Evntually, everything except the case and modular power supply went
back to eBuyer.

On their return and some replacements it was all assembled and guess
what? Dead as a dodo.

Recognising I was out of my depth, I recruited an engineer from
Airtasker. He spent several hours before eliminating one 16Gb DDR5
stick and the Asus Radeon graphics controller.

The monitor was plugged into the on-board graphics controller and we
had lift off.

He had fixed ideas about cable layout and snaked a few through the case
"to improve air flow" with result that I cannot put the side panel on!

I will sort that.

I wanted to install the SSD with Mint 21.3 but the BIOS is not
recognising the live usb flash drive.

I have written to eBuyer about RAM and the Graphics card. I await their
reply.

I will test the flash drive in another machine before trying it in
another socket.

Only been going on since the first week in November.

What I hate most is all my Windows using relatives and friends saying
"Why don't you just buy a machine?" They don't understand I need a
challenge. I do it for the aggravation!

I will follow up.

Alan

--
Linux Mint 21.1 kernel version 5.15.0-94-generic Cinnamon 5.6.8
AMD Phenom II x4 955 CPU 16Gb Dram 2TB Barracuda

On Sat, 10 Feb 2024 07:06:07 +1100, pinnerite <pinnerite@gmail.com> wrote:

> Evntually, everything except the case and modular power supply went
> back to eBuyer.
>
> On their return and some replacements it was all assembled and guess
> what? Dead as a dodo.
>
> Recognising I was out of my depth, I recruited an engineer from
> Airtasker. He spent several hours before eliminating one 16Gb DDR5
> stick and the Asus Radeon graphics controller.
>
> The monitor was plugged into the on-board graphics controller and we
> had lift off.
>
> He had fixed ideas about cable layout and snaked a few through the case
> "to improve air flow" with result that I cannot put the side panel on!
>
> I will sort that.
>
> I wanted to install the SSD with Mint 21.3 but the BIOS is not
> recognising the live usb flash drive.
>
> I have written to eBuyer about RAM and the Graphics card. I await their
> reply.
>
> I will test the flash drive in another machine before trying it in
> another socket.
>
> Only been going on since the first week in November.
>
> What I hate most is all my Windows using relatives and friends saying
> "Why don't you just buy a machine?" They don't understand I need a
> challenge. I do it for the aggravation!
>
> I will follow up.
>
> Alan

Just added the crosspost

On 2/9/2024 7:24 PM, Rod Speed wrote:
> On Sat, 10 Feb 2024 07:06:07 +1100, pinnerite <pinnerite@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Evntually, everything except the case and modular power supply went
>> back to eBuyer.
>>
>> On their return and some replacements it was all assembled and guess
>> what? Dead as a dodo.
>>
>> Recognising I was out of my depth, I recruited an engineer from
>> Airtasker. He spent several hours before eliminating one 16Gb DDR5
>> stick and the Asus Radeon graphics controller.
>>
>> The monitor was plugged into the on-board graphics controller and we
>> had lift off.
>>
>> He had fixed ideas about cable layout and snaked a few through the case
>> "to improve air flow" with result that I cannot put the side panel on!
>>
>> I will sort that.
>>
>> I wanted to install the SSD with Mint 21.3 but the BIOS is not
>> recognising the live usb flash drive.
>>
>> I have written to eBuyer about RAM and the Graphics card. I await their
>> reply.
>>
>> I will test the flash drive in another machine before trying it in
>> another socket.
>>
>> Only been going on since the first week in November.
>>
>> What I hate most is all my Windows using relatives and friends saying
>> "Why don't you just buy a machine?" They don't understand I need a
>> challenge. I do it for the aggravation!
>>
>> I will follow up.
>>
>> Alan
>
> Just added the crosspost

The duff memory stick (if that's what this post implies),
could prevent the system from starting, but there should have
been a memory beep if that was the case. The manual has beep
codes, but no POST code table that I saw in a quick skim.

The BIOS starts with CPU_register-only code, and does not
have usage of the DRAM initially. It has to program the
controller for the correct CAS on the memory controller
end and on the DRAM end. There is a "special cycle" sent
on the DRAM bus, that programs the DRAM for a certain CAS.
So if the RAM runs at DDR5-4800 or whatever, and with
a certain CAS at that speed, the clock needs to be set up
for that (divider or synthesizer), and then the special
cycle commissions the DRAM. The DRAM may also have impedance
settings for bus termination purposes (some of that is programmable).
The DRAM also has calibration cycles, which have been getting
more fancy with each generation.

All these things happen without the machine crashing.

Now, if the memory fails tests after that, the BIOS can
send the beep code to SPKR header and the case speaker.

If the BIOS started to use low memory (E801 reserved area),
and, the memory was bad, then when the BIOS "steps in it",
it could crash. There would be no beeps. However, on a
motherboard with staging lights, one of the staging lights
is on, and the white lettering next to the LED tells
you where it crashed. It crashed during "MEM".

The motherboard in this case, I can't get a picture with
sufficient detail, but as near as I can tell, there are
no staging LEDs. "Staging" refers to the Drag Race track,
where a "christmas tree" with lights on it, counts down
the beginning of the race. And that's what the debug LEDs
on some motherboards are indicating, the start of the race.

*******

What the post is missing then, for starters, is

"WHAT PREVENTED THE POWER FROM COMING ON?"

Note that bad RAM does not stop PS_ON# from being asserted.
The RAM could certainly have a dead short on it, it happens
on ceramic bypass caps on "untested" products. Some DIMMs
come out of the soldering machine and are put in bags,
as a measure of stupidity. Quality products need at least
a small initial test for rail shorts, even if no lengthy
"MEMTEST" is run.

The story lacks convincing detail.

Sure, there are details about integrated graphics versus
the RX6600 I didn't know you'd installed. If I'd known that,
I would have told you to remove it. Debug benefits from
onion skin and building from a debugged core. You remove
as much extraneous crap as you can, making for the simplest
of test cases when breathing life into your monster. If the
7700 lacked a graphics core, you'd install the RX6600 eventually
(after you got the no-video beeps).

Some motherboards disable the internal graphics core, if a
PCIe vid card is detected, on the assumption it is running things.
But you can also go into the BIOS screen when everything is
working, and switch off the internal graphics so the 256MB to 4096MB
of RAM it "stole", can be released. The more RAM you have, the
more it steals. If you had a single 4GB stick installed, then
it would only grab a small chunk. Turning it off, returns
the small chunk so an OS can use it.

*******

it's possible SPKR was not connected. This could be why
there "wasn't enough feedback coming from mobo".

Sometimes, the "pitch" of the computer case connectors
do not match the connector. On one of my case wiring bits,
I had to move a pin from slot 3 to slot 2, by lifting the
plastic tab that allows backing out the pin. Then the
connector would mate with the new mobo header. SPKR
is a 1x4 connector, typically. Usually it becomes obvious
during FP fitting, that something is wrong with the pitch
on one of them.

*******

I cannot tell from the graphics description, why we moved
the cable. Whether the integrated had switched itself off,
or, whatever. Normally, by starting by using the integrated,
you have time to familiarize yourself with the (not documented
in the manual) choices of

Integrated graphics Auto | Off

Auto implies the integrated graphics switches off when the
RX6600 is present.

Paul

On Sat, 10 Feb 2024 11:24:04 +1100, cantankerous trolling geezer Rodent
Speed, the auto-contradicting senile sociopath, blabbered, again:

<FLUSH the abnormal trolling senile cretin's latest trollshit unread>

On Sat, 10 Feb 2024 16:27:42 +1100, Paul <nospam@needed.invalid> wrote:

> On 2/9/2024 7:24 PM, Rod Speed wrote:
>> On Sat, 10 Feb 2024 07:06:07 +1100, pinnerite <pinnerite@gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Evntually, everything except the case and modular power supply went
>>> back to eBuyer.
>>>
>>> On their return and some replacements it was all assembled and guess
>>> what? Dead as a dodo.
>>>
>>> Recognising I was out of my depth, I recruited an engineer from
>>> Airtasker. He spent several hours before eliminating one 16Gb DDR5
>>> stick and the Asus Radeon graphics controller.
>>>
>>> The monitor was plugged into the on-board graphics controller and we
>>> had lift off.
>>>
>>> He had fixed ideas about cable layout and snaked a few through the case
>>> "to improve air flow" with result that I cannot put the side panel on!
>>>
>>> I will sort that.
>>>
>>> I wanted to install the SSD with Mint 21.3 but the BIOS is not
>>> recognising the live usb flash drive.
>>>
>>> I have written to eBuyer about RAM and the Graphics card. I await their
>>> reply.
>>>
>>> I will test the flash drive in another machine before trying it in
>>> another socket.
>>>
>>> Only been going on since the first week in November.
>>>
>>> What I hate most is all my Windows using relatives and friends saying
>>> "Why don't you just buy a machine?" They don't understand I need a
>>> challenge. I do it for the aggravation!
>>>
>>> I will follow up.
>>>
>>> Alan
>>
>> Just added the crosspost

> The duff memory stick (if that's what this post implies),
> could prevent the system from starting,

Nope, not with the power on beep and fans running.

> but there should have been a memory beep if that was the case.

Yep, and some fan running.

> The manual has beep codes, but no POSTcode table that I saw in a quick
> skim.

Its likely the standard AMS post code.

> The BIOS starts with CPU_register-only code, and doesnot have usage of
> the DRAM initially. It has to program the
> controller for the correct CAS on the memory controller
> end and on the DRAM end. There is a "special cycle" sent
> on the DRAM bus, that programs the DRAM for a certain CAS.
> So if the RAM runs at DDR5-4800 or whatever, and with
> a certain CAS at that speed, the clock needs to be set up
> for that (divider or synthesizer), and then the special
> cycle commissions the DRAM. The DRAM may also haveimpedance settings
> for bus termination purposes (someof that is programmable). The DRAM
> also has calibrationcycles, which have been getting more fancy with each
> generation.

But he should have got a startup beep
and atleast the cpu fan running.

But I can't see the original *.linux.mint posts so it isnt
clear if he spelt out exactly what he meant by "won't start"

> All these things happen without the machine crashing.

> Now, if the memory fails tests after that, the BIOS can
> send the beep code to SPKR header and the case speaker.

> If the BIOS started to use low memory (E801 reserved area),
> and, the memory was bad, then when the BIOS "steps in it",
> it could crash. There would be no beeps. However, on a
> motherboard with staging lights, one of the staging lights
> is on, and the white lettering next to the LED tells
> you where it crashed. It crashed during "MEM".

> The motherboard in this case, I can't get a picture with
> sufficient detail, but as near as I can tell, there are
> no staging LEDs. "Staging" refers to the Drag Race track,
> where a "christmas tree" with lights on it, counts down
> the beginning of the race. And that's what the debug LEDs
> on some motherboards are indicating, the start of the race.
>
> *******
>
> What the post is missing then, for starters, is
>
> "WHAT PREVENTED THE POWER FROM COMING ON?"

Is it clear that it didn't ?

> Note that bad RAM does not stop PS_ON# from being asserted.
> The RAM could certainly have a dead short on it, it happens
> on ceramic bypass caps on "untested" products. Some DIMMs
> come out of the soldering machine and are put in bags,
> as a measure of stupidity. Quality products need at least
> a small initial test for rail shorts, even if no lengthy
> "MEMTEST" is run.

> The story lacks convincing detail.

Yep, tho I haven't seen the orignal posts.

> Sure, there are details about integrated graphics versus
> the RX6600 I didn't know you'd installed. If I'd known that,
> I would have told you to remove it. Debug benefits from
> onion skin and building from a debugged core. You remove
> as much extraneous crap as you can, making for the simplest
> of test cases when breathing life into your monster. If the
> 7700 lacked a graphics core, you'd install the RX6600eventually (after
> you got the no-video beeps).

> Some motherboards disable the internal graphics core, if a
> PCIe vid card is detected, on the assumption it is running things.
> But you can also go into the BIOS screen when everything is
> working, and switch off the internal graphics so the 256MB to 4096MB
> of RAM it "stole", can be released. The more RAM you have, the
> more it steals. If you had a single 4GB stick installed, then
> it would only grab a small chunk. Turning it off, returns
> the small chunk so an OS can use it.
>
> *******
>
> it's possible SPKR was not connected. This could be why
> there "wasn't enough feedback coming from mobo".

But the cpu fan should have started.

> Sometimes, the "pitch" of the computer case connectors
> do not match the connector. On one of my case wiring bits,
> I had to move a pin from slot 3 to slot 2, by lifting the
> plastic tab that allows backing out the pin. Then the
> connector would mate with the new mobo header. SPKR
> is a 1x4 connector, typically. Usually it becomes obvious
> during FP fitting, that something is wrong with the pitch
> on one of them.
>
> *******
>
> I cannot tell from the graphics description, why we moved
> the cable. Whether the integrated had switched itself off,
> or, whatever. Normally, by starting by using the integrated,
> you have time to familiarize yourself with the (not documented
> in the manual) choices of
>
> Integrated graphics Auto | Off
>
> Auto implies the integrated graphics switches off when the
> RX6600 is present.

On Sat, 10 Feb 2024 20:12:40 +1100, cantankerous trolling geezer Rodent
Speed, the auto-contradicting senile sociopath, blabbered, again:

<FLUSH the abnormal trolling senile cretin's latest trollshit unread>

--
"Who or What is Rod Speed?
Rod Speed is an entirely modern phenomenon. Essentially, Rod Speed
is an insecure and worthless individual who has discovered he can
enhance his own self-esteem in his own eyes by playing "the big, hard
man" on the InterNet."
https://www.pcreview.co.uk/threads/rod-speed-faq.2973853/

On 10/02/2024 05:27, Paul wrote:
> On 2/9/2024 7:24 PM, Rod Speed wrote:
>> On Sat, 10 Feb 2024 07:06:07 +1100, pinnerite <pinnerite@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Evntually, everything except the case and modular power supply went
>>> back to eBuyer.
>>>
>>> On their return and some replacements it was all assembled and guess
>>> what? Dead as a dodo.
>>>
>>> Recognising I was out of my depth, I recruited an engineer from
>>> Airtasker. He spent several hours before eliminating one 16Gb DDR5
>>> stick and the Asus Radeon graphics controller.
>>>
>>> The monitor was plugged into the on-board graphics controller and we
>>> had lift off.
>>>
>>> He had fixed ideas about cable layout and snaked a few through the case
>>> "to improve air flow" with result that I cannot put the side panel on!
>>>
>>> I will sort that.
>>>
>>> I wanted to install the SSD with Mint 21.3 but the BIOS is not
>>> recognising the live usb flash drive.
>>>
>>> I have written to eBuyer about RAM and the Graphics card. I await their
>>> reply.
>>>
>>> I will test the flash drive in another machine before trying it in
>>> another socket.
>>>
>>> Only been going on since the first week in November.
>>>
>>> What I hate most is all my Windows using relatives and friends saying
>>> "Why don't you just buy a machine?" They don't understand I need a
>>> challenge. I do it for the aggravation!
>>>
>>> I will follow up.
>>>
>>> Alan
>>
>> Just added the crosspost
>
> The duff memory stick (if that's what this post implies),
> could prevent the system from starting, but there should have
> been a memory beep if that was the case. The manual has beep
> codes, but no POST code table that I saw in a quick skim.
>
> The BIOS starts with CPU_register-only code, and does not
> have usage of the DRAM initially. It has to program the
> controller for the correct CAS on the memory controller
> end and on the DRAM end. There is a "special cycle" sent
> on the DRAM bus, that programs the DRAM for a certain CAS.
> So if the RAM runs at DDR5-4800 or whatever, and with
> a certain CAS at that speed, the clock needs to be set up
> for that (divider or synthesizer), and then the special
> cycle commissions the DRAM. The DRAM may also have impedance
> settings for bus termination purposes (some of that is programmable).
> The DRAM also has calibration cycles, which have been getting
> more fancy with each generation.
>
> All these things happen without the machine crashing.
>
> Now, if the memory fails tests after that, the BIOS can
> send the beep code to SPKR header and the case speaker.
>
> If the BIOS started to use low memory (E801 reserved area),
> and, the memory was bad, then when the BIOS "steps in it",
> it could crash. There would be no beeps. However, on a
> motherboard with staging lights, one of the staging lights
> is on, and the white lettering next to the LED tells
> you where it crashed. It crashed during "MEM".
>
> The motherboard in this case, I can't get a picture with
> sufficient detail, but as near as I can tell, there are
> no staging LEDs. "Staging" refers to the Drag Race track,
> where a "christmas tree" with lights on it, counts down
> the beginning of the race. And that's what the debug LEDs
> on some motherboards are indicating, the start of the race.
>
> *******
>
> What the post is missing then, for starters, is
>
> "WHAT PREVENTED THE POWER FROM COMING ON?"
>
> Note that bad RAM does not stop PS_ON# from being asserted.
> The RAM could certainly have a dead short on it, it happens
> on ceramic bypass caps on "untested" products. Some DIMMs
> come out of the soldering machine and are put in bags,
> as a measure of stupidity. Quality products need at least
> a small initial test for rail shorts, even if no lengthy
> "MEMTEST" is run.
>
> The story lacks convincing detail.
>
> Sure, there are details about integrated graphics versus
> the RX6600 I didn't know you'd installed. If I'd known that,
> I would have told you to remove it. Debug benefits from
> onion skin and building from a debugged core. You remove
> as much extraneous crap as you can, making for the simplest
> of test cases when breathing life into your monster. If the
> 7700 lacked a graphics core, you'd install the RX6600 eventually
> (after you got the no-video beeps).
>
> Some motherboards disable the internal graphics core, if a
> PCIe vid card is detected, on the assumption it is running things.
> But you can also go into the BIOS screen when everything is
> working, and switch off the internal graphics so the 256MB to 4096MB
> of RAM it "stole", can be released. The more RAM you have, the
> more it steals. If you had a single 4GB stick installed, then
> it would only grab a small chunk. Turning it off, returns
> the small chunk so an OS can use it.
>
> *******
>
> it's possible SPKR was not connected. This could be why
> there "wasn't enough feedback coming from mobo".
>
> Sometimes, the "pitch" of the computer case connectors
> do not match the connector. On one of my case wiring bits,
> I had to move a pin from slot 3 to slot 2, by lifting the
> plastic tab that allows backing out the pin. Then the
> connector would mate with the new mobo header. SPKR
> is a 1x4 connector, typically. Usually it becomes obvious
> during FP fitting, that something is wrong with the pitch
> on one of them.
>
> *******
>
> I cannot tell from the graphics description, why we moved
> the cable. Whether the integrated had switched itself off,
> or, whatever. Normally, by starting by using the integrated,
> you have time to familiarize yourself with the (not documented
> in the manual) choices of
>
> Integrated graphics Auto | Off
>
> Auto implies the integrated graphics switches off when the
> RX6600 is present.
>
> Paul

I think in some motherboards you could set the primary boot video to be
either the onboard video or via teh PCIe video card.

Mind you, I have personally come across situations where a PCIe graphics
card would work in any PC that did not have the UHD630 onboard video.

As soon as the same graphics card was plugged into a mobo with UHD630
grpahics, it was not possible to have both working at the same time with
the correct sets of drivers... You had one working with correct drivers
and the other using somethign akin to safe mode drivers.....

In fact this machine I am writing this post on has UHD630 graphics on
board that I can't use as there is a AMD Radeon R9 200 series GFX card
with 3GB RAM.

I know the AMD card is very long in the tooth, I do plan to replace it
when graphcis card prices get lower... :-)

On Sat, 10 Feb 2024 20:12:40 +1100
"Rod Speed" <rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> wrote:

> On Sat, 10 Feb 2024 16:27:42 +1100, Paul <nospam@needed.invalid> wrote:
>
> > On 2/9/2024 7:24 PM, Rod Speed wrote:
> >> On Sat, 10 Feb 2024 07:06:07 +1100, pinnerite <pinnerite@gmail.com>
> >> wrote:
> >>
> >>> Evntually, everything except the case and modular power supply went
> >>> back to eBuyer.
> >>>
> >>> On their return and some replacements it was all assembled and guess
> >>> what? Dead as a dodo.
> >>>
> >>> Recognising I was out of my depth, I recruited an engineer from
> >>> Airtasker. He spent several hours before eliminating one 16Gb DDR5
> >>> stick and the Asus Radeon graphics controller.
> >>>
> >>> The monitor was plugged into the on-board graphics controller and we
> >>> had lift off.
> >>>
> >>> He had fixed ideas about cable layout and snaked a few through the case
> >>> "to improve air flow" with result that I cannot put the side panel on!
> >>>
> >>> I will sort that.
> >>>
> >>> I wanted to install the SSD with Mint 21.3 but the BIOS is not
> >>> recognising the live usb flash drive.
> >>>
> >>> I have written to eBuyer about RAM and the Graphics card. I await their
> >>> reply.
> >>>
> >>> I will test the flash drive in another machine before trying it in
> >>> another socket.
> >>>
> >>> Only been going on since the first week in November.
> >>>
> >>> What I hate most is all my Windows using relatives and friends saying
> >>> "Why don't you just buy a machine?" They don't understand I need a
> >>> challenge. I do it for the aggravation!
> >>>
> >>> I will follow up.
> >>>
> >>> Alan
> >>
> >> Just added the crosspost
>
> > The duff memory stick (if that's what this post implies),
> > could prevent the system from starting,
>
> Nope, not with the power on beep and fans running.
>
> > but there should have been a memory beep if that was the case.
>
> Yep, and some fan running.
>
> > The manual has beep codes, but no POSTcode table that I saw in a quick
> > skim.
>
> Its likely the standard AMS post code.
>
> > The BIOS starts with CPU_register-only code, and doesnot have usage of
> > the DRAM initially. It has to program the
> > controller for the correct CAS on the memory controller
> > end and on the DRAM end. There is a "special cycle" sent
> > on the DRAM bus, that programs the DRAM for a certain CAS.
> > So if the RAM runs at DDR5-4800 or whatever, and with
> > a certain CAS at that speed, the clock needs to be set up
> > for that (divider or synthesizer), and then the special
> > cycle commissions the DRAM. The DRAM may also haveimpedance settings
> > for bus termination purposes (someof that is programmable). The DRAM
> > also has calibrationcycles, which have been getting more fancy with each
> > generation.
>
> But he should have got a startup beep
> and atleast the cpu fan running.
>
> But I can't see the original *.linux.mint posts so it isnt
> clear if he spelt out exactly what he meant by "won't start"
>
> > All these things happen without the machine crashing.
>
> > Now, if the memory fails tests after that, the BIOS can
> > send the beep code to SPKR header and the case speaker.
>
> > If the BIOS started to use low memory (E801 reserved area),
> > and, the memory was bad, then when the BIOS "steps in it",
> > it could crash. There would be no beeps. However, on a
> > motherboard with staging lights, one of the staging lights
> > is on, and the white lettering next to the LED tells
> > you where it crashed. It crashed during "MEM".
>
> > The motherboard in this case, I can't get a picture with
> > sufficient detail, but as near as I can tell, there are
> > no staging LEDs. "Staging" refers to the Drag Race track,
> > where a "christmas tree" with lights on it, counts down
> > the beginning of the race. And that's what the debug LEDs
> > on some motherboards are indicating, the start of the race.
> >
> > *******
> >
> > What the post is missing then, for starters, is
> >
> > "WHAT PREVENTED THE POWER FROM COMING ON?"
>
> Is it clear that it didn't ?
>
> > Note that bad RAM does not stop PS_ON# from being asserted.
> > The RAM could certainly have a dead short on it, it happens
> > on ceramic bypass caps on "untested" products. Some DIMMs
> > come out of the soldering machine and are put in bags,
> > as a measure of stupidity. Quality products need at least
> > a small initial test for rail shorts, even if no lengthy
> > "MEMTEST" is run.
>
> > The story lacks convincing detail.
>
> Yep, tho I haven't seen the orignal posts.
>
> > Sure, there are details about integrated graphics versus
> > the RX6600 I didn't know you'd installed. If I'd known that,
> > I would have told you to remove it. Debug benefits from
> > onion skin and building from a debugged core. You remove
> > as much extraneous crap as you can, making for the simplest
> > of test cases when breathing life into your monster. If the
> > 7700 lacked a graphics core, you'd install the RX6600eventually (after
> > you got the no-video beeps).
>
> > Some motherboards disable the internal graphics core, if a
> > PCIe vid card is detected, on the assumption it is running things.
> > But you can also go into the BIOS screen when everything is
> > working, and switch off the internal graphics so the 256MB to 4096MB
> > of RAM it "stole", can be released. The more RAM you have, the
> > more it steals. If you had a single 4GB stick installed, then
> > it would only grab a small chunk. Turning it off, returns
> > the small chunk so an OS can use it.
> >
> > *******
> >
> > it's possible SPKR was not connected. This could be why
> > there "wasn't enough feedback coming from mobo".
>
> But the cpu fan should have started.
>
> > Sometimes, the "pitch" of the computer case connectors
> > do not match the connector. On one of my case wiring bits,
> > I had to move a pin from slot 3 to slot 2, by lifting the
> > plastic tab that allows backing out the pin. Then the
> > connector would mate with the new mobo header. SPKR
> > is a 1x4 connector, typically. Usually it becomes obvious
> > during FP fitting, that something is wrong with the pitch
> > on one of them.
> >
> > *******
> >
> > I cannot tell from the graphics description, why we moved
> > the cable. Whether the integrated had switched itself off,
> > or, whatever. Normally, by starting by using the integrated,
> > you have time to familiarize yourself with the (not documented
> > in the manual) choices of
> >
> > Integrated graphics Auto | Off
> >
> > Auto implies the integrated graphics switches off when the
> > RX6600 is present.

The P.O.S.T gave 3 beeps when either both or just the duff stick was in.

--
Linux Mint 21.1 kernel version 5.15.0-94-generic Cinnamon 5.6.8
AMD Phenom II x4 955 CPU 16Gb Dram 2TB Barracuda

On 2/10/2024 7:34 AM, pinnerite wrote:

>
> The P.O.S.T gave 3 beeps when either both or just the duff stick was in.
>

But it could do that, because it powered up for you.

At one point, it was not powering up.

Then... something changed.

Paul

On 2/10/2024 6:03 AM, SH wrote:

> I think in some motherboards you could set the primary boot video to be either the onboard video or via teh PCIe video card.
>
> Mind you, I have personally come across situations where a PCIe graphics card would work in any PC that did not have the UHD630 onboard video.
>
> As soon as the same graphics card was plugged into a mobo with UHD630 grpahics, it was not possible to have both working at the same time with the correct sets of drivers... You had one working with correct drivers and the other using somethign akin to safe mode drivers.....
>
> In fact this machine I am writing this post on has UHD630 graphics on board that I can't use as there is a AMD Radeon R9 200 series GFX card with 3GB RAM.
>
> I know the AMD card is very long in the tooth, I do plan to replace it when graphcis card prices get lower... :-)

A long time ago, AGP had GART (Graphics Area Translation Table ?).
"You could only have one of those" was the wisdom at the time.
That may have been one of the reasons for having "Auto" behavior
and having one GPU shut off.

When PCIe came along, some sort of scheme which was not GART
was used as a replacement (it would be a scheme for texture transfer
from system RAM, for games). There seemed to be no rules for that.

The machines really should allow multiple GPUs to be present in the
machine, and have the machines still work. While there is a 256KB
table in the 640KB ("Bill Gates") area, for shrinking config ROMs
from the various boards, I don't know if that is still an issue or not.

Another issue, is there are two standards at work for config ROMs.
The newest one is GOP and is part of UEFI or something. At one time,
a few cards, you could buy the card with the legacy format in
the EEPROM on the board, but you could download the GOP version
from the manufacturer. Later, only GOP shipped in the card.
Again, this may be intended to support more than one card,
rather than being something that restricts card usage.

I believe the "UEFI" tick box here, indicates a GOP config ROM
is on the video card (or supports the video silicon). If UEFI is
not ticked, then it could be a legacy VESA config ROM. Just about
all video cards in the old days were VESA compatible -- only a
couple Matrox cards seemed to be busted (made incorrect images during
BIOS POST or something).

[Picture]

https://i.postimg.cc/q7KN80Th/bus-speed-test-pure-fun.gif

A lot of this stuff is no longer discussion material, making
debugging a bit harder.

Paul

On Sat, 10 Feb 2024 08:55:01 -0500
Paul <nospam@needed.invalid> wrote:

> On 2/10/2024 7:34 AM, pinnerite wrote:
>
> >
> > The P.O.S.T gave 3 beeps when either both or just the duff stick was in.
> >
>
> But it could do that, because it powered up for you.
>
> At one point, it was not powering up.
>
> Then... something changed.
>
> Paul

You are right. The miracle worker claimed that either the eight-pin
power cable to the graphics card or the motherboard was of the
wrong type becsause it had PCIe stamped on it. As far as I could see
all those with the same number of connections did too.

He seemed to be fiddling with one set that had a six-pin plus a two-pin
and held them together before inserting them. Either way, he got it
started.

Alan

--
Linux Mint 21.1 kernel version 5.15.0-94-generic Cinnamon 5.6.8
AMD Phenom II x4 955 CPU 16Gb Dram 2TB Barracuda

pinnerite <pinnerite@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Sat, 10 Feb 2024 08:55:01 -0500
> Paul <nospam@needed.invalid> wrote:
>
> > On 2/10/2024 7:34 AM, pinnerite wrote:
> >
> > >
> > > The P.O.S.T gave 3 beeps when either both or just the duff stick was in.
> > >
> >
> > But it could do that, because it powered up for you.
> >
> > At one point, it was not powering up.
> >
> > Then... something changed.
> >
> > Paul
>
> You are right. The miracle worker claimed that either the eight-pin
> power cable to the graphics card or the motherboard was of the
> wrong type becsause it had PCIe stamped on it. As far as I could see
> all those with the same number of connections did too.
>
> He seemed to be fiddling with one set that had a six-pin plus a two-pin
> and held them together before inserting them. Either way, he got it
> started.

The auxiliary EPS12V power to the motherboard and the PCIe power cables to
the GPU are both 8 pin, but have different notches on them - you shouldn't
be able to insert one in the other unless you force them in hard.

Sometimes the EPS12V comes in 4+4 and the PCIe in 6+2 format, which support
devices which only take 4 pin or 6 pin connectors - the two halves latch
together to make an 8 pin connector.

If you have a modular PSU, vendors often use similar connectors on the power
supply end of such cables in some non-standard fashion - depending on what
they used, I suppose it may be possible to get them the wrong way round (ie
connecting the end that should go into the PSU into the motherboard, and so
making a connection you shouldn't be able to).

Theo

On Fri, 9 Feb 2024 20:06:07 +0000
pinnerite <pinnerite@gmail.com> wrote:

> Evntually, everything except the case and modular power supply went
> back to eBuyer.
>
> On their return and some replacements it was all assembled and guess
> what? Dead as a dodo.
>
> Recognising I was out of my depth, I recruited an engineer from
> Airtasker. He spent several hours before eliminating one 16Gb DDR5
> stick and the Asus Radeon graphics controller.
>
> The monitor was plugged into the on-board graphics controller and we
> had lift off.
>
> He had fixed ideas about cable layout and snaked a few through the case
> "to improve air flow" with result that I cannot put the side panel on!
>
> I will sort that.
>
> I wanted to install the SSD with Mint 21.3 but the BIOS is not
> recognising the live usb flash drive.
>
> I have written to eBuyer about RAM and the Graphics card. I await their
> reply.
>
> I will test the flash drive in another machine before trying it in
> another socket.
>
> Only been going on since the first week in November.
>
> What I hate most is all my Windows using relatives and friends saying
> "Why don't you just buy a machine?" They don't understand I need a
> challenge. I do it for the aggravation!
>
> I will follow up.
>
> Alan
>
eBuyer replaced the 32Gb DDR5 and the exotic graphics card.
The whole thing runs beautifully.
Only took four months!

> --
> Linux Mint 21.1 kernel version 5.15.0-94-generic Cinnamon 5.6.8
> AMD Phenom II x4 955 CPU 16Gb Dram 2TB Barracuda

On 2/28/24 09:17 AM, pinnerite wrote:
> On Fri, 9 Feb 2024 20:06:07 +0000
> pinnerite <pinnerite@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Evntually, everything except the case and modular power supply went
>> back to eBuyer.
>>
>> On their return and some replacements it was all assembled and guess
>> what? Dead as a dodo.
>>
>> Recognising I was out of my depth, I recruited an engineer from
>> Airtasker. He spent several hours before eliminating one 16Gb DDR5
>> stick and the Asus Radeon graphics controller.
>>
>> The monitor was plugged into the on-board graphics controller and we
>> had lift off.
>>
>> He had fixed ideas about cable layout and snaked a few through the case
>> "to improve air flow" with result that I cannot put the side panel on!
>>
>> I will sort that.
>>
>> I wanted to install the SSD with Mint 21.3 but the BIOS is not
>> recognising the live usb flash drive.
>>
>> I have written to eBuyer about RAM and the Graphics card. I await their
>> reply.
>>
>> I will test the flash drive in another machine before trying it in
>> another socket.
>>
>> Only been going on since the first week in November.
>>
>> What I hate most is all my Windows using relatives and friends saying
>> "Why don't you just buy a machine?" They don't understand I need a
>> challenge. I do it for the aggravation!
>>
>> I will follow up.
>>
>> Alan
>>
>
> eBuyer replaced the 32Gb DDR5 and the exotic graphics card.
> The whole thing runs beautifully.
> Only took four months!
>
>
>> --
>> Linux Mint 21.1 kernel version 5.15.0-94-generic Cinnamon 5.6.8
>> AMD Phenom II x4 955 CPU 16Gb Dram 2TB Barracuda
Now all you need is to change your sig, or update to 21.3 maybe? Or do you need more headache?
--
Linux Mint 21.3 Cinnamon 6.0.4
Al