Michael Schwingen wrote:
> On 2023-01-12, Phil Hobbs <pcdhSpamMeSenseless@electrooptical.net> wrote:
>>
>> The PC-USB thing isn't something I'd consider for expensive gear,
>> because as you say it's brittle and not very future-proof. (Not as bad
>> as oscilloscopes that run Windows, but don't let me get started on that
>> old rabbit trail.)
>
> If you can use it with sigrok, it should be quite future-proof. USB works
> fine if you don't push it to the maximum possible throughput - a USB3
> connection has advantages.
>
> What I like about the USB logic analyzers is that you can record huge
> amounts of data (limited by PC memory, and the software does on-the-fly
> compression) and later zoom in on the details - with a classic analyzer with
> integrated memory, you need to setup triggers beforehand - buf after
> triggering, those can be faster.
>
> What is better depends on the problem you are analyzing.

With our stuff, there are usually three or four boat anchors in use
already, so having the logic analyzer be unobtrusive is a win.

Cheers

Phil "Still trying to figure out that weird ADC thing" Hobbs

--
Dr Philip C D Hobbs
Principal Consultant
ElectroOptical Innovations LLC / Hobbs ElectroOptics
Optics, Electro-optics, Photonics, Analog Electronics
Briarcliff Manor NY 10510

http://electrooptical.net
http://hobbs-eo.com

fredag den 13. januar 2023 kl. 16.42.51 UTC+1 skrev Phil Hobbs:
> Michael Schwingen wrote:
> > On 2023-01-12, Phil Hobbs <pcdhSpamM...@electrooptical.net> wrote:
> >>
> >> The PC-USB thing isn't something I'd consider for expensive gear,
> >> because as you say it's brittle and not very future-proof. (Not as bad
> >> as oscilloscopes that run Windows, but don't let me get started on that
> >> old rabbit trail.)
> >
> > If you can use it with sigrok, it should be quite future-proof. USB works
> > fine if you don't push it to the maximum possible throughput - a USB3
> > connection has advantages.
> >
> > What I like about the USB logic analyzers is that you can record huge
> > amounts of data (limited by PC memory, and the software does on-the-fly
> > compression) and later zoom in on the details - with a classic analyzer with
> > integrated memory, you need to setup triggers beforehand - buf after
> > triggering, those can be faster.
> >
> > What is better depends on the problem you are analyzing.
> With our stuff, there are usually three or four boat anchors in use
> already, so having the logic analyzer be unobtrusive is a win.
>
> Cheers
>
> Phil "Still trying to figure out that weird ADC thing" Hobbs

there must be bits miswired, missing, or shorted

it never recovers, after the glitch the slope/gain/offset looks different

https://electrooptical.net/static/oldsite/www/sed/Glitch.png

Lasse Langwadt Christensen wrote:
> fredag den 13. januar 2023 kl. 16.42.51 UTC+1 skrev Phil Hobbs:
>> Michael Schwingen wrote:
>>> On 2023-01-12, Phil Hobbs <pcdhSpamM...@electrooptical.net> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> The PC-USB thing isn't something I'd consider for expensive gear,
>>>> because as you say it's brittle and not very future-proof. (Not as bad
>>>> as oscilloscopes that run Windows, but don't let me get started on that
>>>> old rabbit trail.)
>>>
>>> If you can use it with sigrok, it should be quite future-proof. USB works
>>> fine if you don't push it to the maximum possible throughput - a USB3
>>> connection has advantages.
>>>
>>> What I like about the USB logic analyzers is that you can record huge
>>> amounts of data (limited by PC memory, and the software does on-the-fly
>>> compression) and later zoom in on the details - with a classic analyzer with
>>> integrated memory, you need to setup triggers beforehand - buf after
>>> triggering, those can be faster.
>>>
>>> What is better depends on the problem you are analyzing.
>> With our stuff, there are usually three or four boat anchors in use
>> already, so having the logic analyzer be unobtrusive is a win.
>>
>> Cheers
>>
>> Phil "Still trying to figure out that weird ADC thing" Hobbs
>
> there must be bits miswired, missing, or shorted
>
> it never recovers, after the glitch the slope/gain/offset looks different
>
> https://electrooptical.net/static/oldsite/www/sed/Glitch.png
>
>
>
Maybe. It's a vendor IP block that they changed around for us, to make
the floor plan long and skinny. All of the bits seem to be changing
independently, though. I'll check for supply current glitches if the
problem is reproducible on another chip.

Cheers

Phil Hobbs

--
Dr Philip C D Hobbs
Principal Consultant
ElectroOptical Innovations LLC / Hobbs ElectroOptics
Optics, Electro-optics, Photonics, Analog Electronics
Briarcliff Manor NY 10510

http://electrooptical.net
http://hobbs-eo.com

On 10-01-2023 23:12, Phil Hobbs wrote:
> We've been using a little 8-bit, 48-MHz USB logic analyzer--a Chinese
> knockoff of a Saleae Logic 8.  It's been pretty handy for characterizing
> the ADC in a bathymetric lidar chip we've been helping design.
>
> It'll stream data forever at 16 MS/s.  However, at higher sample rates
> it quits after ~100k samples.  Sheesh, and we spent eight bucks on it. ;)
>
I cannot get enough instruments. Can you share a link to the one you have?

Klaus Vestergaard Kragelund wrote:
> On 10-01-2023 23:12, Phil Hobbs wrote:
>> We've been using a little 8-bit, 48-MHz USB logic analyzer--a Chinese
>> knockoff of a Saleae Logic 8.  It's been pretty handy for
>> characterizing the ADC in a bathymetric lidar chip we've been helping
>> design.
>>
>> It'll stream data forever at 16 MS/s.  However, at higher sample rates
>> it quits after ~100k samples.  Sheesh, and we spent eight bucks on it. ;)
>>
> I cannot get enough instruments. Can you share a link to the one you have?

It's actually 24 MHz, I misspoke. If you search Amazon for logic
analyzers and sort by price, there are about 20 very similar to these
ones. AFAICT they all have that same Nordic chip in them.

Cheers

Phil Hobbs

--
Dr Philip C D Hobbs
Principal Consultant
ElectroOptical Innovations LLC / Hobbs ElectroOptics
Optics, Electro-optics, Photonics, Analog Electronics
Briarcliff Manor NY 10510

http://electrooptical.net
http://hobbs-eo.com

On Friday, January 13, 2023 at 6:19:46 PM UTC-5, Phil Hobbs wrote:
> Klaus Vestergaard Kragelund wrote:
> > On 10-01-2023 23:12, Phil Hobbs wrote:
> >> We've been using a little 8-bit, 48-MHz USB logic analyzer--a Chinese
> >> knockoff of a Saleae Logic 8. It's been pretty handy for
> >> characterizing the ADC in a bathymetric lidar chip we've been helping
> >> design.
> >>
> >> It'll stream data forever at 16 MS/s. However, at higher sample rates
> >> it quits after ~100k samples. Sheesh, and we spent eight bucks on it. ;)
> >>
> > I cannot get enough instruments. Can you share a link to the one you have?
> It's actually 24 MHz, I misspoke. If you search Amazon for logic
> analyzers and sort by price, there are about 20 very similar to these
> ones. AFAICT they all have that same Nordic chip in them.
> Cheers
>
> Phil Hobbs
>
> --
> Dr Philip C D Hobbs
> Principal Consultant
> ElectroOptical Innovations LLC / Hobbs ElectroOptics
> Optics, Electro-optics, Photonics, Analog Electronics
> Briarcliff Manor NY 10510
>
> http://electrooptical.net
> http://hobbs-eo.com

agreed, but a name would save a lot of inference....

On Friday, January 13, 2023 at 4:51:42 PM UTC-8, jjhu...@gmail.com wrote:
> On Friday, January 13, 2023 at 6:19:46 PM UTC-5, Phil Hobbs wrote:
> > Klaus Vestergaard Kragelund wrote:
> > > On 10-01-2023 23:12, Phil Hobbs wrote:
> > >> We've been using a little 8-bit, 48-MHz USB logic analyzer--a Chinese
> > >> knockoff of a Saleae Logic 8. It's been pretty handy for
> > >> characterizing the ADC in a bathymetric lidar chip we've been helping
> > >> design.
> > >>
> > >> It'll stream data forever at 16 MS/s. However, at higher sample rates
> > >> it quits after ~100k samples. Sheesh, and we spent eight bucks on it. ;)
> > >>
> > > I cannot get enough instruments. Can you share a link to the one you have?
> > It's actually 24 MHz, I misspoke. If you search Amazon for logic
> > analyzers and sort by price, there are about 20 very similar to these
> > ones. AFAICT they all have that same Nordic chip in them.
> > Cheers
> >
> > Phil Hobbs
> >
> > --
> > Dr Philip C D Hobbs
> > Principal Consultant
> > ElectroOptical Innovations LLC / Hobbs ElectroOptics
> > Optics, Electro-optics, Photonics, Analog Electronics
> > Briarcliff Manor NY 10510
> >
> > http://electrooptical.net
> > http://hobbs-eo.com
> agreed, but a name would save a lot of inference....

You can sort out the riff-raff by searching for "64 channel". This eliminates most, if not all, of the low end logic analyzers. For instance, I found:
https://files.thelabeshop.com/2981/brochure.pdf
https://www.acute.com.tw/logic-analyzer-en/product/logic-analyzer/la3000

fredag den 13. januar 2023 kl. 21.41.34 UTC+1 skrev Klaus Kragelund:
> On 10-01-2023 23:12, Phil Hobbs wrote:
> > We've been using a little 8-bit, 48-MHz USB logic analyzer--a Chinese
> > knockoff of a Saleae Logic 8. It's been pretty handy for characterizing
> > the ADC in a bathymetric lidar chip we've been helping design.
> >
> > It'll stream data forever at 16 MS/s. However, at higher sample rates
> > it quits after ~100k samples. Sheesh, and we spent eight bucks on it. ;)
> >
> I cannot get enough instruments. Can you share a link to the one you have?

something like this: https://let-elektronik.dk/shop/2220-logic-analyzers/18627-usb-logic-analyzer---24mhz8-channel/

Three Jeeps wrote:
> On Friday, January 13, 2023 at 6:19:46 PM UTC-5, Phil Hobbs wrote:
>> Klaus Vestergaard Kragelund wrote:
>>> On 10-01-2023 23:12, Phil Hobbs wrote:
>>>> We've been using a little 8-bit, 48-MHz USB logic analyzer--a Chinese
>>>> knockoff of a Saleae Logic 8. It's been pretty handy for
>>>> characterizing the ADC in a bathymetric lidar chip we've been helping
>>>> design.
>>>>
>>>> It'll stream data forever at 16 MS/s. However, at higher sample rates
>>>> it quits after ~100k samples. Sheesh, and we spent eight bucks on it. ;)
>>>>
>>> I cannot get enough instruments. Can you share a link to the one you have?
>> It's actually 24 MHz, I misspoke. If you search Amazon for logic
>> analyzers and sort by price, there are about 20 very similar to these
>> ones. AFAICT they all have that same Nordic chip in them.
>> Cheers

>
> agreed, but a name would save a lot of inference....
>

Dunno exactly--I didn't buy them.

Cheers

Phil Hobbs

--
Dr Philip C D Hobbs
Principal Consultant
ElectroOptical Innovations LLC / Hobbs ElectroOptics
Optics, Electro-optics, Photonics, Analog Electronics
Briarcliff Manor NY 10510

http://electrooptical.net
http://hobbs-eo.com

On 14-01-2023 14:52, Lasse Langwadt Christensen wrote:
> fredag den 13. januar 2023 kl. 21.41.34 UTC+1 skrev Klaus Kragelund:
>> On 10-01-2023 23:12, Phil Hobbs wrote:
>>> We've been using a little 8-bit, 48-MHz USB logic analyzer--a Chinese
>>> knockoff of a Saleae Logic 8. It's been pretty handy for characterizing
>>> the ADC in a bathymetric lidar chip we've been helping design.
>>>
>>> It'll stream data forever at 16 MS/s. However, at higher sample rates
>>> it quits after ~100k samples. Sheesh, and we spent eight bucks on it. ;)
>>>
>> I cannot get enough instruments. Can you share a link to the one you have?
>
> something like this: https://let-elektronik.dk/shop/2220-logic-analyzers/18627-usb-logic-analyzer---24mhz8-channel/

Nice, thanks. And even a Danish site, only 100km from my location :-)

On 2023-01-14 14:52, Lasse Langwadt Christensen wrote:
> fredag den 13. januar 2023 kl. 21.41.34 UTC+1 skrev Klaus Kragelund:
>> On 10-01-2023 23:12, Phil Hobbs wrote:
>>> We've been using a little 8-bit, 48-MHz USB logic analyzer--a Chinese
>>> knockoff of a Saleae Logic 8. It's been pretty handy for characterizing
>>> the ADC in a bathymetric lidar chip we've been helping design.
>>>
>>> It'll stream data forever at 16 MS/s. However, at higher sample rates
>>> it quits after ~100k samples. Sheesh, and we spent eight bucks on it. ;)
>>>
>> I cannot get enough instruments. Can you share a link to the one you have?
>
> something like this: https://let-elektronik.dk/shop/2220-logic-analyzers/18627-usb-logic-analyzer---24mhz8-channel/

Or like this, exactly what Phil describes:
https://www.google.com/search?q=Usb+Logic+Analyzer+24Mhz+8+channel+aliexpress
https://nl.aliexpress.com/item/1005002991193528.html

They actually run a bit faster than 16 Msample/s, I get about 24 Msample/s.
They go for less than EUR 10, including shipping. I have two, just in case I blow up one.

Arie