|"I've done a right thing. Well, the short and the long of it is,
|I'm determined to get Farren a place, and I reckon on you to give
|him one."
| |"This is cool, however!" exclaimed Mr. Yorke. "What right have
|you to reckon on me to provide for your dismissed workmen?
|What do I know about your Farrens and your Williams?
|I've heard he's an honest man; but am I to support all the
|honest men in Yorkshire? You may say that would be no great
|charge to undertake; but great or little, I'll none of it."
| "Shirley" (1849) - Charlotte Bronte (1816/1855)

On 20/05/2022 14:43, Stefan Ram wrote:
> |"I've done a right thing. Well, the short and the long of it is,
> |I'm determined to get Farren a place, and I reckon on you to give
> |him one."
> |
> |"This is cool, however!" exclaimed Mr. Yorke. "What right have
> |you to reckon on me to provide for your dismissed workmen?
> |What do I know about your Farrens and your Williams?
> |I've heard he's an honest man; but am I to support all the
> |honest men in Yorkshire? You may say that would be no great
> |charge to undertake; but great or little, I'll none of it."
> |
> "Shirley" (1849) - Charlotte Bronte (1816/1855)
>
This is not the 20th C. "cool". It is more likely to be the "lack of due
respect" meaning. "They were given a cool reception".

--
Ray
UK

On Friday, May 20, 2022 at 9:19:43 AM UTC-6, musika wrote:
> On 20/05/2022 14:43, Stefan Ram wrote:
> > |"I've done a right thing. Well, the short and the long of it is,
> > |I'm determined to get Farren a place, and I reckon on you to give
> > |him one."
> > |
> > |"This is cool, however!" exclaimed Mr. Yorke. "What right have
> > |you to reckon on me to provide for your dismissed workmen?
> > |What do I know about your Farrens and your Williams?
> > |I've heard he's an honest man; but am I to support all the
> > |honest men in Yorkshire? You may say that would be no great
> > |charge to undertake; but great or little, I'll none of it."
> > |
> > "Shirley" (1849) - Charlotte Bronte (1816/1855)
> >
> This is not the 20th C. "cool". It is more likely to be the "lack of due
> respect" meaning. "They were given a cool reception".

Specifically, I'd say, the OED's sense

2. d. Of a person, an action, or a person's behaviour: assured and
unabashed where diffidence and hesitation would be expected;
composedly and deliberately audacious or impudent in making a
proposal, demand, or assumption.

--
Jerry Friedman

Charlotte Bronte, quoted by Stefan Ram:
> > "This is cool, however!" exclaimed Mr. Yorke. "What right have
> > you to reckon on me to provide for your dismissed workmen?

"Ray":
> This is not the 20th C. "cool". It is more likely to be the "lack of due
> respect" meaning. "They were given a cool reception".

Yes. Or a simple one-word translation into modern usage would be "cold".
--
Mark Brader, Toronto | An actual human would feel guilt in this situation.
msb@vex.net | -- Scott Adams: Dilbert

On Fri, 20 May 2022 18:24:07 -0500, Mark Brader wrote:

> Charlotte Bronte, quoted by Stefan Ram:
>> > "This is cool, however!" exclaimed Mr. Yorke. "What right have you to
>> > reckon on me to provide for your dismissed workmen?
>
> "Ray":
>> This is not the 20th C. "cool". It is more likely to be the "lack of
>> due respect" meaning. "They were given a cool reception".
>
> Yes. Or a simple one-word translation into modern usage would be
> "cold".

What modern usage is that?

A more accurate modern usage might be "Chutzpah".

A cold reception, a frosty reception, an icy reception, is an implicitly
hostile one.

--
Steve Hayes http://khanya.wordpress.com

On 23/05/2022 4:19 p.m., Steve Hayes wrote:
> On Fri, 20 May 2022 18:24:07 -0500, Mark Brader wrote:
>
>> Charlotte Bronte, quoted by Stefan Ram:
>>>> "This is cool, however!" exclaimed Mr. Yorke. "What right have you to
>>>> reckon on me to provide for your dismissed workmen?
>>
>> "Ray":
>>> This is not the 20th C. "cool". It is more likely to be the "lack of
>>> due respect" meaning. "They were given a cool reception".
>>
>> Yes. Or a simple one-word translation into modern usage would be
>> "cold".
>
> What modern usage is that?
>
> A more accurate modern usage might be "Chutzpah".
>
> A cold reception, a frosty reception, an icy reception, is an implicitly
> hostile one.
>

OED 2d. Of a person, an action, or a person's behaviour: assured and
unabashed where diffidence and hesitation would be expected; composedly
and deliberately audacious or impudent in making a proposal, demand, or
assumption.

or 3b.Exhibiting or demonstrating a lack of warmth of affection; not
cordial, unfriendly.

On 23/05/2022 6:56 p.m., Ross Clark wrote:
> On 23/05/2022 4:19 p.m., Steve Hayes wrote:
>> On Fri, 20 May 2022 18:24:07 -0500, Mark Brader wrote:
>>
>>> Charlotte Bronte, quoted by Stefan Ram:
>>>>> "This is cool, however!" exclaimed Mr. Yorke. "What right have you to
>>>>> reckon on me to provide for your dismissed workmen?
>>>
>>> "Ray":
>>>> This is not the 20th C. "cool". It is more likely to be the "lack of
>>>> due respect" meaning. "They were given a cool reception".
>>>
>>> Yes.  Or a simple one-word translation into modern usage would be
>>> "cold".
>>
>> What modern usage is that?
>>
>> A more accurate modern usage might be "Chutzpah".
>>
>> A cold reception, a frosty reception, an icy reception, is an implicitly
>> hostile one.
>>
>
> OED 2d. Of a person, an action, or a person's behaviour: assured and
> unabashed where diffidence and hesitation would be expected; composedly
> and deliberately audacious or impudent in making a proposal, demand, or
> assumption.
>
> or 3b.Exhibiting or demonstrating a lack of warmth of affection; not
> cordial, unfriendly.

Just to be clear: OED does not have the Bronte quote, but both the above
senses were possible at that time.

In article <t6f211$mgu$2@dont-email.me>, hayesstw@telkomsa.net says...
>
> On Fri, 20 May 2022 18:24:07 -0500, Mark Brader wrote:
>
> > Charlotte Bronte, quoted by Stefan Ram:
> >> > "This is cool, however!" exclaimed Mr. Yorke. "What right have you to
> >> > reckon on me to provide for your dismissed workmen?
> >
> > "Ray":
> >> This is not the 20th C. "cool". It is more likely to be the "lack of
> >> due respect" meaning. "They were given a cool reception".
> >
> > Yes. Or a simple one-word translation into modern usage would be
> > "cold".
>
> What modern usage is that?

The context Ray just posted is current in Br E.

Context rools.

"The agenda received a cool reception" means it was greeted with chilly
reserve, a lack of enthusiasm or support.

>
> A more accurate modern usage might be "Chutzpah".

Nope. Chutzpah implies audacity, cheek, effrontery, nerve, and
temerity. But not, implicit rejection.

Janet

On 23/05/22 21:50, Janet wrote:
> In article <t6f211$mgu$2@dont-email.me>, hayesstw@telkomsa.net says...
>>
>> On Fri, 20 May 2022 18:24:07 -0500, Mark Brader wrote:
>>
>>> Charlotte Bronte, quoted by Stefan Ram:
>>>>> "This is cool, however!" exclaimed Mr. Yorke. "What right have you to
>>>>> reckon on me to provide for your dismissed workmen?
>>>
>>> "Ray":
>>>> This is not the 20th C. "cool". It is more likely to be the "lack of
>>>> due respect" meaning. "They were given a cool reception".
>>>
>>> Yes. Or a simple one-word translation into modern usage would be
>>> "cold".
>>
>> What modern usage is that?
>
> The context Ray just posted is current in Br E.
>
> Context rools.
>
> "The agenda received a cool reception" means it was greeted with chilly
> reserve, a lack of enthusiasm or support.
>
>>
>> A more accurate modern usage might be "Chutzpah".
>
> Nope. Chutzpah implies audacity, cheek, effrontery, nerve, and
> temerity.

Which is exactly what Mr Yorke was complaining about in the Bronte quote.

--
Peter Moylan Newcastle, NSW http://www.pmoylan.org

In message <t6f211$mgu$2@dont-email.me> Steve Hayes <hayesstw@telkomsa.net> wrote:
> On Fri, 20 May 2022 18:24:07 -0500, Mark Brader wrote:

>> Charlotte Bronte, quoted by Stefan Ram:
>>> > "This is cool, however!" exclaimed Mr. Yorke. "What right have you to
>>> > reckon on me to provide for your dismissed workmen?
>>
>> "Ray":
>>> This is not the 20th C. "cool". It is more likely to be the "lack of
>>> due respect" meaning. "They were given a cool reception".
>>
>> Yes. Or a simple one-word translation into modern usage would be
>> "cold".

> What modern usage is that?

Let's say.. my lifetime?

> A more accurate modern usage might be "Chutzpah".

> A cold reception, a frosty reception, an icy reception, is an implicitly
> hostile one.

I would say that frosty and icy lean more towards openly hostile, but
cold does not (and icy is colder and more hostile than frosty which is
more a hunt of hostility).

--
'I like the sound of that,' said Mrs Palm. 'I like the echoes,' said
Dr Downey.

On Monday, May 23, 2022 at 4:10:36 PM UTC-6, Lewis wrote:
> In message <t6f211$mgu$2...@dont-email.me> Steve Hayes <haye...@telkomsa.net> wrote:
> > On Fri, 20 May 2022 18:24:07 -0500, Mark Brader wrote:
>
> >> Charlotte Bronte, quoted by Stefan Ram:
> >>> > "This is cool, however!" exclaimed Mr. Yorke. "What right have you to
> >>> > reckon on me to provide for your dismissed workmen?
> >>
> >> "Ray":
> >>> This is not the 20th C. "cool". It is more likely to be the "lack of
> >>> due respect" meaning. "They were given a cool reception".
> >>
> >> Yes. Or a simple one-word translation into modern usage would be
> >> "cold".
>
> > What modern usage is that?

> Let's say.. my lifetime?

You hear people answer unreasonable requests with "That's cold"?

> > A more accurate modern usage might be "Chutzpah".
>
> > A cold reception, a frosty reception, an icy reception, is an implicitly
> > hostile one.

> I would say that frosty and icy lean more towards openly hostile, but
> cold does not (and icy is colder and more hostile than frosty which is
> more a hunt of hostility).

I agree that a cold reception might just be lack of interest or agreement,
without hostility.

--
Jerry Friedman

In message <ac1638c6-cc86-4f68-a3b3-25fd56abdaf2n@googlegroups.com> Jerry Friedman <jerry_friedman@yahoo.com> wrote:
> On Monday, May 23, 2022 at 4:10:36 PM UTC-6, Lewis wrote:
>> In message <t6f211$mgu$2...@dont-email.me> Steve Hayes <haye...@telkomsa.net> wrote:
>> > On Fri, 20 May 2022 18:24:07 -0500, Mark Brader wrote:
>>
>> >> Charlotte Bronte, quoted by Stefan Ram:
>> >>> > "This is cool, however!" exclaimed Mr. Yorke. "What right have you to
>> >>> > reckon on me to provide for your dismissed workmen?
>> >>
>> >> "Ray":
>> >>> This is not the 20th C. "cool". It is more likely to be the "lack of
>> >>> due respect" meaning. "They were given a cool reception".
>> >>
>> >> Yes. Or a simple one-word translation into modern usage would be
>> >> "cold".
>>
>> > What modern usage is that?

>> Let's say.. my lifetime?

> You hear people answer unreasonable requests with "That's cold"?

I hear people say "That's cold" for a large variety of things. That
phrase by itself can mean heartless, mean, funny, dramatic, indifferent,
unreasonable, and surly more I cannot think of at the moment. But I was
responding specifically to the questioning "lack of respect" as
"cool/cold" and that is certainly normal.

>> I would say that frosty and icy lean more towards openly hostile, but
>> cold does not (and icy is colder and more hostile than frosty which is
>> more a hunt of hostility).

> I agree that a cold reception might just be lack of interest or agreement,
> without hostility.

--
Quis custodiet opsos custodes