Any comments (from US, english-native-speakers) re: regional
(english language) accents that are easiest and hardest to
understand? I.e., a single-pass being all you hear?

Note that it's not just "accent" but terminology/phraseology,
prosodic differences, etc. as these can act as "speed bumps"
during listening, causing you to miss a bit of what might follow
as your brain tries to adjust to the unexpected utterance.

[Of course, a lot of this depends on how well-traveled you are
and, thus, how exposed you are to these speech mannerisms.]

On Wed, 12 Oct 2022 01:46:18 -0700, Don Y
<blockedofcourse@foo.invalid> wrote:

>Any comments (from US, english-native-speakers) re: regional
>(english language) accents that are easiest and hardest to
>understand? I.e., a single-pass being all you hear?
>
>Note that it's not just "accent" but terminology/phraseology,
>prosodic differences, etc. as these can act as "speed bumps"
>during listening, causing you to miss a bit of what might follow
>as your brain tries to adjust to the unexpected utterance.
>
>[Of course, a lot of this depends on how well-traveled you are
>and, thus, how exposed you are to these speech mannerisms.]

Central Mississippi has some intense accents that are hard to
understand. At least for me; I have really bad speech processing,
which my speech pathologist wife finds amusing. She can understand
people in intensive care with tubes, mumbling in German.

Texan, especially west texan and Oklahoma, can be tricky. And there is
hillbilly, Tennessee, which can get intense.

The Cajun (SW Louisiana and a bit of Texas) accent used to be very
difficult (even the French couldn't understand Cajun French) but it's
much milder now. In WWII, cajun soldier recruits had to be taught
English.

New England has some weird accents.

New Orleans has a working-class accent locally known as Yat, from the
Aloha-like greeting "Where Y'at?", responded with same. It is vaguely
Brooklyn but not hard to understand. I missed getting it somehow.

Some black accents, "ebonic", are almost unintelligable. A distinct
language in vocabulary, syntax, tenses, accent. Not a good career
path.

Lots of immigration is creating local accents, but the kids seem to go
standard NBC News in one generation.

On Wednesday, October 12, 2022 at 3:46:33 AM UTC-5, Don Y wrote:
> Any comments (from US, english-native-speakers) re: regional
> (english language) accents that are easiest and hardest to
> understand? I.e., a single-pass being all you hear?
>
> Note that it's not just "accent" but terminology/phraseology,
> prosodic differences, etc. as these can act as "speed bumps"
> during listening, causing you to miss a bit of what might follow
> as your brain tries to adjust to the unexpected utterance.
>
> [Of course, a lot of this depends on how well-traveled you are
> and, thus, how exposed you are to these speech mannerisms.

There's a tv show, The First 48 that follows homicide investigators in various U.S. cities. Many of the suspects are gang members. They have their own words for stuff and mumble.
Another show is Swamp People which tracks alligator hunters in south central Louisiana. They have distinct accents but aren't that hard to understand.
I've been on or around Nebraska farms all of my life and like to think I don't have an accent. Words for farm equipment would probably be foreign to a city dweller.

On 10/12/2022 9:25 AM, John Larkin wrote:
> On Wed, 12 Oct 2022 01:46:18 -0700, Don Y
> <blockedofcourse@foo.invalid> wrote:
>
>> Any comments (from US, english-native-speakers) re: regional
>> (english language) accents that are easiest and hardest to
>> understand? I.e., a single-pass being all you hear?
>>
>> Note that it's not just "accent" but terminology/phraseology,
>> prosodic differences, etc. as these can act as "speed bumps"
>> during listening, causing you to miss a bit of what might follow
>> as your brain tries to adjust to the unexpected utterance.
>>
>> [Of course, a lot of this depends on how well-traveled you are
>> and, thus, how exposed you are to these speech mannerisms.]
>
> The Cajun (SW Louisiana and a bit of Texas) accent used to be very
> difficult (even the French couldn't understand Cajun French) but it's
> much milder now. In WWII, cajun soldier recruits had to be taught
> English.
>
  15 or ore years go I worked on a marina, a Louisiana shrimper came in
speaking Cajun, I didn't understand much of what he said.
I moved from Michigan to Northwest Florida, I would often have the
locals say I had an accent, and 3 or 4 actually suggested I was from
Michigan.
 I would say they have the accent ! :-)
                           Mikek

On 12/10/2022 15:25, John Larkin wrote:
> On Wed, 12 Oct 2022 01:46:18 -0700, Don Y
> <blockedofcourse@foo.invalid> wrote:
>
>> Any comments (from US, english-native-speakers) re: regional
>> (english language) accents that are easiest and hardest to
>> understand? I.e., a single-pass being all you hear?

> Texan, especially west texan and Oklahoma, can be tricky. And there is
> hillbilly, Tennessee, which can get intense.

I am a Brit who went on holiday to New England about 30 years ago,
staying at a small B&B in Chester, Vermont. At breakfast one morning
three new guests appeared. We exchanged small talk. I understood very
little of what they said (no doubt they had trouble understanding me
too). After breakfast I asked the B&B owner where they were from, and he
said "Oklahoma". I said that I was somewhat embarrassed to admit I
couldn't understand what they were saying. He replied that he also
couldn't understand much of what they said!

--

Jeff

On Wed, 12 Oct 2022 18:37:05 +0100, Jeff Layman <Jeff@invalid.invalid>
wrote:

>On 12/10/2022 15:25, John Larkin wrote:
>> On Wed, 12 Oct 2022 01:46:18 -0700, Don Y
>> <blockedofcourse@foo.invalid> wrote:
>>
>>> Any comments (from US, english-native-speakers) re: regional
>>> (english language) accents that are easiest and hardest to
>>> understand? I.e., a single-pass being all you hear?
>
>> Texan, especially west texan and Oklahoma, can be tricky. And there is
>> hillbilly, Tennessee, which can get intense.
>
>I am a Brit who went on holiday to New England about 30 years ago,
>staying at a small B&B in Chester, Vermont. At breakfast one morning
>three new guests appeared. We exchanged small talk. I understood very
>little of what they said (no doubt they had trouble understanding me
>too). After breakfast I asked the B&B owner where they were from, and he
>said "Oklahoma". I said that I was somewhat embarrassed to admit I
>couldn't understand what they were saying. He replied that he also
>couldn't understand much of what they said!

In my experience working in Oklahoma, all they talk about is
basketball.

Jeff Layman wrote:
> On 12/10/2022 15:25, John Larkin wrote:
>> On Wed, 12 Oct 2022 01:46:18 -0700, Don Y
>> <blockedofcourse@foo.invalid> wrote:
>>
>>> Any comments (from US, english-native-speakers) re: regional
>>> (english language) accents that are easiest and hardest to
>>> understand?  I.e., a single-pass being all you hear?
>
>> Texan, especially west texan and Oklahoma, can be tricky. And there is
>> hillbilly, Tennessee, which can get intense.
>
> I am a Brit who went on holiday to New England about 30 years ago,
> staying at a small B&B in Chester, Vermont. At breakfast one morning
> three new guests appeared. We exchanged small talk. I understood very
> little of what they said (no doubt they had trouble understanding me
> too). After breakfast I asked the B&B owner where they were from, and he
> said "Oklahoma". I said that I was somewhat embarrassed to admit I
> couldn't understand what they were saying. He replied that he also
> couldn't understand much of what they said!
>

Hell, in Britain, Glaswegian or Geordie is hardly less different from
Received Pronunciation.

Cheers

Phil Hobbs

--
Dr Philip C D Hobbs
Principal Consultant
ElectroOptical Innovations LLC / Hobbs ElectroOptics
Optics, Electro-optics, Photonics, Analog Electronics
Briarcliff Manor NY 10510

http://electrooptical.net
http://hobbs-eo.com

Am 12.10.22 um 16:25 schrieb John Larkin:

When I was at Infineon Fiber Optics, I had countless colleges
from around the world: Houston, CA, 'stralian Hoons, a guy from
Grenoble France who flew in every week, Japanese etc.
Now take all that as a native German and try to develop
something consistent. No way.
I decided to take our department head of engineering as a model.
He was from London, it cannot be more English than that.
Maybe Cockney.

Then I met a guy in a Berlin bar who was from Country Place, USA.
I repeated: Country place.
He, with disgust: Geee, that's Queen's English!
I gave up. You'll have to take it as I say.

When in England, it was really easier to understand the people
from Newcastle & north. (Geordie land)

Loosely related good music (Newcastle and so):

Mark Knöpfler, Why aye, man
< https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KrwSDX95wCs >

On 10/12/2022 8:45 AM, Dean Hoffman wrote:

Answering out of order...

> Words for farm equipment would probably be foreign to a city dweller.

I'm not concerned about *vocabulary* or grammatical "abnormalities"
("He's the guy what done it!"). I have no control over *what* is
said, but, rather, HOW it is said!

> I've been on or around Nebraska farms all of my life and like to
> think I don't have an accent.

I suspect New Yorkers and Texans, alike, don't think THEY have accents,
either! :>

> There's a tv show, The First 48 that follows homicide investigators in
> various U.S. cities. Many of the suspects are gang members. They have
> their own words for stuff and mumble.

Nothing I can do about mumbling (it would probably be algorithmically
difficult to implement). And, "own words" falls into the class of
vocabulary, above. I suspect there is *some* rationale, in their
minds, for the word-concept associations but that's beyond the
scope of my problem.

Note that even "professionals" use everyday terms in very different
ways than The Public (e.g., a pharmacist dispenses TABLETS, not PILLS)

And, regional industries can adopt terms that may be contrary to what is
encountered elsewhere (soda/pop, frappe, packy, etc.)

> Another show is Swamp People which tracks alligator hunters in south
> central Louisiana. They have distinct accents but aren't that hard
> to understand.

But, would you WANT to listen to it? Would you be confident in thinking
you understood the content, first pass?

Folks in JOISEY put EARL on squeaky hinges. Ohioans MAYSH their
potatoes (my pronunciation is *closer* to "mesh"). Do you have L's
in your ALMONDS and SALMON? Any R's in WARSH? Do you count to TEN?
Or TIN? Does FO-AH have one or two syllables? What about FEYE-EV?
And, MAYNAIZ? Are cot and caught different words to you? Did it
rain for FARTY days and FARTY nights? Do you STARE your lemonade?
Is ARE-KANSAS just north of LOOZIANA?

If you think about what you're hearing (or, can ask them to
repeat themselves/for clarification), its understandable. But,
likely not something you'd want to train your ear to readily
recognize.

When you actively think about pronunciation (as in "developing
rules for"), you notice a lot more variety in the speech around
you. I'm told typeface designers find reading printed word more
tedious as they want to examine the individual *glyphs* instead
of dealing with them as abstractions...

On Wednesday, October 12, 2022 at 10:25:35 AM UTC-4, John Larkin wrote:
> On Wed, 12 Oct 2022 01:46:18 -0700, Don Y
> <blocked...@foo.invalid> wrote:
>
> >Any comments (from US, english-native-speakers) re: regional
> >(english language) accents that are easiest and hardest to
> >understand? I.e., a single-pass being all you hear?
> >
> >Note that it's not just "accent" but terminology/phraseology,
> >prosodic differences, etc. as these can act as "speed bumps"
> >during listening, causing you to miss a bit of what might follow
> >as your brain tries to adjust to the unexpected utterance.
> >
> >[Of course, a lot of this depends on how well-traveled you are
> >and, thus, how exposed you are to these speech mannerisms.]
> Central Mississippi has some intense accents that are hard to
> understand. At least for me; I have really bad speech processing,
> which my speech pathologist wife finds amusing. She can understand
> people in intensive care with tubes, mumbling in German.
>
> Texan, especially west texan and Oklahoma, can be tricky. And there is
> hillbilly, Tennessee, which can get intense.
>
> The Cajun (SW Louisiana and a bit of Texas) accent used to be very
> difficult (even the French couldn't understand Cajun French) but it's
> much milder now. In WWII, cajun soldier recruits had to be taught
> English.
>
> New England has some weird accents.
>
> New Orleans has a working-class accent locally known as Yat, from the
> Aloha-like greeting "Where Y'at?", responded with same. It is vaguely
> Brooklyn but not hard to understand. I missed getting it somehow.
>
> Some black accents, "ebonic", are almost unintelligable. A distinct
> language in vocabulary, syntax, tenses, accent. Not a good career
> path.
>
> Lots of immigration is creating local accents, but the kids seem to go
> standard NBC News in one generation.

You absolutely require subtitles to begin to understand people in Scotland, especially their ghetto people- this is aside from the fact they're not worth listening to.

Nearly the same for Australia, it's not the pronunciation so much as a bunch of words that just aren't used in the U.S.- slangy casual speak words.

On 12/10/2022 21:04, Phil Hobbs wrote:
> Jeff Layman wrote:
>> On 12/10/2022 15:25, John Larkin wrote:
>>> On Wed, 12 Oct 2022 01:46:18 -0700, Don Y
>>> <blockedofcourse@foo.invalid> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Any comments (from US, english-native-speakers) re: regional
>>>> (english language) accents that are easiest and hardest to
>>>> understand?  I.e., a single-pass being all you hear?
>>
>>> Texan, especially west texan and Oklahoma, can be tricky. And there is
>>> hillbilly, Tennessee, which can get intense.
>>
>> I am a Brit who went on holiday to New England about 30 years ago,
>> staying at a small B&B in Chester, Vermont. At breakfast one morning
>> three new guests appeared. We exchanged small talk. I understood very
>> little of what they said (no doubt they had trouble understanding me
>> too). After breakfast I asked the B&B owner where they were from, and he
>> said "Oklahoma". I said that I was somewhat embarrassed to admit I
>> couldn't understand what they were saying. He replied that he also
>> couldn't understand much of what they said!
>>
>
> Hell, in Britain, Glaswegian or Geordie is hardly less different from
> Received Pronunciation.

I think that this thread is confusing accent and dialect. It is true
that Glaswegian can be very difficult to understand, but that is as much
due to them using their own words for certain things rather than just
having a very different pronunciation of words which are the same as
anywhere else in the UK.

I find Geordie the UK accent I like the most (and I'm a Londoner by
birth), and other than some oddities don't usually have a great problem
understanding it.

--

Jeff

Jeff Layman wrote:
> On 12/10/2022 21:04, Phil Hobbs wrote:
>> Jeff Layman wrote:
>>> On 12/10/2022 15:25, John Larkin wrote:
>>>> On Wed, 12 Oct 2022 01:46:18 -0700, Don Y
>>>> <blockedofcourse@foo.invalid> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Any comments (from US, english-native-speakers) re: regional
>>>>> (english language) accents that are easiest and hardest to
>>>>> understand?  I.e., a single-pass being all you hear?
>>>
>>>> Texan, especially west texan and Oklahoma, can be tricky. And there is
>>>> hillbilly, Tennessee, which can get intense.
>>>
>>> I am a Brit who went on holiday to New England about 30 years ago,
>>> staying at a small B&B in Chester, Vermont. At breakfast one morning
>>> three new guests appeared. We exchanged small talk. I understood very
>>> little of what they said (no doubt they had trouble understanding me
>>> too). After breakfast I asked the B&B owner where they were from, and he
>>> said "Oklahoma". I said that I was somewhat embarrassed to admit I
>>> couldn't understand what they were saying. He replied that he also
>>> couldn't understand much of what they said!
>>>
>>
>> Hell, in Britain, Glaswegian or Geordie is hardly less different from
>> Received Pronunciation.
>
> I think that this thread is confusing accent and dialect. It is true
> that Glaswegian can be very difficult to understand, but that is as much
> due to them using their own words for certain things rather than just
> having a very different pronunciation of words which are the same as
> anywhere else in the UK.

Okay, Aberdeen then. ;)

> I find Geordie the UK accent I like the most (and I'm a Londoner by
> birth), and other than some oddities don't usually have a great problem
> understanding it.

Sure, but I can understand Okies and Cajuns just fine too. (And even
Canucks!)

Cheers

Phil Hobbs

--
Dr Philip C D Hobbs
Principal Consultant
ElectroOptical Innovations LLC / Hobbs ElectroOptics
Optics, Electro-optics, Photonics, Analog Electronics
Briarcliff Manor NY 10510

http://electrooptical.net
http://hobbs-eo.com

torsdag den 13. oktober 2022 kl. 19.24.29 UTC+2 skrev Jeff Layman:
> On 12/10/2022 21:04, Phil Hobbs wrote:
> > Jeff Layman wrote:
> >> On 12/10/2022 15:25, John Larkin wrote:
> >>> On Wed, 12 Oct 2022 01:46:18 -0700, Don Y
> >>> <blocked...@foo.invalid> wrote:
> >>>
> >>>> Any comments (from US, english-native-speakers) re: regional
> >>>> (english language) accents that are easiest and hardest to
> >>>> understand? I.e., a single-pass being all you hear?
> >>
> >>> Texan, especially west texan and Oklahoma, can be tricky. And there is
> >>> hillbilly, Tennessee, which can get intense.
> >>
> >> I am a Brit who went on holiday to New England about 30 years ago,
> >> staying at a small B&B in Chester, Vermont. At breakfast one morning
> >> three new guests appeared. We exchanged small talk. I understood very
> >> little of what they said (no doubt they had trouble understanding me
> >> too). After breakfast I asked the B&B owner where they were from, and he
> >> said "Oklahoma". I said that I was somewhat embarrassed to admit I
> >> couldn't understand what they were saying. He replied that he also
> >> couldn't understand much of what they said!
> >>
> >
> > Hell, in Britain, Glaswegian or Geordie is hardly less different from
> > Received Pronunciation.
> I think that this thread is confusing accent and dialect. It is true
> that Glaswegian can be very difficult to understand, but that is as much
> due to them using their own words for certain things rather than just
> having a very different pronunciation of words which are the same as
> anywhere else in the UK.
>
> I find Geordie the UK accent I like the most (and I'm a Londoner by
> birth), and other than some oddities don't usually have a great problem
> understanding it.

I find it interesting is noticing Americans that complain they can't understand some
UK accents/dialects, and wondering why when I with English as my second language
find it perfectly understandable

torsdag den 13. oktober 2022 kl. 00.12.31 UTC+2 skrev Don Y:
> When you actively think about pronunciation (as in "developing
> rules for"), you notice a lot more variety in the speech around
> you. I'm told typeface designers find reading printed word more
> tedious as they want to examine the individual *glyphs* instead
> of dealing with them as abstractions...

and if you are reading at speed you don't look at letters, you recognize words
which is why it is so slow reading text with lots of spelling errors

On 10/13/2022 10:48 AM, Lasse Langwadt Christensen wrote:
> torsdag den 13. oktober 2022 kl. 00.12.31 UTC+2 skrev Don Y:
>> When you actively think about pronunciation (as in "developing
>> rules for"), you notice a lot more variety in the speech around
>> you. I'm told typeface designers find reading printed word more
>> tedious as they want to examine the individual *glyphs* instead
>> of dealing with them as abstractions...
>
> and if you are reading at speed you don't look at letters, you recognize words
> which is why it is so slow reading text with lots of spelling errors

The point is that folks who have become interested in the design of
typefaces *do* look at letters, finding them more interesting than
the "content" (at least until they have examined them). The rest
of us largely don't care -- an A is an a, regardless of serifs,
height to width ratio, whether it is kerned with its neighbors, etc.

On 10/13/2022 20:41, Lasse Langwadt Christensen wrote:
> torsdag den 13. oktober 2022 kl. 19.24.29 UTC+2 skrev Jeff Layman:
>> On 12/10/2022 21:04, Phil Hobbs wrote:
>>> Jeff Layman wrote:
>>>> On 12/10/2022 15:25, John Larkin wrote:
>>>>> On Wed, 12 Oct 2022 01:46:18 -0700, Don Y
>>>>> <blocked...@foo.invalid> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Any comments (from US, english-native-speakers) re: regional
>>>>>> (english language) accents that are easiest and hardest to
>>>>>> understand? I.e., a single-pass being all you hear?
>>>>
>>>>> Texan, especially west texan and Oklahoma, can be tricky. And there is
>>>>> hillbilly, Tennessee, which can get intense.
>>>>
>>>> I am a Brit who went on holiday to New England about 30 years ago,
>>>> staying at a small B&B in Chester, Vermont. At breakfast one morning
>>>> three new guests appeared. We exchanged small talk. I understood very
>>>> little of what they said (no doubt they had trouble understanding me
>>>> too). After breakfast I asked the B&B owner where they were from, and he
>>>> said "Oklahoma". I said that I was somewhat embarrassed to admit I
>>>> couldn't understand what they were saying. He replied that he also
>>>> couldn't understand much of what they said!
>>>>
>>>
>>> Hell, in Britain, Glaswegian or Geordie is hardly less different from
>>> Received Pronunciation.
>> I think that this thread is confusing accent and dialect. It is true
>> that Glaswegian can be very difficult to understand, but that is as much
>> due to them using their own words for certain things rather than just
>> having a very different pronunciation of words which are the same as
>> anywhere else in the UK.
>>
>> I find Geordie the UK accent I like the most (and I'm a Londoner by
>> birth), and other than some oddities don't usually have a great problem
>> understanding it.
>
> I find it interesting is noticing Americans that complain they can't understand some
> UK accents/dialects, and wondering why when I with English as my second language
> find it perfectly understandable
>
>
>

Can you understand Glaswegian? I only get every other word at best when
I listen to the likes of Alex Ferguson or Kenny Dalglish, and they speak
of football, i.e. the words they use are not that many nor that fancy.
Recently I asked my niece's man, a native Londoner, if he could
understand these, and he said "no" without any hesitation.
With the rest of the UK accents on TV and most films/shows I am OK,
sometimes it takes me a few minutes to tune in if it is too colloquial.

American accents are less difficult - as long as I get these on film or
TV and they are not some ghetto lingo which can be no better than
Chinese to me (I know sheh-sheh in Chinese, from a Jackie Chan
film :D ).

Gerhard Hoffmann wrote:
> Am 12.10.22 um 16:25 schrieb John Larkin:
>
> When I was at Infineon Fiber Optics, I had countless colleges
> from around the world: Houston, CA, 'stralian Hoons, a guy from
> Grenoble France who flew in every week, Japanese etc.
> Now take all that as a native German and try to develop
> something consistent. No way.
> I decided to take our department head of engineering as a model.
> He was from London, it cannot be more English than that.
> Maybe Cockney.
>
> Then I met a guy in a Berlin bar who was from Country Place, USA.
> I repeated: Country place.
> He, with disgust: Geee, that's Queen's English!
> I gave up. You'll have to take it as I say.
>
> When in England, it was really easier to understand the people
> from Newcastle & north. (Geordie land)
>
> Loosely related good music (Newcastle and so):
>
> Mark Knöpfler, Why aye, man
> <  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KrwSDX95wCs   >
>
>
>
Up there in the old Danelaw, no surprise. ;:

Cheers

Phil Hobbs

torsdag den 13. oktober 2022 kl. 23.12.03 UTC+2 skrev Dimiter Popoff:
> On 10/13/2022 20:41, Lasse Langwadt Christensen wrote:
> > torsdag den 13. oktober 2022 kl. 19.24.29 UTC+2 skrev Jeff Layman:
> >> On 12/10/2022 21:04, Phil Hobbs wrote:
> >>> Jeff Layman wrote:
> >>>> On 12/10/2022 15:25, John Larkin wrote:
> >>>>> On Wed, 12 Oct 2022 01:46:18 -0700, Don Y
> >>>>> <blocked...@foo.invalid> wrote:
> >>>>>
> >>>>>> Any comments (from US, english-native-speakers) re: regional
> >>>>>> (english language) accents that are easiest and hardest to
> >>>>>> understand? I.e., a single-pass being all you hear?
> >>>>
> >>>>> Texan, especially west texan and Oklahoma, can be tricky. And there is
> >>>>> hillbilly, Tennessee, which can get intense.
> >>>>
> >>>> I am a Brit who went on holiday to New England about 30 years ago,
> >>>> staying at a small B&B in Chester, Vermont. At breakfast one morning
> >>>> three new guests appeared. We exchanged small talk. I understood very
> >>>> little of what they said (no doubt they had trouble understanding me
> >>>> too). After breakfast I asked the B&B owner where they were from, and he
> >>>> said "Oklahoma". I said that I was somewhat embarrassed to admit I
> >>>> couldn't understand what they were saying. He replied that he also
> >>>> couldn't understand much of what they said!
> >>>>
> >>>
> >>> Hell, in Britain, Glaswegian or Geordie is hardly less different from
> >>> Received Pronunciation.
> >> I think that this thread is confusing accent and dialect. It is true
> >> that Glaswegian can be very difficult to understand, but that is as much
> >> due to them using their own words for certain things rather than just
> >> having a very different pronunciation of words which are the same as
> >> anywhere else in the UK.
> >>
> >> I find Geordie the UK accent I like the most (and I'm a Londoner by
> >> birth), and other than some oddities don't usually have a great problem
> >> understanding it.
> >
> > I find it interesting is noticing Americans that complain they can't understand some
> > UK accents/dialects, and wondering why when I with English as my second language
> > find it perfectly understandable
> >
> >
> >
> Can you understand Glaswegian? I only get every other word at best when
> I listen to the likes of Alex Ferguson or Kenny Dalglish, and they speak
> of football, i.e. the words they use are not that many nor that fancy.

just checked a few interviews with them on youtube, doesn't seem to bad

On 10/14/2022 0:44, Lasse Langwadt Christensen wrote:
> torsdag den 13. oktober 2022 kl. 23.12.03 UTC+2 skrev Dimiter Popoff:
>> On 10/13/2022 20:41, Lasse Langwadt Christensen wrote:
>>> torsdag den 13. oktober 2022 kl. 19.24.29 UTC+2 skrev Jeff Layman:
>>>> On 12/10/2022 21:04, Phil Hobbs wrote:
>>>>> Jeff Layman wrote:
>>>>>> On 12/10/2022 15:25, John Larkin wrote:
>>>>>>> On Wed, 12 Oct 2022 01:46:18 -0700, Don Y
>>>>>>> <blocked...@foo.invalid> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Any comments (from US, english-native-speakers) re: regional
>>>>>>>> (english language) accents that are easiest and hardest to
>>>>>>>> understand? I.e., a single-pass being all you hear?
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Texan, especially west texan and Oklahoma, can be tricky. And there is
>>>>>>> hillbilly, Tennessee, which can get intense.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I am a Brit who went on holiday to New England about 30 years ago,
>>>>>> staying at a small B&B in Chester, Vermont. At breakfast one morning
>>>>>> three new guests appeared. We exchanged small talk. I understood very
>>>>>> little of what they said (no doubt they had trouble understanding me
>>>>>> too). After breakfast I asked the B&B owner where they were from, and he
>>>>>> said "Oklahoma". I said that I was somewhat embarrassed to admit I
>>>>>> couldn't understand what they were saying. He replied that he also
>>>>>> couldn't understand much of what they said!
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Hell, in Britain, Glaswegian or Geordie is hardly less different from
>>>>> Received Pronunciation.
>>>> I think that this thread is confusing accent and dialect. It is true
>>>> that Glaswegian can be very difficult to understand, but that is as much
>>>> due to them using their own words for certain things rather than just
>>>> having a very different pronunciation of words which are the same as
>>>> anywhere else in the UK.
>>>>
>>>> I find Geordie the UK accent I like the most (and I'm a Londoner by
>>>> birth), and other than some oddities don't usually have a great problem
>>>> understanding it.
>>>
>>> I find it interesting is noticing Americans that complain they can't understand some
>>> UK accents/dialects, and wondering why when I with English as my second language
>>> find it perfectly understandable
>>>
>>>
>>>
>> Can you understand Glaswegian? I only get every other word at best when
>> I listen to the likes of Alex Ferguson or Kenny Dalglish, and they speak
>> of football, i.e. the words they use are not that many nor that fancy.
>
> just checked a few interviews with them on youtube, doesn't seem to bad
>

Your filters must be really good and adaptive. I do understand parts of
what they say at times, especially when I know the context, but
typically I miss words and if they are key to the sentence I am just
lost.
Sometimes I get the feeling Glaswegians don't understand each other,
they just say their say and just assume what the others are saying :D.

fredag den 14. oktober 2022 kl. 00.40.09 UTC+2 skrev Dimiter Popoff:
> On 10/14/2022 0:44, Lasse Langwadt Christensen wrote:
> > torsdag den 13. oktober 2022 kl. 23.12.03 UTC+2 skrev Dimiter Popoff:
> >> On 10/13/2022 20:41, Lasse Langwadt Christensen wrote:
> >>> torsdag den 13. oktober 2022 kl. 19.24.29 UTC+2 skrev Jeff Layman:
> >>>> On 12/10/2022 21:04, Phil Hobbs wrote:
> >>>>> Jeff Layman wrote:
> >>>>>> On 12/10/2022 15:25, John Larkin wrote:
> >>>>>>> On Wed, 12 Oct 2022 01:46:18 -0700, Don Y
> >>>>>>> <blocked...@foo.invalid> wrote:
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> Any comments (from US, english-native-speakers) re: regional
> >>>>>>>> (english language) accents that are easiest and hardest to
> >>>>>>>> understand? I.e., a single-pass being all you hear?
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>> Texan, especially west texan and Oklahoma, can be tricky. And there is
> >>>>>>> hillbilly, Tennessee, which can get intense.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> I am a Brit who went on holiday to New England about 30 years ago,
> >>>>>> staying at a small B&B in Chester, Vermont. At breakfast one morning
> >>>>>> three new guests appeared. We exchanged small talk. I understood very
> >>>>>> little of what they said (no doubt they had trouble understanding me
> >>>>>> too). After breakfast I asked the B&B owner where they were from, and he
> >>>>>> said "Oklahoma". I said that I was somewhat embarrassed to admit I
> >>>>>> couldn't understand what they were saying. He replied that he also
> >>>>>> couldn't understand much of what they said!
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Hell, in Britain, Glaswegian or Geordie is hardly less different from
> >>>>> Received Pronunciation.
> >>>> I think that this thread is confusing accent and dialect. It is true
> >>>> that Glaswegian can be very difficult to understand, but that is as much
> >>>> due to them using their own words for certain things rather than just
> >>>> having a very different pronunciation of words which are the same as
> >>>> anywhere else in the UK.
> >>>>
> >>>> I find Geordie the UK accent I like the most (and I'm a Londoner by
> >>>> birth), and other than some oddities don't usually have a great problem
> >>>> understanding it.
> >>>
> >>> I find it interesting is noticing Americans that complain they can't understand some
> >>> UK accents/dialects, and wondering why when I with English as my second language
> >>> find it perfectly understandable
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >> Can you understand Glaswegian? I only get every other word at best when
> >> I listen to the likes of Alex Ferguson or Kenny Dalglish, and they speak
> >> of football, i.e. the words they use are not that many nor that fancy.
> >
> > just checked a few interviews with them on youtube, doesn't seem to bad
> >
> Your filters must be really good and adaptive. I do understand parts of
> what they say at times, especially when I know the context, but
> typically I miss words and if they are key to the sentence I am just
> lost.
> Sometimes I get the feeling Glaswegians don't understand each other,
> they just say their say and just assume what the others are saying :D.

like this old Italian song that's made to sound English but is just gibberish

https://youtu.be/-VsmF9m_Nt8

On 10/14/2022 1:52, Lasse Langwadt Christensen wrote:
> fredag den 14. oktober 2022 kl. 00.40.09 UTC+2 skrev Dimiter Popoff:
>> On 10/14/2022 0:44, Lasse Langwadt Christensen wrote:
>>> torsdag den 13. oktober 2022 kl. 23.12.03 UTC+2 skrev Dimiter Popoff:
>>>> On 10/13/2022 20:41, Lasse Langwadt Christensen wrote:
>>>>> torsdag den 13. oktober 2022 kl. 19.24.29 UTC+2 skrev Jeff Layman:
>>>>>> On 12/10/2022 21:04, Phil Hobbs wrote:
>>>>>>> Jeff Layman wrote:
>>>>>>>> On 12/10/2022 15:25, John Larkin wrote:
>>>>>>>>> On Wed, 12 Oct 2022 01:46:18 -0700, Don Y
>>>>>>>>> <blocked...@foo.invalid> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Any comments (from US, english-native-speakers) re: regional
>>>>>>>>>> (english language) accents that are easiest and hardest to
>>>>>>>>>> understand? I.e., a single-pass being all you hear?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Texan, especially west texan and Oklahoma, can be tricky. And there is
>>>>>>>>> hillbilly, Tennessee, which can get intense.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I am a Brit who went on holiday to New England about 30 years ago,
>>>>>>>> staying at a small B&B in Chester, Vermont. At breakfast one morning
>>>>>>>> three new guests appeared. We exchanged small talk. I understood very
>>>>>>>> little of what they said (no doubt they had trouble understanding me
>>>>>>>> too). After breakfast I asked the B&B owner where they were from, and he
>>>>>>>> said "Oklahoma". I said that I was somewhat embarrassed to admit I
>>>>>>>> couldn't understand what they were saying. He replied that he also
>>>>>>>> couldn't understand much of what they said!
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Hell, in Britain, Glaswegian or Geordie is hardly less different from
>>>>>>> Received Pronunciation.
>>>>>> I think that this thread is confusing accent and dialect. It is true
>>>>>> that Glaswegian can be very difficult to understand, but that is as much
>>>>>> due to them using their own words for certain things rather than just
>>>>>> having a very different pronunciation of words which are the same as
>>>>>> anywhere else in the UK.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I find Geordie the UK accent I like the most (and I'm a Londoner by
>>>>>> birth), and other than some oddities don't usually have a great problem
>>>>>> understanding it.
>>>>>
>>>>> I find it interesting is noticing Americans that complain they can't understand some
>>>>> UK accents/dialects, and wondering why when I with English as my second language
>>>>> find it perfectly understandable
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>> Can you understand Glaswegian? I only get every other word at best when
>>>> I listen to the likes of Alex Ferguson or Kenny Dalglish, and they speak
>>>> of football, i.e. the words they use are not that many nor that fancy.
>>>
>>> just checked a few interviews with them on youtube, doesn't seem to bad
>>>
>> Your filters must be really good and adaptive. I do understand parts of
>> what they say at times, especially when I know the context, but
>> typically I miss words and if they are key to the sentence I am just
>> lost.
>> Sometimes I get the feeling Glaswegians don't understand each other,
>> they just say their say and just assume what the others are saying :D.
>
> like this old Italian song that's made to sound English but is just gibberish
>
> https://youtu.be/-VsmF9m_Nt8

Hah! Not dissimilar indeed :). Strangely I had never heard that song,
it is not by just anyone, Celentano was quite a star.

fredag den 14. oktober 2022 kl. 00.59.28 UTC+2 skrev Dimiter Popoff:
> On 10/14/2022 1:52, Lasse Langwadt Christensen wrote:
> > fredag den 14. oktober 2022 kl. 00.40.09 UTC+2 skrev Dimiter Popoff:
> >> On 10/14/2022 0:44, Lasse Langwadt Christensen wrote:
> >>> torsdag den 13. oktober 2022 kl. 23.12.03 UTC+2 skrev Dimiter Popoff:
> >>>> On 10/13/2022 20:41, Lasse Langwadt Christensen wrote:
> >>>>> torsdag den 13. oktober 2022 kl. 19.24.29 UTC+2 skrev Jeff Layman:
> >>>>>> On 12/10/2022 21:04, Phil Hobbs wrote:
> >>>>>>> Jeff Layman wrote:
> >>>>>>>> On 12/10/2022 15:25, John Larkin wrote:
> >>>>>>>>> On Wed, 12 Oct 2022 01:46:18 -0700, Don Y
> >>>>>>>>> <blocked...@foo.invalid> wrote:
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>> Any comments (from US, english-native-speakers) re: regional
> >>>>>>>>>> (english language) accents that are easiest and hardest to
> >>>>>>>>>> understand? I.e., a single-pass being all you hear?
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> Texan, especially west texan and Oklahoma, can be tricky. And there is
> >>>>>>>>> hillbilly, Tennessee, which can get intense.
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> I am a Brit who went on holiday to New England about 30 years ago,
> >>>>>>>> staying at a small B&B in Chester, Vermont. At breakfast one morning
> >>>>>>>> three new guests appeared. We exchanged small talk. I understood very
> >>>>>>>> little of what they said (no doubt they had trouble understanding me
> >>>>>>>> too). After breakfast I asked the B&B owner where they were from, and he
> >>>>>>>> said "Oklahoma". I said that I was somewhat embarrassed to admit I
> >>>>>>>> couldn't understand what they were saying. He replied that he also
> >>>>>>>> couldn't understand much of what they said!
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> Hell, in Britain, Glaswegian or Geordie is hardly less different from
> >>>>>>> Received Pronunciation.
> >>>>>> I think that this thread is confusing accent and dialect. It is true
> >>>>>> that Glaswegian can be very difficult to understand, but that is as much
> >>>>>> due to them using their own words for certain things rather than just
> >>>>>> having a very different pronunciation of words which are the same as
> >>>>>> anywhere else in the UK.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> I find Geordie the UK accent I like the most (and I'm a Londoner by
> >>>>>> birth), and other than some oddities don't usually have a great problem
> >>>>>> understanding it.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> I find it interesting is noticing Americans that complain they can't understand some
> >>>>> UK accents/dialects, and wondering why when I with English as my second language
> >>>>> find it perfectly understandable
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>> Can you understand Glaswegian? I only get every other word at best when
> >>>> I listen to the likes of Alex Ferguson or Kenny Dalglish, and they speak
> >>>> of football, i.e. the words they use are not that many nor that fancy.
> >>>
> >>> just checked a few interviews with them on youtube, doesn't seem to bad
> >>>
> >> Your filters must be really good and adaptive. I do understand parts of
> >> what they say at times, especially when I know the context, but
> >> typically I miss words and if they are key to the sentence I am just
> >> lost.
> >> Sometimes I get the feeling Glaswegians don't understand each other,
> >> they just say their say and just assume what the others are saying :D.
> >
> > like this old Italian song that's made to sound English but is just gibberish
> >
> > https://youtu.be/-VsmF9m_Nt8
> Hah! Not dissimilar indeed :). Strangely I had never heard that song,
> it is not by just anyone, Celentano was quite a star.

afaiu it was quite a hit, but it was before I was born

On 10/13/2022 3:39 PM, Dimiter_Popoff wrote:

> Your filters must be really good and adaptive. I do understand parts of
> what they say at times, especially when I know the context, but
> typically I miss words and if they are key to the sentence I am just
> lost.

That's the problem with all "accents" (speech patterns foreign to YOUR
norm). One can learn to understand damn near anything. But, the effort
required to -- esp when it is an infrequent activity *or* where you
can't just ask for someone to repeat what they've said -- can make
listening "tedious" or stressful.

Most synthetic speech suffers from this problem; it's OK in very small
doses *if* you've become accustomed to it AND have a pretty good idea
of what is being said. (try listening to someone reading nonsense
syllogisms in a "foreign accent" and make note of your overall comprehension!)
But, it's not the sort of experience that you "seek out".

Users of The Reading Machine often complained of "listener fatigue",
despite the fact that they were THRILLED to have access to the materials
that were possible via the machine.

[I always used to say the voice could penetrate CONCRETE!]

> Sometimes I get the feeling Glaswegians don't understand each other,
> they just say their say and just assume what the others are saying :D.

On Thu, 13 Oct 2022 13:38:35 -0400, Phil Hobbs
<pcdhSpamMeSenseless@electrooptical.net> wrote:

>Jeff Layman wrote:
>> On 12/10/2022 21:04, Phil Hobbs wrote:
>>> Jeff Layman wrote:
>>>> On 12/10/2022 15:25, John Larkin wrote:
>>>>> On Wed, 12 Oct 2022 01:46:18 -0700, Don Y
>>>>> <blockedofcourse@foo.invalid> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Any comments (from US, english-native-speakers) re: regional
>>>>>> (english language) accents that are easiest and hardest to
>>>>>> understand?  I.e., a single-pass being all you hear?
>>>>
>>>>> Texan, especially west texan and Oklahoma, can be tricky. And there is
>>>>> hillbilly, Tennessee, which can get intense.
>>>>
>>>> I am a Brit who went on holiday to New England about 30 years ago,
>>>> staying at a small B&B in Chester, Vermont. At breakfast one morning
>>>> three new guests appeared. We exchanged small talk. I understood very
>>>> little of what they said (no doubt they had trouble understanding me
>>>> too). After breakfast I asked the B&B owner where they were from, and he
>>>> said "Oklahoma". I said that I was somewhat embarrassed to admit I
>>>> couldn't understand what they were saying. He replied that he also
>>>> couldn't understand much of what they said!
>>>>
>>>
>>> Hell, in Britain, Glaswegian or Geordie is hardly less different from
>>> Received Pronunciation.
>>
>> I think that this thread is confusing accent and dialect. It is true
>> that Glaswegian can be very difficult to understand, but that is as much
>> due to them using their own words for certain things rather than just
>> having a very different pronunciation of words which are the same as
>> anywhere else in the UK.
>
>Okay, Aberdeen then. ;)
>
>> I find Geordie the UK accent I like the most (and I'm a Londoner by
>> birth), and other than some oddities don't usually have a great problem
>> understanding it.
>
>Sure, but I can understand Okies and Cajuns just fine too. (And even
>Canucks!)

Are you sure abooot that?

On 10/14/2022 3:22, Don Y wrote:
> On 10/13/2022 3:39 PM, Dimiter_Popoff wrote:
>
>> Your filters must be really good and adaptive. I do understand parts of
>> what they say at times, especially when I know the context, but
>> typically I miss words and if they are key to the sentence I am just
>> lost.
>
> That's the problem with all "accents" (speech patterns foreign to YOUR
> norm).  One can learn to understand damn near anything.  But, the effort
> required to -- esp when it is an infrequent activity *or* where you
> can't just ask for someone to repeat what they've said -- can make
> listening "tedious" or stressful.
>
> Most synthetic speech suffers from this problem; it's OK in very small
> doses *if* you've become accustomed to it AND have a pretty good idea
> of what is being said.  (try listening to someone reading nonsense
> syllogisms in a "foreign accent" and make note of your overall
> comprehension!)
> But, it's not the sort of experience that you "seek out".
>
> Users of The Reading Machine often complained of "listener fatigue",
> despite the fact that they were THRILLED to have access to the materials
> that were possible via the machine.
>
> [I always used to say the voice could penetrate CONCRETE!]

Penetrate concrete with Don having trained the machine what to
say in test mode... well well. :D