Gee, all this around Harran plateau (Anatolia) is a massive thing.
This gets attention, but still not the attention it deserves. Only 5 %
is excavated. At this tempo, the whole thing will be excavated 5,000
year from now.

--
https://groups.google.com/g/human-evolution
human-evolution@googlegroups.com

On 7.11.2021. 10:41, Mario Petrinovic wrote:
>         Gee, all this around Harran plateau (Anatolia) is a massive
> thing. This gets attention, but still not the attention it deserves.
> Only 5 % is excavated. At this tempo, the whole thing will be excavated
> 5,000 year from now.

Oh, wrong calculation. It'll be excavated 500 years from now. Alright,
not that bad, lol.

--
https://groups.google.com/g/human-evolution
human-evolution@googlegroups.com

Mario Petrinovic wrote:
> Gee, all this around Harran plateau (Anatolia) is a massive thing.
> This gets attention, but still not the attention it deserves. Only 5 %
> is excavated. At this tempo, the whole thing will be excavated 5,000
> year from now.

It's been talked here, mostly brought up by trolls, but the fact is there
isn't much we can say. There's endless speculating on what it was,
temples or something else, and I personally don't think (in that
context) it was any one thing.

To me it looks like it was spawned by a proto agriculture people. They
were probably migrating with the seasons, maybe herding animals,
and harvested the wild grains in the region seasonally.

In another thread, speaking about the levant, I cited a documentary
claiming that, harvesting such grains, one person could collect
enough to feed FOUR for an entire year in only a matter of weeks...

So they needed someplace to store that excess.

Enterm: Gobekli Tepe!

And they probably needed to protect it from everything from vermin,
spoilage to thieves so I couldn't imagine them NOT including a
religious element...

And from our point of view it was all built practically at once, but for
all we know they had forgotten why they were even doing it. Maybe
by the end there they just knew it was something that their ancestors
did, and they had to do it OR ELSE...

Or maybe if a storage facility was pronounced "Unclean" for some
reason they had to build a new one. Or they just built new ones
periodically. I dunno.

But that's my 2 cents, my working theory: They are the product of
a proto agricultural society & fulfilled the need for storage of the
excess grain.

Want to take this further? It was for their animals. But that's
deliberately wandering out on the speculation limb...

-- --

https://jtem.tumblr.com/post/667178430374215680

On 7.11.2021. 22:36, I Envy JTEM wrote:
> Mario Petrinovic wrote:
>> Gee, all this around Harran plateau (Anatolia) is a massive thing.
>> This gets attention, but still not the attention it deserves. Only 5 %
>> is excavated. At this tempo, the whole thing will be excavated 5,000
>> year from now.
>
> It's been talked here, mostly brought up by trolls, but the fact is there
> isn't much we can say. There's endless speculating on what it was,
> temples or something else, and I personally don't think (in that
> context) it was any one thing.
>
> To me it looks like it was spawned by a proto agriculture people. They
> were probably migrating with the seasons, maybe herding animals,
> and harvested the wild grains in the region seasonally.
>
> In another thread, speaking about the levant, I cited a documentary
> claiming that, harvesting such grains, one person could collect
> enough to feed FOUR for an entire year in only a matter of weeks...
>
> So they needed someplace to store that excess.
>
> Enterm: Gobekli Tepe!
>
> And they probably needed to protect it from everything from vermin,
> spoilage to thieves so I couldn't imagine them NOT including a
> religious element...
>
> And from our point of view it was all built practically at once, but for
> all we know they had forgotten why they were even doing it. Maybe
> by the end there they just knew it was something that their ancestors
> did, and they had to do it OR ELSE...
>
> Or maybe if a storage facility was pronounced "Unclean" for some
> reason they had to build a new one. Or they just built new ones
> periodically. I dunno.
>
> But that's my 2 cents, my working theory: They are the product of
> a proto agricultural society & fulfilled the need for storage of the
> excess grain.
>
> Want to take this further? It was for their animals. But that's
> deliberately wandering out on the speculation limb...

Ok, thanks. I don't know that much about it, but if you take a look at
Harran plateau, it is obvious that this is agricultural. It simply
screams "agricultural".

--
https://groups.google.com/g/human-evolution
human-evolution@googlegroups.com

On 8.11.2021. 1:22, Mario Petrinovic wrote:
> On 7.11.2021. 22:36, I Envy JTEM wrote:
>> Mario Petrinovic wrote:
>>> Gee, all this around Harran plateau (Anatolia) is a massive thing.
>>> This gets attention, but still not the attention it deserves. Only 5 %
>>> is excavated. At this tempo, the whole thing will be excavated 5,000
>>> year from now.
>>
>> It's been talked here, mostly brought up by trolls, but the fact is there
>> isn't much we can say. There's endless speculating on what it was,
>> temples or something else, and I personally don't think (in that
>> context) it was any one thing.
>>
>> To me it looks like it was spawned by a proto agriculture people. They
>> were probably migrating with the seasons, maybe herding animals,
>> and harvested the wild grains in the region seasonally.
>>
>> In another thread, speaking about the levant, I cited a documentary
>> claiming that, harvesting such grains, one person could collect
>> enough to feed FOUR for an entire year in only a matter of weeks...
>>
>> So they needed someplace to store that excess.
>>
>> Enterm:  Gobekli Tepe!
>>
>> And they probably needed to protect it from everything from vermin,
>> spoilage to thieves so I couldn't imagine them NOT including a
>> religious element...
>>
>> And from our point of view it was all built practically at once, but for
>> all we know they had forgotten why they were even doing it. Maybe
>> by the end there they just knew it was something that their ancestors
>> did, and they had to do it OR ELSE...
>>
>> Or maybe if a storage facility was pronounced "Unclean" for some
>> reason they had to build a new one. Or they just built new ones
>> periodically. I dunno.
>>
>> But that's my 2 cents, my working theory:  They are the product of
>> a proto agricultural society & fulfilled the need for storage of the
>> excess grain.
>>
>> Want to take this further?  It was for their animals. But that's
>> deliberately wandering out on the speculation limb...
>
>         Ok, thanks. I don't know that much about it, but if you take a
> look at Harran plateau, it is obvious that this is agricultural. It
> simply screams "agricultural".

Actually, when I look at it closer, it has ideal position to develop
just that. It is agricultural plateau, but it is upstream. At that time
people were mostly separated, connected only by rivers, sea and lakes.
And this plateau, as much as I can see, is surrounded by bare land.
So, you have separated valley, which is upstream. No connection to it
by river (it is upstream, so it takes advantage of having water, but
this water isn't accessible by others), lake, or sea. Surrounded by
pretty bare hills. It can feed a lot of people, yet, those people cannot
be attacked from the outside.

--
https://groups.google.com/g/human-evolution
human-evolution@googlegroups.com

On 8.11.2021. 1:22, Mario Petrinovic wrote:
> On 7.11.2021. 22:36, I Envy JTEM wrote:
>> Mario Petrinovic wrote:
>>> Gee, all this around Harran plateau (Anatolia) is a massive thing.
>>> This gets attention, but still not the attention it deserves. Only 5 %
>>> is excavated. At this tempo, the whole thing will be excavated 5,000
>>> year from now.
>>
>> It's been talked here, mostly brought up by trolls, but the fact is there
>> isn't much we can say. There's endless speculating on what it was,
>> temples or something else, and I personally don't think (in that
>> context) it was any one thing.
>>
>> To me it looks like it was spawned by a proto agriculture people. They
>> were probably migrating with the seasons, maybe herding animals,
>> and harvested the wild grains in the region seasonally.
>>
>> In another thread, speaking about the levant, I cited a documentary
>> claiming that, harvesting such grains, one person could collect
>> enough to feed FOUR for an entire year in only a matter of weeks...
>>
>> So they needed someplace to store that excess.
>>
>> Enterm:  Gobekli Tepe!
>>
>> And they probably needed to protect it from everything from vermin,
>> spoilage to thieves so I couldn't imagine them NOT including a
>> religious element...
>>
>> And from our point of view it was all built practically at once, but for
>> all we know they had forgotten why they were even doing it. Maybe
>> by the end there they just knew it was something that their ancestors
>> did, and they had to do it OR ELSE...
>>
>> Or maybe if a storage facility was pronounced "Unclean" for some
>> reason they had to build a new one. Or they just built new ones
>> periodically. I dunno.
>>
>> But that's my 2 cents, my working theory:  They are the product of
>> a proto agricultural society & fulfilled the need for storage of the
>> excess grain.
>>
>> Want to take this further?  It was for their animals. But that's
>> deliberately wandering out on the speculation limb...
>
>         Ok, thanks. I don't know that much about it, but if you take a
> look at Harran plateau, it is obvious that this is agricultural. It
> simply screams "agricultural".

I mean, even if hills aren't bare, the density of population should be
much greater on the plateau that on the surrounding hills. This is
really unique place with such characteristics.

--
https://groups.google.com/g/human-evolution
human-evolution@googlegroups.com

Mario Petrinovic wrote:

> Ok, thanks. I don't know that much about it, but if you take a look at
> Harran plateau, it is obvious that this is agricultural. It simply
> screams "agricultural".

I've heard that said before. Believe me, agriculture is not my unique idea. I have
read sources talking as you now do, and insisting that it would have been rich
in pre agricultural grasses i.e. wild grains.

Storage would have been a necessity even if they weren't migrating.

-- --

https://jtem.tumblr.com/post/667178430374215680