Hey, remember when Epic used to give away games every day? Now they
only do it once a week; the selfish bastards! ;-)

(Actually, I think I prefer this slower pace. It was getting hard to
keep up with the daily give-aways).

Anyway, this week we get:

Galactic Civilizations III
https://www.epicgames.com/store/en-US/p/galactic-civilizations-iii

This is another repeat game (first offered back in January 2021), but
that's cool; it's a good game. Well, good enough. As a 4X space
strategy game, it provides everything you'd expect. It will never top
the "Masters of Orion" games, but then I've yet to meet a game in that
genre that can.

GalCiv3 is a bit too "kitchen-sink" for me; that is, the developers
kept adding more systems and complexity to the game ("everything and
the kitchen sink", as the saying goes) whether it actually improved
the gameplay or not, just because saying it had all those features
looked good in marketing. The end result is a top-heavy, slow game
with some half-baked features, especially its unimpressive AI.

Still, i is a pretty game and if you enjoy games in the 4X space
strategy genre, this isn't a bad one; it's just not one of the greats.
It's worth adding to the library though, so snag it before it's
gone... you got less than a week!

On Thu, 13 Jan 2022 12:28:08 -0500, Spalls Hurgenson
<spallshurgenson@gmail.com> wrote:

>This is another repeat game (first offered back in January 2021), but

Yes, 'In Library' already according to Epic.

>that's cool; it's a good game. Well, good enough. As a 4X space
>strategy game, it provides everything you'd expect. It will never top
>the "Masters of Orion" games, but then I've yet to meet a game in that
>genre that can.

If you mean Space 4x games, I agree. Master of Orion is permanently
installed. I should get around to installing the sequel as I own it
along with the strategy guide. I am just afraid I am not going to like
it as much as the first as I like the simplicity of just building
factories and moving sliders in MOO 1.

On Thu, 13 Jan 2022 13:40:15 -0500, Mike S. <Mike_S@nowhere.com>
wrote:

>If you mean Space 4x games, I agree.

Ok, I can see now from your post that you were talking about 4x space
games. But if we are talking about 4x games in general, my favorite
has always been Heroes of Might & Magic 3. I would suggest trying it,
but I am sure you already have.

On Thu, 13 Jan 2022 13:50:35 -0500, Mike S. <Mike_S@nowhere.com>
wrote:
>On Thu, 13 Jan 2022 13:40:15 -0500, Mike S. <Mike_S@nowhere.com>
>wrote:

>>If you mean Space 4x games, I agree.

>Ok, I can see now from your post that you were talking about 4x space
>games. But if we are talking about 4x games in general, my favorite
>has always been Heroes of Might & Magic 3. I would suggest trying it,
>but I am sure you already have.

Well, I can't say that you're wrong with that assumption... then
again, it didn't really require much effort on your part. An
old-school strategy game? Of course I've played it. ;-)

The Civilization games remain "king of the hill" for the 4X genre in
general; Master of Orion gets the top position only if I limit it to
"space 4X strategy". I waffle between whether I like MOO1 or MOO2
more; I quite enjoy the original game's simplicity, but at other times
I prefer the sequel's added layers of complexity.

I never quite felt the same way about the HOMM series. They're fine
games, do not mistake my words, but I never found them quite as
engrossing. I think - it's been a while since I played - it's that
none of the mechanics felt all the way developed; the exploration was
humdrum, the city-building too limited, and the combat rather mundane.

I'm not sure when I gave up on the franchise - I think I played up
through HOMM5 and maybe dabbled a bit with Chronicles? - but they all
seemed very much the same too me. I can't remember if HOMM3 was any
better (or worse) than HOMM2 or HOMM4. The whole franchise just seemed
to be running in place, never really improving except for their
graphics.

Then again, the best part of the game for me was the city-building,
and I found it rather annoying that I had to keep scrounging for loot
and fighting off all those annoying warlords, so my take on the game
is arguably suspect ;-)

On Thu, 13 Jan 2022 12:28:08 -0500, Spalls Hurgenson
<spallshurgenson@gmail.com> wrote:

>Hey, remember when Epic used to give away games every day? Now they
>only do it once a week; the selfish bastards! ;-)
>
>(Actually, I think I prefer this slower pace. It was getting hard to
>keep up with the daily give-aways).
>
>Anyway, this week we get:
>
>Galactic Civilizations III
>https://www.epicgames.com/store/en-US/p/galactic-civilizations-iii
>
>This is another repeat game (first offered back in January 2021), but
>that's cool; it's a good game. Well, good enough. As a 4X space
>strategy game, it provides everything you'd expect. It will never top
>the "Masters of Orion" games, but then I've yet to meet a game in that
>genre that can.
>
>GalCiv3 is a bit too "kitchen-sink" for me; that is, the developers
>kept adding more systems and complexity to the game ("everything and
>the kitchen sink", as the saying goes) whether it actually improved
>the gameplay or not, just because saying it had all those features
>looked good in marketing. The end result is a top-heavy, slow game
>with some half-baked features, especially its unimpressive AI.
>
>Still, i is a pretty game and if you enjoy games in the 4X space
>strategy genre, this isn't a bad one; it's just not one of the greats.
>It's worth adding to the library though, so snag it before it's
>gone... you got less than a week!
>

*---

Isn't this something Spalls! I have been thinking about a space
strategy game and especially one of StarDocks since I have just about
all their awesome software for Windows.

In fact, just this morning!

Thanks!

I added it to my library. I will probably download it soon and check
it out. My jerk ISP WispWest caps me at night and/or they give
priority to people streaming games and movies. I can't even play a
game at night becuase of my lousy speed and ping time.

They won't admit that, of course!

-pw

On Thu, 13 Jan 2022 13:40:15 -0500, Mike S. <Mike_S@nowhere.com>
wrote:

>On Thu, 13 Jan 2022 12:28:08 -0500, Spalls Hurgenson
><spallshurgenson@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>>This is another repeat game (first offered back in January 2021), but
>
>Yes, 'In Library' already according to Epic.
>
>>that's cool; it's a good game. Well, good enough. As a 4X space
>>strategy game, it provides everything you'd expect. It will never top
>>the "Masters of Orion" games, but then I've yet to meet a game in that
>>genre that can.
>
>If you mean Space 4x games, I agree. Master of Orion is permanently
>installed. I should get around to installing the sequel as I own it
>along with the strategy guide. I am just afraid I am not going to like
>it as much as the first as I like the simplicity of just building
>factories and moving sliders in MOO 1.

*---

It is $25 at Steam. I forgot about that one.

Thanks Mike S. I added it to my wishlist.
-pw

On Thu, 13 Jan 2022 16:18:00 -0500, Spalls Hurgenson
<spallshurgenson@gmail.com> wrote:

>I'm not sure when I gave up on the franchise - I think I played up
>through HOMM5 and maybe dabbled a bit with Chronicles? - but they all
>seemed very much the same too me. I can't remember if HOMM3 was any
>better (or worse) than HOMM2 or HOMM4. The whole franchise just seemed
>to be running in place, never really improving except for their
>graphics.

HOMM 3 is an upgrade over HOMM 2. HOMM 4 is a different take on the
formula which some preferred. HOMM 5 is HOMM 3 in 3-D for the most
part. I have no experience with the others. I am not surprised at all
that you played some in this series already. Of course you have.

I am also a big fan of Civ 3. I have not gotten around to trying Civ 4
yet but it is installed so I hopefully will soon. I got the impression
from reviews back in the day that Civ 4 was better liked then Civ 3.

On Thu, 13 Jan 2022 21:55:50 -0700, PW
<iamnotusingonewithAgent@notinuse.com> wrote:

>It is $25 at Steam. I forgot about that one.
>
>Thanks Mike S. I added it to my wishlist.
>-pw

The only Master of Orion I see for $25 on Steam is NOT the same Master
of Orion I am talking about. I am referring to the original Microprose
game that came out in 1993 for DOS.

This new Master of Orion on Steam came out in 2016 and I have no
experience with it. In truth, you reminded me of this new one! :)

On Fri, 14 Jan 2022 09:00:23 -0500, Mike S. <Mike_S@nowhere.com>
wrote:

>On Thu, 13 Jan 2022 21:55:50 -0700, PW
><iamnotusingonewithAgent@notinuse.com> wrote:
>
>>It is $25 at Steam. I forgot about that one.
>>
>>Thanks Mike S. I added it to my wishlist.
>>-pw
>
>The only Master of Orion I see for $25 on Steam is NOT the same Master
>of Orion I am talking about. I am referring to the original Microprose
>game that came out in 1993 for DOS.
>
>This new Master of Orion on Steam came out in 2016 and I have no
>experience with it. In truth, you reminded me of this new one! :)

*--

Okie Dokie Mike!

I guess I will take it off of my wishlist and do some more research.

-pw

Mike S. <Mike_S@nowhere.com> wrote:
>Ok, I can see now from your post that you were talking about 4x space
>games. But if we are talking about 4x games in general, my favorite
>has always been Heroes of Might & Magic 3. I would suggest trying it,
>but I am sure you already have.

Heroes of Might and Magic III isn't really a 4X game though. It doesn't
have the economic and tecnological development that a 4X game has,
and is pretty weak on the all of the 4 X's except exterminate.

--
l/ // Ross Ridge -- The Great HTMU
[oo][oo] rridge@csclub.uwaterloo.ca
-()-/()/ http://www.csclub.uwaterloo.ca/~rridge/
db //

On Sat, 15 Jan 2022 04:19:07 -0000 (UTC), rridge@csclub.uwaterloo.ca
(Ross Ridge) wrote:

>Heroes of Might and Magic III isn't really a 4X game though. It doesn't
>have the economic and tecnological development that a 4X game has,
>and is pretty weak on the all of the 4 X's except exterminate.

I never even questioned this, but I just googled it.. and yeah, there
is some debate on the matter. I had no idea it was even an issue. I
will say it is just my favorite strategy game then and leave it at
that.

On Sat, 15 Jan 2022 08:43:59 -0500, Mike S. <Mike_S@nowhere.com>
wrote:

>On Sat, 15 Jan 2022 04:19:07 -0000 (UTC), rridge@csclub.uwaterloo.ca
>(Ross Ridge) wrote:
>
>>Heroes of Might and Magic III isn't really a 4X game though. It doesn't
>>have the economic and tecnological development that a 4X game has,
>>and is pretty weak on the all of the 4 X's except exterminate.
>
>I never even questioned this, but I just googled it.. and yeah, there
>is some debate on the matter. I had no idea it was even an issue. I
>will say it is just my favorite strategy game then and leave it at
>that.

It's definitely on the lighter side of the 4X scale. I myself would
never classify it as such, but I can see why some people might, and it
didn't really seem worth a discussion (genre-wars are too easy to get
into ;-)

Still, there definitely is eXploration in the Heroes of Might & Magic;
you have to wander the map pushing back the fog of war. There's
eXploitation in the form of locating and using resources. You eXpand
your empire by conquering new cities and taking control of the various
mines, alchemists, etc. And, of course, the end-game is to eXterminate
all the foes. It lacks some of the more sophisticated mechanics we
typically associate with 4X games - research and diplomacy, for
instance - but if someone wants to call it a 4X game, I can't argue
too loudly.

(Then again, it's really easy to quantify almost every game as a 4X
game. Looked at in a certain way, "Doom" is 4X; run around exploring
the map, eXterminating the enemies to eXpand the region of 'safe'
areas while eXploiting all the tasty ammo and health packs that just
happen to be lying around. Just like almost every game can be
classified as 'puzzle' or 'role-playing' or 'simulation', so too can
most be seen - if you squint hard enough - as 4X too. Whether it is
right or useful to mangle the genres like this I leave up to wiser
heads than mine ;-)

On Fri, 14 Jan 2022 16:15:17 -0700, PW
<iamnotusingonewithAgent@notinuse.com> wrote:
>On Fri, 14 Jan 2022 09:00:23 -0500, Mike S. <Mike_S@nowhere.com>
>wrote:
>>On Thu, 13 Jan 2022 21:55:50 -0700, PW
>><iamnotusingonewithAgent@notinuse.com> wrote:

>>>It is $25 at Steam. I forgot about that one.

>>>Thanks Mike S. I added it to my wishlist.

>>The only Master of Orion I see for $25 on Steam is NOT the same Master
>>of Orion I am talking about. I am referring to the original Microprose
>>game that came out in 1993 for DOS.

>>This new Master of Orion on Steam came out in 2016 and I have no
>>experience with it. In truth, you reminded me of this new one! :)

>Okie Dokie Mike!

>I guess I will take it off of my wishlist and do some more research.

It's been a long while since I played it, but my recollection was that
the 2016 "Master of Orion" (MOO4) wasn't that bad a game. It just
wasn't a very notable one either. It largely captured the mechanics of
MOO2 and gave credible lip-service to its setting. What it failed to
do is recapture the 'feel'* of the earlier games. MOO4 felt...
mechanical and lifeless; a zombiefied version of the older games. In
fairness, I don't think this was as a result of it being a
nostalgia-chasing money-grab; I think the developers truly wanted to
make a modern MOO, but didn't quite understand the unique and
appealing magic of the original games (in fairness, I'm not sure that
SimTek/Microprose really understoond that either).

The originals are available through GOG at
https://www.gog.com/game/master_of_orion_1_2
(MOO3 and MOO4 are there too if you want the complete set all from the
same place). At $5.99USD for the two games, it's well worth the price.

-----------------
* an absolutely useless and ephemeral description, I know, but it's
been too long for me to remember enough details

>
>The originals are available through GOG at
>https://www.gog.com/game/master_of_orion_1_2
>(MOO3 and MOO4 are there too if you want the complete set all from the
>same place). At $5.99USD for the two games, it's well worth the price.

*--

They do look good Spalls, even if they look so, so old.

They even come with a 153pg manual and a reference card!

Remember those days? :-)

I will try and remember them. Seem very complex. I dunno. It is not
like I have nothing to play!

-pw

On Sunday, January 16, 2022 at 7:34:48 PM UTC-8, PW wrote:
> >
> >The originals are available through GOG at
> >https://www.gog.com/game/master_of_orion_1_2
> >(MOO3 and MOO4 are there too if you want the complete set all from the
> >same place). At $5.99USD for the two games, it's well worth the price.
> *--
>
> They do look good Spalls, even if they look so, so old.
>
> They even come with a 153pg manual and a reference card!
>
> Remember those days? :-)
>
> I will try and remember them. Seem very complex. I dunno. It is not
> like I have nothing to play!
>
> -pw

MoO is a very good and simple game, I highly recommend it.

MoO 2 is a bit more complex, but I enjoyed it as well. I don't
think its quite as fun but still very good.

- Justisaur

On Mon, 17 Jan 2022 06:02:20 -0800 (PST), Justisaur
<justisaur@gmail.com> wrote:

>On Sunday, January 16, 2022 at 7:34:48 PM UTC-8, PW wrote:
>> >
>> >The originals are available through GOG at
>> >https://www.gog.com/game/master_of_orion_1_2
>> >(MOO3 and MOO4 are there too if you want the complete set all from the
>> >same place). At $5.99USD for the two games, it's well worth the price.
>> *--
>>
>> They do look good Spalls, even if they look so, so old.
>>
>> They even come with a 153pg manual and a reference card!
>>
>> Remember those days? :-)
>>
>> I will try and remember them. Seem very complex. I dunno. It is not
>> like I have nothing to play!
>>
>> -pw
>
>MoO is a very good and simple game, I highly recommend it.
>
>MoO 2 is a bit more complex, but I enjoyed it as well. I don't
>think its quite as fun but still very good.
>
>- Justisaur

* --

GOG has a 2016 version of the same name. I wonder how it is and if it
is the same game.

I assume everyone is referring to the 1993 version.

I have no idea why GOG does not display the prices of the games until
the buy button is clicked.

I did that on the "found" item, I assume it was the original version.
After clicking on BUY, it put nothing in my cart and then brought up a
page of games that have nothing to do with MOO and did not list the
game itself!

I wonder if any of the 86 items it found after I clicked the buy
button to purchase MOO include the game I was interested in
puchasing??

To heck with GOG!

On Mon, 17 Jan 2022 17:44:30 -0700, PW <>
>I wonder if any of the 86 items it found after I clicked the buy
>button to purchase MOO include the game I was interested in
>puchasing??
>
>To heck with GOG!

*--

Sorry, that is 86 *pages* of games, probably their entire inventory!

-pw

On 1/17/2022 4:45 PM, PW wrote:
> On Mon, 17 Jan 2022 17:44:30 -0700, PW <>
>> I wonder if any of the 86 items it found after I clicked the buy
>> button to purchase MOO include the game I was interested in
>> puchasing??
>>
>> To heck with GOG!
>
>
> *--
>
> Sorry, that is 86 *pages* of games, probably their entire inventory!
>
Classic 1 and 2: $5.99
https://www.gog.com/game/master_of_orion_1_2

2016 remake: $29.99
https://www.gog.com/game/master_of_orion

--
I've done good in this world. Now I'm tired and just want to be a cranky
dirty old man.

On Mon, 17 Jan 2022 20:29:39 -0800, Dimensional Traveler
<dtravel@sonic.net> wrote:

>On 1/17/2022 4:45 PM, PW wrote:
>> On Mon, 17 Jan 2022 17:44:30 -0700, PW <>
>>> I wonder if any of the 86 items it found after I clicked the buy
>>> button to purchase MOO include the game I was interested in
>>> puchasing??
>>>
>>> To heck with GOG!
>>
>>
>> *--
>>
>> Sorry, that is 86 *pages* of games, probably their entire inventory!
>>
>Classic 1 and 2: $5.99
>https://www.gog.com/game/master_of_orion_1_2" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">https://www.gog.com/game/master_of_orion_1_2
>
>2016 remake: $29.99
>https://www.gog.com/game/master_of_orion

Thanks!

On Thu, 13 Jan 2022 13:40:15 -0500, Mike S. <Mike_S@nowhere.com>
wrote:

>On Thu, 13 Jan 2022 12:28:08 -0500, Spalls Hurgenson
><spallshurgenson@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>>This is another repeat game (first offered back in January 2021), but
>
>Yes, 'In Library' already according to Epic.
>
>>that's cool; it's a good game. Well, good enough. As a 4X space
>>strategy game, it provides everything you'd expect. It will never top
>>the "Masters of Orion" games, but then I've yet to meet a game in that
>>genre that can.
>
>If you mean Space 4x games, I agree. Master of Orion is permanently
>installed. I should get around to installing the sequel as I own it
>along with the strategy guide. I am just afraid I am not going to like
>it as much as the first as I like the simplicity of just building
>factories and moving sliders in MOO 1.

*--

So, what does 4X mean?

On Mon, 17 Jan 2022 20:29:39 -0800, Dimensional Traveler
<dtravel@sonic.net> wrote:

>On 1/17/2022 4:45 PM, PW wrote:
>> On Mon, 17 Jan 2022 17:44:30 -0700, PW <>
>>> I wonder if any of the 86 items it found after I clicked the buy
>>> button to purchase MOO include the game I was interested in
>>> puchasing??
>>>
>>> To heck with GOG!
>>
>>
>> *--
>>
>> Sorry, that is 86 *pages* of games, probably their entire inventory!
>>
>Classic 1 and 2: $5.99
>https://www.gog.com/game/master_of_orion_1_2" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">https://www.gog.com/game/master_of_orion_1_2
>
>2016 remake: $29.99
>https://www.gog.com/game/master_of_orion

*--

I use GOG Galaxy to search using the magnifying glass. I enter
"Master of Orion". It finds 1 and 2 - Game. It brings up a page with
hardly anything on it but an image of the game.

NO BUY BUTTON!! NOTHING!

I am done with purchasing anything from GOG again. What a piece of
junk.

On 1/18/2022 4:33 PM, PW wrote:
> On Mon, 17 Jan 2022 20:29:39 -0800, Dimensional Traveler
> <dtravel@sonic.net> wrote:
>
>> On 1/17/2022 4:45 PM, PW wrote:
>>> On Mon, 17 Jan 2022 17:44:30 -0700, PW <>
>>>> I wonder if any of the 86 items it found after I clicked the buy
>>>> button to purchase MOO include the game I was interested in
>>>> puchasing??
>>>>
>>>> To heck with GOG!
>>>
>>>
>>> *--
>>>
>>> Sorry, that is 86 *pages* of games, probably their entire inventory!
>>>
>> Classic 1 and 2: $5.99
>> https://www.gog.com/game/master_of_orion_1_2" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">https://www.gog.com/game/master_of_orion_1_2
>>
>> 2016 remake: $29.99
>> https://www.gog.com/game/master_of_orion
>
> *--
>
> I use GOG Galaxy to search using the magnifying glass. I enter
> "Master of Orion". It finds 1 and 2 - Game. It brings up a page with
> hardly anything on it but an image of the game.
>
> NO BUY BUTTON!! NOTHING!
>
> I am done with purchasing anything from GOG again. What a piece of
> junk.

I don't think the problem is on GOG's end. Do you have javascript
disabled? You may need to enable it from GOG. Or your firewall or
other security software is blocking some key part of the site.

If you use the links I provided above, what do you get? Each should
take you directly to the respective game's page on GOG where the price
is clearly listed above the "Buy" button.

Here is a link to a screenshot of the MOO 1 & 2 page on GOG using the
link I provided:
https://pixhost.to/show/118/258424535_moo1-2.jpg

--
I've done good in this world. Now I'm tired and just want to be a cranky
dirty old man.

>I don't think the problem is on GOG's end. Do you have javascript
>disabled? You may need to enable it from GOG. Or your firewall or
>other security software is blocking some key part of the site.
>
>If you use the links I provided above, what do you get? Each should
>take you directly to the respective game's page on GOG where the price
>is clearly listed above the "Buy" button.
>
>Here is a link to a screenshot of the MOO 1 & 2 page on GOG using the
>link I provided:
>https://pixhost.to/show/118/258424535_moo1-2.jpg

*-----

I do see your screen print. I do not get a buy button and the screen
I saw looks nothing like that.

Thanks,

-pw

>
>I don't think the problem is on GOG's end. Do you have javascript
>disabled? You may need to enable it from GOG. Or your firewall or
>other security software is blocking some key part of the site.
>
>If you use the links I provided above, what do you get? Each should
>take you directly to the respective game's page on GOG where the price
>is clearly listed above the "Buy" button.

I do get a Master Of Orion 1+2 screen with an $5.99 add to card.

-pw

>
>Here is a link to a screenshot of the MOO 1 & 2 page on GOG using the
>link I provided:
>https://pixhost.to/show/118/258424535_moo1-2.jpg

>I don't think the problem is on GOG's end. Do you have javascript
>disabled? You may need to enable it from GOG. Or your firewall or
>other security software is blocking some key part of the site.
>
>If you use the links I provided above, what do you get? Each should
>take you directly to the respective game's page on GOG where the price
>is clearly listed above the "Buy" button.
>
>Here is a link to a screenshot of the MOO 1 & 2 page on GOG using the
>link I provided:
>https://pixhost.to/show/118/258424535_moo1-2.jpg
*---

I disabled everything Norton (Firewall and AutoProtect) and still do
not see the screen you see and no buy button.

I purchased The Darkside Detective last night!

I was just able to add Heroes of Might and Magic III using GOG Galaxy
to my cart. I removed it.

-pw