I happened upon this Quora question
https://de.quora.com/Was-ist-die-Etymologie-von-Buch?,
and the answer referring to this
http://www.buechersammler.de/woher-stammt-das-wort-buch/
which seemed farfetched to me.

But the Dutch site
https://etymologiebank.nl/trefwoord/boek1
goes in the same sense, though the English
https://www.etymonline.com/search?q=book
seems to be 'aware of nothing' ;)

Opinions? (I still rather believe in the beech link).

--

guido wugi

On Friday, June 18, 2021 at 9:59:36 AM UTC-4, wugi wrote:
> I happened upon this Quora question
> https://de.quora.com/Was-ist-die-Etymologie-von-Buch?,
> and the answer referring to this
> http://www.buechersammler.de/woher-stammt-das-wort-buch/
> which seemed farfetched to me.
>
> But the Dutch site
> https://etymologiebank.nl/trefwoord/boek1
> goes in the same sense, though the English
> https://www.etymonline.com/search?q=book
> seems to be 'aware of nothing' ;)
>
> Opinions? (I still rather believe in the beech link).

Quora demanded that I use Facebook or something else to
see the 92 replies, but the second one seems unlikely.

What's wrong with "beech"?

If someone asks you the IE word for 'write', don't bite.

Op 18/06/2021 om 17:08 schreef Peter T. Daniels:
> On Friday, June 18, 2021 at 9:59:36 AM UTC-4, wugi wrote:
>> I happened upon this Quora question
>> https://de.quora.com/Was-ist-die-Etymologie-von-Buch?,
>> and the answer referring to this
>> http://www.buechersammler.de/woher-stammt-das-wort-buch/
>> which seemed farfetched to me.
>>
>> But the Dutch site
>> https://etymologiebank.nl/trefwoord/boek1
>> goes in the same sense, though the English
>> https://www.etymonline.com/search?q=book
>> seems to be 'aware of nothing' ;)
>>
>> Opinions? (I still rather believe in the beech link).
> Quora demanded that I use Facebook or something else to

Sorry, I thought Quora was freely readable.
(As for registration, it's a complete mystery to me how you'd register
and, moreover, unregister. I managed somehow but don't know how. After
'cleaning up' memory from Chrome etc, I'm usually disconnected and
Chrome knows only a dummy profile I'd made when trying to reconnect and
now can't get rid of anymore. After a while, responding to "Quora
suggestion" mails, I usually get reconnected. How? oh well.)

But here I see only one reply to the question, and merely giving the
second link.

> see the 92 replies, but the second one seems unlikely.
>
> What's wrong with "beech"?

Nothing AFAIC. But see other "insights", so it seems contageous...

> If someone asks you the IE word for 'write', don't bite.

;)

--

guido wugi

On Friday, June 18, 2021 at 9:59:36 AM UTC-4, wugi wrote:
> I happened upon this Quora question
> https://de.quora.com/Was-ist-die-Etymologie-von-Buch?,
> and the answer referring to this
> http://www.buechersammler.de/woher-stammt-das-wort-buch/
> which seemed farfetched to me.
>
> But the Dutch site
> https://etymologiebank.nl/trefwoord/boek1
> goes in the same sense, though the English
> https://www.etymonline.com/search?q=book
> seems to be 'aware of nothing' ;)
>
> Opinions? (I still rather believe in the beech link).
>
>
> --
>
> guido wugi

Bucsken (Dutch) is that buckskin? Was vellum/parchment made primarily from young male ungulates, eg. Calfskin?

Vellum is prepared animal skin or "membrane", typically used as a material for writing on. Parchment is another term for this material, and if vellum is distinguished from this, it is by its being made from calfskin, as opposed to that from other animals,[1] or otherwise being of higher quality.[2] Vellum is prepared for writing or printing on, to produce single pages, scrolls, codices or books. The word is borrowed from Old French vélin 'calfskin', from the Latin word vitulinum 'made from calf'.[3]

Leather-polishing stones date from neanderthals.

Op 18/06/2021 om 17:25 schreef Daud Deden:
> On Friday, June 18, 2021 at 9:59:36 AM UTC-4, wugi wrote:
>> I happened upon this Quora question
>> https://de.quora.com/Was-ist-die-Etymologie-von-Buch?,
>> and the answer referring to this
>> http://www.buechersammler.de/woher-stammt-das-wort-buch/
>> which seemed farfetched to me.
>>
>> But the Dutch site
>> https://etymologiebank.nl/trefwoord/boek1
>> goes in the same sense, though the English
>> https://www.etymonline.com/search?q=book
>> seems to be 'aware of nothing' ;)
>>
>> Opinions? (I still rather believe in the beech link).
>>
>>
>> --
>>
>> guido wugi
> Bucsken (Dutch) is that buckskin? Was vellum/parchment made primarily from young male ungulates, eg. Calfskin?

Wrong trail: dim. of buec, nowadays boek, boekje, dial. boekske(n). The
dim. suff. -je < older/dial. -ke(n), compare German -chen. According to
the stem ending other sounds may get interposed:

meid (maid), meid[s]je > meisje (girl); meisken, meideken ~ Mädchen.

boom (tree), boompje, boomke, bomeke

bloem (flower), bloempje, bloemetje, bloemeke

winkel (shop), winkeltje, winkelke

boek, boekje, boekske

man, mannetje, manneke ~ mannequin/mannikin (comp. napkin)

Dutch uses a lot of diminutives, but is beaten in it by Spanish ;)

Ahorita esperamos un tiempito chiquitito.

--

guido wugi

On Friday, June 18, 2021 at 11:25:35 AM UTC-4, Daud Deden wrote:
> On Friday, June 18, 2021 at 9:59:36 AM UTC-4, wugi wrote:
> > I happened upon this Quora question
> > https://de.quora.com/Was-ist-die-Etymologie-von-Buch?,
> > and the answer referring to this
> > http://www.buechersammler.de/woher-stammt-das-wort-buch/
> > which seemed farfetched to me.
> >
> > But the Dutch site
> > https://etymologiebank.nl/trefwoord/boek1
> > goes in the same sense, though the English
> > https://www.etymonline.com/search?q=book
> > seems to be 'aware of nothing' ;)
> >
> > Opinions? (I still rather believe in the beech link).
> >
> >
> > --
> >
> > guido wugi
> Bucsken (Dutch) is that buckskin? Was vellum/parchment made primarily from young male ungulates, eg. Calfskin?
>
> Vellum is prepared animal skin or "membrane", typically used as a material for writing on. Parchment is another term for this material, and if vellum is distinguished from this, it is by its being made from calfskin, as opposed to that from other animals,[1] or otherwise being of higher quality.[2] Vellum is prepared for writing or printing on, to produce single pages, scrolls, codices or books. The word is borrowed from Old French vélin 'calfskin', from the Latin word vitulinum 'made from calf'.[3]
>
> Leather-polishing stones date from neanderthals.
Excavations of Neanderthal sites more than 40,000 years old have uncovered a kind of tool that leather workers still use to make hides more lustrous and water resistant. The bone tools, known as lissoirs, had previously been associated only with modern humans.

Tamaga@Mongol: stamp, brand, seal, trademark

Private ownership of livestock & land resources required identification especially as quantities & distances increased. The pre-script clay tokens & envelopes (Iraq?) may have related to that.

On Friday, June 18, 2021 at 11:42:34 AM UTC-4, wugi wrote:
> Op 18/06/2021 om 17:25 schreef Daud Deden:
> > On Friday, June 18, 2021 at 9:59:36 AM UTC-4, wugi wrote:
> >> I happened upon this Quora question
> >> https://de.quora.com/Was-ist-die-Etymologie-von-Buch?,
> >> and the answer referring to this
> >> http://www.buechersammler.de/woher-stammt-das-wort-buch/
> >> which seemed farfetched to me.
> >>
> >> But the Dutch site
> >> https://etymologiebank.nl/trefwoord/boek1
> >> goes in the same sense, though the English
> >> https://www.etymonline.com/search?q=book
> >> seems to be 'aware of nothing' ;)
> >>
> >> Opinions? (I still rather believe in the beech link).
> >>
> >>
> >> --
> >>
> >> guido wugi
> > Bucsken (Dutch) is that buckskin? Was vellum/parchment made primarily from young male ungulates, eg. Calfskin?
> Wrong trail: dim. of buec, nowadays boek, boekje, dial. boekske(n). The
> dim. suff. -je < older/dial. -ke(n), compare German -chen. According to
> the stem ending other sounds may get interposed:
>
> meid (maid), meid[s]je > meisje (girl); meisken, meideken ~ Mädchen.
>
> boom (tree), boompje, boomke, bomeke
>
> bloem (flower), bloempje, bloemetje, bloemeke
>
> winkel (shop), winkeltje, winkelke
>
> boek, boekje, boekske
>
> man, mannetje, manneke ~ mannequin/mannikin (comp. napkin)
>
> Dutch uses a lot of diminutives, but is beaten in it by Spanish ;)
>
> Ahorita esperamos un tiempito chiquitito.
>
> --
>
> guido wugi
Ok, seemed plausible.

On 2021-06-18, wugi <brol@wugi.be> wrote:

> http://www.buechersammler.de/woher-stammt-das-wort-buch/
> which seemed farfetched to me.

Pfeifer is conveniently online:
https://www.dwds.de/wb/etymwb/Buch

> But the Dutch site
> https://etymologiebank.nl/trefwoord/boek1
> goes in the same sense, though the English
> https://www.etymonline.com/search?q=book
> seems to be 'aware of nothing' ;)

Etymonline is based on the OED, I think, which may not reflect newer
proposals.

> Opinions? (I still rather believe in the beech link).

I'll go with what the reputable sources say.

--
Christian "naddy" Weisgerber naddy@mips.inka.de

On 2021-06-18, Peter T. Daniels <grammatim@verizon.net> wrote:

>> But the Dutch site
>> https://etymologiebank.nl/trefwoord/boek1
>
> What's wrong with "beech"?

See the entry in _Etymologisch Woordenboek van het Nederlands_ at
the link above, or the Pfeifer one at DWDS.de. Both are suspiciously
similar, so I assume they are drawing from a common source, whatever
that may be.

The Dutch entry has a footnote "Lit.: Seebold 1981".

Alas, the reputable literature is not up to the citation standards
expected by the Wikipedia generation.

--
Christian "naddy" Weisgerber naddy@mips.inka.de

wugi <brol@wugi.be> wrote:
> Dutch uses a lot of diminutives, but is beaten in it by Spanish ;)
>
> Ahorita esperamos un tiempito chiquitito.

That's something I'm always at a loss with in english. Portuguese uses
diminutives a lot - altho in different ways from spanish - and then we get
to english and there are no diminutives at all (or augmentatives). I mean,
-ie/-y can be used as such, but it's not productive in any useful way.

Fri, 18 Jun 2021 08:08:54 -0700 (PDT): "Peter T. Daniels"
<grammatim@verizon.net> scribeva:

>On Friday, June 18, 2021 at 9:59:36 AM UTC-4, wugi wrote:
>> I happened upon this Quora question
>> https://de.quora.com/Was-ist-die-Etymologie-von-Buch?,
>> and the answer referring to this
>> http://www.buechersammler.de/woher-stammt-das-wort-buch/
>> which seemed farfetched to me.
>>
>> But the Dutch site
>> https://etymologiebank.nl/trefwoord/boek1
>> goes in the same sense, though the English
>> https://www.etymonline.com/search?q=book
>> seems to be 'aware of nothing' ;)
>>
>> Opinions? (I still rather believe in the beech link).
>
>Quora demanded that I use Facebook or something else to
>see the 92 replies, but the second one seems unlikely.
>
>What's wrong with "beech"?

https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/book#English
https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/Reconstruction:Proto-Germanic/b%C5%8Dks
"Uncertain. Often linked to *boko (“beech”), though beechbark-writing,
unlike birchbark-writing, is not known, nor is it well imaginable that
it was the time for bookfells made from beeches already. Connected by
some to Proto-Indo-European *bheh2g- (“to allot”) ascribing to the
word the meaning of “letter” in the sense of merely one or few symbols
because letters would have primitively been ownership symbols, which
would then have been generalized to any work with writing upon it.
Pronunciation"

>If someone asks you the IE word for 'write', don't bite.

Nothing controversial, it seems:
https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/write#Etymology
--
Ruud Harmsen, http://rudhar.com

Fri, 18 Jun 2021 08:25:33 -0700 (PDT): Daud Deden
<daud.deden@gmail.com> scribeva:
>Bucsken (Dutch) is that buckskin?

No, a dimunitive, buk-ske(n). Booklet.
Cf. mannequin, from manneke, man(e)ke, little man.

--
Ruud Harmsen, http://rudhar.com

On Saturday, June 19, 2021 at 4:41:41 AM UTC-4, Ruud Harmsen wrote:
> Fri, 18 Jun 2021 08:08:54 -0700 (PDT): "Peter T. Daniels"
> <gram...@verizon.net> scribeva:
> >On Friday, June 18, 2021 at 9:59:36 AM UTC-4, wugi wrote:

> >> I happened upon this Quora question
> >> https://de.quora.com/Was-ist-die-Etymologie-von-Buch?,
> >> and the answer referring to this
> >> http://www.buechersammler.de/woher-stammt-das-wort-buch/
> >> which seemed farfetched to me.
> >> But the Dutch site
> >> https://etymologiebank.nl/trefwoord/boek1
> >> goes in the same sense, though the English
> >> https://www.etymonline.com/search?q=book
> >> seems to be 'aware of nothing' ;)
> >> Opinions? (I still rather believe in the beech link).
> >Quora demanded that I use Facebook or something else to
> >see the 92 replies, but the second one seems unlikely.
> >What's wrong with "beech"?

> https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/book#English
> https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/Reconstruction:Proto-Germanic/b%C5%8Dks
> "Uncertain. Often linked to *boko (“beech”), though beechbark-writing,
> unlike birchbark-writing, is not known, nor is it well imaginable that
> it was the time for bookfells made from beeches already. Connected by
> some to Proto-Indo-European *bheh2g- (“to allot”) ascribing to the
> word the meaning of “letter” in the sense of merely one or few symbols
> because letters would have primitively been ownership symbols, which
> would then have been generalized to any work with writing upon it.
> Pronunciation"

Is that an output of Google Translate? It sure hasn't been edited.

> >If someone asks you the IE word for 'write', don't bite.
> Nothing controversial, it seems:
> https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/write#Etymology

Now look at what I actually said.

On 2021-06-19, Ruud Harmsen <rh@rudhar.com> wrote:

>>If someone asks you the IE word for 'write', don't bite.
>
> Nothing controversial, it seems:
> https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/write#Etymology

PTD didn't mean the etymology of the English word, but a PIE word
with the meaning 'to write'. Such a word didn't exist, PIE speakers
didn't have writing, and the subsequent IE branches eventually
repurposed a variety of different stems with underlying meanings
of 'scratch, carve' or 'paint'.

--
Christian "naddy" Weisgerber naddy@mips.inka.de

Sat, 19 Jun 2021 06:16:56 -0700 (PDT): "Peter T. Daniels"
<grammatim@verizon.net> scribeva:

>On Saturday, June 19, 2021 at 4:41:41 AM UTC-4, Ruud Harmsen wrote:
>> https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/book#English
>> https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/Reconstruction:Proto-Germanic/b%C5%8Dks
>> "Uncertain. Often linked to *boko (“beech”), though beechbark-writing,
>> unlike birchbark-writing, is not known, nor is it well imaginable that
>> it was the time for bookfells made from beeches already. Connected by
>> some to Proto-Indo-European *bheh2g- (“to allot”) ascribing to the
>> word the meaning of “letter” in the sense of merely one or few symbols
>> because letters would have primitively been ownership symbols, which
>> would then have been generalized to any work with writing upon it.
>> Pronunciation"
>
>Is that an output of Google Translate? It sure hasn't been edited.

Go ahead. Anyone can edit Wiktionary, just like Wikipedia.

>> >If someone asks you the IE word for 'write', don't bite.
>> Nothing controversial, it seems:
>> https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/write#Etymology
>
>Now look at what I actually said.

Not the point.

Sat, 19 Jun 2021 14:12:10 -0000 (UTC): Christian Weisgerber
<naddy@mips.inka.de> scribeva:

>On 2021-06-19, Ruud Harmsen <rh@rudhar.com> wrote:
>
>>>If someone asks you the IE word for 'write', don't bite.
>>
>> Nothing controversial, it seems:
>> https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/write#Etymology
>
>PTD didn't mean the etymology of the English word,

I know. But I did.

>but a PIE word with the meaning 'to write'.

That was clear to me from the start.

>Such a word didn't exist, PIE speakers
>didn't have writing, and the subsequent IE branches eventually
>repurposed a variety of different stems with underlying meanings
>of 'scratch, carve' or 'paint'.

Meanings shift. What else is new.

Sat, 19 Jun 2021 10:44:51 +0200: Ruud Harmsen <rh@rudhar.com>
scribeva:

>Fri, 18 Jun 2021 08:25:33 -0700 (PDT): Daud Deden
><daud.deden@gmail.com> scribeva:
>>Bucsken (Dutch) is that buckskin?
>
>No, a dimunitive, buk-ske(n). Booklet.
>Cf. mannequin, from manneke, man(e)ke, little man.

Skin is of Norse origin, totally unrelated to the Dutch family of
suffixes.