On Fri, 12 Aug 2022 20:16:01 +0100, rbowman <bowman@montana.com> wrote:

> On 08/12/2022 11:44 AM, Commander Kinsey wrote:
>> On Fri, 12 Aug 2022 05:58:18 +0100, rbowman <bowman@montana.com> wrote:
>>
>>> On 08/11/2022 09:48 PM, Commander Kinsey wrote:
>>>> On Fri, 12 Aug 2022 04:34:31 +0100, rbowman <bowman@montana.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> On 08/11/2022 11:04 AM, Commander Kinsey wrote:
>>>>>> 110psi? That's shit. Mine does 5000psi. It's for scuba tanks.
>>>>>> Actually I could clean my board with a scuba tank.
>>>>>
>>>>> Scuba tanks are no fun. With that compressor you could get a PCP air
>>>>> rifle and really rock.
>>>>>
>>>>> https://www.umarexusa.com/2254829
>>>>
>>>> They refuse to ship to the UK!
>>>
>>> Figures.
>>
>> Actually they won't ship anywhere outside the states. Surely there are
>> other countries you can use guns?
>>
>>>> And scuba tanks are great fun, especially naked.
>>>
>>> I sometimes regret not getting into scuba. When I was a kid I snorkeled
>>> and it was a lot of fun. Maybe it's not too late.
>>
>> It's another world under there.
>>
>>> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Impressionen_unter_Wasser
>>>
>>> http://www.leni-riefenstahl.de/eng/photo/p_unter.html
>>>
>>> "For the diving examination, her date of birth was changed from 1902 to
>>> 1922 for at her age she was not allowed to make a diving certificate."
>>>
>>> Fortunately the US has no maximum age.
>>
>> No country has any age limit, young or old. That's just for the
>> official diving groups with silly regulations. Go by yourself, that's
>> what I do. Buy your own gear on Ebay and go where you want when you
>> want. You don't need lessons, you just read how to do it on google.
>> There's very little to know that isn't obvious.
>
> Some dive shops get snarky about refilling tanks,

Yeah I think they want a certificate here in the UK aswell. Well fuck them, it's cheaper to buy a compressor anyway. It's my life I'll take my own risks and they can go shove it. And no I don't need a "buddy".

> not a problem with
> your own compressor. The context there is the PCP air gun crowd that
> have to sweet talk the dive shop into filling their tanks. A 5000 psi
> compressor isn't cheap.

Oh yes it is. If you're not in a hurry a $170 unit will fill a large scuba tank in an hour.

> There are handpumps if you want to stay fit. 100
> or more strokes for 2200 psi.

I don't think I'll try that with a scuba tank. Not unless I hired a fit young lad to do it for me.

> Riefenstahl was in her '70s when she was certified, but since she was
> born in 1902 that was also in the 1970's. Things change.

Certification is a sham. It's not rocket science to swim underwater.

rbowman wrote:
> On 08/12/2022 11:44 AM, Commander Kinsey wrote:
>> On Fri, 12 Aug 2022 05:58:18 +0100, rbowman <bowman@montana.com> wrote:
>>
>>> On 08/11/2022 09:48 PM, Commander Kinsey wrote:
>>>> On Fri, 12 Aug 2022 04:34:31 +0100, rbowman <bowman@montana.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> On 08/11/2022 11:04 AM, Commander Kinsey wrote:
>>>>>> 110psi?  That's shit.  Mine does 5000psi.  It's for scuba tanks.
>>>>>> Actually I could clean my board with a scuba tank.
>>>>>
>>>>> Scuba tanks are no fun. With that compressor you could get a PCP air
>>>>> rifle and really rock.
>>>>>
>>>>> https://www.umarexusa.com/2254829
>>>>
>>>> They refuse to ship to the UK!
>>>
>>> Figures.
>>
>> Actually they won't ship anywhere outside the states.  Surely there are
>> other countries you can use guns?
>>
>>>> And scuba tanks are great fun, especially naked.
>>>
>>> I sometimes regret not getting into scuba. When I was a kid I snorkeled
>>> and it was a lot of fun. Maybe it's not too late.
>>
>> It's another world under there.
>>
>>> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Impressionen_unter_Wasser
>>>
>>> http://www.leni-riefenstahl.de/eng/photo/p_unter.html
>>>
>>> "For the diving examination, her date of birth was changed from 1902 to
>>> 1922 for at her age she was not allowed to make a diving certificate."
>>>
>>> Fortunately the US has no maximum age.
>>
>> No country has any age limit, young or old.  That's just for the
>> official diving groups with silly regulations.  Go by yourself, that's
>> what I do.  Buy your own gear on Ebay and go where you want when you
>> want.  You don't need lessons, you just read how to do it on google.
>> There's very little to know that isn't obvious.
>
> Some dive shops get snarky about refilling tanks, not a problem with
> your own compressor. The context there is the PCP air gun crowd that
> have to sweet talk the dive shop into filling their tanks. A 5000 psi
> compressor isn't cheap. There are handpumps if you want to stay fit. 100
> or more strokes for 2200 psi.
>

You want to have high pressure tanks hydroed periodically--a faulty one
is no joke.

Cheers

Phil Hobbs

--
Dr Philip C D Hobbs
Principal Consultant
ElectroOptical Innovations LLC / Hobbs ElectroOptics
Optics, Electro-optics, Photonics, Analog Electronics
Briarcliff Manor NY 10510

http://electrooptical.net
http://hobbs-eo.com

On Fri, 12 Aug 2022 21:14:58 +0100, Phil Hobbs <pcdhSpamMeSenseless@electrooptical.net> wrote:

> rbowman wrote:
>> On 08/12/2022 11:44 AM, Commander Kinsey wrote:
>>> On Fri, 12 Aug 2022 05:58:18 +0100, rbowman <bowman@montana.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> On 08/11/2022 09:48 PM, Commander Kinsey wrote:
>>>>> On Fri, 12 Aug 2022 04:34:31 +0100, rbowman <bowman@montana.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> On 08/11/2022 11:04 AM, Commander Kinsey wrote:
>>>>>>> 110psi? That's shit. Mine does 5000psi. It's for scuba tanks.
>>>>>>> Actually I could clean my board with a scuba tank.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Scuba tanks are no fun. With that compressor you could get a PCP air
>>>>>> rifle and really rock.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> https://www.umarexusa.com/2254829
>>>>>
>>>>> They refuse to ship to the UK!
>>>>
>>>> Figures.
>>>
>>> Actually they won't ship anywhere outside the states. Surely there are
>>> other countries you can use guns?
>>>
>>>>> And scuba tanks are great fun, especially naked.
>>>>
>>>> I sometimes regret not getting into scuba. When I was a kid I snorkeled
>>>> and it was a lot of fun. Maybe it's not too late.
>>>
>>> It's another world under there.
>>>
>>>> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Impressionen_unter_Wasser
>>>>
>>>> http://www.leni-riefenstahl.de/eng/photo/p_unter.html
>>>>
>>>> "For the diving examination, her date of birth was changed from 1902 to
>>>> 1922 for at her age she was not allowed to make a diving certificate."
>>>>
>>>> Fortunately the US has no maximum age.
>>>
>>> No country has any age limit, young or old. That's just for the
>>> official diving groups with silly regulations. Go by yourself, that's
>>> what I do. Buy your own gear on Ebay and go where you want when you
>>> want. You don't need lessons, you just read how to do it on google.
>>> There's very little to know that isn't obvious.
>>
>> Some dive shops get snarky about refilling tanks, not a problem with
>> your own compressor. The context there is the PCP air gun crowd that
>> have to sweet talk the dive shop into filling their tanks. A 5000 psi
>> compressor isn't cheap. There are handpumps if you want to stay fit. 100
>> or more strokes for 2200 psi.
>
> You want to have high pressure tanks hydroed periodically--a faulty one
> is no joke.

Yeah right. And you should have your car serviced regularly too. I've seen pictures of tanks still in use that pass tests, covered in knocks and scrapes and rust damage on the outside, mine is in perfect condition, I'll decide when I don't think it's safe. Guess what, I shave my own face too.

On Fri, 12 Aug 2022 21:21:17 +0100, "Commander Kinsey"
<CK1@nospam.com> wrote:

>On Fri, 12 Aug 2022 21:14:58 +0100, Phil Hobbs <pcdhSpamMeSenseless@electrooptical.net> wrote:
>
>> rbowman wrote:
>>> On 08/12/2022 11:44 AM, Commander Kinsey wrote:
>>>> On Fri, 12 Aug 2022 05:58:18 +0100, rbowman <bowman@montana.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> On 08/11/2022 09:48 PM, Commander Kinsey wrote:
>>>>>> On Fri, 12 Aug 2022 04:34:31 +0100, rbowman <bowman@montana.com> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On 08/11/2022 11:04 AM, Commander Kinsey wrote:
>>>>>>>> 110psi? That's shit. Mine does 5000psi. It's for scuba tanks.
>>>>>>>> Actually I could clean my board with a scuba tank.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Scuba tanks are no fun. With that compressor you could get a PCP air
>>>>>>> rifle and really rock.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> https://www.umarexusa.com/2254829
>>>>>>
>>>>>> They refuse to ship to the UK!
>>>>>
>>>>> Figures.
>>>>
>>>> Actually they won't ship anywhere outside the states. Surely there are
>>>> other countries you can use guns?
>>>>
>>>>>> And scuba tanks are great fun, especially naked.
>>>>>
>>>>> I sometimes regret not getting into scuba. When I was a kid I snorkeled
>>>>> and it was a lot of fun. Maybe it's not too late.
>>>>
>>>> It's another world under there.
>>>>
>>>>> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Impressionen_unter_Wasser
>>>>>
>>>>> http://www.leni-riefenstahl.de/eng/photo/p_unter.html
>>>>>
>>>>> "For the diving examination, her date of birth was changed from 1902 to
>>>>> 1922 for at her age she was not allowed to make a diving certificate."
>>>>>
>>>>> Fortunately the US has no maximum age.
>>>>
>>>> No country has any age limit, young or old. That's just for the
>>>> official diving groups with silly regulations. Go by yourself, that's
>>>> what I do. Buy your own gear on Ebay and go where you want when you
>>>> want. You don't need lessons, you just read how to do it on google.
>>>> There's very little to know that isn't obvious.
>>>
>>> Some dive shops get snarky about refilling tanks, not a problem with
>>> your own compressor. The context there is the PCP air gun crowd that
>>> have to sweet talk the dive shop into filling their tanks. A 5000 psi
>>> compressor isn't cheap. There are handpumps if you want to stay fit. 100
>>> or more strokes for 2200 psi.
>>
>> You want to have high pressure tanks hydroed periodically--a faulty one
>> is no joke.
>
>Yeah right. And you should have your car serviced regularly too. I've seen pictures of tanks still in use that pass tests, covered in knocks and scrapes and rust damage on the outside, mine is in perfect condition, I'll decide when I don't think it's safe. Guess what, I shave my own face too.

Sure, buddy...

..<https://www.cnn.com/videos/us/2011/09/12/fl-exploding-scuba-tank-death.bay-news-9>

..<https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XJuIwHJTCbY>

Exploding Scuba Tank in L&W Explosion Safety Box (may be a fire
extinguisher - blew at 318 Bar or a bit higher)

Joe Gwinn

On 12/08/2022 19:20, Marco Moock wrote:
> Am Mittwoch, 10. August 2022, um 03:07:19 Uhr schrieb Brian Gregory:
>
>> Just from water?
>> That's hard to believe.
>
> Yes, it was normal water, but our water here contains a lot of calcium
> inside, that improves the conductivity.
>

So your thinking that the water carried the +12V or -12V to a part that
expected only a lower voltage? And then passed enough current for a
capacitor to heat up and explode?

I still find it hard to believe.

I guess maybe some tiny capacitor the coupled audio in the on board
audio circuit?

--
Brian Gregory (in England).

On 8/17/2022 10:11 AM, Brian Gregory wrote:
> On 12/08/2022 19:20, Marco Moock wrote:
>> Am Mittwoch, 10. August 2022, um 03:07:19 Uhr schrieb Brian Gregory:
>>
>>> Just from water?
>>> That's hard to believe.
>>
>> Yes, it was normal water, but our water here contains a lot of calcium
>> inside, that improves the conductivity.
>>
>
> So your thinking that the water carried the +12V or -12V to a part that expected only a lower voltage? And then passed enough current for a capacitor to heat up and explode?
>
> I still find it hard to believe.
>
> I guess maybe some tiny capacitor the coupled audio in the on board audio circuit?
>

But that cap is on the input side filter bank.

Some of the R9 280x have two 2x4 pin PCIe power connectors.
The OPs board is one of the bodged ones, where the PCB has
holes for two 2x4, but the board is populated with one 2x3 and one 2x4.
The board VBIOS must be programmed with an appropriate power limit,
if the board has power management.

https://static.techspot.com/articles-info/841/images/Sapphire_08S.jpg

( https://www.techspot.com/review/841-radeon-r9-280x-roundup/page6.html )

The +12V input side, likely uses an LC filter to help prevent switching
noise from the GPU, from getting back into the ATX supply. In this
picture, the layout is unrolled in linear fashion so you can see the
LC filtering the +12V coming in. On another card boardview I could find,
one of those inductors is rated 21A, the other was rated 16A (as some
boards use a 2x3 and a 2x4, so the inductors are allowed to be different).

https://www.igorslab.de/wp-content/uploads/2021/03/00980-990x743.jpg

( https://www.igorslab.de/en/special-adapter-on-the-pcie-socket-of-the-graphics-card-against-load-peaks-snake-oil-or-miracle/ )

But the capacitors are also close to their WVDC, running at
nominally 12V with a 16V rating. If there was any kind of surge
effect, the rail voltage across the cap could rise above 12V.

As for the adapter that Igorslab is testing, this is a bad idea,
because ATX supplies have a limit as to how much capacitance they
can drive, before they lose control loop stability. This would be
why those little toys would not be using all the capacitance
money could buy. As an example of a number (don't use this),
the value might be 5000uF on the thing the ATX supply is driving.
When a motherboard designer "sprinkles" bulk decap on the mobo
(like near PCIe slots), they cannot exceed that kind of number.
Peripherals have to follow some sort of rules as well. Even USB items,
like flash keys, have a limit on allowed bypass caps. (100uF sag
protection on the mobo, 10uF max on a USB key to prevent an inrush
problem on a shared rail.)

Such a cap (the ruined one), is for all practical purposes
running off +12V and GND, and cares not about water sprinkles.
Maybe you could have electrolysis to eat the cap body, but as
far as charging the cap to some illegal value, probably not.

Paul

On Wednesday, 17 August 2022 at 16:52:35 UTC+1, Paul wrote:
> On 8/17/2022 10:11 AM, Brian Gregory wrote:
> > On 12/08/2022 19:20, Marco Moock wrote:
> >> Am Mittwoch, 10. August 2022, um 03:07:19 Uhr schrieb Brian Gregory:
> >>
> >>> Just from water?
> >>> That's hard to believe.
> >>
> >> Yes, it was normal water, but our water here contains a lot of calcium
> >> inside, that improves the conductivity.
> >>
> >
> > So your thinking that the water carried the +12V or -12V to a part that expected only a lower voltage? And then passed enough current for a capacitor to heat up and explode?
> >
> > I still find it hard to believe.
> >
> > I guess maybe some tiny capacitor the coupled audio in the on board audio circuit?
> >
> But that cap is on the input side filter bank.
>
> Some of the R9 280x have two 2x4 pin PCIe power connectors.
> The OPs board is one of the bodged ones, where the PCB has
> holes for two 2x4, but the board is populated with one 2x3 and one 2x4.
> The board VBIOS must be programmed with an appropriate power limit,
> if the board has power management.
>
> https://static.techspot.com/articles-info/841/images/Sapphire_08S.jpg
>
> ( https://www.techspot.com/review/841-radeon-r9-280x-roundup/page6.html )
>
> The +12V input side, likely uses an LC filter to help prevent switching
> noise from the GPU, from getting back into the ATX supply. In this
> picture, the layout is unrolled in linear fashion so you can see the
> LC filtering the +12V coming in. On another card boardview I could find,
> one of those inductors is rated 21A, the other was rated 16A (as some
> boards use a 2x3 and a 2x4, so the inductors are allowed to be different).
>
> https://www.igorslab.de/wp-content/uploads/2021/03/00980-990x743.jpg
>
> ( https://www.igorslab.de/en/special-adapter-on-the-pcie-socket-of-the-graphics-card-against-load-peaks-snake-oil-or-miracle/ )
>
> But the capacitors are also close to their WVDC, running at
> nominally 12V with a 16V rating. If there was any kind of surge
> effect, the rail voltage across the cap could rise above 12V.
>
> As for the adapter that Igorslab is testing, this is a bad idea,
> because ATX supplies have a limit as to how much capacitance they
> can drive, before they lose control loop stability. This would be
> why those little toys would not be using all the capacitance
> money could buy. As an example of a number (don't use this),
> the value might be 5000uF on the thing the ATX supply is driving.
> When a motherboard designer "sprinkles" bulk decap on the mobo
> (like near PCIe slots), they cannot exceed that kind of number.
> Peripherals have to follow some sort of rules as well. Even USB items,
> like flash keys, have a limit on allowed bypass caps. (100uF sag
> protection on the mobo, 10uF max on a USB key to prevent an inrush
> problem on a shared rail.)
>
> Such a cap (the ruined one), is for all practical purposes
> running off +12V and GND, and cares not about water sprinkles.
> Maybe you could have electrolysis to eat the cap body, but as
> far as charging the cap to some illegal value, probably not.
>
> Paul

I recently bought a PoE switch from eBay. It had been damaged by water
ingress and the current flow was sufficient to start a fire inside it.
I know it was water because of the rust on the inside of the steel case and
I know there had been a fire because of the charred pcb and components
and soot on the inside of the case.
I did get a refund without any problems once I sent photographs - despite the
"no returns" statement in the listing.

John

On Wed, 17 Aug 2022 16:52:29 +0100, Paul <nospam@needed.invalid> wrote:

> On 8/17/2022 10:11 AM, Brian Gregory wrote:
>> On 12/08/2022 19:20, Marco Moock wrote:
>>> Am Mittwoch, 10. August 2022, um 03:07:19 Uhr schrieb Brian Gregory:
>>>
>>>> Just from water?
>>>> That's hard to believe.
>>>
>>> Yes, it was normal water, but our water here contains a lot of calcium
>>> inside, that improves the conductivity.
>>>
>>
>> So your thinking that the water carried the +12V or -12V to a part that expected only a lower voltage? And then passed enough current for a capacitor to heat up and explode?
>>
>> I still find it hard to believe.
>>
>> I guess maybe some tiny capacitor the coupled audio in the on board audio circuit?
>
> But that cap is on the input side filter bank.
>
> Some of the R9 280x have two 2x4 pin PCIe power connectors.
> The OPs board is one of the bodged ones, where the PCB has
> holes for two 2x4, but the board is populated with one 2x3 and one 2x4.
> The board VBIOS must be programmed with an appropriate power limit,
> if the board has power management.

Nah, you can drive more power than you're supposed to through those plugs. They just wear out quicker (oxidizing, then voltage drop, then crash the card). I've set one to 1.5 times the standard max current, and run it flat out 24/7. I change the connectors every 4 months. Sometimes I just solder wires straight onto them.

On Fri, 12 Aug 2022 19:22:24 +0100, Marco Moock <mo01@posteo.de> wrote:

> Am Mittwoch, 10. August 2022, um 04:14:44 Uhr schrieb New Me:
>
>> I wash my desktop's motherboard with water every 12 months and there
>> is no malfunction after cleaning and drying it throughly.
>
> Drying is the relevant part. Without water there can't be conductivity.
> With water and minerals inside there is, but the resistance is high.
>
>> Machine is still as fast as it was when I bought it 5 years ago.
>
> It will not change the speed in any way, the clocks will they the same.

Dust insulates heat limits clock speed to avoid burnout. I just blew dust off my Radeon Fury and it's speed increased by one seventh.

On Tue, 09 Aug 2022 23:19:45 +0100, Paul <nospam@needed.invalid> wrote:

> On 8/9/2022 9:07 AM, Mayayana wrote:
>> "Paul" <nospam@needed.invalid> wrote
>>
>> | > https://imgur.com/jYet0zF
>> |
>>
>> Here's the real link without the imgur BS:
>> https://i.imgur.com/jYet0zF.jpg
>>
>> I once had a case where one of those blew up.
>> I was putting in a CD player. Apparently there was
>> a short somewhere inside the player. I smelled electrical
>> fire, but before I could do anything it blew up, taking
>> all the components f the computer with it. Everything
>> got fried.
>
> That could be a +5V shorted to +12V fault. I could
> see that blowing all the +5V logic.

Shouldn't a decent PSU see the 5V being pushed up and shut everything off quick smart? Or maybe it's not that common a fault.

On Tue, 04 Oct 2022 21:24:07 +0100, "Commander Kinsey"
<CK1@nospam.com> wrote:

>On Tue, 09 Aug 2022 23:19:45 +0100, Paul <nospam@needed.invalid> wrote:
>
>> On 8/9/2022 9:07 AM, Mayayana wrote:
>>> "Paul" <nospam@needed.invalid> wrote
>>>
>>> | > https://imgur.com/jYet0zF
>>> |
>>>
>>> Here's the real link without the imgur BS:
>>> https://i.imgur.com/jYet0zF.jpg
>>>
>>> I once had a case where one of those blew up.
>>> I was putting in a CD player. Apparently there was
>>> a short somewhere inside the player. I smelled electrical
>>> fire, but before I could do anything it blew up, taking
>>> all the components f the computer with it. Everything
>>> got fried.
>>
>> That could be a +5V shorted to +12V fault. I could
>> see that blowing all the +5V logic.
>
>Shouldn't a decent PSU see the 5V being pushed up and shut everything off quick smart? Or maybe it's not that common a fault.

Some of the early Xerox copiers had a flame detector and a fire
extinguisher inside.

On Wed, 05 Oct 2022 03:16:12 +0100, John Larkin <jlarkin@highlandsnipmetechnology.com> wrote:

> On Tue, 04 Oct 2022 21:24:07 +0100, "Commander Kinsey"
> <CK1@nospam.com> wrote:
>
>> On Tue, 09 Aug 2022 23:19:45 +0100, Paul <nospam@needed.invalid> wrote:
>>
>>> On 8/9/2022 9:07 AM, Mayayana wrote:
>>>> "Paul" <nospam@needed.invalid> wrote
>>>>
>>>> | > https://imgur.com/jYet0zF
>>>> |
>>>>
>>>> Here's the real link without the imgur BS:
>>>> https://i.imgur.com/jYet0zF.jpg
>>>>
>>>> I once had a case where one of those blew up.
>>>> I was putting in a CD player. Apparently there was
>>>> a short somewhere inside the player. I smelled electrical
>>>> fire, but before I could do anything it blew up, taking
>>>> all the components f the computer with it. Everything
>>>> got fried.
>>>
>>> That could be a +5V shorted to +12V fault. I could
>>> see that blowing all the +5V logic.
>>
>> Shouldn't a decent PSU see the 5V being pushed up and shut everything off quick smart? Or maybe it's not that common a fault.
>
> Some of the early Xerox copiers had a flame detector and a fire
> extinguisher inside.

But they never solved the problem of the glass breaking when people photocopied their buttocks.

I never saw that happeneing at my work, but I have seen people photocopying blank paper. The reason? You had to pay for paper but the photocopying was free!

On Wed, 05 Oct 2022 12:32:08 +0100, "Commander Kinsey"
<CK1@nospam.com> wrote:

>On Wed, 05 Oct 2022 03:16:12 +0100, John Larkin <jlarkin@highlandsnipmetechnology.com> wrote:
>
>> On Tue, 04 Oct 2022 21:24:07 +0100, "Commander Kinsey"
>> <CK1@nospam.com> wrote:
>>
>>> On Tue, 09 Aug 2022 23:19:45 +0100, Paul <nospam@needed.invalid> wrote:
>>>
>>>> On 8/9/2022 9:07 AM, Mayayana wrote:
>>>>> "Paul" <nospam@needed.invalid> wrote
>>>>>
>>>>> | > https://imgur.com/jYet0zF
>>>>> |
>>>>>
>>>>> Here's the real link without the imgur BS:
>>>>> https://i.imgur.com/jYet0zF.jpg
>>>>>
>>>>> I once had a case where one of those blew up.
>>>>> I was putting in a CD player. Apparently there was
>>>>> a short somewhere inside the player. I smelled electrical
>>>>> fire, but before I could do anything it blew up, taking
>>>>> all the components f the computer with it. Everything
>>>>> got fried.
>>>>
>>>> That could be a +5V shorted to +12V fault. I could
>>>> see that blowing all the +5V logic.
>>>
>>> Shouldn't a decent PSU see the 5V being pushed up and shut everything off quick smart? Or maybe it's not that common a fault.
>>
>> Some of the early Xerox copiers had a flame detector and a fire
>> extinguisher inside.
>
>But they never solved the problem of the glass breaking when people photocopied their buttocks.
>
>I never saw that happeneing at my work, but I have seen people photocopying blank paper. The reason? You had to pay for paper but the photocopying was free!

Your company charges employees for paper? Coin operated water
fountains? Electric meters per office?

We let people take reasonable quantities of anything, including parts.

We have a freezer full of TV dinners, and a fridge full of Lundt
chocolate truffles. And a nice stock of beer.

We also don't charge customers for reasonable spare parts.

All that makes people happy and is good business. Petty greed (like HP
toner prices and car parts marked up 30:1) drive customers away.

On Wed, 05 Oct 2022 16:41:08 +0100, John Larkin <jlarkin@highlandsnipmetechnology.com> wrote:

> On Wed, 05 Oct 2022 12:32:08 +0100, "Commander Kinsey"
> <CK1@nospam.com> wrote:
>
>> On Wed, 05 Oct 2022 03:16:12 +0100, John Larkin <jlarkin@highlandsnipmetechnology.com> wrote:
>>
>>> On Tue, 04 Oct 2022 21:24:07 +0100, "Commander Kinsey"
>>> <CK1@nospam.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> On Tue, 09 Aug 2022 23:19:45 +0100, Paul <nospam@needed.invalid> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> On 8/9/2022 9:07 AM, Mayayana wrote:
>>>>>> "Paul" <nospam@needed.invalid> wrote
>>>>>>
>>>>>> | > https://imgur.com/jYet0zF
>>>>>> |
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Here's the real link without the imgur BS:
>>>>>> https://i.imgur.com/jYet0zF.jpg
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I once had a case where one of those blew up.
>>>>>> I was putting in a CD player. Apparently there was
>>>>>> a short somewhere inside the player. I smelled electrical
>>>>>> fire, but before I could do anything it blew up, taking
>>>>>> all the components f the computer with it. Everything
>>>>>> got fried.
>>>>>
>>>>> That could be a +5V shorted to +12V fault. I could
>>>>> see that blowing all the +5V logic.
>>>>
>>>> Shouldn't a decent PSU see the 5V being pushed up and shut everything off quick smart? Or maybe it's not that common a fault.
>>>
>>> Some of the early Xerox copiers had a flame detector and a fire
>>> extinguisher inside.
>>
>> But they never solved the problem of the glass breaking when people photocopied their buttocks.
>>
>> I never saw that happeneing at my work, but I have seen people photocopying blank paper. The reason? You had to pay for paper but the photocopying was free!
>
> Your company charges employees for paper? Coin operated water
> fountains? Electric meters per office?

No, they didn't charge employees, they charged departments.

> We let people take reasonable quantities of anything, including parts.

So did I, but some didn't.

> We have a freezer full of TV dinners, and a fridge full of Lundt
> chocolate truffles. And a nice stock of beer.

I don't think many companies even allow beer, let alone give it away free!

> We also don't charge customers for reasonable spare parts.
>
> All that makes people happy and is good business. Petty greed (like HP
> toner prices and car parts marked up 30:1) drive customers away.

Agreed, I was charged £160 for just the part before labour for a brake caliper I ended up buying for £30 online including postage from Eurocarparts. The same make! That garage isn't where I go anymore. And they're in shit from the DVLA for something else they tried to do to me - "your [just replaced elsewhere] handbrake is hardly working at all sir", when I could cause it to lock the wheels going at 30mph, and prevent the engine from turning those wheels from a standstill.