Hi all!

Is there a way to change MAC on network card ?

On Monday, April 3, 2023 at 7:44:44 AM UTC-7, El SysMan wrote:
> Hi all!
>
> Is there a way to change MAC on network card ?
Depends on the Network Card.
Most PCI style cards with Digital 21041-AA chip, MAC address can be rewritten with special software.
Earlier versions of ISA or TurboChannel, never tried.

DS series of AlphaServer/Stations (DS10, DS15, DS20, et al.), MAC address can be changed via SRM.

'Crabs

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In article <18fe56ac-a525-49a0-92fa-755965cd2446n@googlegroups.com>,
El SysMan <aaa.vms@gmail.com> wrote:
>Hi all!
>
> Is there a way to change MAC on network card ?

Depends on the card... I remember with the DEQNA having to swap a chip but with
the DELQA I remember it being possible to do under program control. A big deal
for DECNET.
--scott
--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."

El SysMan wrote:

> Hi all!
>
> Is there a way to change MAC on network card ?

I thought TULIP cards could handle multiple MAC addresses in hardware
(good for DECNET)

On 2023-04-03, El SysMan <aaa.vms@gmail.com> wrote:
> Hi all!
>
> Is there a way to change MAC on network card ?

Why do you need to change the MAC address ?

If you are running DECnet Phase IV, the physical address changes during
normal operation anyway.

Do you need to duplicate the hardware address for some licencing reason ?

Simon.

--
Simon Clubley, clubley@remove_me.eisner.decus.org-Earth.UFP
Walking destinations on a map are further away than they appear.

On 2023-04-03 14:44:43 +0000, El SysMan said:

> Is there a way to change MAC on network card ?

Terse questions beget terse answers. Variously terse answers to
questions not intended, too.

On some NICs, swap the ROM. Old DEC NICs often had a swappable socketed
MAC ROM DIP.

On others, scrounge the vendor configuration tool.

For OpenVMS changing the NIC MAC for, say, DECnet, send a $QIO or
$IO_PERFORM at the controller to set the new MAC, per the I/O Abuser's
Reference Manual.

On some Integrity, remap the MACs in the virtual I/O configuration
system, where that was installed.

On some Alpha, set the MAC in the SRM console.

For other systems, see the systems' particular documentation.

Most (All?) NICs support multiple MAC addresses (phys/hardware MAC,
multicast, broadcast), the question is how many can be loaded, and what
happens to NIC performance when the NIC exceeds its internal MAC limits
and falls back to promiscious mode processing.

--
Pure Personal Opinion | HoffmanLabs LLC

> For OpenVMS changing the NIC MAC for, say, DECnet, send a $QIO or
> $IO_PERFORM at the controller to set the new MAC, per the I/O Abuser's
> Reference Manual.
Yeah , i know this way , but it's not applicable in my case.

I got the answer - "No way".
Thanks to all!

On 2023-04-03 19:32:10 +0000, El SysMan said:

>>
>> For OpenVMS changing the NIC MAC for, say, DECnet, send a $QIO or
>> $IO_PERFORM at the controller to set the new MAC, per the I/O Abuser's
>> Reference Manual.
> Yeah , i know this way , but it's not applicable in my case.
>
> I got the answer - "No way".

The question was open-ended, and I'm still not sure what was requested.

If you want to swap a MAC at run-time within OpenVMS, set whatever MAC
you want.

What DECnet does with the MAC is a documented API.

This does not alter the default MAC within the controller non-volatile
storage, but does alter what is visible on the LAN.

--
Pure Personal Opinion | HoffmanLabs LLC

On Monday, April 3, 2023 at 7:44:44 AM UTC-7, El SysMan wrote:
> Is there a way to change MAC on network card ?

Tradition is that you can load a new address on boot.

The usual way to make them, is with an address in ROM,
somewhere, that is loaded into the Ethernet chip on boot.

Some systems allow one to override that at boot time.

For the actual, stored, ROM address, that is a different question.

> Is there a way to change MAC on network card ?

I wouldn't ask you to disrupt completely the way you do your work,
but it might waste less of everyone's time if you revealed some basic
information, such as:

Is there some actual problem which you are trying to solve?
Disclose?

What is the hardware and software involved?

On 2023-04-03 18:30, Scott Dorsey wrote:
> In article <18fe56ac-a525-49a0-92fa-755965cd2446n@googlegroups.com>,
> El SysMan <aaa.vms@gmail.com> wrote:
>> Hi all!
>>
>> Is there a way to change MAC on network card ?
>
> Depends on the card... I remember with the DEQNA having to swap a chip but with
> the DELQA I remember it being possible to do under program control. A big deal
> for DECNET.

The chip is for the manufacture assigned MAC address. All DEC
controllers for anything that could talk DECnet was always able to
change the actually used MAC address in software, since that is a
requirement of DECnet.

DEQNA and DELQA works the same. In fact, in most ways, they are
compatible enough that the same software can be used with either
hardware without changes.

Johnny

On 2023-04-03 18:37, Andy Burns wrote:
> El SysMan wrote:
>
>> Hi all!
>>
>>   Is there a way to change MAC on network card ?
>
> I thought TULIP cards could handle multiple MAC addresses in hardware
> (good for DECNET)

DECnet only uses one MAC address. Things would probably start being a
bit weird if you actually used multiple MAC addresses...

Johnny

On 2023-04-07 21:02:52 +0000, Johnny Billquist said:

> DEQNA and DELQA works the same. In fact, in most ways, they are
> compatible enough that the same software can be used with either
> hardware without changes.

Albeit DEQNA won't work on VAX/VMS V5.4-2 and later, and also had an
unrequited love of screaming.

DEQNA is one of the very few supported features that was intentionally
removed, too.

I'll leave y'all to recall which other OpenVMS or OpenVMS SIP features
were deliberatey yanked, not just deprecated. There weren't very many
cases. Arguably, there should have been a few more.

--
Pure Personal Opinion | HoffmanLabs LLC

On 2023-04-08 00:27, Stephen Hoffman wrote:
> On 2023-04-07 21:02:52 +0000, Johnny Billquist said:
>
>
>> DEQNA and DELQA works the same. In fact, in most ways, they are
>> compatible enough that the same software can be used with either
>> hardware without changes.
>
> Albeit DEQNA won't work on VAX/VMS V5.4-2 and later, and also had an
> unrequited love of screaming.

I know. But that was because of how buggy the firmware is, which was
never fixed. The card is still supported on the PDP-11 side, but at
least RSX have some specific code in there to detect DEQNA going dead,
and kick it to restart it when it happens. I guess VMS people just got
tired of having to deal with that broken hardware.

If it explicitly "won't work" on VMS V5.4-2 or later, then it would be
the software explicitly detecting it to be a DEQNA and refuse to run.
Because interface wise, it works the same as the DELQA. But there are
bits in there to identify which it is.
Then there is the DELQA-Plus, which do have a different interfacing. I
would guess VMS supports that too. RSX do not, and run the DELQA-Plus in
plain DELQA mode. :-(

> DEQNA is one of the very few supported features that was intentionally
> removed, too.

Yeah. And to be honest, I do not like the DEQNA. I actually do not like
the DELQA either. It's better, but it's still problematic. Can't
understand why DEC made such a poor interface to those controllers. The
DEUNA/DELUA is way better, and was done at the same time.

I can only assume that because the DEQNA don't have a generic CPU in
there (if I got things right), they made an interface that was "easy" to
implement with the logic that do exists on the card.

Johnny