Rocksolid Light

Welcome to novaBBS (click a section below)

mail  files  register  newsreader  groups  login

Message-ID:  

Dijkstra probably hates me (Linus Torvalds, in kernel/sched.c)

tech / sci.lang / Placement

SubjectAuthor
* PlacementRuud Harmsen
`* Re: PlacementRuud Harmsen
 `* Re: PlacementRuud Harmsen
  `* Re: PlacementRoss Clark
   +- Re: PlacementPeter T. Daniels
   `- Re: PlacementRuud Harmsen

1
Placement

<ptkiegp0vsfqrds3840bqm8linjqo5nr1q@4ax.com>

  copy mid

https://www.novabbs.com/tech/article-flat.php?id=13283&group=sci.lang#13283

  copy link   Newsgroups: sci.lang
Path: i2pn2.org!i2pn.org!aioe.org!iwPJjk21zY3PlaYtYWHUkQ.user.gioia.aioe.org.POSTED!not-for-mail
From: rh...@rudhar.com (Ruud Harmsen)
Newsgroups: sci.lang
Subject: Placement
Date: Sat, 10 Jul 2021 10:02:08 +0200
Organization: Aioe.org NNTP Server
Lines: 5
Message-ID: <ptkiegp0vsfqrds3840bqm8linjqo5nr1q@4ax.com>
NNTP-Posting-Host: iwPJjk21zY3PlaYtYWHUkQ.user.gioia.aioe.org
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Complaints-To: abuse@aioe.org
X-Newsreader: Forte Agent 1.93/32.576 English (American)
X-Notice: Filtered by postfilter v. 0.9.2
 by: Ruud Harmsen - Sat, 10 Jul 2021 08:02 UTC

https://www.facebook.com/RachelsEnglish.Pronunciation/videos/171342100973777
Interesting explanation of formants, for PTD and others who don't
really understand this.

Somewhat longish, and slow, but correct.

Re: Placement

<o5lieg5tdjs3kvfqeo815cscco1iatoefu@4ax.com>

  copy mid

https://www.novabbs.com/tech/article-flat.php?id=13284&group=sci.lang#13284

  copy link   Newsgroups: sci.lang
Path: i2pn2.org!i2pn.org!aioe.org!iwPJjk21zY3PlaYtYWHUkQ.user.gioia.aioe.org.POSTED!not-for-mail
From: rh...@rudhar.com (Ruud Harmsen)
Newsgroups: sci.lang
Subject: Re: Placement
Date: Sat, 10 Jul 2021 10:05:57 +0200
Organization: Aioe.org NNTP Server
Lines: 11
Message-ID: <o5lieg5tdjs3kvfqeo815cscco1iatoefu@4ax.com>
References: <ptkiegp0vsfqrds3840bqm8linjqo5nr1q@4ax.com>
NNTP-Posting-Host: iwPJjk21zY3PlaYtYWHUkQ.user.gioia.aioe.org
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Complaints-To: abuse@aioe.org
X-Notice: Filtered by postfilter v. 0.9.2
X-Newsreader: Forte Agent 1.93/32.576 English (American)
 by: Ruud Harmsen - Sat, 10 Jul 2021 08:05 UTC

Sat, 10 Jul 2021 10:02:08 +0200: Ruud Harmsen <rh@rudhar.com>
scribeva:

>https://www.facebook.com/RachelsEnglish.Pronunciation/videos/171342100973777
>Interesting explanation of formants, for PTD and others who don't
>really understand this.
>
>Somewhat longish, and slow, but correct.

At 8:40 into the video, I still don't know the answer to this
fundamental question: placement of WHAT?

Re: Placement

<idlieglfn89nl0vjl837ar9vj464lqj57u@4ax.com>

  copy mid

https://www.novabbs.com/tech/article-flat.php?id=13285&group=sci.lang#13285

  copy link   Newsgroups: sci.lang
Path: i2pn2.org!i2pn.org!aioe.org!iwPJjk21zY3PlaYtYWHUkQ.user.gioia.aioe.org.POSTED!not-for-mail
From: rh...@rudhar.com (Ruud Harmsen)
Newsgroups: sci.lang
Subject: Re: Placement
Date: Sat, 10 Jul 2021 10:09:58 +0200
Organization: Aioe.org NNTP Server
Lines: 17
Message-ID: <idlieglfn89nl0vjl837ar9vj464lqj57u@4ax.com>
References: <ptkiegp0vsfqrds3840bqm8linjqo5nr1q@4ax.com> <o5lieg5tdjs3kvfqeo815cscco1iatoefu@4ax.com>
NNTP-Posting-Host: iwPJjk21zY3PlaYtYWHUkQ.user.gioia.aioe.org
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Complaints-To: abuse@aioe.org
X-Notice: Filtered by postfilter v. 0.9.2
X-Newsreader: Forte Agent 1.93/32.576 English (American)
 by: Ruud Harmsen - Sat, 10 Jul 2021 08:09 UTC

Sat, 10 Jul 2021 10:05:57 +0200: Ruud Harmsen <rh@rudhar.com>
scribeva:

>Sat, 10 Jul 2021 10:02:08 +0200: Ruud Harmsen <rh@rudhar.com>
>scribeva:
>
>>https://www.facebook.com/RachelsEnglish.Pronunciation/videos/171342100973777
>>Interesting explanation of formants, for PTD and others who don't
>>really understand this.
>>
>>Somewhat longish, and slow, but correct.
>
>At 8:40 into the video, I still don't know the answer to this
>fundamental question: placement of WHAT?

For those not on Facebook: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7apgMOI97Zw
on Youtube is not the same video, but the same subject, I believe.

Re: Placement

<scbvn3$2pm$1@dont-email.me>

  copy mid

https://www.novabbs.com/tech/article-flat.php?id=13287&group=sci.lang#13287

  copy link   Newsgroups: sci.lang
Path: i2pn2.org!i2pn.org!eternal-september.org!reader02.eternal-september.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail
From: benli...@ihug.co.nz (Ross Clark)
Newsgroups: sci.lang
Subject: Re: Placement
Date: Sat, 10 Jul 2021 23:18:52 +1200
Organization: A noiseless patient Spider
Lines: 25
Message-ID: <scbvn3$2pm$1@dont-email.me>
References: <ptkiegp0vsfqrds3840bqm8linjqo5nr1q@4ax.com>
<o5lieg5tdjs3kvfqeo815cscco1iatoefu@4ax.com>
<idlieglfn89nl0vjl837ar9vj464lqj57u@4ax.com>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Injection-Date: Sat, 10 Jul 2021 11:18:59 -0000 (UTC)
Injection-Info: reader02.eternal-september.org; posting-host="8c2cc2a0f5c9c7936e049ef923b5ce32";
logging-data="2870"; mail-complaints-to="abuse@eternal-september.org"; posting-account="U2FsdGVkX1+eRgI2bCiF5/UvYQiVex2y7IHXP/tqOJY="
User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.0; rv:52.0) Gecko/20100101
Thunderbird/52.9.1
Cancel-Lock: sha1:CABSCt8HgHVnxvbBulllL7oaXpc=
In-Reply-To: <idlieglfn89nl0vjl837ar9vj464lqj57u@4ax.com>
Content-Language: en-GB
 by: Ross Clark - Sat, 10 Jul 2021 11:18 UTC

On 10/07/2021 8:09 p.m., Ruud Harmsen wrote:
> Sat, 10 Jul 2021 10:05:57 +0200: Ruud Harmsen <rh@rudhar.com>
> scribeva:
>
>> Sat, 10 Jul 2021 10:02:08 +0200: Ruud Harmsen <rh@rudhar.com>
>> scribeva:
>>
>>> https://www.facebook.com/RachelsEnglish.Pronunciation/videos/171342100973777
>>> Interesting explanation of formants, for PTD and others who don't
>>> really understand this.
>>>
>>> Somewhat longish, and slow, but correct.
>>
>> At 8:40 into the video, I still don't know the answer to this
>> fundamental question: placement of WHAT?
>
> For those not on Facebook: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7apgMOI97Zw
> on Youtube is not the same video, but the same subject, I believe.

After three minutes of it, I was no wiser, and that was enough.
It's not a standard term in phonetics as I know it. It may be used by
speech/language/voice teachers, with whom I've had little contact. But
it ought to at least be translatable into phonetic terms, if it's not
completely illusory.
Let us know if you figure out what she means by it.

Re: Placement

<9720e54a-6f5b-4cec-807f-7dbcc16ad8dcn@googlegroups.com>

  copy mid

https://www.novabbs.com/tech/article-flat.php?id=13289&group=sci.lang#13289

  copy link   Newsgroups: sci.lang
X-Received: by 2002:a37:681:: with SMTP id 123mr902733qkg.453.1625922236316;
Sat, 10 Jul 2021 06:03:56 -0700 (PDT)
X-Received: by 2002:a25:a565:: with SMTP id h92mr52833435ybi.423.1625922236076;
Sat, 10 Jul 2021 06:03:56 -0700 (PDT)
Path: i2pn2.org!i2pn.org!paganini.bofh.team!news.dns-netz.com!news.freedyn.net!newsfeed.xs4all.nl!newsfeed8.news.xs4all.nl!feeder1.cambriumusenet.nl!feed.tweak.nl!209.85.160.216.MISMATCH!news-out.google.com!nntp.google.com!postnews.google.com!google-groups.googlegroups.com!not-for-mail
Newsgroups: sci.lang
Date: Sat, 10 Jul 2021 06:03:55 -0700 (PDT)
In-Reply-To: <scbvn3$2pm$1@dont-email.me>
Injection-Info: google-groups.googlegroups.com; posting-host=100.8.211.134; posting-account=tXYReAoAAABbl0njRzivyU02EBLaX9OF
NNTP-Posting-Host: 100.8.211.134
References: <ptkiegp0vsfqrds3840bqm8linjqo5nr1q@4ax.com> <o5lieg5tdjs3kvfqeo815cscco1iatoefu@4ax.com>
<idlieglfn89nl0vjl837ar9vj464lqj57u@4ax.com> <scbvn3$2pm$1@dont-email.me>
User-Agent: G2/1.0
MIME-Version: 1.0
Message-ID: <9720e54a-6f5b-4cec-807f-7dbcc16ad8dcn@googlegroups.com>
Subject: Re: Placement
From: gramma...@verizon.net (Peter T. Daniels)
Injection-Date: Sat, 10 Jul 2021 13:03:56 +0000
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
 by: Peter T. Daniels - Sat, 10 Jul 2021 13:03 UTC

On Saturday, July 10, 2021 at 7:19:02 AM UTC-4, benl...@ihug.co.nz wrote:
> On 10/07/2021 8:09 p.m., Ruud Harmsen wrote:
> > Sat, 10 Jul 2021 10:05:57 +0200: Ruud Harmsen <r...@rudhar.com>
> > scribeva:
> >
> >> Sat, 10 Jul 2021 10:02:08 +0200: Ruud Harmsen <r...@rudhar.com>
> >> scribeva:
> >>
> >>> https://www.facebook.com/RachelsEnglish.Pronunciation/videos/171342100973777
> >>> Interesting explanation of formants, for PTD and others who don't
> >>> really understand this.
> >>>
> >>> Somewhat longish, and slow, but correct.
> >>
> >> At 8:40 into the video, I still don't know the answer to this
> >> fundamental question: placement of WHAT?
> >
> > For those not on Facebook: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7apgMOI97Zw
> > on Youtube is not the same video, but the same subject, I believe.
>
> After three minutes of it, I was no wiser, and that was enough.
> It's not a standard term in phonetics as I know it. It may be used by
> speech/language/voice teachers, with whom I've had little contact. But
> it ought to at least be translatable into phonetic terms, if it's not
> completely illusory.
> Let us know if you figure out what she means by it.

She's a speech therapist or dialect coach and so comes from a different
field with different terminology. (See the string of related videos below
the image.)

Two possibilities: it might be what Hockett called "a new point d'appui
in phonology" (which I knew only as a lecture but apparently was published
some years later) -- he said that the "hesitation vowel" typically used by
a speaker was typical of a specific language, and showed you where the
"rest point" of the vocal apparatus was.

Aha -- it was in The Second LACUS Forum (1975) -- summary here (Book
Notice in *Language*):

https://muse.jhu.edu/article/452134/pdf

(LACUS hasn't gotten around to scanning the earlier volumes yet.)

Or, something like what voice teachers refer to as "head voice" and "chest
voice"?

Re: Placement

<umdjegtjpmvp9ppvbb9sptadtj3eetksha@4ax.com>

  copy mid

https://www.novabbs.com/tech/article-flat.php?id=13290&group=sci.lang#13290

  copy link   Newsgroups: sci.lang
Path: i2pn2.org!i2pn.org!aioe.org!iwPJjk21zY3PlaYtYWHUkQ.user.gioia.aioe.org.POSTED!not-for-mail
From: rh...@rudhar.com (Ruud Harmsen)
Newsgroups: sci.lang
Subject: Re: Placement
Date: Sat, 10 Jul 2021 17:04:49 +0200
Organization: Aioe.org NNTP Server
Lines: 33
Message-ID: <umdjegtjpmvp9ppvbb9sptadtj3eetksha@4ax.com>
References: <ptkiegp0vsfqrds3840bqm8linjqo5nr1q@4ax.com> <o5lieg5tdjs3kvfqeo815cscco1iatoefu@4ax.com> <idlieglfn89nl0vjl837ar9vj464lqj57u@4ax.com> <scbvn3$2pm$1@dont-email.me>
NNTP-Posting-Host: iwPJjk21zY3PlaYtYWHUkQ.user.gioia.aioe.org
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Complaints-To: abuse@aioe.org
X-Newsreader: Forte Agent 1.93/32.576 English (American)
X-Notice: Filtered by postfilter v. 0.9.2
 by: Ruud Harmsen - Sat, 10 Jul 2021 15:04 UTC

Sat, 10 Jul 2021 23:18:52 +1200: Ross Clark <benlizro@ihug.co.nz>
scribeva:

>On 10/07/2021 8:09 p.m., Ruud Harmsen wrote:
>> Sat, 10 Jul 2021 10:05:57 +0200: Ruud Harmsen <rh@rudhar.com>
>> scribeva:
>>
>>> Sat, 10 Jul 2021 10:02:08 +0200: Ruud Harmsen <rh@rudhar.com>
>>> scribeva:
>>>
>>>> https://www.facebook.com/RachelsEnglish.Pronunciation/videos/171342100973777
>>>> Interesting explanation of formants, for PTD and others who don't
>>>> really understand this.
>>>>
>>>> Somewhat longish, and slow, but correct.
>>>
>>> At 8:40 into the video, I still don't know the answer to this
>>> fundamental question: placement of WHAT?
>>
>> For those not on Facebook: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7apgMOI97Zw
>> on Youtube is not the same video, but the same subject, I believe.
>
>After three minutes of it, I was no wiser, and that was enough.
>It's not a standard term in phonetics as I know it. It may be used by
>speech/language/voice teachers, with whom I've had little contact. But
>it ought to at least be translatable into phonetic terms, if it's not
>completely illusory.
>Let us know if you figure out what she means by it.

The opposite of pharyngalisation, it seems: lowering the larynx so the
pharynx gets bigger.
--
Ruud Harmsen, http://rudhar.com

1
server_pubkey.txt

rocksolid light 0.9.8
clearnet tor