https://whattalks.com/
plate tectonics & hominoid splittings

littor...@gmail.com wrote:
> https://whattalks.com/
> plate tectonics & hominoid splittings

I literally just got home -- was on a 24 Hour Film Project team -- but I'll
try to be awake in two hours... don't know if I can make it but good
luck if I can't!

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https://jtem.tumblr.com/post/716364343858561024

JTEM is so reasonable wrote:

> littor...@gmail.com wrote:
> > https://whattalks.com/
> > plate tectonics & hominoid splittings

> I literally just got home -- was on a 24 Hour Film Project team -- but I'll
> try to be awake in two hours... don't know if I can make it but good
> luck if I can't!

48 hour:

https://www.48hourfilm.com/boston

We went all night, didn't wrap until like 6:30am and even then there was
a lot of editing to do... but I didn't need to it so I could try to get some
sleep.

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https://jtem.tumblr.com/post/716364343858561024

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qh5DKyhvYFc

Primum Sapienti wrote:
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qh5DKyhvYFc

What did you get from the video? What struck you as new, different?

What did you find compelling?

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https://jtem.tumblr.com/post/716364343858561024

> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qh5DKyhvYFc

Sigh... the usual outdated anthropocentrically biased interpretations...
Naledi was no Homo, of course, it was an ape:
Pan or Australopithecus naledi,
google e.g. "verhaegen naledi".

littor...@gmail.com wrote:

> > https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qh5DKyhvYFc
>
> Sigh... the usual outdated anthropocentrically biased interpretations...
> Naledi was no Homo, of course, it was an ape:
> Pan or Australopithecus naledi,
> google e.g. "verhaegen naledi".

I've been disagreeing with EVERYTHING Naledi since it first hit the media.

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https://jtem.tumblr.com/post/716884097016971264

Op woensdag 10 mei 2023 om 18:53:38 UTC+2 schreef JTEM is so reasonable:

troll, totally irrelevant:
> > > https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qh5DKyhvYFc

> > Sigh... the usual outdated anthropocentrically biased interpretations....
> > Naledi was no Homo, of course, it was an ape:
> > Pan or Australopithecus naledi,
> > google e.g. "verhaegen naledi".

> I've been disagreeing with EVERYTHING Naledi since it first hit the media..

Yes, it's incredible how unscientific traditional PAs were & many still are!!
There's nothing "mysterious" about naledi: simply a fossil Pan:
Naledi’s human-like traits are not human-derived, but primitive-hominid:
- Fore-feet were indeed somewhat human-like, but this is also seen in prenatal Pan.
- Hands +-humanlike, but hand-bones longer & curved for vertical climbing.
- Thicker enamel than Pan: wetland vegetation, cf. gorillas wading for seges, bonobos wading for waterlilies...
- Small canine teeth: adapted to / worn down by wetland vegetation...
-- Small hominid, generally bonobo-like Pan paniscus, e.g. narrow heel.
-- Much too recent (~250 ka?) & too ape-like to be Homo.
-- Ape-sized brain.
-- Last molars largest (M3) cf apes/apiths, unlike Homo.
-- Thorax & scapula very ape- & apith-like, unlike Homo.
-- Pelvis wide & femoral neck long (for leg abduction), apith-like.

Naledi’s earbone incus = chimp- & apith-like, but many PAs are still convinced (with 0 evidence) that they're "primitive human" :
"Description and analysis of three Homo naledi incudes from the Dinaledi Chamber, Rising Star cave (South Africa)" Elliott MC cs2018 JHE 122:146-155 doi 10.1016/j.jhevol.2018.06.008
"We describe 3 incudes (plural of "incus" ear ossicle --mv) recovered … during sieving of excavated sediments, likely 3 H.naledi individuals.. Morphologically & metrically, the ossicles resemble chimps & Par.robustus more than later members of the genus Homo (!! they already anthropocentrically *assume* it's evolvin towards us!! --mv), they fall outside (!? --mv) the H.sapiens range of variation in several dimensions. Despite this, when overall size is considered, the functional lengths in H.naledi & P.robustus are very similar to those predicted for a human with a similar-sized incus. In this sense, both taxa seem to show a rel.elongated functional length, distinguishing them from chimps. The functional length in H.naledi is slightly longer in absolute terms than in P.robustus: naledi may already (again anthropocentrism! --mv) show a slight increase in functional length compared with early hominins. H.naledi lacks the more open angle between the long & short processes found in H.sapiens (considered a derived feature within the genus Homo), but the value in naledi is similar to that predicted for a hominoid(! --mv) with a similar-sized incus. PCA of size-standardized variables shows naledi falling outside(! --mv) of the sapiens range of variation, but within the confidence ellipse for gorillas. Phylogenetic polarity is complicated by the absence of incus data from early members (anthropocentric!! --mv) of Homo, but the generally primitive (?? id. --mv) nature of the naledi incudes is cons.x other primitive (!! --mv) features of naledi, e.g. very small cranial capacity ... "

Full Plantigrady:
Fetal chimp feet resemble ours (1st toe long + pointing forward): “Only as it approaches its birth does its foot acquire the appearance of a hand. At no stage of its development does the human foot resemble that of an adult ape.” Carleton Coon "The Story of Man" p.12, IOW, the human foot is generally more primitive-hominid than the chimp’s.
This foot was originally NOT for running, e.g. ostrich & kangaroo feet (real running bipeds): the outer toes are atrophied, but the middle toes are very long & strong (digiti-grady), the opposite of human feet: humans, prenatal chimps, apiths & naledi have flattened feet, with rel.longer outer digital rays (full planti-grady), as in wading/swimming tetrapods.
Comparative Anatomy is clear: human feet evolved from climbing- via swimming/wading- to walking-feet.

All apiths lived in wetlands (Reed 1997 JHE), not running on savannas!!:
- gracile apiths “existed in fairly wooded, well-watered regions”,
- robust apiths “in similar environs & also in more open regions, but always in habitats that include wetlands.”
AL-288 Lucy fossilized in a small slow-moving stream: Johanson & Taieb 1976: “Fossil preservation at this locality is excellent, remains of delicate items such as crocodile & turtle eggs & crab claws being found.”
AL-333 A.afarensis, large bone-collection cf.naledi : Radosevich cs 1992: “The bones were found in swale-like features … very likely they died and partially rotted at or very near this site … this group of hominids was buried in streamside gallery woodland.”

"Deliberate Burial" of naledi = ridiculous anthropocentric fantasy!!
All naledi-fossils were found “in orange mud-clasts embedded in a brown muddy matrix” (orange mud = unoxidated, brown mud = oxidated).
Naledi fossils simply collapsed from the mud-clast breccia above.
“I am a member of the club who made the discovery of the Naledi Fossil … The cave itself has been known to us, and visited frequently for as long as I have been a member. It has indeed been well surveyed: what initially started as 3 different cave systems were all eventually interconnected to create 1 large system. The fossils were discovered in a section known as the Dragon’s Back. This section was visited & surveyed, and has never seen visitors since the survey was first created (I stand to be corrected but I believe 1980s). A new adventurous member of the club – Steven – set out to re-explore the cave. His visit to the chamber was met with the discovery of the first mandible which had collapsed from the breccia above.(!! --mv) It was more a matter of good luck & 20 yrs of nature’s impact that led to the discovery ...” Steven Tucker & Nick Hunter http://ncse.com/blog/2015/10/cave-homo-naledi-textbook-example-how-to-do-science-0016693#comment-2319909560

Ridiculous traditional anthropocentric fantasies about naledi:
-- Homo naledi?? Too recent to be Homo! Homo-like features in naledi are simply early-hominid e.g. feet.
-- Tool-makers? 0 evidence. Small brains. Chimps also make tools.
-- Distance running?? :-DDD No !! Flat feet (vs cursorials) for wading/swimming.
-- Deliberate burial?? :-DDD Far-fetched anthropocentrism.

Concl.: traditional PAs produce ridiculous anthropocentric fantasies about apiths as "human ancestors"!
Apiths incl.naledi were simply fossil relatives of Pan or Gorilla.
Retroviral evidence situates Pliocene Homo in Asia!

JTEM is so reasonable wrote:
> littor...@gmail.com wrote:
>
>>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qh5DKyhvYFc
>>
>> Sigh... the usual outdated anthropocentrically biased interpretations...
>> Naledi was no Homo, of course, it was an ape:
>> Pan or Australopithecus naledi,
>> google e.g. "verhaegen naledi".
>
> I've been disagreeing with EVERYTHING Naledi since it first hit the media.

Is that what they teach you in film school?

> >>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qh5DKyhvYFc

me:
> >> Sigh... the usual outdated anthropocentrically biased interpretations....
> >> Naledi was no Homo, of course, it was an ape: Pan or Australopithecus naledi,
> >> google e.g. "verhaegen naledi".

JTEM:
> > I've been disagreeing with EVERYTHING Naledi since it first hit the media.

Yes, but some imbecile:
> Is that what they teach you in film school?

??

There's 0 "mysterious" about naledi:
simply a fossil Pan: naledi’s human-like traits were primitive-hominid, not human-derived:
- Fore-feet were indeed somewhat human-like, but this is also seen in prenatal Pan.
- Hands +-humanlike, but hand-bones longer & curved for vertical climbing.
- Thicker enamel than Pan: wetland vegetation, cf. gorillas wading for seges, bonobos wading for waterlilies...
- Small canine teeth: adapted to / worn down by wetland vegetation...
-- Small hominid, generally bonobo-like Pan paniscus, e.g. narrow heel.
-- Much too recent (~250 ka?) & too ape-like to be Homo.
-- Ape-sized brain.
-- Last molars largest (M3) cf apes/apiths, unlike Homo.
-- Thorax & scapula very ape- & apith-like, unlike Homo.
-- Pelvis wide & femoral neck long (for leg abduction), apith-like.

Primum Sapienti wrote:

> Is that

19 years ago. Usenet. If I posted the crap they've claimed about
Naledi, if I told you what was coming, in order, and explained the
delays, you'd dismiss it all as a very sad & pathetic troll.

You have your "Truth" and don't give a shit about facts. And your
"Truths" are bestowed upon you by your priests.

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