I thought that F1 venues, had marshals and team staff or instruments at every corer, sending back real-time data on track temperature, air temperature and humidity, visibility, etcetera.

The W Series field were foot-to-the floor on the opening lap of their final qualifying session, fitted with slicks.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6F8KIH6oVCk

Who the hell was in charge when the cars hurtled into Eau Rouge ?

On Friday, August 27, 2021 at 3:31:43 PM UTC-6, bra wrote:

> Who the hell was in charge when the cars hurtled into Eau Rouge ?

the girls right feet

On 28/08/2021 9:31 am, bra wrote:
> I thought that F1 venues, had marshals and team staff or instruments at every corer, sending back real-time data on track temperature, air temperature and humidity, visibility, etcetera.
>
> The W Series field were foot-to-the floor on the opening lap of their final qualifying session, fitted with slicks.
>
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6F8KIH6oVCk
>
> Who the hell was in charge when the cars hurtled into Eau Rouge ?

"Who the hell was in charge"? The drivers were in charge - that's who. They'd finished their two
tyre warm up laps and saw light rain and decided this was the only chance to get a fast lap in for
qually so went for it.

At least that's what two of the drivers said (the first two) in post-incident interviews.

Who's in charge when you drive?
--
Shaun.

"Humans will have advanced a long, long way when religious belief has a cozy little classification
in the DSM"
David Melville

This is not an email and hasn't been checked for viruses by any half-arsed self-promoting software.

On 27/08/2021 22:31, bra wrote:
> I thought that F1 venues, had marshals and team staff or instruments at every corer, sending back real-time data on track temperature, air temperature and humidity, visibility, etcetera.
>
> The W Series field were foot-to-the floor on the opening lap of their final qualifying session, fitted with slicks.
>
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6F8KIH6oVCk
>
> Who the hell was in charge when the cars hurtled into Eau Rouge ?
>

That URL doesn't work for me, complains that I'm in the wrong country.
This one works for me:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TF9ClJSMEGA

Cheers

Geoff

On Friday, August 27, 2021 at 6:20:09 PM UTC-7, ~misfit~ wrote:
> On 28/08/2021 9:31 am, bra wrote:
> > I thought that F1 venues, had marshals and team staff or instruments at every corer, sending back real-time data on track temperature, air temperature and humidity, visibility, etcetera.
> >
> > The W Series field were foot-to-the floor on the opening lap of their final qualifying session, fitted with slicks.
> >
> > https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6F8KIH6oVCk
> >
> > Who the hell was in charge when the cars hurtled into Eau Rouge ?
> "Who the hell was in charge"? The drivers were in charge - that's who. They'd finished their two
> tyre warm up laps and saw light rain and decided this was the only chance to get a fast lap in for
> qually so went for it.
>
> At least that's what two of the drivers said (the first two) in post-incident interviews.

Thanks for the background info. But do corner marshals radio in info, and do teams / stewards act on it?

Wow, when was the last time a "major" series had that?

XYXPDQ <qwrtz123@gmail.com> wrote:
> Wow, when was the last time a "major" series had that?
>

Not sure. Canada on the late 90’s early 2000’s?

Also looks like the halo saved a life. Nasty stuff.

FWIW
DLM

--
....hovering like a fly waiting for the windshield on the freeway...”

On 29/08/2021 4:36 am, bra wrote:
> On Friday, August 27, 2021 at 6:20:09 PM UTC-7, ~misfit~ wrote:
>> On 28/08/2021 9:31 am, bra wrote:
>>> I thought that F1 venues, had marshals and team staff or instruments at every corer, sending back real-time data on track temperature, air temperature and humidity, visibility, etcetera.
>>>
>>> The W Series field were foot-to-the floor on the opening lap of their final qualifying session, fitted with slicks.
>>>
>>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6F8KIH6oVCk
>>>
>>> Who the hell was in charge when the cars hurtled into Eau Rouge ?
>> "Who the hell was in charge"? The drivers were in charge - that's who. They'd finished their two
>> tyre warm up laps and saw light rain and decided this was the only chance to get a fast lap in for
>> qually so went for it.
>>
>> At least that's what two of the drivers said (the first two) in post-incident interviews.
>
> Thanks for the background info. But do corner marshals radio in info, and do teams / stewards act on it?

As Brundle said during the F1 qualifying; The stewards can say, acting on info from Bernd
Maylander, if a session should start. After that it's up to the drivers to either continue the
session or radio in if they want a change of tyres or think the session should be red flagged.
Corner marshals have zero input on conditions.

Sorry for my previous tone, I thought that this was common knowledge among followers of world
motorsport.

Cheers,
--
Shaun.

"Humans will have advanced a long, long way when religious belief has a cozy little classification
in the DSM"
David Melville

This is not an email and hasn't been checked for viruses by any half-arsed self-promoting software.

Presumably oil or debris on a corner would be radio'ed in by marshals and reported to Maylander ---- I hope!

I acknowledge the drivers'-decision protocol.

> As Brundle said during the F1 qualifying; The stewards can say, acting on info from Bernd
> Maylander, if a session should start. After that it's up to the drivers to either continue the
> session or radio in if they want a change of tyres or think the session should be red flagged.
> Corner marshals have zero input on conditions.
>
> Sorry for my previous tone, I thought that this was common knowledge among followers of world
> motorsport.
>
> Cheers,
> --
> Shaun.

On Sunday, August 29, 2021 at 12:16:21 PM UTC-6, bra wrote:

> Presumably oil or debris on a corner would be radio'ed in by marshals and reported to Maylander ---- I hope!
>
> I acknowledge the drivers'-decision protocol.

form a sentence.
you senile old cunt.

On 30/08/2021 6:16 am, bra wrote:
> Presumably oil or debris on a corner would be radio'ed in by marshals and reported to Maylander ---- I hope!

Yep, I thought about that after I hit send. Oil, a crash, a tree falls across the track etc. would
be reported by marshals to race control who would then tell teams to tell drivers...

> I acknowledge the drivers'-decision protocol.
>
>> As Brundle said during the F1 qualifying; The stewards can say, acting on info from Bernd
>> Maylander, if a session should start. After that it's up to the drivers to either continue the
>> session or radio in if they want a change of tyres or think the session should be red flagged.
>> Corner marshals have zero input on conditions.
>>
>> Sorry for my previous tone, I thought that this was common knowledge among followers of world
>> motorsport.
>>
>> Cheers,

--
Shaun.

"Humans will have advanced a long, long way when religious belief has a cozy little classification
in the DSM"
David Melville

This is not an email and hasn't been checked for viruses by any half-arsed self-promoting software.

On Sunday, August 29, 2021 at 9:25:34 PM UTC-6, ~misfit~ wrote:

> a tree falls across the track etc.

yup, you could only hope one falls on your head

On 8/27/2021 2:31 PM, bra wrote:
> I thought that F1 venues, had marshals and team staff or instruments at every corer, sending back real-time data on track temperature, air temperature and humidity, visibility, etcetera.
>
> The W Series field were foot-to-the floor on the opening lap of their final qualifying session, fitted with slicks.
>
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6F8KIH6oVCk
>
> Who the hell was in charge when the cars hurtled into Eau Rouge ?
>
#1, I have been in the race control room at Spa.
It is probably as up to date as anywhere.
It has constant video feed covering every corner.

But those views do not really inform as to dampness
landing in one place on the track.

#2 Look again at your presented video.
The video is just about where the turn station is.
You can look 'up track' and see clearly to La Source.
There is not enough rain in the air to really show up,
looking through the 'rain', but view is still clear
for about 3,000 feet.
If the camera can not see the mist / rain,
how should the turn workers be sure of it?

#3 The cars have over 1 second between them,
I'm a bit surprised that they had not lifted
off seeing what was happening ahead.
From other angles of this accident, seems like the
yellow was not as quick as it should have been.

> #1, I have been in the race control room at Spa.
> It is probably as up to date as anywhere.
> It has constant video feed covering every corner.
>
> But those views do not really inform as to dampness
> landing in one place on the track.
>
> #2 Look again at your presented video.
> The video is just about where the turn station is.
> You can look 'up track' and see clearly to La Source.
> There is not enough rain in the air to really show up,
> looking through the 'rain', but view is still clear
> for about 3,000 feet.
> If the camera can not see the mist / rain,
> how should the turn workers be sure of it?
>
> #3 The cars have over 1 second between them,
> I'm a bit surprised that they had not lifted
> off seeing what was happening ahead.
> From other angles of this accident, seems like the
> yellow was not as quick as it should have been.
Thanks for those notes.

On 2021-08-29 11:25 p.m., ~misfit~ wrote:
> On 30/08/2021 6:16 am, bra wrote:
>> Presumably oil or debris on a corner would be radio'ed in by marshals
>> and reported to Maylander ---- I hope!
>
> Yep, I thought about that after I hit send. Oil, a crash, a tree falls
> across the track etc. would be reported by marshals to race control who
> would then tell teams to tell drivers...

I can't tell you for certain until I speak to my friend who has actually
been an F1 steward at many events, but I believe that:

1. Marshals would always call in changes in surface conditions OTHER
than weather.

2. Race control would be polling the marshals if there was a need to
understand how much rain was falling on various parts of the circuit.

Marshals wouldn't volunteer their opinions on weather, but they would
probably be asked about it.

>
>> I acknowledge the drivers'-decision protocol.
>>
>>> As Brundle said during the F1 qualifying; The stewards can say,
>>> acting on info from Bernd
>>> Maylander, if a session should start. After that it's up to the
>>> drivers to either continue the
>>> session or radio in if they want a change of tyres or think the
>>> session should be red flagged.
>>> Corner marshals have zero input on conditions.
>>>
>>> Sorry for my previous tone, I thought that this was common knowledge
>>> among followers of world
>>> motorsport.

On 8/28/2021 9:36 AM, bra wrote:
> On Friday, August 27, 2021 at 6:20:09 PM UTC-7, ~misfit~ wrote:
>> On 28/08/2021 9:31 am, bra wrote:
>>> I thought that F1 venues, had marshals and team staff or instruments at every corer, sending back real-time data on track temperature, air temperature and humidity, visibility, etcetera.
>>>
>>> The W Series field were foot-to-the floor on the opening lap of their final qualifying session, fitted with slicks.
>>>
>>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6F8KIH6oVCk
>>>
>>> Who the hell was in charge when the cars hurtled into Eau Rouge ?
>> "Who the hell was in charge"? The drivers were in charge - that's who. They'd finished their two
>> tyre warm up laps and saw light rain and decided this was the only chance to get a fast lap in for
>> qually so went for it.
>>
>> At least that's what two of the drivers said (the first two) in post-incident interviews.
>
>
> Thanks for the background info. But do corner marshals radio in info, and do teams / stewards act on it?
>
Corner marshals will normally wave a debris flag when
they see 'stuff' on the track that the drivers should
be aware of.
Anytime they wave any flag they will notify Race Control.
Since wetness is often gradual, they may notify Race
Control before a flag is waved.

On 8/31/2021 3:26 PM, a425couple wrote:
> On 8/28/2021 9:36 AM, bra wrote:
>> On Friday, August 27, 2021 at 6:20:09 PM UTC-7, ~misfit~ wrote:
>>> On 28/08/2021 9:31 am, bra wrote:
>>>> I thought that F1 venues, had marshals and team staff or instruments
>>>> at every corer, sending back real-time data on track temperature,
>>>> air temperature and humidity, visibility, etcetera.
>>>>
>>>> The W Series field were foot-to-the floor on the opening lap of
>>>> their final qualifying session, fitted with slicks.
>>>>
>>>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6F8KIH6oVCk
>>>>
>>>> Who the hell was in charge when the cars hurtled into Eau Rouge ?
>>> "Who the hell was in charge"? The drivers were in charge - that's
>>> who. They'd finished their two
>>> tyre warm up laps and saw light rain and decided this was the only
>>> chance to get a fast lap in for
>>> qually so went for it.
>>>
>>> At least that's what two of the drivers said (the first two) in
>>> post-incident interviews.
>>
>>
>> Thanks for the background info. But do corner marshals radio in info,
>> and do teams / stewards act on it?
>>
> Corner marshals will normally wave a debris flag when
> they see 'stuff' on the track that the drivers should
> be aware of.
> Anytime they wave any flag they will notify Race Control.
> Since wetness is often gradual, they may notify Race
> Control before a flag is waved.
>
I need to modify that above. When I wrote it I was
mentally very much into what I spent the last weekend
doing, being an official at a local race.

Certainly corner marshals radio their observations
to race control (at the local races, generally after
waving the appropriate flag).

Where as, F1 decision making seems much more from
the top driven down.
Also in F1, all drivers have instant communication
with their teams, and the teams have very quick
communication with race control.

So, I would think that an individual corner would
probably be less likely to wave a debris flag
without clearing it through race control.

On 1/09/2021 1:59 pm, a425couple wrote:
> On 8/31/2021 3:26 PM, a425couple wrote:
>> On 8/28/2021 9:36 AM, bra wrote:
>>> On Friday, August 27, 2021 at 6:20:09 PM UTC-7, ~misfit~ wrote:
>>>> On 28/08/2021 9:31 am, bra wrote:
>>>>> I thought that F1 venues, had marshals and team staff or instruments at every corer, sending
>>>>> back real-time data on track temperature, air temperature and humidity, visibility, etcetera.
>>>>>
>>>>> The W Series field were foot-to-the floor on the opening lap of their final qualifying
>>>>> session, fitted with slicks.
>>>>>
>>>>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6F8KIH6oVCk
>>>>>
>>>>> Who the hell was in charge when the cars hurtled into Eau Rouge ?
>>>> "Who the hell was in charge"? The drivers were in charge - that's who. They'd finished their two
>>>> tyre warm up laps and saw light rain and decided this was the only chance to get a fast lap in for
>>>> qually so went for it.
>>>>
>>>> At least that's what two of the drivers said (the first two) in post-incident interviews.
>>>
>>>
>>> Thanks for the background info. But do corner marshals radio in info, and do teams / stewards
>>> act on it?
>>>
>> Corner marshals will normally wave a debris flag when
>> they see 'stuff' on the track that the drivers should
>> be aware of.
>> Anytime they wave any flag they will notify Race Control.
>> Since wetness is often gradual, they may notify Race
>> Control before a flag is waved.
>>
> I need to modify that above.  When I wrote it I was
> mentally very much into what I spent the last weekend
> doing, being an official at a local race.

Thanks for that. :)

> Certainly corner marshals radio their observations
> to race control (at the local races, generally after
> waving the appropriate flag).
>
> Where as, F1 decision making seems much more from
> the top driven down.
> Also in F1, all drivers have instant communication
> with their teams, and the teams have very quick
> communication with race control.

In F1 not only can teams quickly communicate with race control but also race control have a small
team that listens in to all driver / team coms. So if a driver reports an issue on his radio race
control know of it without having to wait for the team to notify them. A race control coms team
member will tell Masi directly if there's something dangerous going on.

Generally a team will only contact race control if they want to emphasise something a driver has
already said about a safety issue or to further their self-interest (i.e. Driver A was pushed off
the track by driver G from team X).

> So, I would think that an individual corner would
> probably be less likely to wave a debris flag
> without clearing it through race control.

Cheers,
--
Shaun.

"Humans will have advanced a long, long way when religious belief has a cozy little classification
in the DSM"
David Melville

This is not an email and hasn't been checked for viruses by any half-arsed self-promoting software.

On 31/08/2021 10:08 am, a425couple wrote:
> On 8/27/2021 2:31 PM, bra wrote:
>> I thought that F1 venues, had marshals and team staff or instruments at every corer, sending back
>> real-time data on track temperature, air temperature and humidity, visibility, etcetera.
>>
>> The W Series field were foot-to-the floor on the opening lap of their final qualifying session,
>> fitted with slicks.
>>
>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6F8KIH6oVCk
>>
>> Who the hell was in charge when the cars hurtled into Eau Rouge ?
>>
> #1, I have been in the race control room at Spa.
>   It is probably as up to date as anywhere.
>   It has constant video feed covering every corner.
>
>   But those views do not really inform as to dampness
> landing in one place on the track.
>
> #2  Look again at your presented video.
>   The video is just about where the turn station is.
>   You can look 'up track' and see clearly to La Source.
>   There is not enough rain in the air to really show up,
> looking through the 'rain', but view is still clear
> for about 3,000 feet.
>   If the camera can not see the mist / rain,
> how should the turn workers be sure of it?
>
> #3  The cars have over 1 second between them,
> I'm a bit surprised that they had not lifted
> off seeing what was happening ahead.

It's a blind crest of a hill.
<https://youtu.be/1MVI023f23M?t=213>
Racing drivers tend to not run into the back or side of other cars of they can avoid it.

> From other angles of this accident, seems like the
> yellow was not as quick as it should have been.

Cheers,
--
Shaun.

"Humans will have advanced a long, long way when religious belief has a cozy little classification
in the DSM"
David Melville

This is not an email and hasn't been checked for viruses by any half-arsed self-promoting software.