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interests / alt.usage.english / Re: help with writing a question - worked time

SubjectAuthor
* help with writing a question - worked timeUserme
+* Re: help with writing a question - worked timeTony Cooper
|+* Re: help with writing a question - worked timeUserme
||`* Re: help with writing a question - worked timeSnidely
|| `* Re: help with writing a question - worked timeUserme
||  +* Re: help with writing a question - worked timePeter Moylan
||  |`- Re: help with writing a question - worked timeUserme
||  `- Re: help with writing a question - worked timeKen Blake
|`- Re: help with writing a question - worked timespains...@gmail.com
`* Re: help with writing a question - worked timePeter T. Daniels
 `- Re: help with writing a question - worked timeUserme

1
help with writing a question - worked time

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Subject: help with writing a question - worked time
From: lezaw...@gmail.com (Userme)
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 by: Userme - Fri, 13 May 2022 20:23 UTC

Hi
I have 3 columns in excel, Name, Start Time, End Time. Like the following

Name ---------- Start Time ---- End Time
Mary Smith --- 7:00 am ---- 2:00 pm

I want to write 2 questions, one is find the total hours worked for each user.
Which is basically EndTime subtracted from StartTime. Then multiple
hours worked by the rate of each user ($15). Is the following question is ok?
How you would write it yourself?
++++++++++++++
Q) Find out total hours worked by each user and also find out total amount
paid for each user?
++++++++++++
Thank you very much

Re: help with writing a question - worked time

<inlt7h180gpf00k70rl02jk21rokoi0b6m@4ax.com>

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From: tonycoop...@gmail.com (Tony Cooper)
Newsgroups: alt.usage.english
Subject: Re: help with writing a question - worked time
Date: Fri, 13 May 2022 18:36:02 -0400
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 by: Tony Cooper - Fri, 13 May 2022 22:36 UTC

On Fri, 13 May 2022 13:23:01 -0700 (PDT), Userme <lezawang@gmail.com>
wrote:

>Hi
>I have 3 columns in excel, Name, Start Time, End Time. Like the following
>
>Name ---------- Start Time ---- End Time
>Mary Smith --- 7:00 am ---- 2:00 pm
>
>I want to write 2 questions, one is find the total hours worked for each user.
>Which is basically EndTime subtracted from StartTime. Then multiple
>hours worked by the rate of each user ($15). Is the following question is ok?
>How you would write it yourself?
>++++++++++++++
>Q) Find out total hours worked by each user and also find out total amount
>paid for each user?
>++++++++++++
>Thank you very much

I don't understand why you are doing it this way. The purpose of
Excel is to put data in columns and to create columns that contain
formulas to perform calculations on that data. The calculations
provide the anwers.

What you are doing above is putting data in three columns and then
asking the students to do mental calculations to determine the number
of hours worked and then to determine the total amount of wages based
on $15 per hour.

You don't need Excel to perform this exercise. The data can be in any
text-based format and the student can do the calculations from that.

What does your exercise contribute to the students ability to work
with Excel?

Using the data as you have provided it is not going to work in Excel
anyway. Excel can't subtract "2:00 PM" from "7:00 AM and arrive at
the hours worked.

You have to convert the times to a 24-hour clock and use 0700 and 1400
for the calculaton. Excel may have a function that automatically
converts this, but I don't work with Excel and don't know if this
function is there.

There is the additonal problem in determining a formula when the
employee works from a PM hour to to an AM hour (2200 to 0600), if
there are employees on that schedule.
--

Tony Cooper - Orlando Florida

I read and post to this group as a form of entertainment.

Re: help with writing a question - worked time

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Subject: Re: help with writing a question - worked time
From: lezaw...@gmail.com (Userme)
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 by: Userme - Fri, 13 May 2022 22:41 UTC

On Friday, May 13, 2022 at 6:36:07 PM UTC-4, Tony Cooper wrote:
> On Fri, 13 May 2022 13:23:01 -0700 (PDT), Userme <leza...@gmail.com>
> wrote:
> >Hi
> >I have 3 columns in excel, Name, Start Time, End Time. Like the following
> >
> >Name ---------- Start Time ---- End Time
> >Mary Smith --- 7:00 am ---- 2:00 pm
> >
> >I want to write 2 questions, one is find the total hours worked for each user.
> >Which is basically EndTime subtracted from StartTime. Then multiple
> >hours worked by the rate of each user ($15). Is the following question is ok?
> >How you would write it yourself?
> >++++++++++++++
> >Q) Find out total hours worked by each user and also find out total amount
> >paid for each user?
> >++++++++++++
> >Thank you very much
> I don't understand why you are doing it this way. The purpose of
> Excel is to put data in columns and to create columns that contain
> formulas to perform calculations on that data. The calculations
> provide the anwers.
>
> What you are doing above is putting data in three columns and then
> asking the students to do mental calculations to determine the number
> of hours worked and then to determine the total amount of wages based
> on $15 per hour.
>
> You don't need Excel to perform this exercise. The data can be in any
> text-based format and the student can do the calculations from that.
>
> What does your exercise contribute to the students ability to work
> with Excel?
>
> Using the data as you have provided it is not going to work in Excel
> anyway. Excel can't subtract "2:00 PM" from "7:00 AM and arrive at
> the hours worked.
>
> You have to convert the times to a 24-hour clock and use 0700 and 1400
> for the calculaton. Excel may have a function that automatically
> converts this, but I don't work with Excel and don't know if this
> function is there.
>
> There is the additonal problem in determining a formula when the
> employee works from a PM hour to to an AM hour (2200 to 0600), if
> there are employees on that schedule.
> --
>
> Tony Cooper - Orlando Florida
>
> I read and post to this group as a form of entertainment.

Thanks again for your help. You are right about Excel and Time. Yes
I agree but I am using Power Query tool which is part of new Excel
which can do these calculation automatically so user would get the
#of worked hours by subtracting the whole column from another
column. So the excercise is to teach how to use the Power Query
Tool. Thank you again.

Re: help with writing a question - worked time

<mn.6c1c7e653c0a64fc.127094@snitoo>

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From: snidely....@gmail.com (Snidely)
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Subject: Re: help with writing a question - worked time
Date: Fri, 13 May 2022 17:32:25 -0700
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 by: Snidely - Sat, 14 May 2022 00:32 UTC

Friday, Userme murmurred ...
> On Friday, May 13, 2022 at 6:36:07 PM UTC-4, Tony Cooper wrote:
>> On Fri, 13 May 2022 13:23:01 -0700 (PDT), Userme <leza...@gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>> Hi
>>> I have 3 columns in excel, Name, Start Time, End Time. Like the following
>>>
>>> Name ---------- Start Time ---- End Time
>>> Mary Smith --- 7:00 am ---- 2:00 pm
>>>
>>> I want to write 2 questions, one is find the total hours worked for each
>>> user. Which is basically EndTime subtracted from StartTime. Then multiple
>>> hours worked by the rate of each user ($15). Is the following question is
>>> ok? How you would write it yourself?
>>> ++++++++++++++
>>> Q) Find out total hours worked by each user and also find out total amount
>>> paid for each user?
>>> ++++++++++++
>>> Thank you very much
>> I don't understand why you are doing it this way. The purpose of
>> Excel is to put data in columns and to create columns that contain
>> formulas to perform calculations on that data. The calculations
>> provide the anwers.
>>
>> What you are doing above is putting data in three columns and then
>> asking the students to do mental calculations to determine the number
>> of hours worked and then to determine the total amount of wages based
>> on $15 per hour.
>>
>> You don't need Excel to perform this exercise. The data can be in any
>> text-based format and the student can do the calculations from that.
>>
>> What does your exercise contribute to the students ability to work
>> with Excel?
>>
>> Using the data as you have provided it is not going to work in Excel
>> anyway. Excel can't subtract "2:00 PM" from "7:00 AM and arrive at
>> the hours worked.
>>
>> You have to convert the times to a 24-hour clock and use 0700 and 1400
>> for the calculaton. Excel may have a function that automatically
>> converts this, but I don't work with Excel and don't know if this
>> function is there.
>>
>> There is the additonal problem in determining a formula when the
>> employee works from a PM hour to to an AM hour (2200 to 0600), if
>> there are employees on that schedule.
>> --
>>
>> Tony Cooper - Orlando Florida
>>
>> I read and post to this group as a form of entertainment.
>
> Thanks again for your help. You are right about Excel and Time. Yes
> I agree but I am using Power Query tool which is part of new Excel
> which can do these calculation automatically so user would get the
> #of worked hours by subtracting the whole column from another
> column. So the excercise is to teach how to use the Power Query
> Tool. Thank you again.

I think time delta functions were already in Excel before that, but for
the example Tony used of someone crossing the midnight boundary, you'd
have to include the date or represent the PM time as a negative AM
time.

However, I'm not an Excel power user, having switched to Python, and I
have no idea (beyond your comment) of what Power Query can do.

/dps

--
"That’s where I end with this kind of conversation: Language is
crucial, and yet not the answer."
Jonathan Rosa, sociocultural and linguistic anthropologist,
Stanford.,2020

Re: help with writing a question - worked time

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Subject: Re: help with writing a question - worked time
From: lezaw...@gmail.com (Userme)
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 by: Userme - Sat, 14 May 2022 00:35 UTC

On Friday, May 13, 2022 at 8:32:32 PM UTC-4, snide...@gmail.com wrote:
> Friday, Userme murmurred ...
> > On Friday, May 13, 2022 at 6:36:07 PM UTC-4, Tony Cooper wrote:
> >> On Fri, 13 May 2022 13:23:01 -0700 (PDT), Userme <leza...@gmail.com>
> >> wrote:
> >>> Hi
> >>> I have 3 columns in excel, Name, Start Time, End Time. Like the following
> >>>
> >>> Name ---------- Start Time ---- End Time
> >>> Mary Smith --- 7:00 am ---- 2:00 pm
> >>>
> >>> I want to write 2 questions, one is find the total hours worked for each
> >>> user. Which is basically EndTime subtracted from StartTime. Then multiple
> >>> hours worked by the rate of each user ($15). Is the following question is
> >>> ok? How you would write it yourself?
> >>> ++++++++++++++
> >>> Q) Find out total hours worked by each user and also find out total amount
> >>> paid for each user?
> >>> ++++++++++++
> >>> Thank you very much
> >> I don't understand why you are doing it this way. The purpose of
> >> Excel is to put data in columns and to create columns that contain
> >> formulas to perform calculations on that data. The calculations
> >> provide the anwers.
> >>
> >> What you are doing above is putting data in three columns and then
> >> asking the students to do mental calculations to determine the number
> >> of hours worked and then to determine the total amount of wages based
> >> on $15 per hour.
> >>
> >> You don't need Excel to perform this exercise. The data can be in any
> >> text-based format and the student can do the calculations from that.
> >>
> >> What does your exercise contribute to the students ability to work
> >> with Excel?
> >>
> >> Using the data as you have provided it is not going to work in Excel
> >> anyway. Excel can't subtract "2:00 PM" from "7:00 AM and arrive at
> >> the hours worked.
> >>
> >> You have to convert the times to a 24-hour clock and use 0700 and 1400
> >> for the calculaton. Excel may have a function that automatically
> >> converts this, but I don't work with Excel and don't know if this
> >> function is there.
> >>
> >> There is the additonal problem in determining a formula when the
> >> employee works from a PM hour to to an AM hour (2200 to 0600), if
> >> there are employees on that schedule.
> >> --
> >>
> >> Tony Cooper - Orlando Florida
> >>
> >> I read and post to this group as a form of entertainment.
> >
> > Thanks again for your help. You are right about Excel and Time. Yes
> > I agree but I am using Power Query tool which is part of new Excel
> > which can do these calculation automatically so user would get the
> > #of worked hours by subtracting the whole column from another
> > column. So the excercise is to teach how to use the Power Query
> > Tool. Thank you again.
> I think time delta functions were already in Excel before that, but for
> the example Tony used of someone crossing the midnight boundary, you'd
> have to include the date or represent the PM time as a negative AM
> time.
>
> However, I'm not an Excel power user, having switched to Python, and I
> have no idea (beyond your comment) of what Power Query can do.
>
> /dps
>
> --
> "That’s where I end with this kind of conversation: Language is
> crucial, and yet not the answer."
> Jonathan Rosa, sociocultural and linguistic anthropologist,
> Stanford.,2020

Thank you for your reply. So is this good question from English point
of view? if not, how you would write it? Thank you
+++++
Q) Find out total hours worked by each user and also find out total amount
paid for each user?

Re: help with writing a question - worked time

<t5n819$nbv$1@dont-email.me>

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Subject: Re: help with writing a question - worked time
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 by: Peter Moylan - Sat, 14 May 2022 03:35 UTC

On 14/05/22 10:35, Userme wrote:

> Thank you for your reply. So is this good question from English
> point of view? if not, how you would write it? Thank you +++++ Q)
> Find out total hours worked by each user and also find out total
> amount paid for each user?

I had trouble, when reading your description, to work out what you meant
by "user".

Is the user someone who is being paid by the hour? If so, you need to
say "worker" or "employee", or something like that, but not "user". And
you need to say "paid TO each employee".

Or is the user someone who is being charged by the hour for the use of
some facility? In that case, it should be "paid BY each user".

--
Peter Moylan Newcastle, NSW http://www.pmoylan.org

Re: help with writing a question - worked time

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Subject: Re: help with writing a question - worked time
From: lezaw...@gmail.com (Userme)
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 by: Userme - Sat, 14 May 2022 04:17 UTC

On Friday, May 13, 2022 at 11:35:09 PM UTC-4, Peter Moylan wrote:
> On 14/05/22 10:35, Userme wrote:
>
> > Thank you for your reply. So is this good question from English
> > point of view? if not, how you would write it? Thank you +++++ Q)
> > Find out total hours worked by each user and also find out total
> > amount paid for each user?
> I had trouble, when reading your description, to work out what you meant
> by "user".
>
> Is the user someone who is being paid by the hour? If so, you need to
> say "worker" or "employee", or something like that, but not "user". And
> you need to say "paid TO each employee".
>
> Or is the user someone who is being charged by the hour for the use of
> some facility? In that case, it should be "paid BY each user".
>
> --
> Peter Moylan Newcastle, NSW http://www.pmoylan.org

I meant Employee. You are right user is not good word here.
Thank you very much for all your help. I appreciate it.

Re: help with writing a question - worked time

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Subject: Re: help with writing a question - worked time
From: gramma...@verizon.net (Peter T. Daniels)
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 by: Peter T. Daniels - Sat, 14 May 2022 13:34 UTC

On Friday, May 13, 2022 at 4:23:04 PM UTC-4, Userme wrote:

> I have 3 columns in excel, Name, Start Time, End Time. Like the following
>
> Name ---------- Start Time ---- End Time
> Mary Smith --- 7:00 am ---- 2:00 pm
>
> I want to write 2 questions, one is find the total hours worked for each user.
> Which is basically EndTime subtracted from StartTime. Then multiple
> hours worked by the rate of each user ($15). Is the following question is ok?
> How you would write it yourself?
> ++++++++++++++
> Q) Find out total hours worked by each user and also find out total amount
> paid for each user?
> ++++++++++++
> Thank you very much

"Determine the number of hours worked by each employee and what each
one is paid for that work."

Stop putting a question mark after an imperative!

Ignore the distractions offered by the posters who ignored the questions
you actually asked.

Re: help with writing a question - worked time

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Subject: Re: help with writing a question - worked time
From: spainsha...@gmail.com (spains...@gmail.com)
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 by: spains...@gmail.com - Sat, 14 May 2022 14:59 UTC

On Friday, May 13, 2022 at 11:36:07 PM UTC+1, Tony Cooper wrote:
> On Fri, 13 May 2022 13:23:01 -0700 (PDT), Userme <leza...@gmail.com>
> wrote:
> >Hi
> >I have 3 columns in excel, Name, Start Time, End Time. Like the following
> >
> >Name ---------- Start Time ---- End Time
> >Mary Smith --- 7:00 am ---- 2:00 pm
> >
> >I want to write 2 questions, one is find the total hours worked for each user.
> >Which is basically EndTime subtracted from StartTime. Then multiple
> >hours worked by the rate of each user ($15). Is the following question is ok?
> >How you would write it yourself?
> >++++++++++++++
> >Q) Find out total hours worked by each user and also find out total amount
> >paid for each user?
> >++++++++++++
> >Thank you very much
> I don't understand why you are doing it this way. The purpose of
> Excel is to put data in columns and to create columns that contain
> formulas to perform calculations on that1900 data. The calculations
> provide the anwers.
>
> What you are doing above is putting data in three columns and then
> asking the students to do mental calculations to determine the number
> of hours worked and then to determine the total amount of wages based
> on $15 per hour.
>
> You don't need Excel to perform this exercise. The data can be in any
> text-based format and the student can do the calculations from that.
>
> What does your exercise contribute to the students ability to work
> with Excel?
>
> Using the data as you have provided it is not going to work in Excel
> anyway. Excel can't subtract "2:00 PM" from "7:00 AM and arrive at
> the hours worked.

Of course it can. Date and Time are all part of the same number (there
is no point in knowing the time unless you also know the date).

You can't go back earlier than January 1st 1900 12.00am.

Re: help with writing a question - worked time

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Subject: Re: help with writing a question - worked time
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 by: Ken Blake - Sat, 14 May 2022 17:40 UTC

On Fri, 13 May 2022 17:35:02 -0700 (PDT), Userme <lezawang@gmail.com>
wrote:

>On Friday, May 13, 2022 at 8:32:32 PM UTC-4, snide...@gmail.com wrote:
>> Friday, Userme murmurred ...
>> > On Friday, May 13, 2022 at 6:36:07 PM UTC-4, Tony Cooper wrote:
>> >> On Fri, 13 May 2022 13:23:01 -0700 (PDT), Userme <leza...@gmail.com>
>> >> wrote:
>> >>> Hi
>> >>> I have 3 columns in excel, Name, Start Time, End Time. Like the following
>> >>>
>> >>> Name ---------- Start Time ---- End Time
>> >>> Mary Smith --- 7:00 am ---- 2:00 pm
>> >>>
>> >>> I want to write 2 questions, one is find the total hours worked for each
>> >>> user. Which is basically EndTime subtracted from StartTime. Then multiple
>> >>> hours worked by the rate of each user ($15). Is the following question is
>> >>> ok? How you would write it yourself?
>> >>> ++++++++++++++
>> >>> Q) Find out total hours worked by each user and also find out total amount
>> >>> paid for each user?
>> >>> ++++++++++++
>> >>> Thank you very much
>> >> I don't understand why you are doing it this way. The purpose of
>> >> Excel is to put data in columns and to create columns that contain
>> >> formulas to perform calculations on that data. The calculations
>> >> provide the anwers.
>> >>
>> >> What you are doing above is putting data in three columns and then
>> >> asking the students to do mental calculations to determine the number
>> >> of hours worked and then to determine the total amount of wages based
>> >> on $15 per hour.
>> >>
>> >> You don't need Excel to perform this exercise. The data can be in any
>> >> text-based format and the student can do the calculations from that.
>> >>
>> >> What does your exercise contribute to the students ability to work
>> >> with Excel?
>> >>
>> >> Using the data as you have provided it is not going to work in Excel
>> >> anyway. Excel can't subtract "2:00 PM" from "7:00 AM and arrive at
>> >> the hours worked.
>> >>
>> >> You have to convert the times to a 24-hour clock and use 0700 and 1400
>> >> for the calculaton. Excel may have a function that automatically
>> >> converts this, but I don't work with Excel and don't know if this
>> >> function is there.
>> >>
>> >> There is the additonal problem in determining a formula when the
>> >> employee works from a PM hour to to an AM hour (2200 to 0600), if
>> >> there are employees on that schedule.
>> >> --
>> >>
>> >> Tony Cooper - Orlando Florida
>> >>
>> >> I read and post to this group as a form of entertainment.
>> >
>> > Thanks again for your help. You are right about Excel and Time. Yes
>> > I agree but I am using Power Query tool which is part of new Excel
>> > which can do these calculation automatically so user would get the
>> > #of worked hours by subtracting the whole column from another
>> > column. So the excercise is to teach how to use the Power Query
>> > Tool. Thank you again.
>> I think time delta functions were already in Excel before that, but for
>> the example Tony used of someone crossing the midnight boundary, you'd
>> have to include the date or represent the PM time as a negative AM
>> time.
>>
>> However, I'm not an Excel power user, having switched to Python, and I
>> have no idea (beyond your comment) of what Power Query can do.
>>
>> /dps
>>
>> --
>> "That’s where I end with this kind of conversation: Language is
>> crucial, and yet not the answer."
>> Jonathan Rosa, sociocultural and linguistic anthropologist,
>> Stanford.,2020
>
>Thank you for your reply. So is this good question from English point
>of view? if not, how you would write it? Thank you
>+++++
>Q) Find out total hours worked by each user and also find out total amount
>paid for each user?

That's a statement, not a question. Better would be something like

Can I find the total hours worked by each user and also the total
amount paid to (by?) each user?

Re: help with writing a question - worked time

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Subject: Re: help with writing a question - worked time
From: lezaw...@gmail.com (Userme)
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 by: Userme - Tue, 17 May 2022 03:19 UTC

On Saturday, May 14, 2022 at 9:34:53 AM UTC-4, Peter T. Daniels wrote:
> On Friday, May 13, 2022 at 4:23:04 PM UTC-4, Userme wrote:
>
> > I have 3 columns in excel, Name, Start Time, End Time. Like the following
> >
> > Name ---------- Start Time ---- End Time
> > Mary Smith --- 7:00 am ---- 2:00 pm
> >
> > I want to write 2 questions, one is find the total hours worked for each user.
> > Which is basically EndTime subtracted from StartTime. Then multiple
> > hours worked by the rate of each user ($15). Is the following question is ok?
> > How you would write it yourself?
> > ++++++++++++++
> > Q) Find out total hours worked by each user and also find out total amount
> > paid for each user?
> > ++++++++++++
> > Thank you very much
> "Determine the number of hours worked by each employee and what each
> one is paid for that work."
>
> Stop putting a question mark after an imperative!
>
> Ignore the distractions offered by the posters who ignored the questions
> you actually asked.

Thank you very much for the help. I appreciate it very much.

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