Anyone else had problems bringing back 21.1 from suspension? There are
several reports in the Linux Mint forum, often for Nvidia drivers, but
there doesn't seem to be a simple resolution.

I had no problems with 17.3 - 20.3, and restarting 21.1 after sleep is
fine. After suspension, apps are generally unresponsive, and trying to
shut down (via the User Applet) takes some time, then fails as the
screen then starts filling with a repeated message, mainly about the
Radeon card. It's similar to the first post here
<https://forums.linuxmint.com/viewtopic.php?t=391788>. The only way out
is a cold shutdown via the power switch.

The laptop will then not reboot, showing an error message after the boot
select screen:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
(unimportant stuff about Intel)

Realtek PCIe GBE Family Controller Series v2.51 (10/08/12)
PXE-E61: Media test failure, check cable

PXE-M0F: Exiting PXE ROM

Reboot and Select proper Boot device
or Insert Boot Media in selected boot device and press a key_
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

If I go into the boot menu and select Realtek instead of the TSSTCorp
device it is on by default, the laptop will boot (I haven't checked to
see if Realtek is normally the default).

From reading through the forum post above, it looks like this is at
least partly an issue of using a new kernel with old hardware. I can't
see it being resolved with 22.2 or higher, and might even get worse.
I'll just have to remember to not use suspend or close the laptop!

--

Jeff

On 4/15/23 10:29, this is what Jeff Layman wrote:
> Anyone  else had problems bringing back 21.1 from suspension? There are several reports in the Linux Mint forum, often
> for Nvidia drivers, but there doesn't seem to be a simple resolution.
>
> I had no problems with 17.3 - 20.3, and restarting 21.1 after sleep is fine. After suspension, apps are generally
> unresponsive, and trying to shut down (via the User Applet) takes some time, then fails as the screen then starts
> filling with a repeated message, mainly about the Radeon card. It's similar to the first post here
> <https://forums.linuxmint.com/viewtopic.php?t=391788>. The only way out is a cold shutdown via the power switch.
>
> The laptop will then not reboot, showing an error message after the boot select screen:
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> (unimportant stuff about Intel)
>
> Realtek PCIe GBE Family Controller Series v2.51 (10/08/12)
> PXE-E61: Media test failure, check cable
>
> PXE-M0F: Exiting PXE ROM
>
> Reboot and Select proper Boot device
> or Insert Boot Media in selected boot device and press a key_
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> If I go into the boot menu and select Realtek instead of the TSSTCorp device it is on by default, the laptop will boot
> (I haven't checked to see if Realtek is normally the default).
>
> From reading through the forum post above, it looks like this is at least partly an issue of using a new kernel with
> old hardware. I can't see it being resolved with 22.2 or higher, and might even get worse. I'll just have to remember to
> not use suspend or close the laptop!
>
What is sleep? I get suspend, but what's the diff? When I close my lid, it suspends. Shutdown and lock are my only
other options.
--
Al

On 15/04/2023 15:38, Big Al wrote:
> On 4/15/23 10:29, this is what Jeff Layman wrote:
>> Anyone  else had problems bringing back 21.1 from suspension? There are several reports in the Linux Mint forum, often
>> for Nvidia drivers, but there doesn't seem to be a simple resolution.
>>
>> I had no problems with 17.3 - 20.3, and restarting 21.1 after sleep is fine. After suspension, apps are generally
>> unresponsive, and trying to shut down (via the User Applet) takes some time, then fails as the screen then starts
>> filling with a repeated message, mainly about the Radeon card. It's similar to the first post here
>> <https://forums.linuxmint.com/viewtopic.php?t=391788>. The only way out is a cold shutdown via the power switch.
>>
>> The laptop will then not reboot, showing an error message after the boot select screen:
>> --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>> (unimportant stuff about Intel)
>>
>> Realtek PCIe GBE Family Controller Series v2.51 (10/08/12)
>> PXE-E61: Media test failure, check cable
>>
>> PXE-M0F: Exiting PXE ROM
>>
>> Reboot and Select proper Boot device
>> or Insert Boot Media in selected boot device and press a key_
>> --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>
>> If I go into the boot menu and select Realtek instead of the TSSTCorp device it is on by default, the laptop will boot
>> (I haven't checked to see if Realtek is normally the default).
>>
>> From reading through the forum post above, it looks like this is at least partly an issue of using a new kernel with
>> old hardware. I can't see it being resolved with 22.2 or higher, and might even get worse. I'll just have to remember to
>> not use suspend or close the laptop!
>>
> What is sleep? I get suspend, but what's the diff? When I close my lid, it suspends. Shutdown and lock are my only
> other options.

"Sleep" is probably a Windows hangover term! It's actually "Turn off the
screen when inactive" for x minutes under "Power Management". I'm fairly
certain it's the same as "lock screen".

It's lucky you asked, because I've just changed "When the lid is closed"
from "Suspend" to "Lock screen". I'd forgotten I had it set as "Suspend".

--

Jeff

On 4/15/2023 11:54 AM, Jeff Layman wrote:
> On 15/04/2023 15:38, Big Al wrote:
>> On 4/15/23 10:29, this is what Jeff Layman wrote:
>>> Anyone  else had problems bringing back 21.1 from suspension? There are several reports in the Linux Mint forum, often
>>> for Nvidia drivers, but there doesn't seem to be a simple resolution.
>>>
>>> I had no problems with 17.3 - 20.3, and restarting 21.1 after sleep is fine. After suspension, apps are generally
>>> unresponsive, and trying to shut down (via the User Applet) takes some time, then fails as the screen then starts
>>> filling with a repeated message, mainly about the Radeon card. It's similar to the first post here
>>> <https://forums.linuxmint.com/viewtopic.php?t=391788>. The only way out is a cold shutdown via the power switch.
>>>
>>> The laptop will then not reboot, showing an error message after the boot select screen:
>>> --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>> (unimportant stuff about Intel)
>>>
>>> Realtek PCIe GBE Family Controller Series v2.51 (10/08/12)
>>> PXE-E61: Media test failure, check cable
>>>
>>> PXE-M0F: Exiting PXE ROM
>>>
>>> Reboot and Select proper Boot device
>>> or Insert Boot Media in selected boot device and press a key_
>>> --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>
>>> If I go into the boot menu and select Realtek instead of the TSSTCorp device it is on by default, the laptop will boot
>>> (I haven't checked to see if Realtek is normally the default).
>>>
>>>   From reading through the forum post above, it looks like this is at least partly an issue of using a new kernel with
>>> old hardware. I can't see it being resolved with 22.2 or higher, and might even get worse. I'll just have to remember to
>>> not use suspend or close the laptop!
>>>
>> What is sleep?  I get suspend, but what's the diff?   When I close my lid, it suspends.  Shutdown and lock are my only
>> other options.
>
> "Sleep" is probably a Windows hangover term! It's actually "Turn off the screen when inactive" for x minutes under "Power Management". I'm fairly certain it's the same as "lock screen".
>
> It's lucky you asked, because I've just changed "When the lid is closed" from "Suspend" to "Lock screen". I'd forgotten I had it set as "Suspend".
>

More "official" descriptions are via the ACPI specifications.

While the states may exist, nothing says they must be instantiated.
Thus S2 is not in evidence. No references to it in the real world.

Also, note that in the old days, state S1 saved no power at all!

Some of the CRT monitors sucked as much juice in S1 as in S0 (mine was like this).

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ACPI

S0 The computer is running

S1 Power on Suspend [A high power state, with monitor off via no SYNC signals]

S2 CPU powered off [This state is not evident in the real world]

S3 Suspend to RAM (STR) [state info in RAM, other hardware off]
Also available as hybrid suspend, with hiberfile loaded

S4 Hibernation or Suspend to Disk

S5 Soft Off (can be bound to the front button on a desktop, or use "shutdown" in menu)
G3 Mechanical Off (the rear button on a desktop, removes +5VSB, then no power inside PC)

Paul

On 15/04/2023 17:26, Paul wrote:
> On 4/15/2023 11:54 AM, Jeff Layman wrote:
>> On 15/04/2023 15:38, Big Al wrote:
>>> On 4/15/23 10:29, this is what Jeff Layman wrote:
>>>> Anyone  else had problems bringing back 21.1 from suspension? There are several reports in the Linux Mint forum, often
>>>> for Nvidia drivers, but there doesn't seem to be a simple resolution.
>>>>
>>>> I had no problems with 17.3 - 20.3, and restarting 21.1 after sleep is fine. After suspension, apps are generally
>>>> unresponsive, and trying to shut down (via the User Applet) takes some time, then fails as the screen then starts
>>>> filling with a repeated message, mainly about the Radeon card. It's similar to the first post here
>>>> <https://forums.linuxmint.com/viewtopic.php?t=391788>. The only way out is a cold shutdown via the power switch.
>>>>
>>>> The laptop will then not reboot, showing an error message after the boot select screen:
>>>> --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>> (unimportant stuff about Intel)
>>>>
>>>> Realtek PCIe GBE Family Controller Series v2.51 (10/08/12)
>>>> PXE-E61: Media test failure, check cable
>>>>
>>>> PXE-M0F: Exiting PXE ROM
>>>>
>>>> Reboot and Select proper Boot device
>>>> or Insert Boot Media in selected boot device and press a key_
>>>> --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>
>>>> If I go into the boot menu and select Realtek instead of the TSSTCorp device it is on by default, the laptop will boot
>>>> (I haven't checked to see if Realtek is normally the default).
>>>>
>>>>   From reading through the forum post above, it looks like this is at least partly an issue of using a new kernel with
>>>> old hardware. I can't see it being resolved with 22.2 or higher, and might even get worse. I'll just have to remember to
>>>> not use suspend or close the laptop!
>>>>
>>> What is sleep?  I get suspend, but what's the diff?   When I close my lid, it suspends.  Shutdown and lock are my only
>>> other options.
>>
>> "Sleep" is probably a Windows hangover term! It's actually "Turn off the screen when inactive" for x minutes under "Power Management". I'm fairly certain it's the same as "lock screen".
>>
>> It's lucky you asked, because I've just changed "When the lid is closed" from "Suspend" to "Lock screen". I'd forgotten I had it set as "Suspend".
>>
>
> More "official" descriptions are via the ACPI specifications.
>
> While the states may exist, nothing says they must be instantiated.
> Thus S2 is not in evidence. No references to it in the real world.
>
> Also, note that in the old days, state S1 saved no power at all!
>
> Some of the CRT monitors sucked as much juice in S1 as in S0 (mine was like this).
>
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ACPI
>
> S0 The computer is running
>
> S1 Power on Suspend [A high power state, with monitor off via no SYNC signals]
>
> S2 CPU powered off [This state is not evident in the real world]
>
> S3 Suspend to RAM (STR) [state info in RAM, other hardware off]
> Also available as hybrid suspend, with hiberfile loaded
>
> S4 Hibernation or Suspend to Disk
>
> S5 Soft Off (can be bound to the front button on a desktop, or use "shutdown" in menu)
> G3 Mechanical Off (the rear button on a desktop, removes +5VSB, then no power inside PC)

The wiki is interesting in that it seems to refer to a desktop rather
than a laptop - most certainly in relation to G3 - even though the photo
at the top is of a Lenovo laptop (the only time in that wiki that the
word laptop appears!).

I'm not sure what the Linux Mint terms refer to. Is "suspend" (S4) the
equivalent of Windows "hibernate"? Is "Lock screen" S0ix? Or is there no
equivalent. It can't be S1 as even with "Lock screen" on the CPU
continues to operate. In the wiki, under S1 the CPU is still powered
although it stops executing instructions. What is the point of that
condition?

--

Jeff

On 4/15/2023 1:24 PM, Jeff Layman wrote:

> The wiki is interesting in that it seems to refer to a desktop rather than a laptop - most certainly in relation to G3 - even though the photo at the top is of a Lenovo laptop (the only time in that wiki that the word laptop appears!).
>
> I'm not sure what the Linux Mint terms refer to. Is "suspend" (S4) the equivalent of Windows "hibernate"? Is "Lock screen" S0ix? Or is there no equivalent. It can't be S1 as even with "Lock screen" on the CPU continues to operate. In the wiki, under S1 the CPU is still powered although it stops executing instructions. What is the point of that condition?
>

The ACPI spec has enough variables, to handle both laptops and desktops.

S0ix is a Microsoft thing. It was not necessarily accepted by all manufacturers.
You might find it on Surface devices. One of the companies "wanted more testing done"
to prove it was a good idea.

Some of the ideas were from a time when CPUs did not have that
many features. You could stop execution on a CPU, by using a HALT
instruction, or you could inject "NOP" instructions in place of
the normal instruction stream. SpeedStep and PowerNow had been
around for a while, so you might be able to drop the speed.
Some of the processors didn't drop the speed all that much.
(1.6GHz to 1.2Ghz.)

On my first (home PC) machine, the idle power was 150W and the Prime95 power
would be 153W. There was really no power saving at all in the
stupid thing. It was an Intel, but without a Speedstep and
no Hyperthreading either. The S1 in that case, would kill the
image on the CRT. But my CRT, a Sony Trinitron, did not save
any power when the sync signals were removed. It did have
significant power differences as a function of resolution. At
1280x1024, you could feel warmth, at 1024x768 it was quite cool
on top, by comparison. We had a monitor at work, later in time,
that if you were to use it at the rated resolution, it could
catch fire. And a technician was flown out from the factory, to
retrofit magnetics where that would not happen. The monitors were
$5K each, so you could afford to have someone come out and fix a bunch.

Kit today, has a lot more features. The BIOS has control of some of
the C states, and if you wanted to keep a machine running at top
speed, you could "aid" the OS to make the right decisions, by stripping
it of control over C states. In one test I did, to get consistent clock
rates, I had to use several controls at BIOS level, to "twist the arm
of the OS" and keep the CPU at full speed.

Referring to S3 as "Sleep" and S4 as "Hibernate", gets the point across.
On a laptop, the power converter for the RAM keeps running in S3 Sleep
state. This refreshes the RAM (DRAM) contents. The power might be on the order
of 1 watt per stick of RAM. Since this continues to drain the battery,
the laptop changes from S3 to S4 Hibernate, when the battery is low.
When the OS turns the laptop off and enters S4, there is no power
being dissipated. And then the laptop should be recharged within a
few days of running it down like that.

Paul