Paul wrote on 4/24/2023 8:53 AM:
>
> It's 6th generation Sandy Bridge from 2011.
>
> https://www.cpu-world.com/CPUs/Celeron_Dual-Core/Intel-Mobile%20Celeron%20B800.html
>

Quite old, low end RAM most likely an original Win7 device upgraded for
free to Win10(or 8.0/8.1 before 10)
Currently Running 21H2 which ceases support in June 2023. Device should
be updated to W10 22H2.
i.e. 21H2 no longer receive security updates after June 13, 2023.

<https://learn.microsoft.com/en-us/lifecycle/announcements/windows-10-21h2-end-of-servicing>

--
....w¡ñ§±¤ñ

....w¡ñ§±¤ñ <winstonmvp@gmail.com> wrote:
[...]

> Quite old, low end RAM most likely an original Win7 device upgraded for
> free to Win10(or 8.0/8.1 before 10)
> Currently Running 21H2 which ceases support in June 2023. Device should
> be updated to W10 22H2.
> i.e. 21H2 no longer receive security updates after June 13, 2023.
>
> <https://learn.microsoft.com/en-us/lifecycle/announcements/windows-10-21h2-end-of-servicing>

Do you know if the user will be notified before/at/after that time?
(Like was the case when 8.1 Extended Support ended in January.)

I like to keep my wife's quite old (May 2014) laptop on a in-support
OS, without living on the bleeding edge.

(Of course I can check by that time, but so many things to think of ...)

Frank Slootweg wrote on 4/24/2023 12:32 PM:
> ...w¡ñ§±¤ñ <winstonmvp@gmail.com> wrote:
> [...]
>
>> Quite old, low end RAM most likely an original Win7 device upgraded for
>> free to Win10(or 8.0/8.1 before 10)
>> Currently Running 21H2 which ceases support in June 2023. Device should
>> be updated to W10 22H2.
>> i.e. 21H2 no longer receive security updates after June 13, 2023.
>>
>> <https://learn.microsoft.com/en-us/lifecycle/announcements/windows-10-21h2-end-of-servicing>
>
> Do you know if the user will be notified before/at/after that time?
> (Like was the case when 8.1 Extended Support ended in January.)
>
> I like to keep my wife's quite old (May 2014) laptop on a in-support
> OS, without living on the bleeding edge.
>
> (Of course I can check by that time, but so many things to think of ...)
>

For earlier Windows versions(RTM 2015 release through 1803) a notice was
deployed via Windows Update.
For 21H2(since 21H1 has the same core o/s files as 22H2) it should happen
automatically, the update for supported systems by using an enablement
package
<https://support.microsoft.com/en-us/topic/kb5015684-featured-update-to-windows-10-version-22h2-by-using-an-enablement-package-09d43632-f438-47b5-985e-d6fd704eee61>
i.e. if 21H2 is fully updated which also would contain the latest
Servicing Stack Update then most of the 22H2 bits are already present,
the enablement package only needs to turn those bits on.

--
....w¡ñ§±¤ñ

Paul wrote:

>It's a two core processor at 1.5GHz.
>
>It's like a dual Tualatin or an early (dual) Pentium
>in terms of horsepower.
>
>It's just as sad a concept as my laptop, which is equivalent
>to an AthlonXP at 2.2GHz.
>
>Why the CPU companies made stuff like this, I'll never know.
>They knew they weren't good for anything modern when they made them.
>
>These just aren't good candidates for "busy little OSes".
>Just the AV activity alone keeps the box railed. The laptop
>has a 5400 RPM hard drive. 320GB.

Well, that pokey laptop HD is your biggest problem.

--
"[The assault on the capital] was actually a protest and not a riot."
- lying kook RonB

Frank Slootweg wrote on 4/24/2023 12:32 PM:
> ...w¡ñ§±¤ñ <winstonmvp@gmail.com> wrote:
> [...]
>
>> Quite old, low end RAM most likely an original Win7 device upgraded for
>> free to Win10(or 8.0/8.1 before 10)
>> Currently Running 21H2 which ceases support in June 2023. Device should
>> be updated to W10 22H2.
>> i.e. 21H2 no longer receive security updates after June 13, 2023.
>>
>> <https://learn.microsoft.com/en-us/lifecycle/announcements/windows-10-21h2-end-of-servicing>
>
> Do you know if the user will be notified before/at/after that time?
> (Like was the case when 8.1 Extended Support ended in January.)
>
> I like to keep my wife's quite old (May 2014) laptop on a in-support
> OS, without living on the bleeding edge.
>
> (Of course I can check by that time, but so many things to think of ...)
>

After a few more queries, afaics, the automatic update is the predominant
route for 21H2 devices. In fact Win10 22H2 devices capable of Win11 have
a mixed result on notification on upgrading to Win11 atm(some seeing an
option to upgrade, some seeing an option upgrade or stay on Win10, some
seeing nothing yet, some...blah)

Not related to Win10:
- the latest Win11 22H2 April 2023 Cumulative Update Preview adds a new
'feature'
"New! This update adds a new toggle control on the Settings > Windows
Update page. When you turn it on, we will prioritize your device to get
the latest non-security updates and enhancements when they are available
for your device. For managed devices, the toggle is disabled by default.

--
....w¡ñ§±¤ñ

On 24/04/2023 16:53, Paul wrote:
> On 4/24/2023 10:29 AM, David Brooks wrote:
>
>>
>> I've checked today!
>>
>> My Toshiba Satellite laptop has an Intel(R) Celeron(R) CPU B800 @
>> 1.5GHz Processor
>>
>> 4.00 GB Installed RAM
>>
>> Windows 10 Home Version 21H2   OS build  19044.1889
>>
>> I had forgotten just how slow it is in comparison to my Apple iMac which
>> is running macOS Ventura 13.3.1 (22E261)
>>
>> Thanks for keeping an eye out for me!
>>
>
> It's 6th generation Sandy Bridge from 2011.
>
> https://www.cpu-world.com/CPUs/Celeron_Dual-Core/Intel-Mobile%20Celeron%20B800.html
>
> It will run mostly in a Windows 10 like fashion. Any newer
> features might well be turned off.
>
>    Microarchitecture            Gen 6
>
>    Frequency                    1.5 GHz
>    The number of CPU cores      2
>    The number of threads        2
>
>    VT-x / Virtualization technology
>    SSE4 / SSE4.1 + SSE4.2 / Streaming SIMD Extensions 4  ?
>    EM64T / Extended Memory 64 technology / Intel 64
>
>    DDR3-1333   [the first really decent RAM type, not all DDR2 was good]
>
> Has a hard drive in it, 320GB or so, 5400 RPM.
> I don't think there is a TPM for Secure Boot.
>
> https://www.newegg.ca/toshiba-satellite-c650-01l/p/N82E16834214538CVF
>
> But you're doing good, as it's got one more core than
> my laptop has got :-) I keep an older version of Win10
> on that, just for speed reasons.

Thanks, Paul. :-D

As I had the laptop 'up and running', I decided to run a scan.

Here's the result: https://ibb.co/4M86CVH

I was a little concerned by the words "Remediation Incomplete" so I
downloaded and installed AVG

Here's the first scan result: https://ibb.co/cFKnHWD

Here's how things are now: https://ibb.co/7bn9rX2

What further action would you take if the computer was your own?

TIA

--
David

On 4/26/2023 6:52 AM, David Brooks wrote:
> On 24/04/2023 16:53, Paul wrote:
>> On 4/24/2023 10:29 AM, David Brooks wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> I've checked today!
>>>
>>> My Toshiba Satellite laptop has an Intel(R) Celeron(R) CPU B800 @ 1.5GHz Processor
>>>
>>> 4.00 GB Installed RAM
>>>
>>> Windows 10 Home Version 21H2   OS build  19044.1889
>>>
>>> I had forgotten just how slow it is in comparison to my Apple iMac which
>>> is running macOS Ventura 13.3.1 (22E261)
>>>
>>> Thanks for keeping an eye out for me!
>>>
>>
>> It's 6th generation Sandy Bridge from 2011.
>>
>> https://www.cpu-world.com/CPUs/Celeron_Dual-Core/Intel-Mobile%20Celeron%20B800.html
>>
>> It will run mostly in a Windows 10 like fashion. Any newer
>> features might well be turned off.
>>
>>     Microarchitecture            Gen 6
>>
>>     Frequency                    1.5 GHz
>>     The number of CPU cores      2
>>     The number of threads        2
>>
>>     VT-x / Virtualization technology
>>     SSE4 / SSE4.1 + SSE4.2 / Streaming SIMD Extensions 4  ?
>>     EM64T / Extended Memory 64 technology / Intel 64
>>
>>     DDR3-1333   [the first really decent RAM type, not all DDR2 was good]
>>
>> Has a hard drive in it, 320GB or so, 5400 RPM.
>> I don't think there is a TPM for Secure Boot.
>>
>> https://www.newegg.ca/toshiba-satellite-c650-01l/p/N82E16834214538CVF
>>
>> But you're doing good, as it's got one more core than
>> my laptop has got :-) I keep an older version of Win10
>> on that, just for speed reasons.
>
> Thanks, Paul. :-D
>
> As I had the laptop 'up and running', I decided to run a scan.
>
> Here's the result:  https://ibb.co/4M86CVH
>
> I was a little concerned by the words "Remediation Incomplete" so I downloaded and installed AVG
>
> Here's the first scan result:  https://ibb.co/cFKnHWD
>
> Here's how things are now:  https://ibb.co/7bn9rX2
>
> What further action would you take if the computer was your own?
>
> TIA
>

The path is more interesting than the Trojan. There seems to be some
general weirdness of the "sync" variety, but the people are also
claiming the images aren't theirs (not received via email).
Note that an AV in the thread, claimed to not be able to remove something
from there. That could be something keeping the file open.

https://answers.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/forum/all/microsoftwindowscommunicationsapps8wekyb3d8bbwe/c8746de8-55d4-47cd-a106-6d01eb6c41e4

Your path is:

C:\Users\username\AppData\Local\Packages\microsoft.windowscommunicationsapps_8wekyb3d8bbwe\
LocalState\Files\S0\1\Attachments

which implies you've been sent a Trojan email and the attachment is waiting for you
to "step in it" by clicking it. The permissions on the structures there, might
be intended to help with privacy. It's possible some anti-tamper setting is
interfering with clearing the pest. Or, your email tool is not exited,
which might allow free access to it.

The Microsoft entry for the Trojan, does not state what it does.

*******

first level scan, would be a Windows Defender quick scan. Which
you've probably already done.

Next level, is MSO from the Security panel. This uses a WinPE or
a WinRE as the OS, as far as I know. On a reboot, you'll get a scan done.
This requires no materials, except the PC itself.

[Picture]

https://i.postimg.cc/Vs9gmh9c/Microsoft-Scanner-Offline-MSO.gif

The next level after that, is MSSS safety scanner. Needs media
such as a USB stick. Scans offline, like the previous one (boot the USB stick
from your popup boot menu on the laptop). You prepare this stick on your uninfected PC.
This pulls updated defs at runtime. Defs are on the order of 100MB, to give some
idea how long the definition update stage might take.

https://learn.microsoft.com/en-us/microsoft-365/security/intelligence/safety-scanner-download?view=o365-worldwide

Winver.exe, does not particularly identify 32 bit versus 64 bit OS.
sysdm.cpl has some info.
msinfo32.exe has some info.

You can check your C: partition contents, as part of identifying bitness.

C: Program Files <=== 64 bit folder \___ This is a 64 bit OS
Program Files (x86) <=== 32 bit folder /

C: Program Files <=== 32 bit folder \___ This is a 32 bit OS
/

Paul

On 26/04/2023 19:37, Paul wrote:
> On 4/26/2023 6:52 AM, David Brooks wrote:
>> On 24/04/2023 16:53, Paul wrote:
>>> On 4/24/2023 10:29 AM, David Brooks wrote:
>>>
>>>>
>>>> I've checked today!
>>>>
>>>> My Toshiba Satellite laptop has an Intel(R) Celeron(R) CPU B800 @
>>>> 1.5GHz Processor
>>>>
>>>> 4.00 GB Installed RAM
>>>>
>>>> Windows 10 Home Version 21H2   OS build  19044.1889
>>>>
>>>> I had forgotten just how slow it is in comparison to my Apple iMac
>>>> which
>>>> is running macOS Ventura 13.3.1 (22E261)
>>>>
>>>> Thanks for keeping an eye out for me!
>>>>
>>>
>>> It's 6th generation Sandy Bridge from 2011.
>>>
>>> https://www.cpu-world.com/CPUs/Celeron_Dual-Core/Intel-Mobile%20Celeron%20B800.html
>>>
>>> It will run mostly in a Windows 10 like fashion. Any newer
>>> features might well be turned off.
>>>
>>>     Microarchitecture            Gen 6
>>>
>>>     Frequency                    1.5 GHz
>>>     The number of CPU cores      2
>>>     The number of threads        2
>>>
>>>     VT-x / Virtualization technology
>>>     SSE4 / SSE4.1 + SSE4.2 / Streaming SIMD Extensions 4  ?
>>>     EM64T / Extended Memory 64 technology / Intel 64
>>>
>>>     DDR3-1333   [the first really decent RAM type, not all DDR2 was
>>> good]
>>>
>>> Has a hard drive in it, 320GB or so, 5400 RPM.
>>> I don't think there is a TPM for Secure Boot.
>>>
>>> https://www.newegg.ca/toshiba-satellite-c650-01l/p/N82E16834214538CVF
>>>
>>> But you're doing good, as it's got one more core than
>>> my laptop has got :-) I keep an older version of Win10
>>> on that, just for speed reasons.
>>
>> Thanks, Paul. :-D
>>
>> As I had the laptop 'up and running', I decided to run a scan.
>>
>> Here's the result:  https://ibb.co/4M86CVH
>>
>> I was a little concerned by the words "Remediation Incomplete" so I
>> downloaded and installed AVG
>>
>> Here's the first scan result:  https://ibb.co/cFKnHWD
>>
>> Here's how things are now:  https://ibb.co/7bn9rX2
>>
>> What further action would you take if the computer was your own?
>>
>> TIA
>>
>
> The path is more interesting than the Trojan. There seems to be some
> general weirdness of the "sync" variety, but the people are also
> claiming the images aren't theirs (not received via email).
> Note that an AV in the thread, claimed to not be able to remove something
> from there. That could be something keeping the file open.
>
> https://answers.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/forum/all/microsoftwindowscommunicationsapps8wekyb3d8bbwe/c8746de8-55d4-47cd-a106-6d01eb6c41e4
>
> Your path is:
>
>
> C:\Users\username\AppData\Local\Packages\microsoft.windowscommunicationsapps_8wekyb3d8bbwe\
>         LocalState\Files\S0\1\Attachments
>
> which implies you've been sent a Trojan email and the attachment is
> waiting for you
> to "step in it" by clicking it. The permissions on the structures there,
> might
> be intended to help with privacy. It's possible some anti-tamper setting is
> interfering with clearing the pest. Or, your email tool is not exited,
> which might allow free access to it.
>
> The Microsoft entry for the Trojan, does not state what it does.
>
> *******
>
> first level scan, would be a Windows Defender quick scan. Which
> you've probably already done.

Yes, I did that.

> Next level, is MSO from the Security panel. This uses a WinPE or
> a WinRE as the OS, as far as I know. On a reboot, you'll get a scan done.
> This requires no materials, except the PC itself.
>
>    [Picture]
>
>     https://i.postimg.cc/Vs9gmh9c/Microsoft-Scanner-Offline-MSO.gif

Yes, I did that too.

> The next level after that, is MSSS safety scanner. Needs media
> such as a USB stick. Scans offline, like the previous one (boot the USB
> stick
> from your popup boot menu on the laptop). You prepare this stick on your
> uninfected PC.
> This pulls updated defs at runtime. Defs are on the order of 100MB, to
> give some
> idea how long the definition update stage might take.

I didn't know about that, which was why I used AVG.

> https://learn.microsoft.com/en-us/microsoft-365/security/intelligence/safety-scanner-download?view=o365-worldwide
>
> Winver.exe, does not particularly identify 32 bit versus 64 bit OS.
> sysdm.cpl has some info.
> msinfo32.exe has some info.
>
> You can check your C: partition contents, as part of identifying bitness.
>
> C:  Program Files        <=== 64 bit folder    \___ This is a 64 bit OS
>     Program Files (x86)  <=== 32 bit folder    /
>
> C:  Program Files        <=== 32 bit folder    \___ This is a 32 bit OS

As always, Paul - a comprehensive reply.

Thank you. 🙂

I'm going to put away the laptop for now; visitors coming tomorrow!

--
David

On 4/22/2023 4:21 PM, Joel wrote:
> https://deals.bleepingcomputer.com/sales/microsoft-windows-11-pro
>
> https://i.imgur.com/ewK4ZP1.png
>
>
> I have never purchased anything through this site, as a disclaimer,
> but I have no reason to doubt it's legitimate. As you see in the
> second link, it says you can install it on three computers, which
> makes me wonder, if that's true of all licenses, but I have seen
> nothing, anywhere else, to indicate that.
>

Now $39.99

Bob F wrote:
> On 4/22/2023 4:21 PM, Joel wrote:
>> https://deals.bleepingcomputer.com/sales/microsoft-windows-11-pro
>>
>> https://i.imgur.com/ewK4ZP1.png
>>
>>
>> I have never purchased anything through this site, as a disclaimer,
>> but I have no reason to doubt it's legitimate.  As you see in the
>> second link, it says you can install it on three computers, which
>> makes me wonder, if that's true of all licenses, but I have seen
>> nothing, anywhere else, to indicate that.
>>
>
> Now $39.99

Unlikely to be seen elsewhere unless a similar offer of a multi-volume
license was avaialble.

Thus, it would not be true 'for all licenses'

--
....w¡ñ§±¤ñ

On 4/27/2023 8:02 PM, ...winston wrote:
> Bob F wrote:
>> On 4/22/2023 4:21 PM, Joel wrote:
>>> https://deals.bleepingcomputer.com/sales/microsoft-windows-11-pro
>>>
>>> https://i.imgur.com/ewK4ZP1.png
>>>
>>>
>>> I have never purchased anything through this site, as a disclaimer,
>>> but I have no reason to doubt it's legitimate.  As you see in the
>>> second link, it says you can install it on three computers, which
>>> makes me wonder, if that's true of all licenses, but I have seen
>>> nothing, anywhere else, to indicate that.
>>>
>>
>> Now $39.99
>
>
> Unlikely to be seen elsewhere unless a similar offer of a multi-volume
> license was avaialble.
>
> Thus, it would not be true 'for all licenses'
>

I email asking if this was Retail or OEM

"Thanks for the email and for checking out Windows 11 on our site!

It is a retail version.

This information and more can be found on the product page under the
"specs" tab for your review."

Personally, I did not find that info under the specs tab.

Bob F <bobnospam@gmail.com> wrote:
>On 4/27/2023 8:02 PM, ...winston wrote:
>> Bob F wrote:
>>> On 4/22/2023 4:21 PM, Joel wrote:
>>>
>>>> https://deals.bleepingcomputer.com/sales/microsoft-windows-11-pro
>>>>
>>>> https://i.imgur.com/ewK4ZP1.png
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> I have never purchased anything through this site, as a disclaimer,
>>>> but I have no reason to doubt it's legitimate.  As you see in the
>>>> second link, it says you can install it on three computers, which
>>>> makes me wonder, if that's true of all licenses, but I have seen
>>>> nothing, anywhere else, to indicate that.
>>>
>>> Now $39.99
>>
>> Unlikely to be seen elsewhere unless a similar offer of a multi-volume
>> license was avaialble.
>>
>> Thus, it would not be true 'for all licenses'
>
>I email asking if this was Retail or OEM
>
>"Thanks for the email and for checking out Windows 11 on our site!
>
>It is a retail version.
>
>This information and more can be found on the product page under the
>"specs" tab for your review."
>
>Personally, I did not find that info under the specs tab.

It's clearly not "retail" in the usual sense, because that would
include a unique product key, like I paid $200 directly to Microsoft
for, in 2021 (it was for Win10, but typing it into the Win11 installer
works). This deal is probably, in truth, neither retail nor OEM, but,
as another poster suggested, is in some way utilizing volume licensing
to be distributed to consumers, which isn't a terrible way to obtain
it, given the low price, because you can then activate the same
machine over and over. The real advantage to my license is merely
that I could use it on a new machine, were this one to no longer be in
use.

--
Joel Crump

Joel wrote:
> Bob F <bobnospam@gmail.com> wrote:
>> On 4/27/2023 8:02 PM, ...winston wrote:
>>> Bob F wrote:
>>>> On 4/22/2023 4:21 PM, Joel wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> https://deals.bleepingcomputer.com/sales/microsoft-windows-11-pro
>>>>>
>>>>> https://i.imgur.com/ewK4ZP1.png
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> I have never purchased anything through this site, as a disclaimer,
>>>>> but I have no reason to doubt it's legitimate.  As you see in the
>>>>> second link, it says you can install it on three computers, which
>>>>> makes me wonder, if that's true of all licenses, but I have seen
>>>>> nothing, anywhere else, to indicate that.
>>>>
>>>> Now $39.99
>>>
>>> Unlikely to be seen elsewhere unless a similar offer of a multi-volume
>>> license was avaialble.
>>>
>>> Thus, it would not be true 'for all licenses'
>>
>> I email asking if this was Retail or OEM
>>
>> "Thanks for the email and for checking out Windows 11 on our site!
>>
>> It is a retail version.
>>
>> This information and more can be found on the product page under the
>> "specs" tab for your review."
>>
>> Personally, I did not find that info under the specs tab.
>
>
> It's clearly not "retail" in the usual sense, because that would
> include a unique product key, like I paid $200 directly to Microsoft
> for, in 2021 (it was for Win10, but typing it into the Win11 installer
> works). This deal is probably, in truth, neither retail nor OEM, but,
> as another poster suggested, is in some way utilizing volume licensing
> to be distributed to consumers, which isn't a terrible way to obtain
> it, given the low price, because you can then activate the same
> machine over and over. The real advantage to my license is merely
> that I could use it on a new machine, were this one to no longer be in
> use.
>

Not necessarily accurate.
There is a unique difference between retail and OEM(the basic is one
is transferable the other not). That's doesn't necessarily apply in the
Volume license arena. A volume license, for example, may have 5 licenses
with one product key. If 1 of the 5 device gets replaced or taken out of
service the license can be used on the new or another device(e.g. a
device with an earlier o/s) to put the 5 volume licenses in use
again(still with the same key).
When one installs a Win10 Home/Pro under volume license, the install
is a retail version even though its still using that one single key for
5 licenses.

In VL, one can always activate the same machines over and over again,
just like one can with a retail license...and not much different with an
OEM same device that gets wiped and clean installed or reset to factory.
- activation for previously activated devices almost always happens
automatically without the fanfare of earlier o/s need to enter a product
key.

--
....w¡ñ§±¤ñ

On 4/28/2023 5:24 PM, ...winston wrote:
> Joel wrote:
>> Bob F <bobnospam@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> On 4/27/2023 8:02 PM, ...winston wrote:
>>>> Bob F wrote:
>>>>> On 4/22/2023 4:21 PM, Joel wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> https://deals.bleepingcomputer.com/sales/microsoft-windows-11-pro
>>>>>>
>>>>>> https://i.imgur.com/ewK4ZP1.png
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I have never purchased anything through this site, as a disclaimer,
>>>>>> but I have no reason to doubt it's legitimate.  As you see in the
>>>>>> second link, it says you can install it on three computers, which
>>>>>> makes me wonder, if that's true of all licenses, but I have seen
>>>>>> nothing, anywhere else, to indicate that.
>>>>>
>>>>> Now $39.99
>>>>
>>>> Unlikely to be seen elsewhere unless a similar offer of a multi-volume
>>>> license was avaialble.
>>>>
>>>> Thus, it would not be true 'for all licenses'
>>>
>>> I email asking if this was Retail or OEM
>>>
>>> "Thanks for the email and for checking out Windows 11 on our site!
>>>
>>> It is a retail version.
>>>
>>> This information and more can be found on the product page under the
>>> "specs" tab for your review."
>>>
>>> Personally, I did not find that info under the specs tab.
>>
>>
>> It's clearly not "retail" in the usual sense, because that would
>> include a unique product key, like I paid $200 directly to Microsoft
>> for, in 2021 (it was for Win10, but typing it into the Win11 installer
>> works).  This deal is probably, in truth, neither retail nor OEM, but,
>> as another poster suggested, is in some way utilizing volume licensing
>> to be distributed to consumers, which isn't a terrible way to obtain
>> it, given the low price, because you can then activate the same
>> machine over and over.  The real advantage to my license is merely
>> that I could use it on a new machine, were this one to no longer be in
>> use.
>>
>
> Not necessarily accurate.
>  There is a unique difference between retail and OEM(the basic is one
> is transferable the other not). That's doesn't necessarily apply in the
> Volume license arena. A volume license, for example, may have 5 licenses
> with one product key. If 1 of the 5 device gets replaced or taken out of
> service the license can be used on the new or another device(e.g. a
> device with an earlier o/s) to put the 5 volume licenses in use
> again(still with the same key).
>  When one installs a Win10 Home/Pro under volume license, the install
> is a retail version even though its still using that one single key for
> 5 licenses.
>
> In VL, one can always activate the same machines over and over again,
> just like one can with a retail license...and not much different with an
> OEM same device that gets wiped and clean installed or reset to factory.
>  - activation for previously activated devices almost always happens
> automatically without the fanfare of earlier o/s need to enter a product
> key.

My wife got Retail Win 10 through her son that works for MS, which I
believe included the 3 license language, FWIW.

On 4/28/2023 7:11 PM, Bob F wrote:
> On 4/28/2023 5:24 PM, ...winston wrote:
>> Joel wrote:
>>> Bob F <bobnospam@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>> On 4/27/2023 8:02 PM, ...winston wrote:
>>>>> Bob F wrote:
>>>>>> On 4/22/2023 4:21 PM, Joel wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> https://deals.bleepingcomputer.com/sales/microsoft-windows-11-pro
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> https://i.imgur.com/ewK4ZP1.png
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I have never purchased anything through this site, as a disclaimer,
>>>>>>> but I have no reason to doubt it's legitimate.  As you see in the
>>>>>>> second link, it says you can install it on three computers, which
>>>>>>> makes me wonder, if that's true of all licenses, but I have seen
>>>>>>> nothing, anywhere else, to indicate that.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Now $39.99
>>>>>
>>>>> Unlikely to be seen elsewhere unless a similar offer of a multi-volume
>>>>> license was avaialble.
>>>>>
>>>>> Thus, it would not be true 'for all licenses'
>>>>
>>>> I email asking if this was Retail or OEM
>>>>
>>>> "Thanks for the email and for checking out Windows 11 on our site!
>>>>
>>>> It is a retail version.
>>>>
>>>> This information and more can be found on the product page under the
>>>> "specs" tab for your review."
>>>>
>>>> Personally, I did not find that info under the specs tab.
>>>
>>>
>>> It's clearly not "retail" in the usual sense, because that would
>>> include a unique product key, like I paid $200 directly to Microsoft
>>> for, in 2021 (it was for Win10, but typing it into the Win11 installer
>>> works).  This deal is probably, in truth, neither retail nor OEM, but,
>>> as another poster suggested, is in some way utilizing volume licensing
>>> to be distributed to consumers, which isn't a terrible way to obtain
>>> it, given the low price, because you can then activate the same
>>> machine over and over.  The real advantage to my license is merely
>>> that I could use it on a new machine, were this one to no longer be in
>>> use.
>>>
>>
>> Not necessarily accurate.
>>   There is a unique difference between retail and OEM(the basic is one
>> is transferable the other not). That's doesn't necessarily apply in
>> the Volume license arena. A volume license, for example, may have 5
>> licenses with one product key. If 1 of the 5 device gets replaced or
>> taken out of service the license can be used on the new or another
>> device(e.g. a device with an earlier o/s) to put the 5 volume licenses
>> in use again(still with the same key).
>>   When one installs a Win10 Home/Pro under volume license, the install
>> is a retail version even though its still using that one single key
>> for 5 licenses.
>>
>> In VL, one can always activate the same machines over and over again,
>> just like one can with a retail license...and not much different with
>> an OEM same device that gets wiped and clean installed or reset to
>> factory.
>>   - activation for previously activated devices almost always happens
>> automatically without the fanfare of earlier o/s need to enter a
>> product key.
>
> My wife got Retail Win 10 through her son that works for MS, which I
> believe included the 3 license language, FWIW.
>

Oops! That was probably the MS Office program that had that 3 PC license.

Bob F wrote:
> On 4/28/2023 7:11 PM, Bob F wrote:
>> On 4/28/2023 5:24 PM, ...winston wrote:
>>> Joel wrote:
>>>> Bob F <bobnospam@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>> On 4/27/2023 8:02 PM, ...winston wrote:
>>>>>> Bob F wrote:
>>>>>>> On 4/22/2023 4:21 PM, Joel wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> https://deals.bleepingcomputer.com/sales/microsoft-windows-11-pro
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
https://i.imgur.com/ewK4ZP1.png
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I have never purchased anything through this site, as a
>>>>>>>> disclaimer, but I have no reason to doubt it's
>>>>>>>> legitimate. As you see in the second link, it says you
>>>>>>>> can install it on three computers, which makes me
>>>>>>>> wonder, if that's true of all licenses, but I have
>>>>>>>> seen nothing, anywhere else, to indicate that.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Now $39.99
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Unlikely to be seen elsewhere unless a similar offer of a
>>>>>> multi-volume license was avaialble.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Thus, it would not be true 'for all licenses'
>>>>>
>>>>> I email asking if this was Retail or OEM
>>>>>
>>>>> "Thanks for the email and for checking out Windows 11 on our
>>>>> site!
>>>>>
>>>>> It is a retail version.
>>>>>
>>>>> This information and more can be found on the product page
>>>>> under the "specs" tab for your review."
>>>>>
>>>>> Personally, I did not find that info under the specs tab.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> It's clearly not "retail" in the usual sense, because that
>>>> would include a unique product key, like I paid $200 directly
>>>> to Microsoft for, in 2021 (it was for Win10, but typing it into
>>>> the Win11 installer works). This deal is probably, in truth,
>>>> neither retail nor OEM, but, as another poster suggested, is in
>>>> some way utilizing volume licensing to be distributed to
>>>> consumers, which isn't a terrible way to obtain it, given the
>>>> low price, because you can then activate the same machine over
>>>> and over. The real advantage to my license is merely that I
>>>> could use it on a new machine, were this one to no longer be
>>>> in use.
>>>>
>>>
>>> Not necessarily accurate. There is a unique difference between
>>> retail and OEM(the basic is one is transferable the other not).
>>> That's doesn't necessarily apply in the Volume license arena. A
>>> volume license, for example, may have 5 licenses with one product
>>> key. If 1 of the 5 device gets replaced or taken out of service
>>> the license can be used on the new or another device(e.g. a
>>> device with an earlier o/s) to put the 5 volume licenses in use
>>> again(still with the same key). When one installs a Win10
>>> Home/Pro under volume license, the install is a retail version
>>> even though its still using that one single key for 5 licenses.
>>>
>>> In VL, one can always activate the same machines over and over
>>> again, just like one can with a retail license...and not much
>>> different with an OEM same device that gets wiped and clean
>>> installed or reset to factory. - activation for previously
>>> activated devices almost always happens automatically without the
>>> fanfare of earlier o/s need to enter a product key.
>>
>> My wife got Retail Win 10 through her son that works for MS, which
>> I believe included the 3 license language, FWIW.
>>
>
> Oops! That was probably the MS Office program that had that 3 PC
> license.
>

MS Employee software(both Windows and Office) are retail version but
classified as NFR(not for resale).
- NFR software can be purchased by an employee and then given to
another(i.e. gift, donate) but the NFR condition remains for the
recipient.
- Afaik, current MS employee purchases for Windows and single license,
single use. Microsoft 365 versions of Office come in different flavors
- standalone(single license, single user), Personal(single license,
single user, subscription renewable annually), and Family(single
license, multiple users 1-6 people, subscription renewable annually)
=> The Family version is single licensed/owned by one user(the
purchaser or
the person gifted/given that installs the NFR software) with the ability
to share the product with up to five other persons.
- i.e. the only multi-use sold to employees would be the Family
version. Though any Personal version can be upgraded after installation
and activation to a Family version for the additional cost.
- Both Windows and Office are sold at reduced pricing to employees, but
for Microsoft 365/Office Family and Personal, the renewal cost after the
first year of use is same annual cost(Personal ~$70/yr, Family $99/yr
with the Family $99 renewal retaining the ability to continue sharing
with 5 others). Note a 'share' is done via the owners online Microsoft
account(Subscriptions). A share can be removed(e.g. share to 3 others
using 4 of the possible 6 with 2 remaining unshared, then unshare one,
then 3 shares remaining).

--
....w¡ñ§±¤ñ

David Brooks wrote:

>On 26/04/2023 19:37, Paul wrote:
>>
>> first level scan, would be a Windows Defender quick scan. Which
>> you've probably already done.
>
>Yes, I did that.
>
>> Next level, is MSO from the Security panel. This uses a WinPE or
>> a WinRE as the OS, as far as I know. On a reboot, you'll get a scan done.
>> This requires no materials, except the PC itself.
>>
>>    [Picture]
>>
>>     https://i.postimg.cc/Vs9gmh9c/Microsoft-Scanner-Offline-MSO.gif
>
>Yes, I did that too.
>
>> The next level after that, is MSSS safety scanner. Needs media
>> such as a USB stick. Scans offline, like the previous one (boot the USB
>> stick
>> from your popup boot menu on the laptop). You prepare this stick on your
>> uninfected PC.
>> This pulls updated defs at runtime. Defs are on the order of 100MB, to
>> give some
>> idea how long the definition update stage might take.
>
>I didn't know about that, which was why I used AVG.
>
>> https://learn.microsoft.com/en-us/microsoft-365/security/intelligence/safety-scanner-download?view=o365-worldwide
>>
>> Winver.exe, does not particularly identify 32 bit versus 64 bit OS.
>> sysdm.cpl has some info.
>> msinfo32.exe has some info.
>>
>> You can check your C: partition contents, as part of identifying bitness.
>>
>> C:  Program Files        <=== 64 bit folder    \___ This is a 64 bit OS
>>     Program Files (x86)  <=== 32 bit folder    /
>>
>> C:  Program Files        <=== 32 bit folder    \___ This is a 32 bit OS
>
>As always, Paul - a comprehensive reply.
>
>Thank you. ?

+1 As high a quality a post as I've seen in some time. I'm going to
try those suggestions on my machines.

--
"Yeah, it was horrible for me to note that JPGs *can* have EXIF data.
LOL! And years later you [Peter Köhlmann] are *still* saying I am
wrong about that!" - the "Snit" thing, lying shamelessly (but no one
can quote it lying)