For an old workstation running under WIN 8.1 we have a MS Wireless Comfort
Keyboard 2000.
This keyboard has built-in buttons for fast app access, f.e. one button
starting the standard Windows mail program.

Times ago the mail program on this PC was changed from Microsoft Mail to
Thunderbird, and obviously the standard mail program was changed to
Thunderbird by its setup program because the keyboatd now accessed
Thunderbird just as expected. This worked for years for a couple of mail
addresses.

Due to a problem with the actual Thunderbird update where the installation
run into the problem that the mail password was no longer stored and so mail
access to the mailboxes managed by this PC was no longer possible.

Since I hope to be able to repair this problem and reuse some years old
mails I installed for the meantime Thunderbird Portable on the same system
which works fine except that it does not, of course, register itself as
standard mail program, and so a keyboard hit still runs the old damaged
version instead of the new Thunderbird Portable.

But I want to change the called mail program from the old version into
Thunderbird Portable.

So I have the choice of two variants both running into problems:

First, changing the standard mail program in Windows:
Internet search for standard mail program registration didn't show a
registry key which defines the standard mail program - there are a lot of
keys referring to "mailto" entries, but I found none which seems to change
the key read out by the keyboard driver.
-> If anyone knows where I can replace the old mailprog exe name by a newer
one I would be glad to try out.

Second, editing the keyboard data:
On the orther hand Microsoft seems to have a program to edit the keyboard
functions, the name was something like "Microsoft Mouse and Keyboard", the
packed download file named MouseKeyboardCenter_64bit_DEU_14.41.exe (for
German language). This software is still available from Microsoft but
calling it does only expand the file, start the installation and ends up in
a message box that it couldn't can install the software probably due to
missing system requirements. Whatever these requirements might be. It looks
like it is running for WIN 10 or WIN 11 only and no longer for WIN 8.1.
-> if anyone knows from where I can load an older version of this file
suitable for WIN 8.1 I would be glad to test it

A third way (which is a Thunderbird question rather than a Windows one)
could be to pass the old mail data folders to the newer portable
application, but I am not sure if this would work.
-> if anyone has an idea how to pass old Thunderbird data to Thunderbird
Portable (ok, no Windows problem, I know) then I would be happy to test it

On 9/21/2023 11:23 AM, Wendelin Uez wrote:
> For an old workstation running under WIN 8.1 we have a MS Wireless Comfort Keyboard 2000.
> This keyboard has built-in buttons for fast app access, f.e. one button starting the standard Windows mail program.
>
> Times ago the mail program on this PC was changed from Microsoft Mail to Thunderbird, and obviously the standard mail program was changed to Thunderbird by its setup program because the keyboatd now accessed Thunderbird just as expected. This worked for years for a couple of mail addresses.
>
> Due to a problem with the actual Thunderbird update where the installation run into the problem that the mail password was no longer stored and so mail access to the mailboxes managed by this PC was no longer possible.
>
> Since I hope to be able to repair this problem and reuse some years old mails I installed for the meantime Thunderbird Portable on the same system which works fine except that it does not, of course, register itself as standard mail program, and so a keyboard hit still runs the old damaged version instead of the new Thunderbird Portable.
>
> But I want to change the called mail program from the old version into Thunderbird Portable.
>
> So I have the choice of two variants both running into problems:
>
> First, changing the standard mail program in Windows:
> Internet search for standard mail program registration didn't show a registry key which defines the standard mail program - there are a lot of keys referring to "mailto" entries, but I found none which seems to change the key read out by the keyboard driver.
> -> If anyone knows where I can replace the old mailprog exe name by a newer one I would be glad to try out.
>
> Second, editing the keyboard data:
> On the orther hand Microsoft seems to have a program to edit the keyboard functions, the name was something like "Microsoft Mouse and Keyboard", the packed download file named MouseKeyboardCenter_64bit_DEU_14.41.exe (for German language). This software is still available from Microsoft but calling it does only expand the file, start the installation and ends up in a message box that it couldn't can install the software probably due to missing system requirements. Whatever these requirements might be. It looks like it is running for WIN 10 or WIN 11 only and no longer for WIN 8.1.
> -> if anyone knows from where I can load an older version of this file suitable for WIN 8.1 I would be glad to test it
>
>
> A third way (which is a Thunderbird question rather than a Windows one) could be to pass the old mail data folders to the newer portable application, but I am not sure if this would work.
> -> if anyone has an idea how to pass old Thunderbird data to Thunderbird Portable (ok, no Windows problem, I know) then I would be happy to test it
>

1) A Portable application is not integrated into the Install Systems.
win32 and Metro Apps have separate tracking. A Portable is a third, untracked type.

2) Default Mail is protected by crypto. Once a few years pass, we don't know
whether these hacks work or not. The reason the developer does not "reveal all mechanisms",
is he could be charged under DMCA (the same chill technique that prevents reverse engineering
or analysis of the new Skype protocol).

The following blurb is copied from another post.

***********************************************
http://kolbi.cz/blog/2017/10/25/setuserfta-userchoice-hash-defeated-set-file-type-associations-per-user/

"Download

here you can download SetUserFTA v1.7.1

http://kolbi.cz/SetUserFTA.zip

SetUserFTA.zip:d551295c779bdb3750ddba8e781c21a3dd42a55578f818e9c789b2ba1b4dcf47
SetUserFTA.exe:791dc39f7bd059226364bb05cf5f8e1dd7ccfdaa33a1574f9dc821b2620991c2

SetUserFTA.exe .pdf AcroExch.Document.DC

this will associate .pdf file with Acrobat Reader for the current user.
"

Another example, SetDefaultBrowser (I haven't looked at this at all).

http://kolbi.cz/blog/2017/11/10/setdefaultbrowser-set-the-default-browser-per-user-on-windows-10-and-server-2016-build-1607/

**************************************************

Some of the things, you might edit the Registry to get what you want.
If you could override the Default behavior (using command line and
pointing the program at the Portable folder contents), then the tools within
Windows 10 could finish the job.

It would take at least an afternoon of careful experiments to make progress.

Maybe there is a menu item, to include arbitrary executables for the job,
but somehow I doubt it.

This answer is for Windows 10. The other OSes work differently,
and may be easier to adjust. They all have similar objectives,
but the implementation can be quite different.

Paul

Wendelin Uez <wuez@online.de> wrote:

> For an old workstation running under WIN 8.1 we have a MS Wireless Comfort
> Keyboard 2000.
> This keyboard has built-in buttons for fast app access, f.e. one button
> starting the standard Windows mail program.
>
> Times ago the mail program on this PC was changed from Microsoft Mail to
> Thunderbird, and obviously the standard mail program was changed to
> Thunderbird by its setup program because the keyboatd now accessed
> Thunderbird just as expected. This worked for years for a couple of mail
> addresses.
>
> Due to a problem with the actual Thunderbird update where the installation
> run into the problem that the mail password was no longer stored and so mail
> access to the mailboxes managed by this PC was no longer possible.
>
> Since I hope to be able to repair this problem and reuse some years old
> mails I installed for the meantime Thunderbird Portable on the same system
> which works fine except that it does not, of course, register itself as
> standard mail program, and so a keyboard hit still runs the old damaged
> version instead of the new Thunderbird Portable.
>
> But I want to change the called mail program from the old version into
> Thunderbird Portable.
>
> So I have the choice of two variants both running into problems:
>
> First, changing the standard mail program in Windows:
> Internet search for standard mail program registration didn't show a
> registry key which defines the standard mail program - there are a lot of
> keys referring to "mailto" entries, but I found none which seems to change
> the key read out by the keyboard driver.
> -> If anyone knows where I can replace the old mailprog exe name by a newer
> one I would be glad to try out.
>
> Second, editing the keyboard data:
> On the orther hand Microsoft seems to have a program to edit the keyboard
> functions, the name was something like "Microsoft Mouse and Keyboard", the
> packed download file named MouseKeyboardCenter_64bit_DEU_14.41.exe (for
> German language). This software is still available from Microsoft but
> calling it does only expand the file, start the installation and ends up in
> a message box that it couldn't can install the software probably due to
> missing system requirements. Whatever these requirements might be. It looks
> like it is running for WIN 10 or WIN 11 only and no longer for WIN 8.1.
> -> if anyone knows from where I can load an older version of this file
> suitable for WIN 8.1 I would be glad to test it
>
> A third way (which is a Thunderbird question rather than a Windows one)
> could be to pass the old mail data folders to the newer portable
> application, but I am not sure if this would work.
> -> if anyone has an idea how to pass old Thunderbird data to Thunderbird
> Portable (ok, no Windows problem, I know) then I would be happy to test it

Instead of trying to get the original keyboard software to work, or even
install, perhaps you should look at 3rd-party macro software, like
AutoHotkeys or AutoIt. You can assign functions or scripts to key
combos. Also lets you assign macros to mouse combos.

https://www.autohotkey.com/
https://www.autoitscript.com/

The Thunderbird newsgroup is over at ---.
..---------------------------------------'
'---> alt.comp.software.thunderbird

In message <1oi9bh41mjkir.dlg@v.nguard.lh> at Thu, 21 Sep 2023 16:50:53,
VanguardLH <V@nguard.LH> writes
>Wendelin Uez <wuez@online.de> wrote:
>
>> For an old workstation running under WIN 8.1 we have a MS Wireless Comfort
>> Keyboard 2000.
>> This keyboard has built-in buttons for fast app access, f.e. one button
>> starting the standard Windows mail program.
[]
>> Second, editing the keyboard data:
>> On the orther hand Microsoft seems to have a program to edit the keyboard
>> functions, the name was something like "Microsoft Mouse and Keyboard", the
[]
>Instead of trying to get the original keyboard software to work, or even
>install, perhaps you should look at 3rd-party macro software, like
>AutoHotkeys or AutoIt. You can assign functions or scripts to key
>combos. Also lets you assign macros to mouse combos.

Do those 3rd-party utilities get the special codes (?) generated by the
non-standard buttons, or are you just suggesting the OP ignores the
non-standard buttons and uses combinations of standard keys (in which
case he could use any keyboard)?
>
>https://www.autohotkey.com/
>https://www.autoitscript.com/
[]
--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/<1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)Ar@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf

Only dirty people need wash

"J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> wrote:

> In message <1oi9bh41mjkir.dlg@v.nguard.lh> at Thu, 21 Sep 2023 16:50:53,
> VanguardLH <V@nguard.LH> writes
>>Wendelin Uez <wuez@online.de> wrote:
>>
>>> For an old workstation running under WIN 8.1 we have a MS Wireless Comfort
>>> Keyboard 2000.
>>> This keyboard has built-in buttons for fast app access, f.e. one button
>>> starting the standard Windows mail program.
> []
>>> Second, editing the keyboard data:
>>> On the orther hand Microsoft seems to have a program to edit the keyboard
>>> functions, the name was something like "Microsoft Mouse and Keyboard", the
> []
>>Instead of trying to get the original keyboard software to work, or even
>>install, perhaps you should look at 3rd-party macro software, like
>>AutoHotkeys or AutoIt. You can assign functions or scripts to key
>>combos. Also lets you assign macros to mouse combos.
>
> Do those 3rd-party utilities get the special codes (?) generated by the
> non-standard buttons, or are you just suggesting the OP ignores the
> non-standard buttons and uses combinations of standard keys (in which
> case he could use any keyboard)?
>>
>>https://www.autohotkey.com/
>>https://www.autoitscript.com/
> []

There is no direct hardware link from keyboard to its mfr provided macro
software. The keyboard still has to send scan codes for its own
software to recognize when the keys got hit. The scancode is the event
telling software, even the OS, that a key got pressed, and which key got
pressed.

Some scan codes are pre-defined in the Windows registry. That's why
with programmable keyboards you don't need software for mail, web
browser, volume up/down/mute, play forward/reverse/pause.

I'd have to go look again, but I've used tools that return what scancode
was sent when making (pressing) and breaking (releasing) a key.
SharpKeys was one of them while letting you remap the keys (just simple
mapping, not assigning macros to keys), but I think it just used the
make scancodes. Keytweak was another one.

You can use Nirsoft's KeyboardStateview to see the key codes. I'd
disable the option to hide keypresses that occured in the last few
seconds, because you might miss what key you hit, and then what keys you
had to hit to get back to Nirsoft's window. You could test if the
scancode was not detected.

I don't have any keyboard macro or key mapping software installed. It's
just the media keyboard's hardware sending scan codes. For my media
keyboard, I have to use the Fn combo key with the F-keys (whose
alternate function are the media codes), which are:

Fn+F1 = web browser
Fn+F2 = mail
Fn+F3 = fast reverse
Fn+F4 = fast forward
Fn+F5 = play/pause
Fn+F6 = mute on/off
Fn+F7 = volume down
Fn+F8 = volume up

Those are some of the standard scan code mappings. For other mappings,
you catch the scan code for the key event to decide what to do. The
keyboard isn't hardwired into the OS.

The OP wants to change the mail mapping. On a media keyboard, the Mail
key just sends the standard scan code for 'mail'. The OP can use
AutoHotkey, AutoIt, or a simple key remapper (e.g., SharpKeys
github.com/randyrants/sharpkeys). For the "app access" key button on
his keyboard, software needs to intercept the scan codes to see when the
scan code appears for that button, and present the UI to select an app.

Since the Mail button on a media keyboard sends the standard scan code
(VK_Launch_Mail, key 180, hex code 0xb4), he should just change the
default mail handler in Windows. However, he wants the portable version
of Thunderbird to be the mail handler yet the portable version is
portable because it does NOT add/delete/change registry entries. If a
portable program modified the registry, it doesn't fit the definition of
being portable. I figure he will need a key remapper (Autohotkey,
AutoIt, Smartkeys, etc) to point the key event to run the .exe wherever
he is loading portable Tbird.

On 9/21/2023 10:39 PM, VanguardLH wrote:

>
> There is no direct hardware link from keyboard to its mfr provided macro
> software. The keyboard still has to send scan codes for its own
> software to recognize when the keys got hit. The scancode is the event
> telling software, even the OS, that a key got pressed, and which key got
> pressed.

In Linux, you can use "xev" for that. [ xev == XWindows Event Viewer ]

*******

When I tested, I kinda scared the crap out of myself,
because the rubber nubbin buttons *DONT* create scan codes.

They DO create scan codes, but the scan codes never make it
to the OS level. That's what "xev" program told me. No
scan "key-down" or "key-up" was generated for the Email rubber button.
Instead, the opening of an Email tool was recorded.

It's got a bit to do, with the modernity of your computer.
These scan codes are being intercepted by ACPI and
converted into some sort of ACPI event, which in turn causes
the "selected" Email tool to open (which is MS "Mail" here).
That's why, on a modern PC, no "driver CD" is needed to make
the rubber buttons work.

https://learn.microsoft.com/en-us/windows-hardware/drivers/hid/acpi-button-device

If I selected my old Pentium 4 machine, then I would need to
insert the driver CD (came in the keyboard box) and install some "cruft"
(poorly written cruft-ware) that really would be dealing with scan codes.
Similarly, if I booted a Linux DVD on the Pentium 4 machine, "xev"
would be reporting weird scan codes (that would not do anything).

I don't think support for this was in the ACPI 1.0 spec, and
it might have been a spec or two later, before they added this.

Whereas the "Power Button", converting the front button of the
PC, into an ACPI event, was done early on. If you boot Linux with
a boot line argument of "noacpi", the OS is incapable of shutting
down, just like it was Windows 98 all over again. And that's because
accessing the ACPI Power Button and shutting off the PC with it,
is disabled by that boot option. I had to use that option, to
boot Knoppix 5.1 DVD on my X79 machine (ten years old or so) -- turn off
ACPI or it would not finish booting the Knoppix DVD.

There's a temporal epoch involved. Our old stories, "need a mod" .
Maybe there is an equivalent to xev -- a utility that just
reports scan codes, without acting on them.

Paul

In message <14uc8g9qt1dd2.dlg@v.nguard.lh> at Thu, 21 Sep 2023 21:39:36,
VanguardLH <V@nguard.LH> writes
>"J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> wrote:
[]
>> Do those 3rd-party utilities get the special codes (?) generated by the
>> non-standard buttons, or are you just suggesting the OP ignores the
>> non-standard buttons and uses combinations of standard keys (in which
>> case he could use any keyboard)?
[]
>There is no direct hardware link from keyboard to its mfr provided macro
>software. The keyboard still has to send scan codes for its own
>software to recognize when the keys got hit. The scancode is the event
>telling software, even the OS, that a key got pressed, and which key got
>pressed.

I realised there is no extra wire from the special buttons to the
motherboard - they're just generating scan codes, same as all other
keys. I was just wondering whether autohotkey etc. actually _recognise_
these extra codes.
>
>Some scan codes are pre-defined in the Windows registry. That's why
>with programmable keyboards you don't need software for mail, web
>browser, volume up/down/mute, play forward/reverse/pause.

Interesting. That must have come in with some version of Windows after
such keyboards (usually called "multimedia" keyboards) became moderately
common. (Question remains as to whether third-party utilities can
intercept them, though I expect they can, especially if they just
intercept any code regardless of type.)
[]
>The OP wants to change the mail mapping. On a media keyboard, the Mail
[]
>Since the Mail button on a media keyboard sends the standard scan code
>(VK_Launch_Mail, key 180, hex code 0xb4), he should just change the
>default mail handler in Windows. However, he wants the portable version

That's what I thought - not a keyboard question at all ...

>of Thunderbird to be the mail handler yet the portable version is
>portable because it does NOT add/delete/change registry entries. If a
>portable program modified the registry, it doesn't fit the definition of
>being portable. I figure he will need a key remapper (Autohotkey,
>AutoIt, Smartkeys, etc) to point the key event to run the .exe wherever
>he is loading portable Tbird.

.... but he might need to make the "default mail handler" something that
calls the portable version (and, obviously, keep the portable version
always in the same place).
--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/<1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)Ar@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf

.... each generation tends to imagine that its attitude to sex strikes just
about the right balance; that by comparison its predecessors were prim and
embarrassed, its successors sex-obsessed and pornified. - Julian Barnes, Radio
Times 9-15 March 2013

"J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> wrote:

> ... but he might need to make the "default mail handler" something that
> calls the portable version (and, obviously, keep the portable version
> always in the same place).

What I can see of Windows 10 Default Apps is you get to select from a
list of *registered* handlers. Registration is a program claiming it is
a handler, and that requires adding a registry entry. In Default Apps,
you only see the list of registered handlers (or the fall-through of
"Look for an app in the Microsoft Store" which would register itself as
an e-mail handler in the registry). Portable software don't (shouldn't)
register themselves.

That's why I mentioned using a key macro or remapper, so the key or
button doesn't have to point at a handler defined in the registry.

I don't know the specifics of the OP's setup, but my guess is the Mail
button uses the mailto: URL protocol. You can do the same by creating a
shortcut on your desktop, in a different folder, or in a toolbar in the
Windows taskbar, that merely specifies "maito:" (sans quotes) as the URL
target. That shortcut will also use the default e-mail program which
would be a registered one. You can specify arguments to mailto:, like
having a shortcut named "My Boss" using "mailto:myboss@domain.com".
Lots of online articles on how to add args to mailto: to do more than
just open the registered default mail app.

You, er, the OP could create a shortcut that runs a program, like
thunderbird.exe (without or without arguments depending how you want to
start Tbird), to load up Thunderbird Portable. I'd probably name the
shortcut something different, like "Thunderbird Portable", and see if
there was a different icon to grab from that .exe, or other .ico in the
Tbird folder. In that shortcut, specify the path to the drive and
folder where is the Tbird executable. You're specifying what program to
run via shortcut, not what handler to use assigned to the URL:MailTo
protocol in the registry.

I doubt the OP really wants to edit the registry to find the default
apps for the mailto: URL protocol, because that would fuck up those
references to his installed and registered copy of Thunderbird. While
there is a mailto node in the registry hive, all registered handlers
that have <productID>.mailto are registered. I don't know where in the
registry the default one of those is specified. The registry is scanned
on Windows startup (to put a copy into memory), and all handlers of the
same type (filetype, URL) are grouped at that time. Because I use eM
Client as my e-mail program, it has an entry:

HKEY_CLASSES_ROOT\eM Client.Url.mailto

with the shell\open command to specify opening its .exe file. I also
have:

HKEY_CURRENT_USER\SOFTWARE\Microsoft\Windows\Shell\Associations\UrlAssociations\mailto

That doesn't specify the handler, but does add a UserChoice subkey which
is the OS adding a hash value. Lots of online articles about
UserChoice, but basically it is Microsoft's way to prevent malicious or
accidential modifications to critical filetypes and URL protocols. You
can't edit the registry to make changes, because you don't know how to
generate a UserChoice hash that the OS will accept. Same for programs
that used to have a setting to set themself as the default handler,
because they also won't know a valid UserChoice hash value to add to the
registry. You now have to use the Default Programs wizard which know
how to generate a valid hash value to store in UserChoice. The OP
editing mailto, especially since I found a registry key with UserChoice,
means the OS will discard that change, and revert back to the prior
default choice.

Prior to Windows 10 (or maybe it was Windows 8), editing the registry to
change the mailto handler was easy. Now it's dangerous, or more likely
useless. Too many filetypes and protocols are protected. There are
tools, like SetUserFTA (but that looks to only work on protected
filetypes, not on protected protocols), that will let you make registry
changes, because the author figured out how to generate a valid
UserChoice hash value.

While the installed copy is fucked up, he should probably discuss with
the Thunderbird newsgroup how to fix the currently installed on, or
install another instance in a side-by-side setup. Some products, like
MS Outlook, don't allow side-by-side installs. Many do, especially when
you want to use different versions of the same program.

Not likely the OP can directly edit the registry. mailto looks to be a
protected URL protocol. The portable version of Tbird won't show up as
a choice since it is not registered as a mail handler. The OP could use
a special shortcut that loads Thunderbird Portable. The OP could use a
key remapper to change the Mail button on his keyboard to load a mail
program other than the default one specified in the OS in the registry.

From what I can tell, the OP doesn't now what to yet get rid of his
current install of Tbird. He just wants the Mail button on his keyboard
to run a different e-mail program. If the old software for that
keyboard is unusable nor even installable, use a different remap tool,
or use a shortcut.

In message <md5tcwpqh0cn.dlg@v.nguard.lh> at Fri, 22 Sep 2023 14:53:27,
VanguardLH <V@nguard.LH> writes
>"J. P. Gilliver" <G6JPG@255soft.uk> wrote:
>
>> ... but he might need to make the "default mail handler" something that
>> calls the portable version (and, obviously, keep the portable version
>> always in the same place).
>
>What I can see of Windows 10 Default Apps is you get to select from a
>list of *registered* handlers. Registration is a program claiming it is
[]
Ah, I was forgetting the ever-increasing clampdown. I was reading this
in the 7 'group.
--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/<1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)Ar@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf

"You play the market?" "No, the ukelele. And I sing too"
- Tony Curtis/Marilyn Monroe in SLIH

> You, er, the OP could create a shortcut that runs a program, like
> thunderbird.exe (without or without arguments depending how you want to
> start Tbird), to load up Thunderbird Portable.

That's exactly that what I would like to do, but what should be the name of
the link?

Wendelin Uez <wuez@online.de> wrote:

>> You, er, the OP could create a shortcut that runs a program, like
>> thunderbird.exe (without or without arguments depending how you want to
>> start Tbird), to load up Thunderbird Portable.
>
> That's exactly that what I would like to do, but what should be the name of
> the link?

You can name the shortcut whatever you like. It's just a name. If, for
example, you have shortcuts already named "Thunderbird" for the existing
install, create another shortcut pointing to the portable .exe that you
name "Thunderbird Portable", "Tbird Portable", "TB (on drive X)", or
whatever makes you remember that shortcut is pointing to the portable
version of Thunderbird.

The shortcut will have a path to the .exe. If the drive letter changes
when you plug in a USB flash drive where you have Tbird Portable, the
shortcut won't work. The USB drive has to get the same drive letter
each time you plug it in.

There are USB tools from UWE that try to fix the drive letters assigned
to USB drives (https://www.uwe-sieber.de/usbdlm_e.html). I haven't used
USBDLM for many years, so I don't know if it works on the latest few
versions of Windows. Or you can put a label (volume ID) on the USB
drive that is unique, use a batch file to find that volume, and run
Tbird from there. You'd have the special shortcut run the .bat file
instead of directly calling the .exe file. I did this trick a few years
back, but don't remember the specifics anymore.

On 23.09.23 20:16, Wendelin Uez wrote:
>> You, er, the OP could create a shortcut that runs a program, like
>> thunderbird.exe (without or without arguments depending how you want to
>> start Tbird), to load up Thunderbird Portable.
>
> That's exactly that what I would like to do, but what should be the name of
> the link?
>
P_bird

>> You, er, the OP could create a shortcut that runs a program, like
>> thunderbird.exe (without or without arguments depending how you want to
>> start Tbird), to load up Thunderbird Portable.
>
> That's exactly that what I would like to do, but what should be the name
> of the link?

Sorry, I made a mistake. Of course I know how to create a link on the
desktop to start any program with any wanted parameters.

What I really want to do is to change the value for the 'mailto' entries. I
can not change keyboard's behaviour, as far as I know because the keyboard
only sends a special key and not the mail command itself.

The special ke is transformed into a command like
"C:\Programs\hunderbird.exe", and all what I want to do is to replace this
by something like "D:\ThunderbirdPortable.exe" or even anything else like
"C:\Pograms\myMail.exe".

I suppose this transforming is a multi step procedure - the key code sent
from keyboard goes at least to a "mailto" registry entry which holds the exe
name, or it holds another registry key which holds the exe name. All what I
should need to do is to find the propper place of it and there to change
the exe name into the new mail program name. But the difficulty is to find
the right entry/entries.

Wendelin Uez <wuez@online.de> wrote:

>>> You, er, the OP could create a shortcut that runs a program, like
>>> thunderbird.exe (without or without arguments depending how you want to
>>> start Tbird), to load up Thunderbird Portable.
>>
>> That's exactly that what I would like to do, but what should be the name
>> of the link?
>
> Sorry, I made a mistake. Of course I know how to create a link on the
> desktop to start any program with any wanted parameters.
>
> What I really want to do is to change the value for the 'mailto' entries. I
> can not change keyboard's behaviour, as far as I know because the keyboard
> only sends a special key and not the mail command itself.
>
> The special ke is transformed into a command like
> "C:\Programs\hunderbird.exe", and all what I want to do is to replace this
> by something like "D:\ThunderbirdPortable.exe" or even anything else like
> "C:\Pograms\myMail.exe".
>
> I suppose this transforming is a multi step procedure - the key code sent
> from keyboard goes at least to a "mailto" registry entry which holds the exe
> name, or it holds another registry key which holds the exe name. All what I
> should need to do is to find the propper place of it and there to change
> the exe name into the new mail program name. But the difficulty is to find
> the right entry/entries.

mailto is a protected URL protocol, as explained. You cannot edit the
registry to change it, because you won't know how to generate the hash
for the UserChoice subkey in the registry. If the hash is invalid (you
or a program tried to create it) or it is deleted, the OS will restore a
new hash and restore the default handler. The protection is to prevent
malware from doing what you are trying to do.

If you go into the Default Apps wizard, and click on "Change default
apps by protocol", and scroll down to "MAILTO - URL:MailTo Protocol",
you can click on the handler selection to pick another. However, those
handlers are registered in ... wait for it ... the registry. You want
to use a portable version of Thunderbird, and portable programs do not
touch the registry. You won't find Thunderbird Portable among the list
of available handlers.

Because you cannot edit the registry since the mailto key is protected
by an OS-generated hash, and because portable apps are not registered as
protocol handlers since they don't do registry edits which means they
won't be in the handler list, you're left with redefining the Mail
button on your keyboard. If you cannot get the software to work from
Microsoft for Microsoft's keyboard, you'll have to use a key remapper
(AutoHotkey, AutoIt, SmartKeys, etc), and test if it detects the Mail
button press on the keyboard (the keyboard has to send some scan code to
identify the button got pressed).

Or, you create a new shortcut that that you double-click which points to
the .exe for the portable version of Thunderbird on whatever storage
media you put it (e.g., USB flash drive). Often plugging in a USB drive
will result in it getting assigned a different drive letter, and why I
gave info on how to try to fix the drive letter assigned to a particular
USB drive. Alternatively, I mentioned (but did not detail) how a unique
Volume ID on the USB flash drive could be used in a batch file to locate
the .exe file, but I'd have to look into how to code that since it's
been eons since I did that.

Or, you get your problematic Thunderbird installation to work, or get
data imported, or whatever is your problem with the Tbird install. Have
you yet asked for help in the Tbird newsgroup to resolve whatever issue
you have with it (alt.comp.software.thunderbird)? I don't see you have
visited the Tbird newsgroup to get your Tbird install working, import
data, or whatever. For example, have you yet tried creating a new
profile in Tbird to eliminate all the add-ons and user tweaks you made
to the problematic profile? You start with a clean slate with a clean
profile, so any continuing problem would be with TBird itself, and not
with your old profile. Visit the Tbird newsgroup for help.

Possibly there is another solution, but I have yet to see anyone else
offer one. My solutions might not be what you want, but they're the
ones I can think of.

Thank you for your detailed informations.

Which kind of data does the MS Wireless Keyboard send when mail button is
pressed - some standard code like an ASCII code like 65 for 'A' , or does
the keyboard driver fire a special Windows message not represented by a key
code?

For the first case it would be easy for me to write a small application
which runs Thunderbird Portable if the mail key was pressed down, in second
case I would have to know the message ID.

Sorry for this question, if I had acess to the keyboard I could look myself,
but it's tied to an external system where I have limited access.

Wendelin Uez <wuez@online.de> wrote:

> Thank you for your detailed informations.
>
> Which kind of data does the MS Wireless Keyboard send when mail button is
> pressed - some standard code like an ASCII code like 65 for 'A' , or does
> the keyboard driver fire a special Windows message not represented by a key
> code?
>
> For the first case it would be easy for me to write a small application
> which runs Thunderbird Portable if the mail key was pressed down, in second
> case I would have to know the message ID.
>
> Sorry for this question, if I had acess to the keyboard I could look myself,
> but it's tied to an external system where I have limited access.

For normal keys, a scan code is sent from the keyboard as an event to
the OS. There is a scan code for the keypress, and another scan code
for the key release. That way, a program can determine if you pressed a
key, or released a key. Many programs will wait until you release a key
to make sure that is the moment you want some action commited. Some
programs look for the key press, because that's the instant you are
making the choice, like in a video game.

The buttons are usually a bit different. They send just one scan code
on the press of the button.

There are lots of articles on keyboard scan codes, like:

https://www.win.tue.nl/~aeb/linux/kbd/scancodes-1.html

I already mentioned Nirsoft's KeyStateView for seeing what scan codes
are sent by the keyboard, but it doesn't seen the best tool. If a key
is pressed multiple times in a row, this tool only shows the key code
once (since subsequent keypresses are for the same key, anyway). It
also seems to show only the make scan code, not the break scan code.

Although you are asking in the Windows newsgroups, that was probably
because you were trying to get Microsoft's remapper tool installed under
Windows, but maybe you know Linux, too. In Linux, there is the showkey
tool to show scan codes as described at:

https://manpages.ubuntu.com/manpages/xenial/man1/showkey.1.html

Rather than employ software that monitors for key events to remap the
action to a specified program, you can remap keys in the Windows
registry. Once the remap is done there, you don't need software anymore
for the remapping. Smartkeys will do the registry editing (been way too
long since I did this in the registry, so I look for a tool that knows
how to do this).

https://apps.microsoft.com/store/detail/sharpkeys/XPFFCG7M673D4F
http://www.randyrants.com/category/sharpkeys/

Up to you if you want to use SharpKeys as a UWP (Universal Windows
Platform) app, or as a Win32 program. Both edit the registry to do the
remapping. Sorry, I haven't used it for a way over a decade, maybe two,
so I don't know if special keys (aka media buttons) on a multimedia
keyboard are handled with remapping in the registry. Many multimedia
keyboards do not have separate buttons for Mail, Play/Pause, etc.
Instead they repurpose the F-keys: when pressed normally, the F-key scan
code is sent, but when combined with an Fn key, as in Fn+<fkey>, then
they have a different action, like open the default mail handler, the
default web browser, etc. I see in the screenshots for SharpKeys that
F-lock combos are listed. Again, Fn (F-lock) is used with a key, so I
can't be sure the separate special-use buttons are remappable in the
registry.

AutoHotkey and AutoIt should capture the separate special-use buttons.
They have their own community where to ask such questions.

https://www.autohotkey.com/boards/
https://www.autoitscript.com/forum/

The special buttons still have to issue a scan code to generate an event
that software can detect, like Microsoft's keyboard tool. These tools
should also be able to detect when the Mail button is pressed. Note
that some key sequences have to be detects in order, and the make scan
code must be sent and not the break scan code for the key combo to work
in the software waiting for the key combo. Ctrl+C for Copy is sent as
make scan code for Ctrl (with no following break scan code for Ctrl)
followed by the make scan code for C (whereupon the action gets
committed, so following break scan codes for either key do not affect
the action requested). The remapper software has to track status of the
keypresses, like their current make or break status. Even if you intend
to write your own remapper program, you might get help at the above
forums to inform you how to record the key states, and how the special
buttons are monitored (what are their scan code sequences).

Be aware that the company owning the host may not want your special
software written by you as it cannot be support when you are no longer
employed by them. I've offered to write code to replace a scheduler the
company was working, all in batch commands that I figured anyone with
batch scripting experience could support, but they didn't want it, and
instead continued to pay for the expensive scheduler (which surpassed
what Windows Task Scheduler can do, especially regarding conditional
executes of subsequent tasks based on status from prior runs either for
series or parallel tasks). They wanted commercial software that they
paid for to get tech support for however long that software was
available and supported. Companies often will pay for support as they
consider it part of the normal operational costs of the company.

In message <z7g9k9sljjcp.dlg@v.nguard.lh> at Sat, 30 Sep 2023 14:58:13,
VanguardLH <V@nguard.LH> writes
[]
>keyboard are handled with remapping in the registry. Many multimedia
>keyboards do not have separate buttons for Mail, Play/Pause, etc.
>Instead they repurpose the F-keys: when pressed normally, the F-key scan
>code is sent, but when combined with an Fn key, as in Fn+<fkey>, then
[]
Can't say for multimedia keys, but on some laptops functions like volume
and brightness up/down, wireless on/off, video output switching, etc.,
are on the F keys too (usually in a different colour, and the "Fn" on
the function key is that colour).

On particularly irritating ones, the functions are the other way round -
i. e. you have to press the Fn key to get the _normal_ F1, F2 etc.
function (F1 for help in most software including the OS, for example).
--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/<1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)Ar@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf

All I ask is to _prove_ that money can't make me happy.

I*ve now written a small VB6 exe which reports the ASCII code for keyboard
input.

Only the first two keys, HIME and MAIL, seem to send an ASCII code, the
other's don't.
HOME sends 172, MAIL 180. F1...F12 send other readable codes.

ASCII code 180 alone cannot indicate a call, there must be more
information. But where?

Wendelin Uez <wuez@online.de> wrote:

> I*ve now written a small VB6 exe which reports the ASCII code for keyboard
> input.
>
> Only the first two keys, HIME and MAIL, seem to send an ASCII code, the
> other's don't.
> HOME sends 172, MAIL 180. F1...F12 send other readable codes.
>
> ASCII code 180 alone cannot indicate a call, there must be more
> information. But where?

Your VB program is reporting the virtual key code returned by the OS to
your process. Your VB program is *not* reporting the scan codes sent by
the hardware to the OS.

Use a tool that shows both make/break scan codes, and [virtual] key
codes, like:

https://dennisbabkin.com/kbdkeyinfo/

There are lots of other similar tools. The one I used long ago I
couldn't remember its name, so I had to do an online search on "keyboard
scan code tool".

Keyboards are interrupt driven. When a key is pressed or released, the
keyboard controller generates a signal (interrupt). The OS handles the
interrupt. PS/2 ports are interrupt driven. USB ports are polled
interfaces that emulate interrupts. Because of the lag with USB ports
(due to their polling intervals), gamers still prefer PS/2 keyboard
(plus they have a larger N-rollover than USB keyboards), and why you
still see high-end or gaming mobos with PS/2 ports in their backpanel.
There is still lag because the CPU has to complete it current
instruction, save flags, next instructions, and context, and then switch
to execute the vectored ISR (Interrupt Service Routine). After
switching context for the interrupt, the ISR code executes to get the
keyboard's controller registers to determine which key was pressed or
released. The ISR can schedule a deferred procedure call to execute the
necessary processing.

I've never gotten into keyboard interception. I would think a driver
(which could be dynamically loaded) would be needed to intercept the
scan code sent by the keyboard which would normally be received by the
OS' ISR vector routine, but maybe there's a way to query the OS to get
the scan code it received instead of the virtual key code it sends to a
process. Scan codes are hardware dependent on what are sent for key
presses and releases, and why some keyboards don't work well with some
OSes. Virtual codes are hardware INdependent, and OS dependent even on
the same key. Because scan codes can vary between keyboards even for
the same key, programmers typically use virtual key codes to standardize
their code to make it rather independent of the hardware-dependent scan
codes. That is, the OS takes the hardware-dependent scan code and maps
it to a virtual key code, so "a" is the same to the process that gets
the key code from the OS regardless what the keyboard happens to send.
This is why the OS-delivered key code to a process is called a virtual
key code: keyboard virtualization (or, key mapping, if you like).

https://learn.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/win32/inputdev/about-keyboard-input

According to the key tool that I mention above, your B4 (180) code is
the virtual key code for your Mail button. Processes designed to look
for and behave differently on a key press (make) versus a key release
(break) can't use virtual key codes sent by the OS to the process,
because the virtual key code for make and break is the same virtual key
code.

I also mentioned Nirsoft's KeyStateView tool. When I press the Mail
button, it also show the B4 key code (but also notes it is one of
Microsoft's special-purpose VK_keys, called VK_LAUNCH_MAIL. You can
find Microsoft's VK keys defined in winuser.h and described at:

https://learn.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/win32/inputdev/virtual-key-codes

You can back up in the tree node to read other articles on keyboard
programming, but not for how to do it in VisualBasic (which I haven't
touched in maybe 30 years which was pre-.NET back then).

https://www.ghacks.net/2010/06/06/the-ultimate-guide-to-keyboard-remapping/

That notes that not all "keys" on a keyboard may issue scan codes. They
may issue their own special-purpose codes, and why you need software
running in the background (as a process or service) to intercept codes
sent by the keyboard. That's why Microsoft provided their software with
their multimedia keyboard. Since that won't install for you (provided
you tried to install its 64-bit version in a 64-bit OS), you need to try
another remapping or scripting tool of which I've mentioned several.
You could write your own, but you've already exhibited lack of keyboard
programming by looking a virtual key codes instead of hardware scan
codes. What's wrong with using AutoHotkey, AutoIt, SharpKeys, or
something already available?

What's wrong with triggering on the B4 (or VK_LAUNCH_MAIL if you can
trigger on that in VB) virtual key code when you press the Mail button?