Source:
University of Massachusetts Amherst
Summary:
A team of engineers has proven that their analog computing device, called a memristor, can complete complex, scientific computing tasks while bypassing the limitations of digital computing.
https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2024/03/240314145325.htm

bit like our neural nets...

On 3/18/24 05:55, Jan Panteltje wrote:
> Source:
> University of Massachusetts Amherst
> Summary:
> A team of engineers has proven that their analog computing device, called a memristor, can complete complex, scientific computing tasks while bypassing the limitations of digital computing.
> https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2024/03/240314145325.htm
>
> bit like our neural nets...

I have an issue with calling a memristor a 'computing device'. If
you accept that, then so are capacitors and inductors!

Jeroen Belleman

On a sunny day (Mon, 18 Mar 2024 11:02:33 +0100) it happened Jeroen Belleman
<jeroen@nospam.please> wrote in <ut93d2$43ac$1@dont-email.me>:

>On 3/18/24 05:55, Jan Panteltje wrote:
>> Source:
>> University of Massachusetts Amherst
>> Summary:
>> A team of engineers has proven that their analog computing device, called a memristor, can complete complex, scientific
>> computing tasks while bypassing the limitations of digital computing.
>> https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2024/03/240314145325.htm
>>
>> bit like our neural nets...
>
>I have an issue with calling a memristor a 'computing device'. If

If you can do matrix computations with it why not?
quote from that llnk:
"When organized into a crossbar array,
such a memristive circuit does analog computing by using physical laws
in a massively parallel fashion, substantially accelerating matrix operation,
the most frequently used but very power-hungry computation in neural networks
"

>If you accept that, then so are capacitors and inductors!

Well you could store analog info in CMOS too, even in capacitors.
Inductors? not so sure, not so easy for a long time?

Jeroen Belleman <jeroen@nospam.please> wrote:

> On 3/18/24 05:55, Jan Panteltje wrote:
> > Source:
> > University of Massachusetts Amherst
> > Summary:
> > A team of engineers has proven that their analog computing device,
> > called a memristor, can complete complex, scientific computing tasks
> > while bypassing the limitations of digital computing.
> > https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2024/03/240314145325.htm
> >
> > bit like our neural nets...
>
> I have an issue with calling a memristor a 'computing device'. If
> you accept that, then so are capacitors and inductors!

I don't see the problem. Switches, relays, beads on a string can all be
computing devices - and not all of them have 'memories'. Pots have been
used as computing elements on the front panel of analogue computers for
years, so what is the difference between them (set by hand) and a
memristor (set electronically)?

....and yes, capacitors are definitely computing devices: Blumlein/Miller
integrator.

--
~ Liz Tuddenham ~
(Remove the ".invalid"s and add ".co.uk" to reply)
www.poppyrecords.co.uk

Jan Panteltje wrote:
> Jeroen Belleman wrote:
>> Jan Panteltje wrote:
>>> Source:
>>> University of Massachusetts Amherst
>>> Summary:
>>> A team of engineers has proven that their analog computing device, called a
>>> memristor, can complete complex, scientific
>>> computing tasks while bypassing the limitations of digital computing.
>>> https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2024/03/240314145325.htm
>>>
>>> bit like our neural nets...
>>
>>I have an issue with calling a memristor a 'computing device'. If
>
> If you can do matrix computations with it why not?
> quote from that llnk:
> "When organized into a crossbar array,
> such a memristive circuit does analog computing by using physical laws
> in a massively parallel fashion, substantially accelerating matrix operation
, > the most frequently used but very power-hungry computation in neural networks
> "
>
>>If you accept that, then so are capacitors and inductors!
>
> Well you could store analog info in CMOS too, even in capacitors.
> Inductors? not so sure, not so easy for a long time?

Does core memory qualify as inductors?

Danke,

--
Don, KB7RPU, https://www.qsl.net/kb7rpu
There was a young lady named Bright Whose speed was far faster than light;
She set out one day In a relative way And returned on the previous night.

On Mon, 18 Mar 2024 12:37:02 -0000 (UTC), "Don" <g@crcomp.net> wrote:

>Jan Panteltje wrote:
>> Jeroen Belleman wrote:
>>> Jan Panteltje wrote:
>>>> Source:
>>>> University of Massachusetts Amherst
>>>> Summary:
>>>> A team of engineers has proven that their analog computing device, called a
>>>> memristor, can complete complex, scientific
>>>> computing tasks while bypassing the limitations of digital computing.
>>>> https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2024/03/240314145325.htm
>>>>
>>>> bit like our neural nets...
>>>
>>>I have an issue with calling a memristor a 'computing device'. If
>>
>> If you can do matrix computations with it why not?
>> quote from that llnk:
>> "When organized into a crossbar array,
>> such a memristive circuit does analog computing by using physical laws
>> in a massively parallel fashion, substantially accelerating matrix operation
>,
>> the most frequently used but very power-hungry computation in neural networks
>> "
>>
>>>If you accept that, then so are capacitors and inductors!
>>
>> Well you could store analog info in CMOS too, even in capacitors.
>> Inductors? not so sure, not so easy for a long time?
>
>Does core memory qualify as inductors?
>
>Danke,

Sure.

On 3/18/24 13:37, Don wrote:
> Jan Panteltje wrote:
>> Jeroen Belleman wrote:
>>> Jan Panteltje wrote:
>>>> Source:
>>>> University of Massachusetts Amherst
>>>> Summary:
>>>> A team of engineers has proven that their analog computing device, called a
>>>> memristor, can complete complex, scientific
>>>> computing tasks while bypassing the limitations of digital computing.
>>>> https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2024/03/240314145325.htm
>>>>
>>>> bit like our neural nets...
>>>
>>> I have an issue with calling a memristor a 'computing device'. If
>>
>> If you can do matrix computations with it why not?
>> quote from that llnk:
>> "When organized into a crossbar array,
>> such a memristive circuit does analog computing by using physical laws
>> in a massively parallel fashion, substantially accelerating matrix operation
> ,
>> the most frequently used but very power-hungry computation in neural networks
>> "
>>
>>> If you accept that, then so are capacitors and inductors!
>>
>> Well you could store analog info in CMOS too, even in capacitors.
>> Inductors? not so sure, not so easy for a long time?
>
> Does core memory qualify as inductors?
>
> Danke,
>

Memory cores have a very wide hysteresis. You need a fair bit of
current to magnetize them, and when they do, they go straight into
saturation and stay there when the current is removed. You have to
reverse the current to magnetize them the other way and again will
flip the whole way.

That's why they were useful as memory. As inductors, not so much.

Jeroen Belleman

On Mon, 18 Mar 2024 04:55:14 GMT, Jan Panteltje <alien@comet.invalid>
wrote:

>Source:
>University of Massachusetts Amherst
>Summary:
>A team of engineers has proven that their analog computing device, called a memristor, can complete complex, scientific computing tasks while bypassing the limitations of digital computing.
> https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2024/03/240314145325.htm
>
>bit like our neural nets...

Most universities now have a team of publicists that prowl the
hallways for miracles to announce. Rags like Sciencedaily need input.

This one is even more fun:

https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2024/03/240314122109.htm

"The device produces energy outputs exceeding 100 volts"

Check out their source, cell.com.

On 3/18/24 11:49, Liz Tuddenham wrote:
> Jeroen Belleman <jeroen@nospam.please> wrote:
>
>> On 3/18/24 05:55, Jan Panteltje wrote:
>>> Source:
>>> University of Massachusetts Amherst
>>> Summary:
>>> A team of engineers has proven that their analog computing device,
>>> called a memristor, can complete complex, scientific computing tasks
>>> while bypassing the limitations of digital computing.
>>> https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2024/03/240314145325.htm
>>>
>>> bit like our neural nets...
>>
>> I have an issue with calling a memristor a 'computing device'. If
>> you accept that, then so are capacitors and inductors!
>
> I don't see the problem. Switches, relays, beads on a string can all be
> computing devices - and not all of them have 'memories'. Pots have been
> used as computing elements on the front panel of analogue computers for
> years, so what is the difference between them (set by hand) and a
> memristor (set electronically)?
>
> ...and yes, capacitors are definitely computing devices: Blumlein/Miller
> integrator.

Well, then so is any electronic component.

I'm old enough to have played with analog computers. They were
fun to solve differential equations with. Not necessarily
electronic, either. I've also done it with pneumatic stuff,
bellows, nozzles and flapper valves, and with water levels in
vertical pipes. Those were real fun too. You could *see* what
was going on without instrumentation.

It's been quite a while since I last did that, though. These
days, everything is electronic.

Jeroen Belleman

On 3/18/24 17:01, John Larkin wrote:
> On Mon, 18 Mar 2024 04:55:14 GMT, Jan Panteltje <alien@comet.invalid>
> wrote:
>
>> Source:
>> University of Massachusetts Amherst
>> Summary:
>> A team of engineers has proven that their analog computing device, called a memristor, can complete complex, scientific computing tasks while bypassing the limitations of digital computing.
>> https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2024/03/240314145325.htm
>>
>> bit like our neural nets...
>
> Most universities now have a team of publicists that prowl the
> hallways for miracles to announce. Rags like Sciencedaily need input.
>
> This one is even more fun:
>
> https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2024/03/240314122109.htm
>
> "The device produces energy outputs exceeding 100 volts"
>
> Check out their source, cell.com.
>
>

I'm surprised they don't claim you can charge your phone with it.

Jeroen Belleman

Jeroen Belleman <jeroen@nospam.please> wrote:

> On 3/18/24 11:49, Liz Tuddenham wrote:
> > Jeroen Belleman <jeroen@nospam.please> wrote:
> >
> >> On 3/18/24 05:55, Jan Panteltje wrote:
> >>> Source:
> >>> University of Massachusetts Amherst
> >>> Summary:
> >>> A team of engineers has proven that their analog computing device,
> >>> called a memristor, can complete complex, scientific computing tasks
> >>> while bypassing the limitations of digital computing.
> >>> https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2024/03/240314145325.htm
> >>>
> >>> bit like our neural nets...
> >>
> >> I have an issue with calling a memristor a 'computing device'. If
> >> you accept that, then so are capacitors and inductors!
> >
> > I don't see the problem. Switches, relays, beads on a string can all be
> > computing devices - and not all of them have 'memories'. Pots have been
> > used as computing elements on the front panel of analogue computers for
> > years, so what is the difference between them (set by hand) and a
> > memristor (set electronically)?
> >
> > ...and yes, capacitors are definitely computing devices: Blumlein/Miller
> > integrator.
>
> Well, then so is any electronic component.
>
> I'm old enough to have played with analog computers. They were
> fun to solve differential equations with. Not necessarily
> electronic, either. I've also done it with pneumatic stuff,
> bellows, nozzles and flapper valves, and with water levels in
> vertical pipes. Those were real fun too. You could *see* what
> was going on without instrumentation.

Whiffle tree?
Used in player pianos and organs for converting binary pneumatic signals
into analogue movement. (...and previous to that, for summing the
tractive effort of a team of horses.)

--
~ Liz Tuddenham ~
(Remove the ".invalid"s and add ".co.uk" to reply)
www.poppyrecords.co.uk

On Mon, 18 Mar 2024 17:29:11 +0100, Jeroen Belleman
<jeroen@nospam.please> wrote:

>On 3/18/24 17:01, John Larkin wrote:
>> On Mon, 18 Mar 2024 04:55:14 GMT, Jan Panteltje <alien@comet.invalid>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Source:
>>> University of Massachusetts Amherst
>>> Summary:
>>> A team of engineers has proven that their analog computing device, called a memristor, can complete complex, scientific computing tasks while bypassing the limitations of digital computing.
>>> https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2024/03/240314145325.htm
>>>
>>> bit like our neural nets...
>>
>> Most universities now have a team of publicists that prowl the
>> hallways for miracles to announce. Rags like Sciencedaily need input.
>>
>> This one is even more fun:
>>
>> https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2024/03/240314122109.htm
>>
>> "The device produces energy outputs exceeding 100 volts"
>>
>> Check out their source, cell.com.
>>
>>
>
>I'm surprised they don't claim you can charge your phone with it.
>
>Jeroen Belleman

The top hat on the duck turns out to be the critical element.

https://www.amazon.com/Forum-Novelties-Retro-Happy-Drinking/dp/B00GYDDQ8U

On Mon, 18 Mar 2024 07:59:14 -0700, John Larkin <jl@997PotHill.com>
wrote:

>On Mon, 18 Mar 2024 12:37:02 -0000 (UTC), "Don" <g@crcomp.net> wrote:
>
>>Jan Panteltje wrote:
>>> Jeroen Belleman wrote:
>>>> Jan Panteltje wrote:
>>>>> Source:
>>>>> University of Massachusetts Amherst
>>>>> Summary:
>>>>> A team of engineers has proven that their analog computing device, called a
>>>>> memristor, can complete complex, scientific
>>>>> computing tasks while bypassing the limitations of digital computing.
>>>>> https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2024/03/240314145325.htm
>>>>>
>>>>> bit like our neural nets...
>>>>
>>>>I have an issue with calling a memristor a 'computing device'. If
>>>
>>> If you can do matrix computations with it why not?
>>> quote from that llnk:
>>> "When organized into a crossbar array,
>>> such a memristive circuit does analog computing by using physical laws
>>> in a massively parallel fashion, substantially accelerating matrix operation
>>,
>>> the most frequently used but very power-hungry computation in neural networks
>>> "
>>>
>>>>If you accept that, then so are capacitors and inductors!
>>>
>>> Well you could store analog info in CMOS too, even in capacitors.
>>> Inductors? not so sure, not so easy for a long time?
>>
>>Does core memory qualify as inductors?
>>
>>Danke,
>
>Sure.

Here are some:

https://www.dropbox.com/sh/zwv8c15rh5t791f/AADT2pjOBm1cONXXPe3I_FI8a?dl=0

When I was a kid, IBM made news by announcing that they had reduced
the price of CPU core memory to a million dollars per megabyte.

A million dollars was a lot of money back then.

On a sunny day (Mon, 18 Mar 2024 12:37:02 -0000 (UTC)) it happened "Don"
<g@crcomp.net> wrote in <20240318a@crcomp.net>:

>Jan Panteltje wrote:
>> Jeroen Belleman wrote:
>>> Jan Panteltje wrote:
>>>> Source:
>>>> University of Massachusetts Amherst
>>>> Summary:
>>>> A team of engineers has proven that their analog computing device, called a
>>>> memristor, can complete complex, scientific
>>>> computing tasks while bypassing the limitations of digital computing.
>>>> https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2024/03/240314145325.htm
>>>>
>>>> bit like our neural nets...
>>>
>>>I have an issue with calling a memristor a 'computing device'. If
>>
>> If you can do matrix computations with it why not?
>> quote from that llnk:
>> "When organized into a crossbar array,
>> such a memristive circuit does analog computing by using physical laws
>> in a massively parallel fashion, substantially accelerating matrix operation
>,
>> the most frequently used but very power-hungry computation in neural networks
>> "
>>
>>>If you accept that, then so are capacitors and inductors!
>>
>> Well you could store analog info in CMOS too, even in capacitors.
>> Inductors? not so sure, not so easy for a long time?
>
>Does core memory qualify as inductors?

No, that is magnetic storage.
You could use a stepper motor (also uses an inductor) to set a value to to some thing too.
Memory is not that hard.
Mechanical, old 78 rpm records store even music.
Books, printing.
Processing it more difficult, but we can read the books and do the math described.

Jan Panteltje <alien@comet.invalid> wrote:

> Mechanical, old 78 rpm records store even music.

They were also used for data. The WWII transatlantic telephone
scrambler system used "one-time records" (like a one-time pad) to
synchronise the encoding and decoding of the audio bands.

(I'm not sure where I came across that, but I think it could be hidden
away in either the 'cdvandt' or the Crypto museum websites.)

--
~ Liz Tuddenham ~
(Remove the ".invalid"s and add ".co.uk" to reply)
www.poppyrecords.co.uk

On a sunny day (Tue, 19 Mar 2024 08:55:59 +0000) it happened
liz@poppyrecords.invalid.invalid (Liz Tuddenham) wrote in
<1qqnsje.160u1is1cm93gcN%liz@poppyrecords.invalid.invalid>:

>Jan Panteltje <alien@comet.invalid> wrote:
>
>
>> Mechanical, old 78 rpm records store even music.
>
>They were also used for data. The WWII transatlantic telephone
>scrambler system used "one-time records" (like a one-time pad) to
>synchronise the encoding and decoding of the audio bands.
>
>(I'm not sure where I came across that, but I think it could be hidden
>away in either the 'cdvandt' or the Crypto museum websites.)

Some googling found it:
https://www.cryptomuseum.com/crypto/usa/sigsaly/index.htm

Some setup!

Jeroen Belleman wrote:
> Don wrote:
>> Jan Panteltje wrote:
>>> Jeroen Belleman wrote:
>>>> Jan Panteltje wrote:
>>>>> Source:
>>>>> University of Massachusetts Amherst
>>>>> Summary:
>>>>> A team of engineers has proven that their analog computing device, called a
>>>>> memristor, can complete complex, scientific
>>>>> computing tasks while bypassing the limitations of digital computing.
>>>>> https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2024/03/240314145325.htm
>>>>>
>>>>> bit like our neural nets...
>>>>
>>>> I have an issue with calling a memristor a 'computing device'. If
>>>
>>> If you can do matrix computations with it why not?
>>> quote from that llnk:
>>> "When organized into a crossbar array,
>>> such a memristive circuit does analog computing by using physical laws
>>> in a massively parallel fashion, substantially accelerating matrix operation,
>>> the most frequently used but very power-hungry computation in neural networks
>>> "
>>>
>>>> If you accept that, then so are capacitors and inductors!
>>>
>>> Well you could store analog info in CMOS too, even in capacitors.
>>> Inductors? not so sure, not so easy for a long time?
>>
>> Does core memory qualify as inductors?
>
> Memory cores have a very wide hysteresis. You need a fair bit of
> current to magnetize them, and when they do, they go straight into
> saturation and stay there when the current is removed. You have to
> reverse the current to magnetize them the other way and again will
> flip the whole way.
>
> That's why they were useful as memory. As inductors, not so much.

Well said! This take on the Two-Capacitor Paradox ironically illustrates
intrisic inductance:

Learning from the Two-Capacitor Paradox: Do Capacitance and Inductance Exist?
<https://www.comsol.com/blogs/learning-from-the-two-capacitor-paradox-do-capacitance-and-inductance-exist>

Danke,

--
Don, KB7RPU, https://www.qsl.net/kb7rpu
There was a young lady named Bright Whose speed was far faster than light;
She set out one day In a relative way And returned on the previous night.