so i was in the garage wrenching on neighbors kids bike
and a pail of parts he brought over and smelled bacon
cooking.... I poke my head in the house to see wife
making up 3 packs of bacon. well now that seems like
a lot but okay... so lunch time rolls around
thinking there will be leftover bacon for BLTs,
but nooo...

there is no such thing as left over bacon, sigh..
at least the kids and their friends got some
bacon for breakfast..

john
btw ebay carbs for 30 bucks aren't worth the time to
install them. they air-leak like a cheese cloth.

On 05/09/2021 05:56 AM, john wrote:
> so i was in the garage wrenching on neighbors kids bike
> and a pail of parts he brought over and smelled bacon
> cooking.... I poke my head in the house to see wife
> making up 3 packs of bacon. well now that seems like
> a lot but okay... so lunch time rolls around
> thinking there will be leftover bacon for BLTs,
> but nooo...
>
> there is no such thing as left over bacon, sigh..
> at least the kids and their friends got some
> bacon for breakfast..

I have long felt that if you can smell bacon cooking the cook is
obligated BY LAW to give you some -- even if you're just a stranger
walking by the house.

> john
> btw ebay carbs for 30 bucks aren't worth the time to
> install them. they air-leak like a cheese cloth.

The previous ham-fisted owner of my Ducati somehow managed to make the
round part of the Dellorto where the cables come in oval. I solved the
problem with a LOT of teflon plumber's tape. And then I got a brand-new
one at a yard sale for $15.00!

I looked at some of the Dellorto websites. WTF happened to the
apolstrophe? And apparently they don't make the one I used any more.
Hey, it was a 1960...

--
Cheers, Bev
"No matter how cynical I get, it's just never enough to keep up."
--Lily Tomlin

On Sun, 9 May 2021 13:13:10 -0700, The Real Bev wrote:
> The previous ham-fisted owner of my Ducati somehow managed to make the
> round part of the Dellorto where the cables come in oval.

If you're talking about the cap:
https://www.stein-dinse.biz/product_info.php?products_id=7745
I really wonder how this could ever happen. This is cast metal after all.
It's quite simple to ovalize the hoses though:
https://www.stein-dinse.biz/index.php?cPath=15_2180_2302
e. g. if you route them off the cap in an awkward direction and then the
gas tank rubs/presses against it. Can happen with the PHM40 in my KTM 620,
too. The tank was made out of HDPE (polyethylene plastic) by a company
contracted by KTM who originally produced watering cans. What could
possibly go wrong?

Well, the mounting flange for the fuel tap for example. All serious bikes
have a metal plate with threads cast in there so the surface does not bend
and warp. Not the KTM. Consequentially, the rubber O-rings don't see a
flat surface after a while and the whole POS starts to leak. You would be
tempted and just tighten the wood screws a little bit more, but that is
the moment you rip out the threads from the two blind holes cast into the
plastic.

I then drilled out the entire thing, cut an aluminum plate with threads and
through holes for the fuel sieves to fit from the inside of the tank and
sealed everything with nitrile O-rings, aluminum screws (mind the
electrochemical series!) and copper washers. Worked like a charm. Still
works like a charm.

KTM, however, also managed to spoil the quality of the potentially single
japanese part on the bike, the fuel tap itself. This has some rotary slide
valve inside (plastic as well) that wears into the cast metal outside.
While you can always stop leakages to the outside with new o-rings, that
thing never shuts off completely: No use draining the carb if you put the
bike away for winter, because the bowl will fill ever so slowly anyway.
Which is bad for the float needle, that tends to jam open from time to
time.

Yeah, and before you say "Just leave the damn carb drain bolt open and
route the hose into some container!"...: The particular PHM40 model KTM
chose doesn't have this. Check out:
https://www.stein-dinse.biz/product_info.php?products_id=3804 vs.
https://www.stein-dinse.biz/product_info.php?products_id=56701
There's just this big SW21 central screw that keeps it all together.

So your best option is to pull the fuel hose and plug it.

> I looked at some of the Dellorto websites. WTF happened to the
> apolstrophe? And apparently they don't make the one I used any more.
> Hey, it was a 1960...

You could probably fit a very similar one. Question is: Why would you use a
Dellorto if there's much better stuff from Mikuni? The TMR...

https://mikuni-topham.de/DEUTSCHSITE/TMR/TMR1.html
https://mikuni-topham.de/ENGLISHSITE/ENGLISH/Frame_English.html

.... might be a bit big and also on the expensive side, but quality wise,
it's top notch.

Volker

On 05/10/2021 12:23 AM, Volker Bartheld wrote:
> On Sun, 9 May 2021 13:13:10 -0700, The Real Bev wrote:
>> The previous ham-fisted owner of my Ducati somehow managed to make the
>> round part of the Dellorto where the cables come in oval.
>
> If you're talking about the cap:
> https://www.stein-dinse.biz/product_info.php?products_id=7745

No. This one:
https://www.ebay.com/itm/Genuine-Ducati-Dellorto-Carburetor-Monza-UBF24BS-Elite-200SS-UBF-24-BS-/283946894409?_ul=BO

I'm amazed at how "Dellorto UBF24BS" rolled so trippingly off my tongue!

The round tube pointing upward was oval. The illustration is capless.
I can see no reason to grab that part of the carb with a tool hard
enough to squash it.

$200. Damn! It might have cost that much new, which is why I was so
happy to get it for $15.

Remainder left for its utility value...

> I really wonder how this could ever happen. This is cast metal after all.
> It's quite simple to ovalize the hoses though:
> https://www.stein-dinse.biz/index.php?cPath=15_2180_2302
> e. g. if you route them off the cap in an awkward direction and then the
> gas tank rubs/presses against it. Can happen with the PHM40 in my KTM 620,
> too. The tank was made out of HDPE (polyethylene plastic) by a company
> contracted by KTM who originally produced watering cans. What could
> possibly go wrong?
>
> Well, the mounting flange for the fuel tap for example. All serious bikes
> have a metal plate with threads cast in there so the surface does not bend
> and warp. Not the KTM. Consequentially, the rubber O-rings don't see a
> flat surface after a while and the whole POS starts to leak. You would be
> tempted and just tighten the wood screws a little bit more, but that is
> the moment you rip out the threads from the two blind holes cast into the
> plastic.
>
> I then drilled out the entire thing, cut an aluminum plate with threads and
> through holes for the fuel sieves to fit from the inside of the tank and
> sealed everything with nitrile O-rings, aluminum screws (mind the
> electrochemical series!) and copper washers. Worked like a charm. Still
> works like a charm.
>
> KTM, however, also managed to spoil the quality of the potentially single
> japanese part on the bike, the fuel tap itself. This has some rotary slide
> valve inside (plastic as well) that wears into the cast metal outside.
> While you can always stop leakages to the outside with new o-rings, that
> thing never shuts off completely: No use draining the carb if you put the
> bike away for winter, because the bowl will fill ever so slowly anyway.
> Which is bad for the float needle, that tends to jam open from time to
> time.
>
> Yeah, and before you say "Just leave the damn carb drain bolt open and
> route the hose into some container!"...: The particular PHM40 model KTM
> chose doesn't have this. Check out:
> https://www.stein-dinse.biz/product_info.php?products_id=3804 vs.
> https://www.stein-dinse.biz/product_info.php?products_id=56701
> There's just this big SW21 central screw that keeps it all together.
>
> So your best option is to pull the fuel hose and plug it.
>
>> I looked at some of the Dellorto websites. WTF happened to the
>> apolstrophe? And apparently they don't make the one I used any more.
>> Hey, it was a 1960...
>
> You could probably fit a very similar one. Question is: Why would you use a
> Dellorto if there's much better stuff from Mikuni? The TMR...

Hey, it was OEM. Who knew? I was satisfied with my kluge, aside from
running a little rich, but I was reluctant to take it apart and adjust
the needle once I'd got the damn air leak fixed. The yard-sale carb was
a pure accident.

We used to talk about the psychic shopping network -- we would talk
about needing something and it would show up within a couple of weeks.
It never occurred to me that I would find a part for a 1060 Ducati at a
random yard sale in 1970 (a guess).

> https://mikuni-topham.de/DEUTSCHSITE/TMR/TMR1.html
> https://mikuni-topham.de/ENGLISHSITE/ENGLISH/Frame_English.html
>
> ... might be a bit big and also on the expensive side, but quality wise,
> it's top notch.

I often wonder what happened to it. I GAVE it to the local Ducati
dealer around 1990 in the hope that it would get a good home.

--
Cheers,Bev
To define recursion, we must first define recursion.

On Mon, 10 May 2021 08:55:37 -0700, The Real Bev wrote:
> On 05/10/2021 12:23 AM, Volker Bartheld wrote:
>> On Sun, 9 May 2021 13:13:10 -0700, The Real Bev wrote:
>>> The previous ham-fisted owner of my Ducati somehow managed to make the
>>> round part of the Dellorto where the cables come in oval.
>> If you're talking about the cap:
>> https://www.stein-dinse.biz/product_info.php?products_id=7745
> No. This one:
> https://www.ebay.com/itm/Genuine-Ducati-Dellorto-Carburetor-Monza-UBF24BS-Elite-200SS-UBF-24-BS-/283946894409?_ul=BO
> The round tube pointing upward was oval. The illustration is capless.

DAMN! That is the dome for the round slide, if I'm not mistaken. Wonder how
the slide moved _at all_ if that part was oval. Probably the cap was stuck
and that guy just clamped the carb in a vise. Who knows?

Volker

On 05/10/2021 10:12 AM, Volker Bartheld wrote:
> On Mon, 10 May 2021 08:55:37 -0700, The Real Bev wrote:
>> On 05/10/2021 12:23 AM, Volker Bartheld wrote:
>>> On Sun, 9 May 2021 13:13:10 -0700, The Real Bev wrote:
>>>> The previous ham-fisted owner of my Ducati somehow managed to make the
>>>> round part of the Dellorto where the cables come in oval.
>>> If you're talking about the cap:
>>> https://www.stein-dinse.biz/product_info.php?products_id=7745
>> No. This one:
>> https://www.ebay.com/itm/Genuine-Ducati-Dellorto-Carburetor-Monza-UBF24BS-Elite-200SS-UBF-24-BS-/283946894409?_ul=BO
>> The round tube pointing upward was oval. The illustration is capless.
>
> DAMN! That is the dome for the round slide, if I'm not mistaken. Wonder how
> the slide moved _at all_ if that part was oval. Probably the cap was stuck
> and that guy just clamped the carb in a vise. Who knows?

Definitely weird. I wrapped plumber's tape around the threads,
tightened the cap, and then wrapped the join with more tape. I also
squeezed some silicone goo into the place where the cable entered --
there was something wrong there too.

Hubby made the air cleaner duct out of a plumbing elbow.

Rotten blowup: https://i.postimg.cc/9fgT42D1/ducaticarb.jpg

--
Cheers, Bev
"If you see me running, try to keep up."
...Back of bomb technician's shirt