Which means thousands of streaming radio gear are now paperweights. Unless someone else steps in. First time I've seen hardware actually killed by
a cloud service.

https://techguylabs.com/episodes/1774/reciva-gone-will-my-wifi-radio-stop-working

https://www.radioworld.com/news-and-business/headlines/reciva-internet-radio-platform-shutting-down

In article <505692ee-f0a6-406e-9b6f-5021e00610dfn@googlegroups.com>,
RichA <rander3128@gmail.com> wrote:

> Which means thousands of streaming radio gear are now paperweights. Unless
> someone else steps in.

too few people used it to be profitable. very simple.

people stream audio on their phone or computer, not an 'internet
radio', which was a stupid idea from the start.

> First time I've seen hardware actually killed by
> a cloud service.

it's not the first nor will it be the last.

On Wednesday, 15 September 2021 at 12:06:27 UTC-4, nospam wrote:
> In article <505692ee-f0a6-406e...@googlegroups.com>,
> RichA <rande...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > Which means thousands of streaming radio gear are now paperweights. Unless
> > someone else steps in.
> too few people used it to be profitable. very simple.
>
> people stream audio on their phone or computer, not an 'internet
> radio', which was a stupid idea from the start.
> > First time I've seen hardware actually killed by
> > a cloud service.
> it's not the first nor will it be the last.

One of the radio makers, Grace, offered "discounts" on a new radio tied to a new service as compensation for the fact their (and other) radios are now bricks.
More than Qualcomm did.

On Thu, 16 Sep 2021 07:23:34 -0700 (PDT), RichA posted:-

> On Wednesday, 15 September 2021 at 12:06:27 UTC-4, nospam wrote:
> > In article <505692ee-f0a6-406e...@googlegroups.com>,
> > RichA <rande...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> > > Which means thousands of streaming radio gear are now
> > > paperweights. Unless someone else steps in.
> > too few people used it to be profitable. very simple.
> >
> > people stream audio on their phone or computer, not an 'internet
> > radio', which was a stupid idea from the start.
> > > First time I've seen hardware actually killed by
> > > a cloud service.
> > it's not the first nor will it be the last.
>
> One of the radio makers, Grace, offered "discounts" on a new radio
> tied to a new service as compensation for the fact their (and other)
> radios are now bricks. More than Qualcomm did.

So no internet radio at all?

In article <iqho4cFb1bcU3@mid.individual.net>, Mountain Magpie
<Leura@blue.mountains.org> wrote:

>
> So no internet radio at all?

that's what phones, computers and smart speakers are for.

On Thu, 16 Sep 2021 16:39:15 -0400, nospam posted:-

> In article <iqho4cFb1bcU3@mid.individual.net>, Mountain Magpie
> <Leura@blue.mountains.org> wrote:
>
> >
> > So no internet radio at all?
>
> that's what phones, computers and smart speakers are for.

Have some old radio gear with Internet Radio (must admit I haven't tried
it for a while), FM, and DAB+

In article <iqhpl9Fb8neU2@mid.individual.net>, Mountain Magpie
<Leura@blue.mountains.org> wrote:

> > > So no internet radio at all?
> >
> > that's what phones, computers and smart speakers are for.
>
> Have some old radio gear with Internet Radio (must admit I haven't tried
> it for a while), FM, and DAB+

an internet radio is one of the dumbest ideas. it's not at all
surprising to see it fail.

terrestrial radio is also doomed although that will be a slow decline.

a smartphone, computer or smart speaker can stream radio stations from
anywhere in the world, not just nearby, along with spotify and similar
services, podcasts and much more.

On Thu, 16 Sep 2021 17:08:06 -0400, nospam posted:-

> a smartphone, computer or smart speaker can stream radio stations from
> anywhere in the world, not just nearby, along with spotify and similar
> services, podcasts and much more.

Provided you have an Internet connection of course?

On 17/09/2021 2:23 am, RichA wrote:
> On Wednesday, 15 September 2021 at 12:06:27 UTC-4, nospam wrote:
>> In article <505692ee-f0a6-406e...@googlegroups.com>,
>> RichA <rande...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Which means thousands of streaming radio gear are now paperweights. Unless
>>> someone else steps in.
>> too few people used it to be profitable. very simple.
>>
>> people stream audio on their phone or computer, not an 'internet
>> radio', which was a stupid idea from the start.
>>> First time I've seen hardware actually killed by
>>> a cloud service.
>> it's not the first nor will it be the last.
>
> One of the radio makers, Grace, offered "discounts" on a new radio tied to a new service as compensation for the fact their (and other) radios are now bricks.
> More than Qualcomm did.
>

How long until free, or next to free, cloud storage is discovered to be
a loss-maker ?

geoff

On 16 Sep 2021 at 22:08:06 BST, "nospam" <nospam@nospam.invalid> wrote:

> In article <iqhpl9Fb8neU2@mid.individual.net>, Mountain Magpie
> <Leura@blue.mountains.org> wrote:
>
>>>> So no internet radio at all?
>>>
>>> that's what phones, computers and smart speakers are for.
>>
>> Have some old radio gear with Internet Radio (must admit I haven't tried
>> it for a while), FM, and DAB+
>
> an internet radio is one of the dumbest ideas. it's not at all
> surprising to see it fail.
>

The OP's post referred to one of those subscription services - not 'internet
radio' IIUC.

My Roberts 83i radio has Love - an internet based subscription service that
was pretty rubbish and folded soon after I bought the radio. I did write to
Robertsand ask if they could reallocate the button through firmware but they
weren't interested. The radio still functions as a DAB/bluetooth/music
server/interent radio though - so it's not exactly a paperweight. The
dedicated Love button looks pretty stupid.

I think internet radio's a good idea, but hardly likely to be mainstream. I
very occasionally use it to access my local radio station when I'm away - it's
only internet or FM (Sheffield Live).

> terrestrial radio is also doomed although that will be a slow decline.
>

A prediction long in the tooth. FM could easily last 20 years - DAB much
longer.

> a smartphone, computer or smart speaker can stream radio stations from
> anywhere in the world, not just nearby, along with spotify and similar
> services, podcasts and much more.

I'd imagine it costs very ittle to bolt internet radio onto a tabletop DAB etc
radio. My radio was the last to offer proprietary radio service - and just as
well, good riddance. But the latest model does still have internet radio.
--
Cheers, Rob

In article <iqhqivFbe3bU2@mid.individual.net>, Mountain Magpie
<Leura@blue.mountains.org> wrote:

>
> > a smartphone, computer or smart speaker can stream radio stations from
> > anywhere in the world, not just nearby, along with spotify and similar
> > services, podcasts and much more.
>
> Provided you have an Internet connection of course?

yep, just as terrestrial radio needs a nearby transmitter.

keep in mind that there is internet in places where radio can't be
received, such as inside steel/concrete buildings, tunnels, desolate
highways through the middle of nowhere, etc.

In article <AqCdnU3FwoV_I978nZ2dnUU7-b2dnZ2d@giganews.com>, geoff
<geoff@nospamgeoffwood.org> wrote:

>
> How long until free, or next to free, cloud storage is discovered to be
> a loss-maker ?

welcome to at least 20 years ago.

In article <si0evv$4ar$1@gioia.aioe.org>, RJH <patchmoney@gmx.com>
wrote:

> I think internet radio's a good idea, but hardly likely to be mainstream. I
> very occasionally use it to access my local radio station when I'm away - it's
> only internet or FM (Sheffield Live).

don't confuse internet radio the service, aka streaming, with a box
called an internet radio that connects to such services.

internet streaming is a great idea and is part of what's fueling the
demise of legacy terrestrial radio.

a box called an internet 'radio', which connects to such services, is a
bad idea because it will soon become a doorstop unless there is a way
to update its station list *and* the audio protocols used as they
change, and usually there is not.

devices that do offer that ability are computers, phones and smart
speakers.

>
> > terrestrial radio is also doomed although that will be a slow decline.
> >
>
> A prediction long in the tooth. FM could easily last 20 years - DAB much
> longer.

that's why i said slow decline.

it's also already happening.

<https://variety.com/2017/music/news/traditional-radio-faces-a-grim-futu
re-new-study-says-1202542681/>
€ Generation Z, which is projected to account for 40% of all
consumers in the U.S. by 2020, shows little interest in traditional
media, including radio, having grown up in an on-demand digital
environment;

€ AM/FM radio is in the midst of a massive drop-off as a
music-discovery tool by younger generations, with self-reported
listening to AM/FM radio among teens aged 13 and up declining by
almost 50 percentage points between 2005 and 2016. Music discovery
as a whole is moving away from AM/FM radio and toward YouTube,
Spotify and Pandora, especially among younger listeners, with 19% of
a 2017 study of surveyed listeners citing it as a source for keeping
up-to-date with music ‹ down from 28% the previous year. Among
12-24 year olds who find music discovery important, AM/FM radio
(50%) becomes even less influential, trailing YouTube (80%), Spotify
(59%), and Pandora (53%).

€ By 2020, 75% of new cars are expected to be ³connected² to
digital services, breaking radio¹s monopoly on the car dashboard
and relegating AM/FM to just one of a series of audio options behind
the wheel. According to the U.S. Department of Transportation, the
typical car in the U.S. was 11.6 years old in 2016, which explains
why radio has not yet faced its disruption event. However, drivers
are buying new cars at a faster rate than ever, and new vehicles
come with more installed options for digital music services.
....
...radio risks becoming a thing of the past, like the wax cylinder or
78 RPM record ­ fondly remembered but no longer relevant to an
audience that has moved on.²

On Thu, 16 Sep 2021 18:34:34 -0400, nospam posted:-

> In article <iqhqivFbe3bU2@mid.individual.net>, Mountain Magpie
> <Leura@blue.mountains.org> wrote:
>
> >
> > > a smartphone, computer or smart speaker can stream radio stations
> > > from anywhere in the world, not just nearby, along with spotify
> > > and similar services, podcasts and much more.
> >
> > Provided you have an Internet connection of course?
>
> yep, just as terrestrial radio needs a nearby transmitter.
>
> keep in mind that there is internet in places where radio can't be
> received, such as inside steel/concrete buildings, tunnels, desolate
> highways through the middle of nowhere, etc.

Bit OT, but some of the shithole places I have had to go to don't even
have decent internet in the hotels. Some shove it through their own
network. Goes to say need to be careful there.

And in North Korea, when I was there, no Internet for foreigners at all.

In article <iqi0m3FcfemU3@mid.individual.net>, Mountain Magpie
<Leura@blue.mountains.org> wrote:

>
> Bit OT, but some of the shithole places I have had to go to don't even
> have decent internet in the hotels. Some shove it through their own
> network. Goes to say need to be careful there.

hotel wifi almost always sucks. cellular is often much better, or a
coffeeshop around the corner.

> And in North Korea, when I was there, no Internet for foreigners at all.

how do they know a device is being used by a foreigner?

On Thu, 16 Sep 2021 19:11:18 -0400, nospam posted:-

> > And in North Korea, when I was there, no Internet for foreigners at
> > all.
>
> how do they know a device is being used by a foreigner?

Their internet is locked down, I suppose if your device is not an
approved list, you can't get on.

In article <iqifubFf397U5@mid.individual.net>, Mountain Magpie
<Leura@blue.mountains.org> wrote:

> > > And in North Korea, when I was there, no Internet for foreigners at
> > > all.
> >
> > how do they know a device is being used by a foreigner?
>
> Their internet is locked down, I suppose if your device is not an
> approved list, you can't get on.

what denotes an approved device? if they go by mac address, that's very
easy to bypass.

On 17/09/2021 10:34 am, nospam wrote:
> In article <iqhqivFbe3bU2@mid.individual.net>, Mountain Magpie
> <Leura@blue.mountains.org> wrote:
>
>>
>>> a smartphone, computer or smart speaker can stream radio stations from
>>> anywhere in the world, not just nearby, along with spotify and similar
>>> services, podcasts and much more.
>>
>> Provided you have an Internet connection of course?
>
> yep, just as terrestrial radio needs a nearby transmitter.
>
> keep in mind that there is internet in places where radio can't be
> received, such as inside steel/concrete buildings, tunnels, desolate
> highways through the middle of nowhere, etc.
>

Yeah, internet doesn't need a nearby transmitter ....

geoff

On Thu, 16 Sep 2021 23:27:04 -0400, nospam posted:-

> > Their internet is locked down, I suppose if your device is not an
> > approved list, you can't get on.
>
> what denotes an approved device? if they go by mac address, that's
> very easy to bypass.

No idea, sorry, but when I was there, and the guys I was with, could
never get a connection. And anything with GPS has to be declared at
the airport, and may be taken from you, to be returned when you leave.

And all photos in your camera are accessed on departure.

https://is.gd/pVDzGC

Was interesting to see the elite getting off the plane from Beijing,
and collecting flat screen TVs, laptops in original boxes, electronic
goods at the airport, and out in the boondocks see the poor people
scratching a harvested rice field for some dropped grains.

In article <iqih2tFf9qiU1@mid.individual.net>, Mountain Magpie
<Leura@blue.mountains.org> wrote:

>
> > > Their internet is locked down, I suppose if your device is not an
> > > approved list, you can't get on.
> >
> > what denotes an approved device? if they go by mac address, that's
> > very easy to bypass.
>
>
> No idea, sorry, but when I was there, and the guys I was with, could
> never get a connection.

that doesn't mean it can't be done. whether it's a good idea is another
story.

> And anything with GPS has to be declared at
> the airport, and may be taken from you, to be returned when you leave.

that's just about every phone, smartwatch and many cameras.

> And all photos in your camera are accessed on departure.

unless they're uploaded prior to departure.

your link expands to this and states:
> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Censorship_in_North_Korea#Internet_policies>
Foreigners can access the internet using the 3G phone network

In article <WuCdndgu7poDkNn8nZ2dnUU7-SudnZ2d@giganews.com>, geoff
<geoff@nospamgeoffwood.org> wrote:

> >>> a smartphone, computer or smart speaker can stream radio stations from
> >>> anywhere in the world, not just nearby, along with spotify and similar
> >>> services, podcasts and much more.
> >>
> >> Provided you have an Internet connection of course?
> >
> > yep, just as terrestrial radio needs a nearby transmitter.
> >
> > keep in mind that there is internet in places where radio can't be
> > received, such as inside steel/concrete buildings, tunnels, desolate
> > highways through the middle of nowhere, etc.
> >
>
> Yeah, internet doesn't need a nearby transmitter ....

there are shitloads of them dotting the major roads and in places radio
can't reach, such as tunnels or inside many buildings.

another advantage is you can keep listening to a station as you drive
outside its range, which for fm is 30-50 miles, depending on terrain.

On Fri, 17 Sep 2021 00:15:10 -0400, nospam posted:-

> In article <iqih2tFf9qiU1@mid.individual.net>, Mountain Magpie
> <Leura@blue.mountains.org> wrote:
>
> >
> > > > Their internet is locked down, I suppose if your device is not
> > > > an approved list, you can't get on.
> > >
> > > what denotes an approved device? if they go by mac address, that's
> > > very easy to bypass.
> >
> >
> > No idea, sorry, but when I was there, and the guys I was with, could
> > never get a connection.
>
> that doesn't mean it can't be done. whether it's a good idea is
> another story.
>
> > And anything with GPS has to be declared at
> > the airport, and may be taken from you, to be returned when you
> > leave.
>
> that's just about every phone, smartwatch and many cameras.
>
> > And all photos in your camera are accessed on departure.
>
> unless they're uploaded prior to departure.

Without Internet, very difficult, last time I looked.
>
> your link expands to this and states:
> > <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Censorship_in_North_Korea#Internet_policies>
> >
> Foreigners can access the internet using the 3G phone network

We couldn't. No signal at all.

On 17/09/2021 4:15 pm, nospam wrote:
> In article <WuCdndgu7poDkNn8nZ2dnUU7-SudnZ2d@giganews.com>, geoff
> <geoff@nospamgeoffwood.org> wrote:
>
>>>>> a smartphone, computer or smart speaker can stream radio stations from
>>>>> anywhere in the world, not just nearby, along with spotify and similar
>>>>> services, podcasts and much more.
>>>>
>>>> Provided you have an Internet connection of course?
>>>
>>> yep, just as terrestrial radio needs a nearby transmitter.
>>>
>>> keep in mind that there is internet in places where radio can't be
>>> received, such as inside steel/concrete buildings, tunnels, desolate
>>> highways through the middle of nowhere, etc.
>>>
>>
>> Yeah, internet doesn't need a nearby transmitter ....
>
> there are shitloads of them dotting the major roads and in places radio
> can't reach, such as tunnels or inside many buildings.
>
> another advantage is you can keep listening to a station as you drive
> outside its range, which for fm is 30-50 miles, depending on terrain.
>

Never heard of 'No Signal' ? You can't drive very far. 50 miles isn't
'far'.

geoff

In article <iqirniFha2mU1@mid.individual.net>, Mountain Magpie
<Leura@blue.mountains.org> wrote:

> >
> > your link expands to this and states:
> > >
> > > <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Censorship_in_North_Korea#Internet_policies>
> > >
> > >
> > Foreigners can access the internet using the 3G phone network
>
> We couldn't. No signal at all.

your phone might not have had all of the 3g bands.

3g is also old. 4g/lte has been around for about a decade and 5g is
starting to roll out.

In article <tJWdncr-BsAE4dn8nZ2dnUU7-eGdnZ2d@giganews.com>, geoff
<geoff@nospamgeoffwood.org> wrote:

> >>>>> a smartphone, computer or smart speaker can stream radio stations from
> >>>>> anywhere in the world, not just nearby, along with spotify and similar
> >>>>> services, podcasts and much more.
> >>>>
> >>>> Provided you have an Internet connection of course?
> >>>
> >>> yep, just as terrestrial radio needs a nearby transmitter.
> >>>
> >>> keep in mind that there is internet in places where radio can't be
> >>> received, such as inside steel/concrete buildings, tunnels, desolate
> >>> highways through the middle of nowhere, etc.
> >>>
> >>
> >> Yeah, internet doesn't need a nearby transmitter ....
> >
> > there are shitloads of them dotting the major roads and in places radio
> > can't reach, such as tunnels or inside many buildings.
> >
> > another advantage is you can keep listening to a station as you drive
> > outside its range, which for fm is 30-50 miles, depending on terrain.
> >
>
> Never heard of 'No Signal' ? You can't drive very far. 50 miles isn't
> 'far'.

having no cell service is very rare unless you're in the middle of
nowhere, where there won't be any radio either.

the reality is that there is more likely to be cell service than radio
reception, and with cell service, you have the choice of thousands of
radio stations anywhere in the world, plus non-radio sources such as
podcasts, spotify, etc.

there is cellular service along desolate highways where there is no
radio or maybe one or two stations which won't be anything of interest.
btdt.

there are also cellular micro and femto cells inside buildings and
tunnels and other dead zones so that people can continue to their
phones. there are not radio repeaters in those locations.

tl;dr cell service is in more places than radio.