Are you a Windows user who has heard of Linux and is considering
trying this new operating system? Very good. You have made a very wise
decision. Not the test itself, although it may be a pleasant
experience, but the very fact that you have opened up your mind to new
possibilities. That in itself is worth its weight in gold.

But before you do anything, let me dampen your mojo a little. Your
Linux experience will be inversely proportional to your expectations,
as well as your level of preparedness. So, if you want to test Linux,
maybe even move to it one day, you should make sure you approach the
adventure with a solid dose of soberness and reality. To wit, this
article. Oh so typical

For most Windows folks, their first and often the only experience with
Linux can be summed thusly. They have a nerd friend who is all leet
and dabbles in Linux. The friend shows them his beautiful free-of-
charge desktop. The Windows folks get all excited and want to partake
in the experience. The nerd helpfully points them to the nearest
distro site, they do a bunch of stuff together, and eventually, Linux
is installed. Then, the Windows folks realize that this new operating
system is so vastly different from what they know and care for, they
promptly go back to their old, familiar technology. The phenomenon is
also known as One Night in Bangkok. Overwhelming

Pretty, I wanna, oh wait. Let�s try something different then

I do not want to focus on the technological parts, although they are
important. Yes, you do need to know what hard disks and partitions are
and how they are numbered in Linux. You also need to be able to dabble
in your BIOS, and make changes to the boot order, if necessary. Burn
ISO files to DVD or copy them to a thumb drive. Be willing to search
for solutions to problems, read a little, check error logs, and even
log into an odd forum or three, and ask a few questions. Then, the
learning curve, or rather, the learning hyperbole.

Things get even more complicated when you start considering the vast
array of Linux options out there. Distributions, flavors, editions,
semi-rolling and rolling in my 5.0, with the ragtop down, long-term
versus short-term, 32-bit versus 64-bit, desktop environments, windows
managers, package managers, file formats, binary compatibility, I want
to die, please.

The rest of the article
https://netrunner-mag.com/windows-user-wanna-try-linux-checklist/

On 2022-10-15, Nomen Nescio <nobody@dizum.com> wrote:
> Are you a Windows user who has heard of Linux and is considering
> trying this new operating system? Very good. You have made a very wise

Whatever. It's not a new operating system, so this is wrong right
out of the starting gate. I switched over 20 years ago and have
never looked back. (No Microsoft, Apple, or Google products in my
home or business.)

--
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
18 Reasons I won't be vaccinated -- https://tinyurl.com/ebty2dx3
Covid vaccines: experimental biology -- https://tinyurl.com/57mncfm5
The fraud of "Climate Change" -- https://RealClimateScience.com
There is no "climate crisis" -- https://climatedepot.com
Don't talk to cops! -- https://DontTalkToCops.com
------------------------------------------------------------------------------

On 10/14/2022 10:03 PM, Nomen Nescio wrote:
> Are you a Windows user who has heard of Linux and is considering
> trying this new operating system?
>
> The rest of the article
> https://netrunner-mag.com/windows-user-wanna-try-linux-checklist/

https://www.nytimes.com/2021/07/28/well/move/how-to-fall-safely-sports.html

“Falling is easy,” Dr. Sosnoff said. “Gravity does the work for you.
It’s the landing that’s hard. You need to disperse the impacts when
you strike the ground.”

That's the secret to any new activity. The landing.

Paul

"Roger Blake" <rogblake@iname.invalid> wrote

| Whatever. It's not a new operating system, so this is wrong right
| out of the starting gate. I switched over 20 years ago and have
| never looked back. (No Microsoft, Apple, or Google products in my
| home or business.)
| | --
| ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
| 18 Reasons I won't be vaccinated -- https://tinyurl.com/ebty2dx3
| Covid vaccines: experimental biology -- https://tinyurl.com/57mncfm5
| The fraud of "Climate Change" -- https://RealClimateScience.com
| There is no "climate crisis" -- https://climatedepot.com
| Don't talk to cops! -- https://DontTalkToCops.com
| ------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Yet here you are, in a Windows group. Did you want to
warn us that Windows causes vaccines, or does it cause
lack of climate change?

Nomen Nescio <nobody@dizum.com> wrote in
news:96f2f1874ac5184d1d06333b56157dae@dizum.com:

> Are you a Windows user who has heard of Linux and is
> considering trying this new operating system? Very good.
> You have made a very wise decision. Not the test itself,
> although it may be a pleasant experience, but the very f

<SNIP>

> 64-bit, desktop environments, windows managers, package
> managers, file formats, binary compatibility, I want to
> die, please.
>
> The rest of the article
> https://netrunner-mag.com/windows-user-wanna-try-linux-check
> list/

Your diatribe fails in one way. *USING* a Linux desktop is very similar to *USING* a
Windows desktop.

It's been my experience, that most people don't know sh*t about WIndows either, they
just *USE IT*, and always have a friend help them out when they're in a jam. Yes, I was
'that friend'.

Aside from the afementioned difference, like drive names for one, it's almost identical
to use.

A typical Linux desktop will have a "Start Menu" of some sorts used to launch
programs, a 'Desktop' area, that you can set a pretty backround in and place icons
(Launchers) to start programs. Applications are presented to you in a "windows",
typically with MIN/MAX/CLOSE buttons in the upper right.

....blah, blah, blah, I can go on and on, but, the truth is, *USING* a Linux based PC is
very much just like *USING* a Windows PC. Hell, even a LOT of the most commonly
used applications have Windows and Linux versions.

Do you know what oneof the better parts of a Linux DT is? Being able to change the
'Window Decorations'....that's Linux-speak for each window's border/min/max/close
button sets.

See, Win7 has Aero, it's a pretty attractive interface, all things considered. Windows
10? Looks like we're back to Win 3.1 square, flat button. Fugly as sh*t.

I know, I know, aesthetics don't "get work done" which is what a lot of people cry when
you mention this...but there's no rule that says anything to "get the job done" needs to
be ugly and unattractive.

I mean, come on, do you want to be felated (if you're a male) by 400lb 4 foot 11 inch
pock-faced crackwhore with a partial beard, or would you prefer an attractive, easy-to-
look-at woman? In the end, they'll both "get the job done", but...

Same thing with an OS. I even *had* *to* buy WindowBlinds to use on my main Win10
PC, because I couldn't stand looking at the crackwhore it looks like, after using the very
easy-to-look-at Win7.

No, I haven't used a Linux-based PC in years. I gave that up after becoming
increasingly frustrated with the difficulty in troubleshooting and solving problems that
arise.

Spending hours and hours and hours over several days trying anything under the sun
to fix what seems like should be a simple fix, often posting many many terminal
outputs of cryptic CLI gobbledeygook (as a friend calls it) to newsgroups filled with
pompous people that look down on you if you're not willing to learn deep technicalities
of all the different subsystems and chipset 'architectures'.

To a Linux aficianado (sp?), automated tools are sacrilege. The last troubleshooting
fiasco had me wasting probably 5 hours trying to get a Linux PC to boot...when I finally
came across a boot image named "BootRepair" (a bootable ISO) that fixed the whole
damn thing in 2 minutes. If those jackases in the newsgroup would have offered
this...but nooooooo!!!

....but that doesn't mean Linux isn't good for some people.

On 2022-10-15, Mayayana <mayayana@invalid.nospam> wrote:
> Yet here you are, in a Windows group. Did you want to
> warn us that Windows causes vaccines, or does it cause
> lack of climate change?

I'm in a Windows group only because I support it for others in my work. I do
not use it myself. I don't barge in here starting topics about Linux or
anything else, but was simply responding to someone else who brought it up.
(I'd just as soon be running TOPS-20 but that OS died with the 36-bit
hardware architecture it was tied to.)

The main thing that Windows "causes" is aggravation. As far as the rest of
it, if you want to participate in medical experimentation that's your
decision (I decline), and there is no man-made "climate crisis". However
those things are even more off-topic here than choice of OS - but you
decided to bring them up nonetheless.

--
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
18 Reasons I won't be vaccinated -- https://tinyurl.com/ebty2dx3
Covid vaccines: experimental biology -- https://tinyurl.com/57mncfm5
The fraud of "Climate Change" -- https://RealClimateScience.com
There is no "climate crisis" -- https://climatedepot.com
Don't talk to cops! -- https://DontTalkToCops.com
------------------------------------------------------------------------------

In article <20221015035549@news.eternal-september.org>
Roger Blake <rogblake@iname.invalid> wrote:
>
> On 2022-10-15, Nomen Nescio <nobody@dizum.com> wrote:
> > Are you a Windows user who has heard of Linux and is considering
> > trying this new operating system? Very good. You have made a very wise
>
> Whatever. It's not a new operating system, so this is wrong right
> out of the starting gate. I switched over 20 years ago and have
> never looked back. (No Microsoft, Apple, or Google products in my
> home or business.)
>

The article was published 2014. Linux was still relatively new at that
point.

I like the way none of you Linux tekkies allowed the article to be
shown.

The article proves that Linux is for tekkie types only. You people
probably also believe no one should be allowed to own a car who cannot
repair a transmission or an engine. The average Windows user wants
SIMPLE. Windows is SIMPLE.

The average Windows user has no desire to deal with the following in
order to use Linux.

"I do not want to focus on the technological parts, although they are
important. Yes, you do need to know what hard disks and partitions are
and how they are numbered in Linux. You also need to be able to dabble
in your BIOS, and make changes to the boot order, if necessary. Burn
ISO files to DVD or copy them to a thumb drive. Be willing to search
for solutions to problems, read a little, check error logs, and even
log into an odd forum or three, and ask a few questions. Then, the
learning curve, or rather, the learning hyperbole.

Things get even more complicated when you start considering the vast
array of Linux options out there. Distributions, flavors, editions,
semi-rolling and rolling in my 5.0, with the ragtop down, long-term
versus short-term, 32-bit versus 64-bit, desktop environments, windows
managers, package managers, file formats, binary compatibility, I want
to die, please."

Are you people freak'n serious?

Since you hid the real meat of my post, I'm reposting the link for any
who are even remotely curious about driving themselves nuts trying to
be a "home" tekkie.

https://netrunner-mag.com/windows-user-wanna-try-linux-checklist/

You Linux obsessives are as bad as the psychos in power today who
believe what they want everybody should want.

Roger Blake wrote:
> On 2022-10-15, Nomen Nescio <nobody@dizum.com> wrote:
>> Are you a Windows user who has heard of Linux and is considering
>> trying this new operating system? Very good. You have made a very wise
>
> Whatever. It's not a new operating system, so this is wrong right
> out of the starting gate. I switched over 20 years ago and have
> never looked back. (No Microsoft, Apple, or Google products in my
> home or business.)

How do you run all your Windows games?
How do you run Windows office apps that MUST connect to company and MS
servers? i.e.: Office 20xx, Teams, Cloud, etc.
I have Linux Mint. It's good for email and web browsing but not much else.

Nomen Nescio <nobody@dizum.com> wrote in
news:cb1c49e86748587207b65a6419a0d1b0@dizum.com:

> In article <20221015035549@news.eternal-september.org>
> Roger Blake <rogblake@iname.invalid> wrote:
>>
>> On 2022-10-15, Nomen Nescio <nobody@dizum.com> wrote:
>> > Are you a Windows user who has heard of Linux and is
>> > considering trying this new operating system? Very good.
>> > You have made a very wise
>>
>> Whatever. It's not a new operating system, so this is
>> wrong right out of the starting gate. I switched over 20
>> years ago and have never looked back. (No Microsoft,
>> Apple, or Google products in my home or business.)
>>
>
> The article was published 2014. Linux was still relatively
> new at that point.

Meeeeeh.....I bought a boxed copy of Mandrake Linux in 1999 at a Highland
SuperStore, that came complete with print (read as heavy) manuals included in the
box. So in 2014, "Linux" was at least 15 years old.

From this article (https://itsfoss.com/earliest-linux-distros/)...

...."TAMU Linux was developed by Aggies at Texas A&M with the Texas A&M Unix &
Linux Users Group in May 1992 and was called TAMU 1.0A. It was the first Linux
distribution to offer the X Window System instead of just a text based operating
system."...

So, GUI Linux is older than Windows 95. And Windows didn't really take off until
WIndows 95 was released.

>
> I like the way none of you Linux tekkies allowed the
> article to be shown.
>
> The article proves that Linux is for tekkie types only. You
> people probably also believe no one should be allowed to
> own a car who cannot repair a transmission or an engine.
> The average Windows user wants SIMPLE. Windows is SIMPLE.
>
> The average Windows user has no desire to deal with the
> following in order to use Linux.
>
> "I do not want to focus on the technological parts,
> although they are important. Yes, you do need to know what
> hard disks and partitions are and how they are numbered in
> Linux. You also need to be able to dabble in your BIOS, and
> make changes to the boot order, if necessary. Burn ISO
> files to DVD or copy them to a thumb drive. Be willing to
> search for solutions to problems, read a little, check
> error logs, and even log into an odd forum or three, and
> ask a few questions. Then, the learning curve, or rather,
> the learning hyperbole.
>
> Things get even more complicated when you start considering
> the vast array of Linux options out there. Distributions,
> flavors, editions, semi-rolling and rolling in my 5.0, with
> the ragtop down, long-term versus short-term, 32-bit versus
> 64-bit, desktop environments, windows managers, package
> managers, file formats, binary compatibility, I want to
> die, please."
>
> Are you people freak'n serious?
>
> Since you hid the real meat of my post, I'm reposting the
> link for any who are even remotely curious about driving
> themselves nuts trying to be a "home" tekkie.
>
> https://netrunner-mag.com/windows-user-wanna-try-linux-check
> list/
>
> You Linux obsessives are as bad as the psychos in power
> today who believe what they want everybody should want.

DanS <t.h.i.s.n.t.h.a.t@r.o.a.d.r.u.n.n.e.r.c.o.m> wrote:
> Nomen Nescio <nobody@dizum.com> wrote in
> news:cb1c49e86748587207b65a6419a0d1b0@dizum.com:
[...]

> > The article was published 2014. Linux was still relatively
> > new at that point.
>
> Meeeeeh.....I bought a boxed copy of Mandrake Linux in 1999 at a
> Highland SuperStore, that came complete with print (read as heavy)
> manuals included in the box. So in 2014, "Linux" was at least 15 years
> old.
>
> From this article (https://itsfoss.com/earliest-linux-distros/)...
>
> ..."TAMU Linux was developed by Aggies at Texas A&M with the Texas A&M
> Unix & Linux Users Group in May 1992 and was called TAMU 1.0A. It was
> the first Linux distribution to offer the X Window System instead of
> just a text based operating system."...
>
> So, GUI Linux is older than Windows 95. And Windows didn't really take
> off until WIndows 95 was released.

Well I was using GUI UNIX at least six years before either existed, so
there you go!

What's my prize? (*What*!? This *wasn't* a contest!? :-))

Frank Slootweg <this@ddress.is.invalid> wrote in
news:tif3p8.pu0.1@ID-201911.user.individual.net:

> DanS <t.h.i.s.n.t.h.a.t@r.o.a.d.r.u.n.n.e.r.c.o.m> wrote:
>> Nomen Nescio <nobody@dizum.com> wrote in
>> news:cb1c49e86748587207b65a6419a0d1b0@dizum.com:
> [...]
>
>> > The article was published 2014. Linux was still
>> > relatively new at that point.
>>
>> Meeeeeh.....I bought a boxed copy of Mandrake Linux in
>> 1999 at a Highland SuperStore, that came complete with
>> print (read as heavy) manuals included in the box. So in
>> 2014, "Linux" was at least 15 years old.
>>
>> From this article
>> (https://itsfoss.com/earliest-linux-distros/)...
>>
>> ..."TAMU Linux was developed by Aggies at Texas A&M with
>> the Texas A&M Unix & Linux Users Group in May 1992 and was
>> called TAMU 1.0A. It was the first Linux distribution to
>> offer the X Window System instead of just a text based
>> operating system."...
>>
>> So, GUI Linux is older than Windows 95. And Windows didn't
>> really take off until WIndows 95 was released.
>
> Well I was using GUI UNIX at least six years before
> either existed, so
> there you go!
>
> What's my prize? (*What*!? This *wasn't* a contest!? :-))

No. No contest. (Is this where I mention my VAXX experience?)

It was mentioned to illustrate that in 2014, (GUI) Linux wasn't 'relatively new', and had
been around for over two decades at that point.

On 10/15/2022 11:45 AM, Paul in Houston TX wrote:
> Roger Blake wrote:
>> On 2022-10-15, Nomen Nescio <nobody@dizum.com> wrote:
>>> Are you a Windows user who has heard of Linux and is considering
>>> trying this new operating system? Very good. You have made a very wise
>>
>> Whatever. It's not a new operating system, so this is wrong right
>> out of the starting gate. I switched over 20 years ago and have
>> never looked back. (No Microsoft, Apple, or Google products in my
>> home or business.)
>
> How do you run all your Windows games?
> How do you run Windows office apps that MUST connect to company and MS servers?  i.e.: Office 20xx, Teams, Cloud, etc.
> I have Linux Mint.  It's good for email and web browsing but not much else.

They're nibbling around the edges.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Proton_%28software%29

"Proton incorporates several libraries that improve 3D performance.
These include Direct3D-to-Vulkan translation layers, namely DXVK for
Direct3D 9, 10 and 11, and VKD3D-Proton for Direct3D 12. A separate
library known as D9VK handled Direct3D 9 support until it was merged
into DXVK in December 2019."

But really the question is, who at the gaming studios
cares about Linux, and who will repair the environment
when something breaks. Even on Windows, games are kept
alive by putting custom hacks in stuff.

I used to play games in MacOS... and after a while you get
used to 20FPS. No matter how carefully a game was ported
(and there were some good ports), the platform still wasn't
the same. It's like putting lipstick on a pig. "Nice try."

One thing that aids portability, is OpenGL. That's how Firefox
runs on Windows. It uses OpenGL type rendering. about:support
may mention the OpenGL calls in your environment. That did not
mean OpenGL was good, merely that OpenGL was available on
more than one platform. Some games were written on OpenGL as well,
even though initially, porting the games to a million different
places, wasn't the immediate plan. it was a long-term plan.

Some people, may remember years ago, copying "opengl32.dll"
into a game folder :-) Like while using my Matrox video card
(four whole megabytes of VRAM).

*******

And if you think things aren't complicated enough, Firefox supports
at least three Linux environments. Stuff that is in transition.

"wayland" [ means working directly under wayland at present ]
"xwayland" [ running legacy X11 by using xwayland compatibility part of wayland]
"x11" [ running X11 under X11 ]

[Picture]

https://i.postimg.cc/MHgVxtC7/FF10402-three-modes.gif

Plus Firefox works under WSLg, which is likely feature-similar to
one of the three above.

In any case "about:support" tells you what is happening currently.
Even a user in MacOS could visit there, and see "Quartz" or some
other Apple-specific graphics capability.

When you bring games across-platform, think of the "firefox style mess"
you'd be in, to support all of them.

Paul

"DanS" <t.h.i.s.n.t.h.a.t@r.o.a.d.r.u.n.n.e.r.c.o.m> wrote

| I bought a boxed copy of Mandrake Linux in 1999 at a Highland
| SuperStore, that came complete with print (read as heavy) manuals included
in the
| box.

I remember that. Once I figured out Windows, I started
trying other things. I tried Redhat 4, Mandrake 5, then
eventually settled on Suse. I'd set them up, try and fail
to get it to see my modem, then leave it installed for
awhile. What else could I do? There was no software.
I even paid $70, as I recall, for Be. That didn't even have
drivers for graphics, so it was black and white.

I kept trying Linux periodically. But it gradually went from
empty framework that required constant commandline, to
locked down kiddie OS that still required constant commandline.
I've written a lot of software and scripts on Windows. One big
reason is because if I have to do something regularly then I
want a button to do it. It's worth it to me to create that
button. The average Linux geek likes to feel like a secret
wizard, making incantations. So they want arcane commandline
whenever possible.

My last Linux exploration led me to Reddit before I was even
able to install the test systems. Things were hidden "for my own
good". Fedora erased my boot manager without asking, and I was
told it's supposed to do that "because no one understands
boot managers so Fedora just takes over." Another version
required a password that I had never entered... Geeks and
their secret decoder rings. I think it was Mint that started
me out with green, Sesame Street folders. It was so annoying
that I just rebooted and erased that mess.

And of course, there's still very little software. There's
still no easy firewall that can block outgoing by process, like I
have on all my Windows computers. I have 3 firewalls. They're
all easy to use. No commandline. I think the last time I needed
commandline on Windows was when I really needed to swap out
the HAL library to accommodate a dual-core CPU on a single-core
machine. :)

WINE had been made more complicated and couldn't support
both 32/64 with one version, last time I tried it...

It's like getting a used car built
by a greasemonkey. The engine is a beauty. The right passenger
door is missing. The back windshield is cracked. No upholstery.
It won't pass inspection. And there's no user manual. ("You want
help files, ask a help file writer. I write code!")... Then the
greasemonkey yells at you for wanting a car that you can drive. :)

DanS <t.h.i.s.n.t.h.a.t@r.o.a.d.r.u.n.n.e.r.c.o.m> wrote:
> Frank Slootweg <this@ddress.is.invalid> wrote in
> news:tif3p8.pu0.1@ID-201911.user.individual.net:
>
> > DanS <t.h.i.s.n.t.h.a.t@r.o.a.d.r.u.n.n.e.r.c.o.m> wrote:
> >> Nomen Nescio <nobody@dizum.com> wrote in
> >> news:cb1c49e86748587207b65a6419a0d1b0@dizum.com:
> > [...]
> >
> >> > The article was published 2014. Linux was still
> >> > relatively new at that point.
> >>
> >> Meeeeeh.....I bought a boxed copy of Mandrake Linux in
> >> 1999 at a Highland SuperStore, that came complete with
> >> print (read as heavy) manuals included in the box. So in
> >> 2014, "Linux" was at least 15 years old.
> >>
> >> From this article
> >> (https://itsfoss.com/earliest-linux-distros/)...
> >>
> >> ..."TAMU Linux was developed by Aggies at Texas A&M with
> >> the Texas A&M Unix & Linux Users Group in May 1992 and was
> >> called TAMU 1.0A. It was the first Linux distribution to
> >> offer the X Window System instead of just a text based
> >> operating system."...
> >>
> >> So, GUI Linux is older than Windows 95. And Windows didn't
> >> really take off until WIndows 95 was released.
> >
> > Well I was using GUI UNIX at least six years before either
> > existed, so there you go!
> >
> > What's my prize? (*What*!? This *wasn't* a contest!? :-))
>
> No. No contest. (Is this where I mention my VAXX experience?)

"VAX" (note spelling)? Wasn't that some kind of newfangled computer?
Real Men (TM) used Real Computers (TM) *way* before that!

> It was mentioned to illustrate that in 2014, (GUI) Linux wasn't
> 'relatively new', and had been around for over two decades at that
> point.

Yeah, I got your point. I was just adding more nonsense to a (mostly)
nonsense thread. (And I just added some more.)

Paul wrote:
> On 10/15/2022 11:45 AM, Paul in Houston TX wrote:
>> Roger Blake wrote:
>>> On 2022-10-15, Nomen Nescio <nobody@dizum.com> wrote:
>>>> Are you a Windows user who has heard of Linux and is considering
>>>> trying this new operating system? Very good. You have made a very wise
>>>
>>> Whatever. It's not a new operating system, so this is wrong right
>>> out of the starting gate. I switched over 20 years ago and have
>>> never looked back. (No Microsoft, Apple, or Google products in my
>>> home or business.)
>>
>> How do you run all your Windows games?
>> How do you run Windows office apps that MUST connect to company and MS
>> servers?  i.e.: Office 20xx, Teams, Cloud, etc.
>> I have Linux Mint.  It's good for email and web browsing but not much
>> else.
>
> They're nibbling around the edges.
>
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Proton_%28software%29
>
>    "Proton incorporates several libraries that improve 3D performance.
>     These include Direct3D-to-Vulkan translation layers, namely DXVK for
>     Direct3D 9, 10 and 11, and VKD3D-Proton for Direct3D 12. A separate
>     library known as D9VK handled Direct3D 9 support until it was merged
>     into DXVK in December 2019."
>
> But really the question is, who at the gaming studios
> cares about Linux, and who will repair the environment
> when something breaks. Even on Windows, games are kept
> alive by putting custom hacks in stuff.
>
> I used to play games in MacOS... and after a while you get
> used to 20FPS. No matter how carefully a game was ported
> (and there were some good ports), the platform still wasn't
> the same. It's like putting lipstick on a pig. "Nice try."
>
> One thing that aids portability, is OpenGL. That's how Firefox
> runs on Windows. It uses OpenGL type rendering. about:support
> may mention the OpenGL calls in your environment. That did not
> mean OpenGL was good, merely that OpenGL was available on
> more than one platform. Some games were written on OpenGL as well,
> even though initially, porting the games to a million different
> places, wasn't the immediate plan. it was a long-term plan.
>
> Some people, may remember years ago, copying "opengl32.dll"
> into a game folder :-) Like while using my Matrox video card
> (four whole megabytes of VRAM).
>
> *******
>
> And if you think things aren't complicated enough, Firefox supports
> at least three Linux environments. Stuff that is in transition.
>
>       "wayland"   [ means working directly under wayland at present ]
>       "xwayland"  [ running legacy X11 by using xwayland compatibility
> part of wayland]
>       "x11"       [ running X11 under X11 ]
>
>       [Picture]
>
>       https://i.postimg.cc/MHgVxtC7/FF10402-three-modes.gif
>
> Plus Firefox works under WSLg, which is likely feature-similar to
> one of the three above.
>
> In any case "about:support" tells you what is happening currently.
> Even a user in MacOS could visit there, and see "Quartz" or some
> other Apple-specific graphics capability.
>
> When you bring games across-platform, think of the "firefox style mess"
> you'd be in, to support all of them.
>
>    Paul

I see. Interesting. Thank you!

"Mayayana" <mayayana@invalid.nospam> wrote in
news:tigtbv$351ul$1@dont-email.me:

> "DanS" <t.h.i.s.n.t.h.a.t@r.o.a.d.r.u.n.n.e.r.c.o.m> wrote
>
>| I bought a boxed copy of Mandrake Linux in 1999 at a
>| Highland SuperStore, that came complete with print (read
>| as heavy) manuals included
> in the
>| box.
>
> I remember that. Once I figured out Windows, I started
> trying other things. I tried Redhat 4, Mandrake 5, then
> eventually settled on Suse. I'd set them up, try and fail
> to get it to see my modem, then leave it installed for
> awhile. What else could I do? There was no software.
> I even paid $70, as I recall, for Be. That didn't even have
> drivers for graphics, so it was black and white.

Be (OS?) (BeOS.)

"DanS" <t.h.i.s.n.t.h.a.t@r.o.a.d.r.u.n.n.e.r.c.o.m> wrote

| Be (OS?) (BeOS.)
|

Yes. It was supposed to be an amazingly well made
system, by some Apple people, I think. But they never
really got it off the ground. They had boxed CDs, but
few drivers and no software. Like Linux, or like a 10-year-old
building a model Mazerati, once it was set up there was
no longer any point.

Then I ran into VBScript and understood that I could
tinker with what happens behind the screen, not just
with what's already on the screen. After that I stopped
looking for model Mazeratis and Deloreans to build. :)

"Mayayana" <mayayana@invalid.nospam> wrote in news:tim4bf$3nqe8$1@dont-
email.me:

> "DanS" <t.h.i.s.n.t.h.a.t@r.o.a.d.r.u.n.n.e.r.c.o.m> wrote
>
>| Be (OS?) (BeOS.)
>|
>
> Yes. It was supposed to be an amazingly well made
> system, by some Apple people, I think. But they never
> really got it off the ground. They had boxed CDs, but
> few drivers and no software. Like Linux, or like a 10-year-old
> building a model Mazerati, once it was set up there was
> no longer any point.

Yes, I had tried out BeOS back when, after developing a disillusion with Win9x and I
was looking for an alternative. That's how I ended up with the retail boxed Mandrake.

Interesting that the BeOS experiment has been kept going and is now something called
'Haiku'.

https://www.haiku-os.org

....the screenshots look like any DE you might find in the *nix world today.

> Then I ran into VBScript and understood that I could
> tinker with what happens behind the screen, not just
> with what's already on the screen. After that I stopped
> looking for model Mazeratis and Deloreans to build. :)

On Wed, 19 Oct 2022 21:26:35 +0000, DanS wrote:

> Interesting that the BeOS experiment has been kept going and is now something called
> 'Haiku'.
>
> https://www.haiku-os.org
>
> ...the screenshots look like any DE you might find in the *nix world today.

Not really - take a closer look. And look out for Haiku week on the
Lunduke blogs.

"mechanic" <mechanic@example.net> wrote

| > https://www.haiku-os.org
| >
| > ...the screenshots look like any DE you might find in the *nix world
today.
| | Not really - take a closer look. And look out for Haiku week on the
| Lunduke blogs.

Yet another eternal beta. They say it runs Libre Office,
but they don't say which version. I guess it must be the
Intel Mac version? But it does have a certain nostalgic appeal:
Just as with BeOS 25 years ago, there's a good chance it
won't support my graphics chip. Maybe I could stream
old Jackie Gleason shows in black and white. :)

On 15/10/2022 10:03 am, Nomen Nescio wrote:
> Are you a Windows user who has heard of Linux and is considering
> trying this new operating system? Very good. You have made a very wise
> decision. Not the test itself, although it may be a pleasant
> experience, but the very fact that you have opened up your mind to new
> possibilities. That in itself is worth its weight in gold.
> ...
> Things get even more complicated when you start considering the vast
> array of Linux options out there. Distributions, flavors, editions,
> semi-rolling and rolling in my 5.0, with the ragtop down, long-term
> versus short-term, 32-bit versus 64-bit, desktop environments, windows
> managers, package managers, file formats, binary compatibility, I want
> to die, please.

Just don't do anything until you understand what's under the hood. There
is nothing wrong with Window$, as a rich client against Linux servers.

On 20/10/2022 10:16 pm, Mr. Man-wai Chang wrote:
>
> Just don't do anything until you understand what's under the hood. There
> is nothing wrong with Window$, as a rich client against Linux servers.

But if you were curious about Linux as a client, you can always use a
virtual machine to play with it.