It's unclear what prompted you to post this just now, Dave, but I'm sure glad you did.

This set me straight on an important moment from the 1950s. For I had misremembered that Khrushchev first used his famous phrase in Moscow during the so-called Kitchen Debate with Vice President Milhous during the veep's USSR tour...and more further proof of how old I'm getting.

BRYAN STYBLE/Florida

On Sunday, July 10, 2022 at 10:36:10 AM UTC-4, Dave P. wrote:
> Commies used to be called the "Reds". How did it
> get changed to the "Blues" and the "Greens"?

I think it's safe to say that most American liberals (as opposed to leftists) are not eager to become Communists, understand well enough how Orwell came to write "Animal Farm," and are determined not to let conservatives lump them together, the way conservatives often did in the early 1970s. Hence, the choice of blue as their color. (Why liberals in at least some European nations apparently don't mind using the same color for both liberalism and communism is another matter. But on the flip side, it reminds me of how some American conservatives are proud to call themselves "rednecks.")

I think I can clear up this oft-posed why-red-for-the-right? question:

I am informed (reliably, I hope) that the red=GOP/blue=Dems graphics convention dates to the 1980 election night coverage on NBC, and ABC News soon if not immediately followed with the practice; John Chancellor is said to have been behind the idea originally.*

By the 1984 election, ABC News was using it as well; not sure when CBS News started doing so.

I specifically remember ABC employing it, because I distinctly remember a comment the ever-erudite George Will made to the sainted David Brinkley (whose usually-witty but always-sterling election-night anchoring was hamstrung by his insufferably-smug co-anchor Peter Jennings), noting the only blue was tiny-on=-the-map D.C. (as home-state Minnesota had not yet been called for Mondale as his only win other than D.C.):

"You know, David, looking up at the map [which was registering Reagan's unfolding 49-state landslide Reagan over Mondale], the President might be inclined to think to himself, "Now that's a perfect visual metaphor for what I've been saying ALL ALONG--little seat-of-government D.C. has one view of America, while the rest of the nation has the opposing viewpoint, as portrayed by the sea of red engulfing tiny blue Washington."

[largely paraphrased, but also some of Will's words are verbatim--at least as best as I can recall nearly four decades later]

STYBLE/Florida
============* And the late great Chancellor certainly had first-rate credentials when it came to the ideological history of the color red: he was the NBC News correspondent posted to Moscow for about five years...during the 1950s!

In article <809d0aa1-452f-4eec-9431-304776d4fbacn@googlegroups.com>,
<"radioacti...@gmail.com"> wrote:

> I think I can clear up this oft-posed why-red-for-the-right? question:
>
> I am informed (reliably, I hope) that the red=GOP/blue=Dems graphics
> convention dates to the 1980 election night coverage on NBC, and ABC News
> soon if not immediately followed with the practice; John Chancellor is said
> to have been behind the idea originally.*
>
> By the 1984 election, ABC News was using it as well; not sure when CBS News
> started doing so.

The red-blue thing started in 1968. The nets assigned red and blue to
different parties, though, and white was used for George Wallace's
third party. The colors had been standardized across all three nets by
1976. I don't know if the dedicated colors were John Chancellor's idea
originally, but it wouldn't surprise me at all if it had been.

radioacti...@gmail.com <radioactiveseattle@gmail.com> wrote:
> It's unclear what prompted you to post this just now, Dave, but I'm sure glad you did.
>
> This set me straight on an important moment from the 1950s. For I had misremembered that Khrushchev first used his famous phrase in Moscow during the so-called Kitchen Debate with Vice President Milhous during the veep's USSR tour...and more further proof of how old I'm getting.
>
> BRYAN STYBLE/Florida

I wasn't around when it was delivered,but my cursory knowledge
of the history led me to believe that it was at a United Nations
meeting that he delivered the statement,punctuating it with
banging a shoe on the table with his hand...probably conflated
mentally with some other occasion of bluster from NSK.

-=-=-
The World Trade Center towers MUST rise again,
at least as tall as before...or terror has triumphed.

radioacti...@gmail.com <radioactiveseattle@gmail.com> wrote:
> I think I can clear up this oft-posed why-red-for-the-right? question:
>
> I am informed (reliably, I hope) that the red=GOP/blue=Dems graphics
> convention dates to the 1980 election night coverage on NBC, and ABC News
> soon if not immediately followed with the practice;

NO!!
Any informants who claim it is pre-2000 are NOT reliable.
The prolonged uncertainty of Bush-Gore is what afflicted
America with the counterintuitive linkage of the Republicans
with the "blood red flag of socialism" color and the Democrats
with the color of bluenoses,bluestockings,and continental
Conservatives.
In which I will NEVER concur.

> John Chancellor is said to have been behind the idea originally.*

I DID watch the 1980 election night coverage on NBC...and with
BLUE being the REPUBLICAN color of NBC's lit-up map,David Brinkley
referred to the map as "like a lake" in the flood of states going
for Reagan compared to the small red islands of Democratic Carter country.

> By the 1984 election, ABC News was using it as well; not sure when CBS News
> started doing so.
>
> I specifically remember ABC employing it, because I distinctly remember a
> comment the ever-erudite George Will made to the sainted David Brinkley
> (whose usually-witty but always-sterling election-night anchoring was
> hamstrung by his insufferably-smug co-anchor Peter Jennings), noting the
> only blue was tiny-on=-the-map D.C. (as home-state Minnesota had not yet
> been called for Mondale as his only win other than D.C.):
>
> "You know, David, looking up at the map [which was registering Reagan's
> unfolding 49-state landslide Reagan over Mondale], the President might be
> inclined to think to himself, "Now that's a perfect visual metaphor for what
> I've been saying ALL ALONG--little seat-of-government D.C. has one view of
> America, while the rest of the nation has the opposing viewpoint, as
> portrayed by the sea of red engulfing tiny blue Washington."
>
> [largely paraphrased, but also some of Will's words are verbatim--at least
> as best as I can recall nearly four decades later]
>
> STYBLE/Florida
> =============
> * And the late great Chancellor certainly had first-rate credentials when
> it came to the ideological history of the color red: he was the NBC News
> correspondent posted to Moscow for about five years...during the 1950s!

-=-=-
The World Trade Center towers MUST rise again,
at least as tall as before...or terror has triumphed.

A Friend <nope@noway.com> wrote:
> In article <809d0aa1-452f-4eec-9431-304776d4fbacn@googlegroups.com>,
> <"radioacti...@gmail.com"> wrote:
>
>> I think I can clear up this oft-posed why-red-for-the-right? question:
>>
>> I am informed (reliably, I hope) that the red=GOP/blue=Dems graphics
>> convention dates to the 1980 election night coverage on NBC, and ABC News
>> soon if not immediately followed with the practice; John Chancellor is said
>> to have been behind the idea originally.*
>>
>> By the 1984 election, ABC News was using it as well; not sure when CBS News
>> started doing so.
>
>
> The red-blue thing started in 1968. The nets assigned red and blue to
> different parties, though, and white was used for George Wallace's
> third party. The colors had been standardized across all three nets by
> 1976. I don't know if the dedicated colors were John Chancellor's idea
> originally, but it wouldn't surprise me at all if it had been.

No,no,no,no.
The standardization of the internationally-wrong colors to the
parties is a 2000-onward thing,the random assignments may date
back to the start of color television but not the R=R mistake.

-=-=-
The World Trade Center towers MUST rise again,
at least as tall as before...or terror has triumphed.

In article <tafudg$3cn$3@reader2.panix.com>, Louis Epstein
<le@top.put.com> wrote:

> A Friend <nope@noway.com> wrote:
> > In article <809d0aa1-452f-4eec-9431-304776d4fbacn@googlegroups.com>,
> > <"radioacti...@gmail.com"> wrote:
> >
> >> I think I can clear up this oft-posed why-red-for-the-right? question:
> >>
> >> I am informed (reliably, I hope) that the red=GOP/blue=Dems graphics
> >> convention dates to the 1980 election night coverage on NBC, and ABC News
> >> soon if not immediately followed with the practice; John Chancellor is said
> >> to have been behind the idea originally.*
> >>
> >> By the 1984 election, ABC News was using it as well; not sure when CBS News
> >> started doing so.
> >
> >
> > The red-blue thing started in 1968. The nets assigned red and blue to
> > different parties, though, and white was used for George Wallace's
> > third party. The colors had been standardized across all three nets by
> > 1976. I don't know if the dedicated colors were John Chancellor's idea
> > originally, but it wouldn't surprise me at all if it had been.
>
> No,no,no,no.
> The standardization of the internationally-wrong colors to the
> parties is a 2000-onward thing,the random assignments may date
> back to the start of color television but not the R=R mistake.

I'm not sure what you're talking about concerning the R=R mistake or,
for that matter, the international-wrong-colors mistake. However, I'm
not disagreeing with you about "standardization," since there was none
at the time. I may be misremembering about 1976.

A Friend <nope@noway.com> wrote:
> In article <tafudg$3cn$3@reader2.panix.com>, Louis Epstein
> <le@top.put.com> wrote:
>
>> A Friend <nope@noway.com> wrote:
>> > In article <809d0aa1-452f-4eec-9431-304776d4fbacn@googlegroups.com>,
>> > <"radioacti...@gmail.com"> wrote:
>> >
>> >> I think I can clear up this oft-posed why-red-for-the-right? question:
>> >>
>> >> I am informed (reliably, I hope) that the red=GOP/blue=Dems graphics
>> >> convention dates to the 1980 election night coverage on NBC, and ABC News
>> >> soon if not immediately followed with the practice; John Chancellor is said
>> >> to have been behind the idea originally.*
>> >>
>> >> By the 1984 election, ABC News was using it as well; not sure when CBS News
>> >> started doing so.
>> >
>> >
>> > The red-blue thing started in 1968. The nets assigned red and blue to
>> > different parties, though, and white was used for George Wallace's
>> > third party. The colors had been standardized across all three nets by
>> > 1976. I don't know if the dedicated colors were John Chancellor's idea
>> > originally, but it wouldn't surprise me at all if it had been.
>>
>> No,no,no,no.
>> The standardization of the internationally-wrong colors to the
>> parties is a 2000-onward thing,the random assignments may date
>> back to the start of color television but not the R=R mistake.
>
>
> I'm not sure what you're talking about concerning the R=R mistake or,
> for that matter, the international-wrong-colors mistake.

The mistake of equating (R)ed with (R)epublican,when red has
been associated with the left on a worldwide basis since at
least the 19th century.
Joe McCarthy would be in disbelief at seeing the party for
which he red-baited associated with red.

> However, I'm not disagreeing with you about "standardization," since there
> was none at the time. I may be misremembering about 1976.

-=-=-
The World Trade Center towers MUST rise again,
at least as tall as before...or terror has triumphed.

In article <tahp8q$8vi$1@reader2.panix.com>, Louis Epstein
<le@top.put.com> wrote:

> A Friend <nope@noway.com> wrote:
> > In article <tafudg$3cn$3@reader2.panix.com>, Louis Epstein
> > <le@top.put.com> wrote:
> >
> >> A Friend <nope@noway.com> wrote:
> >> > In article <809d0aa1-452f-4eec-9431-304776d4fbacn@googlegroups.com>,
> >> > <"radioacti...@gmail.com"> wrote:
> >> >
> >> >> I think I can clear up this oft-posed why-red-for-the-right? question:
> >> >>
> >> >> I am informed (reliably, I hope) that the red=GOP/blue=Dems graphics
> >> >> convention dates to the 1980 election night coverage on NBC, and ABC
> >> >> News
> >> >> soon if not immediately followed with the practice; John Chancellor is
> >> >> said
> >> >> to have been behind the idea originally.*
> >> >>
> >> >> By the 1984 election, ABC News was using it as well; not sure when CBS
> >> >> News
> >> >> started doing so.
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > The red-blue thing started in 1968. The nets assigned red and blue to
> >> > different parties, though, and white was used for George Wallace's
> >> > third party. The colors had been standardized across all three nets by
> >> > 1976. I don't know if the dedicated colors were John Chancellor's idea
> >> > originally, but it wouldn't surprise me at all if it had been.
> >>
> >> No,no,no,no.
> >> The standardization of the internationally-wrong colors to the
> >> parties is a 2000-onward thing,the random assignments may date
> >> back to the start of color television but not the R=R mistake.
> >
> >
> > I'm not sure what you're talking about concerning the R=R mistake or,
> > for that matter, the international-wrong-colors mistake.
>
> The mistake of equating (R)ed with (R)epublican,when red has
> been associated with the left on a worldwide basis since at
> least the 19th century.
> Joe McCarthy would be in disbelief at seeing the party for
> which he red-baited associated with red.

I see. To tell you the truth, that always struck me as a bit odd, too.