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interests / rec.games.chess.misc / Re: Evaluate my modest chess variants

SubjectAuthor
* Evaluate my modest chess variantsMats Winther
+* Re: Evaluate my modest chess variantsCSS Dixieland
|`* Re: Evaluate my modest chess variantsMats Winther
| `* Re: Evaluate my modest chess variantsCSS Dixieland
|  `* Re: Evaluate my modest chess variantsEli Kesef
|   `- Re: Evaluate my modest chess variantsCSS Dixieland
`- Re: Evaluate my modest chess variantsQuadibloc

1
Evaluate my modest chess variants

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Subject: Evaluate my modest chess variants
From: malwi...@gmail.com (Mats Winther)
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 by: Mats Winther - Fri, 22 Sep 2023 18:12 UTC

Modest changes to the chess rules may invigorate the game: http://mlwi.magix.net/bg/chess_rule_change.htm

Re: Evaluate my modest chess variants

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Subject: Re: Evaluate my modest chess variants
From: cssdixie...@gmail.com (CSS Dixieland)
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 by: CSS Dixieland - Sat, 23 Sep 2023 06:41 UTC

On Friday 22 September 2023 at 18:12:32 UTC, Mats Winther wrote:
> Modest changes to the chess rules may invigorate the game: http://mlwi.magix.net/bg/chess_rule_change.htm

Excellent ideas, Mister Winther. All of them seem interesting and I know that some players will want to find opponents for experimenting one or another. There have been literally thousands of Chess varieties proposed for our Noble Game, and some hundreds played at least a few times. Including regional or historical varieties that do not derive from the European Chess of the last five hundred years, but from Arab Shatranj, Indian Chaturanga, or related games that are its probable ancestors or descended from a common ancestor. It is a fascinating field for the enthusiast of Chess History.

I invented myself a variety than in its current name I have called Maidens Chess. Before I used the name of Blown Chess, and even earlier, that of Chessdraughts. It is exactly like Standard European Chess but with one rule taken from old varieties of the game of Draughts (not from modern varieties such as International Draughts, where capture is compulsory and blowing or huffing does not exist).

Any chess man except the king who can capture an opponent has a relative obligation of capturing. The obligation is not absolute, a non-capturing move can be made, but in that case the opponent has the option of blowing or huffing (this is, of completely removing from the board) the chessman that could have captured but did not do it. Then the opponent makes his move in the same turn, because blowing huffing is not a move. Blowing huffing, if done, must be done at the immediate turn of play (as also in the case of 'capture en passant'). If moving before blowing huffing, then the opponent forfeits his right for that particular blowing huffing, although another right to blow huff against the same or another chessman may appear later in the game (and it will probably appear, unless at the very end). The kings are exempt from the relative obligation of capturing, and in case of being in check any legal move is valid, without giving to the opponent the right of blowing huffing.

A chessman who can capture two or more opponents is free to choose which one of them will be captured, without any prevalence of ranks (it may be for example a pawn in stead of a queen). When two or more chessmen can capture the same opponent or different opponents, there is also free choice of who will capture whom, and again without any prevalence of ranks. Blowing huffing is optional, and it can be followed by castling, 'capture en passant', or move and promotion of pawn.

The introduction of the simple old Draughts rule of blowing huffing makes the strategy and tactics of Chess TOTALLY DIFFERENT. For example, a queen capable of capturing an opposing pawn (and no other opposing chessman) has a relative obligation of capturing the pawn. The obligation is not absolute, the queen may not capture, but then she is at risk of being blown huffed at the next turn. The opponent can freely choose if blowing huffing the faulty queen or not, or he may simply not notice in time and he may make his move (touch another chessman in stead of the faulty queen), losing the right of blowing huffing the faulty queen for the time being. Another chance may perhaps appear later in the game. At rare times, it is better for a player not to capture, or not to blow huff.

The current name of my variety, Maidens Chess, is inspired on the name of a North African variety of Arab Shatranj described by King Don Alfonso X el Sábio in his book 'Libro de Juegos del Axedrez, Dados y Tablas', where he names as 'Juego de Donzellas' (Game of Damsels, Maidens, Virgins) that blowing huffing variety of Arab Shatranj. It was played at the time in what is today Morocco, Algeria, Tunisia, and perhaps other North African lands, mainly by Ladies of the Nobility or top social class.

Maidens Chess can of course be played using any standard set for European Chess. It has in fact been played on physical board and by Internet, almost always (though not always) with my victory, so that at present I possess the Title of World Champion of Maidens Chess. I have not met many Candidates challenging me, but the few that I have met have not managed to get the Title from me.

As for Your proposals, Mister Winther, all of them have their merit, but the one that attracts me is Your Relocation Chess, briefly explained in Your Web page at http://mlwi.magix.net/bg/relocvar.htm

I also love Random Chess 960, invented by the unforgettable former World Champion of FIDE Mister James Robert Fischer. I frequently play Random Chess 960, in fact I am playing it at Internet servers such as Little Golem, where I am the SECOND strongest player and I am fighting hard to become the first one. At least in that server, located at https://www.littlegolem.net/jsp/game/index.jsp

I cannot use Your software for Relocation Chess, because Zillions of Games only works in Microsoft Windows and I HATE Windows and Microsoft. I work only with Linux or Apple operating systems.

Keep the good work that You are doing, Mister Winther. Receive an Enthusiastic Confederate Salute.

Dixieland for ever !

CSS Dixieland

Re: Evaluate my modest chess variants

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Subject: Re: Evaluate my modest chess variants
From: malwi...@gmail.com (Mats Winther)
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 by: Mats Winther - Sat, 23 Sep 2023 16:15 UTC

On Saturday, September 23, 2023 at 8:41:48 AM UTC+2, CSS Dixieland wrote:
> On Friday 22 September 2023 at 18:12:32 UTC, Mats Winther wrote:
> > Modest changes to the chess rules may invigorate the game: http://mlwi.magix.net/bg/chess_rule_change.htm
> Excellent ideas, Mister Winther. All of them seem interesting and I know that some players will want to find opponents for experimenting one or another. There have been literally thousands of Chess varieties proposed for our Noble Game, and some hundreds played at least a few times. Including regional or historical varieties that do not derive from the European Chess of the last five hundred years, but from Arab Shatranj, Indian Chaturanga, or related games that are its probable ancestors or descended from a common ancestor. It is a fascinating field for the enthusiast of Chess History.
>
> I invented myself a variety than in its current name I have called Maidens Chess. Before I used the name of Blown Chess, and even earlier, that of Chessdraughts. It is exactly like Standard European Chess but with one rule taken from old varieties of the game of Draughts (not from modern varieties such as International Draughts, where capture is compulsory and blowing or huffing does not exist).
>
> Any chess man except the king who can capture an opponent has a relative obligation of capturing. The obligation is not absolute, a non-capturing move can be made, but in that case the opponent has the option of blowing or huffing (this is, of completely removing from the board) the chessman that could have captured but did not do it. Then the opponent makes his move in the same turn, because blowing huffing is not a move. Blowing huffing, if done, must be done at the immediate turn of play (as also in the case of 'capture en passant'). If moving before blowing huffing, then the opponent forfeits his right for that particular blowing huffing, although another right to blow huff against the same or another chessman may appear later in the game (and it will probably appear, unless at the very end). The kings are exempt from the relative obligation of capturing, and in case of being in check any legal move is valid, without giving to the opponent the right of blowing huffing.
>
> A chessman who can capture two or more opponents is free to choose which one of them will be captured, without any prevalence of ranks (it may be for example a pawn in stead of a queen). When two or more chessmen can capture the same opponent or different opponents, there is also free choice of who will capture whom, and again without any prevalence of ranks. Blowing huffing is optional, and it can be followed by castling, 'capture en passant', or move and promotion of pawn.
>
> The introduction of the simple old Draughts rule of blowing huffing makes the strategy and tactics of Chess TOTALLY DIFFERENT. For example, a queen capable of capturing an opposing pawn (and no other opposing chessman) has a relative obligation of capturing the pawn. The obligation is not absolute, the queen may not capture, but then she is at risk of being blown huffed at the next turn. The opponent can freely choose if blowing huffing the faulty queen or not, or he may simply not notice in time and he may make his move (touch another chessman in stead of the faulty queen), losing the right of blowing huffing the faulty queen for the time being. Another chance may perhaps appear later in the game. At rare times, it is better for a player not to capture, or not to blow huff.
>
> The current name of my variety, Maidens Chess, is inspired on the name of a North African variety of Arab Shatranj described by King Don Alfonso X el Sábio in his book 'Libro de Juegos del Axedrez, Dados y Tablas', where he names as 'Juego de Donzellas' (Game of Damsels, Maidens, Virgins) that blowing huffing variety of Arab Shatranj. It was played at the time in what is today Morocco, Algeria, Tunisia, and perhaps other North African lands, mainly by Ladies of the Nobility or top social class.
>
> Maidens Chess can of course be played using any standard set for European Chess. It has in fact been played on physical board and by Internet, almost always (though not always) with my victory, so that at present I possess the Title of World Champion of Maidens Chess. I have not met many Candidates challenging me, but the few that I have met have not managed to get the Title from me.
>
> As for Your proposals, Mister Winther, all of them have their merit, but the one that attracts me is Your Relocation Chess, briefly explained in Your Web page at http://mlwi.magix.net/bg/relocvar.htm
>
> I also love Random Chess 960, invented by the unforgettable former World Champion of FIDE Mister James Robert Fischer. I frequently play Random Chess 960, in fact I am playing it at Internet servers such as Little Golem, where I am the SECOND strongest player and I am fighting hard to become the first one. At least in that server, located at https://www.littlegolem.net/jsp/game/index.jsp
>
> I cannot use Your software for Relocation Chess, because Zillions of Games only works in Microsoft Windows and I HATE Windows and Microsoft. I work only with Linux or Apple operating systems.
>
> Keep the good work that You are doing, Mister Winther. Receive an Enthusiastic Confederate Salute.
>
> Dixieland for ever !
>
> CSS Dixieland

Thank you. I advise you to buy a cheap Windows laptop and use it only for Zillions. It's worth it. Chess960 is fun, but it's not quite serious, in view of the fact that certain positions are awkward. My "Fischer Placement Chess" gives 25 sound Chess960 positions: http://mlwi.magix.net/bg/fischerplacement.htm
The positions can be studied here: http://mlwi.magix.net/bg/fischerplacementpos.htm
"Placement Chess" gives 20 sound positions, a subset of the above: http://mlwi.magix.net/bg/placementchess.htm
The positions can be studied here: http://mlwi.magix.net/bg/placementpos.htm

Re: Evaluate my modest chess variants

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Subject: Re: Evaluate my modest chess variants
From: cssdixie...@gmail.com (CSS Dixieland)
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 by: CSS Dixieland - Sun, 24 Sep 2023 07:21 UTC

On Saturday 23 September 2023 at 16:16:01 UTC, Mats Winther wrote:
> Thank you. I advise you to buy a cheap Windows laptop and use it only for Zillions. It's worth it. Chess960 is fun, but it's not quite serious, in view of the fact that certain positions are awkward. My "Fischer Placement Chess" gives 25 sound Chess960 positions: http://mlwi.magix.net/bg/fischerplacement.htm
> The positions can be studied here: http://mlwi.magix.net/bg/fischerplacementpos.htm
> "Placement Chess" gives 20 sound positions, a subset of the above: http://mlwi.magix.net/bg/placementchess.htm
> The positions can be studied here: http://mlwi.magix.net/bg/placementpos.htm

A big NEVER, Mister Winther. You have not understood that I HATE MICROSOFT WINDOWS DEEPLY. I advise that You install a Linux distribution of Your choice, or You build Your own Linux operating system from scratch, and You throw Windows to the garbage where it belongs. I expected to converse about Chess, not about the War Between Linux and Windows. My position in this War is firmly entrenched and unchangeable, defending to Death the Linux that I love.

Conversation terminated for ever.

Re: Evaluate my modest chess variants

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Subject: Re: Evaluate my modest chess variants
From: nastyhor...@gmail.com (Eli Kesef)
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 by: Eli Kesef - Sun, 24 Sep 2023 12:09 UTC

On Sunday, September 24, 2023 at 10:21:09 AM UTC+3, CSS Dixieland wrote:
> On Saturday 23 September 2023 at 16:16:01 UTC, Mats Winther wrote:
> > Thank you. I advise you to buy a cheap Windows laptop and use it only for Zillions. It's worth it. Chess960 is fun, but it's not quite serious, in view of the fact that certain positions are awkward. My "Fischer Placement Chess" gives 25 sound Chess960 positions: http://mlwi.magix.net/bg/fischerplacement.htm
> > The positions can be studied here: http://mlwi.magix.net/bg/fischerplacementpos.htm
> > "Placement Chess" gives 20 sound positions, a subset of the above: http://mlwi.magix.net/bg/placementchess.htm
> > The positions can be studied here: http://mlwi.magix.net/bg/placementpos.htm
> A big NEVER, Mister Winther. You have not understood that I HATE MICROSOFT WINDOWS DEEPLY. I advise that You install a Linux distribution of Your choice, or You build Your own Linux operating system from scratch, and You throw Windows to the garbage where it belongs. I expected to converse about Chess, not about the War Between Linux and Windows. My position in this War is firmly entrenched and unchangeable, defending to Death the Linux that I love.
>
> Conversation terminated for ever.

Bs"d

Chess goes better with Ubuntu!

https://tinyurl.com/Ubuntu-rocks

Re: Evaluate my modest chess variants

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Subject: Re: Evaluate my modest chess variants
From: cssdixie...@gmail.com (CSS Dixieland)
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 by: CSS Dixieland - Sun, 24 Sep 2023 15:40 UTC

On Sunday 24 September 2023 at 12:09:22 UTC, Eli Kesef wrote:
>
> Chess goes better with Ubuntu
>
> https://tinyurl.com/Ubuntu-rocks

Undoubtedly, Mister Kesef, or with another Linux distribution. For example Knoppix Linux, installable in a flash storage volume separated from the computer, and boot-strappable via Universal Serial Bus. Advanced system with many good features and optional persistence of personal configurations. It includes full instructions in German and in English. Ideal for programmers, not only for game players. Besides executables for Chess or some of its varieties, it offers other engaging games such as Nethack. It also offers a vast array of other software, or it can be easily installed:

http://knopper.net/knoppix/

Re: Evaluate my modest chess variants

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Subject: Re: Evaluate my modest chess variants
From: jsav...@ecn.ab.ca (Quadibloc)
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 by: Quadibloc - Thu, 19 Oct 2023 21:40 UTC

On Friday, September 22, 2023 at 12:12:32 PM UTC-6, Mats Winther wrote:
> Modest changes to the chess rules may invigorate the game: http://mlwi.magix.net/bg/chess_rule_change.htm

These are all very nice and interesting ideas.

I've been thinking about a modest variant with a different aim.
Inspired by reading that a study involving Google's Alpha
showed that abolishing castling would make attacking chess,
rather than defensive chess, optimal...

although at the time I heard of it, I expressed doubt that this
would really 'fix' chess, as, just because a strategy is
optimal doesn't mean that human players can find it in
over-the-board play, so they may end up continuing to play
defensive positional chess even with castling abolished...

has led me to think of a chess variant where players can
castle, but doing so comes with a penalty.

After you castle, any Queens you may have, or obtain in the
future during the game by pawn promotion, become combined
pieces with the move of Bishop+Knight instead of Bishop+Rook.

Note that it's still possible to promote a Pawn to a Rook, and so
one can still obtain a piece that can mate efficiently through pawn
promotion.

In rare positions, of course, since a move is added to the Queen that
it didn't have before, one could even mate by castling, which would
be a cute possibility to look out for.

John Savard

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