On Wednesday, September 22, 2021 at 9:38:28 PM UTC+12, Jan-Erik Söderholm wrote:

> If you compare with scripting languages (Python and such) there is an
> differnce in that the SQL has to be compiled at runtime. A bit less
> efficient then having the SQL compilation done at compile time.

The bottleneck is invariably in the actual query execution, not the compilation. That’s why a large corporation like Facebook can serve billions of active users with an infrastructure centred around MySQL and PHP. Not that I’m saying I like PHP ...

>> COBOL was born back in the era of ISAM files, and never really adapted to
>> the widespread adoption of SQL and relational databases.
>
> That is a complete BS, of course. As anyone really understanding
> these matters understand.

Let me repeat the example I started this discussion with, namely constructing a where-clause from a set of input field values in Python with something like

where_clause = " and ".join \
(
"%s = %s" % (field_name, format_sql_value(params[field_name]))
for field_name in params
if params[field_name] != ""
)

(i.e. only filter on fields where the user actually entered a value).

Try doing the same in COBOL, and you might understand better what I mean.

On Thursday, September 23, 2021 at 5:27:01 AM UTC+12, Simon Clubley wrote:
> On 2021-09-22, Dave Froble <da...@tsoft-inc.com> wrote:
>>
>> I'm not a fan of Cobol, mostly because of all the required typing. So
>> verbose. But once done, it does a decent job.
>>
> You write the code once, but read it many times.
>
> Code should be written to be readable, not to save you a bit of
> typing time.

Unfortunately, COBOL manages to increase your expenditure of reading time as well...

On Thursday, September 23, 2021 at 12:11:54 AM UTC+12, Simon Clubley wrote:
> Lawrence seems to like COBOL about as much as Phillip likes Linux
> and non-DEC keyboards. :-)

I deliberately avoided it during my Comp Sci degree. Yet it turned out to make up the major part of my first job after graduating. I was hired as the Unix expert for this software house (in spite of having far more DEC experience, first on RSTS/E and then on VMS, at that point), but there was precious little Unix work for the first few months, so guess what I was given to fill in the time.

After I left that job, the client I did the COBOL work for called me up at my new job and asked me to come back and continue developing the system for them. I said no.

On 9/22/2021 9:48 PM, Lawrence D’Oliveiro wrote:
> On Wednesday, September 22, 2021 at 9:38:28 PM UTC+12, Jan-Erik Söderholm wrote:
>>> COBOL was born back in the era of ISAM files, and never really adapted to
>>> the widespread adoption of SQL and relational databases.
>>
>> That is a complete BS, of course. As anyone really understanding
>> these matters understand.
>
> Let me repeat the example I started this discussion with, namely constructing a where-clause from a set of input field values in Python with something like
>
> where_clause = " and ".join \
> (
> "%s = %s" % (field_name, format_sql_value(params[field_name]))
> for field_name in params
> if params[field_name] != ""
> )
>
> (i.e. only filter on fields where the user actually entered a value).
>
> Try doing the same in COBOL, and you might understand better what I mean.

I already posted an example of how to do that in Cobol with
embedded SQL with the help of COALESCE.

Is it elegant? No - but it gets the job done.

Arne

On Thursday, September 23, 2021 at 11:40:08 AM UTC+12, Arne Vajhøj wrote:
> That program seems to be reading from some files and inserting
> some information into a database.

Oh good, at least you understood what the “insert” keyword meant. Emacs tells me that sequence I posted has 27 words in it, so you only have 26 more to go!

Hint: it’s doing an insert of a variable number of records, the number being given by the “len(feature_tags)” expression.

On Saturday, August 7, 2021 at 8:06:35 PM UTC-4, Bill Gunshannon wrote:
> On 8/7/21 7:29 PM, Arne Vajhøj wrote:
> > On 8/7/2021 7:23 PM, Simon Clubley wrote:
> >> Before Windows online activation was created, how many people reused
> >> the same licence key on different PCs ? In other words, how many people
> >> had more PCs than licences for the software which ran on them ?
> >
> > Among the home PC build it yourself enthusiasts: millions.
> >
> > But that is not the market VMS is into.
> >
> I suspect that most of the home PC build it yourself market are
> not running Windows at all but Linux, BSD or something else.
>
> bill

The majority are running windows, primarily for gaming. That's the largest build your own market. Build your own for linux installations is a very, very small market. (Spoken as i'm on the way to microcenter to pick up more parts for my bare metal x86_64 VMS systems that i've been running for a couple months now)

(someone wrote)

> > >> Before Windows online activation was created, how many people reused
> > >> the same licence key on different PCs ? In other words, how many people
> > >> had more PCs than licences for the software which ran on them ?
This depends a lot on how you count, and how MS counts, PCs.

If you move a disk from one computer to another, (and properly dispose
of the first one) do you need a new license? As well as I know, MS,
you do.

On the other hand, it is hard to buy a new PC without a Windows license,
so I suspect that there are more licenses around than PC (still) around.

On Sun, 23 Apr 2023 13:39:23 -0700, gah4 wrote:

> (someone wrote)
>
>> > >> Before Windows online activation was created, how many people
>> > >> reused the same licence key on different PCs ? In other words, how
>> > >> many people had more PCs than licences for the software which ran
>> > >> on them ?
>
> This depends a lot on how you count, and how MS counts, PCs.
>
> If you move a disk from one computer to another, (and properly dispose
> of the first one) do you need a new license? As well as I know, MS, you
> do.

Yes and no. If it's an OEM licence, yes. If it's a retail licence, you
don't unless you change lots of components. A phone call usually fixes it.

On Sunday, April 23, 2023 at 3:20:04 PM UTC-7, Bob Eager wrote:
> On Sun, 23 Apr 2023 13:39:23 -0700, gah4 wrote:

> > (someone wrote)
> >> > >> Before Windows online activation was created, how many people
> >> > >> reused the same licence key on different PCs ? In other words, how
> >> > >> many people had more PCs than licences for the software which ran
> >> > >> on them ?
> > If you move a disk from one computer to another, (and properly dispose
> > of the first one) do you need a new license? As well as I know, MS, you
> > do.

> Yes and no. If it's an OEM licence, yes. If it's a retail licence, you
> don't unless you change lots of components. A phone call usually fixes it..

So, as to the question above, you don't have more PCs than licenses,
but not the licenses that you are supposed to have. For home use, it is
unlikely that anyone will come around and check.

On Mon, 24 Apr 2023 20:26:46 -0700, gah4 wrote:

> On Sunday, April 23, 2023 at 3:20:04 PM UTC-7, Bob Eager wrote:
>> On Sun, 23 Apr 2023 13:39:23 -0700, gah4 wrote:
>
>> > (someone wrote)
>
>> >> > >> Before Windows online activation was created, how many people
>> >> > >> reused the same licence key on different PCs ? In other words,
>> >> > >> how many people had more PCs than licences for the software
>> >> > >> which ran on them ?
>
>> > If you move a disk from one computer to another, (and properly
>> > dispose of the first one) do you need a new license? As well as I
>> > know, MS, you do.
>
>> Yes and no. If it's an OEM licence, yes. If it's a retail licence, you
>> don't unless you change lots of components. A phone call usually fixes
>> it.
>
> So, as to the question above, you don't have more PCs than licenses, but
> not the licenses that you are supposed to have. For home use, it is
> unlikely that anyone will come around and check.

Tyhe Windows may deactivate.

On Thursday, August 5, 2021 at 7:55:23 AM UTC+3, Lawrence D’Oliveiro wrote:
> I had a look at the original pakgen.c source from mirrors.pdp-11.ru. I get the impression somebody disassembled a bunch of VAX machine language, then did a straight transliteration into C code.
>
> So I thought I would clean it up a bit. And I managed to knock its size down by a couple hundred lines. I also wrote a Python version, which is less than half the size of the original, and also add a few features. For example, I was able to add the HARDWARE_ID, TOKEN and VERSION atttributes by guessing at their codes. So far I haven’t been able to figure out the RELEASE_DATE and TERMINATION_DATE attributes, most likely because I can’t get the right date-encoding format.

Do search for "VMS Liberation Front" of "VMS Liberation Front packgen":-) El Commandante (The) already have did all work for u.