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computers / alt.comp.os.windows-10 / Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?

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* Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?Commander Kinsey
`* Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?Paul
 `* Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?Commander Kinsey
  `* Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?Joel
   +- Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?Commander Kinsey
   `* Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?Commander Kinsey
    `* Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?Joel
     `* Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?Commander Kinsey
      +* Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?%
      |`* Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?Commander Kinsey
      | `* Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?%
      |  `- Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?Commander Kinsey
      `* Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?Joel
       `* Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?Commander Kinsey
        +* Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?Joel
        |`* Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?Commander Kinsey
        | `* Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?Joel
        |  `* Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?Commander Kinsey
        |   +* Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?David Brooks
        |   |+- Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?Commander Kinsey
        |   |`* Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?Joel
        |   | `* Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?Commander Kinsey
        |   |  `* Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?Joel
        |   |   `* Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?Commander Kinsey
        |   |    +* Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?Joel
        |   |    |`* Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?Commander Kinsey
        |   |    | `* Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?Joel
        |   |    |  `- Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?Commander Kinsey
        |   |    `- Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?Chris
        |   `* Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?Joel
        |    +* Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?Bill
        |    |`* Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?Commander Kinsey
        |    | `* Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?rabidR04CH
        |    |  +* Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?Joel
        |    |  |`* Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?rabidR04CH
        |    |  | `* Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?Joel
        |    |  |  `* Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?Commander Kinsey
        |    |  |   `* Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?Joel
        |    |  |    `* Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?Commander Kinsey
        |    |  |     `* Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?Joel
        |    |  |      `- Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?Commander Kinsey
        |    |  `* Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?Commander Kinsey
        |    |   +* Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?Joel
        |    |   |+* Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?Commander Kinsey
        |    |   ||`* Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?Joel
        |    |   || `* Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?Commander Kinsey
        |    |   ||  +* Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?rabidR04CH
        |    |   ||  |`* Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?Commander Kinsey
        |    |   ||  | +* Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?Joel
        |    |   ||  | |`* Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?Ken Blake
        |    |   ||  | | `* Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?Joel
        |    |   ||  | |  +* Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?Commander Kinsey
        |    |   ||  | |  |`* Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?Paul
        |    |   ||  | |  | `* Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?Commander Kinsey
        |    |   ||  | |  |  `* Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?Paul
        |    |   ||  | |  |   `- Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?Joel
        |    |   ||  | |  `* Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?Ken Blake
        |    |   ||  | |   `* Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?Joel
        |    |   ||  | |    `* Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?Commander Kinsey
        |    |   ||  | |     `* Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?Joel
        |    |   ||  | |      +* Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?Zaidy036
        |    |   ||  | |      |`- Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?Commander Kinsey
        |    |   ||  | |      `* Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?Commander Kinsey
        |    |   ||  | |       +* Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?Joel
        |    |   ||  | |       |`- Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?Commander Kinsey
        |    |   ||  | |       `* Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?Paul
        |    |   ||  | |        `- Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?Commander Kinsey
        |    |   ||  | +- Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?Paul
        |    |   ||  | `* Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?rabidR04CH
        |    |   ||  |  `* Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?Commander Kinsey
        |    |   ||  |   `* Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?rabidR04CH
        |    |   ||  |    `* Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?Commander Kinsey
        |    |   ||  |     `* Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?rabidR04CH
        |    |   ||  |      `* Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?Commander Kinsey
        |    |   ||  |       `* Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?Paul
        |    |   ||  |        `- Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?Commander Kinsey
        |    |   ||  `* Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?Joel
        |    |   ||   +* Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?rabidR04CH
        |    |   ||   |+* Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?Joel
        |    |   ||   ||`* Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?Commander Kinsey
        |    |   ||   || `* Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?Joel
        |    |   ||   ||  `- Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?Commander Kinsey
        |    |   ||   |`- Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?Commander Kinsey
        |    |   ||   `* Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?Commander Kinsey
        |    |   ||    `* Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?Joel
        |    |   ||     +* Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?rabidR04CH
        |    |   ||     |+* Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?Joel
        |    |   ||     ||`* Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?rabidR04CH
        |    |   ||     || +* Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?Joel
        |    |   ||     || |`* Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?Ken Blake
        |    |   ||     || | +* Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?Joel
        |    |   ||     || | |+* Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?Ken Blake
        |    |   ||     || | ||`- Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?Joel
        |    |   ||     || | |`- Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?Commander Kinsey
        |    |   ||     || | +* Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?J. P. Gilliver (John)
        |    |   ||     || | |`* Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?Ken Blake
        |    |   ||     || | | `* Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?rabidR04CH
        |    |   ||     || | |  +* Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?Bill
        |    |   ||     || | |  |+- Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?Commander Kinsey
        |    |   ||     || | |  |`* Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?rabidR04CH
        |    |   ||     || | |  | +- Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?Commander Kinsey
        |    |   ||     || | |  | `* Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?Bill
        |    |   ||     || | |  `- Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?Commander Kinsey
        |    |   ||     || | `- Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?Commander Kinsey
        |    |   ||     || `- Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?Commander Kinsey
        |    |   ||     |+* Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?Ken Blake
        |    |   ||     |+* Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?Bill
        |    |   ||     |`- Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?Commander Kinsey
        |    |   ||     `* Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?Commander Kinsey
        |    |   |`* Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?Ken Blake
        |    |   `* Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?rabidR04CH
        |    `* Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?Commander Kinsey
        `- Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?Chris

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Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?

<op.1l41bsckmvhs6z@ryzen.lan>

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https://www.novabbs.com/computers/article-flat.php?id=62535&group=alt.comp.os.windows-10#62535

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Subject: Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?
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From: CK1...@nospam.com (Commander Kinsey)
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 by: Commander Kinsey - Sat, 14 May 2022 03:00 UTC

On Sat, 14 May 2022 03:55:39 +0100, rabidR04CH <rabid@r04.ch> wrote:

> On 2022-05-13 10:12 p.m., Bill wrote:
>> On 5/13/2022 10:08 PM, rabidR04CH wrote:
>>> On 2022-05-13 7:15 p.m., Ken Blake wrote:
>>>> On Fri, 13 May 2022 21:17:41 +0100, "J. P. Gilliver (John)"
>>>> <G6JPG@255soft.uk> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> On Fri, 13 May 2022 at 08:04:07, Ken Blake <Ken@invalid.news.com> wrote
>>>>> (my responses usually FOLLOW):
>>>>> []
>>>>>> I have no personal favorite. In fact I'm against the idea of Office
>>>>>> Suites. In my opinion, it's best to choose the program you like best
>>>>>> in each category, without regard to what suite it's in.
>>>>>
>>>>> I tend to agree, for such different prog.s; as well as everything else,
>>>>> it also encourages people to think "grid" means "spreadsheet", so when
>>>>> they want a grid/table in their Word document, they use Excel.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> My favorite word processor is WordPerfect, my favorite spreadsheet
>>>>>> program is Excel, my favorite e-mail client is Thunderbird.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The same goes for non-office programs My favorite e-mail client is
>>>>>> Thunderbird, but my favorite newsreader is Agent. I'm against the idea
>>>>>> of bundling programs of any type together.
>>>>>
>>>>> Each to his own; I like having the same prog. For news and mail, as
>>>>> they
>>>>> have similar requirements (quoted text etc.), and I don't have to
>>>>> remember which I'm using and how it does things differently from how
>>>>> the
>>>>> other one does;
>>>>
>>>> Yes, yours is a common point of view. As I said, it's not mine.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> >and the main disadvantage usually quoted - that of
>>>>> accidentally sending an email where a post was intended, or vice
>>>>> versa -
>>>>> I don't tend to do (well under one a year; I think less than 5 times in
>>>>> about 30 years, but can't remember for sure). Conversely, if I
>>>>> _want_ to
>>>>> send a private email reply to a newsgroup poster, it's easy.
>>>>>
>>>>> But I wouldn't try to force my view on anyone; above is/are just my
>>>>> explanation of why _I_ like the way I have.
>>>>>
>>>>> (As to the question of what's improved in recent Office suites and
>>>>> someone's reply that comparing 12 year old to current isn't very valid,
>>>>> I disagree: I use by default Word 2003, and have seen very little
>>>>> reason
>>>>> to change [I have the converters].
>>>>
>>>> For word processor in particular, the opportunity for real
>>>> improvements ran out years ago. There very little difference between
>>>> versions, for WordPerfect as well as for Word.
>>>
>>> I don't disagree. Whatever improvements the software companies make
>>> now will most likely have more to do with collaboration and
>>> conferencing than with things a solo worker would actually need.
>>>
>>
>> From this I conclude that $23 for a USB DVD Drive is a good investment
>> for a new computer.
>
> How the heck did you come to that conclusion based on what I said?

Does the word hell scare you? What about damn? Heck isn't a fucking word you religious nut.

Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?

<011v7h5m9hf8k57371aomm156fmjamsdmj@4ax.com>

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From: joelcr...@gmail.com (Joel)
Newsgroups: alt.comp.os.windows-11,alt.comp.os.windows-10
Subject: Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?
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 by: Joel - Sat, 14 May 2022 10:30 UTC

"Commander Kinsey" <CK1@nospam.com> wrote:

>>>>> What evidence do you have that you bought it [Windows]?
>>>>
>>>> Uh, the key, but I actually wouldn't even need to enter it, because
>>>> I've already activated this machine with it.
>>>
>>> Anyone can have a key, you could have got that from a naughty website.
>>
>> Of course, more power to people who do it that way, but I like the
>> fact that my key is private info between Microsoft and myself. They
>> recognize me as the one who bought it, and is using it with the same
>> Microsoft account. It's peace of mind.
>
>ROFL, I know someone who successfully sued a small computer store for selling him a Windows 10 computer which "forced him" to open a Microsoft account to log in. He got the computer free and believe the same amount (well over a grand) as compensation. No he wasn't American. Yes, he was Jewish. I asked him why he didn't sue MS and he declined to answer.

That is weird. I don't even get why people are so worried about
logging in with a Microsoft account. It wasn't required, when I did
so, but it was to my advantage to do it.

>As for peace of mind, I know my 7 computers will continue to run Windows 11 with no key forever. I trust pirates more than I trust MS. And you I suppose would have just shelled out $1400 just for some operating systems.

I paid $200, as I've said. It's a fair market value, in my view.

--
Joel Crump

Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?

<k91v7hd7pl4u59f8ht27ffc7gc2492u052@4ax.com>

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From: joelcr...@gmail.com (Joel)
Newsgroups: alt.comp.os.windows-11,alt.comp.os.windows-10
Subject: Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?
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 by: Joel - Sat, 14 May 2022 10:35 UTC

"Commander Kinsey" <CK1@nospam.com> wrote:

>>>> When you self-build a computer, the motherboard's manufacturer basically is
>>>> your OEM, for all intents and purposes.
>>>
>>> What the hell are you talking about? A computer is more than a motherboard.
>>
>> I know that, but if I look at my Microsoft account, it shows this
>> machine as the brand name of the manufacturer of the motherboard. It's
>> what identifies a self-built machine.
>
>Only in MS's eyes. Now consider your wallet. What percentage of the cost of the computer was the MB?

Significant, it cost more than Win10 Pro did, the motherboard was the
single biggest price tag of all the parts. I didn't want to get one
that didn't have the capacity for expansion.

>Would you really give up on a machine if the MB was the bottleneck in speed? Or would you keep all other components and change the MB, just as you would add more RAM, upgrade the disk, put in a faster processor or graphics card?

That would never happen, because I don't cheap out on any of the
parts, in the first place.

>>>> Whereas a power supply, when you buy an inferior one, may be replaced more routinely.
>>>
>>> You're obviously not very good with your hands.
>>
>> I'm OK with my hands, that really isn't relevant. It's annoying to
>> assemble a computer, but not difficult enough that it isn't worth
>> doing, to get a better machine for the money. Even including the $200
>> I spent on Windows, I got a far superior box to what I'd get from
>> Dell.
>
>I think you got yourself mixed up in all those negatives. You wrote:
>"but not difficult enough that it isn't worth doing, to get a better machine for the money" - completely unintelligible.
>We can cancel out "not" and "difficult" to get easy, so it's sort of understandable.
>"but easy enough that it isn't worth doing, to get a better machine for the money"
>So since it's easy to assemble a computer, you don't think you should assemble it yourself for a better machine for the money?

God, are you dumb.

--
Joel Crump

Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?

<9dnv7hlsi34ppfjb9jtr4jop8eml59ek8l@4ax.com>

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From: Ken...@invalid.news.com (Ken Blake)
Newsgroups: alt.comp.os.windows-11,alt.comp.os.windows-10
Subject: Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?
Date: Sat, 14 May 2022 09:55:56 -0700
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 by: Ken Blake - Sat, 14 May 2022 16:55 UTC

On Sat, 14 May 2022 06:35:21 -0400, Joel <joelcrump@gmail.com> wrote:

>"Commander Kinsey" <CK1@nospam.com> wrote:
>
>>>>> When you self-build a computer, the motherboard's manufacturer basically is
>>>>> your OEM, for all intents and purposes.
>>>>
>>>> What the hell are you talking about? A computer is more than a motherboard.
>>>
>>> I know that, but if I look at my Microsoft account, it shows this
>>> machine as the brand name of the manufacturer of the motherboard. It's
>>> what identifies a self-built machine.
>>
>>Only in MS's eyes. Now consider your wallet. What percentage of the cost of the computer was the MB?
>
>
>Significant, it cost more than Win10 Pro did, the motherboard was the
>single biggest price tag of all the parts. I didn't want to get one
>that didn't have the capacity for expansion.

Out of curiosity, I just checked the prices I paid for the all the
components in my current (Oct 2021) computer.

The most expensive was the CPU: i9-11900.

Second was the SSD: Seagate Firecuda 520 2TB Performance Internal
Solid State Drive SSD PCIe Gen4 X4 NVMe 1.3

The motherboard (ASUS Prime Z590-P) was third.

Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?

<srnv7h1vgming77id41a65f7iupdprnp7m@4ax.com>

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From: joelcr...@gmail.com (Joel)
Newsgroups: alt.comp.os.windows-11,alt.comp.os.windows-10
Subject: Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?
Message-ID: <srnv7h1vgming77id41a65f7iupdprnp7m@4ax.com>
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 by: Joel - Sat, 14 May 2022 16:57 UTC

Ken Blake <Ken@invalid.news.com> wrote:

>Out of curiosity, I just checked the prices I paid for the all the
>components in my current (Oct 2021) computer.
>
>The most expensive was the CPU: i9-11900.
>
>Second was the SSD: Seagate Firecuda 520 2TB Performance Internal
>Solid State Drive SSD PCIe Gen4 X4 NVMe 1.3
>
>The motherboard (ASUS Prime Z590-P) was third.

<drooling>

--
Joel Crump

Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?

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From: Ken...@invalid.news.com (Ken Blake)
Newsgroups: alt.comp.os.windows-11,alt.comp.os.windows-10
Subject: Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?
Date: Sat, 14 May 2022 11:18:24 -0700
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 by: Ken Blake - Sat, 14 May 2022 18:18 UTC

On Sat, 14 May 2022 12:57:48 -0400, Joel <joelcrump@gmail.com> wrote:

>Ken Blake <Ken@invalid.news.com> wrote:
>
>>Out of curiosity, I just checked the prices I paid for the all the
>>components in my current (Oct 2021) computer.
>>
>>The most expensive was the CPU: i9-11900.
>>
>>Second was the SSD: Seagate Firecuda 520 2TB Performance Internal
>>Solid State Drive SSD PCIe Gen4 X4 NVMe 1.3
>>
>>The motherboard (ASUS Prime Z590-P) was third.
>
>
><drooling>

I'm very happy with what I chose. The total price for all the
components, with tax, come to about $1,800 USD--not cheap, but not a
fortune either.

I don't get a new computer every year. Whenever I do, I like to get as
close to state-of-the-art as I can afford, so it can last me a long
time. A cheaper one might have needed to be replaced sooner, and
therefore cost more in the long run. At my age (84) this one may last
me the rest of my life. At least I hope so.

Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?

<6nsv7h13fkpd1mten2dcinpep3qk3d3t81@4ax.com>

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From: joelcr...@gmail.com (Joel)
Newsgroups: alt.comp.os.windows-11,alt.comp.os.windows-10
Subject: Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?
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 by: Joel - Sat, 14 May 2022 18:23 UTC

Ken Blake <Ken@invalid.news.com> wrote:

>>>Out of curiosity, I just checked the prices I paid for the all the
>>>components in my current (Oct 2021) computer.
>>>
>>>The most expensive was the CPU: i9-11900.
>>>
>>>Second was the SSD: Seagate Firecuda 520 2TB Performance Internal
>>>Solid State Drive SSD PCIe Gen4 X4 NVMe 1.3
>>>
>>>The motherboard (ASUS Prime Z590-P) was third.
>>
>><drooling>
>
>I'm very happy with what I chose. The total price for all the
>components, with tax, come to about $1,800 USD--not cheap, but not a
>fortune either.
>
>I don't get a new computer every year. Whenever I do, I like to get as
>close to state-of-the-art as I can afford, so it can last me a long
>time. A cheaper one might have needed to be replaced sooner, and
>therefore cost more in the long run. At my age (84) this one may last
>me the rest of my life. At least I hope so.

Your motherboard is very similar to mine, although mine has WiFi 6
built in, about the only difference I could tell (mine is a Gigabyte
Aorus model). Your CPU is a generation newer, though, and mine is an
i5, and a modest clock speed. And your SSD is double the size of
mine, similar specs.

--
Joel Crump

Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?

<5AZuncaJvBgiFwFk@a.a>

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From: G6J...@255soft.uk (J. P. Gilliver (John))
Newsgroups: alt.comp.os.windows-11,alt.comp.os.windows-10
Subject: Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?
Date: Sat, 14 May 2022 22:14:49 +0100
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 by: J. P. Gilliver (John - Sat, 14 May 2022 21:14 UTC

On Sat, 14 May 2022 at 11:18:24, Ken Blake <Ken@invalid.news.com> wrote
(my responses usually FOLLOW):
[]
>I don't get a new computer every year. Whenever I do, I like to get as
>close to state-of-the-art as I can afford, so it can last me a long

I tend to avoid the bleeding edge, in case it is some wonderful new idea
whose shortcomings haven't been discovered yet.

>time. A cheaper one might have needed to be replaced sooner, and
>therefore cost more in the long run. At my age (84) this one may last
>me the rest of my life. At least I hope so.

That could be taken two ways - I hope you mean you're hoping for a
long-lasting computer! (-:
--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/<1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)Ar@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf

....Every morning is the dawn of a new error...

Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?

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From: Ken...@invalid.news.com (Ken Blake)
Newsgroups: alt.comp.os.windows-11,alt.comp.os.windows-10
Subject: Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?
Date: Sat, 14 May 2022 14:36:47 -0700
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 by: Ken Blake - Sat, 14 May 2022 21:36 UTC

On Sat, 14 May 2022 22:14:49 +0100, "J. P. Gilliver (John)"
<G6JPG@255soft.uk> wrote:

>On Sat, 14 May 2022 at 11:18:24, Ken Blake <Ken@invalid.news.com> wrote
>(my responses usually FOLLOW):
>[]
>>I don't get a new computer every year. Whenever I do, I like to get as
>>close to state-of-the-art as I can afford, so it can last me a long
>
>I tend to avoid the bleeding edge, in case it is some wonderful new idea
>whose shortcomings haven't been discovered yet.
>
>>time. A cheaper one might have needed to be replaced sooner, and
>>therefore cost more in the long run. At my age (84) this one may last
>>me the rest of my life. At least I hope so.
>
>That could be taken two ways

Yes, of course, but it's hard to imagine that anyone would take it the
wrong way.

>- I hope you mean you're hoping for a
>long-lasting computer! (-:

Yes, long-lasting in two senses: not breaking down, and not being so
slow as compared to more modern computers that newer software won't
run acceptably fast on it (or not run at all).

Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?

<ulYfK.5381$x1Wf.3431@fx10.iad>

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 by: Bill - Sun, 15 May 2022 01:05 UTC

On 5/13/2022 10:55 PM, rabidR04CH wrote:
> On 2022-05-13 10:12 p.m., Bill wrote:
>> On 5/13/2022 10:08 PM, rabidR04CH wrote:
>>> On 2022-05-13 7:15 p.m., Ken Blake wrote:
>>>> On Fri, 13 May 2022 21:17:41 +0100, "J. P. Gilliver (John)"
>>>> <G6JPG@255soft.uk> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> On Fri, 13 May 2022 at 08:04:07, Ken Blake <Ken@invalid.news.com>
>>>>> wrote
>>>>> (my responses usually FOLLOW):
>>>>> []
>>>>>> I have no personal favorite. In fact I'm against the idea of Office
>>>>>> Suites. In my opinion, it's best to choose the program you like best
>>>>>> in each category, without regard to what suite it's in.
>>>>>
>>>>> I tend to agree, for such different prog.s; as well as everything
>>>>> else,
>>>>> it also encourages people to think "grid" means "spreadsheet", so when
>>>>> they want a grid/table in their Word document, they use Excel.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> My favorite word processor is WordPerfect, my favorite spreadsheet
>>>>>> program is Excel, my favorite e-mail client is Thunderbird.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The same goes for non-office programs My favorite e-mail client is
>>>>>> Thunderbird, but my favorite newsreader is Agent. I'm against the
>>>>>> idea
>>>>>> of bundling programs of any type together.
>>>>>
>>>>> Each to his own; I like having the same prog. For news and mail, as
>>>>> they
>>>>> have similar requirements (quoted text etc.), and I don't have to
>>>>> remember which I'm using and how it does things differently from
>>>>> how the
>>>>> other one does;
>>>>
>>>> Yes, yours is a common point of view. As I said, it's not mine.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>   >and the main disadvantage usually quoted - that of
>>>>> accidentally sending an email where a post was intended, or vice
>>>>> versa -
>>>>> I don't tend to do (well under one a year; I think less than 5
>>>>> times in
>>>>> about 30 years, but can't remember for sure). Conversely, if I
>>>>> _want_ to
>>>>> send a private email reply to a newsgroup poster, it's easy.
>>>>>
>>>>> But I wouldn't try to force my view on anyone; above is/are just my
>>>>> explanation of why _I_ like the way I have.
>>>>>
>>>>> (As to the question of what's improved in recent Office suites and
>>>>> someone's reply that comparing 12 year old to current isn't very
>>>>> valid,
>>>>> I disagree: I use by default Word 2003, and have seen very little
>>>>> reason
>>>>> to change [I have the converters].
>>>>
>>>> For word processor in particular, the opportunity for real
>>>> improvements ran out years ago. There very little difference between
>>>> versions, for WordPerfect as well as for Word.
>>>
>>> I don't disagree. Whatever improvements the software companies make
>>> now will most likely have more to do with collaboration and
>>> conferencing than with things a solo worker would actually need.
>>>
>>
>>  From this I conclude that $23 for a USB DVD Drive is a good
>> investment for a new computer.
>
> How the heck did you come to that conclusion based on what I said?
>

I will enjoy using MS Office and other apps that I have on DVD, rather
then succumbing to the subscription model which appears to be being
pushed out next. You may have noticed that DVD's have been "going out of
style", and aren't present on many prebuilt computers. "$23" just
happens to be the price of the USB DVD drive that is on my Amazon wish
list.

Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?

<op.1l6yiwtlmvhs6z@ryzen.lan>

 copy mid

https://www.novabbs.com/computers/article-flat.php?id=62571&group=alt.comp.os.windows-10#62571

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 by: Commander Kinsey - Sun, 15 May 2022 03:55 UTC

On Sat, 14 May 2022 11:30:10 +0100, Joel <joelcrump@gmail.com> wrote:

> "Commander Kinsey" <CK1@nospam.com> wrote:
>
>>>>>> What evidence do you have that you bought it [Windows]?
>>>>>
>>>>> Uh, the key, but I actually wouldn't even need to enter it, because
>>>>> I've already activated this machine with it.
>>>>
>>>> Anyone can have a key, you could have got that from a naughty website.
>>>
>>> Of course, more power to people who do it that way, but I like the
>>> fact that my key is private info between Microsoft and myself. They
>>> recognize me as the one who bought it, and is using it with the same
>>> Microsoft account. It's peace of mind.
>>
>> ROFL, I know someone who successfully sued a small computer store for selling him a Windows 10 computer which "forced him" to open a Microsoft account to log in. He got the computer free and believe the same amount (well over a grand) as compensation. No he wasn't American. Yes, he was Jewish. I asked him why he didn't sue MS and he declined to answer.
>
> That is weird. I don't even get why people are so worried about
> logging in with a Microsoft account. It wasn't required, when I did
> so, but it was to my advantage to do it.

I can understand him not wanting MS to know everything he does, but he was too stupid to look up how to not use one (I figured it out myself), too arrogant to just take the computer back or ask for a different OS, and too wimpy to sue the people who actually made that decision he hated (MS).

>> As for peace of mind, I know my 7 computers will continue to run Windows 11 with no key forever. I trust pirates more than I trust MS. And you I suppose would have just shelled out $1400 just for some operating systems.
>
> I paid $200, as I've said. It's a fair market value, in my view.

$200 x 7 = $1400. That is not acceptable.

Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?

<op.1l60js12mvhs6z@ryzen.lan>

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https://www.novabbs.com/computers/article-flat.php?id=62573&group=alt.comp.os.windows-10#62573

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 by: Commander Kinsey - Sun, 15 May 2022 04:39 UTC

On Sat, 14 May 2022 11:35:21 +0100, Joel <joelcrump@gmail.com> wrote:

> "Commander Kinsey" <CK1@nospam.com> wrote:
>
>>>>> When you self-build a computer, the motherboard's manufacturer basically is
>>>>> your OEM, for all intents and purposes.
>>>>
>>>> What the hell are you talking about? A computer is more than a motherboard.
>>>
>>> I know that, but if I look at my Microsoft account, it shows this
>>> machine as the brand name of the manufacturer of the motherboard. It's
>>> what identifies a self-built machine.
>>
>> Only in MS's eyes. Now consider your wallet. What percentage of the cost of the computer was the MB?
>
>
> Significant, it cost more than Win10 Pro did, the motherboard was the
> single biggest price tag of all the parts. I didn't want to get one
> that didn't have the capacity for expansion.

You paid over $200 for a MB? I didn't know they went that high. The best one I could find was only $130. I got the $100 version as PCI Express 4 won't help me for years.

>> Would you really give up on a machine if the MB was the bottleneck in speed? Or would you keep all other components and change the MB, just as you would add more RAM, upgrade the disk, put in a faster processor or graphics card?
>
> That would never happen, because I don't cheap out on any of the
> parts, in the first place.

Something will always become the bottleneck. At some point that has to be the MB. This computer I''m using right not was built in 1994. Just changed one part at a time....

>>>>> Whereas a power supply, when you buy an inferior one, may be replaced more routinely.
>>>>
>>>> You're obviously not very good with your hands.
>>>
>>> I'm OK with my hands, that really isn't relevant. It's annoying to
>>> assemble a computer, but not difficult enough that it isn't worth
>>> doing, to get a better machine for the money. Even including the $200
>>> I spent on Windows, I got a far superior box to what I'd get from
>>> Dell.
>>
>> I think you got yourself mixed up in all those negatives. You wrote:
>> "but not difficult enough that it isn't worth doing, to get a better machine for the money" - completely unintelligible.
>> We can cancel out "not" and "difficult" to get easy, so it's sort of understandable.
>> "but easy enough that it isn't worth doing, to get a better machine for the money"
>> So since it's easy to assemble a computer, you don't think you should assemble it yourself for a better machine for the money?
>
> God, are you dumb.

Oh dear, can't you handle being caught out?

Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?

<op.1l60merymvhs6z@ryzen.lan>

 copy mid

https://www.novabbs.com/computers/article-flat.php?id=62574&group=alt.comp.os.windows-10#62574

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 by: Commander Kinsey - Sun, 15 May 2022 04:40 UTC

On Sat, 14 May 2022 19:18:24 +0100, Ken Blake <Ken@invalid.news.com> wrote:

> On Sat, 14 May 2022 12:57:48 -0400, Joel <joelcrump@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Ken Blake <Ken@invalid.news.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Out of curiosity, I just checked the prices I paid for the all the
>>> components in my current (Oct 2021) computer.
>>>
>>> The most expensive was the CPU: i9-11900.
>>>
>>> Second was the SSD: Seagate Firecuda 520 2TB Performance Internal
>>> Solid State Drive SSD PCIe Gen4 X4 NVMe 1.3
>>>
>>> The motherboard (ASUS Prime Z590-P) was third.
>>
>> <drooling>
>
> I'm very happy with what I chose. The total price for all the
> components, with tax,

You paid tax ROTFPMSL!

> come to about $1,800 USD--not cheap, but not a
> fortune either.

I forget how weak the dollar is against the British pound, but does that come to over a grand here? Bit much for a computer.

> I don't get a new computer every year. Whenever I do, I like to get as
> close to state-of-the-art as I can afford, so it can last me a long
> time. A cheaper one might have needed to be replaced sooner, and
> therefore cost more in the long run. At my age (84) this one may last
> me the rest of my life. At least I hope so.

Have you never heard of upgrading?

Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?

<op.1l60m3nymvhs6z@ryzen.lan>

 copy mid

https://www.novabbs.com/computers/article-flat.php?id=62575&group=alt.comp.os.windows-10#62575

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 by: Commander Kinsey - Sun, 15 May 2022 04:41 UTC

On Sat, 14 May 2022 19:23:01 +0100, Joel <joelcrump@gmail.com> wrote:

> Ken Blake <Ken@invalid.news.com> wrote:
>
>>>> Out of curiosity, I just checked the prices I paid for the all the
>>>> components in my current (Oct 2021) computer.
>>>>
>>>> The most expensive was the CPU: i9-11900.
>>>>
>>>> Second was the SSD: Seagate Firecuda 520 2TB Performance Internal
>>>> Solid State Drive SSD PCIe Gen4 X4 NVMe 1.3
>>>>
>>>> The motherboard (ASUS Prime Z590-P) was third.
>>>
>>> <drooling>
>>
>> I'm very happy with what I chose. The total price for all the
>> components, with tax, come to about $1,800 USD--not cheap, but not a
>> fortune either.
>>
>> I don't get a new computer every year. Whenever I do, I like to get as
>> close to state-of-the-art as I can afford, so it can last me a long
>> time. A cheaper one might have needed to be replaced sooner, and
>> therefore cost more in the long run. At my age (84) this one may last
>> me the rest of my life. At least I hope so.
>
>
> Your motherboard is very similar to mine, although mine has WiFi 6
> built in, about the only difference I could tell (mine is a Gigabyte
> Aorus model). Your CPU is a generation newer, though, and mine is an
> i5, and a modest clock speed. And your SSD is double the size of
> mine, similar specs.

Wifi is for phones.

Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?

<op.1l60nydmmvhs6z@ryzen.lan>

 copy mid

https://www.novabbs.com/computers/article-flat.php?id=62576&group=alt.comp.os.windows-10#62576

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 by: Commander Kinsey - Sun, 15 May 2022 04:41 UTC

On Sat, 14 May 2022 22:14:49 +0100, J. P. Gilliver (John) <G6JPG@255soft.uk> wrote:

> On Sat, 14 May 2022 at 11:18:24, Ken Blake <Ken@invalid.news.com> wrote
> (my responses usually FOLLOW):
> []
>> I don't get a new computer every year. Whenever I do, I like to get as
>> close to state-of-the-art as I can afford, so it can last me a long
>
> I tend to avoid the bleeding edge, in case it is some wonderful new idea
> whose shortcomings haven't been discovered yet.

There's also that curve of performance and cost that levels off....

Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?

<op.1l662onjmvhs6z@ryzen.lan>

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 by: Commander Kinsey - Sun, 15 May 2022 07:00 UTC

On Sun, 15 May 2022 02:05:28 +0100, Bill <nonegiven@att.net> wrote:

> On 5/13/2022 10:55 PM, rabidR04CH wrote:
>> On 2022-05-13 10:12 p.m., Bill wrote:
>>> On 5/13/2022 10:08 PM, rabidR04CH wrote:
>>>> On 2022-05-13 7:15 p.m., Ken Blake wrote:
>>>>> On Fri, 13 May 2022 21:17:41 +0100, "J. P. Gilliver (John)"
>>>>> <G6JPG@255soft.uk> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> On Fri, 13 May 2022 at 08:04:07, Ken Blake <Ken@invalid.news.com>
>>>>>> wrote
>>>>>> (my responses usually FOLLOW):
>>>>>> []
>>>>>>> I have no personal favorite. In fact I'm against the idea of Office
>>>>>>> Suites. In my opinion, it's best to choose the program you like best
>>>>>>> in each category, without regard to what suite it's in.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I tend to agree, for such different prog.s; as well as everything
>>>>>> else,
>>>>>> it also encourages people to think "grid" means "spreadsheet", so when
>>>>>> they want a grid/table in their Word document, they use Excel.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> My favorite word processor is WordPerfect, my favorite spreadsheet
>>>>>>> program is Excel, my favorite e-mail client is Thunderbird.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> The same goes for non-office programs My favorite e-mail client is
>>>>>>> Thunderbird, but my favorite newsreader is Agent. I'm against the
>>>>>>> idea
>>>>>>> of bundling programs of any type together.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Each to his own; I like having the same prog. For news and mail, as
>>>>>> they
>>>>>> have similar requirements (quoted text etc.), and I don't have to
>>>>>> remember which I'm using and how it does things differently from
>>>>>> how the
>>>>>> other one does;
>>>>>
>>>>> Yes, yours is a common point of view. As I said, it's not mine.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> >and the main disadvantage usually quoted - that of
>>>>>> accidentally sending an email where a post was intended, or vice
>>>>>> versa -
>>>>>> I don't tend to do (well under one a year; I think less than 5
>>>>>> times in
>>>>>> about 30 years, but can't remember for sure). Conversely, if I
>>>>>> _want_ to
>>>>>> send a private email reply to a newsgroup poster, it's easy.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> But I wouldn't try to force my view on anyone; above is/are just my
>>>>>> explanation of why _I_ like the way I have.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> (As to the question of what's improved in recent Office suites and
>>>>>> someone's reply that comparing 12 year old to current isn't very
>>>>>> valid,
>>>>>> I disagree: I use by default Word 2003, and have seen very little
>>>>>> reason
>>>>>> to change [I have the converters].
>>>>>
>>>>> For word processor in particular, the opportunity for real
>>>>> improvements ran out years ago. There very little difference between
>>>>> versions, for WordPerfect as well as for Word.
>>>>
>>>> I don't disagree. Whatever improvements the software companies make
>>>> now will most likely have more to do with collaboration and
>>>> conferencing than with things a solo worker would actually need.
>>>>
>>>
>>> From this I conclude that $23 for a USB DVD Drive is a good
>>> investment for a new computer.
>>
>> How the heck did you come to that conclusion based on what I said?
>>
>
> I will enjoy using MS Office and other apps that I have on DVD, rather
> then succumbing to the subscription model which appears to be being
> pushed out next. You may have noticed that DVD's have been "going out of
> style", and aren't present on many prebuilt computers. "$23" just
> happens to be the price of the USB DVD drive that is on my Amazon wish
> list.

Use Ebay, about 15% cheaper.

Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?

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From: joelcr...@gmail.com (Joel)
Newsgroups: alt.comp.os.windows-11,alt.comp.os.windows-10
Subject: Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?
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 by: Joel - Sun, 15 May 2022 10:23 UTC

Bill <nonegiven@att.net> wrote:
>On 5/13/2022 10:55 PM, rabidR04CH wrote:
>> On 2022-05-13 10:12 p.m., Bill wrote:
>>>
>>>  From this I conclude that $23 for a USB DVD Drive is a good
>>> investment for a new computer.
>>
>> How the heck did you come to that conclusion based on what I said?
>
>I will enjoy using MS Office and other apps that I have on DVD, rather
>then succumbing to the subscription model which appears to be being
>pushed out next. You may have noticed that DVD's have been "going out of
>style", and aren't present on many prebuilt computers. "$23" just
>happens to be the price of the USB DVD drive that is on my Amazon wish
>list.

I deliberately bought a case with no spaces for optical drives,
leaving my BD-RE in my old computer. It's just not needed for
anything, anymore.

--
Joel Crump

Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?

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From: joelcr...@gmail.com (Joel)
Newsgroups: alt.comp.os.windows-11,alt.comp.os.windows-10
Subject: Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?
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 by: Joel - Sun, 15 May 2022 10:26 UTC

"Commander Kinsey" <CK1@nospam.com> wrote:

>>>>> Anyone can have a key, you could have got that from a naughty website.
>>>>
>>>> Of course, more power to people who do it that way, but I like the
>>>> fact that my key is private info between Microsoft and myself. They
>>>> recognize me as the one who bought it, and is using it with the same
>>>> Microsoft account. It's peace of mind.
>>>
>>> As for peace of mind, I know my 7 computers will continue to run Windows 11 with no key forever. I trust pirates more than I trust MS. And you I suppose would have just shelled out $1400 just for some operating systems.
>>
>> I paid $200, as I've said. It's a fair market value, in my view.
>
>$200 x 7 = $1400. That is not acceptable.

Ah, I misread. Well, that would be expensive, but so is building
seven computers. It's just what is expected, whether you're actually
going to do it or not.

--
Joel Crump

Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?

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From: joelcr...@gmail.com (Joel)
Newsgroups: alt.comp.os.windows-11,alt.comp.os.windows-10
Subject: Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?
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 by: Joel - Sun, 15 May 2022 10:30 UTC

"Commander Kinsey" <CK1@nospam.com> wrote:

>> Your motherboard is very similar to mine, although mine has WiFi 6
>> built in, about the only difference I could tell (mine is a Gigabyte
>> Aorus model). Your CPU is a generation newer, though, and mine is an
>> i5, and a modest clock speed. And your SSD is double the size of
>> mine, similar specs.
>
>Wifi is for phones.

I have just as stable a connection over WiFi as I would with a wire.
And I can't run a wire here, anyway. WiFi is what I've used for many
years, going back to before my mom and I moved from the old
neighborhood.

--
Joel Crump

Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?

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From: Ken...@invalid.news.com (Ken Blake)
Newsgroups: alt.comp.os.windows-11,alt.comp.os.windows-10
Subject: Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?
Date: Sun, 15 May 2022 08:33:13 -0700
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 by: Ken Blake - Sun, 15 May 2022 15:33 UTC

On Sun, 15 May 2022 06:23:55 -0400, Joel <joelcrump@gmail.com> wrote:

>Bill <nonegiven@att.net> wrote:
>>On 5/13/2022 10:55 PM, rabidR04CH wrote:
>>> On 2022-05-13 10:12 p.m., Bill wrote:
>>>>
>>>>  From this I conclude that $23 for a USB DVD Drive is a good
>>>> investment for a new computer.
>>>
>>> How the heck did you come to that conclusion based on what I said?
>>
>>I will enjoy using MS Office and other apps that I have on DVD, rather
>>then succumbing to the subscription model which appears to be being
>>pushed out next. You may have noticed that DVD's have been "going out of
>>style", and aren't present on many prebuilt computers. "$23" just
>>happens to be the price of the USB DVD drive that is on my Amazon wish
>>list.

To Bill: Why is it on your wish list? $23 isn't a lot of money (at
least not to most people). Why not just buy and install it.

>I deliberately bought a case with no spaces for optical drives,
>leaving my BD-RE in my old computer. It's just not needed for
>anything, anymore.

That's a giant overstatement, as far as I'm concerned. I need mine to
read the many CDs and DVDs I still have, some of which are need to
reinstall a program, should it be necessary.

Granted, I don't use mine often, but I never know when I might need
to.

Also granted that we're not all the same, and there are those (you
apparently, for example) who don't need it. But it's not true that
nobody needs one.

When my new (Oct 2021) computer was built, I made sure it had a DVD
drive.

Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?

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From: rlam...@shaw.ca (Rene Lamontagne)
Newsgroups: alt.comp.os.windows-11,alt.comp.os.windows-10
Subject: Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?
Date: Sun, 15 May 2022 10:52:55 -0500
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 by: Rene Lamontagne - Sun, 15 May 2022 15:52 UTC

On 2022-05-15 10:33 a.m., Ken Blake wrote:
> On Sun, 15 May 2022 06:23:55 -0400, Joel <joelcrump@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Bill <nonegiven@att.net> wrote:
>>> On 5/13/2022 10:55 PM, rabidR04CH wrote:
>>>> On 2022-05-13 10:12 p.m., Bill wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>  From this I conclude that $23 for a USB DVD Drive is a good
>>>>> investment for a new computer.
>>>>
>>>> How the heck did you come to that conclusion based on what I said?
>>>
>>> I will enjoy using MS Office and other apps that I have on DVD, rather
>>> then succumbing to the subscription model which appears to be being
>>> pushed out next. You may have noticed that DVD's have been "going out of
>>> style", and aren't present on many prebuilt computers. "$23" just
>>> happens to be the price of the USB DVD drive that is on my Amazon wish
>>> list.
>
> To Bill: Why is it on your wish list? $23 isn't a lot of money (at
> least not to most people). Why not just buy and install it.
>
>
>> I deliberately bought a case with no spaces for optical drives,
>> leaving my BD-RE in my old computer. It's just not needed for
>> anything, anymore.
>
> That's a giant overstatement, as far as I'm concerned. I need mine to
> read the many CDs and DVDs I still have, some of which are need to
> reinstall a program, should it be necessary.
>
> Granted, I don't use mine often, but I never know when I might need
> to.
>
> Also granted that we're not all the same, and there are those (you
> apparently, for example) who don't need it. But it's not true that
> nobody needs one.
>
> When my new (Oct 2021) computer was built, I made sure it had a DVD
> drive.
>

Likewise , I don't use it often but still have some utilities that I use
and a a few old programs that I access so for $25.00 I will always have
one installed.

Rene

Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?

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From: Ken...@invalid.news.com (Ken Blake)
Newsgroups: alt.comp.os.windows-11,alt.comp.os.windows-10
Subject: Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?
Date: Sun, 15 May 2022 09:32:23 -0700
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 by: Ken Blake - Sun, 15 May 2022 16:32 UTC

On Sun, 15 May 2022 10:52:55 -0500, Rene Lamontagne <rlamont@shaw.ca>
wrote:

>On 2022-05-15 10:33 a.m., Ken Blake wrote:
>> On Sun, 15 May 2022 06:23:55 -0400, Joel <joelcrump@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Bill <nonegiven@att.net> wrote:
>>>> On 5/13/2022 10:55 PM, rabidR04CH wrote:
>>>>> On 2022-05-13 10:12 p.m., Bill wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>  From this I conclude that $23 for a USB DVD Drive is a good
>>>>>> investment for a new computer.
>>>>>
>>>>> How the heck did you come to that conclusion based on what I said?
>>>>
>>>> I will enjoy using MS Office and other apps that I have on DVD, rather
>>>> then succumbing to the subscription model which appears to be being
>>>> pushed out next. You may have noticed that DVD's have been "going out of
>>>> style", and aren't present on many prebuilt computers. "$23" just
>>>> happens to be the price of the USB DVD drive that is on my Amazon wish
>>>> list.
>>
>> To Bill: Why is it on your wish list? $23 isn't a lot of money (at
>> least not to most people). Why not just buy and install it.
>>
>>
>>> I deliberately bought a case with no spaces for optical drives,
>>> leaving my BD-RE in my old computer. It's just not needed for
>>> anything, anymore.
>>
>> That's a giant overstatement, as far as I'm concerned. I need mine to
>> read the many CDs and DVDs I still have, some of which are need to
>> reinstall a program, should it be necessary.
>>
>> Granted, I don't use mine often, but I never know when I might need
>> to.
>>
>> Also granted that we're not all the same, and there are those (you
>> apparently, for example) who don't need it. But it's not true that
>> nobody needs one.
>>
>> When my new (Oct 2021) computer was built, I made sure it had a DVD
>> drive.
>>
>
>Likewise , I don't use it often but still have some utilities that I use
>and a a few old programs that I access so for $25.00 I will always have
>one installed.

Similarly, I used to always have 3.5" and 5.25" diskette drives
installed on the theory that I still had a bunch of old diskettes and
I might need one some day. After several years went by without ever
using either one, I stopped having them, and all my recent computers
haven't had any.

The same will probably be true of DVD/CD drives one of these days, but
as far as I'm concerned, we're not there yet.

Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?

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https://www.novabbs.com/computers/article-flat.php?id=62586&group=alt.comp.os.windows-10#62586

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Subject: Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?
Newsgroups: alt.comp.os.windows-11,alt.comp.os.windows-10
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From: rab...@r04.ch (rabidR04CH)
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 by: rabidR04CH - Sun, 15 May 2022 16:34 UTC

On 2022-05-14 9:05 p.m., Bill wrote:
> On 5/13/2022 10:55 PM, rabidR04CH wrote:
>> On 2022-05-13 10:12 p.m., Bill wrote:
>>> On 5/13/2022 10:08 PM, rabidR04CH wrote:
>>>> On 2022-05-13 7:15 p.m., Ken Blake wrote:
>>>>> On Fri, 13 May 2022 21:17:41 +0100, "J. P. Gilliver (John)"
>>>>> <G6JPG@255soft.uk> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> On Fri, 13 May 2022 at 08:04:07, Ken Blake <Ken@invalid.news.com>
>>>>>> wrote
>>>>>> (my responses usually FOLLOW):
>>>>>> []
>>>>>>> I have no personal favorite. In fact I'm against the idea of Office
>>>>>>> Suites. In my opinion, it's best to choose the program you like best
>>>>>>> in each category, without regard to what suite it's in.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I tend to agree, for such different prog.s; as well as everything
>>>>>> else,
>>>>>> it also encourages people to think "grid" means "spreadsheet", so
>>>>>> when
>>>>>> they want a grid/table in their Word document, they use Excel.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> My favorite word processor is WordPerfect, my favorite spreadsheet
>>>>>>> program is Excel, my favorite e-mail client is Thunderbird.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> The same goes for non-office programs My favorite e-mail client is
>>>>>>> Thunderbird, but my favorite newsreader is Agent. I'm against the
>>>>>>> idea
>>>>>>> of bundling programs of any type together.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Each to his own; I like having the same prog. For news and mail,
>>>>>> as they
>>>>>> have similar requirements (quoted text etc.), and I don't have to
>>>>>> remember which I'm using and how it does things differently from
>>>>>> how the
>>>>>> other one does;
>>>>>
>>>>> Yes, yours is a common point of view. As I said, it's not mine.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>   >and the main disadvantage usually quoted - that of
>>>>>> accidentally sending an email where a post was intended, or vice
>>>>>> versa -
>>>>>> I don't tend to do (well under one a year; I think less than 5
>>>>>> times in
>>>>>> about 30 years, but can't remember for sure). Conversely, if I
>>>>>> _want_ to
>>>>>> send a private email reply to a newsgroup poster, it's easy.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> But I wouldn't try to force my view on anyone; above is/are just my
>>>>>> explanation of why _I_ like the way I have.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> (As to the question of what's improved in recent Office suites and
>>>>>> someone's reply that comparing 12 year old to current isn't very
>>>>>> valid,
>>>>>> I disagree: I use by default Word 2003, and have seen very little
>>>>>> reason
>>>>>> to change [I have the converters].
>>>>>
>>>>> For word processor in particular, the opportunity for real
>>>>> improvements ran out years ago. There very little difference between
>>>>> versions, for WordPerfect as well as for Word.
>>>>
>>>> I don't disagree. Whatever improvements the software companies make
>>>> now will most likely have more to do with collaboration and
>>>> conferencing than with things a solo worker would actually need.
>>>>
>>>
>>>  From this I conclude that $23 for a USB DVD Drive is a good
>>> investment for a new computer.
>>
>> How the heck did you come to that conclusion based on what I said?
>>
>
> I will enjoy using MS Office and other apps that I have on DVD, rather
> then succumbing to the subscription model which appears to be being
> pushed out next. You may have noticed that DVD's have been "going out of
> style", and aren't present on many prebuilt computers.  "$23" just
> happens to be the price of the USB DVD drive that is on my Amazon wish
> list.

For me, having a license directly attacked to my Microsoft account is
convenient. When it's time to reinstall, not only does it provide me a
link to the product but gives the license key as well. For that as well
as the knowledge that my product gets updates and security fixes, I'm
willing to shell out $50.

--
rabidR04CH
Encrypt. Avoid social media. Stay sane.
Zephyrus G14 GA401QM on Windows 11
https://retalk.com/invite/rabidR04CH

Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?

<CsagK.11130$pqKf.9208@fx12.iad>

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From: nonegi...@att.net (Bill)
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 by: Bill - Sun, 15 May 2022 17:08 UTC

On 5/15/2022 11:33 AM, Ken Blake wrote:
> On Sun, 15 May 2022 06:23:55 -0400, Joel <joelcrump@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Bill <nonegiven@att.net> wrote:
>>> On 5/13/2022 10:55 PM, rabidR04CH wrote:
>>>> On 2022-05-13 10:12 p.m., Bill wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>  From this I conclude that $23 for a USB DVD Drive is a good
>>>>> investment for a new computer.
>>>>
>>>> How the heck did you come to that conclusion based on what I said?
>>>
>>> I will enjoy using MS Office and other apps that I have on DVD, rather
>>> then succumbing to the subscription model which appears to be being
>>> pushed out next. You may have noticed that DVD's have been "going out of
>>> style", and aren't present on many prebuilt computers. "$23" just
>>> happens to be the price of the USB DVD drive that is on my Amazon wish
>>> list.
>
> To Bill: Why is it on your wish list? $23 isn't a lot of money (at
> least not to most people). Why not just buy and install it.

Because I don't have the rest of the computer yet! I was thinking of my
"next" one. My current computer has a built in DVD drive.

Re: Two GPUs, one way more power efficient? How?

<MxagK.11131$pqKf.6172@fx12.iad>

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https://www.novabbs.com/computers/article-flat.php?id=62588&group=alt.comp.os.windows-10#62588

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From: nonegi...@att.net (Bill)
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 by: Bill - Sun, 15 May 2022 17:14 UTC

On 5/15/2022 6:30 AM, Joel wrote:
> "Commander Kinsey" <CK1@nospam.com> wrote:
>
>>> Your motherboard is very similar to mine, although mine has WiFi 6
>>> built in, about the only difference I could tell (mine is a Gigabyte
>>> Aorus model). Your CPU is a generation newer, though, and mine is an
>>> i5, and a modest clock speed. And your SSD is double the size of
>>> mine, similar specs.
>>
>> Wifi is for phones.
>
>
> I have just as stable a connection over WiFi as I would with a wire.

"Stable" maybe, depending on what you mean by that, but arguably not as
"secure".

> And I can't run a wire here, anyway. WiFi is what I've used for many
> years, going back to before my mom and I moved from the old
> neighborhood.
>

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