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tech / sci.space.policy / Re: Orbital launch pad

SubjectAuthor
* Orbital launch padJF Mezei
`* Re: Orbital launch padSnidely
 `- Re: Orbital launch padJF Mezei

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Orbital launch pad

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From: jfmezei....@vaxination.ca (JF Mezei)
Subject: Orbital launch pad
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 by: JF Mezei - Tue, 27 Apr 2021 09:39 UTC

For a long time now, there have been these angled pylons being called
"Orbital launch site" with no work on them. In the last couple weeks,
much work has happened around these pylons to build actual structures,
add large GSE tanks etc. This has a lot of concrete in it which gives
much more of a sense of permanence compared to the simple metal rigs
that support Startship tests without flame trenchs etc.

Is there any information on whether this orbital launch paid is to be
"iterative design" with new ones build from scratch at regular
intervals, or would this be a final long term facility with just tweaks?

I assume it will have flamne trench, watre sprays for noise supression
and allow longer duration engine tests?

More importantly, is it possible that Boca Chica might become primary
lauch site for Starship/Heavy since SpaceX wouldn't have schedule
constraints (range safety at KSC/Canaveral) and the launch pad is next
door to the machine that spits out new Starships at rapid pace? (so
Transpiort costs and logistics are much reduced).

From a cost point of view, Bca Chica would seem to have huge savings.

Or is the geographoical location of Boca Chica a show stopper to reach
desirable orbits and one really needs to be on east coast?

(I am aware Musk bought old oil rigs, but at this point this is very
speculative).

Would it be fair to state that Boca Chica facility has a beach and that
building a port to ship Starship and Super Heavy on barges is a no-go?
(so those would have to be trucked or flown to Florida?

Re: Orbital launch pad

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From: snidely....@gmail.com (Snidely)
Newsgroups: sci.space.policy
Subject: Re: Orbital launch pad
Date: Wed, 28 Apr 2021 00:50:19 -0700
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 by: Snidely - Wed, 28 Apr 2021 07:50 UTC

JF Mezei formulated the question :
> For a long time now, there have been these angled pylons being called
> "Orbital launch site" with no work on them.

The concrete was curing is my understanding.

> In the last couple weeks,
> much work has happened around these pylons to build actual structures,
> add large GSE tanks etc.

This work has been going on for a long time. When SN8 flew, there was
already a lot of pipes and conduits run, and the main bunker (likely
GSE equipment rooms for pumps, etc) had foundations back then.

There's also been a lot of work on the landing pad, which was expanded
after SN8.

> This has a lot of concrete in it which gives

There's now a lot of concrete around both Pad A and Pad B. None of it
is pylons, but they've certainly been working on the suborbital
facilities.

> much more of a sense of permanence compared to the simple metal rigs
> that support Startship tests without flame trenchs etc.
>
> Is there any information on whether this orbital launch paid is to be
> "iterative design" with new ones build from scratch at regular
> intervals, or would this be a final long term facility with just tweaks?

I expect that the time to build the structures and the size of the
integration tower make it desirable to avoid too many iterations.
They've built 5 Starships and 2 1/2 SuperHeavy's in the time they've
been doing the concrete work.

> I assume it will have flamne trench, watre sprays for noise supression
> and allow longer duration engine tests?

We have yet to see a flame trench or water sprays. The visible parts
of the latter might be one of the last things installed.

> More importantly, is it possible that Boca Chica might become primary
> lauch site for Starship/Heavy since SpaceX wouldn't have schedule
> constraints (range safety at KSC/Canaveral) and the launch pad is next
> door to the machine that spits out new Starships at rapid pace? (so
> Transpiort costs and logistics are much reduced).
>
> From a cost point of view, Bca Chica would seem to have huge savings.
>
> Or is the geographoical location of Boca Chica a show stopper to reach
> desirable orbits and one really needs to be on east coast?

Boca Chica really likes to launch south to avoid over-flying
populations. Fine for polar and a range of sub-orbital targets.

> (I am aware Musk bought old oil rigs, but at this point this is very
> speculative).

Speculative? Maybe. Very speculative? No.

> Would it be fair to state that Boca Chica facility has a beach and that
> building a port to ship Starship and Super Heavy on barges is a no-go?
> (so those would have to be trucked or flown to Florida?

Almost certainly flown. Florida is easy suborbital range for Starship.
But the production facilities in Florida are likely to wake up again.

(SuperHeavy's range might not be as far, especially if it doesn't get
the TPS tiles, but those oil platforms would be easy to land on ....)

/dps

--
Trust, but verify.

Re: Orbital launch pad

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Subject: Re: Orbital launch pad
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 by: JF Mezei - Fri, 30 Apr 2021 21:51 UTC

On 2021-04-28 03:50, Snidely wrote:

> Boca Chica really likes to launch south to avoid over-flying> populations. Fine for polar and a range of sub-orbital targets.

If It can't launch to orbit due east or north east, can it actually fly
to KSC?

Curious on the types of tests that will be needed for a vehicle
traveling from A to B on Earth since it will have much forward speed
during the belly flop manoeuver.

So traveling from Boca Chica to KSC, wouldn't it end up gliding in a
belly-flop atti8tude over Tampa/Orlando at relatively low altitude?

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