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tech / sci.lang / Re: Movie title Inglorious Bastards is complimentary!

SubjectAuthor
* Movie title Inglorious Bastards is complimentary!Dingbat
+* Re: Movie title Inglorious Bastards is complimentary!Peter T. Daniels
|`* Re: Movie title Inglorious Bastards is complimentary!Quinn C
| `* Re: Movie title Inglorious Bastards is complimentary!Ross Clark
|  `* Re: Movie title Inglorious Bastards is complimentary!Dingbat
|   `- Re: Movie title Inglorious Bastards is complimentary!Daud Deden
`* Re: Movie title Inglorious Bastards is complimentary!António Marques
 `* Re: Movie title Inglorious Bastards is complimentary!Dingbat
  +* Re: Movie title Inglorious Bastards is complimentary!Ross Clark
  |`- Re: Movie title Inglorious Bastards is complimentary!Peter T. Daniels
  `* Re: Movie title Inglorious Bastards is complimentary!wugi
   `- Re: Movie title Inglorious Bastards is complimentary!wugi

1
Movie title Inglorious Bastards is complimentary!

<367393a7-aee0-4695-9364-0fd7d69ccd44n@googlegroups.com>

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Subject: Movie title Inglorious Bastards is complimentary!
From: ranjit_m...@yahoo.com (Dingbat)
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 by: Dingbat - Sun, 25 Apr 2021 02:11 UTC

Movie title Inglorious Bastards is complimentary!
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frederick_Mayer_(spy)

Inglorious Bastards is a complimentary nickname designating a group of
US spies as heroes. One of them, Frederick Mayer, brought about the
German surrender at Innsbruck.

I don't know any other language where people are complimented by
receiving negative sounding names. Is there another such language?

The Devil's Brigade is another movie title about a brigade of heroes,
not a brigade of devils or a brigade commanded by the Devil as
would be suggested if literally translated to the Indian languages I
know.

Re: Movie title Inglorious Bastards is complimentary!

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Subject: Re: Movie title Inglorious Bastards is complimentary!
From: gramma...@verizon.net (Peter T. Daniels)
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 by: Peter T. Daniels - Sun, 25 Apr 2021 13:31 UTC

On Saturday, April 24, 2021 at 10:11:12 PM UTC-4, Dingbat wrote:

> Movie title Inglorious Bastards is complimentary!
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frederick_Mayer_(spy)

There is no such movie. Please spell it correctly.

> Inglorious Bastards is a complimentary nickname designating a group of
> US spies as heroes. One of them, Frederick Mayer, brought about the
> German surrender at Innsbruck.
>
> I don't know any other language where people are complimented by
> receiving negative sounding names. Is there another such language?
>
> The Devil's Brigade is another movie title about a brigade of heroes,
> not a brigade of devils or a brigade commanded by the Devil as
> would be suggested if literally translated to the Indian languages I
> know.

Another movie: The Dirty Dozen.

Re: Movie title Inglorious Bastards is complimentary!

<s63rai$65e$1@dont-email.me>

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From: antonio...@sapo.pt (António Marques)
Newsgroups: sci.lang
Subject: Re: Movie title Inglorious Bastards is complimentary!
Date: Sun, 25 Apr 2021 13:37:22 -0000 (UTC)
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 by: António Marques - Sun, 25 Apr 2021 13:37 UTC

Dingbat <ranjit_mathews@yahoo.com> wrote:
> Movie title Inglorious Bastards is complimentary!
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frederick_Mayer_(spy)
>
> Inglorious Bastards is a complimentary nickname designating a group of
> US spies as heroes. One of them, Frederick Mayer, brought about the
> German surrender at Innsbruck.
>
> I don't know any other language where people are complimented by
> receiving negative sounding names. Is there another such language?

I would imagine 'all of them'.

>
> The Devil's Brigade is another movie title about a brigade of heroes,
> not a brigade of devils or a brigade commanded by the Devil as
> would be suggested if literally translated to the Indian languages I
> know.
>

Re: Movie title Inglorious Bastards is complimentary!

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Subject: Re: Movie title Inglorious Bastards is complimentary!
From: ranjit_m...@yahoo.com (Dingbat)
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 by: Dingbat - Mon, 26 Apr 2021 07:21 UTC

On Sunday, April 25, 2021 at 6:37:24 AM UTC-7, António Marques wrote:
> Dingbat <ranjit_...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> > Movie title Inglorious Bastards is complimentary!
> > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frederick_Mayer_(spy)
> >
> > Inglorious Bastards is a complimentary nickname designating a group of
> > US spies as heroes. One of them, Frederick Mayer, brought about the
> > German surrender at Innsbruck.
> >
> > I don't know any other language where people are complimented by
> > receiving negative sounding names. Is there another such language?

> I would imagine 'all of them'.

A negative sounding nickname is uncomplimentary in the Indian
languages I know. Can you give an example in a language other
than English where it can be complimentary?
>
> > The Devil's Brigade is another movie title about a brigade of heroes,
> > not a brigade of devils or a brigade commanded by the Devil as
> > would be suggested if literally translated to the Indian languages I
> > know.
> >

Re: Movie title Inglorious Bastards is complimentary!

<s65uke$m1j$1@dont-email.me>

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From: benli...@ihug.co.nz (Ross Clark)
Newsgroups: sci.lang
Subject: Re: Movie title Inglorious Bastards is complimentary!
Date: Mon, 26 Apr 2021 20:45:59 +1200
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 by: Ross Clark - Mon, 26 Apr 2021 08:45 UTC

On 26/04/2021 7:21 p.m., Dingbat wrote:
> On Sunday, April 25, 2021 at 6:37:24 AM UTC-7, António Marques wrote:
>> Dingbat <ranjit_...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>> Movie title Inglorious Bastards is complimentary!
>>> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frederick_Mayer_(spy)
>>>
>>> Inglorious Bastards is a complimentary nickname designating a group of
>>> US spies as heroes. One of them, Frederick Mayer, brought about the
>>> German surrender at Innsbruck.
>>>
>>> I don't know any other language where people are complimented by
>>> receiving negative sounding names. Is there another such language?
>
>> I would imagine 'all of them'.
>
> A negative sounding nickname is uncomplimentary in the Indian
> languages I know. Can you give an example in a language other
> than English where it can be complimentary?
>>
>>> The Devil's Brigade is another movie title about a brigade of heroes,
>>> not a brigade of devils or a brigade commanded by the Devil as
>>> would be suggested if literally translated to the Indian languages I
>>> know.
>>>

It was at Anzio that the Germans dubbed the 1st Special Service Force
the "Black Devils." There is no record of any German ever referring to
the Force as "The Devil's Brigade". They were referred to as "black"
devils because the brigade's members smeared their faces with black boot
polish for their covert operations in the dark of the night.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/First_Special_Service_Force

In other words, they were named "devils" by their enemies, and
eventually, ironically, accepted the label. A "devil" can, of course, be
someone who is exceptionally clever, especially at deception and
concealment. Surely that sort of subtlety is not incomprehensible to
Indians?

Re: Movie title Inglorious Bastards is complimentary!

<a595349e-dbd0-4dba-904d-80a7b02ed729n@googlegroups.com>

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Subject: Re: Movie title Inglorious Bastards is complimentary!
From: gramma...@verizon.net (Peter T. Daniels)
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 by: Peter T. Daniels - Mon, 26 Apr 2021 15:54 UTC

On Monday, April 26, 2021 at 4:46:09 AM UTC-4, benl...@ihug.co.nz wrote:
> On 26/04/2021 7:21 p.m., Dingbat wrote:
> > On Sunday, April 25, 2021 at 6:37:24 AM UTC-7, António Marques wrote:
> >> Dingbat <ranjit_...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> >>> Movie title Inglorious Bastards is complimentary!
> >>> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frederick_Mayer_(spy)
> >>>
> >>> Inglorious Bastards is a complimentary nickname designating a group of
> >>> US spies as heroes. One of them, Frederick Mayer, brought about the
> >>> German surrender at Innsbruck.
> >>>
> >>> I don't know any other language where people are complimented by
> >>> receiving negative sounding names. Is there another such language?
> >
> >> I would imagine 'all of them'.
> >
> > A negative sounding nickname is uncomplimentary in the Indian
> > languages I know. Can you give an example in a language other
> > than English where it can be complimentary?
> >>
> >>> The Devil's Brigade is another movie title about a brigade of heroes,
> >>> not a brigade of devils or a brigade commanded by the Devil as
> >>> would be suggested if literally translated to the Indian languages I
> >>> know.
> >>>
> It was at Anzio that the Germans dubbed the 1st Special Service Force
> the "Black Devils." There is no record of any German ever referring to
> the Force as "The Devil's Brigade". They were referred to as "black"
> devils because the brigade's members smeared their faces with black boot
> polish for their covert operations in the dark of the night.

That sort of name can also bespeak grudging respect for the prowess
of the enemy -- at least in movies.

De Paul University, (formerly) a basketball powerhouse in Chicago and
nationally, is a Catholic institution that calls its teams the Blue Demons.
This claims that it's because when the name was changed from St. Vincent's
in 1907, the teams wore shirts with a big D so they were the "D-men."

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DePaul_Blue_Demons#Nickname

St. Vincent's was founded by Vincentian Fathers, followers of
St. Vincent de Paul. I wonder if he came to someone in a dream
and told them he'd rather they use a more formal form of his name.

> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/First_Special_Service_Force
>
> In other words, they were named "devils" by their enemies, and
> eventually, ironically, accepted the label. A "devil" can, of course, be
> someone who is exceptionally clever, especially at deception and
> concealment. Surely that sort of subtlety is not incomprehensible to
> Indians?

Re: Movie title Inglorious Bastards is complimentary!

<s6785r$qtf$1@gioia.aioe.org>

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From: bro...@wugi.be (wugi)
Newsgroups: sci.lang
Subject: Re: Movie title Inglorious Bastards is complimentary!
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 by: wugi - Mon, 26 Apr 2021 20:35 UTC

Op 26/04/2021 om 9:21 schreef Dingbat:
> On Sunday, April 25, 2021 at 6:37:24 AM UTC-7, António Marques wrote:
>> Dingbat <ranjit_...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>> Movie title Inglorious Bastards is complimentary!
>>> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frederick_Mayer_(spy)
>>>
>>> Inglorious Bastards is a complimentary nickname designating a group of
>>> US spies as heroes. One of them, Frederick Mayer, brought about the
>>> German surrender at Innsbruck.
>>>
>>> I don't know any other language where people are complimented by
>>> receiving negative sounding names. Is there another such language?
>> I would imagine 'all of them'.
> A negative sounding nickname is uncomplimentary in the Indian
> languages I know. Can you give an example in a language other
> than English where it can be complimentary?

It can be through "recuperation" of an insulting epithet. See for
instance our "Geuzen": https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Geuzen

>>> The Devil's Brigade is another movie title about a brigade of heroes,
>>> not a brigade of devils or a brigade commanded by the Devil as
>>> would be suggested if literally translated to the Indian languages I
>>> know.

The Red Devils is the national soccer team in Belgium:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Belgium_national_football_team, I doubt
that would be the only example.

Some sport champions get nicknames like "the butcher of XXX"; our
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eddy_Merckx was called "De Kannibaal" (see
4th para).

--

guido wugi

Re: Movie title Inglorious Bastards is complimentary!

<s67911$17j3$1@gioia.aioe.org>

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From: bro...@wugi.be (wugi)
Newsgroups: sci.lang
Subject: Re: Movie title Inglorious Bastards is complimentary!
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 by: wugi - Mon, 26 Apr 2021 20:49 UTC

Op 26/04/2021 om 22:35 schreef wugi:

> It can be through "recuperation" of an insulting epithet. See for
> instance our "Geuzen": https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Geuzen

Probably a "Geuzenstraat" in Brussels, with a brewery that discovered
the champagnoise method, is at the origin of our precious Belgian beer
brand https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gueuze. A Gueuze beer is a blend of
various vintage Lambics, brewed by 'spontaneous fermentation' and after
refermenting the mix champagnewise in its bottle.

--

guido wugi

Re: Movie title Inglorious Bastards is complimentary!

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Date: Mon, 26 Apr 2021 19:58:07 -0400
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 by: Quinn C - Mon, 26 Apr 2021 23:58 UTC

* Peter T. Daniels:

> On Saturday, April 24, 2021 at 10:11:12 PM UTC-4, Dingbat wrote:
>
>> Movie title Inglorious Bastards is complimentary!
>> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frederick_Mayer_(spy)
>
> There is no such movie. Please spell it correctly.

There is a movie called "The Inglorious Bastards", in the original "Quel
maledetto treno blindato", a loose remake of ...
> Another movie: The Dirty Dozen.

this one, and title inspiration for the later Inglorious Basterds.

--
Learning the rules that govern intelligible speech is an
inculcation into normalized language, where the price of not
conforming is the loss of intelligibility itself.
-- Judith Butler

Re: Movie title Inglorious Bastards is complimentary!

<s688o1$6mc$1@dont-email.me>

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From: benli...@ihug.co.nz (Ross Clark)
Newsgroups: sci.lang
Subject: Re: Movie title Inglorious Bastards is complimentary!
Date: Tue, 27 Apr 2021 17:50:51 +1200
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 by: Ross Clark - Tue, 27 Apr 2021 05:50 UTC

On 27/04/2021 11:58 a.m., Quinn C wrote:
> * Peter T. Daniels:
>
>> On Saturday, April 24, 2021 at 10:11:12 PM UTC-4, Dingbat wrote:
>>
>>> Movie title Inglorious Bastards is complimentary!
>>> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frederick_Mayer_(spy)
>>
>> There is no such movie. Please spell it correctly.
>
> There is a movie called "The Inglorious Bastards", in the original "Quel
> maledetto treno blindato", a loose remake of ...
>
>> Another movie: The Dirty Dozen.
>
> this one, and title inspiration for the later Inglorious Basterds.

Sorry, still wrong. It's "Inglourious". And no "The".
It's official "Quentin Tarantino Spelling".

Re: Movie title Inglorious Bastards is complimentary!

<2d162ca7-f20a-4d5f-b740-075c8536ae7an@googlegroups.com>

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Subject: Re: Movie title Inglorious Bastards is complimentary!
From: ranjit_m...@yahoo.com (Dingbat)
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 by: Dingbat - Wed, 28 Apr 2021 04:16 UTC

On Monday, April 26, 2021 at 10:51:00 PM UTC-7, benl...@ihug.co.nz wrote:
> On 27/04/2021 11:58 a.m., Quinn C wrote:
> > * Peter T. Daniels:
> >
> >> On Saturday, April 24, 2021 at 10:11:12 PM UTC-4, Dingbat wrote:
> >>
> >>> Movie title Inglorious Bastards is complimentary!
> >>> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frederick_Mayer_(spy)
> >>
> >> There is no such movie. Please spell it correctly.
> >
> > There is a movie called "The Inglorious Bastards", in the original "Quel
> > maledetto treno blindato", a loose remake of ...
> >
> >> Another movie: The Dirty Dozen.
> >
> > this one, and title inspiration for the later Inglorious Basterds.
> Sorry, still wrong. It's "Inglourious". And no "The".
> It's official "Quentin Tarantino Spelling".

They're not given to glowering?

Adj. 1. glowering - showing a brooding ill humor; "a dark scowl"; "the proverbially dour New England Puritan"; "a glum, hopeless shrug"; "he sat in moody silence"; "a morose and unsociable manner"; "a saturnine, almost misanthropic young genius"- Bruce Bliven; "a sour temper"; "a sullen crowd" | <https://www.thefreedictionary.com/glowering>

Re: Movie title Inglorious Bastards is complimentary!

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Subject: Re: Movie title Inglorious Bastards is complimentary!
From: daud.de...@gmail.com (Daud Deden)
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 by: Daud Deden - Wed, 28 Apr 2021 15:17 UTC

On Wednesday, April 28, 2021 at 12:16:24 AM UTC-4, Dingbat wrote:
> On Monday, April 26, 2021 at 10:51:00 PM UTC-7, benl...@ihug.co.nz wrote:
> > On 27/04/2021 11:58 a.m., Quinn C wrote:
> > > * Peter T. Daniels:
> > >
> > >> On Saturday, April 24, 2021 at 10:11:12 PM UTC-4, Dingbat wrote:
> > >>
> > >>> Movie title Inglorious Bastards is complimentary!
> > >>> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frederick_Mayer_(spy)
> > >>
> > >> There is no such movie. Please spell it correctly.
> > >
> > > There is a movie called "The Inglorious Bastards", in the original "Quel
> > > maledetto treno blindato", a loose remake of ...
> > >
> > >> Another movie: The Dirty Dozen.
> > >
> > > this one, and title inspiration for the later Inglorious Basterds.
> > Sorry, still wrong. It's "Inglourious". And no "The".
> > It's official "Quentin Tarantino Spelling".
> They're not given to glowering?
>
> Adj. 1. glowering - showing a brooding ill humor; "a dark scowl"; "the proverbially dour New England Puritan"; "a glum, hopeless shrug"; "he sat in moody silence"; "a morose and unsociable manner"; "a saturnine, almost misanthropic young genius"- Bruce Bliven; "a sour temper"; "a sullen crowd" | <https://www.thefreedictionary.com/glowering>

Glorious ~ glow refers to sunlit dome exterior.
Glower refers to dome effect (darkened interior).

Glower ~ glum ~ gloom.ily ~ dark.en = (men)gelap@Mly = mela@Grk = nigra@Ltn = monguoluo@PPygmy: en.dome/dome.shield < (njuambuaNGDUALUA)+p via ngongo foliage shingling frame of dome. During expansion from rainforest, broadleaf shingles were replaced by savanna thatch or reeds/sedges or animal hide [hut/hue/hew] coverings.

hide (v.1)

Old English hydan (transitive and intransitive) "to hide, conceal; preserve; hide oneself; bury a corpse," from West Germanic *hudjan (source also of Middle Dutch, Middle Low German huden), from suffixed form of PIE *keudh- (source also of Greek keuthein "to hide, conceal"), from root *(s)keu- "to cover, conceal."

hide (n.1)

"skin of a large animal," Old English hyd "a hide, a skin," from Proto-Germanic *hudiz (source also of Old Norse huð, Old Frisian hed, Middle Dutch huut, Dutch huid, Old High German hut, German Haut "skin"), from PIE root *(s)keu- "to cover, conceal."

Related prehistorically to Old English verb hydan "to hide" (see hide (v.1)), the common notion being of "covering." The alliterative pairing of hide and hair (often negative, hide nor hair) was in Middle English (early 15c.), but earlier and more common was hide ne hewe, literally "skin and complexion ('hue')" (c. 1200).

hide (n.2)

a measure of land (obsolete), Old English hid "hide of land," earlier higid, from hiw- "family," from or related to hiwan "household," hiwo "a husband, master of a household," from Proto-Germanic *hiwido-, from PIE *keiwo- (source also of Latin civis "citizen"), from PIE root *kei- (1) "to lie," also forming words for "bed, couch," and with a secondary sense of "beloved, dear."

The notion was of "amount of land needed to feed one free family [household= hut] and dependents," usually 100 or 120 acres, but the amount could be as little as 60, depending on the quality of the land. Often also defined as "as much land as could be tilled by one plow in a year." Translated in Latin as familia.

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