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tech / sci.electronics.design / Adolphe Quetelet Brilliant Scientist

SubjectAuthor
* Adolphe Quetelet Brilliant ScientistFred Bloggs
+* Re: Adolphe Quetelet Brilliant ScientistJohn Larkin
|`* Re: Adolphe Quetelet Brilliant ScientistJoe Gwinn
| `* Re: Adolphe Quetelet Brilliant ScientistJohn Larkin
|  +- Re: Adolphe Quetelet Brilliant ScientistJoe Gwinn
|  +- Re: Adolphe Quetelet Brilliant ScientistAnthony William Sloman
|  `- Re: Adolphe Quetelet Brilliant ScientistFred Bloggs
`* Re: Adolphe Quetelet Brilliant Scientistlegg
 `- Re: Adolphe Quetelet Brilliant ScientistFred Bloggs

1
Adolphe Quetelet Brilliant Scientist

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Subject: Adolphe Quetelet Brilliant Scientist
From: bloggs.f...@gmail.com (Fred Bloggs)
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 by: Fred Bloggs - Thu, 23 Nov 2023 17:35 UTC

Invented the BMI.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Body_mass_index

It's not perfect but to this day nothing better has been found.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adolphe_Quetelet

There's a YT video made by a mathematics full professor at Stanford calling Quetelet's BMI a 'hack'. Just goes to show, credentials don't cover for ignorance and stupidity.

Re: Adolphe Quetelet Brilliant Scientist

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From: jl...@997PotHill.com (John Larkin)
Newsgroups: sci.electronics.design
Subject: Re: Adolphe Quetelet Brilliant Scientist
Date: Thu, 23 Nov 2023 11:42:11 -0800
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 by: John Larkin - Thu, 23 Nov 2023 19:42 UTC

On Thu, 23 Nov 2023 09:35:30 -0800 (PST), Fred Bloggs
<bloggs.fredbloggs.fred@gmail.com> wrote:

>Invented the BMI.
>
>https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Body_mass_index
>
>It's not perfect but to this day nothing better has been found.
>
>https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adolphe_Quetelet
>
>There's a YT video made by a mathematics full professor at Stanford calling Quetelet's BMI a 'hack'. Just goes to show, credentials don't cover for ignorance and stupidity.

A simple chart or graph of statistically healthy and unhealthy weights
vs height would be just as good as BMI, probably better.

Re: Adolphe Quetelet Brilliant Scientist

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From: joegw...@comcast.net (Joe Gwinn)
Newsgroups: sci.electronics.design
Subject: Re: Adolphe Quetelet Brilliant Scientist
Date: Thu, 23 Nov 2023 15:01:31 -0500
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 by: Joe Gwinn - Thu, 23 Nov 2023 20:01 UTC

On Thu, 23 Nov 2023 11:42:11 -0800, John Larkin <jl@997PotHill.com>
wrote:

>On Thu, 23 Nov 2023 09:35:30 -0800 (PST), Fred Bloggs
><bloggs.fredbloggs.fred@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>>Invented the BMI.
>>
>><https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Body_mass_index>
>>
>>It's not perfect but to this day nothing better has been found.
>>
>><https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adolphe_Quetelet>
>>
>>There's a YT video made by a mathematics full professor at Stanford calling Quetelet's BMI a 'hack'. Just goes to show, credentials don't cover for ignorance and stupidity.
>
>A simple chart or graph of statistically healthy and unhealthy weights
>vs height would be just as good as BMI, probably better.

That's exactly what is underneath the standard BMI curve.

Look at reference 32 in the BMI Wiki cited above, where the full
dataset is documented.

Joe Gwinn

Re: Adolphe Quetelet Brilliant Scientist

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From: jl...@997PotHill.com (John Larkin)
Newsgroups: sci.electronics.design
Subject: Re: Adolphe Quetelet Brilliant Scientist
Date: Thu, 23 Nov 2023 12:16:00 -0800
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 by: John Larkin - Thu, 23 Nov 2023 20:16 UTC

On Thu, 23 Nov 2023 15:01:31 -0500, Joe Gwinn <joegwinn@comcast.net>
wrote:

>On Thu, 23 Nov 2023 11:42:11 -0800, John Larkin <jl@997PotHill.com>
>wrote:
>
>>On Thu, 23 Nov 2023 09:35:30 -0800 (PST), Fred Bloggs
>><bloggs.fredbloggs.fred@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>>Invented the BMI.
>>>
>>><https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Body_mass_index>
>>>
>>>It's not perfect but to this day nothing better has been found.
>>>
>>><https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adolphe_Quetelet>
>>>
>>>There's a YT video made by a mathematics full professor at Stanford calling Quetelet's BMI a 'hack'. Just goes to show, credentials don't cover for ignorance and stupidity.
>>
>>A simple chart or graph of statistically healthy and unhealthy weights
>>vs height would be just as good as BMI, probably better.
>
>That's exactly what is underneath the standard BMI curve.
>
>Look at reference 32 in the BMI Wiki cited above, where the full
>dataset is documented.
>
>Joe Gwinn

Sure. The BMI calculation is just a way to make a simple thing more
complex. That happens a lot.

Re: Adolphe Quetelet Brilliant Scientist

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Subject: Re: Adolphe Quetelet Brilliant Scientist
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 by: Joe Gwinn - Thu, 23 Nov 2023 23:37 UTC

On Thu, 23 Nov 2023 12:16:00 -0800, John Larkin <jl@997PotHill.com>
wrote:

>On Thu, 23 Nov 2023 15:01:31 -0500, Joe Gwinn <joegwinn@comcast.net>
>wrote:
>
>>On Thu, 23 Nov 2023 11:42:11 -0800, John Larkin <jl@997PotHill.com>
>>wrote:
>>
>>>On Thu, 23 Nov 2023 09:35:30 -0800 (PST), Fred Bloggs
>>><bloggs.fredbloggs.fred@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>>Invented the BMI.
>>>>
>>>><https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Body_mass_index>
>>>>
>>>>It's not perfect but to this day nothing better has been found.
>>>>
>>>><https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adolphe_Quetelet>
>>>>
>>>>There's a YT video made by a mathematics full professor at Stanford calling Quetelet's BMI a 'hack'. Just goes to show, credentials don't cover for ignorance and stupidity.
>>>
>>>A simple chart or graph of statistically healthy and unhealthy weights
>>>vs height would be just as good as BMI, probably better.
>>
>>That's exactly what is underneath the standard BMI curve.
>>
>>Look at reference 32 in the BMI Wiki cited above, where the full
>>dataset is documented.
>>
>>Joe Gwinn
>
>Sure. The BMI calculation is just a way to make a simple thing more
>complex. That happens a lot.

Actually, the medical intent was and still is to summarize a large
space of body sizes and shapes into a single score number that does a
reasonable albeit imperfect job of predicting prognosis probabilities,
so the doctors will know where to focus, what to worry about first.

But BMI has gone from a rule of thumb to holy writ, which it isn't.

Joe Gwinn

Re: Adolphe Quetelet Brilliant Scientist

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Subject: Re: Adolphe Quetelet Brilliant Scientist
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 by: Anthony William Slom - Fri, 24 Nov 2023 04:19 UTC

On Friday, November 24, 2023 at 7:16:52 AM UTC+11, John Larkin wrote:
> On Thu, 23 Nov 2023 15:01:31 -0500, Joe Gwinn <joeg...@comcast.net> wrote:
> >On Thu, 23 Nov 2023 11:42:11 -0800, John Larkin <j...@997PotHill.com> wrote:
> >>On Thu, 23 Nov 2023 09:35:30 -0800 (PST), Fred Bloggs <bloggs.fred...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >>
> >>>Invented the BMI.
> >>>
> >>><https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Body_mass_index>
> >>>
> >>>It's not perfect but to this day nothing better has been found.
> >>>
> >>><https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adolphe_Quetelet>
> >>>
> >>>There's a YT video made by a mathematics full professor at Stanford calling Quetelet's BMI a 'hack'. Just goes to show, credentials don't cover for ignorance and stupidity.
> >>
> >>A simple chart or graph of statistically healthy and unhealthy weights
> >>vs height would be just as good as BMI, probably better.
> >
> >That's exactly what is underneath the standard BMI curve.
> >
> >Look at reference 32 in the BMI Wiki cited above, where the full
> >dataset is documented.
> >
> Sure. The BMI calculation is just a way to make a simple thing more complex. That happens a lot.

The BMI is the simplest way of taking out the influence of height on body weight. If you know a simpler one, tell us about it.

--
Bill Sloman, Sydney

Re: Adolphe Quetelet Brilliant Scientist

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 by: legg - Fri, 24 Nov 2023 13:00 UTC

On Thu, 23 Nov 2023 09:35:30 -0800 (PST), Fred Bloggs
<bloggs.fredbloggs.fred@gmail.com> wrote:

>Invented the BMI.
>
>https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Body_mass_index
>
>It's not perfect but to this day nothing better has been found.
>
>https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adolphe_Quetelet
>
>There's a YT video made by a mathematics full professor at Stanford calling Quetelet's BMI a 'hack'. Just goes to show, credentials don't cover for ignorance and stupidity.

I'm wondering why a professor of mathematics considers the
uses of such an arbitrary measurement to be within his own
bailiwick, or why its 19th century developer should be
considered 'brilliant'.

RL

Re: Adolphe Quetelet Brilliant Scientist

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Subject: Re: Adolphe Quetelet Brilliant Scientist
From: bloggs.f...@gmail.com (Fred Bloggs)
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 by: Fred Bloggs - Fri, 24 Nov 2023 16:17 UTC

On Friday, November 24, 2023 at 8:00:04 AM UTC-5, legg wrote:
> On Thu, 23 Nov 2023 09:35:30 -0800 (PST), Fred Bloggs
> <bloggs.fred...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >Invented the BMI.
> >
> >https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Body_mass_index
> >
> >It's not perfect but to this day nothing better has been found.
> >
> >https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adolphe_Quetelet
> >
> >There's a YT video made by a mathematics full professor at Stanford calling Quetelet's BMI a 'hack'. Just goes to show, credentials don't cover for ignorance and stupidity.
> I'm wondering why a professor of mathematics considers the
> uses of such an arbitrary measurement to be within his own
> bailiwick, or why its 19th century developer should be
> considered 'brilliant'.

This was so long ago that just about all of probability and mathematical statistics was cutting edge and distributed across a disorganized mess of unorganized literature, if at all. Michael Faraday was just getting started at this time.

>
> RL

Re: Adolphe Quetelet Brilliant Scientist

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Subject: Re: Adolphe Quetelet Brilliant Scientist
From: bloggs.f...@gmail.com (Fred Bloggs)
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 by: Fred Bloggs - Fri, 24 Nov 2023 16:27 UTC

On Thursday, November 23, 2023 at 3:16:52 PM UTC-5, John Larkin wrote:
> On Thu, 23 Nov 2023 15:01:31 -0500, Joe Gwinn <joeg...@comcast.net>
> wrote:
>
> >On Thu, 23 Nov 2023 11:42:11 -0800, John Larkin <j...@997PotHill.com>
> >wrote:
> >
> >>On Thu, 23 Nov 2023 09:35:30 -0800 (PST), Fred Bloggs
> >><bloggs.fred...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >>
> >>>Invented the BMI.
> >>>
> >>><https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Body_mass_index>
> >>>
> >>>It's not perfect but to this day nothing better has been found.
> >>>
> >>><https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adolphe_Quetelet>
> >>>
> >>>There's a YT video made by a mathematics full professor at Stanford calling Quetelet's BMI a 'hack'. Just goes to show, credentials don't cover for ignorance and stupidity.
> >>
> >>A simple chart or graph of statistically healthy and unhealthy weights
> >>vs height would be just as good as BMI, probably better.
> >
> >That's exactly what is underneath the standard BMI curve.
> >
> >Look at reference 32 in the BMI Wiki cited above, where the full
> >dataset is documented.
> >
> >Joe Gwinn
> Sure. The BMI calculation is just a way to make a simple thing more
> complex. That happens a lot.

Quetelet took his cue from 'BMI' on trees to conclude BMI is mass divided by height squared. You would think it would be height x width or some correlation thereof. But his analysis of the data was height encapsulates the width-effect, if any, in its measurement.

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