On 2022-03-26 1:00 p.m., 😉 Good Guy 😉 wrote:
> This is quite interesting read but it is from an unofficial website:
>
> <https://www-drwindows-de.translate.goog/news/windows-11-version-22h2-ende-der-reise-fuer-nicht-unterstuetzte-pcs?_x_tr_sl=auto&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=en-US&_x_tr_pto=wapp>
> <https://www-drwindows-de.translate.goog/news/windows-11-version-22h2-ende-der-reise-fuer-nicht-unterstuetzte-pcs?_x_tr_sl=auto&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=en-US&_x_tr_pto=wapp>
> <https://www-drwindows-de.translate.goog/news/windows-11-version-22h2-ende-der-reise-fuer-nicht-unterstuetzte-pcs?_x_tr_sl=auto&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=en-US&_x_tr_pto=wapp>
> <https://www-drwindows-de.translate.goog/news/windows-11-version-22h2-ende-der-reise-fuer-nicht-unterstuetzte-pcs?_x_tr_sl=auto&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=en-US&_x_tr_pto=wapp>

At this point, people who use unsupported hardware and plan to continue
to do so past 2025 might as well just install Linux if they can swallow
their pride and lower their standards significantly. Otherwise, it will
simply retire then.

--
rabidR04CH
Red Cross donor, supporter of independent media, proud Catholic and free
speech absolutist
Zephyrus G14 GA401QM on Windows 11
"But Peter and the apostles answered, 'We must obey God rather than
men.'" - Acts 5:29
For fans of message boards, I invite you:
https://retalk.com/invite/rabidR04CH

On 3/27/22 08:22, this is what rabidR04CH wrote:
> On 2022-03-26 1:00 p.m., 😉 Good Guy 😉 wrote:
>> This is quite interesting read but it is from an unofficial website:
>>
>> <https://www-drwindows-de.translate.goog/news/windows-11-version-22h2-ende-der-reise-fuer-nicht-unterstuetzte-pcs?_x_tr_sl=auto&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=en-US&_x_tr_pto=wapp>
>>
>> <https://www-drwindows-de.translate.goog/news/windows-11-version-22h2-ende-der-reise-fuer-nicht-unterstuetzte-pcs?_x_tr_sl=auto&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=en-US&_x_tr_pto=wapp>
>>
>> <https://www-drwindows-de.translate.goog/news/windows-11-version-22h2-ende-der-reise-fuer-nicht-unterstuetzte-pcs?_x_tr_sl=auto&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=en-US&_x_tr_pto=wapp>
>>
>> <https://www-drwindows-de.translate.goog/news/windows-11-version-22h2-ende-der-reise-fuer-nicht-unterstuetzte-pcs?_x_tr_sl=auto&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=en-US&_x_tr_pto=wapp>
>>
>
> At this point, people who use unsupported hardware and plan to continue to do so past 2025 might as well just install Linux if they can
> swallow their pride and lower their standards significantly. Otherwise, it will simply retire then.
>
>
Don't knock it, Linux is very good. I am much more productive in Linux than I am in Windows. I don't have things changing on me weekly.

On 2022-03-27 9:00 a.m., Big Al wrote:
> On 3/27/22 08:22, this is what rabidR04CH wrote:
>> On 2022-03-26 1:00 p.m., 😉 Good Guy 😉 wrote:
>>> This is quite interesting read but it is from an unofficial website:
>>>
>>> <https://www-drwindows-de.translate.goog/news/windows-11-version-22h2-ende-der-reise-fuer-nicht-unterstuetzte-pcs?_x_tr_sl=auto&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=en-US&_x_tr_pto=wapp>
>>>
>>> <https://www-drwindows-de.translate.goog/news/windows-11-version-22h2-ende-der-reise-fuer-nicht-unterstuetzte-pcs?_x_tr_sl=auto&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=en-US&_x_tr_pto=wapp>
>>>
>>> <https://www-drwindows-de.translate.goog/news/windows-11-version-22h2-ende-der-reise-fuer-nicht-unterstuetzte-pcs?_x_tr_sl=auto&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=en-US&_x_tr_pto=wapp>
>>>
>>> <https://www-drwindows-de.translate.goog/news/windows-11-version-22h2-ende-der-reise-fuer-nicht-unterstuetzte-pcs?_x_tr_sl=auto&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=en-US&_x_tr_pto=wapp>
>>>
>>
>> At this point, people who use unsupported hardware and plan to
>> continue to do so past 2025 might as well just install Linux if they
>> can swallow their pride and lower their standards significantly.
>> Otherwise, it will simply retire then.
>>
>>
> Don't knock it, Linux is very good.  I am much more productive in Linux
> than I am in Windows.  I don't have things changing on me weekly.

Linux does the job, however there is no doubt that updates can break
your system and that if you have an NVIDIA GPU, the experience can be
hit or miss. Anyone who has hardware which relies on free drivers is not
likely to see any big issue.

--
rabidR04CH
Red Cross donor, supporter of independent media, proud Catholic and free
speech absolutist
Zephyrus G14 GA401QM on Windows 11
"But Peter and the apostles answered, 'We must obey God rather than
men.'" - Acts 5:29
For fans of message boards, I invite you:
https://retalk.com/invite/rabidR04CH

On 3/27/22 09:56, this is what rabidR04CH wrote:
> On 2022-03-27 9:00 a.m., Big Al wrote:
>> On 3/27/22 08:22, this is what rabidR04CH wrote:
>>> On 2022-03-26 1:00 p.m., 😉 Good Guy 😉 wrote:
>>>> This is quite interesting read but it is from an unofficial website:
>>>>
>>>> <https://www-drwindows-de.translate.goog/news/windows-11-version-22h2-ende-der-reise-fuer-nicht-unterstuetzte-pcs?_x_tr_sl=auto&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=en-US&_x_tr_pto=wapp>
>>>>
>>>> <https://www-drwindows-de.translate.goog/news/windows-11-version-22h2-ende-der-reise-fuer-nicht-unterstuetzte-pcs?_x_tr_sl=auto&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=en-US&_x_tr_pto=wapp>
>>>>
>>>> <https://www-drwindows-de.translate.goog/news/windows-11-version-22h2-ende-der-reise-fuer-nicht-unterstuetzte-pcs?_x_tr_sl=auto&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=en-US&_x_tr_pto=wapp>
>>>>
>>>> <https://www-drwindows-de.translate.goog/news/windows-11-version-22h2-ende-der-reise-fuer-nicht-unterstuetzte-pcs?_x_tr_sl=auto&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=en-US&_x_tr_pto=wapp>
>>>>
>>>
>>> At this point, people who use unsupported hardware and plan to continue to do so past 2025 might as well just install Linux if they can
>>> swallow their pride and lower their standards significantly. Otherwise, it will simply retire then.
>>>
>>>
>> Don't knock it, Linux is very good.  I am much more productive in Linux than I am in Windows.  I don't have things changing on me weekly.
>
> Linux does the job, however there is no doubt that updates can break your system and that if you have an NVIDIA GPU, the experience can be
> hit or miss. Anyone who has hardware which relies on free drivers is not likely to see any big issue.
>
And yes, I've heard the NVIDIA issue a lot, so I'm not using it and have a good experience.

[]
>On 3/27/22 09:56, this is what rabidR04CH wrote:
>> On 2022-03-27 9:00 a.m., Big Al wrote:
>>> On 3/27/22 08:22, this is what rabidR04CH wrote:
>>>> On 2022-03-26 1:00 p.m., 0 >>>>> This is quite interesting read but it is from an unofficial website:
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>><https://www-drwindows-de.translate.goog/news/windows-11-version-22h
>>>>>2-ende-der-reise-fuer-nicht-unterstuetzte-pcs?_x_tr_sl=auto&_x_tr_tl
>>>>>=en&_x_tr_hl=en-US&_x_tr_pto=wapp>
>>>>>
>>>>><https://www-drwindows-de.translate.goog/news/windows-11-version-22h
>>>>>2-ende-der-reise-fuer-nicht-unterstuetzte-pcs?_x_tr_sl=auto&_x_tr_tl
>>>>>=en&_x_tr_hl=en-US&_x_tr_pto=wapp>
>>>>>
>>>>><https://www-drwindows-de.translate.goog/news/windows-11-version-22h
>>>>>2-ende-der-reise-fuer-nicht-unterstuetzte-pcs?_x_tr_sl=auto&_x_tr_tl
>>>>>=en&_x_tr_hl=en-US&_x_tr_pto=wapp>
>>>>>
>>>>><https://www-drwindows-de.translate.goog/news/windows-11-version-22h
>>>>>2-ende-der-reise-fuer-nicht-unterstuetzte-pcs?_x_tr_sl=auto&_x_tr_tl
>>>>>=en&_x_tr_hl=en-US&_x_tr_pto=wapp>

I wonder if there's a reason he posted the URL four times! (And didn't
trim it before the first "?", which usually works.)
>>>>
>>>> At this point, people who use unsupported hardware and plan to
>>>>continue to do so past 2025

**#IF#** they plan/want to keep up with the Windows 11+ gravy-train.

>>>> might as well just install Linux if they can swallow their pride
>>>>and lower their standards significantly. Otherwise, it will simply
>>>>retire then.
>>>>
I can see it being quit possible Ill still be using Windows 7 in 2025 or
after.
>>>>
>>> Don't knock it, Linux is very good.  I am much more productive in
>>>Linux than I am in Windows.  I don't have things changing on me weekly.

Nor do I (-:

>> Linux does the job, however there is no doubt that updates can break
>>your system and that if you have an NVIDIA GPU, the experience can be
>>hit or miss. Anyone who has hardware which relies on free drivers is
>>not likely to see any big issue.
[]
I think there are roughly two sorts of user: (The one that wants to
divide the world into two sorts, and ... sorry) the one who is happy
with a system that works, and doesn't want to change it once it's
working ['if it ain't broke don't "fix" it'], and the one who wants to
remain "up to date" ['it _is_ broke, you just didn't know it was
(especially security concerns)']. I'm sure that applies whether Windows,
Linux, Apple, or ...
--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/<1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)Ar@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf

The average US shareholding lasts 22 seconds. Nobody knows who invented the
fire hydrant: the patent records were destroyed in a fire. Sandcastles kill
more people than sharks. Your brain uses less power than the light in your
fridge. The Statue of Liberty wears size 879 shoes.
- John Lloyd, QI supremo (RT, 2014/9/27-10/3)

On 3/27/2022 1:01 PM, J. P. Gilliver (John) wrote:
> []
>> On 3/27/22 09:56, this is what rabidR04CH wrote:
>>> On 2022-03-27 9:00 a.m., Big Al wrote:
>>>> On 3/27/22 08:22, this is what rabidR04CH wrote:
>>>>> On 2022-03-26 1:00 p.m., 0 >>>>> This is quite interesting read but it is from an unofficial website:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> <https://www-drwindows-de.translate.goog/news/windows-11-version-22h
>>>>>> 2-ende-der-reise-fuer-nicht-unterstuetzte-pcs?_x_tr_sl=auto&_x_tr_tl
>>>>>> =en&_x_tr_hl=en-US&_x_tr_pto=wapp>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> <https://www-drwindows-de.translate.goog/news/windows-11-version-22h
>>>>>> 2-ende-der-reise-fuer-nicht-unterstuetzte-pcs?_x_tr_sl=auto&_x_tr_tl
>>>>>> =en&_x_tr_hl=en-US&_x_tr_pto=wapp>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> <https://www-drwindows-de.translate.goog/news/windows-11-version-22h
>>>>>> 2-ende-der-reise-fuer-nicht-unterstuetzte-pcs?_x_tr_sl=auto&_x_tr_tl
>>>>>> =en&_x_tr_hl=en-US&_x_tr_pto=wapp>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> <https://www-drwindows-de.translate.goog/news/windows-11-version-22h
>>>>>> 2-ende-der-reise-fuer-nicht-unterstuetzte-pcs?_x_tr_sl=auto&_x_tr_tl
>>>>>> =en&_x_tr_hl=en-US&_x_tr_pto=wapp>
>
> I wonder if there's a reason he posted the URL four times! (And didn't trim it before the first "?", which usually works.)
>>>>>
>>>>> At this point, people who use unsupported hardware and plan to continue to do so past 2025
>
> **#IF#** they plan/want to keep up with the Windows 11+ gravy-train.
>
>>>>> might as well just install Linux if they can  swallow their pride and lower their standards significantly. Otherwise, it will simply retire then.
>>>>>
> I can see it being quit possible Ill still be using Windows 7 in 2025 or after.
>>>>>
>>>> Don't knock it, Linux is very good.  I am much more productive in Linux than I am in Windows.  I don't have things changing on me weekly.
>
> Nor do I (-:
>
>>>  Linux does the job, however there is no doubt that updates can break your system and that if you have an NVIDIA GPU, the experience can be hit or miss. Anyone who has hardware which relies on free drivers is not likely to see any big issue.
> []
> I think there are roughly two sorts of user: (The one that wants to divide the world into two sorts, and ... sorry) the one who is happy with a system that works, and doesn't want to change it once it's working ['if it ain't broke don't "fix" it'], and the one who wants to remain "up to date" ['it _is_ broke, you just didn't know it was (especially security concerns)']. I'm sure that applies whether Windows, Linux, Apple, or ...

If you didn't have W11, nothing of value would be lost.

reg add HKLM\System\CurrentControlSet\Services\WpnUserService /v Start /t REG_DWORD /d 4 /f
reg add HKLM\System\CurrentControlSet\Services\CDPUserSvc /v Start /t REG_DWORD /d 4 /f
reg add HKLM\System\CurrentControlSet\Services\OneSyncSvc /v Start /t REG_DWORD /d 4 /f
reg add HKLM\System\CurrentControlSet\Services\UnistoreSvc /v Start /t REG_DWORD /d 4 /f
reg add HKLM\System\CurrentControlSet\Services\PimIndexMaintenanceSvc /v Start /t REG_DWORD /d 4 /f
reg add HKLM\System\CurrentControlSet\Services\UserDataSvc /v Start /t REG_DWORD /d 4 /f

5060 CDPUserSvc <=== visible read/write "Connected Devices Platform", constant scanning
3820 WpnUserService
9780 OneSyncSvc, UnistoreSvc, PimIndexMaintenanceSvc, UserDataSvc

CDPUserSvc_3e64b is svchost.exe -k UnistackSvcGroup.

OneSyncSvc_3e64b Sync Host_3e64b - This service synchronizes mail, contacts, calendar and various other user data.
Mail may dependent on it

PimIndexMaintenanceSvc_3e64b Contact Data_3e64b - contact date for fast contact searching.
contacts might be missing from you search results.

UnistoreSvc_3e64b User Data Storage_3e64b - Handles storage of structed user data, including contact info,
calendars, messages and other content.

UserDataSvc_3e64b User Data Access_3e64b - Provides apps with access to structured user data,
including contact info, calendars, messages and other content.

Really ? Why not create half a dozen more of these ?
Nobody is watching. Go ahead. Pleasure yerself.
Why don't you index my fucking calendars ? Hmmm ?

And of course SysMain (superfetch preparation).

And Windows Defender, and Search Indexer.

*******

Now, ask me why the disk LED is constantly flashing :-/

Now, bench your NVMe and ask me why it runs at
half the expected rate in W11 (compared to a bench run in Linux).

While you're at it, run Task Manager, see the CPU pane register
8% usage, flip over to Details and see 3% usage. The thing
I feared most, has happened. Dishonest Task Manager in W11.

When you do Properties on your C: drive in Windows 11, why
is the space used 8 GB larger than the space claimed to be
used in Macrium Reflect analysis ? System Protection is off,
so it's not a shadow related to that sort of backup.

Now tell me why we want this rubbish of a design.
What is in it for us exactly ? Constant annoyance ?
Constant mystery and intrigue ?

What kind of people are attracted to this ???
Panos Panay maybe ? Quick, someone take a shot
of his PC and see what he runs.

I'm easy to get along with. But

*do not visually annoy me*

Do not rub my face in your shenanigans.
Do a little work to hide what you're doing.

Like, fucking well add the numbers together in Task Manager
Details and make it match the CPU pane. See ? Dishonesty is easy.
Or fudge the numbers in C: properties, so it matches Macrium.

I use abnormal activity, to detect trouble on PCs,
and I don't need this.

Paul

On 27 Mar 2022, rabidR04CH wrote
(in article <qGY%J.468444$Rza5.253731@fx47.iad>):

> On 2022-03-26 1:00 p.m., 😉 Good Guy 😉 wrote:
> > This is quite interesting read but it is from an unofficial website:
> >
> > <https://www-drwindows-de.translate.goog/news/windows-11-version-22h2-ende-d
> > er-reise-fuer-nicht-unterstuetzte-pcs?_x_tr_sl=auto&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=en-
> > US&_x_tr_pto=wapp>
> > <https://www-drwindows-de.translate.goog/news/windows-11-version-22h2-ende-d
> > er-reise-fuer-nicht-unterstuetzte-pcs?_x_tr_sl=auto&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=en-
> > US&_x_tr_pto=wapp>
> > <https://www-drwindows-de.translate.goog/news/windows-11-version-22h2-ende-d
> > er-reise-fuer-nicht-unterstuetzte-pcs?_x_tr_sl=auto&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=en-
> > US&_x_tr_pto=wapp>
> > <https://www-drwindows-de.translate.goog/news/windows-11-version-22h2-ende-d
> > er-reise-fuer-nicht-unterstuetzte-pcs?_x_tr_sl=auto&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=en-
> > US&_x_tr_pto=wapp>
>
> At this point, people who use unsupported hardware and plan to continue
> to do so past 2025 might as well just install Linux if they can swallow
> their pride and lower their standards significantly. Otherwise, it will
> simply retire then.

Or, simply, keep using Win 10 until the hardware dies. At the office there
are XP and Win 7 machines still running, for various reasons. We just keep
them isolated from the main network, and, of course, from the internet.

On 2022-03-27 11:54 a.m., Big Al wrote:
> On 3/27/22 09:56, this is what rabidR04CH wrote:
>> On 2022-03-27 9:00 a.m., Big Al wrote:
>>> On 3/27/22 08:22, this is what rabidR04CH wrote:
>>>> On 2022-03-26 1:00 p.m., 😉 Good Guy 😉 wrote:
>>>>> This is quite interesting read but it is from an unofficial website:
>>>>>
>>>>> <https://www-drwindows-de.translate.goog/news/windows-11-version-22h2-ende-der-reise-fuer-nicht-unterstuetzte-pcs?_x_tr_sl=auto&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=en-US&_x_tr_pto=wapp>
>>>>>
>>>>> <https://www-drwindows-de.translate.goog/news/windows-11-version-22h2-ende-der-reise-fuer-nicht-unterstuetzte-pcs?_x_tr_sl=auto&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=en-US&_x_tr_pto=wapp>
>>>>>
>>>>> <https://www-drwindows-de.translate.goog/news/windows-11-version-22h2-ende-der-reise-fuer-nicht-unterstuetzte-pcs?_x_tr_sl=auto&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=en-US&_x_tr_pto=wapp>
>>>>>
>>>>> <https://www-drwindows-de.translate.goog/news/windows-11-version-22h2-ende-der-reise-fuer-nicht-unterstuetzte-pcs?_x_tr_sl=auto&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=en-US&_x_tr_pto=wapp>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> At this point, people who use unsupported hardware and plan to
>>>> continue to do so past 2025 might as well just install Linux if they
>>>> can swallow their pride and lower their standards significantly.
>>>> Otherwise, it will simply retire then.
>>>>
>>>>
>>> Don't knock it, Linux is very good.  I am much more productive in
>>> Linux than I am in Windows.  I don't have things changing on me weekly.
>>
>> Linux does the job, however there is no doubt that updates can break
>> your system and that if you have an NVIDIA GPU, the experience can be
>> hit or miss. Anyone who has hardware which relies on free drivers is
>> not likely to see any big issue.
>>
> And yes, I've heard the NVIDIA issue a lot, so I'm not using it and have
> a good experience.

Whether you're using on-board Intel or AMD or discrete AMD, you're not
likely to have any problems with your computer in Linux and you will
indeed find it to be better than Windows since every driver is going to
be open-source. The more free the code is, the less likely you'll have
problems and even a screwy update is not likely to take down your
system. With NVIDIA though, not only is every update a potential problem
but things like suspend and hibernation aren't likely to ever wake. Some
distributions work better than others but using those distributions
might not be the user-friendly experience a potential Linux users were
hoping for.

There's a lot to love but a lot to hate as well. I've tried to make it
my only operating system since around 1998 but I give up... I just do.
It's just not worth the headaches anymore.

--
rabidR04CH
Red Cross donor, supporter of independent media, proud Catholic and free
speech absolutist
Zephyrus G14 GA401QM on Windows 11
"But Peter and the apostles answered, 'We must obey God rather than
men.'" - Acts 5:29
For fans of message boards, I invite you:
https://retalk.com/invite/rabidR04CH

On 3/27/2022 7:45 PM, rabidR04CH wrote:
> On 2022-03-27 11:54 a.m., Big Al wrote:
>> On 3/27/22 09:56, this is what rabidR04CH wrote:
>>> On 2022-03-27 9:00 a.m., Big Al wrote:
>>>> On 3/27/22 08:22, this is what rabidR04CH wrote:
>>>>> At this point, people who use unsupported hardware and plan to continue to do so past 2025 might as well just install Linux if they can swallow their pride and lower their standards significantly. Otherwise, it will simply retire then.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>> Don't knock it, Linux is very good.  I am much more productive in Linux than I am in Windows.  I don't have things changing on me weekly.
>>>
>>> Linux does the job, however there is no doubt that updates can break your system and that if you have an NVIDIA GPU, the experience can be hit or miss. Anyone who has hardware which relies on free drivers is not likely to see any big issue.
>>>
>> And yes, I've heard the NVIDIA issue a lot, so I'm not using it and have a good experience.
>
> Whether you're using on-board Intel or AMD or discrete AMD, you're not likely to have any problems with your computer in Linux and you will indeed find it to be better than Windows since every driver is going to be open-source. The more free the code is, the less likely you'll have problems and even a screwy update is not likely to take down your system. With NVIDIA though, not only is every update a potential problem but things like suspend and hibernation aren't likely to ever wake. Some distributions work better than others but using those distributions might not be the user-friendly experience a potential Linux users were hoping for.
>
> There's a lot to love but a lot to hate as well. I've tried to make it my only operating system since around 1998 but I give up... I just do. It's just not worth the headaches anymore.
>

Linux is only as good as the people managing the distro.

I have a BitDefender CD, which I think may have been
constructed from Gentoo (a build-from-source distro).

It's not the fault of Gentoo, when people strip down the OS too
much and break it.

In the BitDefender CD, when you go to use it (boot the machine with
the scanning CD), to save on drivers, only ModeSetting is included.
No Nouveau or NVidia in the directory structure. Well, ModeSetting
did not work on my GTX1080 (which is a few years old now).

To run BitDefender, I had to set up XMing on a second PC, as an XWindows
display, then set the DISPLAY variable and Export it on the BitDefender
machine. This causes the machine I'm doing the AV scan on, to
draw the screen on the monitor of the second computer.

And then... I could see the screen, to do an AV scan.

On more sanely constructed setups, the custom NVidia drivers are
tied to kernel versions. Like a particular driver works with
kernel 5.5 to 5.13 perhaps. If kernel 5.14 were to be installed,
the display breaks. Or the machine doesn't boot. Then you have
to hope the GRUB menu is set up, to show you the fallbacks and
select an older kernel to run.

This level of management is not what Windows users dream of.
They're used to some pretty crusty driver setups continuing to work.

Linux seems incapable of fixing stuff like this, instead choosing
to add more complexity and just "wallow in it".

I can show you distros that have excellent table manners. Puppy runs
X with XVesa as a driver, which is a vanilla frame buffer and should
work with just about everything. If I were to say that to a Canonical
employee they would just laugh at me and say "not complicated enough".

It's not that I particularly care about how something gets
done, the gritty details. It's the attitude that counts.

For example, if someone were to say "I just looked at Puppy and it'll
run just about any hardware, we should do that!", that would impress
the hell out of me. Well, that used to be the attitude of Linux,
before parts of it got too commercial. It's hobbyists, who say things
like "we should do that!" instead of "let us use Snaps to handcuff
the users six ways from Sunday".

*******

When the day comes, that it's time to ditch Windows (and that
day will eventually arrive), you should be ready for it.
Test Test Test. Try stuff out. Evaluate. See what parts
of things suck. Be opinionated.

Paul

On 2022-03-27 9:07 p.m., Paul wrote:
> On 3/27/2022 7:45 PM, rabidR04CH wrote:
>> On 2022-03-27 11:54 a.m., Big Al wrote:
>>> On 3/27/22 09:56, this is what rabidR04CH wrote:
>>>> On 2022-03-27 9:00 a.m., Big Al wrote:
>>>>> On 3/27/22 08:22, this is what rabidR04CH wrote:
>>>>>> At this point, people who use unsupported hardware and plan to
>>>>>> continue to do so past 2025 might as well just install Linux if
>>>>>> they can swallow their pride and lower their standards
>>>>>> significantly. Otherwise, it will simply retire then.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>> Don't knock it, Linux is very good.  I am much more productive in
>>>>> Linux than I am in Windows.  I don't have things changing on me
>>>>> weekly.
>>>>
>>>> Linux does the job, however there is no doubt that updates can break
>>>> your system and that if you have an NVIDIA GPU, the experience can
>>>> be hit or miss. Anyone who has hardware which relies on free drivers
>>>> is not likely to see any big issue.
>>>>
>>> And yes, I've heard the NVIDIA issue a lot, so I'm not using it and
>>> have a good experience.
>>
>> Whether you're using on-board Intel or AMD or discrete AMD, you're not
>> likely to have any problems with your computer in Linux and you will
>> indeed find it to be better than Windows since every driver is going
>> to be open-source. The more free the code is, the less likely you'll
>> have problems and even a screwy update is not likely to take down your
>> system. With NVIDIA though, not only is every update a potential
>> problem but things like suspend and hibernation aren't likely to ever
>> wake. Some distributions work better than others but using those
>> distributions might not be the user-friendly experience a potential
>> Linux users were hoping for.
>>
>> There's a lot to love but a lot to hate as well. I've tried to make it
>> my only operating system since around 1998 but I give up... I just do.
>> It's just not worth the headaches anymore.
>>
>
> Linux is only as good as the people managing the distro.
>
> I have a BitDefender CD, which I think may have been
> constructed from Gentoo (a build-from-source distro).
>
> It's not the fault of Gentoo, when people strip down the OS too
> much and break it.
>
> In the BitDefender CD, when you go to use it (boot the machine with
> the scanning CD), to save on drivers, only ModeSetting is included.
> No Nouveau or NVidia in the directory structure. Well, ModeSetting
> did not work on my GTX1080 (which is a few years old now).
>
> To run BitDefender, I had to set up XMing on a second PC, as an XWindows
> display, then set the DISPLAY variable and Export it on the BitDefender
> machine. This causes the machine I'm doing the AV scan on, to
> draw the screen on the monitor of the second computer.
>
> And then... I could see the screen, to do an AV scan.
>
> On more sanely constructed setups, the custom NVidia drivers are
> tied to kernel versions. Like a particular driver works with
> kernel 5.5 to 5.13 perhaps. If kernel 5.14 were to be installed,
> the display breaks. Or the machine doesn't boot. Then you have
> to hope the GRUB menu is set up, to show you the fallbacks and
> select an older kernel to run.
>
> This level of management is not what Windows users dream of.
> They're used to some pretty crusty driver setups continuing to work.
>
> Linux seems incapable of fixing stuff like this, instead choosing
> to add more complexity and just "wallow in it".
>
> I can show you distros that have excellent table manners. Puppy runs
> X with XVesa as a driver, which is a vanilla frame buffer and should
> work with just about everything. If I were to say that to a Canonical
> employee they would just laugh at me and say "not complicated enough".
>
> It's not that I particularly care about how something gets
> done, the gritty details. It's the attitude that counts.
>
> For example, if someone were to say "I just looked at Puppy and it'll
> run just about any hardware, we should do that!", that would impress
> the hell out of me. Well, that used to be the attitude of Linux,
> before parts of it got too commercial. It's hobbyists, who say things
> like "we should do that!" instead of "let us use Snaps to handcuff
> the users six ways from Sunday".
>
> *******
>
> When the day comes, that it's time to ditch Windows (and that
> day will eventually arrive), you should be ready for it.
> Test Test Test. Try stuff out. Evaluate. See what parts
> of things suck. Be opinionated.

I've already made my decision for when that time comes and all roads
lead to openSUSE. I know my way around Linux quite well but I don't feel
that it is worth the bother on machines more recent than three years. At
five years or older, you're much better off with it.

If people don't mind upgrading every four or five years, Windows or Mac
OS is fine but it's nice to know that Linux is around if you do. It does
do a good job if you're willing to put some time into learning it but
unless your mind is open to the fact that it might screw up on you,
chances are that you'll be disappointed.

--
rabidR04CH
Red Cross donor, supporter of independent media, proud Catholic and free
speech absolutist
Zephyrus G14 GA401QM on Windows 11
"But Peter and the apostles answered, 'We must obey God rather than
men.'" - Acts 5:29
For fans of message boards, I invite you:
https://retalk.com/invite/rabidR04CH

Wolffan wrote:
> rabidR04CH wrote
>> At this point, people who use unsupported hardware and plan to continue
>> to do so past 2025 might as well just install Linux if they can swallow
>> their pride and lower their standards significantly. Otherwise, it will
>> simply retire then.
>
> Or, simply, keep using Win 10 until the hardware dies.

Of course. Especially now, with prices skyrocketing, zillions of Win10
users are not willing or simply unable to buy new hardware that conforms
to Micro$oft's dictates. So we'll see a massive installed base of Win10
staying active and connected after 2025. And maybe M$ is heading for yet
another clash with the EU for abusing its de facto monopoly.

-p

On 2022-03-28 3:57 a.m., Piet wrote:
> Wolffan wrote:
>> rabidR04CH wrote
>>> At this point, people who use unsupported hardware and plan to continue
>>> to do so past 2025 might as well just install Linux if they can swallow
>>> their pride and lower their standards significantly. Otherwise, it will
>>> simply retire then.
>>
>> Or, simply, keep using Win 10 until the hardware dies.
>
> Of course. Especially now, with prices skyrocketing, zillions of Win10
> users are not willing or simply unable to buy new hardware that conforms
> to Micro$oft's dictates.

Very likely. Considering how most people basically just browse, use
social media and do tasks like light video editing that their aging
machine did quite fine in 2015 and still manages to do very well in
2022, there would be no reason to upgrade just to use a higher version
of the operating system.

> So we'll see a massive installed base of Win10
> staying active and connected after 2025.

Either with Windows 10 without any support from the company or by
installing one of the many Linux distributions available to them.

> And maybe M$ is heading for yet
> another clash with the EU for abusing its de facto monopoly.

I doubt this.

--
rabidR04CH
MSI GT72 2QD on Windows 10
Red Cross donor, supporter of independent media, proud Catholic and free
speech absolutist
"But Peter and the apostles answered, 'We must obey God rather than
men.'" - Acts 5:29
For fans of message boards, I invite you:
https://retalk.com/invite/rabidR04CH

On 3/27/22 21:07, this is what Paul wrote:
> When the day comes, that it's time to ditch Windows (and that
> day will eventually arrive), you should be ready for it.
> Test Test Test. Try stuff out. Evaluate. See what parts
> of things suck. Be opinionated.
>
>    Paul
And try different distros. By all means as you said they are not the same. Each has it's plus/minus.

Piet <www.godfatherof.nl/@opt-in.invalid> wrote:
> Wolffan wrote:
> > rabidR04CH wrote
> >> At this point, people who use unsupported hardware and plan to continue
> >> to do so past 2025 might as well just install Linux if they can swallow
> >> their pride and lower their standards significantly. Otherwise, it will
> >> simply retire then.
> >
> > Or, simply, keep using Win 10 until the hardware dies.
>
> Of course. Especially now, with prices skyrocketing, zillions of Win10
> users are not willing or simply unable to buy new hardware that conforms
> to Micro$oft's dictates. So we'll see a massive installed base of Win10
> staying active and connected after 2025. And maybe M$ is heading for yet
> another clash with the EU for abusing its de facto monopoly.

Exactly. That's why I'll try to keep my limping 2015-era laptop
limping along till it really dies. A new comparable laptop now costs
some 75% more (yes, SSD instead of HDD; can't get one with a HDD
anymore). Fingers crossed.

On 2022-03-28, Frank Slootweg <this@ddress.is.invalid> wrote:
> Exactly. That's why I'll try to keep my limping 2015-era laptop
> limping along till it really dies. A new comparable laptop now costs
> some 75% more (yes, SSD instead of HDD; can't get one with a HDD
> anymore). Fingers crossed.

2015 sounds pretty new. I'm writing this on a 2004-vintage laptop,
juiced up to its maximum of 2GB memory and with an old 30GB SSD.
Not a ball of fire but it's quite usable. (Running Linux of course.)

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