Years of marital bliss.

Ken
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On Wednesday, September 13, 2023 at 9:29:23 AM UTC-5, Ken Olson wrote:
> Years of marital bliss.

No such thing.

On 9/13/2023 11:16 AM, unclejr wrote:
> On Wednesday, September 13, 2023 at 9:29:23 AM UTC-5, Ken Olson wrote:
>> Years of marital bliss.
>
> No such thing.

Hills and valleys, but all in all it's been good.
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Ken Olson <kolson@freedomnet.org> wrote:
> Years of marital bliss.
>
> Ken

Congrats.

Before I saw it was you I was like “no way anyone that young is still
poasting here”

--
“I usually skip over your posts because of your disguistng, contrarian,
liberal personality.” — Altie

On 9/13/2023 11:43 AM, xyzzy wrote:
> Ken Olson <kolson@freedomnet.org> wrote:
>> Years of marital bliss.
>>
>> Ken
>
> Congrats.
>
> Before I saw it was you I was like “no way anyone that young is still
> poasting here”
>

I'm about 11 months away from Medicare.

Thank you.

Ken
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On Wednesday, September 13, 2023 at 11:37:48 AM UTC-5, Ken Olson wrote:
> On 9/13/2023 11:43 AM, xyzzy wrote:
> > Ken Olson <kol...@freedomnet.org> wrote:
> >> Years of marital bliss.
> >>
> >> Ken
> >
> > Congrats.
> >
> > Before I saw it was you I was like “no way anyone that young is still
> > poasting here”
> >
> I'm about 11 months away from Medicare.
>
> Thank you.
> Ken

A social program created by Democrats.

On 9/13/2023 9:16 PM, unclejr wrote:
> On Wednesday, September 13, 2023 at 11:37:48 AM UTC-5, Ken Olson wrote:
>> On 9/13/2023 11:43 AM, xyzzy wrote:
>>> Ken Olson <kol...@freedomnet.org> wrote:
>>>> Years of marital bliss.
>>>>
>>>> Ken
>>>
>>> Congrats.
>>>
>>> Before I saw it was you I was like “no way anyone that young is still
>>> poasting here”
>>>
>> I'm about 11 months away from Medicare.
>>
>> Thank you.
>> Ken
>
> A social program created by Democrats.

That I have no choice in. Power to the government.

Ken
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On 2023-09-14, Ken Olson <kolson@freedomnet.org> wrote:
> On 9/13/2023 9:16 PM, unclejr wrote:
>> On Wednesday, September 13, 2023 at 11:37:48 AM UTC-5, Ken Olson wrote:
>>> On 9/13/2023 11:43 AM, xyzzy wrote:
>>>> Ken Olson <kol...@freedomnet.org> wrote:
>>>>> Years of marital bliss.
>>>>>
>>>>> Ken
>>>>
>>>> Congrats.
>>>>
>>>> Before I saw it was you I was like “no way anyone that young is still
>>>> poasting here”
>>>>
>>> I'm about 11 months away from Medicare.
>>>
>>> Thank you.
>>> Ken
>>
>> A social program created by Democrats.
>
> That I have no choice in. Power to the government.

And without which we probably would have had to really deal with
the health care problem. The good news is that we have the ability
to do so when and if we get pushed to the wall, and that we still
have the highest quality health care in the world albeit at a rather
stiff price.

--
Fast, reliable, cheap. Pick two and we'll talk.
-- unknown

On 9/13/2023 10:29 AM, Ken Olson wrote:
> Years of marital bliss.
>
> Ken
Good for you. I just reached 47.

--
"In theory, there is no difference between theory and practice. In
practice, there is." Ruben Goldberg

On 9/13/2023 9:28 PM, Ken Olson wrote:
> On 9/13/2023 9:16 PM, unclejr wrote:
>> On Wednesday, September 13, 2023 at 11:37:48 AM UTC-5, Ken Olson wrote:
>>> On 9/13/2023 11:43 AM, xyzzy wrote:
>>>> Ken Olson <kol...@freedomnet.org> wrote:
>>>>> Years of marital bliss.
>>>>>
>>>>> Ken
>>>>
>>>> Congrats.
>>>>
>>>> Before I saw it was you I was like “no way anyone that young is still
>>>> poasting here”
>>>>
>>> I'm about 11 months away from Medicare.
>>>
>>> Thank you.
>>> Ken
>>
>> A social program created by Democrats.
>
> That I have no choice in.  Power to the government.
>
> Ken

You do have a choice. Move out of the country. Medicare does not cover
you overseas. So if you travel you should get travel medical insurance.

--
"In theory, there is no difference between theory and practice. In
practice, there is." Ruben Goldberg

On 9/16/2023 1:18 AM, RoddyMcCorley wrote:
> On 9/13/2023 9:28 PM, Ken Olson wrote:
>> On 9/13/2023 9:16 PM, unclejr wrote:
>>> On Wednesday, September 13, 2023 at 11:37:48 AM UTC-5, Ken Olson wrote:
>>>> On 9/13/2023 11:43 AM, xyzzy wrote:
>>>>> Ken Olson <kol...@freedomnet.org> wrote:
>>>>>> Years of marital bliss.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Ken
>>>>>
>>>>> Congrats.
>>>>>
>>>>> Before I saw it was you I was like “no way anyone that young is still
>>>>> poasting here”
>>>>>
>>>> I'm about 11 months away from Medicare.
>>>>
>>>> Thank you.
>>>> Ken
>>>
>>> A social program created by Democrats.
>>
>> That I have no choice in.  Power to the government.
>>
>> Ken
>
> You do have a choice. Move out of the country. Medicare does not cover
> you overseas. So if you travel you should get travel medical insurance.
>

I have no desire to leave the country at this point.
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On 2023-09-17, Ken Olson <kolson@freedomnet.org> wrote:
> On 9/16/2023 1:18 AM, RoddyMcCorley wrote:
>> On 9/13/2023 9:28 PM, Ken Olson wrote:
>>> On 9/13/2023 9:16 PM, unclejr wrote:
>>>> On Wednesday, September 13, 2023 at 11:37:48 AM UTC-5, Ken Olson wrote:
>>>>> On 9/13/2023 11:43 AM, xyzzy wrote:
>>>>>> Ken Olson <kol...@freedomnet.org> wrote:
>>>>>>> Years of marital bliss.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Ken
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Congrats.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Before I saw it was you I was like “no way anyone that young is still
>>>>>> poasting here”
>>>>>>
>>>>> I'm about 11 months away from Medicare.
>>>>>
>>>>> Thank you.
>>>>> Ken
>>>>
>>>> A social program created by Democrats.
>>>
>>> That I have no choice in.  Power to the government.
>>>
>>> Ken
>>
>> You do have a choice. Move out of the country. Medicare does not cover
>> you overseas. So if you travel you should get travel medical insurance.
>>
>
> I have no desire to leave the country at this point.

And the choice was whether to pay for it or not. You've already paid for it,
of course. And it is a deeply progressive option; Medicare is great if you
didn't make much money, whether or not it was due to circumstance or sloth.
If you paid into the system, it isn't nearly so great and you might
have been better off without it.

--
There is something fascinating about science. One gets such wholesale
returns of conjecture out of such a trifling investment of fact.
-- Mark Twain

Con Reeder, unhyphenated American <constance@duxmail.com> wrote:
> On 2023-09-17, Ken Olson <kolson@freedomnet.org> wrote:
>> On 9/16/2023 1:18 AM, RoddyMcCorley wrote:
>>> On 9/13/2023 9:28 PM, Ken Olson wrote:
>>>> On 9/13/2023 9:16 PM, unclejr wrote:
>>>>> On Wednesday, September 13, 2023 at 11:37:48 AM UTC-5, Ken Olson wrote:
>>>>>> On 9/13/2023 11:43 AM, xyzzy wrote:
>>>>>>> Ken Olson <kol...@freedomnet.org> wrote:
>>>>>>>> Years of marital bliss.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Ken
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Congrats.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Before I saw it was you I was like “no way anyone that young is still
>>>>>>> poasting here”
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> I'm about 11 months away from Medicare.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Thank you.
>>>>>> Ken
>>>>>
>>>>> A social program created by Democrats.
>>>>
>>>> That I have no choice in.  Power to the government.
>>>>
>>>> Ken
>>>
>>> You do have a choice. Move out of the country. Medicare does not cover
>>> you overseas. So if you travel you should get travel medical insurance.
>>>
>>
>> I have no desire to leave the country at this point.
>
> And the choice was whether to pay for it or not. You've already paid for it,
> of course. And it is a deeply progressive option; Medicare is great if you
> didn't make much money, whether or not it was due to circumstance or sloth.
> If you paid into the system, it isn't nearly so great and you might
> have been better off without it.

Actuarially, everyone comes out ahead with social security and Medicare.
That’s why the programs have such large structural deficits. For example:

https://www.politifact.com/article/2013/feb/01/medicare-and-social-security-what-you-paid-what-yo/

Scrolling about halfway down the page gets you to the bar graphs that show
it pretty plainly.

--
“I usually skip over your posts because of your disguistng, contrarian,
liberal personality.” — Altie

On 2023-09-17, xyzzy <xyzzy.dude@gmail.com> wrote:
> Con Reeder, unhyphenated American <constance@duxmail.com> wrote:
>> On 2023-09-17, Ken Olson <kolson@freedomnet.org> wrote:
>>> On 9/16/2023 1:18 AM, RoddyMcCorley wrote:
>>>> On 9/13/2023 9:28 PM, Ken Olson wrote:
>>>>> On 9/13/2023 9:16 PM, unclejr wrote:
>>>>>> On Wednesday, September 13, 2023 at 11:37:48 AM UTC-5, Ken Olson wrote:
>>>>>>> On 9/13/2023 11:43 AM, xyzzy wrote:
>>>>>>>> Ken Olson <kol...@freedomnet.org> wrote:
>>>>>>>>> Years of marital bliss.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Ken
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Congrats.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Before I saw it was you I was like “no way anyone that young is still
>>>>>>>> poasting here”
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I'm about 11 months away from Medicare.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Thank you.
>>>>>>> Ken
>>>>>>
>>>>>> A social program created by Democrats.
>>>>>
>>>>> That I have no choice in.  Power to the government.
>>>>>
>>>>> Ken
>>>>
>>>> You do have a choice. Move out of the country. Medicare does not cover
>>>> you overseas. So if you travel you should get travel medical insurance.
>>>>
>>>
>>> I have no desire to leave the country at this point.
>>
>> And the choice was whether to pay for it or not. You've already paid for it,
>> of course. And it is a deeply progressive option; Medicare is great if you
>> didn't make much money, whether or not it was due to circumstance or sloth.
>> If you paid into the system, it isn't nearly so great and you might
>> have been better off without it.
>
> Actuarially, everyone comes out ahead with social security and Medicare.

Medicare probably true. Social Security, not so at all. If you
contribute anywhere near the maximum and count the employer match, you
do much better simply by saving the money and investing in index
funds. The higher earners subsidize the lower earners. (I don't
begrudge the money, it's part of the deal.) The present value of my
Social Security is well under a million, and I would easily have saved
and reaped much more based on my contributions. The benefits are
heavily loaded to benefit lower earners.

You do realize that the SSA has not run their operation like a real
pension fund, right? They have not been at all accountable; they comingle
funds all over the place.

> That’s why the programs have such large structural deficits. For example:
>
> https://www.politifact.com/article/2013/feb/01/medicare-and-social-security-what-you-paid-what-yo/
>
> Scrolling about halfway down the page gets you to the bar graphs that show
> it pretty plainly.

No. Like almost all Politifact stuff, it's BS, because they have a
large partisan lean. They manipulate their "facts" to achieve their
desired result, and do it in a more egregious way than any
organization out there.

It cites "paid in" and "average earner". It doesn't take into
account realistic investment returns. Two percent is not what
pension funds plan for. It also doesn't look at actuarial issues or
what happens to the residue if you die before you get benefits.

Assuming you are reasonably well-paid, from the median salary on up,
If you are a baby boomer and save the equivalent of what you pay in
social security and invest it, you end up with more money than you get
from Social Security. Period.

--
Nature, to be commanded, must be obeyed. -- Francis Bacon

Con Reeder, unhyphenated American <constance@duxmail.com> wrote:
> On 2023-09-17, xyzzy <xyzzy.dude@gmail.com> wrote:
>> Con Reeder, unhyphenated American <constance@duxmail.com> wrote:
>>> On 2023-09-17, Ken Olson <kolson@freedomnet.org> wrote:
>>>> On 9/16/2023 1:18 AM, RoddyMcCorley wrote:
>>>>> On 9/13/2023 9:28 PM, Ken Olson wrote:
>>>>>> On 9/13/2023 9:16 PM, unclejr wrote:
>>>>>>> On Wednesday, September 13, 2023 at 11:37:48 AM UTC-5, Ken Olson wrote:
>>>>>>>> On 9/13/2023 11:43 AM, xyzzy wrote:
>>>>>>>>> Ken Olson <kol...@freedomnet.org> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> Years of marital bliss.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Ken
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Congrats.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Before I saw it was you I was like “no way anyone that young is still
>>>>>>>>> poasting here”
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I'm about 11 months away from Medicare.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Thank you.
>>>>>>>> Ken
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> A social program created by Democrats.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> That I have no choice in.  Power to the government.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Ken
>>>>>
>>>>> You do have a choice. Move out of the country. Medicare does not cover
>>>>> you overseas. So if you travel you should get travel medical insurance.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> I have no desire to leave the country at this point.
>>>
>>> And the choice was whether to pay for it or not. You've already paid for it,
>>> of course. And it is a deeply progressive option; Medicare is great if you
>>> didn't make much money, whether or not it was due to circumstance or sloth.
>>> If you paid into the system, it isn't nearly so great and you might
>>> have been better off without it.
>>
>> Actuarially, everyone comes out ahead with social security and Medicare.
>
> Medicare probably true.

Since Medicare was the subject of this thread you could have stopped there.

Social Security, not so at all. If you
> contribute anywhere near the maximum and count the employer match, you
> do much better simply by saving the money and investing in index
> funds. The higher earners subsidize the lower earners. (I don't
> begrudge the money, it's part of the deal.) The present value of my
> Social Security is well under a million, and I would easily have saved
> and reaped much more based on my contributions. The benefits are
> heavily loaded to benefit lower earners.
>
> You do realize that the SSA has not run their operation like a real
> pension fund, right? They have not been at all accountable; they comingle
> funds all over the place.
>
>> That’s why the programs have such large structural deficits. For example:
>>
>> https://www.politifact.com/article/2013/feb/01/medicare-and-social-security-what-you-paid-what-yo/
>>
>> Scrolling about halfway down the page gets you to the bar graphs that show
>> it pretty plainly.
>
> No. Like almost all Politifact stuff, it's BS, because they have a
> large partisan lean. They manipulate their "facts" to achieve their
> desired result, and do it in a more egregious way than any
> organization out there.
>
> It cites "paid in" and "average earner". It doesn't take into
> account realistic investment returns. Two percent is not what
> pension funds plan for.

You’re right and neither did this article. It was inflation plus 2%.

It also doesn't look at actuarial issues or
> what happens to the residue if you die before you get benefits.
>
> Assuming you are reasonably well-paid, from the median salary on up,
> If you are a baby boomer and save the equivalent of what you pay in
> social security and invest it, you end up with more money than you get
> from Social Security. Period.
>

Except for your inaccuracy about the assumed percentage return and the idea
that you know you would do better investing it yourself is a hypothetical
counter factual, I don’t disagree with any of what you are saying about
social security. It’s an insurance program against old age poverty.

--
“I usually skip over your posts because of your disguistng, contrarian,
liberal personality.” — Altie

On 2023-09-18, xyzzy <xyzzy.dude@gmail.com> wrote:
> Con Reeder, unhyphenated American <constance@duxmail.com> wrote:
>> On 2023-09-17, xyzzy <xyzzy.dude@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> Con Reeder, unhyphenated American <constance@duxmail.com> wrote:
>>>> On 2023-09-17, Ken Olson <kolson@freedomnet.org> wrote:
>>>>> On 9/16/2023 1:18 AM, RoddyMcCorley wrote:
>>>>>> On 9/13/2023 9:28 PM, Ken Olson wrote:
>>>>>>> On 9/13/2023 9:16 PM, unclejr wrote:
>>>>>>>> On Wednesday, September 13, 2023 at 11:37:48 AM UTC-5, Ken Olson wrote:
>>>>>>>>> On 9/13/2023 11:43 AM, xyzzy wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> Ken Olson <kol...@freedomnet.org> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>> Years of marital bliss.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Ken
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Congrats.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Before I saw it was you I was like “no way anyone that young is still
>>>>>>>>>> poasting here”
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> I'm about 11 months away from Medicare.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Thank you.
>>>>>>>>> Ken
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> A social program created by Democrats.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> That I have no choice in.  Power to the government.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Ken
>>>>>>
>>>>>> You do have a choice. Move out of the country. Medicare does not cover
>>>>>> you overseas. So if you travel you should get travel medical insurance.
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> I have no desire to leave the country at this point.
>>>>
>>>> And the choice was whether to pay for it or not. You've already paid for it,
>>>> of course. And it is a deeply progressive option; Medicare is great if you
>>>> didn't make much money, whether or not it was due to circumstance or sloth.
>>>> If you paid into the system, it isn't nearly so great and you might
>>>> have been better off without it.
>>>
>>> Actuarially, everyone comes out ahead with social security and Medicare.
>>
>> Medicare probably true.
>
> Since Medicare was the subject of this thread you could have stopped there.

Well, it's true in one sense -- that the supposed contributions don't pay
for the benefits. But since tax money pays for it, of course higher earners
could easily do better if they didn't have to pay those taxes. But again,
I don't really begrudge the money. It's part of the social contract.

I've paid far more than my share, but I have reaped a wonderful life.
It all comes out in the wash. I do wish the whole operation was better
run without all the billions and billions in fraud. Which is why
railing against insurance company profits is such a strange exercise
-- those profits are no doubt less than the amount of Medicare fraud.

There are undoubtedly some aspects of the European health care model
one could wish for. As a country, we pay for the dynamism of our
economy with our the chaos of wild-west market. But that dynamism
fuels the world economy in so many ways the European model does not.

>
>
> Social Security, not so at all. If you
>> contribute anywhere near the maximum and count the employer match, you
>> do much better simply by saving the money and investing in index
>> funds. The higher earners subsidize the lower earners. (I don't
>> begrudge the money, it's part of the deal.) The present value of my
>> Social Security is well under a million, and I would easily have saved
>> and reaped much more based on my contributions. The benefits are
>> heavily loaded to benefit lower earners.
>>
>> You do realize that the SSA has not run their operation like a real
>> pension fund, right? They have not been at all accountable; they comingle
>> funds all over the place.
>>
>>> That’s why the programs have such large structural deficits. For example:
>>>
>>> https://www.politifact.com/article/2013/feb/01/medicare-and-social-security-what-you-paid-what-yo/
>>>
>>> Scrolling about halfway down the page gets you to the bar graphs that show
>>> it pretty plainly.
>>
>> No. Like almost all Politifact stuff, it's BS, because they have a
>> large partisan lean. They manipulate their "facts" to achieve their
>> desired result, and do it in a more egregious way than any
>> organization out there.
>>
>> It cites "paid in" and "average earner". It doesn't take into
>> account realistic investment returns. Two percent is not what
>> pension funds plan for.
>
> You’re right and neither did this article. It was inflation plus 2%.
>
> It also doesn't look at actuarial issues or
>> what happens to the residue if you die before you get benefits.
>>
>> Assuming you are reasonably well-paid, from the median salary on up,
>> If you are a baby boomer and save the equivalent of what you pay in
>> social security and invest it, you end up with more money than you get
>> from Social Security. Period.
>>
>
> Except for your inaccuracy about the assumed percentage return and the idea
> that you know you would do better investing it yourself is a hypothetical
> counter factual, I don’t disagree with any of what you are saying about
> social security. It’s an insurance program against old age poverty.

My inaccuracy? In what way? Certainly not in any such massive amount
as ignoring the employer portion of contributions, which the Politifact
screed does.

--
There's nothing sweeter than life nor more precious than time.
-- Barney