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interests / rec.boats / Re: Civil war in the United States is far more likely than you think. In fact, it may have already begun.

SubjectAuthor
* Civil war in the United States is far more likely than you think. Inwaynebatrecdotboats@hotmail.com
+* Re:Civil war in the United States is far more likely than youjustan
|+* Re: Civil war in the United States is far more likely than you think.waynebatrecdotboats@hotmail.com
||+- Re: Civil war in the United States is far more likely than youjustan
||`* Re: Civil war in the United States is far more likely than you think. In fact, iJohn H
|| +* Re: Civil war in the United States is far more likely than you think.waynebatrecdotboats@hotmail.com
|| |+* Re: Civil war in the United States is far more likely than youjustan
|| ||`- Re: Civil war in the United States is far more likely than you think.waynebatrecdotboats@hotmail.com
|| |+* Re: Civil war in the United States is far more likely thanBill
|| ||+- Re: Civil war in the United States is far more likely than youjustan
|| ||`- Re: Civil war in the United States is far more likely than you think. In fact, iMr Robot
|| |`- Re: Civil war in the United States is far more likely than you think. In fact, iJohn H
|| `- Re: Civil war in the United States is far more likely than you think. In fact, igfretwell
|`- Re: Civil war in the United States is far more likely than you think. In fact, iMr Robot
`* Re: Civil war in the United States is far more likely than you think.Mr. Luddite
 +* Re: Civil war in the United States is far more likely than you think.waynebatrecdotboats@hotmail.com
 |+* Re: Civil war in the United States is far more likely thanBill
 ||`- Re: Civil war in the United States is far more likely than youjustan
 |+- Re: Civil war in the United States is far more likely than you think. In fact, igfretwell
 |`* Re: Civil war in the United States is far more likely than you think.Mr. Luddite
 | +* Re: Civil war in the United States is far more likely than youJustan
 | |`* Re: Civil war in the United States is far more likely than you think.Mr. Luddite
 | | +* Re: Civil war in the United States is far more likely than youjustan
 | | |`* Re: Civil war in the United States is far more likely than you think. In fact, igfretwell
 | | | +* Re: Civil war in the United States is far more likely than youjustan
 | | | |`- Re: Civil war in the United States is far more likely than you think. In fact, igfretwell
 | | | `* Re: Civil war in the United States is far more likely than you think.waynebatrecdotboats@hotmail.com
 | | |  `- Re: Civil war in the United States is far more likely than you think.True North
 | | +* Re: Civil war in the United States is far more likely thanBill
 | | |`- Re: Civil war in the United States is far more likely than you think.Mr. Luddite
 | | `- Re: Civil war in the United States is far more likely than you think. In fact, igfretwell
 | `* Re: Civil war in the United States is far more likely than you think. In fact, igfretwell
 |  +- Re: Civil war in the United States is far more likely than youjustan
 |  +- Re: Civil war in the United States is far more likely than youjustan
 |  +* Re: Civil war in the United States is far more likely than you think.Mr. Luddite
 |  |`- Re: Civil war in the United States is far more likely than you think. In fact, igfretwell
 |  `- Re: Civil war in the United States is far more likely than you think. In fact, iMr Robot
 `- Re: Civil war in the United States is far more likely than you think. In fact, iMr Robot

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Re: Civil war in the United States is far more likely than you think. In fact, it may have already begun.

<srkamc$svj$1@dont-email.me>

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https://www.novabbs.com/interests/article-flat.php?id=3642&group=rec.boats#3642

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From: califbil...@gmail.com (Bill)
Newsgroups: rec.boats
Subject: Re: Civil war in the United States is far more likely than
you think. In fact, it may have already begun.
Date: Tue, 11 Jan 2022 16:19:24 -0000 (UTC)
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 by: Bill - Tue, 11 Jan 2022 16:19 UTC

Mr. Luddite <nothere@noland.com> wrote:
> On 1/10/2022 12:14 PM, Justan wrote:
>> On 1/10/22 6:53 AM, Mr. Luddite wrote:
>>> On 1/9/2022 3:16 PM, waynebatrecdotboats@hotmail.com wrote:
>>>> On Sunday, January 9, 2022 at 1:12:35 PM UTC-5, Mr. Luddite wrote:
>>>>> On 1/9/2022 12:14 PM, waynebatr...@hotmail.com wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> This is a very thought provoking and insightful article:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> https://www.marketwatch.com/story/civil-war-in-the-united-states-is-far-more-likely-than-you-think-in-fact-it-may-have-already-begun-11641418149
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>> Wayne, you might want to consider doing some more reading about this
>>>>> opinion article that is based on interests (and a newly released book)
>>>>>
>>>>> Walter is a professor of political science at the University of
>>>>> California at San Diego. Her primary interest and papers/
>>>>> publications are on the US and other Civil Wars.
>>>>>
>>>>> With that as a platform for her *opinions* it is not surprising
>>>>> that she'd tie current events to a pending Civil War.
>>>>>
>>>>> I read it (plus more about her) and take it with a grain of salt.
>>>>>
>>>>> If people with companies can make money selling toilet paper with
>>>>> pictures of Trump, Biden, Pelosi and others, she may as well join
>>>>> in in a more hi-brow manner and sell some books. :-)
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> ===
>>>>
>>>> Writers have been using magazine articles and opinion pieces to help
>>>> sell their books for a long time.  That doesn't bother me, and it
>>>> doesn't make their opinions less valuable and thought provoking.
>>>> The cultural shifts that she mentions are undeniable, and not
>>>> surprisingly many people are unhappy about it.  The risk is that
>>>> unhappiness will spill over into attempts at subverting our
>>>> democratic institutions and the constitution.  It's already
>>>> happening.  That's the wrong way to defend our cultural heritage, and
>>>> it will lead to increased strife in my opinion.
>>>
>>> Mrs.E. (a Trumpster) and I had a recent debate about the status of
>>> this country.
>>>
>>> My position is that although politically inspired
>>> dissension has existed for many decades, the current situation, full of
>>> animosity and hatred started when Donald Trump walked down the golden
>>> escalator and announced his candidacy for POTUS. Since then,
>>> throughout his term in office and to this day the division (which
>>> Walter claims
>>> may lead to a Civil War) continues.
>>>
>>> Before Trump, the country had elected Republicans and Democrats, often
>>> with much debate and alliances but Trump's eventual election started
>>> a whole new level of division that has pretty much erased any true
>>> moderate or "centralist"  beliefs.  People today are either left or
>>> right.  There is no other option.  If you don't hate Trump, you are
>>> a Trumpster ... and a racist to boot.
>>>
>>> Mrs. E.'s position is that the people elected him.
>>>
>>> I think if the Republicans had nominated someone else who shared the
>>> same policy views as Trump but was better equipped temperment-wise
>>> to execute those policies, we would not have the ultra political
>>> division that exists today.
>>>
>>> I think Trump did many things that were in the best interests of the
>>> USA.  I can't say the same for the current crop of Democrats.
>>>
>>> So, it's difficult to claim to be a "centralist" today.
>>>
>> What is really sad is that this division is based on a fellas personality.
>> The country is being made to suffer because the hate has driven the party
>> in power to undo all of the good things the prior administration has done
>> for the country. Anyone who believes the current administration is doing
>> good by America is out of his mind. I suppose it is possible for a
>> centralist to be out of his mind. :-)
>>
>
> My problem with Trump is that I believe that the office of POTUS
> requires a certain level of maturity, professionalism and a civil
> temperament, all of which Trump lacks. He acts more like a junior
> high school bully.
>
> Yesterday I spent an hour or so watching old videos of Ronald Reagan
> speeches including a debate with Jimmy Carter in 1980. Both were
> critical of each other's policy views but I was struck by the
> respect they gave each other personally. What a difference
> to what we witness today! Trump started his campaign by
> verbally harassing and personally attacking the other 16 Republicans
> seeking the GOP nomination .... well before the Democrat's "Russia,
> Russia, Russia" mantra really took hold. It's in his DNA.
>
> Anywhoo, let's see what happens in 2022 and 2024.
>

Maybe this is a sign of the times. Ok at all the nastiest on the
internet. We have are own Mr. Roomba…

Re: Civil war in the United States is far more likely than you think. In fact, it may have already begun.

<frmrtg111stmagdtq46880kk89kvbn78h8@4ax.com>

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From: gfretw...@aol.com
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Subject: Re: Civil war in the United States is far more likely than you think. In fact, it may have already begun.
Date: Tue, 11 Jan 2022 14:44:17 -0500
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 by: gfretw...@aol.com - Tue, 11 Jan 2022 19:44 UTC

On Tue, 11 Jan 2022 06:26:53 -0500, "Mr. Luddite" <nothere@noland.com>
wrote:

>On 1/10/2022 12:14 PM, Justan wrote:
>> On 1/10/22 6:53 AM, Mr. Luddite wrote:
>>> On 1/9/2022 3:16 PM, waynebatrecdotboats@hotmail.com wrote:
>>>> On Sunday, January 9, 2022 at 1:12:35 PM UTC-5, Mr. Luddite wrote:
>>>>> On 1/9/2022 12:14 PM, waynebatr...@hotmail.com wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> This is a very thought provoking and insightful article:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> https://www.marketwatch.com/story/civil-war-in-the-united-states-is-far-more-likely-than-you-think-in-fact-it-may-have-already-begun-11641418149
>>>>>>
>>>>> Wayne, you might want to consider doing some more reading about this
>>>>> opinion article that is based on interests (and a newly released book)
>>>>>
>>>>> Walter is a professor of political science at the University of
>>>>> California at San Diego. Her primary interest and papers/
>>>>> publications are on the US and other Civil Wars.
>>>>>
>>>>> With that as a platform for her *opinions* it is not surprising
>>>>> that she'd tie current events to a pending Civil War.
>>>>>
>>>>> I read it (plus more about her) and take it with a grain of salt.
>>>>>
>>>>> If people with companies can make money selling toilet paper with
>>>>> pictures of Trump, Biden, Pelosi and others, she may as well join
>>>>> in in a more hi-brow manner and sell some books. :-)
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> ===
>>>>
>>>> Writers have been using magazine articles and opinion pieces to help
>>>> sell their books for a long time.  That doesn't bother me, and it
>>>> doesn't make their opinions less valuable and thought provoking.
>>>> The cultural shifts that she mentions are undeniable, and not
>>>> surprisingly many people are unhappy about it.  The risk is that
>>>> unhappiness will spill over into attempts at subverting our
>>>> democratic institutions and the constitution.  It's already
>>>> happening.  That's the wrong way to defend our cultural heritage, and
>>>> it will lead to increased strife in my opinion.
>>>
>>> Mrs.E. (a Trumpster) and I had a recent debate about the status of
>>> this country.
>>>
>>> My position is that although politically inspired
>>> dissension has existed for many decades, the current situation, full of
>>> animosity and hatred started when Donald Trump walked down the golden
>>> escalator and announced his candidacy for POTUS. Since then,
>>> throughout his term in office and to this day the division (which
>>> Walter claims
>>> may lead to a Civil War) continues.
>>>
>>> Before Trump, the country had elected Republicans and Democrats, often
>>> with much debate and alliances but Trump's eventual election started
>>> a whole new level of division that has pretty much erased any true
>>> moderate or "centralist"  beliefs.  People today are either left or
>>> right.  There is no other option.  If you don't hate Trump, you are
>>> a Trumpster ... and a racist to boot.
>>>
>>> Mrs. E.'s position is that the people elected him.
>>>
>>> I think if the Republicans had nominated someone else who shared the
>>> same policy views as Trump but was better equipped temperment-wise
>>> to execute those policies, we would not have the ultra political
>>> division that exists today.
>>>
>>> I think Trump did many things that were in the best interests of the
>>> USA.  I can't say the same for the current crop of Democrats.
>>>
>>> So, it's difficult to claim to be a "centralist" today.
>>>
>> What is really sad is that this division is based on a fellas personality.
>> The country is being made to suffer because the hate has driven the party
>> in power to undo all of the good things the prior administration has done
>> for the country. Anyone who believes the current administration is doing
>> good by America is out of his mind. I suppose it is possible for a
>> centralist to be out of his mind. :-)
>>
>
>My problem with Trump is that I believe that the office of POTUS
>requires a certain level of maturity, professionalism and a civil
>temperament, all of which Trump lacks. He acts more like a junior
>high school bully.
>
>Yesterday I spent an hour or so watching old videos of Ronald Reagan
>speeches including a debate with Jimmy Carter in 1980. Both were
>critical of each other's policy views but I was struck by the
>respect they gave each other personally. What a difference
>to what we witness today! Trump started his campaign by
>verbally harassing and personally attacking the other 16 Republicans
>seeking the GOP nomination .... well before the Democrat's "Russia,
>Russia, Russia" mantra really took hold. It's in his DNA.
>
>Anywhoo, let's see what happens in 2022 and 2024.

I think that is what attracted his base. These are regular folks who
feel betrayed by the smooth talking, air brushed politicians like the
Bushes (all 4) and Biden. They want someone who talks like them and
ridicules the status quo that has left them holding the shitty end of
the stick.

I am not really a Trump fan but I understand it. I am also not as
concerned that we are ruffing the feathers of the up tight Europeans
who have been sucking on the American tit for the last 70 years.

Guys like Putin need a rough talker. Biden and Obama will have likely
the distinction of both having a Ukraine invasion on their watch.
They both come off as weak in Moscow. We will impose some meaningless
sanctions and say that was all we could do.
OTOH I suppose Biden could start another war.
Whee, war with Russia, what could possibly go wrong ;-)

Re: Civil war in the United States is far more likely than you think. In fact, it may have already begun.

<phnrtg5eu6co5090o9qdf0hntnubmps5fk@4ax.com>

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Subject: Re: Civil war in the United States is far more likely than you think. In fact, it may have already begun.
Date: Tue, 11 Jan 2022 14:52:58 -0500
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 by: gfretw...@aol.com - Tue, 11 Jan 2022 19:52 UTC

On Tue, 11 Jan 2022 06:35:48 -0500, "Mr. Luddite" <nothere@noland.com>
wrote:

>On 1/10/2022 2:58 PM, gfretwell@aol.com wrote:
>> On Mon, 10 Jan 2022 06:53:27 -0500, "Mr. Luddite" <nothere@noland.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> On 1/9/2022 3:16 PM, waynebatrecdotboats@hotmail.com wrote:
>>>> On Sunday, January 9, 2022 at 1:12:35 PM UTC-5, Mr. Luddite wrote:
>>>>> On 1/9/2022 12:14 PM, waynebatr...@hotmail.com wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> This is a very thought provoking and insightful article:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> https://www.marketwatch.com/story/civil-war-in-the-united-states-is-far-more-likely-than-you-think-in-fact-it-may-have-already-begun-11641418149
>>>>> Wayne, you might want to consider doing some more reading about this
>>>>> opinion article that is based on interests (and a newly released book)
>>>>>
>>>>> Walter is a professor of political science at the University of
>>>>> California at San Diego. Her primary interest and papers/
>>>>> publications are on the US and other Civil Wars.
>>>>>
>>>>> With that as a platform for her *opinions* it is not surprising
>>>>> that she'd tie current events to a pending Civil War.
>>>>>
>>>>> I read it (plus more about her) and take it with a grain of salt.
>>>>>
>>>>> If people with companies can make money selling toilet paper with
>>>>> pictures of Trump, Biden, Pelosi and others, she may as well join
>>>>> in in a more hi-brow manner and sell some books. :-)
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> ===
>>>>
>>>> Writers have been using magazine articles and opinion pieces to help sell their books for a long time. That doesn't bother me, and it doesn't make their opinions less valuable and thought provoking. The cultural shifts that she mentions are undeniable, and not surprisingly many people are unhappy about it. The risk is that unhappiness will spill over into attempts at subverting our democratic institutions and the constitution. It's already happening. That's the wrong way to defend our cultural heritage, and it will lead to increased strife in my opinion.
>>>
>>> Mrs.E. (a Trumpster) and I had a recent debate about the status of this
>>> country.
>>>
>>> My position is that although politically inspired
>>> dissension has existed for many decades, the current situation, full of
>>> animosity and hatred started when Donald Trump walked down the golden
>>> escalator and announced his candidacy for POTUS. Since then, throughout
>>> his term in office and to this day the division (which Walter claims
>>> may lead to a Civil War) continues.
>>>
>>> Before Trump, the country had elected Republicans and Democrats, often
>>> with much debate and alliances but Trump's eventual election started
>>> a whole new level of division that has pretty much erased any true
>>> moderate or "centralist" beliefs. People today are either left or
>>> right. There is no other option. If you don't hate Trump, you are
>>> a Trumpster ... and a racist to boot.
>>>
>>> Mrs. E.'s position is that the people elected him.
>>>
>>> I think if the Republicans had nominated someone else who shared the
>>> same policy views as Trump but was better equipped temperment-wise
>>> to execute those policies, we would not have the ultra political
>>> division that exists today.
>>>
>>> I think Trump did many things that were in the best interests of the
>>> USA. I can't say the same for the current crop of Democrats.
>>>
>>> So, it's difficult to claim to be a "centralist" today.
>>
>> The PBS show Frontline seemed to put the real divide at the election
>> of Obama but I think it goes back to Bush v Gore. There are still
>> plenty of Democrats who think Bush wasn't the legitimate president.
>
>The post-mortem of the Bush/Gore contest indicates Bush won. He also
>defeated Kerry for re-election in 2004.
>
>If you haven't, I recommend
>reading Bush's book "Decision Points". In it he lays out several of
>the critical decisions he made as POTUS in a detailed, non "hyped"
>manner. It left me with a more heightened degree of respect for the
>man.

I am sure his ghost writer made a great justification for the wars but
they don't pass the laugh test in light of the actual history.
It is far from clear taking Saddam out was a good thing in the sense
of peace in the region or the suppression of terrorism and "Breaking"
the place in the Colin Powell reference certainly cost us a lot in
blood and treasure with no particular gain. It just made Iran stronger
and gave Israel more reason to start that upcoming war. We will most
likely do the fighting there too.
Diplomatically we have decided fighting a war for the Israelis (like
Iraq) is preferable to backing them in a war they fight. We learned
that lesson in 1974.

Re: Civil war in the United States is far more likely than you think. In fact, it may have already begun.

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From: gfretw...@aol.com
Newsgroups: rec.boats
Subject: Re: Civil war in the United States is far more likely than you think. In fact, it may have already begun.
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 by: gfretw...@aol.com - Tue, 11 Jan 2022 19:55 UTC

On Tue, 11 Jan 2022 10:13:39 -0500 (EST), justan <me@here.com> wrote:

>If you had to choose, which of those two
> would you rather be in a lifeboat with, far out to sea? Put
> another way. Would you rather have the wheeler dealer or the
> hollow man as president?

I wouldn't want to be in a lifeboat with either of them. Wayne would
be a better choice ;)

Re: Civil war in the United States is far more likely than you think. In fact, it may have already begun.

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Newsgroups: rec.boats
Subject: Re: Civil war in the United States is far more likely than you
think. In fact, it may have already begun.
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 by: justan - Tue, 11 Jan 2022 21:02 UTC

gfretwell@aol.com Wrote in message:r
> On Tue, 11 Jan 2022 10:13:39 -0500 (EST), justan <me@here.com> wrote:>If you had to choose, which of those two> would you rather be in a lifeboat with, far out to sea? Put> another way. Would you rather have the wheeler dealer or the> hollow man as president?I wouldn't want to be in a lifeboat with either of them. Wayne wouldbe a better choice ;)

Your ship is sinking. There are two lifeboats. Remember
Afghanistan while you decide.
--
Thanks Donald. Do you miss him yet?

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Re: Civil war in the United States is far more likely than you think. In fact, it may have already begun.

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Subject: Re: Civil war in the United States is far more likely than you think.
In fact, it may have already begun.
From: wayne.be...@gmail.com (waynebatrecdotboats@hotmail.com)
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 by: waynebatrecdotboats@ - Tue, 11 Jan 2022 21:27 UTC

On Tuesday, January 11, 2022 at 2:55:03 PM UTC-5, gfre...@aol.com wrote:
> On Tue, 11 Jan 2022 10:13:39 -0500 (EST), justan <m...@here.com> wrote:
>
> >If you had to choose, which of those two
> > would you rather be in a lifeboat with, far out to sea? Put
> > another way. Would you rather have the wheeler dealer or the
> > hollow man as president?
> I wouldn't want to be in a lifeboat with either of them. Wayne would
> be a better choice ;)

===

Bad choice; I think you should go with Trump. His orange luminescence and gigantic ego would be easier to spot by rescuers. :-)

Re: Civil war in the United States is far more likely than you think. In fact, it may have already begun.

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Subject: Re: Civil war in the United States is far more likely than you think.
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From: princecr...@gmail.com (True North)
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 by: True North - Tue, 11 Jan 2022 21:53 UTC

On Tuesday, 11 January 2022 at 17:27:07 UTC-4, waynebatrecdotboats@hotmail.com wrote:
> On Tuesday, January 11, 2022 at 2:55:03 PM UTC-5, gfre...@aol.com wrote:
> > On Tue, 11 Jan 2022 10:13:39 -0500 (EST), justan <m...@here.com> wrote:
> >
> > >If you had to choose, which of those two
> > > would you rather be in a lifeboat with, far out to sea? Put
> > > another way. Would you rather have the wheeler dealer or the
> > > hollow man as president?
> > I wouldn't want to be in a lifeboat with either of them. Wayne would
> > be a better choice ;)
> ===
>
> Bad choice; I think you should go with Trump. His orange luminescence and gigantic ego would be easier to spot by rescuers. :-)

On the other hand I'd be afraid to go to sleep or turn my back to him if we were low on food or water.

Re: Civil war in the United States is far more likely than you think. In fact, it may have already begun.

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 by: gfretw...@aol.com - Wed, 12 Jan 2022 00:24 UTC

On Tue, 11 Jan 2022 16:02:25 -0500 (EST), justan <me@here.com> wrote:

>gfretwell@aol.com Wrote in message:r
>> On Tue, 11 Jan 2022 10:13:39 -0500 (EST), justan <me@here.com> wrote:>If you had to choose, which of those two> would you rather be in a lifeboat with, far out to sea? Put> another way. Would you rather have the wheeler dealer or the> hollow man as president?I wouldn't want to be in a lifeboat with either of them. Wayne wouldbe a better choice ;)
>
>Your ship is sinking. There are two lifeboats. Remember
> Afghanistan while you decide.

If my ship is sinking my last thought would be Afghanistan. I want the
saltiest SOB I can find with open sea skills.
Extra credit if he has an EPIRB in his pocket ;-)

Re: Civil war in the United States is far more likely than you think. In fact, it may have already begun.

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 by: Mr. Luddite - Wed, 12 Jan 2022 13:07 UTC

On 1/11/2022 11:19 AM, Bill wrote:
> Mr. Luddite <nothere@noland.com> wrote:
>> On 1/10/2022 12:14 PM, Justan wrote:
>>> On 1/10/22 6:53 AM, Mr. Luddite wrote:
>>>> On 1/9/2022 3:16 PM, waynebatrecdotboats@hotmail.com wrote:
>>>>> On Sunday, January 9, 2022 at 1:12:35 PM UTC-5, Mr. Luddite wrote:
>>>>>> On 1/9/2022 12:14 PM, waynebatr...@hotmail.com wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> This is a very thought provoking and insightful article:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> https://www.marketwatch.com/story/civil-war-in-the-united-states-is-far-more-likely-than-you-think-in-fact-it-may-have-already-begun-11641418149
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> Wayne, you might want to consider doing some more reading about this
>>>>>> opinion article that is based on interests (and a newly released book)
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Walter is a professor of political science at the University of
>>>>>> California at San Diego. Her primary interest and papers/
>>>>>> publications are on the US and other Civil Wars.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> With that as a platform for her *opinions* it is not surprising
>>>>>> that she'd tie current events to a pending Civil War.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I read it (plus more about her) and take it with a grain of salt.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> If people with companies can make money selling toilet paper with
>>>>>> pictures of Trump, Biden, Pelosi and others, she may as well join
>>>>>> in in a more hi-brow manner and sell some books. :-)
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> ===
>>>>>
>>>>> Writers have been using magazine articles and opinion pieces to help
>>>>> sell their books for a long time.  That doesn't bother me, and it
>>>>> doesn't make their opinions less valuable and thought provoking.
>>>>> The cultural shifts that she mentions are undeniable, and not
>>>>> surprisingly many people are unhappy about it.  The risk is that
>>>>> unhappiness will spill over into attempts at subverting our
>>>>> democratic institutions and the constitution.  It's already
>>>>> happening.  That's the wrong way to defend our cultural heritage, and
>>>>> it will lead to increased strife in my opinion.
>>>>
>>>> Mrs.E. (a Trumpster) and I had a recent debate about the status of
>>>> this country.
>>>>
>>>> My position is that although politically inspired
>>>> dissension has existed for many decades, the current situation, full of
>>>> animosity and hatred started when Donald Trump walked down the golden
>>>> escalator and announced his candidacy for POTUS. Since then,
>>>> throughout his term in office and to this day the division (which
>>>> Walter claims
>>>> may lead to a Civil War) continues.
>>>>
>>>> Before Trump, the country had elected Republicans and Democrats, often
>>>> with much debate and alliances but Trump's eventual election started
>>>> a whole new level of division that has pretty much erased any true
>>>> moderate or "centralist"  beliefs.  People today are either left or
>>>> right.  There is no other option.  If you don't hate Trump, you are
>>>> a Trumpster ... and a racist to boot.
>>>>
>>>> Mrs. E.'s position is that the people elected him.
>>>>
>>>> I think if the Republicans had nominated someone else who shared the
>>>> same policy views as Trump but was better equipped temperment-wise
>>>> to execute those policies, we would not have the ultra political
>>>> division that exists today.
>>>>
>>>> I think Trump did many things that were in the best interests of the
>>>> USA.  I can't say the same for the current crop of Democrats.
>>>>
>>>> So, it's difficult to claim to be a "centralist" today.
>>>>
>>> What is really sad is that this division is based on a fellas personality.
>>> The country is being made to suffer because the hate has driven the party
>>> in power to undo all of the good things the prior administration has done
>>> for the country. Anyone who believes the current administration is doing
>>> good by America is out of his mind. I suppose it is possible for a
>>> centralist to be out of his mind. :-)
>>>
>>
>> My problem with Trump is that I believe that the office of POTUS
>> requires a certain level of maturity, professionalism and a civil
>> temperament, all of which Trump lacks. He acts more like a junior
>> high school bully.
>>
>> Yesterday I spent an hour or so watching old videos of Ronald Reagan
>> speeches including a debate with Jimmy Carter in 1980. Both were
>> critical of each other's policy views but I was struck by the
>> respect they gave each other personally. What a difference
>> to what we witness today! Trump started his campaign by
>> verbally harassing and personally attacking the other 16 Republicans
>> seeking the GOP nomination .... well before the Democrat's "Russia,
>> Russia, Russia" mantra really took hold. It's in his DNA.
>>
>> Anywhoo, let's see what happens in 2022 and 2024.
>>
>

> Maybe this is a sign of the times. Ok at all the nastiest on the
> internet. We have are own Mr. Roomba…
>

I think what needs to be done is to stop all the idiotic exchanges
in the Senate hearings between people like Rand Paul and
Fauci. The chairperson of that committee should demand the hearings
focus on the agenda and subject of the hearing. There's plenty of
time later to point fingers and cast blame.

The Covid thing is like a house fire. The primary purpose is to
extinguish the fire. Determining it's cause comes later.

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 by: Mr Robot - Thu, 13 Jan 2022 00:32 UTC

On Sun, 9 Jan 2022 12:20:13 -0500 (EST), justan <me@here.com> wrote:

>"waynebatrecdotboats@hotmail.com" <wayne.beardsley@gmail.com>
> Wrote in message:r
>> This is a very thought provoking and insightful article:https://www.marketwatch.com/story/civil-war-in-the-united-states-is-far-more-likely-than-you-think-in-fact-it-may-have-already-begun-11641418149
>
>If you remove your tin hat you might be able to recieve
> information other than liberal bullshit. :-)

If you remove your head from Donnie ass, you might be able to see
daylight.

Re: Civil war in the United States is far more likely than you think. In fact, it may have already begun.

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From: rob...@mr_robot.com (Mr Robot)
Newsgroups: rec.boats
Subject: Re: Civil war in the United States is far more likely than you think. In fact, it may have already begun.
Date: Wed, 12 Jan 2022 16:32:47 -0800
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 by: Mr Robot - Thu, 13 Jan 2022 00:32 UTC

On Mon, 10 Jan 2022 04:16:43 -0000 (UTC), Bill
<califbill9998remove8@gmail.com> wrote:

>waynebatrecdotboats@hotmail.com <wayne.beardsley@gmail.com> wrote:
>> On Sunday, January 9, 2022 at 5:52:10 PM UTC-5, John H wrote:
>>> On Sun, 9 Jan 2022 09:47:18 -0800 (PST),
>>> "waynebatr...@hotmail.com" <wayne.b...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> On Sunday, January 9, 2022 at 12:20:16 PM UTC-5, justan wrote:
>>>>> "waynebatr...@hotmail.com" <wayne.b...@gmail.com>
>>>>> Wrote in message:r
>>>>>> This is a very thought provoking and insightful
>>>>>> article:https://www.marketwatch.com/story/civil-war-in-the-united-states-is-far-more-likely-than-you-think-in-fact-it-may-have-already-begun-11641418149
>>>>>>
>>>>> If you remove your tin hat you might be able to recieve
>>>>> information other than liberal bullshit. :-)
>>>>> --
>>>> ===
>>>>
>>>> I found it interesting and thought provoking. Your mileage may vary.
>>> As a leftist, you'd find anything against the right interesting and
>>> thought provoking. I thought this was interesting and thought
>>> provoking:
>>>
>>> https://www.raptureforums.com/politics-culture-wars/why-do-democrats-support-lawlessness/
>>
>> ==
>> Actually I'm a centrist and don't condone violent protest for any reason
>> or cause. What's happened is that the right has moved so far in that
>> direction, that moderate republicans are now incorrectly viewed as left
>> wingers. And the cult of Trumpism has become so deeply rooted that
>> anyone else is viewed as a radical. Sad.
>>
>
>Nothing centrist about your comments.

Nothing except stupid from yours...

Re: Civil war in the United States is far more likely than you think. In fact, it may have already begun.

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From: rob...@mr_robot.com (Mr Robot)
Newsgroups: rec.boats
Subject: Re: Civil war in the United States is far more likely than you think. In fact, it may have already begun.
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 by: Mr Robot - Thu, 13 Jan 2022 00:33 UTC

On Sun, 9 Jan 2022 13:12:29 -0500, "Mr. Luddite" <nothere@noland.com>
wrote:

>On 1/9/2022 12:14 PM, waynebatrecdotboats@hotmail.com wrote:
>
>> This is a very thought provoking and insightful article:
>>
>> https://www.marketwatch.com/story/civil-war-in-the-united-states-is-far-more-likely-than-you-think-in-fact-it-may-have-already-begun-11641418149
>
>Wayne, you might want to consider doing some more reading about this
>opinion article that is based on interests (and a newly released book)
>
>Walter is a professor of political science at the University of
>California at San Diego. Her primary interest and papers/
>publications are on the US and other Civil Wars.
>
>With that as a platform for her *opinions* it is not surprising
>that she'd tie current events to a pending Civil War.
>
>I read it (plus more about her) and take it with a grain of salt.
>
>If people with companies can make money selling toilet paper with
>pictures of Trump, Biden, Pelosi and others, she may as well join
>in in a more hi-brow manner and sell some books. :-)

I really don't care what you wipe your ass with. Just do it.

Re: Civil war in the United States is far more likely than you think. In fact, it may have already begun.

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From: rob...@mr_robot.com (Mr Robot)
Newsgroups: rec.boats
Subject: Re: Civil war in the United States is far more likely than you think. In fact, it may have already begun.
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 by: Mr Robot - Thu, 13 Jan 2022 00:34 UTC

On Mon, 10 Jan 2022 14:58:37 -0500, gfretwell@aol.com wrote:

>On Mon, 10 Jan 2022 06:53:27 -0500, "Mr. Luddite" <nothere@noland.com>
>wrote:
>
>>On 1/9/2022 3:16 PM, waynebatrecdotboats@hotmail.com wrote:
>>> On Sunday, January 9, 2022 at 1:12:35 PM UTC-5, Mr. Luddite wrote:
>>>> On 1/9/2022 12:14 PM, waynebatr...@hotmail.com wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> This is a very thought provoking and insightful article:
>>>>>
>>>>> https://www.marketwatch.com/story/civil-war-in-the-united-states-is-far-more-likely-than-you-think-in-fact-it-may-have-already-begun-11641418149
>>>> Wayne, you might want to consider doing some more reading about this
>>>> opinion article that is based on interests (and a newly released book)
>>>>
>>>> Walter is a professor of political science at the University of
>>>> California at San Diego. Her primary interest and papers/
>>>> publications are on the US and other Civil Wars.
>>>>
>>>> With that as a platform for her *opinions* it is not surprising
>>>> that she'd tie current events to a pending Civil War.
>>>>
>>>> I read it (plus more about her) and take it with a grain of salt.
>>>>
>>>> If people with companies can make money selling toilet paper with
>>>> pictures of Trump, Biden, Pelosi and others, she may as well join
>>>> in in a more hi-brow manner and sell some books. :-)
>>>>
>>>
>>> ===
>>>
>>> Writers have been using magazine articles and opinion pieces to help sell their books for a long time. That doesn't bother me, and it doesn't make their opinions less valuable and thought provoking. The cultural shifts that she mentions are undeniable, and not surprisingly many people are unhappy about it. The risk is that unhappiness will spill over into attempts at subverting our democratic institutions and the constitution. It's already happening. That's the wrong way to defend our cultural heritage, and it will lead to increased strife in my opinion.
>>
>>Mrs.E. (a Trumpster) and I had a recent debate about the status of this
>>country.
>>
>>My position is that although politically inspired
>>dissension has existed for many decades, the current situation, full of
>>animosity and hatred started when Donald Trump walked down the golden
>>escalator and announced his candidacy for POTUS. Since then, throughout
>>his term in office and to this day the division (which Walter claims
>>may lead to a Civil War) continues.
>>
>>Before Trump, the country had elected Republicans and Democrats, often
>>with much debate and alliances but Trump's eventual election started
>>a whole new level of division that has pretty much erased any true
>>moderate or "centralist" beliefs. People today are either left or
>>right. There is no other option. If you don't hate Trump, you are
>>a Trumpster ... and a racist to boot.
>>
>>Mrs. E.'s position is that the people elected him.
>>
>>I think if the Republicans had nominated someone else who shared the
>>same policy views as Trump but was better equipped temperment-wise
>>to execute those policies, we would not have the ultra political
>>division that exists today.
>>
>>I think Trump did many things that were in the best interests of the
>>USA. I can't say the same for the current crop of Democrats.
>>
>>So, it's difficult to claim to be a "centralist" today.
>
>The PBS show Frontline seemed to put the real divide at the election
>of Obama but I think it goes back to Bush v Gore. There are still
>plenty of Democrats who think Bush wasn't the legitimate president.

He was the legitimate president.. elected by SCOTUS for his first
term. FYI, you're an asswipe, so buy some DJT toilet paper.

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