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tech / sci.electronics.design / Re: Fine pitch twisted pair ribbon cable

Fine pitch twisted pair ribbon cable

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From: bon...@hertz.ikp.physik.tu-darmstadt.de (Uwe Bonnes)
Newsgroups: sci.electronics.design
Subject: Fine pitch twisted pair ribbon cable
Date: 15 Nov 2022 12:46:28 GMT
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by: Uwe Bonnes - Tue, 15 Nov 2022 12:46 UTC

Hello,

it seems, Hitachi stopped producing their Micro Quick-Twist 0.635 mm
pitch twisted pair ribbon cable. Samtec still offer such cables with
connectors. Any source for the pure cable?

Thanks

--
Uwe Bonnes bon@elektron.ikp.physik.tu-darmstadt.de

Institut fuer Kernphysik Schlossgartenstrasse 9 64289 Darmstadt
--------- Tel. 06151 1623569 ------- Fax. 06151 1623305 ---------

Re: Fine pitch twisted pair ribbon cable

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From: leg...@nospam.magma.ca (legg)
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Subject: Re: Fine pitch twisted pair ribbon cable
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by: legg - Tue, 15 Nov 2022 13:44 UTC

On 15 Nov 2022 12:46:28 GMT, Uwe Bonnes
<bon@hertz.ikp.physik.tu-darmstadt.de> wrote:

>Hello,
>
>it seems, Hitachi stopped producing their Micro Quick-Twist 0.635 mm
>pitch twisted pair ribbon cable. Samtec still offer such cables with
>connectors. Any source for the pure cable?
>
>Thanks

It's usually mfred with a defined distance between 'flattened'
sections - required for automated termination.

The 0.635mm pitch? That's 0.025in in 'merkin.

I see your problem.

Hitachi stopped producing it? Says who?

Re: Fine pitch twisted pair ribbon cable

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From: bon...@hertz.ikp.physik.tu-darmstadt.de (Uwe Bonnes)
Newsgroups: sci.electronics.design
Subject: Re: Fine pitch twisted pair ribbon cable
Date: 15 Nov 2022 14:42:14 GMT
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by: Uwe Bonnes - Tue, 15 Nov 2022 14:42 UTC

legg <legg@nospam.magma.ca> wrote:
> Hitachi stopped producing it? Says who?
>
Collegues at another institute that try to order.

Bye
--
Uwe Bonnes bon@elektron.ikp.physik.tu-darmstadt.de

Institut fuer Kernphysik Schlossgartenstrasse 9 64289 Darmstadt
--------- Tel. 06151 1623569 ------- Fax. 06151 1623305 ---------

Re: Fine pitch twisted pair ribbon cable

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by: legg - Tue, 15 Nov 2022 15:11 UTC

On 15 Nov 2022 12:46:28 GMT, Uwe Bonnes
<bon@hertz.ikp.physik.tu-darmstadt.de> wrote:

There are 21 types of (0.025) micro-twist cable.

I see discontinued notices for only 5 of these types.

Effective Date March 1, 2022

Product - Micro Quick Twist Series

TPO MQT 20051-068,

TPO DLMQT 20095-068, 20096-068,

?? 20293-068,

MQT 20050-068, 23195-068

The -68 may refer to the conductor count.

There are other varieties of the same TPO MQT, TPO DLMQT
and MQT cables in the catalog, not to mention conductor
counts, but I see that MQT products are no longer linked
in the general sales blurbs.

https://www.hca.hitachi-cable.com/products/hca/products/ribbon/mqt/pdfs/tpo-dual-laminated-mqt-cable.pdf

I wonder if single-sourcing is the issue - why it won't
sell . . .

Re: Fine pitch twisted pair ribbon cable

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by: John Larkin - Tue, 15 Nov 2022 16:54 UTC

On 15 Nov 2022 12:46:28 GMT, Uwe Bonnes
<bon@hertz.ikp.physik.tu-darmstadt.de> wrote:

Do you really need twisted pair? For differential data, likely not.

Re: Fine pitch twisted pair ribbon cable

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From: bon...@hertz.ikp.physik.tu-darmstadt.de (Uwe Bonnes)
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Subject: Re: Fine pitch twisted pair ribbon cable
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by: Uwe Bonnes - Tue, 15 Nov 2022 17:15 UTC

John Larkin <jlarkin@highlandsnipmetechnology.com> wrote:
> Do you really need twisted pair? For differential data, likely not.
>

Yes, it is intended for differential data with LVDS level on many
neighbouring pairs. Electrical
coupling is probably not an issue with LVDS and the way the pairs are
twisted does not decrease electrical coupling substantial. But
magnetic coupling is nearly canceled out and I think has influence.

What is your reasoning that differential data does not profit from
twisted pairs?

Thanks
--
Uwe Bonnes bon@elektron.ikp.physik.tu-darmstadt.de

Institut fuer Kernphysik Schlossgartenstrasse 9 64289 Darmstadt
--------- Tel. 06151 1623569 ------- Fax. 06151 1623305 ---------

Re: Fine pitch twisted pair ribbon cable

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Subject: Re: Fine pitch twisted pair ribbon cable
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by: whit3rd - Tue, 15 Nov 2022 20:05 UTC

On Tuesday, November 15, 2022 at 4:46:35 AM UTC-8, Uwe Bonnes wrote:
> Hello,
>
> it seems, Hitachi stopped producing their Micro Quick-Twist 0.635 mm
> pitch twisted pair ribbon cable. Samtec still offer such cables with
> connectors. Any source for the pure cable?

How about 3M? Not sure about the fine pitch, though.

<https://www.3m.com/3M/en_US/p/c/electronics-components/interconnect-products/copper-wire-cable/flat-ribbon/twisted/>

Re: Fine pitch twisted pair ribbon cable

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by: John Larkin - Wed, 16 Nov 2022 00:46 UTC

On 15 Nov 2022 17:15:46 GMT, Uwe Bonnes
<bon@hertz.ikp.physik.tu-darmstadt.de> wrote:

>John Larkin <jlarkin@highlandsnipmetechnology.com> wrote:
>
>> Do you really need twisted pair? For differential data, likely not.
>>
>
>Yes, it is intended for differential data with LVDS level on many
>neighbouring pairs. Electrical
>coupling is probably not an issue with LVDS and the way the pairs are
>twisted does not decrease electrical coupling substantial. But
>magnetic coupling is nearly canceled out and I think has influence.
>
>What is your reasoning that differential data does not profit from
>twisted pairs?
>
>Thanks

Just that the coupling between flat pairs may not trash the data
enough to matter. It might be easy to try.

I generally use flat cable with a ground (or an AC ground, like a
power supply) between pairs. That's more prudence than known
necessity. It might have less crosstalk than between adjacent twisted
pairs.

Re: Fine pitch twisted pair ribbon cable

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by: legg - Wed, 16 Nov 2022 00:53 UTC

On Tue, 15 Nov 2022 12:05:46 -0800 (PST), whit3rd <whit3rd@gmail.com>
wrote:

>On Tuesday, November 15, 2022 at 4:46:35 AM UTC-8, Uwe Bonnes wrote:
>> Hello,
>>
>> it seems, Hitachi stopped producing their Micro Quick-Twist 0.635 mm
>> pitch twisted pair ribbon cable. Samtec still offer such cables with
>> connectors. Any source for the pure cable?
>
>How about 3M? Not sure about the fine pitch, though.
>
><https://www.3m.com/3M/en_US/p/c/electronics-components/interconnect-products/copper-wire-cable/flat-ribbon/twisted/>

Not twisted.

Re: Fine pitch twisted pair ribbon cable

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Re: Fine pitch twisted pair ribbon cable

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by: John Larkin - Mon, 16 Jan 2023 14:16 UTC

On Tue, 15 Nov 2022 12:05:46 -0800 (PST), whit3rd <whit3rd@gmail.com>
wrote:

It looks like that cable has pairs with identical twist pitch but
alternating twist sign. Unshielded ethernet cables usually have
different pitches in the pairs to minimize crosstalk, at the price of
different prop delay per pair.

The choice to go to twist vs flat cable depends heavily on cable
length and data speeds. Flat is a lot cheaper and easier; just order
your jumpers from Mouser.

Subject	Author
Fine pitch twisted pair ribbon cable	Uwe Bonnes
Re: Fine pitch twisted pair ribbon cable	legg
Re: Fine pitch twisted pair ribbon cable	Uwe Bonnes
Re: Fine pitch twisted pair ribbon cable	legg
Re: Fine pitch twisted pair ribbon cable	John Larkin
Re: Fine pitch twisted pair ribbon cable	Uwe Bonnes
Re: Fine pitch twisted pair ribbon cable	John Larkin
Re: Fine pitch twisted pair ribbon cable	Chris949
Re: Fine pitch twisted pair ribbon cable	whit3rd
Re: Fine pitch twisted pair ribbon cable	legg
Re: Fine pitch twisted pair ribbon cable	John Larkin
Re: Fine pitch twisted pair ribbon cable	Chris949