On Friday, July 2, 2021 at 11:38:06 AM UTC-4, ltlee1 wrote:
> https://www.aspeninstitute.org/wp-content/uploads/2017/07/Abramson.Trust-and-Democracy.pdf
>
> A straight forward, easy to understand article.
>
> In short, society needs horizontal trust, i.e. trust between people and parties and vertical trust, i.e., trust between the government and the governed, to thrive.
> It also has a list on why trust is low in America.
>
> America is low on both.

It is a matter of time that an untrustworthy government would be considered to be an illegitimate government by some citizens. And the continuous threat of mass extremism. Many people will not recognize current US laws.

"According to local police: "during a motor vehicle stop, several heavily armed men claiming to be from a group that does not recognize our laws exited their vehicles and fled into the woodline" near Interstate Highway 95.

The incident unfolded around 1:30 a.m. when a state trooper came across a group of 8 to 10 people refueling on the side of the I-95 highway in Wakefield, a suburb of Boston. The group was dressed in military-style uniforms, carried tactical gear like body cameras and helmets and had long guns slung over their shoulders.

They told officials they were on their way to Maine from Rhode Island for “training,” Col. Christopher Mason said.

Officials said they made two arrests and the rest of the group, which calls itself “Moorish American Arms,” fled into a wooded area that is now surrounded by police."

https://abcnews.go.com/US/massachusetts-police-responding-group-heavily-armed-men-claiming/story?id=78647486

On Saturday, July 3, 2021 at 7:49:32 AM UTC-7, ltlee1 wrote:
> On Friday, July 2, 2021 at 11:38:06 AM UTC-4, ltlee1 wrote:
> > https://www.aspeninstitute.org/wp-content/uploads/2017/07/Abramson.Trust-and-Democracy.pdf
> >
> > A straight forward, easy to understand article.
> >
> > In short, society needs horizontal trust, i.e. trust between people and parties and vertical trust, i.e., trust between the government and the governed, to thrive.
> > It also has a list on why trust is low in America.
> >
> > America is low on both.
>
> It is a matter of time that an untrustworthy government would be considered to be an illegitimate government by some citizens. And the continuous threat of mass extremism. Many people will not recognize current US laws.
>
> "According to local police: "during a motor vehicle stop, several heavily armed men claiming to be from a group that does not recognize our laws exited their vehicles and fled into the woodline" near Interstate Highway 95.
>
> The incident unfolded around 1:30 a.m. when a state trooper came across a group of 8 to 10 people refueling on the side of the I-95 highway in Wakefield, a suburb of Boston. The group was dressed in military-style uniforms, carried tactical gear like body cameras and helmets and had long guns slung over their shoulders.
>
> They told officials they were on their way to Maine from Rhode Island for “training,” Col. Christopher Mason said.
>
> Officials said they made two arrests and the rest of the group, which calls itself “Moorish American Arms,” fled into a wooded area that is now surrounded by police."
>
> https://abcnews.go.com/US/massachusetts-police-responding-group-heavily-armed-men-claiming/story?id=78647486

Interesting!!!!
What about the 14th Amendment, the right to bear arms????
As far as I can see, they didn't do anything wrong!!!!

On Saturday, July 3, 2021 at 1:37:23 PM UTC-7, Rusty Wyse wrote:
> On Saturday, July 3, 2021 at 7:49:32 AM UTC-7, ltlee1 wrote:
> > On Friday, July 2, 2021 at 11:38:06 AM UTC-4, ltlee1 wrote:
> > > https://www.aspeninstitute.org/wp-content/uploads/2017/07/Abramson.Trust-and-Democracy.pdf
> > >
> > > A straight forward, easy to understand article.
> > >
> > > In short, society needs horizontal trust, i.e. trust between people and parties and vertical trust, i.e., trust between the government and the governed, to thrive.
> > > It also has a list on why trust is low in America.
> > >
> > > America is low on both.
> >
> > It is a matter of time that an untrustworthy government would be considered to be an illegitimate government by some citizens. And the continuous threat of mass extremism. Many people will not recognize current US laws.
> >
> > "According to local police: "during a motor vehicle stop, several heavily armed men claiming to be from a group that does not recognize our laws exited their vehicles and fled into the woodline" near Interstate Highway 95..
> >
> > The incident unfolded around 1:30 a.m. when a state trooper came across a group of 8 to 10 people refueling on the side of the I-95 highway in Wakefield, a suburb of Boston. The group was dressed in military-style uniforms, carried tactical gear like body cameras and helmets and had long guns slung over their shoulders.
> >
> > They told officials they were on their way to Maine from Rhode Island for “training,” Col. Christopher Mason said.
> >
> > Officials said they made two arrests and the rest of the group, which calls itself “Moorish American Arms,” fled into a wooded area that is now surrounded by police."
> >
> > https://abcnews.go.com/US/massachusetts-police-responding-group-heavily-armed-men-claiming/story?id=78647486
> Interesting!!!!
> What about the 14th Amendment, the right to bear arms????

Correction:
Second Amendment. 14th Amendment defined "Natural born citizen".

> As far as I can see, they didn't do anything wrong!!!!

On Saturday, July 3, 2021 at 10:49:32 AM UTC-4, ltlee1 wrote:
> On Friday, July 2, 2021 at 11:38:06 AM UTC-4, ltlee1 wrote:
> > https://www.aspeninstitute.org/wp-content/uploads/2017/07/Abramson.Trust-and-Democracy.pdf
> >
> > A straight forward, easy to understand article.
> >
> > In short, society needs horizontal trust, i.e. trust between people and parties and vertical trust, i.e., trust between the government and the governed, to thrive.
> > It also has a list on why trust is low in America.
> >
> > America is low on both.

How to re-establish trust in the US?
Jeffrey Abramson listed the following factors:

1) Atomization as in "Bowling for Columbine"
2) Loss of optimism
3) Balkanization
4) Political polarization
5) Media coverage
6) Lost of trust in the media.

Jeffrey Abramson did not really provide answers on how to reverse the lack of trust. More important,
the list, while it looks OK, does not allow one to separate what are the causes and what are the effects.

Books like "Trust in a Polarized Age" by Kevin Vallier are supposed to address the issue.
But it only offers the same old, same old Western democracy orthodoxy.

Table of Content of the book:

"Introduction: Trust and Polarization
Chapter 1: Must Politics Be War Here and Now?
Chapter 2: Social and Political Trust: Concepts, Causes, and Consequences
Chapter 3: Civil Society and Freedom of Association
Chapter 4: The Market Economy
Chapter 5: The Welfare State
Chapter 6: Against Egalitarianism
Chapter 7: Democratic Constitutionalism
Chapter 8: Elections and Process Democracy
Epilogue: How is Trust Restored?"

Chapter 3 to Chapter 8 are given as ways increase trust, social as well as political.
In Chapter 6, the author advised against highly redistributive taxation and liberal socialism because
both would harm the economic base of trust and cannot produce
unsustainable positive effect on trust.

Problem: Hasn't the US practiced all Vallier's suggestion for decades?
Yet trust both horizontally and vertically are not improving, just getting worse.

>
> It is a matter of time that an untrustworthy government would be considered to be an illegitimate government by some citizens. And the continuous threat of mass extremism. Many people will not recognize current US laws.
>
> "According to local police: "during a motor vehicle stop, several heavily armed men claiming to be from a group that does not recognize our laws exited their vehicles and fled into the woodline" near Interstate Highway 95.
>
> The incident unfolded around 1:30 a.m. when a state trooper came across a group of 8 to 10 people refueling on the side of the I-95 highway in Wakefield, a suburb of Boston. The group was dressed in military-style uniforms, carried tactical gear like body cameras and helmets and had long guns slung over their shoulders.
>
> They told officials they were on their way to Maine from Rhode Island for “training,” Col. Christopher Mason said.
>
> Officials said they made two arrests and the rest of the group, which calls itself “Moorish American Arms,” fled into a wooded area that is now surrounded by police."
>
> https://abcnews.go.com/US/massachusetts-police-responding-group-heavily-armed-men-claiming/story?id=78647486