nospam)
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Subject: Re: Posting on my LC 475, What are you running? Follow up
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In article <smsah6$rnh$1@gioia.aioe.org>, philo <philo@privacy.net>
wrote:

I think I have it figured out, and you are right, it has to be HFS.

yep.

I just pulled the machine back out of storage and booted it up.

It was not running OS-7   it's running OS 6.0.4

that's not surprising for a mac se.

the mac se originally shipped with system 4.0 and supports up to 7.5.5.

What I did not know was that there were two versions of HFS prior to HFS+

there is only one version of hfs.

This evidently is the first version which supports up to 2 gig drives.
The 2nd version starting with OS 7.5 (I believe) supports 4 Gig drives.

hfs supports up to 2 terabyte drives.

the 2 gig limitation was mac os through 7.1.

system 7.5 added support for 4 gb.

the limit was increased to 2 tb for macs that originally shipped with
system 7.5.2 (or later) or has pci slots. the mac se is neither.

What I have therefore surmised is that the Linux and Windows Mac-reading
utilities must simply not recognize early HFS.

there is no 'early hfs'.

hfs was replaced with hfs+ in 1998, but that's a different (although
similar) file system.

The drive is not corrupted because I just now ran a diagnostic and it
checked OK

what diagnostic did you use?

the only one that will reliably find and repair directory corruption is
alsoft diskwarrior.


Subject: Re: Posting on my LC 475, What are you running? Follow up
From: philo
Newsgroups: comp.sys.mac.vintage
Organization: novaBBS
Date: Mon, 15 Nov 2021 04:51 UTC
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Subject: Re: Posting on my LC 475, What are you running? Follow up
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You need to read Apple's knowledge base.
It clearly states that HFS was modified once and semi-clearly states twice.  HFS+ first came out with OS8



Subject: Re: Posting on my LC 475, What are you running? Follow up
From: nospam
Newsgroups: comp.sys.mac.vintage
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Date: Mon, 15 Nov 2021 10:58 UTC
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Subject: Re: Posting on my LC 475, What are you running? Follow up
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In article <362bb29106bc080325f526848f2c9118@news.novabbs.com>, philo
<philo@news.novabbs.com> wrote:

You need to read Apple's knowledge base.

you need to stop trying to tell me about mac os (or apple in general).
i've been writing mac software since 1984, moving to ios about 12 years
ago.

It clearly states that HFS was modified once and semi-clearly states twice.

citation required.

there were minor changes to hfs+, not hfs.

HFS+ first came out with OS8

nope. hfs+ appeared with mac os 8.1.

you might want to re-read whatever it is you supposedly read.


Subject: Re: Posting on my LC 475, What are you running? Follow up
From: philo
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Subject: Re: Posting on my LC 475, What are you running? Follow up
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Since you do not how to search the Apple knowledge base, I will no longer be reading your replies.
Though you ended up wrong again as usual, I did at least learn somethig about MFS.



Subject: Re: Posting on my LC 475, What are you running? Follow up
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Subject: Re: Posting on my LC 475, What are you running? Follow up
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In article <4127633d81a5b92b1a7096b874974bab@news.novabbs.com>, philo
<philo@news.novabbs.com> wrote:

Since you do not how to search the Apple knowledge base, I will no longer be
reading your replies.

as expected, you can't back up your claims and resort to attacks.

post the kb article that states there was more than one version of hfs
or admit you're wrong.

Though you ended up wrong again as usual,

nope. it's *you* who has consistently been wrong, including this.

I did at least learn somethig about
MFS.

only because i explained it to you.


Subject: Re: Posting on my LC 475, What are you running? Follow up
From: Scott Alfter
Newsgroups: comp.sys.mac.vintage
Organization: USS Voyager NCC-74656, Delta Quadrant
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Subject: Re: Posting on my LC 475, What are you running? Follow up
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In article <121120211746166994%nospam@nospam.invalid>,
nospam  <nospam@nospam.invalid> wrote:
In article <5LBjJ.49931$SR4.6229@fx43.iad>, Scott Alfter
<scott@alfter.diespammersdie.us> wrote:


I don't know how easy they are to find now, but I've used a Cayman GatorBox
CS to bridge an Apple IIGS and a Color Classic to Linux servers running
netatalk.  I think I even had them talking to a G4 Mac mini when the Mac was
running Tiger.  Other LocalTalk-to-Ethernet bridges might work, but the
trick with getting older hardware talking to newer hardware is EtherTalk
support.  Linux still supports EtherTalk if you have the right kernel
modules compiled, but IIRC Mac OS X dropped EtherTalk support after 10.4.

or just use a vintage mac. :)

I have a Quadra 610 that could take the GatorBox's place, but it takes more
space. :)

....or if you're referring to hardware and not software, the reason for
connecting to the Linux box and not an old Mac is that most of my files live
there.  At one point, I was using cc65 to cross-compile software that the
IIGS could then copy over and run...not a bad way at all to do that, as you
can take advantage of modern editors, version control, etc.

  _/_
 / v \ Scott Alfter (remove the obvious to send mail)
(IIGS( https://alfter.us/          Top-posting!
 \_^_/                              >What's the most annoying thing on Usenet?



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