Since I don’t think they can defeat the amount of Russians Putin will throw
at them, they should take the war to Russia. Start by blowing up the
transformers at lots of major power substations. Then mine bridges
connecting major areas. Run a war against the people of Russia and make
them stop Putin and his cronies. Would also stop most cyber attacks, as
how long is the cyber computers going to be able to run on auxiliary power,
since the lack of power may take down the internet repeaters.

On Sat, 26 Feb 2022 20:03:35 -0000 (UTC), Bill
<califbill9998remove8@gmail.com> wrote:

>
>Since I don’t think they can defeat the amount of Russians Putin will throw
>at them, they should take the war to Russia. Start by blowing up the
>transformers at lots of major power substations. Then mine bridges
>connecting major areas. Run a war against the people of Russia and make
>them stop Putin and his cronies. Would also stop most cyber attacks, as
>how long is the cyber computers going to be able to run on auxiliary power,
>since the lack of power may take down the internet repeaters.

That would be the best way to insure Ukraine ends up a smoking hole on
the ground. Russians take attacks on their homeland seriously, much
like the US and they might send in a million soldiers with all the
technology they can bring to bear.

gfretwell@aol.com Wrote in message:r
> On Sat, 26 Feb 2022 20:03:35 -0000 (UTC), Bill<califbill9998remove8@gmail.com> wrote:>>Since I don?t think they can defeat the amount of Russians Putin will throw>at them, they should take the war to Russia. Start by blowing up the>transformers at lots of major power substations. Then mine bridges>connecting major areas. Run a war against the people of Russia and make>them stop Putin and his cronies. Would also stop most cyber attacks, as>how long is the cyber computers going to be able to run on auxiliary power,>since the lack of power may take down the internet repeaters. That would be the best way to insure Ukraine ends up a smoking hole onthe ground. Russians take attacks on their homeland seriously, muchlike the US and they might send in a million soldiers with all thetechnology they can bring to bear.

I'm not sure it would play out like you think it might.
--
Thanks Donald. Do you miss him yet?

----Android NewsGroup Reader----
https://piaohong.s3-us-west-2.amazonaws.com/usenet/index.html

<gfretwell@aol.com> wrote:
> On Sat, 26 Feb 2022 20:03:35 -0000 (UTC), Bill
> <califbill9998remove8@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>>
>> Since I don’t think they can defeat the amount of Russians Putin will throw
>> at them, they should take the war to Russia. Start by blowing up the
>> transformers at lots of major power substations. Then mine bridges
>> connecting major areas. Run a war against the people of Russia and make
>> them stop Putin and his cronies. Would also stop most cyber attacks, as
>> how long is the cyber computers going to be able to run on auxiliary power,
>> since the lack of power may take down the internet repeaters.
>
> That would be the best way to insure Ukraine ends up a smoking hole on
> the ground. Russians take attacks on their homeland seriously, much
> like the US and they might send in a million soldiers with all the
> technology they can bring to bear.
>

With the modern technology, I don’t think Russia would do well. They may
not depend on the internet as much as we do, but I bet it is a lot. How
much starvation when they can not get orders to deliver food?

On Sun, 27 Feb 2022 05:34:09 -0000 (UTC), Bill
<califbill9998remove8@gmail.com> wrote:

><gfretwell@aol.com> wrote:
>> On Sat, 26 Feb 2022 20:03:35 -0000 (UTC), Bill
>> <califbill9998remove8@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> Since I don’t think they can defeat the amount of Russians Putin will throw
>>> at them, they should take the war to Russia. Start by blowing up the
>>> transformers at lots of major power substations. Then mine bridges
>>> connecting major areas. Run a war against the people of Russia and make
>>> them stop Putin and his cronies. Would also stop most cyber attacks, as
>>> how long is the cyber computers going to be able to run on auxiliary power,
>>> since the lack of power may take down the internet repeaters.
>>
>> That would be the best way to insure Ukraine ends up a smoking hole on
>> the ground. Russians take attacks on their homeland seriously, much
>> like the US and they might send in a million soldiers with all the
>> technology they can bring to bear.
>>
>
>With the modern technology, I don’t think Russia would do well. They may
>not depend on the internet as much as we do, but I bet it is a lot. How
>much starvation when they can not get orders to deliver food?

I think you are overestimating what Ukraine could do and
underestimating the resilience of Russians. Bear in mind they lived
the USSR for most of the 20th century where shortages were just a way
of life. They also have a couple hundred year tradition of repelling
invaders. Napoleon and Hitler found that out the hard way. They may
have a generation or two of snowflakes but I doubt it.

My bet is if Putin could sell the idea that Russia was being attacked,
Ukraine would cease to exist as a viable country.

The reality is if they had just made some kind of agrement that the
Eastern regions, that would willingly go back to being Russia, be
allowed to, this whole thing might have been unnecessary. It is the
likely outcome anyway.

On Sun, 27 Feb 2022 16:25:34 -0000 (UTC), Bill
<califbill9998remove8@gmail.com> wrote:

><gfretwell@aol.com> wrote:
>> On Sun, 27 Feb 2022 05:34:09 -0000 (UTC), Bill
>> <califbill9998remove8@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> <gfretwell@aol.com> wrote:
>>>> On Sat, 26 Feb 2022 20:03:35 -0000 (UTC), Bill
>>>> <califbill9998remove8@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Since I don’t think they can defeat the amount of Russians Putin will throw
>>>>> at them, they should take the war to Russia. Start by blowing up the
>>>>> transformers at lots of major power substations. Then mine bridges
>>>>> connecting major areas. Run a war against the people of Russia and make
>>>>> them stop Putin and his cronies. Would also stop most cyber attacks, as
>>>>> how long is the cyber computers going to be able to run on auxiliary power,
>>>>> since the lack of power may take down the internet repeaters.
>>>>
>>>> That would be the best way to insure Ukraine ends up a smoking hole on
>>>> the ground. Russians take attacks on their homeland seriously, much
>>>> like the US and they might send in a million soldiers with all the
>>>> technology they can bring to bear.
>>>>
>>>
>>> With the modern technology, I don’t think Russia would do well. They may
>>> not depend on the internet as much as we do, but I bet it is a lot. How
>>> much starvation when they can not get orders to deliver food?
>>
>> I think you are overestimating what Ukraine could do and
>> underestimating the resilience of Russians. Bear in mind they lived
>> the USSR for most of the 20th century where shortages were just a way
>> of life. They also have a couple hundred year tradition of repelling
>> invaders. Napoleon and Hitler found that out the hard way. They may
>> have a generation or two of snowflakes but I doubt it.
>>
>> My bet is if Putin could sell the idea that Russia was being attacked,
>> Ukraine would cease to exist as a viable country.
>>
>> The reality is if they had just made some kind of agrement that the
>> Eastern regions, that would willingly go back to being Russia, be
>> allowed to, this whole thing might have been unnecessary. It is the
>> likely outcome anyway.
>>
>
>I don’t think it would take too many assets to bring Russia or the USA to a
>halt. Destroy the transformers at a few major power stations. How many
>spares are a available, and how long to build replacements? A few bridges
>taken out. Look how much havoc the San Francisco Bay taken out in the
>Loma Prieta earthquake caused and how long to replace? A couple hundred
>people with a couple semi’s worth of explosives.

You do not want to test the resolve of the second most powerful
military in the world by attacking their homeland. A small gang of
terrorists brought down 2 buildings here and damaged a third. It gave
us the excuse to destroy three countries that were not responsible at
all. We still do not have a good count of how many people died.

On Sun, 27 Feb 2022 11:38:32 -0500 (EST), justan <me@here.com> wrote:

>gfretwell@aol.com Wrote in message:r
>> On Sun, 27 Feb 2022 05:34:09 -0000 (UTC), Bill<califbill9998remove8@gmail.com> wrote:><gfretwell@aol.com> wrote:>> On Sat, 26 Feb 2022 20:03:35 -0000 (UTC), Bill>> <califbill9998remove8@gmail.com> wrote:>> >>> >>> Since I don?t think they can defeat the amount of Russians Putin will throw>>> at them, they should take the war to Russia. Start by blowing up the>>> transformers at lots of major power substations. Then mine bridges>>> connecting major areas. Run a war against the people of Russia and make>>> them stop Putin and his cronies. Would also stop most cyber attacks, as>>> how long is the cyber computers going to be able to run on auxiliary power,>>> since the lack of power may take down the internet repeaters. >> >> That would be the best way to insure Ukraine ends up a smoking hole on>> the ground. Russians take attacks on their homeland seriously, much>> like the US and they might send in a million soldiers with all the>> technology they can bring to bear. >> >>With
>the modern technology, I don?t think Russia would do well. They may>not depend on the internet as much as we do, but I bet it is a lot. How>much starvation when they can not get orders to deliver food?I think you are overestimating what Ukraine could do andunderestimating the resilience of Russians. Bear in mind they livedthe USSR for most of the 20th century where shortages were just a wayof life. They also have a couple hundred year tradition of repellinginvaders. Napoleon and Hitler found that out the hard way. They mayhave a generation or two of snowflakes but I doubt it. My bet is if Putin could sell the idea that Russia was being attacked,Ukraine would cease to exist as a viable country. The reality is if they had just made some kind of agrement that theEastern regions, that would willingly go back to being Russia, beallowed to, this whole thing might have been unnecessary. It is thelikely outcome anyway.
>
>I will take your speculative analysis under consideration. I
> expect it will end up in the round file.

Time will tell but my guess is the Russians will pull back to the
Dombass and that will be the end of it, unless somebody does something
stupid.
The real wild card is China.

On Sun, 27 Feb 2022 16:25:34 -0000 (UTC), Bill
<califbill9998remove8@gmail.com> wrote:

><gfretwell@aol.com> wrote:
>> On Sun, 27 Feb 2022 05:34:09 -0000 (UTC), Bill
>> <califbill9998remove8@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> <gfretwell@aol.com> wrote:
>>>> On Sat, 26 Feb 2022 20:03:35 -0000 (UTC), Bill
>>>> <califbill9998remove8@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Since I don’t think they can defeat the amount of Russians Putin will throw
>>>>> at them, they should take the war to Russia. Start by blowing up the
>>>>> transformers at lots of major power substations. Then mine bridges
>>>>> connecting major areas. Run a war against the people of Russia and make
>>>>> them stop Putin and his cronies. Would also stop most cyber attacks, as
>>>>> how long is the cyber computers going to be able to run on auxiliary power,
>>>>> since the lack of power may take down the internet repeaters.
>>>>
>>>> That would be the best way to insure Ukraine ends up a smoking hole on
>>>> the ground. Russians take attacks on their homeland seriously, much
>>>> like the US and they might send in a million soldiers with all the
>>>> technology they can bring to bear.
>>>>
>>>
>>> With the modern technology, I don’t think Russia would do well. They may
>>> not depend on the internet as much as we do, but I bet it is a lot. How
>>> much starvation when they can not get orders to deliver food?
>>
>> I think you are overestimating what Ukraine could do and
>> underestimating the resilience of Russians. Bear in mind they lived
>> the USSR for most of the 20th century where shortages were just a way
>> of life. They also have a couple hundred year tradition of repelling
>> invaders. Napoleon and Hitler found that out the hard way. They may
>> have a generation or two of snowflakes but I doubt it.
>>
>> My bet is if Putin could sell the idea that Russia was being attacked,
>> Ukraine would cease to exist as a viable country.
>>
>> The reality is if they had just made some kind of agrement that the
>> Eastern regions, that would willingly go back to being Russia, be
>> allowed to, this whole thing might have been unnecessary. It is the
>> likely outcome anyway.
>>
>
>I don’t think it would take too many assets to bring Russia or the USA to a
>halt. Destroy the transformers at a few major power stations. How many
>spares are a available, and how long to build replacements? A few bridges
>taken out. Look how much havoc the San Francisco Bay taken out in the
>Loma Prieta earthquake caused and how long to replace? A couple hundred
>people with a couple semi’s worth of explosives.

With the Russian checkpoints at the border crossings, getting a semi
(or anything else) into Russia would be a bitch.

On Sun, 27 Feb 2022 12:40:47 -0500, gfretwell@aol.com wrote:

>On Sun, 27 Feb 2022 11:19:02 -0500, John H <jherring@cox.net> wrote:
>
>>On Sun, 27 Feb 2022 10:47:42 -0500, gfretwell@aol.com wrote:
>>
>>>On Sun, 27 Feb 2022 05:34:09 -0000 (UTC), Bill
>>><califbill9998remove8@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>><gfretwell@aol.com> wrote:
>>>>> On Sat, 26 Feb 2022 20:03:35 -0000 (UTC), Bill
>>>>> <califbill9998remove8@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Since I don’t think they can defeat the amount of Russians Putin will throw
>>>>>> at them, they should take the war to Russia. Start by blowing up the
>>>>>> transformers at lots of major power substations. Then mine bridges
>>>>>> connecting major areas. Run a war against the people of Russia and make
>>>>>> them stop Putin and his cronies. Would also stop most cyber attacks, as
>>>>>> how long is the cyber computers going to be able to run on auxiliary power,
>>>>>> since the lack of power may take down the internet repeaters.
>>>>>
>>>>> That would be the best way to insure Ukraine ends up a smoking hole on
>>>>> the ground. Russians take attacks on their homeland seriously, much
>>>>> like the US and they might send in a million soldiers with all the
>>>>> technology they can bring to bear.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>With the modern technology, I don’t think Russia would do well. They may
>>>>not depend on the internet as much as we do, but I bet it is a lot. How
>>>>much starvation when they can not get orders to deliver food?
>>>
>>>I think you are overestimating what Ukraine could do and
>>>underestimating the resilience of Russians. Bear in mind they lived
>>>the USSR for most of the 20th century where shortages were just a way
>>>of life. They also have a couple hundred year tradition of repelling
>>>invaders. Napoleon and Hitler found that out the hard way. They may
>>>have a generation or two of snowflakes but I doubt it.
>>>
>>>My bet is if Putin could sell the idea that Russia was being attacked,
>>>Ukraine would cease to exist as a viable country.
>>>
>>>The reality is if they had just made some kind of agrement that the
>>>Eastern regions, that would willingly go back to being Russia, be
>>>allowed to, this whole thing might have been unnecessary. It is the
>>>likely outcome anyway.
>>
>>I wouldn't count on any 'likely outcomes' if Putin pops a nuke.
>
>The only reason he would do that is because morons like Macron
>threaten him with nukes.
>There is no reason to nuke Ukraine.
>They have the conventional force to win there. If it costs them enough
>they might get out tho. There are people in Russia against this war.
>The only thing that would change that is if Putin could sell this war
>as protecting Mother Russia. Then he would have all the support he
>needs from the average Russian. That is the problem with Bill's idea.
>We saw that here when Bush Jr attacked Iraq. We had no national
>interest to do so but the administration lied and tied Saddam to 9-11.
>Then he could sell a stupid war as protecting America.

Of course there's no 'rational' reason to nuke Ukraine! But just how
rational is that asshole? To the rest of the world, he is looking like
a fool right now. Even bringing his nuclear forces to high alert (if
that is true) is an irrational act.

John H <jherring@cox.net> wrote:
> On Sun, 27 Feb 2022 16:25:34 -0000 (UTC), Bill
> <califbill9998remove8@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> <gfretwell@aol.com> wrote:
>>> On Sun, 27 Feb 2022 05:34:09 -0000 (UTC), Bill
>>> <califbill9998remove8@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> <gfretwell@aol.com> wrote:
>>>>> On Sat, 26 Feb 2022 20:03:35 -0000 (UTC), Bill
>>>>> <califbill9998remove8@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Since I don’t think they can defeat the amount of Russians Putin will throw
>>>>>> at them, they should take the war to Russia. Start by blowing up the
>>>>>> transformers at lots of major power substations. Then mine bridges
>>>>>> connecting major areas. Run a war against the people of Russia and make
>>>>>> them stop Putin and his cronies. Would also stop most cyber attacks, as
>>>>>> how long is the cyber computers going to be able to run on auxiliary power,
>>>>>> since the lack of power may take down the internet repeaters.
>>>>>
>>>>> That would be the best way to insure Ukraine ends up a smoking hole on
>>>>> the ground. Russians take attacks on their homeland seriously, much
>>>>> like the US and they might send in a million soldiers with all the
>>>>> technology they can bring to bear.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> With the modern technology, I don’t think Russia would do well. They may
>>>> not depend on the internet as much as we do, but I bet it is a lot. How
>>>> much starvation when they can not get orders to deliver food?
>>>
>>> I think you are overestimating what Ukraine could do and
>>> underestimating the resilience of Russians. Bear in mind they lived
>>> the USSR for most of the 20th century where shortages were just a way
>>> of life. They also have a couple hundred year tradition of repelling
>>> invaders. Napoleon and Hitler found that out the hard way. They may
>>> have a generation or two of snowflakes but I doubt it.
>>>
>>> My bet is if Putin could sell the idea that Russia was being attacked,
>>> Ukraine would cease to exist as a viable country.
>>>
>>> The reality is if they had just made some kind of agrement that the
>>> Eastern regions, that would willingly go back to being Russia, be
>>> allowed to, this whole thing might have been unnecessary. It is the
>>> likely outcome anyway.
>>>
>>
>> I don’t think it would take too many assets to bring Russia or the USA to a
>> halt. Destroy the transformers at a few major power stations. How many
>> spares are a available, and how long to build replacements? A few bridges
>> taken out. Look how much havoc the San Francisco Bay taken out in the
>> Loma Prieta earthquake caused and how long to replace? A couple hundred
>> people with a couple semi’s worth of explosives.
>
> With the Russian checkpoints at the border crossings, getting a semi
> (or anything else) into Russia would be a bitch.
>

Should have had stuff in place already, and I said a semi load, does not
have be in a semi.

On Sun, 27 Feb 2022 18:54:59 -0000 (UTC), Bill
<califbill9998remove8@gmail.com> wrote:

>John H <jherring@cox.net> wrote:
>> On Sun, 27 Feb 2022 16:25:34 -0000 (UTC), Bill
>> <califbill9998remove8@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> <gfretwell@aol.com> wrote:
>>>> On Sun, 27 Feb 2022 05:34:09 -0000 (UTC), Bill
>>>> <califbill9998remove8@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> <gfretwell@aol.com> wrote:
>>>>>> On Sat, 26 Feb 2022 20:03:35 -0000 (UTC), Bill
>>>>>> <califbill9998remove8@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Since I don?t think they can defeat the amount of Russians Putin will throw
>>>>>>> at them, they should take the war to Russia. Start by blowing up the
>>>>>>> transformers at lots of major power substations. Then mine bridges
>>>>>>> connecting major areas. Run a war against the people of Russia and make
>>>>>>> them stop Putin and his cronies. Would also stop most cyber attacks, as
>>>>>>> how long is the cyber computers going to be able to run on auxiliary power,
>>>>>>> since the lack of power may take down the internet repeaters.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> That would be the best way to insure Ukraine ends up a smoking hole on
>>>>>> the ground. Russians take attacks on their homeland seriously, much
>>>>>> like the US and they might send in a million soldiers with all the
>>>>>> technology they can bring to bear.
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> With the modern technology, I don?t think Russia would do well. They may
>>>>> not depend on the internet as much as we do, but I bet it is a lot. How
>>>>> much starvation when they can not get orders to deliver food?
>>>>
>>>> I think you are overestimating what Ukraine could do and
>>>> underestimating the resilience of Russians. Bear in mind they lived
>>>> the USSR for most of the 20th century where shortages were just a way
>>>> of life. They also have a couple hundred year tradition of repelling
>>>> invaders. Napoleon and Hitler found that out the hard way. They may
>>>> have a generation or two of snowflakes but I doubt it.
>>>>
>>>> My bet is if Putin could sell the idea that Russia was being attacked,
>>>> Ukraine would cease to exist as a viable country.
>>>>
>>>> The reality is if they had just made some kind of agrement that the
>>>> Eastern regions, that would willingly go back to being Russia, be
>>>> allowed to, this whole thing might have been unnecessary. It is the
>>>> likely outcome anyway.
>>>>
>>>
>>> I don?t think it would take too many assets to bring Russia or the USA to a
>>> halt. Destroy the transformers at a few major power stations. How many
>>> spares are a available, and how long to build replacements? A few bridges
>>> taken out. Look how much havoc the San Francisco Bay taken out in the
>>> Loma Prieta earthquake caused and how long to replace? A couple hundred
>>> people with a couple semi?s worth of explosives.
>>
>> With the Russian checkpoints at the border crossings, getting a semi
>> (or anything else) into Russia would be a bitch.
>>
>
>Should have had stuff in place already, and I said a semi load, does not
>have be in a semi.

No, that would fall under 'anything else'!

Do you mean Ukraine should have had tons of explosives in place to
take out bridges and transformers?

John H <jherring@cox.net> wrote:
> On Sun, 27 Feb 2022 18:54:59 -0000 (UTC), Bill
> <califbill9998remove8@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> John H <jherring@cox.net> wrote:
>>> On Sun, 27 Feb 2022 16:25:34 -0000 (UTC), Bill
>>> <califbill9998remove8@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> <gfretwell@aol.com> wrote:
>>>>> On Sun, 27 Feb 2022 05:34:09 -0000 (UTC), Bill
>>>>> <califbill9998remove8@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> <gfretwell@aol.com> wrote:
>>>>>>> On Sat, 26 Feb 2022 20:03:35 -0000 (UTC), Bill
>>>>>>> <califbill9998remove8@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Since I don?t think they can defeat the amount of Russians Putin will throw
>>>>>>>> at them, they should take the war to Russia. Start by blowing up the
>>>>>>>> transformers at lots of major power substations. Then mine bridges
>>>>>>>> connecting major areas. Run a war against the people of Russia and make
>>>>>>>> them stop Putin and his cronies. Would also stop most cyber attacks, as
>>>>>>>> how long is the cyber computers going to be able to run on auxiliary power,
>>>>>>>> since the lack of power may take down the internet repeaters.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> That would be the best way to insure Ukraine ends up a smoking hole on
>>>>>>> the ground. Russians take attacks on their homeland seriously, much
>>>>>>> like the US and they might send in a million soldiers with all the
>>>>>>> technology they can bring to bear.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> With the modern technology, I don?t think Russia would do well. They may
>>>>>> not depend on the internet as much as we do, but I bet it is a lot. How
>>>>>> much starvation when they can not get orders to deliver food?
>>>>>
>>>>> I think you are overestimating what Ukraine could do and
>>>>> underestimating the resilience of Russians. Bear in mind they lived
>>>>> the USSR for most of the 20th century where shortages were just a way
>>>>> of life. They also have a couple hundred year tradition of repelling
>>>>> invaders. Napoleon and Hitler found that out the hard way. They may
>>>>> have a generation or two of snowflakes but I doubt it.
>>>>>
>>>>> My bet is if Putin could sell the idea that Russia was being attacked,
>>>>> Ukraine would cease to exist as a viable country.
>>>>>
>>>>> The reality is if they had just made some kind of agrement that the
>>>>> Eastern regions, that would willingly go back to being Russia, be
>>>>> allowed to, this whole thing might have been unnecessary. It is the
>>>>> likely outcome anyway.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> I don?t think it would take too many assets to bring Russia or the USA to a
>>>> halt. Destroy the transformers at a few major power stations. How many
>>>> spares are a available, and how long to build replacements? A few bridges
>>>> taken out. Look how much havoc the San Francisco Bay taken out in the
>>>> Loma Prieta earthquake caused and how long to replace? A couple hundred
>>>> people with a couple semi?s worth of explosives.
>>>
>>> With the Russian checkpoints at the border crossings, getting a semi
>>> (or anything else) into Russia would be a bitch.
>>>
>>
>> Should have had stuff in place already, and I said a semi load, does not
>> have be in a semi.
>
> No, that would fall under 'anything else'!
>
> Do you mean Ukraine should have had tons of explosives in place to
> take out bridges and transformers?
>

Yup, just like Putin had his military prepared.

On Sun, 27 Feb 2022 13:09:39 -0500, John H <jherring@cox.net> wrote:

>On Sun, 27 Feb 2022 12:40:47 -0500, gfretwell@aol.com wrote:
>
>>On Sun, 27 Feb 2022 11:19:02 -0500, John H <jherring@cox.net> wrote:
>>
>>>On Sun, 27 Feb 2022 10:47:42 -0500, gfretwell@aol.com wrote:
>>>
>>>>On Sun, 27 Feb 2022 05:34:09 -0000 (UTC), Bill
>>>><califbill9998remove8@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>><gfretwell@aol.com> wrote:
>>>>>> On Sat, 26 Feb 2022 20:03:35 -0000 (UTC), Bill
>>>>>> <califbill9998remove8@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Since I don’t think they can defeat the amount of Russians Putin will throw
>>>>>>> at them, they should take the war to Russia. Start by blowing up the
>>>>>>> transformers at lots of major power substations. Then mine bridges
>>>>>>> connecting major areas. Run a war against the people of Russia and make
>>>>>>> them stop Putin and his cronies. Would also stop most cyber attacks, as
>>>>>>> how long is the cyber computers going to be able to run on auxiliary power,
>>>>>>> since the lack of power may take down the internet repeaters.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> That would be the best way to insure Ukraine ends up a smoking hole on
>>>>>> the ground. Russians take attacks on their homeland seriously, much
>>>>>> like the US and they might send in a million soldiers with all the
>>>>>> technology they can bring to bear.
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>With the modern technology, I don’t think Russia would do well. They may
>>>>>not depend on the internet as much as we do, but I bet it is a lot. How
>>>>>much starvation when they can not get orders to deliver food?
>>>>
>>>>I think you are overestimating what Ukraine could do and
>>>>underestimating the resilience of Russians. Bear in mind they lived
>>>>the USSR for most of the 20th century where shortages were just a way
>>>>of life. They also have a couple hundred year tradition of repelling
>>>>invaders. Napoleon and Hitler found that out the hard way. They may
>>>>have a generation or two of snowflakes but I doubt it.
>>>>
>>>>My bet is if Putin could sell the idea that Russia was being attacked,
>>>>Ukraine would cease to exist as a viable country.
>>>>
>>>>The reality is if they had just made some kind of agrement that the
>>>>Eastern regions, that would willingly go back to being Russia, be
>>>>allowed to, this whole thing might have been unnecessary. It is the
>>>>likely outcome anyway.
>>>
>>>I wouldn't count on any 'likely outcomes' if Putin pops a nuke.
>>
>>The only reason he would do that is because morons like Macron
>>threaten him with nukes.
>>There is no reason to nuke Ukraine.
>>They have the conventional force to win there. If it costs them enough
>>they might get out tho. There are people in Russia against this war.
>>The only thing that would change that is if Putin could sell this war
>>as protecting Mother Russia. Then he would have all the support he
>>needs from the average Russian. That is the problem with Bill's idea.
>>We saw that here when Bush Jr attacked Iraq. We had no national
>>interest to do so but the administration lied and tied Saddam to 9-11.
>>Then he could sell a stupid war as protecting America.
>
>Of course there's no 'rational' reason to nuke Ukraine! But just how
>rational is that asshole? To the rest of the world, he is looking like
>a fool right now. Even bringing his nuclear forces to high alert (if
>that is true) is an irrational act.

Not any more irrational than the feckless French rattling their saber
with nukes. That is how this shit starts.

On Sun, 27 Feb 2022 22:40:56 -0000 (UTC), Bill
<califbill9998remove8@gmail.com> wrote:

>John H <jherring@cox.net> wrote:
>> On Sun, 27 Feb 2022 18:54:59 -0000 (UTC), Bill
>> <califbill9998remove8@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> John H <jherring@cox.net> wrote:
>>>> On Sun, 27 Feb 2022 16:25:34 -0000 (UTC), Bill
>>>> <califbill9998remove8@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> <gfretwell@aol.com> wrote:
>>>>>> On Sun, 27 Feb 2022 05:34:09 -0000 (UTC), Bill
>>>>>> <califbill9998remove8@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> <gfretwell@aol.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>> On Sat, 26 Feb 2022 20:03:35 -0000 (UTC), Bill
>>>>>>>> <califbill9998remove8@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Since I don?t think they can defeat the amount of Russians Putin will throw
>>>>>>>>> at them, they should take the war to Russia. Start by blowing up the
>>>>>>>>> transformers at lots of major power substations. Then mine bridges
>>>>>>>>> connecting major areas. Run a war against the people of Russia and make
>>>>>>>>> them stop Putin and his cronies. Would also stop most cyber attacks, as
>>>>>>>>> how long is the cyber computers going to be able to run on auxiliary power,
>>>>>>>>> since the lack of power may take down the internet repeaters.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> That would be the best way to insure Ukraine ends up a smoking hole on
>>>>>>>> the ground. Russians take attacks on their homeland seriously, much
>>>>>>>> like the US and they might send in a million soldiers with all the
>>>>>>>> technology they can bring to bear.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> With the modern technology, I don?t think Russia would do well. They may
>>>>>>> not depend on the internet as much as we do, but I bet it is a lot. How
>>>>>>> much starvation when they can not get orders to deliver food?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I think you are overestimating what Ukraine could do and
>>>>>> underestimating the resilience of Russians. Bear in mind they lived
>>>>>> the USSR for most of the 20th century where shortages were just a way
>>>>>> of life. They also have a couple hundred year tradition of repelling
>>>>>> invaders. Napoleon and Hitler found that out the hard way. They may
>>>>>> have a generation or two of snowflakes but I doubt it.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> My bet is if Putin could sell the idea that Russia was being attacked,
>>>>>> Ukraine would cease to exist as a viable country.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The reality is if they had just made some kind of agrement that the
>>>>>> Eastern regions, that would willingly go back to being Russia, be
>>>>>> allowed to, this whole thing might have been unnecessary. It is the
>>>>>> likely outcome anyway.
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> I don?t think it would take too many assets to bring Russia or the USA to a
>>>>> halt. Destroy the transformers at a few major power stations. How many
>>>>> spares are a available, and how long to build replacements? A few bridges
>>>>> taken out. Look how much havoc the San Francisco Bay taken out in the
>>>>> Loma Prieta earthquake caused and how long to replace? A couple hundred
>>>>> people with a couple semi?s worth of explosives.
>>>>
>>>> With the Russian checkpoints at the border crossings, getting a semi
>>>> (or anything else) into Russia would be a bitch.
>>>>
>>>
>>> Should have had stuff in place already, and I said a semi load, does not
>>> have be in a semi.
>>
>> No, that would fall under 'anything else'!
>>
>> Do you mean Ukraine should have had tons of explosives in place to
>> take out bridges and transformers?
>>
>
>Yup, just like Putin had his military prepared.

They may have tons of explosives in Ukraine but you haven't said how
they get to Russia and placed near enough to that critical
infrastructure to damage it.
I still say all it will take is a big firecracker going off in Moscow
to flip the Russian opposition to this war to a rabid desire for
revenge.

<gfretwell@aol.com> wrote:
> On Sun, 27 Feb 2022 22:40:56 -0000 (UTC), Bill
> <califbill9998remove8@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> John H <jherring@cox.net> wrote:
>>> On Sun, 27 Feb 2022 18:54:59 -0000 (UTC), Bill
>>> <califbill9998remove8@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> John H <jherring@cox.net> wrote:
>>>>> On Sun, 27 Feb 2022 16:25:34 -0000 (UTC), Bill
>>>>> <califbill9998remove8@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> <gfretwell@aol.com> wrote:
>>>>>>> On Sun, 27 Feb 2022 05:34:09 -0000 (UTC), Bill
>>>>>>> <califbill9998remove8@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> <gfretwell@aol.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>> On Sat, 26 Feb 2022 20:03:35 -0000 (UTC), Bill
>>>>>>>>> <califbill9998remove8@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Since I don?t think they can defeat the amount of Russians Putin will throw
>>>>>>>>>> at them, they should take the war to Russia. Start by blowing up the
>>>>>>>>>> transformers at lots of major power substations. Then mine bridges
>>>>>>>>>> connecting major areas. Run a war against the people of Russia and make
>>>>>>>>>> them stop Putin and his cronies. Would also stop most cyber attacks, as
>>>>>>>>>> how long is the cyber computers going to be able to run on auxiliary power,
>>>>>>>>>> since the lack of power may take down the internet repeaters.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> That would be the best way to insure Ukraine ends up a smoking hole on
>>>>>>>>> the ground. Russians take attacks on their homeland seriously, much
>>>>>>>>> like the US and they might send in a million soldiers with all the
>>>>>>>>> technology they can bring to bear.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> With the modern technology, I don?t think Russia would do well. They may
>>>>>>>> not depend on the internet as much as we do, but I bet it is a lot. How
>>>>>>>> much starvation when they can not get orders to deliver food?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I think you are overestimating what Ukraine could do and
>>>>>>> underestimating the resilience of Russians. Bear in mind they lived
>>>>>>> the USSR for most of the 20th century where shortages were just a way
>>>>>>> of life. They also have a couple hundred year tradition of repelling
>>>>>>> invaders. Napoleon and Hitler found that out the hard way. They may
>>>>>>> have a generation or two of snowflakes but I doubt it.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> My bet is if Putin could sell the idea that Russia was being attacked,
>>>>>>> Ukraine would cease to exist as a viable country.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> The reality is if they had just made some kind of agrement that the
>>>>>>> Eastern regions, that would willingly go back to being Russia, be
>>>>>>> allowed to, this whole thing might have been unnecessary. It is the
>>>>>>> likely outcome anyway.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I don?t think it would take too many assets to bring Russia or the USA to a
>>>>>> halt. Destroy the transformers at a few major power stations. How many
>>>>>> spares are a available, and how long to build replacements? A few bridges
>>>>>> taken out. Look how much havoc the San Francisco Bay taken out in the
>>>>>> Loma Prieta earthquake caused and how long to replace? A couple hundred
>>>>>> people with a couple semi?s worth of explosives.
>>>>>
>>>>> With the Russian checkpoints at the border crossings, getting a semi
>>>>> (or anything else) into Russia would be a bitch.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Should have had stuff in place already, and I said a semi load, does not
>>>> have be in a semi.
>>>
>>> No, that would fall under 'anything else'!
>>>
>>> Do you mean Ukraine should have had tons of explosives in place to
>>> take out bridges and transformers?
>>>
>>
>> Yup, just like Putin had his military prepared.
>
> They may have tons of explosives in Ukraine but you haven't said how
> they get to Russia and placed near enough to that critical
> infrastructure to damage it.
> I still say all it will take is a big firecracker going off in Moscow
> to flip the Russian opposition to this war to a rabid desire for
> revenge.
>

Would have moved the explosives months ago. Maybe just blow up the
Kremlin, and the politicos. The people of Russia would probably approve
of that.

On Sun, 27 Feb 2022 22:40:56 -0000 (UTC), Bill
<califbill9998remove8@gmail.com> wrote:

>John H <jherring@cox.net> wrote:
>> On Sun, 27 Feb 2022 18:54:59 -0000 (UTC), Bill
>> <califbill9998remove8@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> John H <jherring@cox.net> wrote:
>>>> On Sun, 27 Feb 2022 16:25:34 -0000 (UTC), Bill
>>>> <califbill9998remove8@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> <gfretwell@aol.com> wrote:
>>>>>> On Sun, 27 Feb 2022 05:34:09 -0000 (UTC), Bill
>>>>>> <califbill9998remove8@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> <gfretwell@aol.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>> On Sat, 26 Feb 2022 20:03:35 -0000 (UTC), Bill
>>>>>>>> <califbill9998remove8@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Since I don?t think they can defeat the amount of Russians Putin will throw
>>>>>>>>> at them, they should take the war to Russia. Start by blowing up the
>>>>>>>>> transformers at lots of major power substations. Then mine bridges
>>>>>>>>> connecting major areas. Run a war against the people of Russia and make
>>>>>>>>> them stop Putin and his cronies. Would also stop most cyber attacks, as
>>>>>>>>> how long is the cyber computers going to be able to run on auxiliary power,
>>>>>>>>> since the lack of power may take down the internet repeaters.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> That would be the best way to insure Ukraine ends up a smoking hole on
>>>>>>>> the ground. Russians take attacks on their homeland seriously, much
>>>>>>>> like the US and they might send in a million soldiers with all the
>>>>>>>> technology they can bring to bear.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> With the modern technology, I don?t think Russia would do well. They may
>>>>>>> not depend on the internet as much as we do, but I bet it is a lot. How
>>>>>>> much starvation when they can not get orders to deliver food?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I think you are overestimating what Ukraine could do and
>>>>>> underestimating the resilience of Russians. Bear in mind they lived
>>>>>> the USSR for most of the 20th century where shortages were just a way
>>>>>> of life. They also have a couple hundred year tradition of repelling
>>>>>> invaders. Napoleon and Hitler found that out the hard way. They may
>>>>>> have a generation or two of snowflakes but I doubt it.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> My bet is if Putin could sell the idea that Russia was being attacked,
>>>>>> Ukraine would cease to exist as a viable country.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The reality is if they had just made some kind of agrement that the
>>>>>> Eastern regions, that would willingly go back to being Russia, be
>>>>>> allowed to, this whole thing might have been unnecessary. It is the
>>>>>> likely outcome anyway.
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> I don?t think it would take too many assets to bring Russia or the USA to a
>>>>> halt. Destroy the transformers at a few major power stations. How many
>>>>> spares are a available, and how long to build replacements? A few bridges
>>>>> taken out. Look how much havoc the San Francisco Bay taken out in the
>>>>> Loma Prieta earthquake caused and how long to replace? A couple hundred
>>>>> people with a couple semi?s worth of explosives.
>>>>
>>>> With the Russian checkpoints at the border crossings, getting a semi
>>>> (or anything else) into Russia would be a bitch.
>>>>
>>>
>>> Should have had stuff in place already, and I said a semi load, does not
>>> have be in a semi.
>>
>> No, that would fall under 'anything else'!
>>
>> Do you mean Ukraine should have had tons of explosives in place to
>> take out bridges and transformers?
>>
>
>Yup, just like Putin had his military prepared.

No way. The autobahn bridges in Germany were pre-chambered for
explosives, including a small nuke. I can't imagine any of the major
Russian bridges being pre-chambered, so a couple tons of explosives
would have to be left in a pile somewhere. Of course, that's assuming
they could be smuggled past the checkpoints at the border crossings.
The same is true for your large electrical installations. Where would
they leave the pile of explosives until needed?

On Sun, 27 Feb 2022 22:31:31 -0500, gfretwell@aol.com wrote:

>On Sun, 27 Feb 2022 13:09:39 -0500, John H <jherring@cox.net> wrote:
>
>>On Sun, 27 Feb 2022 12:40:47 -0500, gfretwell@aol.com wrote:
>>
>>>On Sun, 27 Feb 2022 11:19:02 -0500, John H <jherring@cox.net> wrote:
>>>
>>>>On Sun, 27 Feb 2022 10:47:42 -0500, gfretwell@aol.com wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>On Sun, 27 Feb 2022 05:34:09 -0000 (UTC), Bill
>>>>><califbill9998remove8@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>><gfretwell@aol.com> wrote:
>>>>>>> On Sat, 26 Feb 2022 20:03:35 -0000 (UTC), Bill
>>>>>>> <califbill9998remove8@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Since I don’t think they can defeat the amount of Russians Putin will throw
>>>>>>>> at them, they should take the war to Russia. Start by blowing up the
>>>>>>>> transformers at lots of major power substations. Then mine bridges
>>>>>>>> connecting major areas. Run a war against the people of Russia and make
>>>>>>>> them stop Putin and his cronies. Would also stop most cyber attacks, as
>>>>>>>> how long is the cyber computers going to be able to run on auxiliary power,
>>>>>>>> since the lack of power may take down the internet repeaters.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> That would be the best way to insure Ukraine ends up a smoking hole on
>>>>>>> the ground. Russians take attacks on their homeland seriously, much
>>>>>>> like the US and they might send in a million soldiers with all the
>>>>>>> technology they can bring to bear.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>With the modern technology, I don’t think Russia would do well. They may
>>>>>>not depend on the internet as much as we do, but I bet it is a lot. How
>>>>>>much starvation when they can not get orders to deliver food?
>>>>>
>>>>>I think you are overestimating what Ukraine could do and
>>>>>underestimating the resilience of Russians. Bear in mind they lived
>>>>>the USSR for most of the 20th century where shortages were just a way
>>>>>of life. They also have a couple hundred year tradition of repelling
>>>>>invaders. Napoleon and Hitler found that out the hard way. They may
>>>>>have a generation or two of snowflakes but I doubt it.
>>>>>
>>>>>My bet is if Putin could sell the idea that Russia was being attacked,
>>>>>Ukraine would cease to exist as a viable country.
>>>>>
>>>>>The reality is if they had just made some kind of agrement that the
>>>>>Eastern regions, that would willingly go back to being Russia, be
>>>>>allowed to, this whole thing might have been unnecessary. It is the
>>>>>likely outcome anyway.
>>>>
>>>>I wouldn't count on any 'likely outcomes' if Putin pops a nuke.
>>>
>>>The only reason he would do that is because morons like Macron
>>>threaten him with nukes.
>>>There is no reason to nuke Ukraine.
>>>They have the conventional force to win there. If it costs them enough
>>>they might get out tho. There are people in Russia against this war.
>>>The only thing that would change that is if Putin could sell this war
>>>as protecting Mother Russia. Then he would have all the support he
>>>needs from the average Russian. That is the problem with Bill's idea.
>>>We saw that here when Bush Jr attacked Iraq. We had no national
>>>interest to do so but the administration lied and tied Saddam to 9-11.
>>>Then he could sell a stupid war as protecting America.
>>
>>Of course there's no 'rational' reason to nuke Ukraine! But just how
>>rational is that asshole? To the rest of the world, he is looking like
>>a fool right now. Even bringing his nuclear forces to high alert (if
>>that is true) is an irrational act.
>
>Not any more irrational than the feckless French rattling their saber
>with nukes. That is how this shit starts.

Different circumstances and tone.

""Yes, I think that Vladimir Putin must also understand that the
Atlantic alliance is a nuclear alliance. That is all I will say about
this," Le Drian said on Thursday on French television TF1."

On 2/27/2022 12:46 PM, gfretwell@aol.com wrote:
> On Sun, 27 Feb 2022 16:25:34 -0000 (UTC), Bill
> <califbill9998remove8@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> <gfretwell@aol.com> wrote:
>>> On Sun, 27 Feb 2022 05:34:09 -0000 (UTC), Bill
>>> <califbill9998remove8@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> <gfretwell@aol.com> wrote:
>>>>> On Sat, 26 Feb 2022 20:03:35 -0000 (UTC), Bill
>>>>> <califbill9998remove8@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Since I don’t think they can defeat the amount of Russians Putin will throw
>>>>>> at them, they should take the war to Russia. Start by blowing up the
>>>>>> transformers at lots of major power substations. Then mine bridges
>>>>>> connecting major areas. Run a war against the people of Russia and make
>>>>>> them stop Putin and his cronies. Would also stop most cyber attacks, as
>>>>>> how long is the cyber computers going to be able to run on auxiliary power,
>>>>>> since the lack of power may take down the internet repeaters.
>>>>>
>>>>> That would be the best way to insure Ukraine ends up a smoking hole on
>>>>> the ground. Russians take attacks on their homeland seriously, much
>>>>> like the US and they might send in a million soldiers with all the
>>>>> technology they can bring to bear.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> With the modern technology, I don’t think Russia would do well. They may
>>>> not depend on the internet as much as we do, but I bet it is a lot. How
>>>> much starvation when they can not get orders to deliver food?
>>>
>>> I think you are overestimating what Ukraine could do and
>>> underestimating the resilience of Russians. Bear in mind they lived
>>> the USSR for most of the 20th century where shortages were just a way
>>> of life. They also have a couple hundred year tradition of repelling
>>> invaders. Napoleon and Hitler found that out the hard way. They may
>>> have a generation or two of snowflakes but I doubt it.
>>>
>>> My bet is if Putin could sell the idea that Russia was being attacked,
>>> Ukraine would cease to exist as a viable country.
>>>
>>> The reality is if they had just made some kind of agrement that the
>>> Eastern regions, that would willingly go back to being Russia, be
>>> allowed to, this whole thing might have been unnecessary. It is the
>>> likely outcome anyway.
>>>
>>
>> I don’t think it would take too many assets to bring Russia or the USA to a
>> halt. Destroy the transformers at a few major power stations. How many
>> spares are a available, and how long to build replacements? A few bridges
>> taken out. Look how much havoc the San Francisco Bay taken out in the
>> Loma Prieta earthquake caused and how long to replace? A couple hundred
>> people with a couple semi’s worth of explosives.
>
> You do not want to test the resolve of the second most powerful
> military in the world by attacking their homeland. A small gang of
> terrorists brought down 2 buildings here and damaged a third. It gave
> us the excuse to destroy three countries that were not responsible at
> all. We still do not have a good count of how many people died.

I realize your post is a few days old but based on the Russian military
's performance so far in Ukraine, it sure doesn't seem to be of the
same caliber it was years ago. Several former US generals on the
various cable networks all agree. Russia's invasion has been a
clusterfuck so far. Munition malfunctions, logistical problems
and a bunch of young conscripts who didn't even know why they were
there.

It's too bad the nuke issue hangs over this. I think US and NATO forces
could make mincemeat of the 40 mile long line of Russian tanks, missile
launchers, troop transports and fuel trucks, all lined up three abreast
for miles. A few A-10 Warthogs would probably due the trick.

--
This email has been checked for viruses by AVG.
https://www.avg.com

On Thu, 3 Mar 2022 10:27:38 -0500, "Mr. Luddite" <nothere@noland.com>
wrote:

>On 2/27/2022 12:46 PM, gfretwell@aol.com wrote:
>> On Sun, 27 Feb 2022 16:25:34 -0000 (UTC), Bill
>> <califbill9998remove8@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> <gfretwell@aol.com> wrote:
>>>> On Sun, 27 Feb 2022 05:34:09 -0000 (UTC), Bill
>>>> <califbill9998remove8@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> <gfretwell@aol.com> wrote:
>>>>>> On Sat, 26 Feb 2022 20:03:35 -0000 (UTC), Bill
>>>>>> <califbill9998remove8@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Since I don’t think they can defeat the amount of Russians Putin will throw
>>>>>>> at them, they should take the war to Russia. Start by blowing up the
>>>>>>> transformers at lots of major power substations. Then mine bridges
>>>>>>> connecting major areas. Run a war against the people of Russia and make
>>>>>>> them stop Putin and his cronies. Would also stop most cyber attacks, as
>>>>>>> how long is the cyber computers going to be able to run on auxiliary power,
>>>>>>> since the lack of power may take down the internet repeaters.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> That would be the best way to insure Ukraine ends up a smoking hole on
>>>>>> the ground. Russians take attacks on their homeland seriously, much
>>>>>> like the US and they might send in a million soldiers with all the
>>>>>> technology they can bring to bear.
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> With the modern technology, I don’t think Russia would do well. They may
>>>>> not depend on the internet as much as we do, but I bet it is a lot. How
>>>>> much starvation when they can not get orders to deliver food?
>>>>
>>>> I think you are overestimating what Ukraine could do and
>>>> underestimating the resilience of Russians. Bear in mind they lived
>>>> the USSR for most of the 20th century where shortages were just a way
>>>> of life. They also have a couple hundred year tradition of repelling
>>>> invaders. Napoleon and Hitler found that out the hard way. They may
>>>> have a generation or two of snowflakes but I doubt it.
>>>>
>>>> My bet is if Putin could sell the idea that Russia was being attacked,
>>>> Ukraine would cease to exist as a viable country.
>>>>
>>>> The reality is if they had just made some kind of agrement that the
>>>> Eastern regions, that would willingly go back to being Russia, be
>>>> allowed to, this whole thing might have been unnecessary. It is the
>>>> likely outcome anyway.
>>>>
>>>
>>> I don’t think it would take too many assets to bring Russia or the USA to a
>>> halt. Destroy the transformers at a few major power stations. How many
>>> spares are a available, and how long to build replacements? A few bridges
>>> taken out. Look how much havoc the San Francisco Bay taken out in the
>>> Loma Prieta earthquake caused and how long to replace? A couple hundred
>>> people with a couple semi’s worth of explosives.
>>
>> You do not want to test the resolve of the second most powerful
>> military in the world by attacking their homeland. A small gang of
>> terrorists brought down 2 buildings here and damaged a third. It gave
>> us the excuse to destroy three countries that were not responsible at
>> all. We still do not have a good count of how many people died.
>
>
>I realize your post is a few days old but based on the Russian military
>'s performance so far in Ukraine, it sure doesn't seem to be of the
>same caliber it was years ago. Several former US generals on the
>various cable networks all agree. Russia's invasion has been a
>clusterfuck so far. Munition malfunctions, logistical problems
>and a bunch of young conscripts who didn't even know why they were
>there.
>
>It's too bad the nuke issue hangs over this. I think US and NATO forces
>could make mincemeat of the 40 mile long line of Russian tanks, missile
>launchers, troop transports and fuel trucks, all lined up three abreast
>for miles. A few A-10 Warthogs would probably due the trick.

I wonder if his nuclear threat would work if he attacks Poland.

On Thu, 3 Mar 2022 10:27:38 -0500, "Mr. Luddite" <nothere@noland.com>
wrote:

>On 2/27/2022 12:46 PM, gfretwell@aol.com wrote:
>> On Sun, 27 Feb 2022 16:25:34 -0000 (UTC), Bill
>> <califbill9998remove8@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> <gfretwell@aol.com> wrote:
>>>> On Sun, 27 Feb 2022 05:34:09 -0000 (UTC), Bill
>>>> <califbill9998remove8@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> <gfretwell@aol.com> wrote:
>>>>>> On Sat, 26 Feb 2022 20:03:35 -0000 (UTC), Bill
>>>>>> <califbill9998remove8@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Since I don’t think they can defeat the amount of Russians Putin will throw
>>>>>>> at them, they should take the war to Russia. Start by blowing up the
>>>>>>> transformers at lots of major power substations. Then mine bridges
>>>>>>> connecting major areas. Run a war against the people of Russia and make
>>>>>>> them stop Putin and his cronies. Would also stop most cyber attacks, as
>>>>>>> how long is the cyber computers going to be able to run on auxiliary power,
>>>>>>> since the lack of power may take down the internet repeaters.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> That would be the best way to insure Ukraine ends up a smoking hole on
>>>>>> the ground. Russians take attacks on their homeland seriously, much
>>>>>> like the US and they might send in a million soldiers with all the
>>>>>> technology they can bring to bear.
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> With the modern technology, I don’t think Russia would do well. They may
>>>>> not depend on the internet as much as we do, but I bet it is a lot. How
>>>>> much starvation when they can not get orders to deliver food?
>>>>
>>>> I think you are overestimating what Ukraine could do and
>>>> underestimating the resilience of Russians. Bear in mind they lived
>>>> the USSR for most of the 20th century where shortages were just a way
>>>> of life. They also have a couple hundred year tradition of repelling
>>>> invaders. Napoleon and Hitler found that out the hard way. They may
>>>> have a generation or two of snowflakes but I doubt it.
>>>>
>>>> My bet is if Putin could sell the idea that Russia was being attacked,
>>>> Ukraine would cease to exist as a viable country.
>>>>
>>>> The reality is if they had just made some kind of agrement that the
>>>> Eastern regions, that would willingly go back to being Russia, be
>>>> allowed to, this whole thing might have been unnecessary. It is the
>>>> likely outcome anyway.
>>>>
>>>
>>> I don’t think it would take too many assets to bring Russia or the USA to a
>>> halt. Destroy the transformers at a few major power stations. How many
>>> spares are a available, and how long to build replacements? A few bridges
>>> taken out. Look how much havoc the San Francisco Bay taken out in the
>>> Loma Prieta earthquake caused and how long to replace? A couple hundred
>>> people with a couple semi’s worth of explosives.
>>
>> You do not want to test the resolve of the second most powerful
>> military in the world by attacking their homeland. A small gang of
>> terrorists brought down 2 buildings here and damaged a third. It gave
>> us the excuse to destroy three countries that were not responsible at
>> all. We still do not have a good count of how many people died.
>
>
>I realize your post is a few days old but based on the Russian military
>'s performance so far in Ukraine, it sure doesn't seem to be of the
>same caliber it was years ago. Several former US generals on the
>various cable networks all agree. Russia's invasion has been a
>clusterfuck so far. Munition malfunctions, logistical problems
>and a bunch of young conscripts who didn't even know why they were
>there.
>
>It's too bad the nuke issue hangs over this. I think US and NATO forces
>could make mincemeat of the 40 mile long line of Russian tanks, missile
>launchers, troop transports and fuel trucks, all lined up three abreast
>for miles. A few A-10 Warthogs would probably due the trick.

No doubt they are fighting a "3d world" style war, assuming there is
no real opposition other than small arms fire on the ground.
It also appears the Russian soldiers are not that motivated. That is
why I pointed out to Bill, we really don't want to see an effective
attack on Russian soil. That might be what it takes to turn them into
an army out for revenge. Right now I doubt Putin is doing a very good
job in selling this war to his citizens. On the bright side, the big
money in Russia may be the ones to stop this and knock a little shine
off of Putin. I still bet he keeps the Donbass area.
..

On Thu, 03 Mar 2022 12:35:09 -0500, John H <jherring@cox.net> wrote:

>On Thu, 3 Mar 2022 10:27:38 -0500, "Mr. Luddite" <nothere@noland.com>
>wrote:
>
>>On 2/27/2022 12:46 PM, gfretwell@aol.com wrote:
>>> On Sun, 27 Feb 2022 16:25:34 -0000 (UTC), Bill
>>> <califbill9998remove8@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> <gfretwell@aol.com> wrote:
>>>>> On Sun, 27 Feb 2022 05:34:09 -0000 (UTC), Bill
>>>>> <califbill9998remove8@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> <gfretwell@aol.com> wrote:
>>>>>>> On Sat, 26 Feb 2022 20:03:35 -0000 (UTC), Bill
>>>>>>> <califbill9998remove8@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Since I don’t think they can defeat the amount of Russians Putin will throw
>>>>>>>> at them, they should take the war to Russia. Start by blowing up the
>>>>>>>> transformers at lots of major power substations. Then mine bridges
>>>>>>>> connecting major areas. Run a war against the people of Russia and make
>>>>>>>> them stop Putin and his cronies. Would also stop most cyber attacks, as
>>>>>>>> how long is the cyber computers going to be able to run on auxiliary power,
>>>>>>>> since the lack of power may take down the internet repeaters.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> That would be the best way to insure Ukraine ends up a smoking hole on
>>>>>>> the ground. Russians take attacks on their homeland seriously, much
>>>>>>> like the US and they might send in a million soldiers with all the
>>>>>>> technology they can bring to bear.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> With the modern technology, I don’t think Russia would do well. They may
>>>>>> not depend on the internet as much as we do, but I bet it is a lot. How
>>>>>> much starvation when they can not get orders to deliver food?
>>>>>
>>>>> I think you are overestimating what Ukraine could do and
>>>>> underestimating the resilience of Russians. Bear in mind they lived
>>>>> the USSR for most of the 20th century where shortages were just a way
>>>>> of life. They also have a couple hundred year tradition of repelling
>>>>> invaders. Napoleon and Hitler found that out the hard way. They may
>>>>> have a generation or two of snowflakes but I doubt it.
>>>>>
>>>>> My bet is if Putin could sell the idea that Russia was being attacked,
>>>>> Ukraine would cease to exist as a viable country.
>>>>>
>>>>> The reality is if they had just made some kind of agrement that the
>>>>> Eastern regions, that would willingly go back to being Russia, be
>>>>> allowed to, this whole thing might have been unnecessary. It is the
>>>>> likely outcome anyway.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> I don’t think it would take too many assets to bring Russia or the USA to a
>>>> halt. Destroy the transformers at a few major power stations. How many
>>>> spares are a available, and how long to build replacements? A few bridges
>>>> taken out. Look how much havoc the San Francisco Bay taken out in the
>>>> Loma Prieta earthquake caused and how long to replace? A couple hundred
>>>> people with a couple semi’s worth of explosives.
>>>
>>> You do not want to test the resolve of the second most powerful
>>> military in the world by attacking their homeland. A small gang of
>>> terrorists brought down 2 buildings here and damaged a third. It gave
>>> us the excuse to destroy three countries that were not responsible at
>>> all. We still do not have a good count of how many people died.
>>
>>
>>I realize your post is a few days old but based on the Russian military
>>'s performance so far in Ukraine, it sure doesn't seem to be of the
>>same caliber it was years ago. Several former US generals on the
>>various cable networks all agree. Russia's invasion has been a
>>clusterfuck so far. Munition malfunctions, logistical problems
>>and a bunch of young conscripts who didn't even know why they were
>>there.
>>
>>It's too bad the nuke issue hangs over this. I think US and NATO forces
>>could make mincemeat of the 40 mile long line of Russian tanks, missile
>>launchers, troop transports and fuel trucks, all lined up three abreast
>>for miles. A few A-10 Warthogs would probably due the trick.
>
>I wonder if his nuclear threat would work if he attacks Poland.

The US has troops in Poland. I doubt he wants that confrontation for
the same reason we don't.

gfretwell@aol.com Wrote in message:r
> On Thu, 03 Mar 2022 12:35:09 -0500, John H <jherring@cox.net> wrote:>On Thu, 3 Mar 2022 10:27:38 -0500, "Mr. Luddite" <nothere@noland.com>>wrote:>>>On 2/27/2022 12:46 PM, gfretwell@aol.com wrote:>>> On Sun, 27 Feb 2022 16:25:34 -0000 (UTC), Bill>>> <califbill9998remove8@gmail.com> wrote:>>> >>>> <gfretwell@aol.com> wrote:>>>>> On Sun, 27 Feb 2022 05:34:09 -0000 (UTC), Bill>>>>> <califbill9998remove8@gmail.com> wrote:>>>>>>>>>>> <gfretwell@aol.com> wrote:>>>>>>> On Sat, 26 Feb 2022 20:03:35 -0000 (UTC), Bill>>>>>>> <califbill9998remove8@gmail.com> wrote:>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Since I don?t think they can defeat the amount of Russians Putin will throw>>>>>>>> at them, they should take the war to Russia. Start by blowing up the>>>>>>>> transformers at lots of major power substations. Then mine bridges>>>>>>>> connecting major areas. Run a war against the people of Russia and make>>>>>>>> them stop Putin and his cronies. Would also stop most cyber attacks, as>>>>>>>> how long is the cyber computers going to be able to run on auxiliary power,>>>>>>>> since the lack of power may take down the internet repeaters.>>>>>>>>>>>>>> That would be the best way to insure Ukraine ends up
a smoking hole on>>>>>>> the ground. Russians take attacks on their homeland seriously, much>>>>>>> like the US and they might send in a million soldiers with all the>>>>>>> technology they can bring to bear.>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> With the modern technology, I don?t think Russia would do well. They may>>>>>> not depend on the internet as much as we do, but I bet it is a lot. How>>>>>> much starvation when they can not get orders to deliver food?>>>>>>>>>> I think you are overestimating what Ukraine could do and>>>>> underestimating the resilience of Russians. Bear in mind they lived>>>>> the USSR for most of the 20th century where shortages were just a way>>>>> of life. They also have a couple hundred year tradition of repelling>>>>> invaders. Napoleon and Hitler found that out the hard way. They may>>>>> have a generation or two of snowflakes but I doubt it.>>>>>>>>>> My bet is if Putin could sell the idea that Russia was being attacked,>>>>> Ukraine would cease to exist as a viable country.>>>>>>>>>> The reality is if they had just made some kind of agrement that the>>>>> Eastern regions, that would willingly go back to being Russia, be>>>>> allowed to, this whole thing might h
ave been unnecessary. It is the>>>>> likely outcome anyway.>>>>>>>>>>>>> I don?t think it would take too many assets to bring Russia or the USA to a>>>> halt. Destroy the transformers at a few major power stations. How many>>>> spares are a available, and how long to build replacements? A few bridges>>>> taken out. Look how much havoc the San Francisco Bay taken out in the>>>> Loma Prieta earthquake caused and how long to replace? A couple hundred>>>> people with a couple semi?s worth of explosives.>>> >>> You do not want to test the resolve of the second most powerful>>> military in the world by attacking their homeland. A small gang of>>> terrorists brought down 2 buildings here and damaged a third. It gave>>> us the excuse to destroy three countries that were not responsible at>>> all. We still do not have a good count of how many people died.>>>>>>I realize your post is a few days old but based on the Russian military>>'s performance so far in Ukraine, it sure doesn't seem to be of the>>same caliber it was years ago. Several former US generals on the>>various cable networks all agree. Russia's invasion has been a>>clusterfuck so far. Munition malfunctions, logistica
l problems>>and a bunch of young conscripts who didn't even know why they were>>there.>>>>It's too bad the nuke issue hangs over this. I think US and NATO forces>>could make mincemeat of the 40 mile long line of Russian tanks, missile >>launchers, troop transports and fuel trucks, all lined up three abreast>>for miles. A few A-10 Warthogs would probably due the trick.>>I wonder if his nuclear threat would work if he attacks Poland. The US has troops in Poland. I doubt he wants that confrontation forthe same reason we don't.

Russians are destroying their own equipment. And there is a seven
figure pricetag on Putin's head courtesy of a Russian
billionaire. There is a 550 foot Russian yacht that the Germans
confiscated. Russian soldiers are refusing to go on missions.
There aren't too many countrys that Putin can fly over. Biden
ought to jump on the bandwagon and get our oil production back on
line. Or, we could enlist SealTeam B to solve the
problem
--
Thanks Donald. Do you miss him yet?

----Android NewsGroup Reader----
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On 3/3/2022 12:53 PM, gfretwell@aol.com wrote:
> On Thu, 3 Mar 2022 10:27:38 -0500, "Mr. Luddite" <nothere@noland.com>
> wrote:
>
>> On 2/27/2022 12:46 PM, gfretwell@aol.com wrote:
>>> On Sun, 27 Feb 2022 16:25:34 -0000 (UTC), Bill
>>> <califbill9998remove8@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> <gfretwell@aol.com> wrote:
>>>>> On Sun, 27 Feb 2022 05:34:09 -0000 (UTC), Bill
>>>>> <califbill9998remove8@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> <gfretwell@aol.com> wrote:
>>>>>>> On Sat, 26 Feb 2022 20:03:35 -0000 (UTC), Bill
>>>>>>> <califbill9998remove8@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Since I don’t think they can defeat the amount of Russians Putin will throw
>>>>>>>> at them, they should take the war to Russia. Start by blowing up the
>>>>>>>> transformers at lots of major power substations. Then mine bridges
>>>>>>>> connecting major areas. Run a war against the people of Russia and make
>>>>>>>> them stop Putin and his cronies. Would also stop most cyber attacks, as
>>>>>>>> how long is the cyber computers going to be able to run on auxiliary power,
>>>>>>>> since the lack of power may take down the internet repeaters.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> That would be the best way to insure Ukraine ends up a smoking hole on
>>>>>>> the ground. Russians take attacks on their homeland seriously, much
>>>>>>> like the US and they might send in a million soldiers with all the
>>>>>>> technology they can bring to bear.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> With the modern technology, I don’t think Russia would do well. They may
>>>>>> not depend on the internet as much as we do, but I bet it is a lot. How
>>>>>> much starvation when they can not get orders to deliver food?
>>>>>
>>>>> I think you are overestimating what Ukraine could do and
>>>>> underestimating the resilience of Russians. Bear in mind they lived
>>>>> the USSR for most of the 20th century where shortages were just a way
>>>>> of life. They also have a couple hundred year tradition of repelling
>>>>> invaders. Napoleon and Hitler found that out the hard way. They may
>>>>> have a generation or two of snowflakes but I doubt it.
>>>>>
>>>>> My bet is if Putin could sell the idea that Russia was being attacked,
>>>>> Ukraine would cease to exist as a viable country.
>>>>>
>>>>> The reality is if they had just made some kind of agrement that the
>>>>> Eastern regions, that would willingly go back to being Russia, be
>>>>> allowed to, this whole thing might have been unnecessary. It is the
>>>>> likely outcome anyway.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> I don’t think it would take too many assets to bring Russia or the USA to a
>>>> halt. Destroy the transformers at a few major power stations. How many
>>>> spares are a available, and how long to build replacements? A few bridges
>>>> taken out. Look how much havoc the San Francisco Bay taken out in the
>>>> Loma Prieta earthquake caused and how long to replace? A couple hundred
>>>> people with a couple semi’s worth of explosives.
>>>
>>> You do not want to test the resolve of the second most powerful
>>> military in the world by attacking their homeland. A small gang of
>>> terrorists brought down 2 buildings here and damaged a third. It gave
>>> us the excuse to destroy three countries that were not responsible at
>>> all. We still do not have a good count of how many people died.
>>
>>
>> I realize your post is a few days old but based on the Russian military
>> 's performance so far in Ukraine, it sure doesn't seem to be of the
>> same caliber it was years ago. Several former US generals on the
>> various cable networks all agree. Russia's invasion has been a
>> clusterfuck so far. Munition malfunctions, logistical problems
>> and a bunch of young conscripts who didn't even know why they were
>> there.
>>
>> It's too bad the nuke issue hangs over this. I think US and NATO forces
>> could make mincemeat of the 40 mile long line of Russian tanks, missile
>> launchers, troop transports and fuel trucks, all lined up three abreast
>> for miles. A few A-10 Warthogs would probably due the trick.
>
> No doubt they are fighting a "3d world" style war, assuming there is
> no real opposition other than small arms fire on the ground.
> It also appears the Russian soldiers are not that motivated. That is
> why I pointed out to Bill, we really don't want to see an effective
> attack on Russian soil. That might be what it takes to turn them into
> an army out for revenge. Right now I doubt Putin is doing a very good
> job in selling this war to his citizens. On the bright side, the big
> money in Russia may be the ones to stop this and knock a little shine
> off of Putin. I still bet he keeps the Donbass area.
> .

I think the Russian civilian population is experiencing a similar
enlightenment that the US civilian population experienced starting
in the mid 60's with the war in Vietnam.

Post Soviet Russia is not the same as it was prior to 1991.
Capitalism has flourished. The Internet exists. Social Media
is available. A new generation of Russians exist with access
to information about the world beyond their borders.

Putin is a hold over from the Soviet days. He doesn't use the
Internet. He doesn't even live in the Kremlin ... and hasn't
for years. He lives in a "palace" built for him back in 2005
in a very controversial "business" arrangement with a wealthy
Russian ally. He's out of touch and not living in the world
of 2022.

Ultimately I think the Russian people will be the cause of
his downfall. I also think that eventually the same may be
true in China.

If you keep your citizens like mushrooms ... living in dark
caves and feeding them bullshit you can maintain power. But
once the sunlight starts to illuminate what is around them,
the revolts begin.

--
This email has been checked for viruses by AVG.
https://www.avg.com

"Mr. Luddite" <nothere@noland.com> Wrote in message:r
> On 3/3/2022 12:53 PM, gfretwell@aol.com wrote:> On Thu, 3 Mar 2022 10:27:38 -0500, "Mr. Luddite" <nothere@noland.com>> wrote:> >> On 2/27/2022 12:46 PM, gfretwell@aol.com wrote:>>> On Sun, 27 Feb 2022 16:25:34 -0000 (UTC), Bill>>> <califbill9998remove8@gmail.com> wrote:>>>>>>> <gfretwell@aol.com> wrote:>>>>> On Sun, 27 Feb 2022 05:34:09 -0000 (UTC), Bill>>>>> <califbill9998remove8@gmail.com> wrote:>>>>>>>>>>> <gfretwell@aol.com> wrote:>>>>>>> On Sat, 26 Feb 2022 20:03:35 -0000 (UTC), Bill>>>>>>> <califbill9998remove8@gmail.com> wrote:>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Since I don?t think they can defeat the amount of Russians Putin will throw>>>>>>>> at them, they should take the war to Russia. Start by blowing up the>>>>>>>> transformers at lots of major power substations. Then mine bridges>>>>>>>> connecting major areas. Run a war against the people of Russia and make>>>>>>>> them stop Putin and his cronies. Would also stop most cyber attacks, as>>>>>>>> how long is the cyber computers going to be able to run on auxiliary power,>>>>>>>> since the lack of power may take down the internet repeaters.>>>>>>>>>>>>>> That would be the best way to insure Ukraine ends up a smoking hole on>>
>>>>> the ground. Russians take attacks on their homeland seriously, much>>>>>>> like the US and they might send in a million soldiers with all the>>>>>>> technology they can bring to bear.>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> With the modern technology, I don?t think Russia would do well. They may>>>>>> not depend on the internet as much as we do, but I bet it is a lot. How>>>>>> much starvation when they can not get orders to deliver food?>>>>>>>>>> I think you are overestimating what Ukraine could do and>>>>> underestimating the resilience of Russians. Bear in mind they lived>>>>> the USSR for most of the 20th century where shortages were just a way>>>>> of life. They also have a couple hundred year tradition of repelling>>>>> invaders. Napoleon and Hitler found that out the hard way. They may>>>>> have a generation or two of snowflakes but I doubt it.>>>>>>>>>> My bet is if Putin could sell the idea that Russia was being attacked,>>>>> Ukraine would cease to exist as a viable country.>>>>>>>>>> The reality is if they had just made some kind of agrement that the>>>>> Eastern regions, that would willingly go back to being Russia, be>>>>> allowed to, this whole thing might have been unnecessar
y. It is the>>>>> likely outcome anyway.>>>>>>>>>>>>> I don?t think it would take too many assets to bring Russia or the USA to a>>>> halt. Destroy the transformers at a few major power stations. How many>>>> spares are a available, and how long to build replacements? A few bridges>>>> taken out. Look how much havoc the San Francisco Bay taken out in the>>>> Loma Prieta earthquake caused and how long to replace? A couple hundred>>>> people with a couple semi?s worth of explosives.>>>>>> You do not want to test the resolve of the second most powerful>>> military in the world by attacking their homeland. A small gang of>>> terrorists brought down 2 buildings here and damaged a third. It gave>>> us the excuse to destroy three countries that were not responsible at>>> all. We still do not have a good count of how many people died.>>>>>> I realize your post is a few days old but based on the Russian military>> 's performance so far in Ukraine, it sure doesn't seem to be of the>> same caliber it was years ago. Several former US generals on the>> various cable networks all agree. Russia's invasion has been a>> clusterfuck so far. Munition malfunctions, logistical problems>> an
d a bunch of young conscripts who didn't even know why they were>> there.>>>> It's too bad the nuke issue hangs over this. I think US and NATO forces>> could make mincemeat of the 40 mile long line of Russian tanks, missile>> launchers, troop transports and fuel trucks, all lined up three abreast>> for miles. A few A-10 Warthogs would probably due the trick.> > No doubt they are fighting a "3d world" style war, assuming there is> no real opposition other than small arms fire on the ground.> It also appears the Russian soldiers are not that motivated. That is> why I pointed out to Bill, we really don't want to see an effective> attack on Russian soil. That might be what it takes to turn them into> an army out for revenge. Right now I doubt Putin is doing a very good> job in selling this war to his citizens. On the bright side, the big > money in Russia may be the ones to stop this and knock a little shine> off of Putin. I still bet he keeps the Donbass area.> .I think the Russian civilian population is experiencing a similarenlightenment that the US civilian population experienced startingin the mid 60's with the war in Vietnam.Post Soviet Russia is not the same as it was prior
to 1991.Capitalism has flourished. The Internet exists. Social Mediais available. A new generation of Russians exist with accessto information about the world beyond their borders.Putin is a hold over from the Soviet days. He doesn't use theInternet. He doesn't even live in the Kremlin ... and hasn'tfor years. He lives in a "palace" built for him back in 2005in a very controversial "business" arrangement with a wealthyRussian ally. He's out of touch and not living in the worldof 2022.Ultimately I think the Russian people will be the cause ofhis downfall. I also think that eventually the same may betrue in China.If you keep your citizens like mushrooms ... living in darkcaves and feeding them bullshit you can maintain power. Butonce the sunlight starts to illuminate what is around them,the revolts begin.-- This email has been checked for viruses by AVG.https://www.avg.com

I think we need to shine some sunlight on democrats to make sure
this Obama/Biden thing never happens again.
--
Thanks Donald. Do you miss him yet?

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On Thu, 3 Mar 2022 13:28:11 -0500 (EST), justan <me@here.com> wrote:

>gfretwell@aol.com Wrote in message:r
>> On Thu, 03 Mar 2022 12:35:09 -0500, John H <jherring@cox.net> wrote:>On Thu, 3 Mar 2022 10:27:38 -0500, "Mr. Luddite" <nothere@noland.com>>wrote:>>>On 2/27/2022 12:46 PM, gfretwell@aol.com wrote:>>> On Sun, 27 Feb 2022 16:25:34 -0000 (UTC), Bill>>> <califbill9998remove8@gmail.com> wrote:>>> >>>> <gfretwell@aol.com> wrote:>>>>> On Sun, 27 Feb 2022 05:34:09 -0000 (UTC), Bill>>>>> <califbill9998remove8@gmail.com> wrote:>>>>>>>>>>> <gfretwell@aol.com> wrote:>>>>>>> On Sat, 26 Feb 2022 20:03:35 -0000 (UTC), Bill>>>>>>> <califbill9998remove8@gmail.com> wrote:>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Since I don?t think they can defeat the amount of Russians Putin will throw>>>>>>>> at them, they should take the war to Russia. Start by blowing up the>>>>>>>> transformers at lots of major power substations. Then mine bridges>>>>>>>> connecting major areas. Run a war against the people of Russia and make>>>>>>>> them stop Putin and his cronies. Would also stop most cyber attacks, as>>>>>>>> how long is
>the cyber computers going to be able to run on auxiliary power,>>>>>>>> since the lack of power may take down the internet repeaters.>>>>>>>>>>>>>> That would be the best way to insure Ukraine ends up a smoking hole on>>>>>>> the ground. Russians take attacks on their homeland seriously, much>>>>>>> like the US and they might send in a million soldiers with all the>>>>>>> technology they can bring to bear.>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> With the modern technology, I don?t think Russia would do well. They may>>>>>> not depend on the internet as much as we do, but I bet it is a lot. How>>>>>> much starvation when they can not get orders to deliver food?>>>>>>>>>> I think you are overestimating what Ukraine could do and>>>>> underestimating the resilience of Russians. Bear in mind they lived>>>>> the USSR for most of the 20th century where shortages were just a way>>>>> of life. They also have a couple hundred year tradition of repelling>>>>> invaders. Napoleon and Hitler found that out the
>hard way. They may>>>>> have a generation or two of snowflakes but I doubt it.>>>>>>>>>> My bet is if Putin could sell the idea that Russia was being attacked,>>>>> Ukraine would cease to exist as a viable country.>>>>>>>>>> The reality is if they had just made some kind of agrement that the>>>>> Eastern regions, that would willingly go back to being Russia, be>>>>> allowed to, this whole thing might have been unnecessary. It is the>>>>> likely outcome anyway.>>>>>>>>>>>>> I don?t think it would take too many assets to bring Russia or the USA to a>>>> halt. Destroy the transformers at a few major power stations. How many>>>> spares are a available, and how long to build replacements? A few bridges>>>> taken out. Look how much havoc the San Francisco Bay taken out in the>>>> Loma Prieta earthquake caused and how long to replace? A couple hundred>>>> people with a couple semi?s worth of explosives.>>> >>> You do not want to test the resolve of the second most powerful>>>
>military in the world by attacking their homeland. A small gang of>>> terrorists brought down 2 buildings here and damaged a third. It gave>>> us the excuse to destroy three countries that were not responsible at>>> all. We still do not have a good count of how many people died.>>>>>>I realize your post is a few days old but based on the Russian military>>'s performance so far in Ukraine, it sure doesn't seem to be of the>>same caliber it was years ago. Several former US generals on the>>various cable networks all agree. Russia's invasion has been a>>clusterfuck so far. Munition malfunctions, logistical problems>>and a bunch of young conscripts who didn't even know why they were>>there.>>>>It's too bad the nuke issue hangs over this. I think US and NATO forces>>could make mincemeat of the 40 mile long line of Russian tanks, missile >>launchers, troop transports and fuel trucks, all lined up three abreast>>for miles. A few A-10 Warthogs would probably due the trick.>>I wonder
if
>his nuclear threat would work if he attacks Poland. The US has troops in Poland. I doubt he wants that confrontation forthe same reason we don't.
>
>Russians are destroying their own equipment. And there is a seven
> figure pricetag on Putin's head courtesy of a Russian
> billionaire. There is a 550 foot Russian yacht that the Germans
> confiscated. Russian soldiers are refusing to go on missions.
> There aren't too many countrys that Putin can fly over. Biden
> ought to jump on the bandwagon and get our oil production back on
> line. Or, we could enlist SealTeam B to solve the
> problem

In the meantime much of Ukraine is getting flattened. Damn shame. I
wish we could do something. Can't believe Biden is still buying oil
from the fucker.