isn't anything like what the Media portray.

Donetz (and Lughansk) was founded by this guy

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Hughes_(businessman)

who came from

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Merthyr_Tydfil

and brought a whole lot of Welsh coal miners to "settle",

which led to

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nestor_Makhno

and

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Revolutionary_Insurrectionary_Army_of_Ukraine

What they don't talk about *anywhere* is that the Black Army's commanders
used a secret language from the coalmines that the Russian secret police
couldn't grasp: Welsh.

Just thot y'd like t'know ;)

Nikki Kruschev figgered to ballance the OUN by giving Ukraine the Donetz ;-)

Most of what he did worked out ok...

Dhu

--
Je suis Canadien. Ce n'est pas Francais ou Anglaise.
C'est une esp`ece de sauvage: ne obliviscaris, vix ea nostra voco;-)

Dhu on Gate, <news:ssqth0$lm7$1@dont-email.me>

> isn't anything like what the Media portray.
>
> Donetz (and Lughansk) was founded by this guy
>
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Hughes_(businessman)
>
> who came from
>
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Merthyr_Tydfil
>
> and brought a whole lot of Welsh coal miners

About 100 persons.

> to "settle",

He bought a piece of land encumbered with a concession obligation
and moved permanently to Russian Empire to implement the
concession. It turned out successful business. Donetsk grew due
to this enterprise, true. Lughansk had nothing to do with Hughes
(although another Englishman conducted geological surveys there
in the late 18th century). Untill the 19th century, these areas
remained to be 'Wild Fields' because of the Crimean Tatar threat.

> which led to
>
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nestor_Makhno

No it didn't.

Makhno was born and spent his younger years in Zaporozhia area. It
is neighboring to the Donetsk area, but still differs historically
and culturally. Anarchism would be more typal for Zaporozhia.

> and
>
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Revolutionary_Insurrectionary_Army_of_Ukraine
>
> What they don't talk about *anywhere* is that the Black Army's commanders
> used a secret language from the coalmines that the Russian secret police
> couldn't grasp: Welsh.

BS

"Russian secret police" had ended in 1917. "Black Army" emerged in
1918. It attracted adherents of leftist anarchism from various areas,
and its commanders had nothing special to do with Welsh.

> Just thot y'd like t'know ;)
>
> Nikki Kruschev figgered to ballance the OUN by giving Ukraine the Donetz ;-)
>
> Most of what he did worked out ok...

Dhu is trolling.

On Wed, 26 Jan 2022 15:29:28 +0300, Oleg Smirnov wrote:

> Dhu on Gate, <news:ssqth0$lm7$1@dont-email.me>
>
>> isn't anything like what the Media portray.
>>
>> Donetz (and Lughansk) was founded by this guy
>>
>> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Hughes_(businessman)
>>
>> who came from
>>
>> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Merthyr_Tydfil
>>
>> and brought a whole lot of Welsh coal miners
>
> About 100 persons.

A lot more cam on their own.
Welsh was the operating language in a lot of the area's mines.

>
>> to "settle",
>
> He bought a piece of land encumbered with a concession obligation
> and moved permanently to Russian Empire to implement the
> concession. It turned out successful business. Donetsk grew due
> to this enterprise, true. Lughansk had nothing to do with Hughes
> (although another Englishman conducted geological surveys there
> in the late 18th century). Untill the 19th century, these areas
> remained to be 'Wild Fields' because of the Crimean Tatar threat.
>
>> which led to
>>
>> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nestor_Makhno
>
> No it didn't.
>
> Makhno was born and spent his younger years in Zaporozhia area. It
> is neighboring to the Donetsk area, but still differs historically

About a hundred clicks away.

> and culturally. Anarchism would be more typal for Zaporozhia.

Welshmen are not big supporters of the Crown. Believe it.

>
>> and
>>
>> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Revolutionary_Insurrectionary_Army_of_Ukraine
>>
>> What they don't talk about *anywhere* is that the Black Army's commanders
>> used a secret language from the coalmines that the Russian secret police
>> couldn't grasp: Welsh.
>
> BS
>
> "Russian secret police" had ended in 1917. "Black Army" emerged in
> 1918. It attracted adherents of leftist anarchism from various areas,
> and its commanders had nothing special to do with Welsh.

The secret police are a continuous presence. Seizing the Okrana's files
was the basis of Joe Steel's power and allowed for institutional continuity.

Their gripe with the Black Army is it was seen as "Foreign Led".

>
>> Just thot y'd like t'know ;)
>>
>> Nikki Kruschev figgered to ballance the OUN by giving Ukraine the Donetz ;-)
>>
>> Most of what he did worked out ok...
>
> Dhu is trolling.

No.
I actually believe Nikita Kruschev was one of the greatest men of the 20th Century.
Attaching the Donets to Ukraine was an attempt by him to deal with the OUN preblom
in western Ukraine.

Dhu

--
Je suis Canadien. Ce n'est pas Francais ou Anglaise.
C'est une esp`ece de sauvage: ne obliviscaris, vix ea nostra voco;-)

Dhu on Gate, <news:sssg1q$lm7$4@dont-email.me>
> On Wed, 26 Jan 2022 15:29:28 +0300, Oleg Smirnov wrote:

>>> isn't anything like what the Media portray.
>>>
>>> Donetz (and Lughansk) was founded by this guy
>>>
>>> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Hughes_(businessman)
>>>
>>> who came from
>>>
>>> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Merthyr_Tydfil
>>>
>>> and brought a whole lot of Welsh coal miners
>>
>> About 100 persons.
>
> A lot more cam on their own.
> Welsh was the operating language in a lot of the area's mines.
>
>>> to "settle",
>>
>> He bought a piece of land encumbered with a concession obligation
>> and moved permanently to Russian Empire to implement the
>> concession. It turned out successful business. Donetsk grew due
>> to this enterprise, true. Lughansk had nothing to do with Hughes
>> (although another Englishman conducted geological surveys there
>> in the late 18th century). Untill the 19th century, these areas
>> remained to be 'Wild Fields' because of the Crimean Tatar threat.
>>
>>> which led to
>>>
>>> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nestor_Makhno
>>
>> No it didn't.
>>
>> Makhno was born and spent his younger years in Zaporozhia area. It
>> is neighboring to the Donetsk area, but still differs historically
>
> About a hundred clicks away.
>
>> and culturally. Anarchism would be more typal for Zaporozhia.
>
> Welshmen are not big supporters of the Crown. Believe it.

Irrelevant.

Hughes brought some qualified staff for middle management which
later either returned back to Britain or have become "russified"
(he died in 1889, and his offspring left Russia few years later).

The Crimean Khanate was defeated in 1770s, what made it possible
to begin domestication of the 'virgin' steppe lands. For the
present day Ukraine, it roughly corresponds to the blue area in
this picture <http://bit.ly/3AAQxpH>. The imperial government
stimulated resettlement to these steppes from other Russia areas
as well as welcomed European 'colonists', so the Hughes' case
was not something especial. There were many groups of foreigners
coming from various parts of Europe, but their number was still
incomparably less against the Russians.

Since the late 19th century and in the early 19th century, when
situation in the Russian Empire became socially unstable, quite
a large part of such 'colonists', who were 'easy going' kind,
chose to emigrate from Russia to North America or back to Europe
while the rest assimilated.

The Hughes' enterprise was a little element within this bigger
picture, so it's silly to attribute to those Welshmen a special
influence to the Makhno's anarchist movement.

>>> and
>>>
>>> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Revolutionary_Insurrectionary_Army_of_Ukraine
>>>
>>> What they don't talk about *anywhere* is that the Black Army's commanders
>>> used a secret language from the coalmines that the Russian secret police
>>> couldn't grasp: Welsh.
>>
>> BS
>>
>> "Russian secret police" had ended in 1917. "Black Army" emerged in
>> 1918. It attracted adherents of leftist anarchism from various areas,
>> and its commanders had nothing special to do with Welsh.
>
> The secret police are a continuous presence. Seizing the Okrana's files
> was the basis of Joe Steel's power and allowed for institutional continuity.
>
> Their gripe with the Black Army is it was seen as "Foreign Led".
>
>>
>>> Just thot y'd like t'know ;)
>>>
>>> Nikki Kruschev figgered to ballance the OUN by giving Ukraine the Donetz
>>> ;-)
>>>
>>> Most of what he did worked out ok...
>>
>> Dhu is trolling.
>
> No.
> I actually believe Nikita Kruschev was one of the greatest men of the 20th
> Century.
> Attaching the Donets to Ukraine was an attempt by him to deal with the OUN
> preblom
> in western Ukraine.
>
> Dhu
>
> --
> Je suis Canadien. Ce n'est pas Francais ou Anglaise.
> C'est une esp`ece de sauvage: ne obliviscaris, vix ea nostra voco;-)

Learn the Ukraine history: <https://tinyurl.com/yh33mena>

Oleg Smirnov, <news:sstfel$kek$1@os.motzarella.org>

> Since the late 19th century and in the early 19th century, when

Correction: .. and in the early 20th century ..

On Wed, 26 Jan 2022 15:29:28 +0300, Oleg Smirnov wrote:

>>
>> Nikki Kruschev figgered to ballance the OUN by giving Ukraine the Donetz
>> ;-)
>>
>> Most of what he did worked out ok...
>
> Dhu is trolling.

I'd also like to propose that, before joining NATO or furthering
it's defensive arraignments with CSTO, we need to recognize, in
some official manner, that Ukraine has a "Special Relationship"
to Russia, much like what some would claim for Britain and the
USA.

Similarly for Taiwan and China: China's "legal" claim to Taiwan
rests solely on the legitimacy of the Kuomintang as a lawful and
legal Chinese Political Party (which makes it pretty shakey, indeed).

But there is a Treasure Hall in a Mountain north of Taipei that makes
it clear that the Kuomintang took a lot from China, including it's
intelligentsia. So there too is a "special relationship" that needs
recognition.

Dhu

--
Je suis Canadien. Ce n'est pas Francais ou Anglaise.
C'est une esp`ece de sauvage: ne obliviscaris, vix ea nostra voco;-)

On Thu, 27 Jan 2022 09:54:11 +0300, Oleg Smirnov wrote:

> Learn the Ukraine history: <https://tinyurl.com/yh33mena>

Odessa and Crimea were part of the Ancient Wierld, before
there was Kiev'n Russ or the Duchy of Moscow. Russia and
Ukraine both claim some inheritance of civil structure from
there.

Dhu

--
Je suis Canadien. Ce n'est pas Francais ou Anglaise.
C'est une esp`ece de sauvage: ne obliviscaris, vix ea nostra voco;-)

Dhu on Gate, <news:st05lb$q5b$6@dont-email.me>
> On Thu, 27 Jan 2022 09:54:11 +0300, Oleg Smirnov wrote:
>
>> Learn the Ukraine history: <https://tinyurl.com/yh33mena>
>
> Odessa and Crimea were part of the Ancient Wierld, before
> there was Kiev'n Russ or the Duchy of Moscow. Russia and
> Ukraine both claim some inheritance of civil structure from
> there.

About the early Russia read here <https://tinyurl.com/y8tkbghy>

On Fri, 28 Jan 2022 16:42:10 +0300, Oleg Smirnov wrote:

> Dhu on Gate, <news:st05lb$q5b$6@dont-email.me>
>> On Thu, 27 Jan 2022 09:54:11 +0300, Oleg Smirnov wrote:
>>
>>> Learn the Ukraine history: <https://tinyurl.com/yh33mena>
>>
>> Odessa and Crimea were part of the Ancient Wierld, before
>> there was Kiev'n Russ or the Duchy of Moscow. Russia and
>> Ukraine both claim some inheritance of civil structure from
>> there.
>
> About the early Russia read here <https://tinyurl.com/y8tkbghy>

Oh, we can go further back than that. The NAZIs were right about
red hair, just a little off with the time-scale and actors: the
reds are Mischlings alright, but it's not "Africans and Jews" it
was Neanderthals and there _WAS_ are race war and by and large
the bad guys won: that's us.

Dhu

--
Je suis Canadien. Ce n'est pas Francais ou Anglaise.
C'est une esp`ece de sauvage: ne obliviscaris, vix ea nostra voco;-)

> Learn the Ukraine history: <https://tinyurl.com/yh33mena>

....

Below's what it looks like from Africa.

<https://tinyurl.com/ybtdg54o> premiumtimesng.com

In other words, if Russian troops, according to the U.S., have been fighting
in Eastern Ukraine since 2014, why does Russia need to 'invade' Ukraine when
all it needs to do is push towards Kiev?

Perhaps NATO has been silent about the civil war in Ukraine partly because
it is more a case of its ally rejecting Western democracy and relying on
violence and non-constitutional means to attain power or change government.
The Ukrainian crises began in 2004 when Viktor Yanukovych from the East won
the presidential election. But some pro-West Ukrainians refused to accept
his victory as he was seen as pro-Russian. Mass protests erupted,
especially in Kiev.

It was christened the Orange Revolution. The election was upturned and in
the new election, the rival candidate, Viktor Yushchenko, was declared
winner. In the 2010 presidential election, again Yanukovych won.

This time, his electoral victory was accepted. But four years later, when
his government decided to sign a trade agreement with Russia, rather than
the European Union, Ukrainians, mostly in the Kiev region, protested,
killing over 100 persons. President Yanukovych was overthrown in a coup. The
angry Eastern populace which was witnessing the second unconstitutional move
against a leader from their region, declared themselves independent and took
up arms. Half the Ukrainian troops in that region joined the rebel army.

This led to the on-going Ukrainian Civil War ..

Read more <https://tinyurl.com/ybtdg54o>

....

The writer has gotten the point: "rejecting .. democracy and relying on
violence and non-constitutional means to attain power or change government."
The cultist Westerners believe that if violence and non-constitutional
means are "pro-West", then it's still democracy, "automatically". However,
non-Westerners don't share this fetish, even if they are pro-democracy.

The first casualty of war is .......

In article <SeadnbCJhcLh1WL8nZ2dnUU7-KOdnZ2d@earthlink.com>,
25.BZ942 <25BZ492.net> wrote:
>The first casualty of war is .......

TRUTH!!
--
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Yahweh, Queen & country!Never Satan President Republic!Beware AntiChrist rising!
Look at Psalms 14 and 53 on Atheism https://www.empire.kred/ROOTNK?t=94a1f39b
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