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computers / alt.comp.os.windows-10 / Re: thunderbird hanging the cpu

SubjectAuthor
* thunderbird hanging the cpumike
+* Re: thunderbird hanging the cpuMighty✅ Wannabe✅
|`* Re: thunderbird hanging the cpumike
| +- Re: thunderbird hanging the cpuMighty✅ Wannabe✅
| `* Re: thunderbird hanging the cpuPaul
|  `* Re: thunderbird hanging the cpumike
|   `* Re: thunderbird hanging the cpuPaul
|    `- Re: thunderbird hanging the cpuCarlos E.R.
+* Re: thunderbird hanging the cpumechanic
|`* Re: thunderbird hanging the cpuKen Blake
| `- Re: thunderbird hanging the cpuVanguardLH
+* Re: thunderbird hanging the cpuVanguardLH
|`* Re: thunderbird hanging the cpumike
| +- Re: thunderbird hanging the cpuCarlos E.R.
| +* Re: thunderbird hanging the cpuVanguardLH
| |`* Re: thunderbird hanging the cpuCarlos E.R.
| | `- Re: thunderbird hanging the cpuVanguardLH
| +* Re: thunderbird hanging the cpuVanguardLH
| |+- Re: thunderbird hanging the cpuCarlos E.R.
| |+- Re: thunderbird hanging the cpuAndy Burns
| |`* Re: thunderbird hanging the cpumike
| | `* Re: thunderbird hanging the cpuVanguardLH
| |  +* Re: thunderbird hanging the cpuAndy Burns
| |  |+- Re: thunderbird hanging the cpumike
| |  |`* Re: thunderbird hanging the cpuVanguardLH
| |  | `* Re: thunderbird hanging the cpuAndy Burns
| |  |  `* Re: thunderbird hanging the cpuVanguardLH
| |  |   `* Re: thunderbird hanging the cpuAndy Burns
| |  |    `- Re: thunderbird hanging the cpuVanguardLH
| |  `* Re: thunderbird hanging the cpumike
| |   +* Re: thunderbird hanging the cpusticks
| |   |`- Re: thunderbird hanging the cpuVanguardLH
| |   +- Re: thunderbird hanging the cpuVanguardLH
| |   `- Re: thunderbird hanging the cpuPaul
| +- Re: thunderbird hanging the cpuAndy Burns
| `- Re: thunderbird hanging the cpuDanS
`- Re: thunderbird hanging the cpuMr. Man-wai Chang

Pages:12
Re: thunderbird hanging the cpu

<ts3131$mdum$1@solani.org>

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https://www.novabbs.com/computers/article-flat.php?id=68838&group=alt.comp.os.windows-10#68838

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Path: i2pn2.org!i2pn.org!weretis.net!feeder8.news.weretis.net!reader5.news.weretis.net!news.solani.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail
From: thi...@address.is.invalid (mike)
Newsgroups: alt.comp.software.thunderbird,alt.comp.os.windows-10
Subject: Re: thunderbird hanging the cpu
Date: Thu, 9 Feb 2023 20:18:15 +0530
Message-ID: <ts3131$mdum$1@solani.org>
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 by: mike - Thu, 9 Feb 2023 14:48 UTC

On 09-02-2023 16:54 Andy Burns <usenet@andyburns.uk> wrote:

> VanguardLH wrote:
>
>> Javascript is allowed to run when
>> you choose to render HTML-formatted e-mails
>
> You keep saying that without any evidence, send yourself an html email
> containing
>
> <script>alert("BOO!");</script>
>
> do you get a javascript popup message when reading it?

I sent myself an email with this in the message body.
<script>alert("BOO!");</script>

Nothing happened (other than getting the exact message that I had sent).
Does this mean javascript isn't working in my Thunderbird MUA?

If so good.
I wouldn't have wanted it to work.

What's the cleanest way to re-install Thunderbird and not lose data
but still use a new profile? Is portable TB the way to go?

Re: thunderbird hanging the cpu

<ts32pq$mv0b$1@dont-email.me>

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From: wolverin...@charter.net (sticks)
Newsgroups: alt.comp.software.thunderbird,alt.comp.os.windows-10
Subject: Re: thunderbird hanging the cpu
Date: Thu, 9 Feb 2023 09:17:15 -0600
Organization: A noiseless patient Spider
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In-Reply-To: <ts3018$mdaa$1@solani.org>
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 by: sticks - Thu, 9 Feb 2023 15:17 UTC

On 2/9/2023 8:30 AM, mike wrote:
> On 09-02-2023 01:05 VanguardLH <V@nguard.LH> wrote:
>
>>> You sure jump to conclusions without any reason to be so suspicious.
>>
>> The title falls into the realm of spam and phish e-mails.  Obviously I
>> could not see the content of the e-mail assuming you weren't viewing a
>> web page inside of Thunderbird.  My telescope still cannot bend around
>> the curvature of the Earth.
>
> Which is exactly _why_ you shouldn't jump to wild conclusions.
> It's what racists do. > It's also how marketing works.
> They hint at something and then let you built your own spurious story.

I don't know why Vanguard is helping you after the last two ridiculous
posts of yours? YOU are the one who has jumped to "wild conclusions"
along with a little name calling. He should have told you to fuck off
after this post.

> When solving technical problems, it doesn't help to jump to wild
> conclusions but you're certainly welcome to ask if it was a nefarious
> email.

Again, here is where YOU jump to conclusions. His reaction was to check
for some of the typical things that cause hanging in e-mail. Then you
post a mile long page of all the shit you talked about that nobody gives
a flying fuck on, and call him names. That was sure helpful on your part.

> It wasn't.
>
>>> All that is what you can read Thunderbird conspiracies into, but I
>>> wouldn't
>>> as I'm sure you had the same conversations with your buddies using TB
>>> too.

Yeah, you need some help. Try alt.kooks

Re: thunderbird hanging the cpu

<ts32sq$n1mk$3@toylet.eternal-september.org>

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From: toylet.t...@gmail.com (Mr. Man-wai Chang)
Newsgroups: alt.comp.software.thunderbird,alt.comp.os.windows-10
Subject: Re: thunderbird hanging the cpu
Date: Thu, 9 Feb 2023 23:18:45 +0800
Organization: A noiseless patient Spider
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In-Reply-To: <trvbkp$jk1n$1@solani.org>
 by: Mr. Man-wai Chang - Thu, 9 Feb 2023 15:18 UTC

On 8/2/2023 1:23 pm, mike wrote:
> Lately my machine has been crunching away for reasons previously unknown.
>
> I asked on the Windows newsgroup and they suggested running Memory Hogs.
> https://www.ghacks.net/2017/01/23/memory-hogs/
> http://michaels-tech-notes.info/software-database/
> https://www.michaels-tech-notes.info/app/download/3888974/MemoryHogs.exe
>
> It turns out, at least so far, that Thunderbird is likely what's hanging.
> https://i.postimg.cc/sg6DpCc9/hung.jpg
>
> The problem now is I don't know how to debug WHY Thunderbird is hanging.
> What would you do next if you found out it was Thunderbird hanging the CPU?

I will try a new, clean Thunderbird profile. Of course, you back up the
current profile first, and keep the backup safe.

Are you still using the same Thunderbird profile while updating your
Thunderbird many times?

Re: thunderbird hanging the cpu

<12ummqirvwk7y.dlg@v.nguard.lh>

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From: V...@nguard.LH (VanguardLH)
Newsgroups: alt.comp.software.thunderbird,alt.comp.os.windows-10
Subject: Re: thunderbird hanging the cpu
Date: Thu, 9 Feb 2023 10:10:00 -0600
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 by: VanguardLH - Thu, 9 Feb 2023 16:10 UTC

Andy Burns <usenet@andyburns.uk> wrote:

> VanguardLH wrote:
>
>> Javascript is allowed to run when
>> you choose to render HTML-formatted e-mails
>
> You keep saying that without any evidence, send yourself an html email
> containing
>
> <script>alert("BOO!");</script>
>
> do you get a javascript popup message when reading it?

I do not keep saying that. I warned that allowing Javascript to run
when viewing e-mails is a hazard, and *if* Tbird let you disable that
then do so, especially for testing the hang problem. Someone else
claimed Tbird never runs Javascript in e-mails, so that issue might've
gotten addressed.

The part you snipped in quoting my post was:

Javascript is allowed to run when you choose to render HTML-formatted
e-mails in a web tab; ...
^^^^^^^^^^^^

When you choose to have Tbird render the e-mail as a web page, it's
showing it using Firefox code (aka in a web browser). That was left as
an option in case you cannot read enough of an e-mail, and need to
render it as a web page. Too many users dump a web page into e-mails
thinking e-mail clients should behave as web browsers.

Are you claiming when you offload an e-mail message into a web browser
that the web browser doesn't allow Javascript? Does a web tab in Tbird
use different settings than the default web browser to ensure Javascript
is not allowed in a web tab in Tbird?

Sorry, I gave up on Tbird around 3+ years years after several trials the
last of which lasted 6 months. So, I defer ultimate analysis to actual
Tbird users. As I recall, you could load e-mails in a web tab inside of
Tbird; see:

https://www.simplehelp.net/2021/03/14/how-to-view-web-pages-from-directly-within-thunderbird/

I also recall you could pass the e-mail to an external web browser to
get rendered there. So, does a web tab in Tbird disable Javascript?
Seems contrary to that purpose. I cannot see Tbird passing an e-mail to
an external web browser will control the configuration of that external
web browser to disable its Javascript support.

Is a web tab inside of Tbird treated as a separate process showing up in
Task Manager as a firefox.exe process? Or is it a thread of Tbird?

Are web tabs inside of Tbird only available via add-ons? If so, the OP
said he has no add-ons in Tbird. That leaves viewing the e-mail in an
external web browser. Tbird doesn't allow that? Does the user have to
save the HTML-formatted e-mail into a file, and then open the file using
a web browser?

To recap:
- Can Tbird, with an add-on, open an e-mail in a web tab inside of
Tbird?
- Can Tbird, with an add-on, send an e-mail to an external web browser?
- Didn't/Doesn't Tbird have the "View -> Message Body As -> (Original
HTML|Simple HTML|plaintext)" view option? If so, what's the point of
"Original HTML" mode if not rendered like a web page? (*)

(*) https://www.ghacks.net/2010/08/16/switch-between-html-and-plain-text-emails-in-thunderbird/
"Original HTML displays emails as HTML messages. This may include that
images do get downloaded from remote servers (something that trackers
often do) and that JavaScript may be executed."

With trialing and using many different e-mail clients, I could be
conflating features between them.

Re: thunderbird hanging the cpu

<1ixi0vxjrhpz$.dlg@v.nguard.lh>

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From: V...@nguard.LH (VanguardLH)
Newsgroups: alt.comp.software.thunderbird,alt.comp.os.windows-10
Subject: Re: thunderbird hanging the cpu
Date: Thu, 9 Feb 2023 10:16:22 -0600
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 by: VanguardLH - Thu, 9 Feb 2023 16:16 UTC

mike <this@address.is.invalid> wrote:

> VanguardLH <V@nguard.LH> wrote:
>
>>> You sure jump to conclusions without any reason to be so suspicious.
>>
>> The title falls into the realm of spam and phish e-mails. Obviously I
>> could not see the content of the e-mail assuming you weren't viewing a
>> web page inside of Thunderbird. My telescope still cannot bend around
>> the curvature of the Earth.
>
> Which is exactly _why_ you shouldn't jump to wild conclusions.
> It's what racists do.

It was not a wild conclusion. I've been a spam reporter for decades,
and the title is typical of something untoward. I saw the title, and
then questioned if you have Javascript enabled for viewing messages. It
was an intro to asking if Javascript was involved. Learn to focus!

Now that you inferred me a racist, I'll end my partitication in your
thread. Once "nazi" is mentioned, the thread is through, and accusation
of "racist" is no different.

Enjoy trying to resolve the problem yourself. How has that been going
for you, so far, huh?

Bye.

Re: thunderbird hanging the cpu

<okuf1ufokfaw$.dlg@v.nguard.lh>

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From: V...@nguard.LH (VanguardLH)
Newsgroups: alt.comp.software.thunderbird,alt.comp.os.windows-10
Subject: Re: thunderbird hanging the cpu
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 by: VanguardLH - Thu, 9 Feb 2023 16:22 UTC

sticks <wolverine01@charter.net> wrote:

> On 2/9/2023 8:30 AM, mike wrote:
>> On 09-02-2023 01:05 VanguardLH <V@nguard.LH> wrote:
>>
>>>> You sure jump to conclusions without any reason to be so suspicious.
>>>
>>> The title falls into the realm of spam and phish e-mails.  Obviously I
>>> could not see the content of the e-mail assuming you weren't viewing a
>>> web page inside of Thunderbird.  My telescope still cannot bend around
>>> the curvature of the Earth.
>>
>> Which is exactly _why_ you shouldn't jump to wild conclusions.
>> It's what racists do. > It's also how marketing works.
>> They hint at something and then let you built your own spurious story.
>
> I don't know why Vanguard is helping you after the last two ridiculous
> posts of yours? YOU are the one who has jumped to "wild conclusions"
> along with a little name calling. He should have told you to fuck off
> after this post.
>
>> When solving technical problems, it doesn't help to jump to wild
>> conclusions but you're certainly welcome to ask if it was a nefarious
>> email.
>
> Again, here is where YOU jump to conclusions. His reaction was to check
> for some of the typical things that cause hanging in e-mail. Then you
> post a mile long page of all the shit you talked about that nobody gives
> a flying fuck on, and call him names. That was sure helpful on your part.
>
>> It wasn't.
>>
>>>> All that is what you can read Thunderbird conspiracies into, but I
>>>> wouldn't
>>>> as I'm sure you had the same conversations with your buddies using TB
>>>> too.
>
> Yeah, you need some help. Try alt.kooks

Reminds of the old Connors poster (forget his first name): If you agreed
with him, you were his Godsent ally, but if you questioned anything (for
elucidation on his proclamations) or disagreed with him, you were the
spawn of Satan.

I mention the message of questionable titling, and immediately go into
how the problem could be with Javascript. So, what does he focus on?
An intro sentence, and ignores the rest.

Yep, I already told him I'm not participating in his thread any further.
He asks for help, and then becomes petulant. He doesn't deserve help.

Re: thunderbird hanging the cpu

<k4knsfF4uaiU1@mid.individual.net>

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From: use...@andyburns.uk (Andy Burns)
Newsgroups: alt.comp.software.thunderbird,alt.comp.os.windows-10
Subject: Re: thunderbird hanging the cpu
Date: Thu, 9 Feb 2023 17:12:47 +0000
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In-Reply-To: <12ummqirvwk7y.dlg@v.nguard.lh>
 by: Andy Burns - Thu, 9 Feb 2023 17:12 UTC

VanguardLH wrote:

> I gave up on Tbird around 3+ years years after several trials the
> last of which lasted 6 months. So, I defer ultimate analysis to actual
> Tbird users. As I recall, you could load e-mails in a web tab inside of
> Tbird;

About the only pages I ever see TB load in a web tab, are the TB release
notes, not emails, if someone installs an add-on to do it, that's their
look-out

Re: thunderbird hanging the cpu

<l2rptorttrgq.dlg@v.nguard.lh>

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From: V...@nguard.LH (VanguardLH)
Newsgroups: alt.comp.software.thunderbird,alt.comp.os.windows-10
Subject: Re: thunderbird hanging the cpu
Date: Thu, 9 Feb 2023 12:54:21 -0600
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 by: VanguardLH - Thu, 9 Feb 2023 18:54 UTC

Andy Burns <usenet@andyburns.uk> wrote:

> VanguardLH wrote:
>
>> I gave up on Tbird around 3+ years years after several trials the
>> last of which lasted 6 months. So, I defer ultimate analysis to actual
>> Tbird users. As I recall, you could load e-mails in a web tab inside of
>> Tbird;
>
> About the only pages I ever see TB load in a web tab, are the TB release
> notes, not emails, if someone installs an add-on to do it, that's their
> look-out

And the "View -> Message Body As -> Original HTML" menu option is no
longer present?

Re: thunderbird hanging the cpu

<k4kv1vF61dnU1@mid.individual.net>

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From: use...@andyburns.uk (Andy Burns)
Newsgroups: alt.comp.software.thunderbird,alt.comp.os.windows-10
Subject: Re: thunderbird hanging the cpu
Date: Thu, 9 Feb 2023 19:15:10 +0000
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In-Reply-To: <l2rptorttrgq.dlg@v.nguard.lh>
 by: Andy Burns - Thu, 9 Feb 2023 19:15 UTC

VanguardLH wrote:

> Andy Burns wrote:
>
>> About the only pages I ever see TB load in a web tab, are the TB release
>> notes
>
> And the "View -> Message Body As -> Original HTML" menu option is no
> longer present?

Of course it is, but it only renders a html email in the message pane
area, not in a web tab, and it doesn't run any javascript.

Re: thunderbird hanging the cpu

<1d3y3go049z51$.dlg@v.nguard.lh>

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From: V...@nguard.LH (VanguardLH)
Newsgroups: alt.comp.software.thunderbird,alt.comp.os.windows-10
Subject: Re: thunderbird hanging the cpu
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 by: VanguardLH - Thu, 9 Feb 2023 20:07 UTC

Andy Burns <usenet@andyburns.uk> wrote:

> VanguardLH wrote:
>
>> Andy Burns wrote:
>>
>>> About the only pages I ever see TB load in a web tab, are the TB release
>>> notes
>>
>> And the "View -> Message Body As -> Original HTML" menu option is no
>> longer present?
>
> Of course it is, but it only renders a html email in the message pane
> area, not in a web tab, and it doesn't run any javascript.

If you say so, I'll believe you. Elsewhere, those reviewing Tbird noted
that using Original HTML view did run Javascript. Thanks for another
data point.

Re: thunderbird hanging the cpu

<XnsAFA94BA0B283Cthisnthatroadrunnern@69.80.102.23>

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Newsgroups: alt.comp.software.thunderbird,alt.comp.os.windows-10
Subject: Re: thunderbird hanging the cpu
From: t.h.i.s....@r.o.a.d.r.u.n.n.e.r.c.o.m (DanS)
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 by: DanS - Sun, 12 Feb 2023 12:26 UTC

mike <this@address.is.invalid> wrote in
news:ts0s4c$lcbj$1@solani.org:

> As a matter of principle, I don't ever use addons or
> plugins in anything. Not Firefox. Not Thunderbird. Not
> Chrome. Nothing.

I couldn't fathom using a browser without ad-blocking capabilites, be it intrinsically like
Opera does, or through a plug-in like AdBlockPlus. You can use just the HOSTS file, but
the plugin/extension seems to be less disruptive to the overall browsing experience, to
me.

That, and there's an extension for Chrome/Chromium/Edge/etc called TabsToTheFront
which, when middle-clicking a link to open in a new tab, that new tab will be brought to the
foreground.(It's bizarre that bringing that new tab to the foreground isn't just a program
option and needs an "Add-on").

Other than that though...I don't think there are any others I use.

Re: thunderbird hanging the cpu

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From: nos...@needed.invalid (Paul)
Newsgroups: alt.comp.software.thunderbird,alt.comp.os.windows-10
Subject: Re: thunderbird hanging the cpu
Date: Mon, 27 Feb 2023 06:12:51 -0500
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 by: Paul - Mon, 27 Feb 2023 11:12 UTC

On 2/9/2023 9:30 AM, mike wrote:

> I'm only using TB for email on Windows, using IMAP only.
> On Android I use the TB K9 mail user agent.
> I never use a web browser to get email on any platform.
>
> I think what I'm going to do is delete TB and reinstall it.
> What's holding me up is I don't want to lose the email.
>
> I think I'll follow the advice to install the portable TB instead.
> That advice said the mail folders would be saved in that portable folder.
>
> My biggest worry about uninstalling & re-installing TB is losing my mail.
> But since it's all on IMAP, I probably won't lose a thing.
>
> Still. I worry.

I did some more work on this.

The plan was to load 15GB of mails into my mail server.

Well, I could use Thunderbird to "send" the messages,
to get the mails into the server. That was the plan.

The web page said one of the limits of Thunderbird, was
around 4GB per box. I carefully prepared some slightly
smaller "Unsent Messages" boxes manually (with scripts
and word-salad message bodies), and...

32-bit Thunderbird is running out of RAM.
The hang happens when around 2200MB of the Unsent Messages
box is parsed.

Switching to the 64-bit version of Thunderbird, may help.
You can move the profile (keep the old profile) and load
that into 64-bit, without you having to change anything.

I will have to build another VM to test out the 64-bit
version and see if things go any better.

But at least, so far, I see what the problem is.
It runs out of RAM, then it's too stupid to put up
a dialog and say "Hey! I've run out of RAM".

Windows File Explorer has similar behavior. If you use
pathologically large folders, File Explorer zooms up
to 15GB of memory allocation, then the wheel spins and
the memory consumption stops. And it's too stupid to
recover. The wheel could spin forever at that point.
And that is obviously not a piece of 32 bit software,
but something prevents it from using all the RAM that
is available to it.

"Spinning your wheel" and not telling the user what
is going on, that's a poor design. Because then we're
assuming plugins, extensions, Adobe Flash, GPU problems,
javascript, and so on.

Paul

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