Rocksolid Light

Welcome to novaBBS (click a section below)

mail  files  register  newsreader  groups  login

Message-ID:  

It is Fortune, not Wisdom, that rules man's life.


interests / alt.usage.english / Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidence

SubjectAuthor
* An interlingual phonetic coincidenceBebercito
+- Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidenceStefan Ram
+* Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidencePeter T. Daniels
|`* Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidenceBebercito
| +- Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidencespains...@gmail.com
| `* Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidencePeter T. Daniels
|  +- Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidenceQuinn C
|  `* Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidenceBebercito
|   +- Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidenceCDB
|   `* Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidenceRoss Clark
|    +* Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidenceBebercito
|    |`* Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidencePeter T. Daniels
|    | `* Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidenceBebercito
|    |  +- Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidencePeter T. Daniels
|    |  `* Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidenceRoss Clark
|    |   +* Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidenceStefan Ram
|    |   |`- Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidenceRoss Clark
|    |   `* Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidenceBebercito
|    |    +- Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidenceBebercito
|    |    `* Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidenceRoss Clark
|    |     `- Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidenceBebercito
|    `* Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidenceSnidely
|     `* Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidenceAthel Cornish-Bowden
|      +* Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidenceKen Blake
|      |`* Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidenceSnidely
|      | +- Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidenceSnidely
|      | +- Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidenceCDB
|      | +* Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidencePeter T. Daniels
|      | |`* Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidenceAdam Funk
|      | | `- Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidencePeter T. Daniels
|      | `* Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidenceQuinn C
|      |  +* Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidencelar3ryca
|      |  |`- Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidenceStefan Ram
|      |  `- Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidencelar3ryca
|      `* Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidenceHibou
|       +* Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidencePeter Moylan
|       |`* Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidenceHibou
|       | +* Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidencePeter Moylan
|       | |+* Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidenceHibou
|       | ||+* Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidencePeter Moylan
|       | |||`- Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidenceDingbat
|       | ||`- Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidenceKerr-Mudd, John
|       | |`* Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidenceKen Blake
|       | | +* Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidencecharles
|       | | |+* Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidenceKen Blake
|       | | ||+- Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidencecharles
|       | | ||`* Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidencePeter Moylan
|       | | || `* Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidenceKen Blake
|       | | ||  +* Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidenceLewis
|       | | ||  |`- Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidencePeter Moylan
|       | | ||  `* Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidenceQuinn C
|       | | ||   `* Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidenceKen Blake
|       | | ||    +- Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidencePeter T. Daniels
|       | | ||    `- Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidenceKerr-Mudd, John
|       | | |+* Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidencelar3ryca
|       | | ||+* Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidenceTony Cooper
|       | | |||+- Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidenceGordonD
|       | | |||`- Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidencePeter T. Daniels
|       | | ||+* Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidenceSam Plusnet
|       | | |||`* Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidencelar3ryca
|       | | ||| `* Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidenceSam Plusnet
|       | | |||  `- Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidencelar3ryca
|       | | ||`* Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidencePaul Wolff
|       | | || `* Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidenceJoy Beeson
|       | | ||  `* Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidenceSam Plusnet
|       | | ||   +* Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidenceStefan Ram
|       | | ||   |`* Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidenceRichard Heathfield
|       | | ||   | `- Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidenceSam Plusnet
|       | | ||   `* Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidenceJanet
|       | | ||    `- Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidenceMack A. Damia
|       | | |`- Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidencePeter T. Daniels
|       | | `* Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidencePaul Wolff
|       | |  +- Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidenceTony Cooper
|       | |  `* Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidencePeter Moylan
|       | |   +- Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidencelar3ryca
|       | |   +* Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidencelar3ryca
|       | |   |+* Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidencePeter T. Daniels
|       | |   ||`- Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidencePeter Moylan
|       | |   |`* Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidenceSnidely
|       | |   | `* Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidencelar3ryca
|       | |   |  +* Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidencePeter Moylan
|       | |   |  |`* Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidenceAnders D. Nygaard
|       | |   |  | `* Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidenceMark Brader
|       | |   |  |  `* Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidenceQuinn C
|       | |   |  |   `* Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidenceBebercito
|       | |   |  |    `- Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidenceQuinn C
|       | |   |  `* Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidenceMark Brader
|       | |   |   `* Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidenceTony Cooper
|       | |   |    +* Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidencebil...@shaw.ca
|       | |   |    |+* Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidencePeter T. Daniels
|       | |   |    ||`* Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidenceJerry Friedman
|       | |   |    || +- Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidencePeter Moylan
|       | |   |    || `- Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidenceMadhu
|       | |   |    |`- Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidenceKen Blake
|       | |   |    `- Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidenceAthel Cornish-Bowden
|       | |   `* Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidencebil...@shaw.ca
|       | |    +* Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidenceKerr-Mudd, John
|       | |    |+* Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidencePeter Moylan
|       | |    ||+* Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidenceKen Blake
|       | |    |||`* Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidencePeter Moylan
|       | |    ||| `- Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidenceSilvano
|       | |    ||`- Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidenceStoat
|       | |    |+- Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidenceQuinn C
|       | |    |+- Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidenceSam Plusnet
|       | |    |`* Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidencecharles
|       | |    `* Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidenceJerry Friedman
|       | `* Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidenceTony Cooper
|       +* Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidencePeter T. Daniels
|       `* Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidenceSnidely
`* Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidenceDingbat

Pages:12345678910111213141516171819202122232425262728
Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidence

<t5p5nd$17p$1@dont-email.me>

 copy mid

https://www.novabbs.com/interests/article-flat.php?id=130961&group=alt.usage.english#130961

 copy link   Newsgroups: alt.usage.english
Path: i2pn2.org!i2pn.org!eternal-september.org!reader02.eternal-september.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail
From: lar...@invalid.ca (lar3ryca)
Newsgroups: alt.usage.english
Subject: Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidence
Date: Sat, 14 May 2022 15:07:56 -0600
Organization: A noiseless patient Spider
Lines: 21
Message-ID: <t5p5nd$17p$1@dont-email.me>
References: <0c47be90-5c9c-4fd1-884e-ac7a3edcb2e3n@googlegroups.com>
<407bad16-686c-4349-8a66-a74f8b2d5aa6n@googlegroups.com>
<bfd6082c-eea4-4490-b177-4fe6db591822n@googlegroups.com>
<t5mjd6$3si$1@dont-email.me>
<884a0ef7-6fa7-420c-93fc-faad0346f83an@googlegroups.com>
<1pryhp9.12xl23p9bb8aeN%nospam@de-ster.demon.nl>
<8c30aa1c-2857-4ab5-a97f-f9fe33385656n@googlegroups.com>
<pi108h519bseu5lhca4r35btd5fb6banh7@4ax.com> <t5p1a1$26n$1@dont-email.me>
<89b89aac-dec7-4fea-abd0-c2927597e84en@googlegroups.com>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
Injection-Date: Sat, 14 May 2022 21:07:57 -0000 (UTC)
Injection-Info: reader02.eternal-september.org; posting-host="d3ec7768b0afdd85817fda5f259ab2af";
logging-data="1273"; mail-complaints-to="abuse@eternal-september.org"; posting-account="U2FsdGVkX1/TDioqMoejJFA7B9v2cYHzZrow+8CIhvQ="
User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:91.0) Gecko/20100101
Thunderbird/91.8.1
Cancel-Lock: sha1:o31zAOPwlq98flR35obgbp1Fy+4=
In-Reply-To: <89b89aac-dec7-4fea-abd0-c2927597e84en@googlegroups.com>
Content-Language: en-CA
 by: lar3ryca - Sat, 14 May 2022 21:07 UTC

On 2022-05-14 14:34, Bebercito wrote:
> Le samedi 14 mai 2022 à 21:52:37 UTC+2, lar3ryca a écrit :
>> On 2022-05-14 13:45, Ruud Harmsen wrote:
>>> Sat, 14 May 2022 12:10:36 -0700 (PDT): "Peter T. Daniels"
>>> <gram...@verizon.net> scribeva:
>>>
>>>> Useful would be information as to whether Du. "duur" also has the other
>>>> meaning of the English, Russian, French, and (marginally) German words
>>>> that have been mentioned.
>>>
>>> Dutch duur mean expensive, costly, not dear.
>> Hmmm... since 'dear' (in English), is a synonym of 'costly' and
>> 'expensive', doesn't that mean that 'duur' is also a synonym of 'dear'?
>
> No, the implication is "expensive" as opposed to "dear" meaning
> "cherished".

But 'cherished' is only one definition of the word 'dear' in English. It
also means expensive or costly.

Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidence

<8o608h9jupu7ehf1dgsrambdk8d3obtqlc@4ax.com>

 copy mid

https://www.novabbs.com/interests/article-flat.php?id=130964&group=alt.usage.english#130964

 copy link   Newsgroups: alt.usage.english
Path: i2pn2.org!i2pn.org!weretis.net!feeder8.news.weretis.net!3.eu.feeder.erje.net!feeder.erje.net!fu-berlin.de!uni-berlin.de!individual.net!not-for-mail
From: Ken...@invalid.news.com (Ken Blake)
Newsgroups: alt.usage.english
Subject: Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidence
Date: Sat, 14 May 2022 14:13:01 -0700
Lines: 39
Message-ID: <8o608h9jupu7ehf1dgsrambdk8d3obtqlc@4ax.com>
References: <407bad16-686c-4349-8a66-a74f8b2d5aa6n@googlegroups.com> <bfd6082c-eea4-4490-b177-4fe6db591822n@googlegroups.com> <t5mjd6$3si$1@dont-email.me> <884a0ef7-6fa7-420c-93fc-faad0346f83an@googlegroups.com> <1pryhp9.12xl23p9bb8aeN%nospam@de-ster.demon.nl> <8c30aa1c-2857-4ab5-a97f-f9fe33385656n@googlegroups.com> <pi108h519bseu5lhca4r35btd5fb6banh7@4ax.com> <t5p1a1$26n$1@dont-email.me> <89b89aac-dec7-4fea-abd0-c2927597e84en@googlegroups.com> <t5p5nd$17p$1@dont-email.me>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
X-Trace: individual.net Skb/XtBP0P63WZqbiOuLqgxAQ1ge/DYdEsqAHOEfHGFr0vxi9z
Cancel-Lock: sha1:XLPvrkfxEaoWUPkAzEcXo3gkr9M=
X-Newsreader: Forte Agent 6.00/32.1186
 by: Ken Blake - Sat, 14 May 2022 21:13 UTC

On Sat, 14 May 2022 15:07:56 -0600, lar3ryca <larry@invalid.ca> wrote:

>On 2022-05-14 14:34, Bebercito wrote:
>> Le samedi 14 mai 2022 à 21:52:37 UTC+2, lar3ryca a écrit :
>>> On 2022-05-14 13:45, Ruud Harmsen wrote:
>>>> Sat, 14 May 2022 12:10:36 -0700 (PDT): "Peter T. Daniels"
>>>> <gram...@verizon.net> scribeva:
>>>>
>>>>> Useful would be information as to whether Du. "duur" also has the other
>>>>> meaning of the English, Russian, French, and (marginally) German words
>>>>> that have been mentioned.
>>>>
>>>> Dutch duur mean expensive, costly, not dear.
>>> Hmmm... since 'dear' (in English), is a synonym of 'costly' and
>>> 'expensive', doesn't that mean that 'duur' is also a synonym of 'dear'?
>>
>> No, the implication is "expensive" as opposed to "dear" meaning
>> "cherished".
>
>But 'cherished' is only one definition of the word 'dear' in English. It
>also means expensive or costly.

For some reason, I am reminded of

I hold your hand in mine, dear
I press it to my lips
I take a healthy bite from
Your dainty fingertips

My joy would be complete, dear
If you were only here
But still I keep your hand
As a precious souvenir

Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidence

<1pryvzx.w6byx3fd4y5pN%nospam@de-ster.demon.nl>

 copy mid

https://www.novabbs.com/interests/article-flat.php?id=130965&group=alt.usage.english#130965

 copy link   Newsgroups: alt.usage.english
Path: i2pn2.org!i2pn.org!eternal-september.org!reader02.eternal-september.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail
From: nos...@de-ster.demon.nl (J. J. Lodder)
Newsgroups: alt.usage.english
Subject: Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidence
Date: Sat, 14 May 2022 23:16:00 +0200
Organization: De Ster
Lines: 50
Message-ID: <1pryvzx.w6byx3fd4y5pN%nospam@de-ster.demon.nl>
References: <0c47be90-5c9c-4fd1-884e-ac7a3edcb2e3n@googlegroups.com> <407bad16-686c-4349-8a66-a74f8b2d5aa6n@googlegroups.com> <bfd6082c-eea4-4490-b177-4fe6db591822n@googlegroups.com> <t5mjd6$3si$1@dont-email.me> <884a0ef7-6fa7-420c-93fc-faad0346f83an@googlegroups.com> <1pryhp9.12xl23p9bb8aeN%nospam@de-ster.demon.nl> <8c30aa1c-2857-4ab5-a97f-f9fe33385656n@googlegroups.com>
Reply-To: jjlax32@xs4all.nl (J. J. Lodder)
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
Injection-Info: reader02.eternal-september.org; posting-host="74f92b8e5ae62cf9e8203ef7c2fd327e";
logging-data="4849"; mail-complaints-to="abuse@eternal-september.org"; posting-account="U2FsdGVkX1+JDOZ221wnegrRED/Lzg7QRrafRClbXuY="
User-Agent: MacSOUP/2.8.5 (ea919cf118) (Mac OS 10.10.5)
Cancel-Lock: sha1:PV/iFmRdIBlQqdEHN7TQnlJhD+8=
 by: J. J. Lodder - Sat, 14 May 2022 21:16 UTC

Peter T. Daniels <grammatim@verizon.net> wrote:

> On Saturday, May 14, 2022 at 1:53:49 PM UTC-4, J. J. Lodder wrote:
> > Peter T. Daniels <gram...@verizon.net> wrote:
> > > On Friday, May 13, 2022 at 5:43:06 PM UTC-4, benl...@ihug.co.nz wrote:
> > > > On 14/05/2022 2:36 a.m., Peter T. Daniels wrote:
> > > > > On Friday, May 13, 2022 at 1:08:22 AM UTC-4, Dingbat wrote:
> > > > >> On Monday, May 9, 2022 at 7:22:46 AM UTC-7, Bebercito wrote:
>
> > > > >>> Two French words, "charretière" and "jarretière" phonetically differ
> > > > >>> only by their first consonants being respectively the unvoiced
> > > > >>> and voiced forms of the same consonant, i.e [?] and [?].
> > > > >>> Now, the English counterparts of those two words, "carter" and
> > > > >>> "garter", have the same trait with different first consonants,
> > > > >>> i.e [k] and [g], where the former is the unvoiced form of the
> > > > >>> latter.
> > > > >>> Isn't that weird?
> > > > >> Not if they came from those French words.
> > > > >> This is a curious coincidence:
> > > > >> English DEAR and Russian DOROGOY have the same two meanings:
> > > > >> 1) Beloved
> > > > >> 2) Expensive
> > > > > French CHER as well. It's beginning to look non-coincidental, no?
> > > > Indeed. The English seems to be two directions of development from an
> > > > original meaning something like "precious, valuable, worthy". I feel
> > > > them as quite separate now; I knew the "beloved" one from childhood, but
> > > > only encountered the "expensive" one in adolescence from British sources
> > > > (spoken and written), and found it surprising.
> > > Interesting. It was my grandmother's (b. 1891, Brooklyn) regular
> > > word for 'expensive'.
> >
> > If Brooklyn from Dutch 'duur', perhaps,
>
> Uh, no.

Usages may last,

Jan

> Dutch was very long dead by the time her ancestors (probably her parents,
> but we don't know) iommigrated from Eastern Europe (perhaps in the 1850s,
> as we recently learned of her husband's, our grandfather). She seems to have
> grown up, an orphan, in Rockland County, NY. (Her two older sisters were
> sent to an orphanage in Fall River, Massachusetts. They had an older brother.
> We do not know how or when he ended up in Memphis, Tennessee.)
>
> Useful would be information as to whether Du. "duur" also has the other
> meaning of the English, Russian, French, and (marginally) German words
> that have been mentioned.

Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidence

<36948dd8-b540-45d8-80be-c0413b3ecc53n@googlegroups.com>

 copy mid

https://www.novabbs.com/interests/article-flat.php?id=130969&group=alt.usage.english#130969

 copy link   Newsgroups: alt.usage.english
X-Received: by 2002:a05:622a:1195:b0:2f3:b8bf:46ab with SMTP id m21-20020a05622a119500b002f3b8bf46abmr9992826qtk.190.1652563686991;
Sat, 14 May 2022 14:28:06 -0700 (PDT)
X-Received: by 2002:a25:4944:0:b0:648:a796:a2 with SMTP id w65-20020a254944000000b00648a79600a2mr11729029yba.123.1652563686784;
Sat, 14 May 2022 14:28:06 -0700 (PDT)
Path: i2pn2.org!i2pn.org!usenet.blueworldhosting.com!feed1.usenet.blueworldhosting.com!peer01.iad!feed-me.highwinds-media.com!news.highwinds-media.com!news-out.google.com!nntp.google.com!postnews.google.com!google-groups.googlegroups.com!not-for-mail
Newsgroups: alt.usage.english
Date: Sat, 14 May 2022 14:28:06 -0700 (PDT)
In-Reply-To: <t5p1a1$26n$1@dont-email.me>
Injection-Info: google-groups.googlegroups.com; posting-host=100.8.211.134; posting-account=tXYReAoAAABbl0njRzivyU02EBLaX9OF
NNTP-Posting-Host: 100.8.211.134
References: <0c47be90-5c9c-4fd1-884e-ac7a3edcb2e3n@googlegroups.com>
<407bad16-686c-4349-8a66-a74f8b2d5aa6n@googlegroups.com> <bfd6082c-eea4-4490-b177-4fe6db591822n@googlegroups.com>
<t5mjd6$3si$1@dont-email.me> <884a0ef7-6fa7-420c-93fc-faad0346f83an@googlegroups.com>
<1pryhp9.12xl23p9bb8aeN%nospam@de-ster.demon.nl> <8c30aa1c-2857-4ab5-a97f-f9fe33385656n@googlegroups.com>
<pi108h519bseu5lhca4r35btd5fb6banh7@4ax.com> <t5p1a1$26n$1@dont-email.me>
User-Agent: G2/1.0
MIME-Version: 1.0
Message-ID: <36948dd8-b540-45d8-80be-c0413b3ecc53n@googlegroups.com>
Subject: Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidence
From: gramma...@verizon.net (Peter T. Daniels)
Injection-Date: Sat, 14 May 2022 21:28:06 +0000
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
X-Received-Bytes: 2374
 by: Peter T. Daniels - Sat, 14 May 2022 21:28 UTC

On Saturday, May 14, 2022 at 3:52:37 PM UTC-4, lar3ryca wrote:
> On 2022-05-14 13:45, Ruud Harmsen wrote:
> > Sat, 14 May 2022 12:10:36 -0700 (PDT): "Peter T. Daniels"
> > <gram...@verizon.net> scribeva:

> >> Useful would be information as to whether Du. "duur" also has the other
> >> meaning of the English, Russian, French, and (marginally) German words
> >> that have been mentioned.
> > Dutch duur mean expensive, costly, not dear.
>
> Hmmm... since 'dear' (in English), is a synonym of 'costly' and
> 'expensive', doesn't that mean that 'duur' is also a synonym of 'dear'?

And that's why newbies should not parachute into discussions without
having read what led up to any particular message.

> > But we also have dierbaar, which means dear, close to someone's heart.
> > They are indeed related: https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/dierbaar

Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidence

<t5pfnu$pjc$1@dont-email.me>

 copy mid

https://www.novabbs.com/interests/article-flat.php?id=130987&group=alt.usage.english#130987

 copy link   Newsgroups: alt.usage.english
Path: i2pn2.org!i2pn.org!eternal-september.org!reader02.eternal-september.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail
From: pet...@pmoylan.org.invalid (Peter Moylan)
Newsgroups: alt.usage.english
Subject: Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidence
Date: Sun, 15 May 2022 09:58:54 +1000
Organization: A noiseless patient Spider
Lines: 27
Message-ID: <t5pfnu$pjc$1@dont-email.me>
References: <0c47be90-5c9c-4fd1-884e-ac7a3edcb2e3n@googlegroups.com>
<407bad16-686c-4349-8a66-a74f8b2d5aa6n@googlegroups.com>
<bfd6082c-eea4-4490-b177-4fe6db591822n@googlegroups.com>
<t5mjd6$3si$1@dont-email.me>
<884a0ef7-6fa7-420c-93fc-faad0346f83an@googlegroups.com>
<1pryhp9.12xl23p9bb8aeN%nospam@de-ster.demon.nl>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Injection-Date: Sat, 14 May 2022 23:58:55 -0000 (UTC)
Injection-Info: reader02.eternal-september.org; posting-host="703a2f8ed92cd3ba926037d6d6bde969";
logging-data="26220"; mail-complaints-to="abuse@eternal-september.org"; posting-account="U2FsdGVkX1+16OmLib54P+N1wYLWiZx9"
User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (OS/2; Warp 4.5; rv:38.0) Gecko/20100101
Thunderbird/38.8.0
Cancel-Lock: sha1:YCwXeaYM0d+kBw1QQJWeqzW9kVw=
In-Reply-To: <1pryhp9.12xl23p9bb8aeN%nospam@de-ster.demon.nl>
 by: Peter Moylan - Sat, 14 May 2022 23:58 UTC

On 15/05/22 03:53, J. J. Lodder wrote:
> Peter T. Daniels <grammatim@verizon.net> wrote:
>> On Friday, May 13, 2022 at 5:43:06 PM UTC-4, benl...@ihug.co.nz wrote:
>>> On 14/05/2022 2:36 a.m., Peter T. Daniels wrote:
>>>> On Friday, May 13, 2022 at 1:08:22 AM UTC-4, Dingbat wrote:

>>>>> English DEAR and Russian DOROGOY have the same two meanings:
>>>>> 1) Beloved
>>>>> 2) Expensive
>>>> French CHER as well. It's beginning to look non-coincidental, no?
>>>
>>> Indeed. The English seems to be two directions of development from an
>>> original meaning something like "precious, valuable, worthy". I feel
>>> them as quite separate now; I knew the "beloved" one from childhood, but
>>> only encountered the "expensive" one in adolescence from British sources
>>> (spoken and written), and found it surprising.
>>
>> Interesting. It was my grandmother's (b. 1891, Brooklyn) regular
>> word for 'expensive'.
>
> If Brooklyn from Dutch 'duur', perhaps,

Unlikely, because dear=expensive can be found all over the
English-speaking world, and most of us have never been to Brooklyn.

--
Peter Moylan Newcastle, NSW http://www.pmoylan.org

Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidence

<t5q33b$15dc$1@gioia.aioe.org>

 copy mid

https://www.novabbs.com/interests/article-flat.php?id=131003&group=alt.usage.english#131003

 copy link   Newsgroups: alt.usage.english
Path: i2pn2.org!i2pn.org!aioe.org!GoYh/JQ/kANReHhDebHIGg.user.46.165.242.75.POSTED!not-for-mail
From: h.i...@b.ou (Hibou)
Newsgroups: alt.usage.english
Subject: Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidence
Date: Sun, 15 May 2022 06:29:14 +0100
Organization: Aioe.org NNTP Server
Message-ID: <t5q33b$15dc$1@gioia.aioe.org>
References: <0c47be90-5c9c-4fd1-884e-ac7a3edcb2e3n@googlegroups.com>
<4c01fefc-de7f-4031-a550-251a37425177n@googlegroups.com>
<ed095e27-d963-4af9-a08f-6970b9137793n@googlegroups.com>
<b83d050c-046d-48c7-9ff5-23414691ba62n@googlegroups.com>
<c81698c1-6ff8-4d99-919e-30231c3af695n@googlegroups.com>
<t5g7kh$rje$1@dont-email.me> <mn.5c527e65b71faa84.127094@snitoo>
<je3rh8Fn132U1@mid.individual.net>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
Injection-Info: gioia.aioe.org; logging-data="38316"; posting-host="GoYh/JQ/kANReHhDebHIGg.user.gioia.aioe.org"; mail-complaints-to="abuse@aioe.org";
User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:91.0) Gecko/20100101
Thunderbird/91.8.1
X-Notice: Filtered by postfilter v. 0.9.2
Content-Language: en-GB
 by: Hibou - Sun, 15 May 2022 05:29 UTC

Le 12/05/2022 à 08:32, Athel Cornish-Bowden a écrit :
>
> There are considerable variations even between British and American
> English. Words relating to cars (boot/trunk ...) and babies
> (diaper/nappy ...) are often different; words in other contexts are
> usually the same.

There are certainly a lot of differences in transport-transportation:
lorry-truck, pavement-sidewalk, give-way-yield, underground-subway,
subway-?, railway-station-train-station, points-switch,
engine-driver-engineer.... In other fields too: biscuit-cookie,
post-mail, bill-check, flat-apartment, torch-flashlight, coffin-casket,
crisps-chips, rubbish-garbage, angry-mad....

It doesn't stop with vocabulary, though. Formal English and formal
American are often very close, barring the odd spelling difference; but
in everyday speech it seems there's hardly a sentence that is the same
in Eastpondia and Westpondia. Take verb use, for instance: I've eaten vs
I ate already etc.. Or the question "How are you?", to which the answer
is either an adverb ("Fine") or an adjective ("Good").

Is a language a dialect with an army? I'm inclined to say it's the
expression of, and the vehicle for, a culture, and Britain and America
have quite different cultures.

Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidence

<t5q5hh$g24$1@dont-email.me>

 copy mid

https://www.novabbs.com/interests/article-flat.php?id=131006&group=alt.usage.english#131006

 copy link   Newsgroups: alt.usage.english
Path: i2pn2.org!i2pn.org!eternal-september.org!reader02.eternal-september.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail
From: pet...@pmoylan.org.invalid (Peter Moylan)
Newsgroups: alt.usage.english
Subject: Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidence
Date: Sun, 15 May 2022 16:10:54 +1000
Organization: A noiseless patient Spider
Lines: 32
Message-ID: <t5q5hh$g24$1@dont-email.me>
References: <0c47be90-5c9c-4fd1-884e-ac7a3edcb2e3n@googlegroups.com>
<4c01fefc-de7f-4031-a550-251a37425177n@googlegroups.com>
<ed095e27-d963-4af9-a08f-6970b9137793n@googlegroups.com>
<b83d050c-046d-48c7-9ff5-23414691ba62n@googlegroups.com>
<c81698c1-6ff8-4d99-919e-30231c3af695n@googlegroups.com>
<t5g7kh$rje$1@dont-email.me> <mn.5c527e65b71faa84.127094@snitoo>
<je3rh8Fn132U1@mid.individual.net> <t5q33b$15dc$1@gioia.aioe.org>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
Injection-Date: Sun, 15 May 2022 06:10:57 -0000 (UTC)
Injection-Info: reader02.eternal-september.org; posting-host="703a2f8ed92cd3ba926037d6d6bde969";
logging-data="16452"; mail-complaints-to="abuse@eternal-september.org"; posting-account="U2FsdGVkX19qYTY0DzLY2/iltIQI5/5X"
User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (OS/2; Warp 4.5; rv:38.0) Gecko/20100101
Thunderbird/38.8.0
Cancel-Lock: sha1:lm6MNggGE/tkRT9/AMicyOfMdf8=
In-Reply-To: <t5q33b$15dc$1@gioia.aioe.org>
 by: Peter Moylan - Sun, 15 May 2022 06:10 UTC

On 15/05/22 15:29, Hibou wrote:
> Le 12/05/2022 à 08:32, Athel Cornish-Bowden a écrit :
>>
>> There are considerable variations even between British and American
>> English. Words relating to cars (boot/trunk ...) and babies
>> (diaper/nappy ...) are often different; words in other contexts are
>> usually the same.
>
> There are certainly a lot of differences in transport-transportation:
> lorry-truck, pavement-sidewalk, give-way-yield, underground-subway,
> subway-?

Underpass, I think. Or possibly tunnel.

, railway-station-train-station, points-switch,
> engine-driver-engineer.... In other fields too: biscuit-cookie,
> post-mail, bill-check, flat-apartment, torch-flashlight, coffin-casket,
> crisps-chips, rubbish-garbage, angry-mad....
>
> It doesn't stop with vocabulary, though. Formal English and formal
> American are often very close, barring the odd spelling difference; but
> in everyday speech it seems there's hardly a sentence that is the same
> in Eastpondia and Westpondia. Take verb use, for instance: I've eaten vs
> I ate already etc.. Or the question "How are you?", to which the answer
> is either an adverb ("Fine") or an adjective ("Good").
>
> Is a language a dialect with an army? I'm inclined to say it's the
> expression of, and the vehicle for, a culture, and Britain and America
> have quite different cultures.

--
Peter Moylan Newcastle, NSW http://www.pmoylan.org

Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidence

<9faea7b7-e622-4e82-b545-d46e7c4b2721n@googlegroups.com>

 copy mid

https://www.novabbs.com/interests/article-flat.php?id=131007&group=alt.usage.english#131007

 copy link   Newsgroups: alt.usage.english
X-Received: by 2002:a05:622a:188a:b0:2f3:f4a8:ac9b with SMTP id v10-20020a05622a188a00b002f3f4a8ac9bmr10996511qtc.396.1652598097068;
Sun, 15 May 2022 00:01:37 -0700 (PDT)
X-Received: by 2002:a25:4944:0:b0:648:a796:a2 with SMTP id w65-20020a254944000000b00648a79600a2mr12993138yba.123.1652598096853;
Sun, 15 May 2022 00:01:36 -0700 (PDT)
Path: i2pn2.org!i2pn.org!weretis.net!feeder8.news.weretis.net!proxad.net!feeder1-2.proxad.net!209.85.160.216.MISMATCH!news-out.google.com!nntp.google.com!postnews.google.com!google-groups.googlegroups.com!not-for-mail
Newsgroups: alt.usage.english
Date: Sun, 15 May 2022 00:01:36 -0700 (PDT)
In-Reply-To: <8c30aa1c-2857-4ab5-a97f-f9fe33385656n@googlegroups.com>
Injection-Info: google-groups.googlegroups.com; posting-host=220.225.126.138; posting-account=7i9CYgkAAAD0b2D1lL-NyeNZeE4r5Wir
NNTP-Posting-Host: 220.225.126.138
References: <0c47be90-5c9c-4fd1-884e-ac7a3edcb2e3n@googlegroups.com>
<407bad16-686c-4349-8a66-a74f8b2d5aa6n@googlegroups.com> <bfd6082c-eea4-4490-b177-4fe6db591822n@googlegroups.com>
<t5mjd6$3si$1@dont-email.me> <884a0ef7-6fa7-420c-93fc-faad0346f83an@googlegroups.com>
<1pryhp9.12xl23p9bb8aeN%nospam@de-ster.demon.nl> <8c30aa1c-2857-4ab5-a97f-f9fe33385656n@googlegroups.com>
User-Agent: G2/1.0
MIME-Version: 1.0
Message-ID: <9faea7b7-e622-4e82-b545-d46e7c4b2721n@googlegroups.com>
Subject: Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidence
From: ranjit_m...@yahoo.com (Dingbat)
Injection-Date: Sun, 15 May 2022 07:01:37 +0000
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
 by: Dingbat - Sun, 15 May 2022 07:01 UTC

On Saturday, May 14, 2022 at 12:10:39 PM UTC-7, Peter T. Daniels wrote:
> On Saturday, May 14, 2022 at 1:53:49 PM UTC-4, J. J. Lodder wrote:
> > Peter T. Daniels <gram...@verizon.net> wrote:
> > > On Friday, May 13, 2022 at 5:43:06 PM UTC-4, benl...@ihug.co.nz wrote:
> > > > On 14/05/2022 2:36 a.m., Peter T. Daniels wrote:
> > > > > On Friday, May 13, 2022 at 1:08:22 AM UTC-4, Dingbat wrote:
> > > > >> On Monday, May 9, 2022 at 7:22:46 AM UTC-7, Bebercito wrote:
>
> > > > >>> Two French words, "charretière" and "jarretière" phonetically differ
> > > > >>> only by their first consonants being respectively the unvoiced
> > > > >>> and voiced forms of the same consonant, i.e [?] and [?].
> > > > >>> Now, the English counterparts of those two words, "carter" and
> > > > >>> "garter", have the same trait with different first consonants, i.e [k]
> > > > >>> and [g], where the former is the unvoiced form of the latter.
> > > > >>> Isn't that weird?
> > > > >> Not if they came from those French words.
> > > > >> This is a curious coincidence:
> > > > >> English DEAR and Russian DOROGOY have the same two meanings:
> > > > >> 1) Beloved
> > > > >> 2) Expensive
> > > > > French CHER as well. It's beginning to look non-coincidental, no?
> > > > Indeed. The English seems to be two directions of development from an
> > > > original meaning something like "precious, valuable, worthy". I feel
> > > > them as quite separate now; I knew the "beloved" one from childhood, but
> > > > only encountered the "expensive" one in adolescence from British sources
> > > > (spoken and written), and found it surprising.
> > > Interesting. It was my grandmother's (b. 1891, Brooklyn) regular
> > > word for 'expensive'.
> >
> > If Brooklyn from Dutch 'duur', perhaps,
> Uh, no.
>
> Dutch was very long dead by the time her ancestors (probably her parents,
> but we don't know) iommigrated from Eastern Europe (perhaps in the 1850s,
> as we recently learned of her husband's, our grandfather). She seems to have
> grown up, an orphan, in Rockland County, NY. (Her two older sisters were
> sent to an orphanage in Fall River, Massachusetts. They had an older brother.
> We do not know how or when he ended up in Memphis, Tennessee.)
>
> Useful would be information as to whether Du. "duur" also has the other
> meaning of the English, Russian, French, and (marginally) German words
> that have been mentioned.

My Malayalam speaking paternal grandmother spoke little English
but used cypher to mean zero. I haven't heard any English speaker
in India or elsewhere use cypher with that meaning. So, I can't
imagine where she borrowed it from;.

zero is one of the meanings listed here for cypher
https://www.thefreedictionary.com/cypher

Patricia Louise says here that her grandmother used it when
teaching math. Cyphering can mean calculating. Louise
doesn't say what her grandmother meant by cypher.

Patricia Louise
5 March, 2022

Grandma used this term when she helped us do math.
https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/cypher

Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidence

<t5qcvh$8hs$1@gioia.aioe.org>

 copy mid

https://www.novabbs.com/interests/article-flat.php?id=131009&group=alt.usage.english#131009

 copy link   Newsgroups: alt.usage.english
Path: i2pn2.org!i2pn.org!aioe.org!GoYh/JQ/kANReHhDebHIGg.user.46.165.242.75.POSTED!not-for-mail
From: h.i...@b.ou (Hibou)
Newsgroups: alt.usage.english
Subject: Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidence
Date: Sun, 15 May 2022 09:17:53 +0100
Organization: Aioe.org NNTP Server
Message-ID: <t5qcvh$8hs$1@gioia.aioe.org>
References: <0c47be90-5c9c-4fd1-884e-ac7a3edcb2e3n@googlegroups.com>
<4c01fefc-de7f-4031-a550-251a37425177n@googlegroups.com>
<ed095e27-d963-4af9-a08f-6970b9137793n@googlegroups.com>
<b83d050c-046d-48c7-9ff5-23414691ba62n@googlegroups.com>
<c81698c1-6ff8-4d99-919e-30231c3af695n@googlegroups.com>
<t5g7kh$rje$1@dont-email.me> <mn.5c527e65b71faa84.127094@snitoo>
<je3rh8Fn132U1@mid.individual.net> <t5q33b$15dc$1@gioia.aioe.org>
<t5q5hh$g24$1@dont-email.me>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
Injection-Info: gioia.aioe.org; logging-data="8764"; posting-host="GoYh/JQ/kANReHhDebHIGg.user.gioia.aioe.org"; mail-complaints-to="abuse@aioe.org";
User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:91.0) Gecko/20100101
Thunderbird/91.8.1
X-Notice: Filtered by postfilter v. 0.9.2
Content-Language: en-GB
 by: Hibou - Sun, 15 May 2022 08:17 UTC

Le 15/05/2022 à 07:10, Peter Moylan a écrit :
> On 15/05/22 15:29, Hibou wrote:
>>
>> There are certainly a lot of differences in transport-transportation:
>> lorry-truck, pavement-sidewalk, give-way-yield, underground-subway,
>> subway-?
>
> Underpass, I think. Or possibly tunnel.

Usage is a bit fluid here in GB. In general, I would associate a subway
with pedestrians and an underpass with vehicles.

The Underground in London is definitely the Underground (made up of the
Tube plus the original cut-and-cover lines), even though much of it runs
above ground; but the 'system' (one line) in Glasgow is usually called
the Subway.

Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidence

<m3pmkfuqxm.fsf@leonis4.robolove.meer.net>

 copy mid

https://www.novabbs.com/interests/article-flat.php?id=131010&group=alt.usage.english#131010

 copy link   Newsgroups: alt.usage.english
Path: i2pn2.org!i2pn.org!eternal-september.org!reader02.eternal-september.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail
From: enom...@meer.net (Madhu)
Newsgroups: alt.usage.english
Subject: Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidence
Date: Sun, 15 May 2022 14:13:17 +0530
Organization: Motzarella
Lines: 14
Message-ID: <m3pmkfuqxm.fsf@leonis4.robolove.meer.net>
References: <0c47be90-5c9c-4fd1-884e-ac7a3edcb2e3n@googlegroups.com>
<407bad16-686c-4349-8a66-a74f8b2d5aa6n@googlegroups.com>
<bfd6082c-eea4-4490-b177-4fe6db591822n@googlegroups.com>
<t5mjd6$3si$1@dont-email.me>
<884a0ef7-6fa7-420c-93fc-faad0346f83an@googlegroups.com>
<1pryhp9.12xl23p9bb8aeN%nospam@de-ster.demon.nl>
<8c30aa1c-2857-4ab5-a97f-f9fe33385656n@googlegroups.com>
<9faea7b7-e622-4e82-b545-d46e7c4b2721n@googlegroups.com>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain
Injection-Info: reader02.eternal-september.org; posting-host="7c5fef211c0697c233b73dbaef6b340e";
logging-data="15041"; mail-complaints-to="abuse@eternal-september.org"; posting-account="U2FsdGVkX1/RVMsW0vPtKwrHngyU6mayzYJdONwait8="
Cancel-Lock: sha1:lxRS2cE+zwJEDTUFr0QweI3F5NY=
sha1:+K8iXvWKizLBOioAel+oKHU1ydY=
 by: Madhu - Sun, 15 May 2022 08:43 UTC

* Dingbat <9faea7b7-e622-4e82-b545-d46e7c4b2721n@googlegroups.com> :
Wrote on Sun, 15 May 2022 00:01:36 -0700 (PDT):
> My Malayalam speaking paternal grandmother spoke little English
> but used cypher to mean zero. I haven't heard any English speaker
> in India or elsewhere use cypher with that meaning. So, I can't
> imagine where she borrowed it from;.

very common in the civil-servant class of the erstwhile madras state the
late 19th and 20th centuries. (and perhaps elsewhere)

Even in the mid 20th centuries in educational contexts it was the
opposite of centum (100 "marks" in an exam) (a cipher was a score of 0)

Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidence

<t5qkdu$mdk$1@dont-email.me>

 copy mid

https://www.novabbs.com/interests/article-flat.php?id=131014&group=alt.usage.english#131014

 copy link   Newsgroups: alt.usage.english
Path: i2pn2.org!i2pn.org!eternal-september.org!reader02.eternal-september.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail
From: pet...@pmoylan.org.invalid (Peter Moylan)
Newsgroups: alt.usage.english
Subject: Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidence
Date: Sun, 15 May 2022 20:25:01 +1000
Organization: A noiseless patient Spider
Lines: 18
Message-ID: <t5qkdu$mdk$1@dont-email.me>
References: <0c47be90-5c9c-4fd1-884e-ac7a3edcb2e3n@googlegroups.com>
<4c01fefc-de7f-4031-a550-251a37425177n@googlegroups.com>
<ed095e27-d963-4af9-a08f-6970b9137793n@googlegroups.com>
<b83d050c-046d-48c7-9ff5-23414691ba62n@googlegroups.com>
<c81698c1-6ff8-4d99-919e-30231c3af695n@googlegroups.com>
<t5g7kh$rje$1@dont-email.me> <mn.5c527e65b71faa84.127094@snitoo>
<je3rh8Fn132U1@mid.individual.net> <t5q33b$15dc$1@gioia.aioe.org>
<t5q5hh$g24$1@dont-email.me> <t5qcvh$8hs$1@gioia.aioe.org>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
Injection-Date: Sun, 15 May 2022 10:25:03 -0000 (UTC)
Injection-Info: reader02.eternal-september.org; posting-host="703a2f8ed92cd3ba926037d6d6bde969";
logging-data="22964"; mail-complaints-to="abuse@eternal-september.org"; posting-account="U2FsdGVkX19E/xREhBIbZCzSog8CaMEW"
User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (OS/2; Warp 4.5; rv:38.0) Gecko/20100101
Thunderbird/38.8.0
Cancel-Lock: sha1:0tDZkXJQe/YtR9ARZ8kpK9HXOnM=
In-Reply-To: <t5qcvh$8hs$1@gioia.aioe.org>
 by: Peter Moylan - Sun, 15 May 2022 10:25 UTC

On 15/05/22 18:17, Hibou wrote:
> Le 15/05/2022 à 07:10, Peter Moylan a écrit :
>> On 15/05/22 15:29, Hibou wrote:
>>>
>>> There are certainly a lot of differences in
>>> transport-transportation: lorry-truck, pavement-sidewalk,
>>> give-way-yield, underground-subway, subway-?
>>
>> Underpass, I think. Or possibly tunnel.
>
> Usage is a bit fluid here in GB. In general, I would associate a
> subway with pedestrians and an underpass with vehicles.

So would I, but I thought you were looking for the AmE term. As far as I
know a pedestrian underpass is not called a subway in the US.

--
Peter Moylan Newcastle, NSW http://www.pmoylan.org

Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidence

<t5ql6q$19oo$1@gioia.aioe.org>

 copy mid

https://www.novabbs.com/interests/article-flat.php?id=131016&group=alt.usage.english#131016

 copy link   Newsgroups: alt.usage.english
Path: i2pn2.org!i2pn.org!aioe.org!GoYh/JQ/kANReHhDebHIGg.user.46.165.242.75.POSTED!not-for-mail
From: h.i...@b.ou (Hibou)
Newsgroups: alt.usage.english
Subject: Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidence
Date: Sun, 15 May 2022 11:38:18 +0100
Organization: Aioe.org NNTP Server
Message-ID: <t5ql6q$19oo$1@gioia.aioe.org>
References: <0c47be90-5c9c-4fd1-884e-ac7a3edcb2e3n@googlegroups.com>
<4c01fefc-de7f-4031-a550-251a37425177n@googlegroups.com>
<ed095e27-d963-4af9-a08f-6970b9137793n@googlegroups.com>
<b83d050c-046d-48c7-9ff5-23414691ba62n@googlegroups.com>
<c81698c1-6ff8-4d99-919e-30231c3af695n@googlegroups.com>
<t5g7kh$rje$1@dont-email.me> <mn.5c527e65b71faa84.127094@snitoo>
<je3rh8Fn132U1@mid.individual.net> <t5q33b$15dc$1@gioia.aioe.org>
<t5q5hh$g24$1@dont-email.me> <t5qcvh$8hs$1@gioia.aioe.org>
<t5qkdu$mdk$1@dont-email.me>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
Injection-Info: gioia.aioe.org; logging-data="42776"; posting-host="GoYh/JQ/kANReHhDebHIGg.user.gioia.aioe.org"; mail-complaints-to="abuse@aioe.org";
User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:91.0) Gecko/20100101
Thunderbird/91.8.1
Content-Language: en-GB
X-Notice: Filtered by postfilter v. 0.9.2
 by: Hibou - Sun, 15 May 2022 10:38 UTC

Le 15/05/2022 à 11:25, Peter Moylan a écrit :
> On 15/05/22 18:17, Hibou wrote:
>> Le 15/05/2022 à 07:10, Peter Moylan a écrit :
>>> On 15/05/22 15:29, Hibou wrote:
>>>>
>>>> There are certainly a lot of differences in
>>>> transport-transportation: lorry-truck, pavement-sidewalk,
>>>> give-way-yield, underground-subway, subway-?
>>>
>>> Underpass, I think. Or possibly tunnel.
>>
>> Usage is a bit fluid here in GB. In general, I would associate a
>> subway with pedestrians and an underpass with vehicles.
>
> So would I, but I thought you were looking for the AmE term.

Not really, having already drawn the distinction between subway as an
underground railway and subway as a way of crossing a road. My focus was
on the existence of many differences between BrE and AmE, rather than
the details.

> As far as I
> know a pedestrian underpass is not called a subway in the US.

Wikipedia suggests it's 'subway' in some places and 'pedestrian
underpass' in others:

<https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Subway_(underpass)#Terminology>

Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidence

<t5qqki$2kp$1@dont-email.me>

 copy mid

https://www.novabbs.com/interests/article-flat.php?id=131030&group=alt.usage.english#131030

 copy link   Newsgroups: alt.usage.english
Path: i2pn2.org!i2pn.org!eternal-september.org!reader02.eternal-september.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail
From: pet...@pmoylan.org.invalid (Peter Moylan)
Newsgroups: alt.usage.english
Subject: Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidence
Date: Sun, 15 May 2022 22:10:55 +1000
Organization: A noiseless patient Spider
Lines: 41
Message-ID: <t5qqki$2kp$1@dont-email.me>
References: <0c47be90-5c9c-4fd1-884e-ac7a3edcb2e3n@googlegroups.com>
<4c01fefc-de7f-4031-a550-251a37425177n@googlegroups.com>
<ed095e27-d963-4af9-a08f-6970b9137793n@googlegroups.com>
<b83d050c-046d-48c7-9ff5-23414691ba62n@googlegroups.com>
<c81698c1-6ff8-4d99-919e-30231c3af695n@googlegroups.com>
<t5g7kh$rje$1@dont-email.me> <mn.5c527e65b71faa84.127094@snitoo>
<je3rh8Fn132U1@mid.individual.net> <t5q33b$15dc$1@gioia.aioe.org>
<t5q5hh$g24$1@dont-email.me> <t5qcvh$8hs$1@gioia.aioe.org>
<t5qkdu$mdk$1@dont-email.me> <t5ql6q$19oo$1@gioia.aioe.org>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
Injection-Date: Sun, 15 May 2022 12:10:58 -0000 (UTC)
Injection-Info: reader02.eternal-september.org; posting-host="703a2f8ed92cd3ba926037d6d6bde969";
logging-data="2713"; mail-complaints-to="abuse@eternal-september.org"; posting-account="U2FsdGVkX184KSTVsanI3P+KoXCtqsJ5"
User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (OS/2; Warp 4.5; rv:38.0) Gecko/20100101
Thunderbird/38.8.0
Cancel-Lock: sha1:dW8WzW/VxYcomijbvw7COz0B+vU=
In-Reply-To: <t5ql6q$19oo$1@gioia.aioe.org>
 by: Peter Moylan - Sun, 15 May 2022 12:10 UTC

On 15/05/22 20:38, Hibou wrote:
> Le 15/05/2022 à 11:25, Peter Moylan a écrit :
>> On 15/05/22 18:17, Hibou wrote:
>>> Le 15/05/2022 à 07:10, Peter Moylan a écrit :
>>>> On 15/05/22 15:29, Hibou wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> There are certainly a lot of differences in
>>>>> transport-transportation: lorry-truck, pavement-sidewalk,
>>>>> give-way-yield, underground-subway, subway-?
>>>>
>>>> Underpass, I think. Or possibly tunnel.
>>>
>>> Usage is a bit fluid here in GB. In general, I would associate a
>>> subway with pedestrians and an underpass with vehicles.
>>
>> So would I, but I thought you were looking for the AmE term.
>
> Not really, having already drawn the distinction between subway as
> an underground railway and subway as a way of crossing a road. My
> focus was on the existence of many differences between BrE and AmE,
> rather than the details.
>
>> As far as I know a pedestrian underpass is not called a subway in
>> the US.
>
> Wikipedia suggests it's 'subway' in some places and 'pedestrian
> underpass' in others:
>
> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Subway_(underpass)#Terminology>

I should have guessed that Wikipedia had it covered.

The small town I grew up in had just one thing called "the subway". It
was the pedestrian access to the two platforms at the railway station,
but it also served as one of the few places pedestrians could get to the
other side of the railway line. It was a real hazard for cyclists,
because the entrance on one side was a steep down-ramp terminating in a
right-angle turn. Failing to make the turn was a common cause of accidents.

--
Peter Moylan Newcastle, NSW http://www.pmoylan.org

Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidence

<efu18h5cttksvmikfstk7csdn7tm134td8@4ax.com>

 copy mid

https://www.novabbs.com/interests/article-flat.php?id=131035&group=alt.usage.english#131035

 copy link   Newsgroups: alt.usage.english
Path: i2pn2.org!i2pn.org!weretis.net!feeder8.news.weretis.net!news.mixmin.net!news2.arglkargh.de!news.karotte.org!fu-berlin.de!uni-berlin.de!individual.net!not-for-mail
From: tonycoop...@gmail.com (Tony Cooper)
Newsgroups: alt.usage.english
Subject: Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidence
Date: Sun, 15 May 2022 09:14:06 -0400
Lines: 35
Message-ID: <efu18h5cttksvmikfstk7csdn7tm134td8@4ax.com>
References: <0c47be90-5c9c-4fd1-884e-ac7a3edcb2e3n@googlegroups.com> <4c01fefc-de7f-4031-a550-251a37425177n@googlegroups.com> <ed095e27-d963-4af9-a08f-6970b9137793n@googlegroups.com> <b83d050c-046d-48c7-9ff5-23414691ba62n@googlegroups.com> <c81698c1-6ff8-4d99-919e-30231c3af695n@googlegroups.com> <t5g7kh$rje$1@dont-email.me> <mn.5c527e65b71faa84.127094@snitoo> <je3rh8Fn132U1@mid.individual.net> <t5q33b$15dc$1@gioia.aioe.org> <t5q5hh$g24$1@dont-email.me> <t5qcvh$8hs$1@gioia.aioe.org>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
X-Trace: individual.net VnDWRTsP+vn8kwwkGxyChQE4C+rkNvk9zhlQ5DYj2lH2Eda3s7
Cancel-Lock: sha1:BuGqO8mYAZfi6ugKNGLtz7X0lsA=
User-Agent: ForteAgent/7.00.32.1200
 by: Tony Cooper - Sun, 15 May 2022 13:14 UTC

On Sun, 15 May 2022 09:17:53 +0100, Hibou <h.i@b.ou> wrote:

>Le 15/05/2022 à 07:10, Peter Moylan a écrit :
>> On 15/05/22 15:29, Hibou wrote:
>>>
>>> There are certainly a lot of differences in transport-transportation:
>>> lorry-truck, pavement-sidewalk, give-way-yield, underground-subway,
>>> subway-?
>>
>> Underpass, I think. Or possibly tunnel.
>
>Usage is a bit fluid here in GB. In general, I would associate a subway
>with pedestrians and an underpass with vehicles.
>
>The Underground in London is definitely the Underground (made up of the
>Tube plus the original cut-and-cover lines), even though much of it runs
>above ground; but the 'system' (one line) in Glasgow is usually called
>the Subway.

In Chicago, you can board the "El" at a station that is above ground
or at a station that is below ground. It is still the El when it runs
underground.

The El is operated by the Chicago Transit Authority, and is officially
named the 'L'. Many Chicagoans, though, write it as "El" on the basis
that it's short for Elevated. I am of this group.


--

Tony Cooper - Orlando Florida

I read and post to this group as a form of entertainment.

Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidence

<c811d851-8786-4314-9b65-7eb864b17b54n@googlegroups.com>

 copy mid

https://www.novabbs.com/interests/article-flat.php?id=131037&group=alt.usage.english#131037

 copy link   Newsgroups: alt.usage.english
X-Received: by 2002:a37:a4cd:0:b0:6a2:df84:b88e with SMTP id n196-20020a37a4cd000000b006a2df84b88emr3265437qke.766.1652621599243;
Sun, 15 May 2022 06:33:19 -0700 (PDT)
X-Received: by 2002:a25:814b:0:b0:648:fa24:ee17 with SMTP id
j11-20020a25814b000000b00648fa24ee17mr13615259ybm.385.1652621599086; Sun, 15
May 2022 06:33:19 -0700 (PDT)
Path: i2pn2.org!i2pn.org!usenet.blueworldhosting.com!feed1.usenet.blueworldhosting.com!peer02.iad!feed-me.highwinds-media.com!news.highwinds-media.com!news-out.google.com!nntp.google.com!postnews.google.com!google-groups.googlegroups.com!not-for-mail
Newsgroups: alt.usage.english
Date: Sun, 15 May 2022 06:33:18 -0700 (PDT)
In-Reply-To: <t5qqki$2kp$1@dont-email.me>
Injection-Info: google-groups.googlegroups.com; posting-host=220.225.126.138; posting-account=7i9CYgkAAAD0b2D1lL-NyeNZeE4r5Wir
NNTP-Posting-Host: 220.225.126.138
References: <0c47be90-5c9c-4fd1-884e-ac7a3edcb2e3n@googlegroups.com>
<4c01fefc-de7f-4031-a550-251a37425177n@googlegroups.com> <ed095e27-d963-4af9-a08f-6970b9137793n@googlegroups.com>
<b83d050c-046d-48c7-9ff5-23414691ba62n@googlegroups.com> <c81698c1-6ff8-4d99-919e-30231c3af695n@googlegroups.com>
<t5g7kh$rje$1@dont-email.me> <mn.5c527e65b71faa84.127094@snitoo>
<je3rh8Fn132U1@mid.individual.net> <t5q33b$15dc$1@gioia.aioe.org>
<t5q5hh$g24$1@dont-email.me> <t5qcvh$8hs$1@gioia.aioe.org>
<t5qkdu$mdk$1@dont-email.me> <t5ql6q$19oo$1@gioia.aioe.org> <t5qqki$2kp$1@dont-email.me>
User-Agent: G2/1.0
MIME-Version: 1.0
Message-ID: <c811d851-8786-4314-9b65-7eb864b17b54n@googlegroups.com>
Subject: Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidence
From: ranjit_m...@yahoo.com (Dingbat)
Injection-Date: Sun, 15 May 2022 13:33:19 +0000
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
X-Received-Bytes: 3931
 by: Dingbat - Sun, 15 May 2022 13:33 UTC

On Sunday, May 15, 2022 at 5:11:03 AM UTC-7, Peter Moylan wrote:
> On 15/05/22 20:38, Hibou wrote:
> > Le 15/05/2022 à 11:25, Peter Moylan a écrit :
> >> On 15/05/22 18:17, Hibou wrote:
> >>> Le 15/05/2022 à 07:10, Peter Moylan a écrit :
> >>>> On 15/05/22 15:29, Hibou wrote:
> >>>>>
> >>>>> There are certainly a lot of differences in
> >>>>> transport-transportation: lorry-truck, pavement-sidewalk,
> >>>>> give-way-yield, underground-subway, subway-?
> >>>>
> >>>> Underpass, I think. Or possibly tunnel.
> >>>
> >>> Usage is a bit fluid here in GB. In general, I would associate a
> >>> subway with pedestrians and an underpass with vehicles.
> >>
> >> So would I, but I thought you were looking for the AmE term.
> >
> > Not really, having already drawn the distinction between subway as
> > an underground railway and subway as a way of crossing a road. My
> > focus was on the existence of many differences between BrE and AmE,
> > rather than the details.
> >
> >> As far as I know a pedestrian underpass is not called a subway in
> >> the US.
> >
> > Wikipedia suggests it's 'subway' in some places and 'pedestrian
> > underpass' in others:
> >
> > <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Subway_(underpass)#Terminology>
> I should have guessed that Wikipedia had it covered.
>
> The small town I grew up in had just one thing called "the subway". It
> was the pedestrian access to the two platforms at the railway station,
> but it also served as one of the few places pedestrians could get to the

> other side of the railway line. It was a real hazard for cyclists,
> because the entrance on one side was a steep down-ramp terminating in a
> right-angle turn. Failing to make the turn was a common cause of accidents.
> --
> Peter Moylan Newcastle, NSW http://www.pmoylan.org

A bicycle underpass is called that, never a subway.

In places where a subway is an underground railroad,
a subway can also mean an underground walkway from
one underground railroad platform to another.

So, one can walk through a subway from one *underground
railroad subway to another!

Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidence

<b43310dc-50ae-48ab-a3e0-9849fabb1cd9n@googlegroups.com>

 copy mid

https://www.novabbs.com/interests/article-flat.php?id=131052&group=alt.usage.english#131052

 copy link   Newsgroups: alt.usage.english
X-Received: by 2002:ac8:7d46:0:b0:2f3:dd89:5557 with SMTP id h6-20020ac87d46000000b002f3dd895557mr12159538qtb.567.1652624086652;
Sun, 15 May 2022 07:14:46 -0700 (PDT)
X-Received: by 2002:a25:1cc3:0:b0:64d:851a:597b with SMTP id
c186-20020a251cc3000000b0064d851a597bmr3162518ybc.624.1652624086524; Sun, 15
May 2022 07:14:46 -0700 (PDT)
Path: i2pn2.org!i2pn.org!usenet.blueworldhosting.com!feed1.usenet.blueworldhosting.com!peer02.iad!feed-me.highwinds-media.com!news.highwinds-media.com!news-out.google.com!nntp.google.com!postnews.google.com!google-groups.googlegroups.com!not-for-mail
Newsgroups: alt.usage.english
Date: Sun, 15 May 2022 07:14:46 -0700 (PDT)
In-Reply-To: <t5q33b$15dc$1@gioia.aioe.org>
Injection-Info: google-groups.googlegroups.com; posting-host=100.8.211.134; posting-account=tXYReAoAAABbl0njRzivyU02EBLaX9OF
NNTP-Posting-Host: 100.8.211.134
References: <0c47be90-5c9c-4fd1-884e-ac7a3edcb2e3n@googlegroups.com>
<4c01fefc-de7f-4031-a550-251a37425177n@googlegroups.com> <ed095e27-d963-4af9-a08f-6970b9137793n@googlegroups.com>
<b83d050c-046d-48c7-9ff5-23414691ba62n@googlegroups.com> <c81698c1-6ff8-4d99-919e-30231c3af695n@googlegroups.com>
<t5g7kh$rje$1@dont-email.me> <mn.5c527e65b71faa84.127094@snitoo>
<je3rh8Fn132U1@mid.individual.net> <t5q33b$15dc$1@gioia.aioe.org>
User-Agent: G2/1.0
MIME-Version: 1.0
Message-ID: <b43310dc-50ae-48ab-a3e0-9849fabb1cd9n@googlegroups.com>
Subject: Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidence
From: gramma...@verizon.net (Peter T. Daniels)
Injection-Date: Sun, 15 May 2022 14:14:46 +0000
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
X-Received-Bytes: 3151
 by: Peter T. Daniels - Sun, 15 May 2022 14:14 UTC

On Sunday, May 15, 2022 at 1:29:26 AM UTC-4, Hibou wrote:
> Le 12/05/2022 à 08:32, Athel Cornish-Bowden a écrit :

> > There are considerable variations even between British and American
> > English. Words relating to cars (boot/trunk ...) and babies
> > (diaper/nappy ...) are often different; words in other contexts are
> > usually the same.
>
> There are certainly a lot of differences in transport-transportation:
> lorry-truck, pavement-sidewalk, give-way-yield, underground-subway,
> subway-?,

We don't have those weird underground pervy toilets.

> railway-station-train-station, points-switch,
> engine-driver-engineer.... In other fields too: biscuit-cookie,
> post-mail, bill-check, flat-apartment, torch-flashlight, coffin-casket,
> crisps-chips, rubbish-garbage, angry-mad....
>
> It doesn't stop with vocabulary, though. Formal English and formal
> American are often very close, barring the odd spelling difference; but
> in everyday speech it seems there's hardly a sentence that is the same
> in Eastpondia and Westpondia. Take verb use, for instance: I've eaten vs
> I ate already etc.. Or the question "How are you?", to which the answer
> is either an adverb ("Fine") or an adjective ("Good").

Your notions of American English are not based on experience with
actual American English. Gangster movies, maybe?

> Is a language a dialect with an army? I'm inclined to say it's the
> expression of, and the vehicle for, a culture, and Britain and America
> have quite different cultures.

Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidence

<rj2cuj6if0md.dlg@mid.crommatograph.info>

 copy mid

https://www.novabbs.com/interests/article-flat.php?id=131059&group=alt.usage.english#131059

 copy link   Newsgroups: alt.usage.english
Path: i2pn2.org!i2pn.org!usenet.blueworldhosting.com!feed1.usenet.blueworldhosting.com!peer01.iad!feed-me.highwinds-media.com!news.highwinds-media.com!peer02.ams1!peer.ams1.xlned.com!news.xlned.com!feeder.cambriumusenet.nl!feed.tweaknews.nl!posting.tweaknews.nl!fx06.ams1.POSTED!not-for-mail
From: lispamat...@crommatograph.info (Quinn C)
Subject: Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidence
Newsgroups: alt.usage.english
User-Agent: 40tude_Dialog/2.0.15.41
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
Organization: Computers don't get me 'cause I'm non-binary
References: <0c47be90-5c9c-4fd1-884e-ac7a3edcb2e3n@googlegroups.com> <4c01fefc-de7f-4031-a550-251a37425177n@googlegroups.com> <ed095e27-d963-4af9-a08f-6970b9137793n@googlegroups.com> <b83d050c-046d-48c7-9ff5-23414691ba62n@googlegroups.com> <c81698c1-6ff8-4d99-919e-30231c3af695n@googlegroups.com> <t5g7kh$rje$1@dont-email.me> <mn.5c527e65b71faa84.127094@snitoo> <je3rh8Fn132U1@mid.individual.net> <t5q33b$15dc$1@gioia.aioe.org> <b43310dc-50ae-48ab-a3e0-9849fabb1cd9n@googlegroups.com>
Message-ID: <rj2cuj6if0md.dlg@mid.crommatograph.info>
X-Face: .f:ZE>c\~9oJ+1nK#>ntSHOQS~4x"Qx2m(<D<@p$G"tzb1lgWLUGY.zApKa@VL_?d$r(8=?VjrD9=uY:x!+H=hvj58Uw7)Y9<:KMYD.+^~#qMpeg2rvt`{#2a~7YoyFaFaBEdo4.TJzBqgtCZZ:mku4J|hey}DE}_"z(rl0N)\Pxh*0$"3B2mr\01&YPY7WJ:2kSe'I#PqiTxs1s49!S#W85'\zMXy*wRgD,,k.=4:3M{(P"i6S;\az~ut3z`;?*Y;&]11<(EPF-SN`|3PhyL%~AuZpoFjjE_oM1`znHPq_?uib2WXwE+q@m),cLq~B$r^5uO]u6?CEecn=%xsDXNVa(1DX.)O(
Cancel-Lock: sha1:u9QM1K11a8rsJy2xz5uf5Br/7Sw=
Lines: 23
X-Complaints-To: abuse@tweaknews.nl
NNTP-Posting-Date: Sun, 15 May 2022 15:15:42 UTC
Date: Sun, 15 May 2022 11:15:54 -0400
X-Received-Bytes: 2478
 by: Quinn C - Sun, 15 May 2022 15:15 UTC

* Peter T. Daniels:

> On Sunday, May 15, 2022 at 1:29:26 AM UTC-4, Hibou wrote:
>> Le 12/05/2022 à 08:32, Athel Cornish-Bowden a écrit :
>
>>> There are considerable variations even between British and American
>>> English. Words relating to cars (boot/trunk ...) and babies
>>> (diaper/nappy ...) are often different; words in other contexts are
>>> usually the same.
>>
>> There are certainly a lot of differences in transport-transportation:
>> lorry-truck, pavement-sidewalk, give-way-yield, underground-subway,
>> subway-?,
>
> We don't have those weird underground pervy toilets.

More likely, just like anywhere else, you don't have them any more.

--
There is no freedom for men unless there is freedom for women.
If women mustn't bring their will to the fore, why should men
be allowed to?
-- Hedwig Dohm (1876), my translation

Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidence

<of828h99kbr4tejqbopn56t8ebs8qkjtbg@4ax.com>

 copy mid

https://www.novabbs.com/interests/article-flat.php?id=131067&group=alt.usage.english#131067

 copy link   Newsgroups: alt.usage.english
Path: i2pn2.org!i2pn.org!aioe.org!news.mixmin.net!news2.arglkargh.de!news.karotte.org!fu-berlin.de!uni-berlin.de!individual.net!not-for-mail
From: Ken...@invalid.news.com (Ken Blake)
Newsgroups: alt.usage.english
Subject: Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidence
Date: Sun, 15 May 2022 08:55:00 -0700
Lines: 21
Message-ID: <of828h99kbr4tejqbopn56t8ebs8qkjtbg@4ax.com>
References: <4c01fefc-de7f-4031-a550-251a37425177n@googlegroups.com> <ed095e27-d963-4af9-a08f-6970b9137793n@googlegroups.com> <b83d050c-046d-48c7-9ff5-23414691ba62n@googlegroups.com> <c81698c1-6ff8-4d99-919e-30231c3af695n@googlegroups.com> <t5g7kh$rje$1@dont-email.me> <mn.5c527e65b71faa84.127094@snitoo> <je3rh8Fn132U1@mid.individual.net> <t5q33b$15dc$1@gioia.aioe.org> <t5q5hh$g24$1@dont-email.me> <t5qcvh$8hs$1@gioia.aioe.org> <t5qkdu$mdk$1@dont-email.me>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
X-Trace: individual.net 8FaE04XzWoAZ55V0HnWBXQ3mCaF01J+6ibKck4v1lFPT0Xc9Vy
Cancel-Lock: sha1:hB0tfAIwFE6fMg+R7fUdcwWWIMo=
X-Newsreader: Forte Agent 6.00/32.1186
 by: Ken Blake - Sun, 15 May 2022 15:55 UTC

On Sun, 15 May 2022 20:25:01 +1000, Peter Moylan
<peter@pmoylan.org.invalid> wrote:

>On 15/05/22 18:17, Hibou wrote:
>> Le 15/05/2022 à 07:10, Peter Moylan a écrit :
>>> On 15/05/22 15:29, Hibou wrote:
>>>>
>>>> There are certainly a lot of differences in
>>>> transport-transportation: lorry-truck, pavement-sidewalk,
>>>> give-way-yield, underground-subway, subway-?
>>>
>>> Underpass, I think. Or possibly tunnel.
>>
>> Usage is a bit fluid here in GB. In general, I would associate a
>> subway with pedestrians and an underpass with vehicles.
>
>So would I, but I thought you were looking for the AmE term. As far as I
>know a pedestrian underpass is not called a subway in the US.

You are correct. In AmE a "subway" is what BrE calls "tube" or
"underground."

Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidence

<9e8917b3-a7c5-49b8-ad6d-23c1d3be9302n@googlegroups.com>

 copy mid

https://www.novabbs.com/interests/article-flat.php?id=131068&group=alt.usage.english#131068

 copy link   Newsgroups: alt.usage.english
X-Received: by 2002:ac8:5b96:0:b0:2f8:af64:a0bd with SMTP id a22-20020ac85b96000000b002f8af64a0bdmr1572250qta.463.1652630232050;
Sun, 15 May 2022 08:57:12 -0700 (PDT)
X-Received: by 2002:a81:15d6:0:b0:2f8:5d5:2b49 with SMTP id
205-20020a8115d6000000b002f805d52b49mr15098492ywv.357.1652630231892; Sun, 15
May 2022 08:57:11 -0700 (PDT)
Path: i2pn2.org!i2pn.org!usenet.blueworldhosting.com!feed1.usenet.blueworldhosting.com!peer02.iad!feed-me.highwinds-media.com!news.highwinds-media.com!news-out.google.com!nntp.google.com!postnews.google.com!google-groups.googlegroups.com!not-for-mail
Newsgroups: alt.usage.english
Date: Sun, 15 May 2022 08:57:11 -0700 (PDT)
In-Reply-To: <rj2cuj6if0md.dlg@mid.crommatograph.info>
Injection-Info: google-groups.googlegroups.com; posting-host=100.8.211.134; posting-account=tXYReAoAAABbl0njRzivyU02EBLaX9OF
NNTP-Posting-Host: 100.8.211.134
References: <0c47be90-5c9c-4fd1-884e-ac7a3edcb2e3n@googlegroups.com>
<4c01fefc-de7f-4031-a550-251a37425177n@googlegroups.com> <ed095e27-d963-4af9-a08f-6970b9137793n@googlegroups.com>
<b83d050c-046d-48c7-9ff5-23414691ba62n@googlegroups.com> <c81698c1-6ff8-4d99-919e-30231c3af695n@googlegroups.com>
<t5g7kh$rje$1@dont-email.me> <mn.5c527e65b71faa84.127094@snitoo>
<je3rh8Fn132U1@mid.individual.net> <t5q33b$15dc$1@gioia.aioe.org>
<b43310dc-50ae-48ab-a3e0-9849fabb1cd9n@googlegroups.com> <rj2cuj6if0md.dlg@mid.crommatograph.info>
User-Agent: G2/1.0
MIME-Version: 1.0
Message-ID: <9e8917b3-a7c5-49b8-ad6d-23c1d3be9302n@googlegroups.com>
Subject: Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidence
From: gramma...@verizon.net (Peter T. Daniels)
Injection-Date: Sun, 15 May 2022 15:57:12 +0000
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
X-Received-Bytes: 2101
 by: Peter T. Daniels - Sun, 15 May 2022 15:57 UTC

On Sunday, May 15, 2022 at 11:15:48 AM UTC-4, Quinn C wrote:
> * Peter T. Daniels:
> > On Sunday, May 15, 2022 at 1:29:26 AM UTC-4, Hibou wrote:

[BrE/AmE]
> >> There are certainly a lot of differences in transport-transportation:
> >> lorry-truck, pavement-sidewalk, give-way-yield, underground-subway,
> >> subway-?,
> > We don't have those weird underground pervy toilets.
>
> More likely, just like anywhere else, you don't have them any more.

I doubt it. Where would they have been?

Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidence

<vk828hlrgv8qav3pahfjvq3nn9rijjmgvb@4ax.com>

 copy mid

https://www.novabbs.com/interests/article-flat.php?id=131069&group=alt.usage.english#131069

 copy link   Newsgroups: alt.usage.english
Path: i2pn2.org!i2pn.org!weretis.net!feeder8.news.weretis.net!news.mixmin.net!news2.arglkargh.de!news.karotte.org!fu-berlin.de!uni-berlin.de!individual.net!not-for-mail
From: Ken...@invalid.news.com (Ken Blake)
Newsgroups: alt.usage.english
Subject: Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidence
Date: Sun, 15 May 2022 08:57:51 -0700
Lines: 39
Message-ID: <vk828hlrgv8qav3pahfjvq3nn9rijjmgvb@4ax.com>
References: <4c01fefc-de7f-4031-a550-251a37425177n@googlegroups.com> <ed095e27-d963-4af9-a08f-6970b9137793n@googlegroups.com> <b83d050c-046d-48c7-9ff5-23414691ba62n@googlegroups.com> <c81698c1-6ff8-4d99-919e-30231c3af695n@googlegroups.com> <t5g7kh$rje$1@dont-email.me> <mn.5c527e65b71faa84.127094@snitoo> <je3rh8Fn132U1@mid.individual.net> <t5q33b$15dc$1@gioia.aioe.org> <t5q5hh$g24$1@dont-email.me> <t5qcvh$8hs$1@gioia.aioe.org> <efu18h5cttksvmikfstk7csdn7tm134td8@4ax.com>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
X-Trace: individual.net SLcLWtiUzbClvTy06tymOQRDKbMsO1o/6caHFc/nzr9cMw660f
Cancel-Lock: sha1:y5e4fFtJl+yBEIaby81D1HDolMM=
X-Newsreader: Forte Agent 6.00/32.1186
 by: Ken Blake - Sun, 15 May 2022 15:57 UTC

On Sun, 15 May 2022 09:14:06 -0400, Tony Cooper
<tonycooper214@gmail.com> wrote:

>On Sun, 15 May 2022 09:17:53 +0100, Hibou <h.i@b.ou> wrote:
>
>>Le 15/05/2022 à 07:10, Peter Moylan a écrit :
>>> On 15/05/22 15:29, Hibou wrote:
>>>>
>>>> There are certainly a lot of differences in transport-transportation:
>>>> lorry-truck, pavement-sidewalk, give-way-yield, underground-subway,
>>>> subway-?
>>>
>>> Underpass, I think. Or possibly tunnel.
>>
>>Usage is a bit fluid here in GB. In general, I would associate a subway
>>with pedestrians and an underpass with vehicles.
>>
>>The Underground in London is definitely the Underground (made up of the
>>Tube plus the original cut-and-cover lines), even though much of it runs
>>above ground; but the 'system' (one line) in Glasgow is usually called
>>the Subway.
>
>In Chicago, you can board the "El" at a station that is above ground
>or at a station that is below ground. It is still the El when it runs
>underground.
>
>The El is operated by the Chicago Transit Authority, and is officially
>named the 'L'.

I'm certainly familiar with "El, "but I've never seen it called "L."

> Many Chicagoans, though, write it as "El" on the basis
>that it's short for Elevated. I am of this group.

So am I, even though I'm not a Chicagoan.

Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidence

<cs828ht4cqs6lhgn67eril9i9nvin2rkob@4ax.com>

 copy mid

https://www.novabbs.com/interests/article-flat.php?id=131071&group=alt.usage.english#131071

 copy link   Newsgroups: alt.usage.english
Path: i2pn2.org!i2pn.org!aioe.org!news.mixmin.net!news2.arglkargh.de!news.karotte.org!fu-berlin.de!uni-berlin.de!individual.net!not-for-mail
From: tonycoop...@gmail.com (Tony Cooper)
Newsgroups: alt.usage.english
Subject: Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidence
Date: Sun, 15 May 2022 12:05:04 -0400
Lines: 48
Message-ID: <cs828ht4cqs6lhgn67eril9i9nvin2rkob@4ax.com>
References: <ed095e27-d963-4af9-a08f-6970b9137793n@googlegroups.com> <b83d050c-046d-48c7-9ff5-23414691ba62n@googlegroups.com> <c81698c1-6ff8-4d99-919e-30231c3af695n@googlegroups.com> <t5g7kh$rje$1@dont-email.me> <mn.5c527e65b71faa84.127094@snitoo> <je3rh8Fn132U1@mid.individual.net> <t5q33b$15dc$1@gioia.aioe.org> <t5q5hh$g24$1@dont-email.me> <t5qcvh$8hs$1@gioia.aioe.org> <efu18h5cttksvmikfstk7csdn7tm134td8@4ax.com> <vk828hlrgv8qav3pahfjvq3nn9rijjmgvb@4ax.com>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
X-Trace: individual.net hOLeIVMqaY+K3Ofm5SUuSwwqrd1UG5D1Bjaf1dM3J86J34lsb2
Cancel-Lock: sha1:D4Awzx7CJh0QAKL7PnWOtaOUIMs=
User-Agent: ForteAgent/7.00.32.1200
 by: Tony Cooper - Sun, 15 May 2022 16:05 UTC

On Sun, 15 May 2022 08:57:51 -0700, Ken Blake <Ken@invalid.news.com>
wrote:

>On Sun, 15 May 2022 09:14:06 -0400, Tony Cooper
><tonycooper214@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>>On Sun, 15 May 2022 09:17:53 +0100, Hibou <h.i@b.ou> wrote:
>>
>>>Le 15/05/2022 à 07:10, Peter Moylan a écrit :
>>>> On 15/05/22 15:29, Hibou wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> There are certainly a lot of differences in transport-transportation:
>>>>> lorry-truck, pavement-sidewalk, give-way-yield, underground-subway,
>>>>> subway-?
>>>>
>>>> Underpass, I think. Or possibly tunnel.
>>>
>>>Usage is a bit fluid here in GB. In general, I would associate a subway
>>>with pedestrians and an underpass with vehicles.
>>>
>>>The Underground in London is definitely the Underground (made up of the
>>>Tube plus the original cut-and-cover lines), even though much of it runs
>>>above ground; but the 'system' (one line) in Glasgow is usually called
>>>the Subway.
>>
>>In Chicago, you can board the "El" at a station that is above ground
>>or at a station that is below ground. It is still the El when it runs
>>underground.
>>
>>The El is operated by the Chicago Transit Authority, and is officially
>>named the 'L'.
>
>I'm certainly familiar with "El, "but I've never seen it called "L."

Not only does the CTA use 'L', but they insist on the single ' on each
side of the L.

https://www.transitchicago.com/assets/1/6/ctamap_Lsystem.png
>
>> Many Chicagoans, though, write it as "El" on the basis
>>that it's short for Elevated. I am of this group.
>
>So am I, even though I'm not a Chicagoan.
--

Tony Cooper - Orlando Florida

I read and post to this group as a form of entertainment.

Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidence

<882fd86f-7ec0-42c9-96c1-ceabf4185c9en@googlegroups.com>

 copy mid

https://www.novabbs.com/interests/article-flat.php?id=131072&group=alt.usage.english#131072

 copy link   Newsgroups: alt.usage.english
X-Received: by 2002:ac8:59cd:0:b0:2f3:c08d:9ffa with SMTP id f13-20020ac859cd000000b002f3c08d9ffamr12391889qtf.564.1652630769717;
Sun, 15 May 2022 09:06:09 -0700 (PDT)
X-Received: by 2002:a25:3008:0:b0:64b:5176:eff0 with SMTP id
w8-20020a253008000000b0064b5176eff0mr14576521ybw.296.1652630769529; Sun, 15
May 2022 09:06:09 -0700 (PDT)
Path: i2pn2.org!i2pn.org!usenet.blueworldhosting.com!feed1.usenet.blueworldhosting.com!peer02.iad!feed-me.highwinds-media.com!news.highwinds-media.com!news-out.google.com!nntp.google.com!postnews.google.com!google-groups.googlegroups.com!not-for-mail
Newsgroups: alt.usage.english
Date: Sun, 15 May 2022 09:06:09 -0700 (PDT)
In-Reply-To: <vk828hlrgv8qav3pahfjvq3nn9rijjmgvb@4ax.com>
Injection-Info: google-groups.googlegroups.com; posting-host=100.8.211.134; posting-account=tXYReAoAAABbl0njRzivyU02EBLaX9OF
NNTP-Posting-Host: 100.8.211.134
References: <4c01fefc-de7f-4031-a550-251a37425177n@googlegroups.com>
<ed095e27-d963-4af9-a08f-6970b9137793n@googlegroups.com> <b83d050c-046d-48c7-9ff5-23414691ba62n@googlegroups.com>
<c81698c1-6ff8-4d99-919e-30231c3af695n@googlegroups.com> <t5g7kh$rje$1@dont-email.me>
<mn.5c527e65b71faa84.127094@snitoo> <je3rh8Fn132U1@mid.individual.net>
<t5q33b$15dc$1@gioia.aioe.org> <t5q5hh$g24$1@dont-email.me>
<t5qcvh$8hs$1@gioia.aioe.org> <efu18h5cttksvmikfstk7csdn7tm134td8@4ax.com> <vk828hlrgv8qav3pahfjvq3nn9rijjmgvb@4ax.com>
User-Agent: G2/1.0
MIME-Version: 1.0
Message-ID: <882fd86f-7ec0-42c9-96c1-ceabf4185c9en@googlegroups.com>
Subject: Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidence
From: gramma...@verizon.net (Peter T. Daniels)
Injection-Date: Sun, 15 May 2022 16:06:09 +0000
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
X-Received-Bytes: 2611
 by: Peter T. Daniels - Sun, 15 May 2022 16:06 UTC

On Sunday, May 15, 2022 at 11:57:55 AM UTC-4, Ken Blake wrote:
> On Sun, 15 May 2022 09:14:06 -0400, Tony Cooper
> <tonyco...@gmail.com> wrote:

> >In Chicago, you can board the "El" at a station that is above ground
> >or at a station that is below ground. It is still the El when it runs
> >underground.

Except when the two relevant lines are called the subway (one under
State Street, one under Dearborn one block to the west). I never heard
the brief portion of the Blue Line that runs beneath Logan Square called
a subway. (In your day it may not yet have replaced the "L" tracks.)

> >The El is operated by the Chicago Transit Authority, and is officially
> >named the 'L'.
>
> I'm certainly familiar with "El, "but I've never seen it called "L."
>
> > Many Chicagoans, though, write it as "El" on the basis
> >that it's short for Elevated. I am of this group.
>
> So am I, even though I'm not a Chicagoan.

"_The_" book on the history of the "L" uses that form and explains why.

Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidence

<lq828hhmf378sisj4ojbvgh40og4pmiqil@4ax.com>

 copy mid

https://www.novabbs.com/interests/article-flat.php?id=131073&group=alt.usage.english#131073

 copy link   Newsgroups: alt.usage.english
Path: i2pn2.org!i2pn.org!weretis.net!feeder8.news.weretis.net!news.mixmin.net!news2.arglkargh.de!news.karotte.org!fu-berlin.de!uni-berlin.de!individual.net!not-for-mail
From: Ken...@invalid.news.com (Ken Blake)
Newsgroups: alt.usage.english
Subject: Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidence
Date: Sun, 15 May 2022 09:07:08 -0700
Lines: 40
Message-ID: <lq828hhmf378sisj4ojbvgh40og4pmiqil@4ax.com>
References: <0c47be90-5c9c-4fd1-884e-ac7a3edcb2e3n@googlegroups.com> <407bad16-686c-4349-8a66-a74f8b2d5aa6n@googlegroups.com> <bfd6082c-eea4-4490-b177-4fe6db591822n@googlegroups.com> <t5mjd6$3si$1@dont-email.me> <884a0ef7-6fa7-420c-93fc-faad0346f83an@googlegroups.com> <1pryhp9.12xl23p9bb8aeN%nospam@de-ster.demon.nl> <t5pfnu$pjc$1@dont-email.me>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
X-Trace: individual.net gi1c4BY89c2RgC4s18c7XwDZc+DX2NNDChiottNEL5ipHWoCqR
Cancel-Lock: sha1:D+lVmLRPrGTVZjVgXaxRcbIbydc=
X-Newsreader: Forte Agent 6.00/32.1186
 by: Ken Blake - Sun, 15 May 2022 16:07 UTC

On Sun, 15 May 2022 09:58:54 +1000, Peter Moylan
<peter@pmoylan.org.invalid> wrote:

>On 15/05/22 03:53, J. J. Lodder wrote:
>> Peter T. Daniels <grammatim@verizon.net> wrote:
>>> On Friday, May 13, 2022 at 5:43:06 PM UTC-4, benl...@ihug.co.nz wrote:
>>>> On 14/05/2022 2:36 a.m., Peter T. Daniels wrote:
>>>>> On Friday, May 13, 2022 at 1:08:22 AM UTC-4, Dingbat wrote:
>
>>>>>> English DEAR and Russian DOROGOY have the same two meanings:
>>>>>> 1) Beloved
>>>>>> 2) Expensive
>>>>> French CHER as well. It's beginning to look non-coincidental, no?
>>>>
>>>> Indeed. The English seems to be two directions of development from an
>>>> original meaning something like "precious, valuable, worthy". I feel
>>>> them as quite separate now; I knew the "beloved" one from childhood, but
>>>> only encountered the "expensive" one in adolescence from British sources
>>>> (spoken and written), and found it surprising.
>>>
>>> Interesting. It was my grandmother's (b. 1891, Brooklyn) regular
>>> word for 'expensive'.
>>
>> If Brooklyn from Dutch 'duur', perhaps,
>
>Unlikely, because dear=expensive can be found all over the
>English-speaking world, and most of us have never been to Brooklyn.

I have. I lived in NYC for about 14 years of my life. I was born in
Brooklyn, and lived there until I was three. Since then, I've been in
Brooklyn about seven times (three marathons that went through
Brooklyn, the wedding of my sister-in-law, two parties of friends who
lived there, and one visit with my in-laws to their friends who lived
there.

Despite the above, I remember nothing about Brooklyn.

Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidence

<1kykrlsiqi1ie$.dlg@mid.crommatograph.info>

 copy mid

https://www.novabbs.com/interests/article-flat.php?id=131074&group=alt.usage.english#131074

 copy link   Newsgroups: alt.usage.english
Path: i2pn2.org!i2pn.org!aioe.org!news.uzoreto.com!newsreader4.netcologne.de!news.netcologne.de!npeer.as286.net!npeer-ng0.as286.net!peer03.ams1!peer.ams1.xlned.com!news.xlned.com!feeder.cambriumusenet.nl!feed.tweaknews.nl!posting.tweaknews.nl!fx09.ams1.POSTED!not-for-mail
From: lispamat...@crommatograph.info (Quinn C)
Subject: Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidence
Newsgroups: alt.usage.english
User-Agent: 40tude_Dialog/2.0.15.41
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Organization: Computers don't get me 'cause I'm non-binary
References: <0c47be90-5c9c-4fd1-884e-ac7a3edcb2e3n@googlegroups.com> <4c01fefc-de7f-4031-a550-251a37425177n@googlegroups.com> <ed095e27-d963-4af9-a08f-6970b9137793n@googlegroups.com> <b83d050c-046d-48c7-9ff5-23414691ba62n@googlegroups.com> <c81698c1-6ff8-4d99-919e-30231c3af695n@googlegroups.com> <t5g7kh$rje$1@dont-email.me> <mn.5c527e65b71faa84.127094@snitoo> <je3rh8Fn132U1@mid.individual.net> <t5q33b$15dc$1@gioia.aioe.org> <b43310dc-50ae-48ab-a3e0-9849fabb1cd9n@googlegroups.com> <rj2cuj6if0md.dlg@mid.crommatograph.info> <9e8917b3-a7c5-49b8-ad6d-23c1d3be9302n@googlegroups.com>
Message-ID: <1kykrlsiqi1ie$.dlg@mid.crommatograph.info>
X-Face: .f:ZE>c\~9oJ+1nK#>ntSHOQS~4x"Qx2m(<D<@p$G"tzb1lgWLUGY.zApKa@VL_?d$r(8=?VjrD9=uY:x!+H=hvj58Uw7)Y9<:KMYD.+^~#qMpeg2rvt`{#2a~7YoyFaFaBEdo4.TJzBqgtCZZ:mku4J|hey}DE}_"z(rl0N)\Pxh*0$"3B2mr\01&YPY7WJ:2kSe'I#PqiTxs1s49!S#W85'\zMXy*wRgD,,k.=4:3M{(P"i6S;\az~ut3z`;?*Y;&]11<(EPF-SN`|3PhyL%~AuZpoFjjE_oM1`znHPq_?uib2WXwE+q@m),cLq~B$r^5uO]u6?CEecn=%xsDXNVa(1DX.)O(
Cancel-Lock: sha1:Znxsc3LngPGHXAPJ6tsiuNFRX6c=
Lines: 24
X-Complaints-To: abuse@tweaknews.nl
NNTP-Posting-Date: Sun, 15 May 2022 16:15:40 UTC
Date: Sun, 15 May 2022 12:15:52 -0400
X-Received-Bytes: 2454
 by: Quinn C - Sun, 15 May 2022 16:15 UTC

* Peter T. Daniels:

> On Sunday, May 15, 2022 at 11:15:48 AM UTC-4, Quinn C wrote:
>> * Peter T. Daniels:
>>> On Sunday, May 15, 2022 at 1:29:26 AM UTC-4, Hibou wrote:
>
> [BrE/AmE]
>>>> There are certainly a lot of differences in transport-transportation:
>>>> lorry-truck, pavement-sidewalk, give-way-yield, underground-subway,
>>>> subway-?,
>>> We don't have those weird underground pervy toilets.
>>
>> More likely, just like anywhere else, you don't have them any more.
>
> I doubt it. Where would they have been?

How would I know? But an online search quickly yields:

<https://www.richlandsource.com/area_history/the-famous-central-park-underground-restrooms/article_16b1c4d2-c503-11e5-890c-6360a850aa28.html>

--
Quinn C
My pronouns are they/them
(or other gender-neutral ones)

Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidence

<59e90de45echarles@candehope.me.uk>

 copy mid

https://www.novabbs.com/interests/article-flat.php?id=131080&group=alt.usage.english#131080

 copy link   Newsgroups: alt.usage.english
Path: i2pn2.org!i2pn.org!weretis.net!feeder6.news.weretis.net!news.misty.com!border2.nntp.dca1.giganews.com!nntp.giganews.com!buffer2.nntp.dca1.giganews.com!nntp.orpheusnet.co.uk!news.orpheusnet.co.uk.POSTED!not-for-mail
NNTP-Posting-Date: Sun, 15 May 2022 11:29:10 -0500
From: char...@candehope.me.uk (charles)
Subject: Re: An interlingual phonetic coincidence
Newsgroups: alt.usage.english
Date: Sun, 15 May 2022 17:28:34 +0100
Message-ID: <59e90de45echarles@candehope.me.uk>
References: <4c01fefc-de7f-4031-a550-251a37425177n@googlegroups.com> <ed095e27-d963-4af9-a08f-6970b9137793n@googlegroups.com> <b83d050c-046d-48c7-9ff5-23414691ba62n@googlegroups.com> <c81698c1-6ff8-4d99-919e-30231c3af695n@googlegroups.com> <t5g7kh$rje$1@dont-email.me> <mn.5c527e65b71faa84.127094@snitoo> <je3rh8Fn132U1@mid.individual.net> <t5q33b$15dc$1@gioia.aioe.org> <t5q5hh$g24$1@dont-email.me> <t5qcvh$8hs$1@gioia.aioe.org> <t5qkdu$mdk$1@dont-email.me> <of828h99kbr4tejqbopn56t8ebs8qkjtbg@4ax.com>
User-Agent: Pluto/3.18 (RISC OS/5.29) NewsHound/v1.52-32
Organization: None
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
Cache-Post-Path: slave.orpheusnet.co.uk!unknown@81.5.154.219
X-Cache: nntpcache 3.0.2 (see http://www.nntpcache.com/)
Lines: 29
X-Usenet-Provider: http://www.giganews.com
X-Trace: sv3-NjOO53Hu0Lqt6y7aktaiBRH+Rv5YDbMhxU+i+xM5m/XxrYmF8um31TKYTO6n2T1xa2fJWbeV1jsTQXC!w+njCu/m6VmZsbCVZu5NZp8DnlAf7VimGQRVU3NmKIFh1ktRoBWmpRHl7s/x1PxPCKm0XamG8Ics!Bw==
X-Abuse-and-DMCA-Info: Please be sure to forward a copy of ALL headers
X-Abuse-and-DMCA-Info: Otherwise we will be unable to process your complaint properly
X-Postfilter: 1.3.40
X-Original-Bytes: 2654
 by: charles - Sun, 15 May 2022 16:28 UTC

In article <of828h99kbr4tejqbopn56t8ebs8qkjtbg@4ax.com>,
Ken Blake <Ken@invalid.news.com> wrote:
> On Sun, 15 May 2022 20:25:01 +1000, Peter Moylan
> <peter@pmoylan.org.invalid> wrote:

> >On 15/05/22 18:17, Hibou wrote:
> >> Le 15/05/2022 à 07:10, Peter Moylan a écrit :
> >>> On 15/05/22 15:29, Hibou wrote:
> >>>>
> >>>> There are certainly a lot of differences in
> >>>> transport-transportation: lorry-truck, pavement-sidewalk,
> >>>> give-way-yield, underground-subway, subway-?
> >>>
> >>> Underpass, I think. Or possibly tunnel.
> >>
> >> Usage is a bit fluid here in GB. In general, I would associate a
> >> subway with pedestrians and an underpass with vehicles.
> >
> >So would I, but I thought you were looking for the AmE term. As far as I
> >know a pedestrian underpass is not called a subway in the US.

> You are correct. In AmE a "subway" is what BrE calls "tube" or
> "underground."

Unless the "subway" is a sort of sandwich

--
from KT24 in Surrey, England
"I'd rather die of exhaustion than die of boredom" Thomas Carlyle

Pages:12345678910111213141516171819202122232425262728
server_pubkey.txt

rocksolid light 0.9.7
clearnet tor