I can't find an FIA rule about the provision and maintenance of engines. (1.) Who builds and who maintains the Ferrari engines in the three teams that use it? (2.) Likewise the four users of the Mercedes engine. (3.) Lastly, when did the Red Bull engine come into existence without parents?

On 3/17/2022 1:16 PM, bra wrote:
> I can't find an FIA rule about the provision and maintenance of
> engines. (1.) Who builds and who maintains the Ferrari engines in
> the three teams that use it? (2.) Likewise the four users of the
> Mercedes engine.

I believe those engine manufacturers build and maintain the engines - by
choice, not by rule.

> (3.) Lastly, when did the Red Bull engine come into existence without
> parents?

Honda abandoned it on their doorstep. After they had announced their
intention Max won the WDC using it, so they decided to continue to
assemble it (although AIUI the Red Bull engine operation, formed in
anticipation of entirely taking over the Honda operation and of
developing a new engine for 2026 or so) has more of a role in
maintenance than a customer would.

--
Mark Jackson - https://mark-jackson.online/
A vital part of my job is to render
soporific subjects into gripping prose.
- Idrees Kahloon

> > (3.) Lastly, when did the Red Bull engine come into existence without
> > parents?
> Honda abandoned it on their doorstep. After they had announced their
> intention Max won the WDC using it, so they decided to continue to
> assemble it (although AIUI the Red Bull engine operation, formed in
> anticipation of entirely taking over the Honda operation and of
> developing a new engine for 2026 or so) has more of a role in
> maintenance than a customer would.
Thank you, Mark.
Was the 'initial' Honda engine built in England, and if so, is it still built there at Red Bull?

On 3/17/2022 3:31 PM, bra wrote:

> Was the 'initial' Honda engine built in England, and if so, is it
> still built there at Red Bull?

Always been Japan:

"Honda will continue to assemble engines in Japan for Red Bull next year
after the manufacturer's departure from Formula One, team boss Christian
Horner said at the Austrian Grand Prix."

https://www.espn.com/f1/story/_/id/31755710/honda-continue-assembling-f1-engines-red-bull-2022

Note that this article is from July 2021, and Honda may be more involved
in the next couple of years than indicated.

--
Mark Jackson - https://mark-jackson.online/
A vital part of my job is to render
soporific subjects into gripping prose.
- Idrees Kahloon

On Thursday, March 17, 2022 at 12:52:33 PM UTC-7, Mark Jackson wrote:
> On 3/17/2022 3:31 PM, bra wrote:
>
> > Was the 'initial' Honda engine built in England, and if so, is it
> > still built there at Red Bull?
> Always been Japan:
>
> "Honda will continue to assemble engines in Japan for Red Bull next year
> after the manufacturer's departure from Formula One, team boss Christian
> Horner said at the Austrian Grand Prix."
>
> https://www.espn.com/f1/story/_/id/31755710/honda-continue-assembling-f1-engines-red-bull-2022
>
> Note that this article is from July 2021, and Honda may be more involved
> in the next couple of years than indicated.
> --
> Mark Jackson - https://mark-jackson.online/
> A vital part of my job is to render
> soporific subjects into gripping prose.
> - Idrees Kahloon

Thanks again. I'm surprised the car's not called 'Red Bull Honda', though Honda's name appears boldly on the body.

On 3/17/2022 6:59 PM, bra wrote:
> I'm surprised the car's not called 'Red Bull Honda', though Honda's
> name appears boldly on the body.

The engine is the "Red Bull RBPTH001" according to Forix; presumably the
initials are for Red Bull Power Train Honda.

Rebadging engines has precedent in F1. The 1990s Renault 3-liter V10
was also known as Mechachrome, Supertec, and Playlife depending on the
year and the team using it.

--
Mark Jackson - https://mark-jackson.online/
A vital part of my job is to render
soporific subjects into gripping prose.
- Idrees Kahloon

On 18/03/2022 11:59 am, bra wrote:
> On Thursday, March 17, 2022 at 12:52:33 PM UTC-7, Mark Jackson wrote:
>> On 3/17/2022 3:31 PM, bra wrote:
>>
>>> Was the 'initial' Honda engine built in England, and if so, is it
>>> still built there at Red Bull?
>> Always been Japan:
>>
>> "Honda will continue to assemble engines in Japan for Red Bull next year
>> after the manufacturer's departure from Formula One, team boss Christian
>> Horner said at the Austrian Grand Prix."
>>
>> https://www.espn.com/f1/story/_/id/31755710/honda-continue-assembling-f1-engines-red-bull-2022
>>
>> Note that this article is from July 2021, and Honda may be more involved
>> in the next couple of years than indicated.
>> --
>> Mark Jackson - https://mark-jackson.online/
>> A vital part of my job is to render
>> soporific subjects into gripping prose.
>> - Idrees Kahloon
>
>
> Thanks again. I'm surprised the car's not called 'Red Bull Honda', though Honda's name appears boldly on the body.

Did somebody somewehere miss the news last year that Honda were
withdrawing from F1, and sold all their engine intellectual property,
etc, to Red Bull ?

geoff