Ricky <gnuarm.deletethisbit@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Saturday, November 5, 2022 at 6:42:11 AM UTC-4, Don Y wrote:
>> On 11/4/2022 11:24 PM, whit3rd wrote:
>> > All 'normal' patch cables are 568B, so that's the only spec I'd ever want to use.
>> +42
>>
>> You also want to be sure to be buying connector terminations that carry the
>> matching color code, lest folks get even MORE confused.
>
> Confused about what??? The color of the wires in the cable are totally irrelevant to anything done using cables with RJ-45 connectors on each end. What is important is that the cable be straight through if that's what you need, or crossover, if that's what you need. I will never see the colors in the cables.
>
>
>> > POE, I'm not sure of.
>> When power is delivered over the data pairs (Orange/Green), polarity is
>> important. So, you want to know whether you've adopted 568A or B.
>> Unless you are always probing an 8P8C by pin number (and never actual
>> conductors).
>
> Again, the only difference is the color of the wires in the cables.
> You can use either type of cable and they are identically the same
> unless you cut one open and look at the colors.

This is mostly true. The amount of twist is different between the colors.
There's two amounts of twist used, strip the sheath off a cable and look
at the pairs. It's obvious once you see it. Wiring up patch cables with
odd color sequences may not meet specs.

I use 568B for panels as that's what AT&T/lucent/Avaya/whoeverit is now
ones silkscreen right on the front.

Commercially made patch cables will almost always be 568B.

>> The "spare pairs" (Blue/Brown) feed diode bridges so don't really care about
>> polarity (unless you're a stickler for standards).
>>
>> But, 8P8C's are shit connectors. Even shrouded, the damn latches seem
>> to find a way to snap off ("plastic fatigue"?)

Stop buying junk cables. Panduit 688 series plugs have been the best for
decades. They don't snag and they don't break apart.

On Saturday, November 12, 2022 at 11:09:42 PM UTC-4, Cydrome Leader wrote:
> Ricky <gnuarm.del...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > On Saturday, November 5, 2022 at 6:42:11 AM UTC-4, Don Y wrote:
> >> On 11/4/2022 11:24 PM, whit3rd wrote:
> >> > All 'normal' patch cables are 568B, so that's the only spec I'd ever want to use.
> >> +42
> >>
> >> You also want to be sure to be buying connector terminations that carry the
> >> matching color code, lest folks get even MORE confused.
> >
> > Confused about what??? The color of the wires in the cable are totally irrelevant to anything done using cables with RJ-45 connectors on each end. What is important is that the cable be straight through if that's what you need, or crossover, if that's what you need. I will never see the colors in the cables.
> >
> >
> >> > POE, I'm not sure of.
> >> When power is delivered over the data pairs (Orange/Green), polarity is
> >> important. So, you want to know whether you've adopted 568A or B.
> >> Unless you are always probing an 8P8C by pin number (and never actual
> >> conductors).
> >
> > Again, the only difference is the color of the wires in the cables.
> > You can use either type of cable and they are identically the same
> > unless you cut one open and look at the colors.
> This is mostly true. The amount of twist is different between the colors.
> There's two amounts of twist used, strip the sheath off a cable and look
> at the pairs. It's obvious once you see it. Wiring up patch cables with
> odd color sequences may not meet specs.

The reference I found said there were four twists used, and also indicated the amount of twist is not in the standard. So no point in assuming any correlation between twist and color.

> I use 568B for panels as that's what AT&T/lucent/Avaya/whoeverit is now
> ones silkscreen right on the front.
>
> Commercially made patch cables will almost always be 568B.

They don't seem to indicate that, but I'll never know, even if I buy them. I suppose I could use a lens and look at the connectors carefully. I think they are mostly clear.

--

Rick C.

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søndag den 13. november 2022 kl. 05.23.57 UTC+1 skrev Ricky:
> On Saturday, November 12, 2022 at 11:09:42 PM UTC-4, Cydrome Leader wrote:
> > Ricky <gnuarm.del...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > On Saturday, November 5, 2022 at 6:42:11 AM UTC-4, Don Y wrote:
> > >> On 11/4/2022 11:24 PM, whit3rd wrote:
> > >> > All 'normal' patch cables are 568B, so that's the only spec I'd ever want to use.
> > >> +42
> > >>
> > >> You also want to be sure to be buying connector terminations that carry the
> > >> matching color code, lest folks get even MORE confused.
> > >
> > > Confused about what??? The color of the wires in the cable are totally irrelevant to anything done using cables with RJ-45 connectors on each end. What is important is that the cable be straight through if that's what you need, or crossover, if that's what you need. I will never see the colors in the cables.
> > >
> > >
> > >> > POE, I'm not sure of.
> > >> When power is delivered over the data pairs (Orange/Green), polarity is
> > >> important. So, you want to know whether you've adopted 568A or B.
> > >> Unless you are always probing an 8P8C by pin number (and never actual
> > >> conductors).
> > >
> > > Again, the only difference is the color of the wires in the cables.
> > > You can use either type of cable and they are identically the same
> > > unless you cut one open and look at the colors.
> > This is mostly true. The amount of twist is different between the colors.
> > There's two amounts of twist used, strip the sheath off a cable and look
> > at the pairs. It's obvious once you see it. Wiring up patch cables with
> > odd color sequences may not meet specs.
> The reference I found said there were four twists used, and also indicated the amount of twist is not in the standard. So no point in assuming any correlation between twist and color.

each pair have a different number of twists per length to reduce crosstalk

On Sunday, 13 November 2022 at 14:49:18 UTC, lang...@fonz.dk wrote:
> søndag den 13. november 2022 kl. 05.23.57 UTC+1 skrev Ricky:
> > On Saturday, November 12, 2022 at 11:09:42 PM UTC-4, Cydrome Leader wrote:
> > > Ricky <gnuarm.del...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > > On Saturday, November 5, 2022 at 6:42:11 AM UTC-4, Don Y wrote:
> > > >> On 11/4/2022 11:24 PM, whit3rd wrote:
> > > >> > All 'normal' patch cables are 568B, so that's the only spec I'd ever want to use.
> > > >> +42
> > > >>
> > > >> You also want to be sure to be buying connector terminations that carry the
> > > >> matching color code, lest folks get even MORE confused.
> > > >
> > > > Confused about what??? The color of the wires in the cable are totally irrelevant to anything done using cables with RJ-45 connectors on each end. What is important is that the cable be straight through if that's what you need, or crossover, if that's what you need. I will never see the colors in the cables.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >> > POE, I'm not sure of.
> > > >> When power is delivered over the data pairs (Orange/Green), polarity is
> > > >> important. So, you want to know whether you've adopted 568A or B.
> > > >> Unless you are always probing an 8P8C by pin number (and never actual
> > > >> conductors).
> > > >
> > > > Again, the only difference is the color of the wires in the cables.
> > > > You can use either type of cable and they are identically the same
> > > > unless you cut one open and look at the colors.
> > > This is mostly true. The amount of twist is different between the colors.
> > > There's two amounts of twist used, strip the sheath off a cable and look
> > > at the pairs. It's obvious once you see it. Wiring up patch cables with
> > > odd color sequences may not meet specs.
> > The reference I found said there were four twists used, and also indicated the amount of twist is not in the standard. So no point in assuming any correlation between twist and color.
> each pair have a different number of twists per length to reduce crosstalk

According to para 5.8.2 of TIA 568.C.2
"Because of their identical pair groupings, patch cords terminated in either T568A or T568B
may be used interchangeably, provided that both ends are terminated with the same pin/pair
scheme."
As for the number of twists per unit length, the standard simply states:
"5.6.2 Pair assembly
The pair twist lengths shall be chosen to ensure compliance with the transmission requirements of this
Standard."
In other words, it is entirely up to the cable manufacturer to choose how many twists
per unit length are used so long as the completed cable is within specification.
So different patch cables could have totally different internal construction
and still meet the standard.

John

On Sunday, November 13, 2022 at 10:49:18 AM UTC-4, lang...@fonz.dk wrote:
> søndag den 13. november 2022 kl. 05.23.57 UTC+1 skrev Ricky:
> > On Saturday, November 12, 2022 at 11:09:42 PM UTC-4, Cydrome Leader wrote:
> > > Ricky <gnuarm.del...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > > On Saturday, November 5, 2022 at 6:42:11 AM UTC-4, Don Y wrote:
> > > >> On 11/4/2022 11:24 PM, whit3rd wrote:
> > > >> > All 'normal' patch cables are 568B, so that's the only spec I'd ever want to use.
> > > >> +42
> > > >>
> > > >> You also want to be sure to be buying connector terminations that carry the
> > > >> matching color code, lest folks get even MORE confused.
> > > >
> > > > Confused about what??? The color of the wires in the cable are totally irrelevant to anything done using cables with RJ-45 connectors on each end. What is important is that the cable be straight through if that's what you need, or crossover, if that's what you need. I will never see the colors in the cables.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >> > POE, I'm not sure of.
> > > >> When power is delivered over the data pairs (Orange/Green), polarity is
> > > >> important. So, you want to know whether you've adopted 568A or B.
> > > >> Unless you are always probing an 8P8C by pin number (and never actual
> > > >> conductors).
> > > >
> > > > Again, the only difference is the color of the wires in the cables.
> > > > You can use either type of cable and they are identically the same
> > > > unless you cut one open and look at the colors.
> > > This is mostly true. The amount of twist is different between the colors.
> > > There's two amounts of twist used, strip the sheath off a cable and look
> > > at the pairs. It's obvious once you see it. Wiring up patch cables with
> > > odd color sequences may not meet specs.
> > The reference I found said there were four twists used, and also indicated the amount of twist is not in the standard. So no point in assuming any correlation between twist and color.
> each pair have a different number of twists per length to reduce crosstalk

Yes, different from one another and each an unknown quantity. So no point in preserving any wiring scheme thinking the specific twist associated with a color is significant.

--

Rick C.

-++ Get 1,000 miles of free Supercharging
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On Sunday, November 13, 2022 at 3:21:30 PM UTC-4, John Walliker wrote:
> On Sunday, 13 November 2022 at 14:49:18 UTC, lang...@fonz.dk wrote:
> > søndag den 13. november 2022 kl. 05.23.57 UTC+1 skrev Ricky:
> > > On Saturday, November 12, 2022 at 11:09:42 PM UTC-4, Cydrome Leader wrote:
> > > > Ricky <gnuarm.del...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > > > On Saturday, November 5, 2022 at 6:42:11 AM UTC-4, Don Y wrote:
> > > > >> On 11/4/2022 11:24 PM, whit3rd wrote:
> > > > >> > All 'normal' patch cables are 568B, so that's the only spec I'd ever want to use.
> > > > >> +42
> > > > >>
> > > > >> You also want to be sure to be buying connector terminations that carry the
> > > > >> matching color code, lest folks get even MORE confused.
> > > > >
> > > > > Confused about what??? The color of the wires in the cable are totally irrelevant to anything done using cables with RJ-45 connectors on each end. What is important is that the cable be straight through if that's what you need, or crossover, if that's what you need. I will never see the colors in the cables.
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >> > POE, I'm not sure of.
> > > > >> When power is delivered over the data pairs (Orange/Green), polarity is
> > > > >> important. So, you want to know whether you've adopted 568A or B..
> > > > >> Unless you are always probing an 8P8C by pin number (and never actual
> > > > >> conductors).
> > > > >
> > > > > Again, the only difference is the color of the wires in the cables.
> > > > > You can use either type of cable and they are identically the same
> > > > > unless you cut one open and look at the colors.
> > > > This is mostly true. The amount of twist is different between the colors.
> > > > There's two amounts of twist used, strip the sheath off a cable and look
> > > > at the pairs. It's obvious once you see it. Wiring up patch cables with
> > > > odd color sequences may not meet specs.
> > > The reference I found said there were four twists used, and also indicated the amount of twist is not in the standard. So no point in assuming any correlation between twist and color.
> > each pair have a different number of twists per length to reduce crosstalk
> According to para 5.8.2 of TIA 568.C.2
> "Because of their identical pair groupings, patch cords terminated in either T568A or T568B
> may be used interchangeably, provided that both ends are terminated with the same pin/pair
> scheme."
> As for the number of twists per unit length, the standard simply states:
> "5.6.2 Pair assembly
> The pair twist lengths shall be chosen to ensure compliance with the transmission requirements of this
> Standard."
> In other words, it is entirely up to the cable manufacturer to choose how many twists
> per unit length are used so long as the completed cable is within specification.
> So different patch cables could have totally different internal construction
> and still meet the standard.

Bingo! Give the man a kewpie doll!

--

Rick C.

+-- Get 1,000 miles of free Supercharging
+-- Tesla referral code - https://ts.la/richard11209