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sport / rec.sport.football.college / Re: Leaving the sinking ship, or seeing the writing on the wall?

SubjectAuthor
* Leaving the sinking ship, or seeing the writing on the wall?The NOTBCS Guy
+* Re: Leaving the sinking ship, or seeing the writing on the wall?Michael Falkner
|`* Re: Leaving the sinking ship, or seeing the writing on the wall?The NOTBCS Guy
| `- Re: Leaving the sinking ship, or seeing the writing on the wall?Michael Falkner
+* Re: Leaving the sinking ship, or seeing the writing on the wall?Tim VanWagoner
|+* Re: Leaving the sinking ship, or seeing the writing on the wall?Johnny RSFCootball
||`- Re: Leaving the sinking ship, or seeing the writing on the wall?Ken Olson
|`- Re: Leaving the sinking ship, or seeing the writing on the wall?floaterjr
`* Re: Leaving the sinking ship, or seeing the writing on the wall?RoddyMcCorley
 `* Re: Leaving the sinking ship, or seeing the writing on the wall?Michael Falkner
  `* Re: Leaving the sinking ship, or seeing the writing on the wall?Ken Olson
   `* Re: Leaving the sinking ship, or seeing the writing on the wall?Michael Falkner
    `* Re: Leaving the sinking ship, or seeing the writing on the wall?Ken Olson
     `* Re: Leaving the sinking ship, or seeing the writing on the wall?Michael Falkner
      `* Re: Leaving the sinking ship, or seeing the writing on the wall?Ken Olson
       `* Re: Leaving the sinking ship, or seeing the writing on the wall?Michael Falkner
        `- Re: Leaving the sinking ship, or seeing the writing on the wall?Ken Olson

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Leaving the sinking ship, or seeing the writing on the wall?

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Subject: Leaving the sinking ship, or seeing the writing on the wall?
From: don.p.de...@gmail.com (The NOTBCS Guy)
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 by: The NOTBCS Guy - Wed, 27 Apr 2022 21:55 UTC

Mark Emmert is stepping down as NCAA President, effective at the end of June, 2023, unless a replacement is found for him before then.

Why do I have the feeling that his idea of "there's a reason they're called student-athletes" not seeming to hold up very well, at least in Division I, with the Transfer Portal and NIL deals left and right (and not just for Power 5 football or "major" men's basketball, either) has something to do with this?

Re: Leaving the sinking ship, or seeing the writing on the wall?

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Subject: Re: Leaving the sinking ship, or seeing the writing on the wall?
From: darkstar...@gmail.com (Michael Falkner)
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 by: Michael Falkner - Wed, 27 Apr 2022 22:41 UTC

On Wednesday, April 27, 2022 at 2:55:07 PM UTC-7, The NOTBCS Guy wrote:
> Mark Emmert is stepping down as NCAA President, effective at the end of June, 2023, unless a replacement is found for him before then.
>
> Why do I have the feeling that his idea of "there's a reason they're called student-athletes" not seeming to hold up very well, at least in Division I, with the Transfer Portal and NIL deals left and right (and not just for Power 5 football or "major" men's basketball, either) has something to do with this?

I think, between that and transgender issues, the NCAA as a governing body is about to become a thing of the past.

Mike

Re: Leaving the sinking ship, or seeing the writing on the wall?

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Subject: Re: Leaving the sinking ship, or seeing the writing on the wall?
From: don.p.de...@gmail.com (The NOTBCS Guy)
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 by: The NOTBCS Guy - Thu, 28 Apr 2022 00:00 UTC

> > Why do I have the feeling that his idea of "there's a reason they're called student-athletes" not seeming to hold up very well, at least in Division I, with the Transfer Portal and NIL deals left and right (and not just for Power 5 football or "major" men's basketball, either) has something to do with this?
> I think, between that and transgender issues, the NCAA as a governing body is about to become a thing of the past.

I think that, eventually, the NCAA as a governing body over "big time" football and men's basketball (I hesitate to say "Power 5" as a lot of P5 schools wouldn't make it to any "superleague") will be a thing of the past - and Notre Dame's AD agrees with me. The players won't even have to attend the schools. However, there will always be a need for the NCAA in some capacity, in the same way that the NAIA and NJCAA exist; somebody has to be the "parent organization" for the rest of the schools/sports. Who would enforce the rules - the schools? Guess what? The NCAA **is** "the schools" in this respect. Why is there a limit of 25 freshmen/juco transfers at any time on an FBS football team? Because a majority of the FBS schools want it that way.

Re: Leaving the sinking ship, or seeing the writing on the wall?

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Subject: Re: Leaving the sinking ship, or seeing the writing on the wall?
From: darkstar...@gmail.com (Michael Falkner)
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 by: Michael Falkner - Thu, 28 Apr 2022 02:03 UTC

On Wednesday, April 27, 2022 at 5:00:20 PM UTC-7, The NOTBCS Guy wrote:

> I think that, eventually, the NCAA as a governing body over "big time" football and men's basketball (I hesitate to say "Power 5" as a lot of P5 schools wouldn't make it to any "superleague") will be a thing of the past - and Notre Dame's AD agrees with me.

I think that will pretty much end the NCAA, however. That's EXACTLY what I see happening, and I see incrementally more talk of a Super League-ish football scenario, at the barest of minimum.

But without the income of the few power schools propping up the NCAA, that and the transgender issues especially (and I do think race may also enter into play here -- I could see a lot of schools wanting to go back to White-only teams, even though Bear Bryant was openly taught that's not a good idea on the field) will end a national sanctioning body at the university level..

I could see several regional bodies perking up, but I see no real middle ground between right and left states, as it were, on a number of issues that the NCAA would have to deal with -- and be in conflict with current US Federal law and mandate.

I could see the NAIA rising to more prominence as an attempt to have a national sanctioning body, but I don't see agreement in the gulf between left and right, nor the gulf between relevant and irrelevant (and that can be taken both in revenue generation and in competitive nature).

>The players won't even have to attend the schools.

This is one of the reasons I eventually believe the NFL will take over. The biggest problem with the NFL spring farm leagues (even through the AAFL, which was an open farm league for the NFL) has never been the NFL branding it. It's been the quality of play has never been sufficient to hold interest. The power schools do provide a great infrastructure for such a concept..

> However, there will always be a need for the NCAA in some capacity,

Even if I agreed before, I cannot now. This transgenderism issue is going to be the final straw.

I've long been of the opinion that you can have Title IX or the ADA, but you cannot have both. And, with what I see coming down the line (which see many of my political posts), I don't think you're going to have either!

We are under a year from seeing a major transgender college athlete murdered for being transgendered, either at their event or otherwise. And the fact is that an increasing amount of the country does not simply wish to outlaw MTF athletes, but to outlaw transgenderism as a concept -- and a foothold to get the other letters banned as well.

You cannot have a national sanctioning body in which half the schools openly break Federal law.

I would, however, state that the NCAA could survive in a Republican America, if but only if the college education system survives and the liberal states (such as mine) subjugated, but that's another discussion.

>in the same way that the NAIA and NJCAA exist; somebody has to be the "parent organization" for the rest of the schools/sports. Who would enforce the rules - the schools?

Many of these programs wouldn't -- and, IMODO, SHOULDN'T -- exist. The fact still remains that the NCAA has been a front for a lot of the travails of collegiate sport.

That entire Todd Hodne article you may have read from ESPN in the last 2 weeks? The NCAA did that.

The protection of Pedophile State -- the entire university, not just the football team? The NCAA, it's corporate sponsors, and it's broadcasting companies.

Rapelor, Michigan State, etc.? The NCAA did all of that, because it gave the backbone for all of that to occur.

The NCAA only survives in a men's only, no Title IX world.

>Guess what? The NCAA **is** "the schools" in this respect. Why is there a limit of 25 freshmen/juco transfers at any time on an FBS football team? Because a majority of the FBS schools want it that way.

Because the FBS schools, and especially the P5, want to remain that way.

Mike

Re: Leaving the sinking ship, or seeing the writing on the wall?

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Subject: Re: Leaving the sinking ship, or seeing the writing on the wall?
From: tim.vanw...@gmail.com (Tim VanWagoner)
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 by: Tim VanWagoner - Thu, 28 Apr 2022 12:49 UTC

On Wednesday, April 27, 2022 at 4:55:07 PM UTC-5, The NOTBCS Guy wrote:
> Mark Emmert is stepping down as NCAA President, effective at the end of June, 2023, unless a replacement is found for him before then.
>
> Why do I have the feeling that his idea of "there's a reason they're called student-athletes" not seeming to hold up very well, at least in Division I, with the Transfer Portal and NIL deals left and right (and not just for Power 5 football or "major" men's basketball, either) has something to do with this?

Or maybe it’s because he is 70 and just wants to retire.

Re: Leaving the sinking ship, or seeing the writing on the wall?

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Subject: Re: Leaving the sinking ship, or seeing the writing on the wall?
From: 1jay1mil...@gmail.com (Johnny RSFCootball)
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 by: Johnny RSFCootball - Thu, 28 Apr 2022 12:58 UTC

On Thursday, April 28, 2022 at 7:49:44 AM UTC-5, tim.vanwa...@gmail.com wrote:
> On Wednesday, April 27, 2022 at 4:55:07 PM UTC-5, The NOTBCS Guy wrote:
> > Mark Emmert is stepping down as NCAA President, effective at the end of June, 2023, unless a replacement is found for him before then.
> >
> > Why do I have the feeling that his idea of "there's a reason they're called student-athletes" not seeming to hold up very well, at least in Division I, with the Transfer Portal and NIL deals left and right (and not just for Power 5 football or "major" men's basketball, either) has something to do with this?
> Or maybe it’s because he is 70 and just wants to retire.

Or maybe a little of both. Some people at retirement age may just need some new thing to come along to make them finally say “Alright enough of this shit. Im going to play golf. See ya don’t wanna be ya.”

Re: Leaving the sinking ship, or seeing the writing on the wall?

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Subject: Re: Leaving the sinking ship, or seeing the writing on the wall?
From: gpg...@gmail.com (floaterjr)
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 by: floaterjr - Thu, 28 Apr 2022 13:01 UTC

On Thursday, April 28, 2022 at 8:49:44 AM UTC-4, tim.vanwa...@gmail.com wrote:
> On Wednesday, April 27, 2022 at 4:55:07 PM UTC-5, The NOTBCS Guy wrote:
> > Mark Emmert is stepping down as NCAA President, effective at the end of June, 2023, unless a replacement is found for him before then.
> >
> > Why do I have the feeling that his idea of "there's a reason they're called student-athletes" not seeming to hold up very well, at least in Division I, with the Transfer Portal and NIL deals left and right (and not just for Power 5 football or "major" men's basketball, either) has something to do with this?
> Or maybe it’s because he is 70 and just wants to retire.
POTD

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From: kol...@freedomnet.org (Ken Olson)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.football.college
Subject: Re: Leaving the sinking ship, or seeing the writing on the wall?
Date: Thu, 28 Apr 2022 09:02:57 -0400
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 by: Ken Olson - Thu, 28 Apr 2022 13:02 UTC

On 4/28/2022 8:58 AM, Johnny RSFCootball wrote:
> On Thursday, April 28, 2022 at 7:49:44 AM UTC-5, tim.vanwa...@gmail.com wrote:
>> On Wednesday, April 27, 2022 at 4:55:07 PM UTC-5, The NOTBCS Guy wrote:
>>> Mark Emmert is stepping down as NCAA President, effective at the end of June, 2023, unless a replacement is found for him before then.
>>>
>>> Why do I have the feeling that his idea of "there's a reason they're called student-athletes" not seeming to hold up very well, at least in Division I, with the Transfer Portal and NIL deals left and right (and not just for Power 5 football or "major" men's basketball, either) has something to do with this?
>> Or maybe it’s because he is 70 and just wants to retire.
>
> Or maybe a little of both. Some people at retirement age may just need some new thing to come along to make them finally say “Alright enough of this shit. Im going to play golf. See ya don’t wanna be ya.”

That was my attitude. The final straw for me was my cat dying. I don't
golf, so none of that.

--
ÄLSKAR - Fänga Dagen

Слава Україні та НАТО

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From: Roddy.Mc...@verizon.net (RoddyMcCorley)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.football.college
Subject: Re: Leaving the sinking ship, or seeing the writing on the wall?
Date: Thu, 28 Apr 2022 14:03:25 -0400
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 by: RoddyMcCorley - Thu, 28 Apr 2022 18:03 UTC

On 4/27/2022 5:55 PM, The NOTBCS Guy wrote:
> Mark Emmert is stepping down as NCAA President, effective at the end of June, 2023, unless a replacement is found for him before then.
>
> Why do I have the feeling that his idea of "there's a reason they're called student-athletes" not seeming to hold up very well, at least in Division I, with the Transfer Portal and NIL deals left and right (and not just for Power 5 football or "major" men's basketball, either) has something to do with this?

Just a thought: Shrinking and curbing the power/influence of the NCAA
allows chaos to ensue. Then there is an outcry for a for some collegiate
regulatory body to step in and bring order.

--
"In theory, there is no difference between theory and practice. In
practice, there is." Ruben Goldberg

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Subject: Re: Leaving the sinking ship, or seeing the writing on the wall?
From: darkstar...@gmail.com (Michael Falkner)
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 by: Michael Falkner - Thu, 28 Apr 2022 18:46 UTC

On Thursday, April 28, 2022 at 11:03:27 AM UTC-7, RoddyMcCorley wrote:

> Just a thought: Shrinking and curbing the power/influence of the NCAA
> allows chaos to ensue. Then there is an outcry for a for some collegiate
> regulatory body to step in and bring order.

The problem with that is you're not going to be able to have a national sanctioning body without enforcing the same rules in conservative states as you do in liberal ones.

For example, what happens if an MTF transgender who otherwise meets the sport's requirements attempts to compete in an NCAA championship where transgender (more correctly, MTF) athletics are illegal?

Mike

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From: kol...@freedomnet.org (Ken Olson)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.football.college
Subject: Re: Leaving the sinking ship, or seeing the writing on the wall?
Date: Thu, 28 Apr 2022 16:46:06 -0400
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 by: Ken Olson - Thu, 28 Apr 2022 20:46 UTC

On 4/28/2022 2:46 PM, Michael Falkner wrote:
> On Thursday, April 28, 2022 at 11:03:27 AM UTC-7, RoddyMcCorley wrote:
>
>> Just a thought: Shrinking and curbing the power/influence of the NCAA
>> allows chaos to ensue. Then there is an outcry for a for some collegiate
>> regulatory body to step in and bring order.
>
> The problem with that is you're not going to be able to have a national sanctioning body without enforcing the same rules in conservative states as you do in liberal ones.
>
> For example, what happens if an MTF transgender who otherwise meets the sport's requirements attempts to compete in an NCAA championship where transgender (more correctly, MTF) athletics are illegal?
>
> Mike

What about the females born that way that have to compete against
someone who's usually going to have benefited from going through male
puberty?

--
ÄLSKAR - Fänga Dagen

Слава Україні та НАТО

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 by: Michael Falkner - Thu, 28 Apr 2022 22:05 UTC

On Thursday, April 28, 2022 at 1:46:10 PM UTC-7, Ken Olson wrote:

> What about the females born that way that have to compete against
> someone who's usually going to have benefited from going through male
> puberty?

#1, except by guys wanting to hit on/grope/rape/sex them, not really that many people apparently care about those women anyway in sports.

#2, if we are going to allow the concept of gender not to be enforced by the government, then this must be allowed through both Title IX and the ADA.

If God created those with both sets of genitalia, he created transgenders too.

The only other option is to outlaw the practice and expose this country as as bigoted as you are, but I guess that comes with the territory of being a CO, doesn't it?

Mike

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Newsgroups: rec.sport.football.college
Subject: Re: Leaving the sinking ship, or seeing the writing on the wall?
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 by: Ken Olson - Thu, 28 Apr 2022 22:12 UTC

On 4/28/2022 6:05 PM, Michael Falkner wrote:
> On Thursday, April 28, 2022 at 1:46:10 PM UTC-7, Ken Olson wrote:
>
>> What about the females born that way that have to compete against
>> someone who's usually going to have benefited from going through male
>> puberty?
>
> #1, except by guys wanting to hit on/grope/rape/sex them, not really that many people apparently care about those women anyway in sports.
>
> #2, if we are going to allow the concept of gender not to be enforced by the government, then this must be allowed through both Title IX and the ADA.
>
> If God created those with both sets of genitalia, he created transgenders too.
>
> The only other option is to outlaw the practice and expose this country as as bigoted as you are, but I guess that comes with the territory of being a CO, doesn't it?
>
> Mike

For me, being a CO was like being water.

--
ÄLSKAR - Fänga Dagen

Слава Україні та НАТО

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 by: Michael Falkner - Thu, 28 Apr 2022 22:16 UTC

On Thursday, April 28, 2022 at 3:12:19 PM UTC-7, Ken Olson wrote:

> For me, being a CO was like being water.

Yeah, you did more damage than you ever realized.

Mike (as water does -- you don't realize how much damage water does until you really have to deal with it!)

Re: Leaving the sinking ship, or seeing the writing on the wall?

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From: kol...@freedomnet.org (Ken Olson)
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 by: Ken Olson - Thu, 28 Apr 2022 22:28 UTC

On 4/28/2022 6:16 PM, Michael Falkner wrote:
> On Thursday, April 28, 2022 at 3:12:19 PM UTC-7, Ken Olson wrote:
>
>> For me, being a CO was like being water.
>
> Yeah, you did more damage than you ever realized.
>
> Mike (as water does -- you don't realize how much damage water does until you really have to deal with it!)

If you asked those who I dealt with most would say I was reasonable
about how I did my duties.

--
ÄLSKAR - Fänga Dagen

Слава Україні та НАТО

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Newsgroups: rec.sport.football.college
Date: Thu, 28 Apr 2022 16:04:05 -0700 (PDT)
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Subject: Re: Leaving the sinking ship, or seeing the writing on the wall?
From: darkstar...@gmail.com (Michael Falkner)
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 by: Michael Falkner - Thu, 28 Apr 2022 23:04 UTC

On Thursday, April 28, 2022 at 3:28:54 PM UTC-7, Ken Olson wrote:

> If you asked those who I dealt with most would say I was reasonable
> about how I did my duties.

Uhhh, most prisoners would say otherwise -- so I'm not sure if you want me to ask them or the ones who you work _with_.

Turning your back and letting people get fucked up and further dehumanized was part of the job, I'd say a major part of one from what I saw.

Mike

Re: Leaving the sinking ship, or seeing the writing on the wall?

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https://www.novabbs.com/sport/article-flat.php?id=62068&group=rec.sport.football.college#62068

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From: kol...@freedomnet.org (Ken Olson)
Newsgroups: rec.sport.football.college
Subject: Re: Leaving the sinking ship, or seeing the writing on the wall?
Date: Thu, 28 Apr 2022 20:15:46 -0400
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 by: Ken Olson - Fri, 29 Apr 2022 00:15 UTC

On 4/28/2022 7:04 PM, Michael Falkner wrote:
> On Thursday, April 28, 2022 at 3:28:54 PM UTC-7, Ken Olson wrote:
>
>> If you asked those who I dealt with most would say I was reasonable
>> about how I did my duties.
>
> Uhhh, most prisoners would say otherwise -- so I'm not sure if you want me to ask them or the ones who you work _with_.
>
> Turning your back and letting people get fucked up and further dehumanized was part of the job, I'd say a major part of one from what I saw.
>
> Mike

I got in more than one throw down where we were trying to keep prisoners
from hurting each other.

--
ÄLSKAR - Fänga Dagen

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