https://youtu.be/PPBzihGWsg4

R

On Tuesday, November 22, 2022 at 8:29:12 AM UTC-5, R wrote:
> https://youtu.be/PPBzihGWsg4
>
> R
Good video. OBTP

Great video. Too bad there hasn't been much of this sort of coverage since it was made in 2006.

On Tuesday, November 22, 2022 at 8:16:29 AM UTC-7, Mark Mocho wrote:
> Great video. Too bad there hasn't been much of this sort of coverage since it was made in 2006.
The web site no longer exists. Without significant sponsorship to cover the cost of the technology and the helicopters, it's a non-starter. The DVD sales from the first SGP final in Chile did little to offset the $250,000 cost of the helicopter used to capture the action. IIRC, the original SGP concept was professional pilots and support from the gaming industry. When that didn't pan out, the FAI got involved (amateur sport). SGP live tracking seems to attract something over 5000 viewers, without the video feeds, which would seem to be needed to attract a public and sports network interest.

On Tuesday, November 22, 2022 at 11:57:57 AM UTC-5, Frank Whiteley wrote:
> On Tuesday, November 22, 2022 at 8:16:29 AM UTC-7, Mark Mocho wrote:
> > Great video. Too bad there hasn't been much of this sort of coverage since it was made in 2006.
> The web site no longer exists. Without significant sponsorship to cover the cost of the technology and the helicopters, it's a non-starter. The DVD sales from the first SGP final in Chile did little to offset the $250,000 cost of the helicopter used to capture the action. IIRC, the original SGP concept was professional pilots and support from the gaming industry. When that didn't pan out, the FAI got involved (amateur sport). SGP live tracking seems to attract something over 5000 viewers, without the video feeds, which would seem to be needed to attract a public and sports network interest.

I’m wondering if the SSA had a hyper-razzle-dazzle video of this level, something to show off, promote gliding in U.S.
Send CDs out all over U.S. Sell the cool. Just pondering, the video sure did get a big wow from me.

R

On Tuesday, November 22, 2022 at 4:47:39 PM UTC-5, R wrote:
> On Tuesday, November 22, 2022 at 11:57:57 AM UTC-5, Frank Whiteley wrote:
> > On Tuesday, November 22, 2022 at 8:16:29 AM UTC-7, Mark Mocho wrote:
> > > Great video. Too bad there hasn't been much of this sort of coverage since it was made in 2006.
> > The web site no longer exists. Without significant sponsorship to cover the cost of the technology and the helicopters, it's a non-starter. The DVD sales from the first SGP final in Chile did little to offset the $250,000 cost of the helicopter used to capture the action. IIRC, the original SGP concept was professional pilots and support from the gaming industry. When that didn't pan out, the FAI got involved (amateur sport). SGP live tracking seems to attract something over 5000 viewers, without the video feeds, which would seem to be needed to attract a public and sports network interest..
> I’m wondering if the SSA had a hyper-razzle-dazzle video of this level, something to show off, promote gliding in U.S.
> Send CDs out all over U.S. Sell the cool. Just pondering, the video sure did get a big wow from me.
>
> R
To R,
I really don't think that a video like this would make much difference in the participation of soaring in this country. Take a look at the video, how many young people do you see ? The key to promoting soaring in this country lies at the grass roots, the young and the willing. I go to schools and talk to kids, and we get new participants. We post pictures in a local Facebook page and we get new kids interested in soaring. The target is the young, that is the largest opportunity for growth, do a youth oriented video and measure the results, you may be a bit surprised. OBTP

On Tuesday, November 22, 2022 at 2:47:39 PM UTC-7, R wrote:
> On Tuesday, November 22, 2022 at 11:57:57 AM UTC-5, Frank Whiteley wrote:
> > On Tuesday, November 22, 2022 at 8:16:29 AM UTC-7, Mark Mocho wrote:
> > > Great video. Too bad there hasn't been much of this sort of coverage since it was made in 2006.
> > The web site no longer exists. Without significant sponsorship to cover the cost of the technology and the helicopters, it's a non-starter. The DVD sales from the first SGP final in Chile did little to offset the $250,000 cost of the helicopter used to capture the action. IIRC, the original SGP concept was professional pilots and support from the gaming industry. When that didn't pan out, the FAI got involved (amateur sport). SGP live tracking seems to attract something over 5000 viewers, without the video feeds, which would seem to be needed to attract a public and sports network interest..
> I’m wondering if the SSA had a hyper-razzle-dazzle video of this level, something to show off, promote gliding in U.S.
> Send CDs out all over U.S. Sell the cool. Just pondering, the video sure did get a big wow from me.
>
> R
R-
SSA has been marketing on social media with some short videos. Although there has yet to be a survey, there are waiting lists for training of up to a year at several soaring sites around the US. So far I haven't found a site asking for more students, however, North Florida Soaring Society has a running ad on Barnstormers.com.
Frank

On Tuesday, November 22, 2022 at 6:22:45 PM UTC-5, Frank Whiteley wrote:
> On Tuesday, November 22, 2022 at 2:47:39 PM UTC-7, R wrote:
> > On Tuesday, November 22, 2022 at 11:57:57 AM UTC-5, Frank Whiteley wrote:
> > > On Tuesday, November 22, 2022 at 8:16:29 AM UTC-7, Mark Mocho wrote:
> > > > Great video. Too bad there hasn't been much of this sort of coverage since it was made in 2006.
> > > The web site no longer exists. Without significant sponsorship to cover the cost of the technology and the helicopters, it's a non-starter. The DVD sales from the first SGP final in Chile did little to offset the $250,000 cost of the helicopter used to capture the action. IIRC, the original SGP concept was professional pilots and support from the gaming industry. When that didn't pan out, the FAI got involved (amateur sport). SGP live tracking seems to attract something over 5000 viewers, without the video feeds, which would seem to be needed to attract a public and sports network interest.
> > I’m wondering if the SSA had a hyper-razzle-dazzle video of this level, something to show off, promote gliding in U.S.
> > Send CDs out all over U.S. Sell the cool. Just pondering, the video sure did get a big wow from me.
> >
> > R
> R-
> SSA has been marketing on social media with some short videos. Although there has yet to be a survey, there are waiting lists for training of up to a year at several soaring sites around the US. So far I haven't found a site asking for more students, however, North Florida Soaring Society has a running ad on Barnstormers.com.
> Fran

Interesting….If true…the conduit feeding members into the sport is broken or inefficient, so it seems. A Marketing Promotional Czar is needed. Take charge person…..maybe the FTX guy who sold 5 Billion$ crypto$ to knuckleheads. It’s not the product…gliding is simply not ‘out there’. Made achievable. But if schools are backed up….no sense promoting to only have people disappointed waiting.
So, the question is,,,what is needed?

R

On Tuesday, November 22, 2022 at 3:22:45 PM UTC-8, Frank Whiteley wrote:
> On Tuesday, November 22, 2022 at 2:47:39 PM UTC-7, R wrote:
> > On Tuesday, November 22, 2022 at 11:57:57 AM UTC-5, Frank Whiteley wrote:
> > > On Tuesday, November 22, 2022 at 8:16:29 AM UTC-7, Mark Mocho wrote:
> > > > Great video. Too bad there hasn't been much of this sort of coverage since it was made in 2006.
> > > The web site no longer exists. Without significant sponsorship to cover the cost of the technology and the helicopters, it's a non-starter. The DVD sales from the first SGP final in Chile did little to offset the $250,000 cost of the helicopter used to capture the action. IIRC, the original SGP concept was professional pilots and support from the gaming industry. When that didn't pan out, the FAI got involved (amateur sport). SGP live tracking seems to attract something over 5000 viewers, without the video feeds, which would seem to be needed to attract a public and sports network interest.
> > I’m wondering if the SSA had a hyper-razzle-dazzle video of this level, something to show off, promote gliding in U.S.
> > Send CDs out all over U.S. Sell the cool. Just pondering, the video sure did get a big wow from me.
> >
> > R
> R-
> SSA has been marketing on social media with some short videos. Although there has yet to be a survey, there are waiting lists for training of up to a year at several soaring sites around the US. So far I haven't found a site asking for more students, however, North Florida Soaring Society has a running ad on Barnstormers.com.
> Frank
Frank,

Are the waiting lists a capacity issue or something else? High demand and low supply of instructors and/or gliders? Limited outfits (club or commercial) providing the training?

On Tuesday, November 22, 2022 at 5:32:10 PM UTC-8, Jon wrote:
> On Tuesday, November 22, 2022 at 3:22:45 PM UTC-8, Frank Whiteley wrote:
> > On Tuesday, November 22, 2022 at 2:47:39 PM UTC-7, R wrote:
> > > On Tuesday, November 22, 2022 at 11:57:57 AM UTC-5, Frank Whiteley wrote:
> > > > On Tuesday, November 22, 2022 at 8:16:29 AM UTC-7, Mark Mocho wrote:
> > > > > Great video. Too bad there hasn't been much of this sort of coverage since it was made in 2006.
> > > > The web site no longer exists. Without significant sponsorship to cover the cost of the technology and the helicopters, it's a non-starter. The DVD sales from the first SGP final in Chile did little to offset the $250,000 cost of the helicopter used to capture the action. IIRC, the original SGP concept was professional pilots and support from the gaming industry. When that didn't pan out, the FAI got involved (amateur sport). SGP live tracking seems to attract something over 5000 viewers, without the video feeds, which would seem to be needed to attract a public and sports network interest.
> > > I’m wondering if the SSA had a hyper-razzle-dazzle video of this level, something to show off, promote gliding in U.S.
> > > Send CDs out all over U.S. Sell the cool. Just pondering, the video sure did get a big wow from me.
> > >
> > > R
> > R-
> > SSA has been marketing on social media with some short videos. Although there has yet to be a survey, there are waiting lists for training of up to a year at several soaring sites around the US. So far I haven't found a site asking for more students, however, North Florida Soaring Society has a running ad on Barnstormers.com.
> > Frank
> Frank,
>
> Are the waiting lists a capacity issue or something else? High demand and low supply of instructors and/or gliders? Limited outfits (club or commercial) providing the training?
The biggest issue my club has is instructor availability.. We’re working on a solution.

Charlie

On Tuesday, November 22, 2022 at 6:05:52 PM UTC-7, R wrote:
> On Tuesday, November 22, 2022 at 6:22:45 PM UTC-5, Frank Whiteley wrote:
> > On Tuesday, November 22, 2022 at 2:47:39 PM UTC-7, R wrote:
> > > On Tuesday, November 22, 2022 at 11:57:57 AM UTC-5, Frank Whiteley wrote:
> > > > On Tuesday, November 22, 2022 at 8:16:29 AM UTC-7, Mark Mocho wrote:
> > > > > Great video. Too bad there hasn't been much of this sort of coverage since it was made in 2006.
> > > > The web site no longer exists. Without significant sponsorship to cover the cost of the technology and the helicopters, it's a non-starter. The DVD sales from the first SGP final in Chile did little to offset the $250,000 cost of the helicopter used to capture the action. IIRC, the original SGP concept was professional pilots and support from the gaming industry. When that didn't pan out, the FAI got involved (amateur sport). SGP live tracking seems to attract something over 5000 viewers, without the video feeds, which would seem to be needed to attract a public and sports network interest.
> > > I’m wondering if the SSA had a hyper-razzle-dazzle video of this level, something to show off, promote gliding in U.S.
> > > Send CDs out all over U.S. Sell the cool. Just pondering, the video sure did get a big wow from me.
> > >
> > > R
> > R-
> > SSA has been marketing on social media with some short videos. Although there has yet to be a survey, there are waiting lists for training of up to a year at several soaring sites around the US. So far I haven't found a site asking for more students, however, North Florida Soaring Society has a running ad on Barnstormers.com.
> > Fran
> Interesting….If true…the conduit feeding members into the sport is broken or inefficient, so it seems. A Marketing Promotional Czar is needed. Take charge person…..maybe the FTX guy who sold 5 Billion$ crypto$ to knuckleheads. It’s not the product…gliding is simply not ‘out there’. Made achievable. But if schools are backed up….no sense promoting to only have people disappointed waiting.
> So, the question is,,,what is needed?
>
> R
When people have to wait up to a year to get training, they are likely to find another interest. Growing more instructors would help as it seems to be a choke point. I had a long chat with Bob Wander recently and he suggests providing a more professional training environment is important, whether in a club or commercial operation, and something which is being done at Minnesota Soaring Club by moving some of the training away from the weekend. Instructor burn-out is also an issue to keep in mind.

Frank

On Tuesday, November 22, 2022 at 8:05:52 PM UTC-5, R wrote:
> On Tuesday, November 22, 2022 at 6:22:45 PM UTC-5, Frank Whiteley wrote:
> > On Tuesday, November 22, 2022 at 2:47:39 PM UTC-7, R wrote:
> > > On Tuesday, November 22, 2022 at 11:57:57 AM UTC-5, Frank Whiteley wrote:
> > > > On Tuesday, November 22, 2022 at 8:16:29 AM UTC-7, Mark Mocho wrote:
> > > > > Great video. Too bad there hasn't been much of this sort of coverage since it was made in 2006.
> > > > The web site no longer exists. Without significant sponsorship to cover the cost of the technology and the helicopters, it's a non-starter. The DVD sales from the first SGP final in Chile did little to offset the $250,000 cost of the helicopter used to capture the action. IIRC, the original SGP concept was professional pilots and support from the gaming industry. When that didn't pan out, the FAI got involved (amateur sport). SGP live tracking seems to attract something over 5000 viewers, without the video feeds, which would seem to be needed to attract a public and sports network interest.
> > > I’m wondering if the SSA had a hyper-razzle-dazzle video of this level, something to show off, promote gliding in U.S.
> > > Send CDs out all over U.S. Sell the cool. Just pondering, the video sure did get a big wow from me.
> > >
> > > R
> > R-
> > SSA has been marketing on social media with some short videos. Although there has yet to be a survey, there are waiting lists for training of up to a year at several soaring sites around the US. So far I haven't found a site asking for more students, however, North Florida Soaring Society has a running ad on Barnstormers.com.
> > Fran
> Interesting….If true…the conduit feeding members into the sport is broken or inefficient, so it seems. A Marketing Promotional Czar is needed. Take charge person…..maybe the FTX guy who sold 5 Billion$ crypto$ to knuckleheads. It’s not the product…gliding is simply not ‘out there’. Made achievable. But if schools are backed up….no sense promoting to only have people disappointed waiting.
> So, the question is,,,what is needed?
>
> R
The Train is off the track, get the Train back on the track! OBTP

On Tuesday, November 22, 2022 at 6:32:10 PM UTC-7, Jon wrote:
> On Tuesday, November 22, 2022 at 3:22:45 PM UTC-8, Frank Whiteley wrote:
> > On Tuesday, November 22, 2022 at 2:47:39 PM UTC-7, R wrote:
> > > On Tuesday, November 22, 2022 at 11:57:57 AM UTC-5, Frank Whiteley wrote:
> > > > On Tuesday, November 22, 2022 at 8:16:29 AM UTC-7, Mark Mocho wrote:
> > > > > Great video. Too bad there hasn't been much of this sort of coverage since it was made in 2006.
> > > > The web site no longer exists. Without significant sponsorship to cover the cost of the technology and the helicopters, it's a non-starter. The DVD sales from the first SGP final in Chile did little to offset the $250,000 cost of the helicopter used to capture the action. IIRC, the original SGP concept was professional pilots and support from the gaming industry. When that didn't pan out, the FAI got involved (amateur sport). SGP live tracking seems to attract something over 5000 viewers, without the video feeds, which would seem to be needed to attract a public and sports network interest.
> > > I’m wondering if the SSA had a hyper-razzle-dazzle video of this level, something to show off, promote gliding in U.S.
> > > Send CDs out all over U.S. Sell the cool. Just pondering, the video sure did get a big wow from me.
> > >
> > > R
> > R-
> > SSA has been marketing on social media with some short videos. Although there has yet to be a survey, there are waiting lists for training of up to a year at several soaring sites around the US. So far I haven't found a site asking for more students, however, North Florida Soaring Society has a running ad on Barnstormers.com.
> > Frank
> Frank,
>
> Are the waiting lists a capacity issue or something else? High demand and low supply of instructors and/or gliders? Limited outfits (club or commercial) providing the training?
It's a mix. In a club/chapter, operating more days may be an option. The soaring season varies by latitude, so some operations may operate more intensely for a few months. Sugarbush Soaring schedules Youth Camps during the summer and offers ab-initio and advanced training courses. One commercial operation has several ride pilots who are also CFI-Gs but will no longer sit in the rear of a 2-33 to instruct, so fleet availability is not the issue, but fleet composition. They had a wait list of 13 students and 6 STEM students last time I checked. They did just add a young lady as a CFI-G, so maybe they are clearing some of the backlog.

On Tuesday, November 22, 2022 at 9:58:18 PM UTC-5, Frank Whiteley wrote:
> On Tuesday, November 22, 2022 at 6:05:52 PM UTC-7, R wrote:
> > On Tuesday, November 22, 2022 at 6:22:45 PM UTC-5, Frank Whiteley wrote:
> > > On Tuesday, November 22, 2022 at 2:47:39 PM UTC-7, R wrote:
> > > > On Tuesday, November 22, 2022 at 11:57:57 AM UTC-5, Frank Whiteley wrote:
> > > > > On Tuesday, November 22, 2022 at 8:16:29 AM UTC-7, Mark Mocho wrote:
> > > > > > Great video. Too bad there hasn't been much of this sort of coverage since it was made in 2006.
> > > > > The web site no longer exists. Without significant sponsorship to cover the cost of the technology and the helicopters, it's a non-starter. The DVD sales from the first SGP final in Chile did little to offset the $250,000 cost of the helicopter used to capture the action. IIRC, the original SGP concept was professional pilots and support from the gaming industry. When that didn't pan out, the FAI got involved (amateur sport). SGP live tracking seems to attract something over 5000 viewers, without the video feeds, which would seem to be needed to attract a public and sports network interest.
> > > > I’m wondering if the SSA had a hyper-razzle-dazzle video of this level, something to show off, promote gliding in U.S.
> > > > Send CDs out all over U.S. Sell the cool. Just pondering, the video sure did get a big wow from me.
> > > >
> > > > R
> > > R-
> > > SSA has been marketing on social media with some short videos. Although there has yet to be a survey, there are waiting lists for training of up to a year at several soaring sites around the US. So far I haven't found a site asking for more students, however, North Florida Soaring Society has a running ad on Barnstormers.com.
> > > Fran
> > Interesting….If true…the conduit feeding members into the sport is broken or inefficient, so it seems. A Marketing Promotional Czar is needed. Take charge person…..maybe the FTX guy who sold 5 Billion$ crypto$ to knuckleheads. It’s not the product…gliding is simply not ‘out there’. Made achievable. But if schools are backed up….no sense promoting to only have people disappointed waiting.
> > So, the question is,,,what is needed?
> >
> > R
> When people have to wait up to a year to get training, they are likely to find another interest. Growing more instructors would help as it seems to be a choke point. I had a long chat with Bob Wander recently and he suggests providing a more professional training environment is important, whether in a club or commercial operation, and something which is being done at Minnesota Soaring Club by moving some of the training away from the weekend. Instructor burn-out is also an issue to keep in mind.
>
> Frank
So moving youth training away from the weekend, when that is the only time they have available, will do what? Adding new glider pilots to the sport is fundamental for the survival and growth. My observation is that they are coming from the younger age groups like in our case 13 to 25 years. This hasn't happened by mistake, but rather by design. OBTP

On Tuesday, November 22, 2022 at 8:19:46 PM UTC-7, youngbl...@gmail.com wrote:
> On Tuesday, November 22, 2022 at 9:58:18 PM UTC-5, Frank Whiteley wrote:
> > On Tuesday, November 22, 2022 at 6:05:52 PM UTC-7, R wrote:
> > > On Tuesday, November 22, 2022 at 6:22:45 PM UTC-5, Frank Whiteley wrote:
> > > > On Tuesday, November 22, 2022 at 2:47:39 PM UTC-7, R wrote:
> > > > > On Tuesday, November 22, 2022 at 11:57:57 AM UTC-5, Frank Whiteley wrote:
> > > > > > On Tuesday, November 22, 2022 at 8:16:29 AM UTC-7, Mark Mocho wrote:
> > > > > > > Great video. Too bad there hasn't been much of this sort of coverage since it was made in 2006.
> > > > > > The web site no longer exists. Without significant sponsorship to cover the cost of the technology and the helicopters, it's a non-starter.. The DVD sales from the first SGP final in Chile did little to offset the $250,000 cost of the helicopter used to capture the action. IIRC, the original SGP concept was professional pilots and support from the gaming industry. When that didn't pan out, the FAI got involved (amateur sport). SGP live tracking seems to attract something over 5000 viewers, without the video feeds, which would seem to be needed to attract a public and sports network interest.
> > > > > I’m wondering if the SSA had a hyper-razzle-dazzle video of this level, something to show off, promote gliding in U.S.
> > > > > Send CDs out all over U.S. Sell the cool. Just pondering, the video sure did get a big wow from me.
> > > > >
> > > > > R
> > > > R-
> > > > SSA has been marketing on social media with some short videos. Although there has yet to be a survey, there are waiting lists for training of up to a year at several soaring sites around the US. So far I haven't found a site asking for more students, however, North Florida Soaring Society has a running ad on Barnstormers.com.
> > > > Fran
> > > Interesting….If true…the conduit feeding members into the sport is broken or inefficient, so it seems. A Marketing Promotional Czar is needed. Take charge person…..maybe the FTX guy who sold 5 Billion$ crypto$ to knuckleheads. It’s not the product…gliding is simply not ‘out there’. Made achievable. But if schools are backed up….no sense promoting to only have people disappointed waiting.
> > > So, the question is,,,what is needed?
> > >
> > > R
> > When people have to wait up to a year to get training, they are likely to find another interest. Growing more instructors would help as it seems to be a choke point. I had a long chat with Bob Wander recently and he suggests providing a more professional training environment is important, whether in a club or commercial operation, and something which is being done at Minnesota Soaring Club by moving some of the training away from the weekend. Instructor burn-out is also an issue to keep in mind.
> >
> > Frank
> So moving youth training away from the weekend, when that is the only time they have available, will do what? Adding new glider pilots to the sport is fundamental for the survival and growth. My observation is that they are coming from the younger age groups like in our case 13 to 25 years. This hasn't happened by mistake, but rather by design. OBTP
The chapter I mentioned operates mostly during the summer soaring season. Soaring in WI, Minnesota, and Illinois usually commences the first part of April and a few start in early May. By the time members get their annual checks and currency out of the way, school's out and young people may be available during the week until August or September. One of the CFI-Gs involved says it allows them to give full attention to the student rather than jumping from student to student on the weekends, resulting in better progress for the student and a more productive session. Some states now have school year round. That's a different issue.

Frank

On Tuesday, November 22, 2022 at 10:45:39 PM UTC-5, Frank Whiteley wrote:
> On Tuesday, November 22, 2022 at 8:19:46 PM UTC-7, youngbl...@gmail.com wrote:
> > On Tuesday, November 22, 2022 at 9:58:18 PM UTC-5, Frank Whiteley wrote:
> > > On Tuesday, November 22, 2022 at 6:05:52 PM UTC-7, R wrote:
> > > > On Tuesday, November 22, 2022 at 6:22:45 PM UTC-5, Frank Whiteley wrote:
> > > > > On Tuesday, November 22, 2022 at 2:47:39 PM UTC-7, R wrote:
> > > > > > On Tuesday, November 22, 2022 at 11:57:57 AM UTC-5, Frank Whiteley wrote:
> > > > > > > On Tuesday, November 22, 2022 at 8:16:29 AM UTC-7, Mark Mocho wrote:
> > > > > > > > Great video. Too bad there hasn't been much of this sort of coverage since it was made in 2006.
> > > > > > > The web site no longer exists. Without significant sponsorship to cover the cost of the technology and the helicopters, it's a non-starter. The DVD sales from the first SGP final in Chile did little to offset the $250,000 cost of the helicopter used to capture the action. IIRC, the original SGP concept was professional pilots and support from the gaming industry. When that didn't pan out, the FAI got involved (amateur sport). SGP live tracking seems to attract something over 5000 viewers, without the video feeds, which would seem to be needed to attract a public and sports network interest.
> > > > > > I’m wondering if the SSA had a hyper-razzle-dazzle video of this level, something to show off, promote gliding in U.S.
> > > > > > Send CDs out all over U.S. Sell the cool. Just pondering, the video sure did get a big wow from me.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > R
> > > > > R-
> > > > > SSA has been marketing on social media with some short videos. Although there has yet to be a survey, there are waiting lists for training of up to a year at several soaring sites around the US. So far I haven't found a site asking for more students, however, North Florida Soaring Society has a running ad on Barnstormers.com.
> > > > > Fran
> > > > Interesting….If true…the conduit feeding members into the sport is broken or inefficient, so it seems. A Marketing Promotional Czar is needed. Take charge person…..maybe the FTX guy who sold 5 Billion$ crypto$ to knuckleheads. It’s not the product…gliding is simply not ‘out there’. Made achievable. But if schools are backed up….no sense promoting to only have people disappointed waiting.
> > > > So, the question is,,,what is needed?
> > > >
> > > > R
> > > When people have to wait up to a year to get training, they are likely to find another interest. Growing more instructors would help as it seems to be a choke point. I had a long chat with Bob Wander recently and he suggests providing a more professional training environment is important, whether in a club or commercial operation, and something which is being done at Minnesota Soaring Club by moving some of the training away from the weekend. Instructor burn-out is also an issue to keep in mind.
> > >
> > > Frank
> > So moving youth training away from the weekend, when that is the only time they have available, will do what? Adding new glider pilots to the sport is fundamental for the survival and growth. My observation is that they are coming from the younger age groups like in our case 13 to 25 years. This hasn't happened by mistake, but rather by design. OBTP
> The chapter I mentioned operates mostly during the summer soaring season. Soaring in WI, Minnesota, and Illinois usually commences the first part of April and a few start in early May. By the time members get their annual checks and currency out of the way, school's out and young people may be available during the week until August or September. One of the CFI-Gs involved says it allows them to give full attention to the student rather than jumping from student to student on the weekends, resulting in better progress for the student and a more productive session. Some states now have school year round. That's a different issue.
>
> Frank
Consider this, old people like the two of us have enjoyed the sport for years and have seen the decline in activity starting back in the early 80"s. I have a wonderful scrap book that depicts the exact same scenario that we see today, a bunch of elder guys sitting at the gliderport with a couple of young guys there, those guys would be myself and Scott Bingham, Burt Compton, and Eileen. Since that time glider operations have close in several place in Florida, Naples, Labelle, Arcadia, Kendall, Richards Field, Thermal Research, Indiantown, Okeechobee, North County and probably more. So, I guess we can agree that the opportunity to soar has been a contributing factor.

Youth today is a different animal compared to what it was 45 years ago, my observation indicates that most youth would rather sit on the couch watching videos or texting with their friends, I know you get the picture, we could make an entirely new thread to discuss the youth of today in our sport, but not all is lost as we might think. The key is finding the potential individual and getting that or those individuals involved. Our club has been very successful, probably the most successful over the past few years in advancing soaring to youth members. Our dedicated youth program has been refined to meet the goal of the club to promote soaring and develop new pilots, this has taken considerable time and effort to accomplish. About or youth program, the members of our program are IMHO exceptional kids, they are great students, and goal oriented. Just last weekend a new youth member applied for application after getting the application I requested that she write us an essay about what flying glider would do toward achieving her lifetime goals. Our youth program members have NO cost involved in flying other than being required to join the SSA. We have had sponsors for kids that cover cost, you would be surprised to see what we have been given to support our youth program. Another interesting fact is that there are more girls involved in our youth program than boys, and as their tow pilot my evaluation is that they will out fly their male counterparts at this age and experience level.
We can all sit back and be armchair quarterbacks, second guess every decision yet make little or no effort to change the outcome. Being proactive and developing the correct program is key toward the future of developing new glider pilots. If you think this is impossible you may just ask R what he experienced sitting under the oak tree. OBTP

On Wednesday, November 23, 2022 at 1:20:14 PM UTC-7, youngbl...@gmail.com wrote:
> On Tuesday, November 22, 2022 at 10:45:39 PM UTC-5, Frank Whiteley wrote:
> > On Tuesday, November 22, 2022 at 8:19:46 PM UTC-7, youngbl...@gmail.com wrote:
> > > On Tuesday, November 22, 2022 at 9:58:18 PM UTC-5, Frank Whiteley wrote:
> > > > On Tuesday, November 22, 2022 at 6:05:52 PM UTC-7, R wrote:
> > > > > On Tuesday, November 22, 2022 at 6:22:45 PM UTC-5, Frank Whiteley wrote:
> > > > > > On Tuesday, November 22, 2022 at 2:47:39 PM UTC-7, R wrote:
> > > > > > > On Tuesday, November 22, 2022 at 11:57:57 AM UTC-5, Frank Whiteley wrote:
> > > > > > > > On Tuesday, November 22, 2022 at 8:16:29 AM UTC-7, Mark Mocho wrote:
> > > > > > > > > Great video. Too bad there hasn't been much of this sort of coverage since it was made in 2006.
> > > > > > > > The web site no longer exists. Without significant sponsorship to cover the cost of the technology and the helicopters, it's a non-starter. The DVD sales from the first SGP final in Chile did little to offset the $250,000 cost of the helicopter used to capture the action. IIRC, the original SGP concept was professional pilots and support from the gaming industry. When that didn't pan out, the FAI got involved (amateur sport). SGP live tracking seems to attract something over 5000 viewers, without the video feeds, which would seem to be needed to attract a public and sports network interest.
> > > > > > > I’m wondering if the SSA had a hyper-razzle-dazzle video of this level, something to show off, promote gliding in U.S.
> > > > > > > Send CDs out all over U.S. Sell the cool. Just pondering, the video sure did get a big wow from me.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > R
> > > > > > R-
> > > > > > SSA has been marketing on social media with some short videos. Although there has yet to be a survey, there are waiting lists for training of up to a year at several soaring sites around the US. So far I haven't found a site asking for more students, however, North Florida Soaring Society has a running ad on Barnstormers.com.
> > > > > > Fran
> > > > > Interesting….If true…the conduit feeding members into the sport is broken or inefficient, so it seems. A Marketing Promotional Czar is needed. Take charge person…..maybe the FTX guy who sold 5 Billion$ crypto$ to knuckleheads. It’s not the product…gliding is simply not ‘out there’. Made achievable. But if schools are backed up….no sense promoting to only have people disappointed waiting.
> > > > > So, the question is,,,what is needed?
> > > > >
> > > > > R
> > > > When people have to wait up to a year to get training, they are likely to find another interest. Growing more instructors would help as it seems to be a choke point. I had a long chat with Bob Wander recently and he suggests providing a more professional training environment is important, whether in a club or commercial operation, and something which is being done at Minnesota Soaring Club by moving some of the training away from the weekend. Instructor burn-out is also an issue to keep in mind.
> > > >
> > > > Frank
> > > So moving youth training away from the weekend, when that is the only time they have available, will do what? Adding new glider pilots to the sport is fundamental for the survival and growth. My observation is that they are coming from the younger age groups like in our case 13 to 25 years. This hasn't happened by mistake, but rather by design. OBTP
> > The chapter I mentioned operates mostly during the summer soaring season. Soaring in WI, Minnesota, and Illinois usually commences the first part of April and a few start in early May. By the time members get their annual checks and currency out of the way, school's out and young people may be available during the week until August or September. One of the CFI-Gs involved says it allows them to give full attention to the student rather than jumping from student to student on the weekends, resulting in better progress for the student and a more productive session. Some states now have school year round. That's a different issue.
> >
> > Frank
> Consider this, old people like the two of us have enjoyed the sport for years and have seen the decline in activity starting back in the early 80"s. I have a wonderful scrap book that depicts the exact same scenario that we see today, a bunch of elder guys sitting at the gliderport with a couple of young guys there, those guys would be myself and Scott Bingham, Burt Compton, and Eileen. Since that time glider operations have close in several place in Florida, Naples, Labelle, Arcadia, Kendall, Richards Field, Thermal Research, Indiantown, Okeechobee, North County and probably more. So, I guess we can agree that the opportunity to soar has been a contributing factor..
>
> Youth today is a different animal compared to what it was 45 years ago, my observation indicates that most youth would rather sit on the couch watching videos or texting with their friends, I know you get the picture, we could make an entirely new thread to discuss the youth of today in our sport, but not all is lost as we might think. The key is finding the potential individual and getting that or those individuals involved. Our club has been very successful, probably the most successful over the past few years in advancing soaring to youth members. Our dedicated youth program has been refined to meet the goal of the club to promote soaring and develop new pilots, this has taken considerable time and effort to accomplish. About or youth program, the members of our program are IMHO exceptional kids, they are great students, and goal oriented. Just last weekend a new youth member applied for application after getting the application I requested that she write us an essay about what flying glider would do toward achieving her lifetime goals. Our youth program members have NO cost involved in flying other than being required to join the SSA. We have had sponsors for kids that cover cost, you would be surprised to see what we have been given to support our youth program. Another interesting fact is that there are more girls involved in our youth program than boys, and as their tow pilot my evaluation is that they will out fly their male counterparts at this age and experience level.
> We can all sit back and be armchair quarterbacks, second guess every decision yet make little or no effort to change the outcome. Being proactive and developing the correct program is key toward the future of developing new glider pilots. If you think this is impossible you may just ask R what he experienced sitting under the oak tree. OBTP
Your most recent 14yo solo is not an SSA member. There are several successful programs engaging youth and a couple that have turned out 17yo tow pilots. Yes, local effort is paramount and can generate outstanding results. However, it can't be the work of one or two individuals and requires both a vision and a commitment to that long term vision on the part of the organization. Several clubs are not willing to make that commitment.
Frank

> To R,
> I really don't think that a video like this would make much difference in the participation of soaring in this country. Take a look at the video, how many young people do you see ? The key to promoting soaring in this country lies at the grass roots, the young and the willing. I go to schools and talk to kids, and we get new participants. We post pictures in a local Facebook page and we get new kids interested in soaring. The target is the young, that is the largest opportunity for growth, do a youth oriented video and measure the results, you may be a bit surprised. OBTP

Look at this video.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bms_xmODCc4
UH

On Wednesday, November 23, 2022 at 5:45:56 PM UTC-5, Frank Whiteley wrote:
> On Wednesday, November 23, 2022 at 1:20:14 PM UTC-7, youngbl...@gmail.com wrote:
> > On Tuesday, November 22, 2022 at 10:45:39 PM UTC-5, Frank Whiteley wrote:
> > > On Tuesday, November 22, 2022 at 8:19:46 PM UTC-7, youngbl...@gmail.com wrote:
> > > > On Tuesday, November 22, 2022 at 9:58:18 PM UTC-5, Frank Whiteley wrote:
> > > > > On Tuesday, November 22, 2022 at 6:05:52 PM UTC-7, R wrote:
> > > > > > On Tuesday, November 22, 2022 at 6:22:45 PM UTC-5, Frank Whiteley wrote:
> > > > > > > On Tuesday, November 22, 2022 at 2:47:39 PM UTC-7, R wrote:
> > > > > > > > On Tuesday, November 22, 2022 at 11:57:57 AM UTC-5, Frank Whiteley wrote:
> > > > > > > > > On Tuesday, November 22, 2022 at 8:16:29 AM UTC-7, Mark Mocho wrote:
> > > > > > > > > > Great video. Too bad there hasn't been much of this sort of coverage since it was made in 2006.
> > > > > > > > > The web site no longer exists. Without significant sponsorship to cover the cost of the technology and the helicopters, it's a non-starter. The DVD sales from the first SGP final in Chile did little to offset the $250,000 cost of the helicopter used to capture the action. IIRC, the original SGP concept was professional pilots and support from the gaming industry. When that didn't pan out, the FAI got involved (amateur sport). SGP live tracking seems to attract something over 5000 viewers, without the video feeds, which would seem to be needed to attract a public and sports network interest.
> > > > > > > > I’m wondering if the SSA had a hyper-razzle-dazzle video of this level, something to show off, promote gliding in U.S.
> > > > > > > > Send CDs out all over U.S. Sell the cool. Just pondering, the video sure did get a big wow from me.
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > R
> > > > > > > R-
> > > > > > > SSA has been marketing on social media with some short videos.. Although there has yet to be a survey, there are waiting lists for training of up to a year at several soaring sites around the US. So far I haven't found a site asking for more students, however, North Florida Soaring Society has a running ad on Barnstormers.com.
> > > > > > > Fran
> > > > > > Interesting….If true…the conduit feeding members into the sport is broken or inefficient, so it seems. A Marketing Promotional Czar is needed. Take charge person…..maybe the FTX guy who sold 5 Billion$ crypto$ to knuckleheads. It’s not the product…gliding is simply not ‘out there’. Made achievable. But if schools are backed up….no sense promoting to only have people disappointed waiting.
> > > > > > So, the question is,,,what is needed?
> > > > > >
> > > > > > R
> > > > > When people have to wait up to a year to get training, they are likely to find another interest. Growing more instructors would help as it seems to be a choke point. I had a long chat with Bob Wander recently and he suggests providing a more professional training environment is important, whether in a club or commercial operation, and something which is being done at Minnesota Soaring Club by moving some of the training away from the weekend. Instructor burn-out is also an issue to keep in mind.
> > > > >
> > > > > Frank
> > > > So moving youth training away from the weekend, when that is the only time they have available, will do what? Adding new glider pilots to the sport is fundamental for the survival and growth. My observation is that they are coming from the younger age groups like in our case 13 to 25 years. This hasn't happened by mistake, but rather by design. OBTP
> > > The chapter I mentioned operates mostly during the summer soaring season. Soaring in WI, Minnesota, and Illinois usually commences the first part of April and a few start in early May. By the time members get their annual checks and currency out of the way, school's out and young people may be available during the week until August or September. One of the CFI-Gs involved says it allows them to give full attention to the student rather than jumping from student to student on the weekends, resulting in better progress for the student and a more productive session. Some states now have school year round. That's a different issue.
> > >
> > > Frank
> > Consider this, old people like the two of us have enjoyed the sport for years and have seen the decline in activity starting back in the early 80"s. I have a wonderful scrap book that depicts the exact same scenario that we see today, a bunch of elder guys sitting at the gliderport with a couple of young guys there, those guys would be myself and Scott Bingham, Burt Compton, and Eileen. Since that time glider operations have close in several place in Florida, Naples, Labelle, Arcadia, Kendall, Richards Field, Thermal Research, Indiantown, Okeechobee, North County and probably more. So, I guess we can agree that the opportunity to soar has been a contributing factor.
> >
> > Youth today is a different animal compared to what it was 45 years ago, my observation indicates that most youth would rather sit on the couch watching videos or texting with their friends, I know you get the picture, we could make an entirely new thread to discuss the youth of today in our sport, but not all is lost as we might think. The key is finding the potential individual and getting that or those individuals involved. Our club has been very successful, probably the most successful over the past few years in advancing soaring to youth members. Our dedicated youth program has been refined to meet the goal of the club to promote soaring and develop new pilots, this has taken considerable time and effort to accomplish. About or youth program, the members of our program are IMHO exceptional kids, they are great students, and goal oriented. Just last weekend a new youth member applied for application after getting the application I requested that she write us an essay about what flying glider would do toward achieving her lifetime goals. Our youth program members have NO cost involved in flying other than being required to join the SSA. We have had sponsors for kids that cover cost, you would be surprised to see what we have been given to support our youth program. Another interesting fact is that there are more girls involved in our youth program than boys, and as their tow pilot my evaluation is that they will out fly their male counterparts at this age and experience level.
> > We can all sit back and be armchair quarterbacks, second guess every decision yet make little or no effort to change the outcome. Being proactive and developing the correct program is key toward the future of developing new glider pilots. If you think this is impossible you may just ask R what he experienced sitting under the oak tree. OBTP
> Your most recent 14yo solo is not an SSA member. There are several successful programs engaging youth and a couple that have turned out 17yo tow pilots. Yes, local effort is paramount and can generate outstanding results. However, it can't be the work of one or two individuals and requires both a vision and a commitment to that long term vision on the part of the organization. Several clubs are not willing to make that commitment.
> Frank
Thanks Frank I will check on that, I do think that our program is more than one or two individuals as you have outlined, it is probably much more successful than the collegiate program, how many new glider pilots has it put forward?

On Wednesday, November 23, 2022 at 4:43:54 PM UTC-7, youngbl...@gmail.com wrote:
> On Wednesday, November 23, 2022 at 5:45:56 PM UTC-5, Frank Whiteley wrote:
> > On Wednesday, November 23, 2022 at 1:20:14 PM UTC-7, youngbl...@gmail.com wrote:
> > > On Tuesday, November 22, 2022 at 10:45:39 PM UTC-5, Frank Whiteley wrote:
> > > > On Tuesday, November 22, 2022 at 8:19:46 PM UTC-7, youngbl...@gmail..com wrote:
> > > > > On Tuesday, November 22, 2022 at 9:58:18 PM UTC-5, Frank Whiteley wrote:
> > > > > > On Tuesday, November 22, 2022 at 6:05:52 PM UTC-7, R wrote:
> > > > > > > On Tuesday, November 22, 2022 at 6:22:45 PM UTC-5, Frank Whiteley wrote:
> > > > > > > > On Tuesday, November 22, 2022 at 2:47:39 PM UTC-7, R wrote:
> > > > > > > > > On Tuesday, November 22, 2022 at 11:57:57 AM UTC-5, Frank Whiteley wrote:
> > > > > > > > > > On Tuesday, November 22, 2022 at 8:16:29 AM UTC-7, Mark Mocho wrote:
> > > > > > > > > > > Great video. Too bad there hasn't been much of this sort of coverage since it was made in 2006.
> > > > > > > > > > The web site no longer exists. Without significant sponsorship to cover the cost of the technology and the helicopters, it's a non-starter. The DVD sales from the first SGP final in Chile did little to offset the $250,000 cost of the helicopter used to capture the action. IIRC, the original SGP concept was professional pilots and support from the gaming industry. When that didn't pan out, the FAI got involved (amateur sport). SGP live tracking seems to attract something over 5000 viewers, without the video feeds, which would seem to be needed to attract a public and sports network interest.
> > > > > > > > > I’m wondering if the SSA had a hyper-razzle-dazzle video of this level, something to show off, promote gliding in U.S.
> > > > > > > > > Send CDs out all over U.S. Sell the cool. Just pondering, the video sure did get a big wow from me.
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > R
> > > > > > > > R-
> > > > > > > > SSA has been marketing on social media with some short videos. Although there has yet to be a survey, there are waiting lists for training of up to a year at several soaring sites around the US. So far I haven't found a site asking for more students, however, North Florida Soaring Society has a running ad on Barnstormers.com.
> > > > > > > > Fran
> > > > > > > Interesting….If true…the conduit feeding members into the sport is broken or inefficient, so it seems. A Marketing Promotional Czar is needed. Take charge person…..maybe the FTX guy who sold 5 Billion$ crypto$ to knuckleheads. It’s not the product…gliding is simply not ‘out there’. Made achievable. But if schools are backed up….no sense promoting to only have people disappointed waiting.
> > > > > > > So, the question is,,,what is needed?
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > R
> > > > > > When people have to wait up to a year to get training, they are likely to find another interest. Growing more instructors would help as it seems to be a choke point. I had a long chat with Bob Wander recently and he suggests providing a more professional training environment is important, whether in a club or commercial operation, and something which is being done at Minnesota Soaring Club by moving some of the training away from the weekend. Instructor burn-out is also an issue to keep in mind.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Frank
> > > > > So moving youth training away from the weekend, when that is the only time they have available, will do what? Adding new glider pilots to the sport is fundamental for the survival and growth. My observation is that they are coming from the younger age groups like in our case 13 to 25 years.. This hasn't happened by mistake, but rather by design. OBTP
> > > > The chapter I mentioned operates mostly during the summer soaring season. Soaring in WI, Minnesota, and Illinois usually commences the first part of April and a few start in early May. By the time members get their annual checks and currency out of the way, school's out and young people may be available during the week until August or September. One of the CFI-Gs involved says it allows them to give full attention to the student rather than jumping from student to student on the weekends, resulting in better progress for the student and a more productive session. Some states now have school year round. That's a different issue.
> > > >
> > > > Frank
> > > Consider this, old people like the two of us have enjoyed the sport for years and have seen the decline in activity starting back in the early 80"s. I have a wonderful scrap book that depicts the exact same scenario that we see today, a bunch of elder guys sitting at the gliderport with a couple of young guys there, those guys would be myself and Scott Bingham, Burt Compton, and Eileen. Since that time glider operations have close in several place in Florida, Naples, Labelle, Arcadia, Kendall, Richards Field, Thermal Research, Indiantown, Okeechobee, North County and probably more. So, I guess we can agree that the opportunity to soar has been a contributing factor.
> > >
> > > Youth today is a different animal compared to what it was 45 years ago, my observation indicates that most youth would rather sit on the couch watching videos or texting with their friends, I know you get the picture, we could make an entirely new thread to discuss the youth of today in our sport, but not all is lost as we might think. The key is finding the potential individual and getting that or those individuals involved. Our club has been very successful, probably the most successful over the past few years in advancing soaring to youth members. Our dedicated youth program has been refined to meet the goal of the club to promote soaring and develop new pilots, this has taken considerable time and effort to accomplish. About or youth program, the members of our program are IMHO exceptional kids, they are great students, and goal oriented. Just last weekend a new youth member applied for application after getting the application I requested that she write us an essay about what flying glider would do toward achieving her lifetime goals. Our youth program members have NO cost involved in flying other than being required to join the SSA. We have had sponsors for kids that cover cost, you would be surprised to see what we have been given to support our youth program. Another interesting fact is that there are more girls involved in our youth program than boys, and as their tow pilot my evaluation is that they will out fly their male counterparts at this age and experience level.
> > > We can all sit back and be armchair quarterbacks, second guess every decision yet make little or no effort to change the outcome. Being proactive and developing the correct program is key toward the future of developing new glider pilots. If you think this is impossible you may just ask R what he experienced sitting under the oak tree. OBTP
> > Your most recent 14yo solo is not an SSA member. There are several successful programs engaging youth and a couple that have turned out 17yo tow pilots. Yes, local effort is paramount and can generate outstanding results. However, it can't be the work of one or two individuals and requires both a vision and a commitment to that long term vision on the part of the organization. Several clubs are not willing to make that commitment.
> > Frank
> Thanks Frank I will check on that, I do think that our program is more than one or two individuals as you have outlined, it is probably much more successful than the collegiate program, how many new glider pilots has it put forward?
Risk management attorneys have not been kind to university soaring programs or other risk averse activities.

On Wednesday, November 23, 2022 at 6:31:35 PM UTC-5, Hank Nixon wrote:
> > To R,
> > I really don't think that a video like this would make much difference in the participation of soaring in this country. Take a look at the video, how many young people do you see ? The key to promoting soaring in this country lies at the grass roots, the young and the willing. I go to schools and talk to kids, and we get new participants. We post pictures in a local Facebook page and we get new kids interested in soaring. The target is the young, that is the largest opportunity for growth, do a youth oriented video and measure the results, you may be a bit surprised. OBTP
> Look at this video.
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bms_xmODCc4
> UH
And another.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=90MLtk7jOZs

On Wednesday, November 23, 2022 at 7:17:17 PM UTC-5, Frank Whiteley wrote:
> On Wednesday, November 23, 2022 at 4:43:54 PM UTC-7, youngbl...@gmail.com wrote:
> > On Wednesday, November 23, 2022 at 5:45:56 PM UTC-5, Frank Whiteley wrote:
> > > On Wednesday, November 23, 2022 at 1:20:14 PM UTC-7, youngbl...@gmail..com wrote:
> > > > On Tuesday, November 22, 2022 at 10:45:39 PM UTC-5, Frank Whiteley wrote:
> > > > > On Tuesday, November 22, 2022 at 8:19:46 PM UTC-7, youngbl...@gmail.com wrote:
> > > > > > On Tuesday, November 22, 2022 at 9:58:18 PM UTC-5, Frank Whiteley wrote:
> > > > > > > On Tuesday, November 22, 2022 at 6:05:52 PM UTC-7, R wrote:
> > > > > > > > On Tuesday, November 22, 2022 at 6:22:45 PM UTC-5, Frank Whiteley wrote:
> > > > > > > > > On Tuesday, November 22, 2022 at 2:47:39 PM UTC-7, R wrote:
> > > > > > > > > > On Tuesday, November 22, 2022 at 11:57:57 AM UTC-5, Frank Whiteley wrote:
> > > > > > > > > > > On Tuesday, November 22, 2022 at 8:16:29 AM UTC-7, Mark Mocho wrote:
> > > > > > > > > > > > Great video. Too bad there hasn't been much of this sort of coverage since it was made in 2006.
> > > > > > > > > > > The web site no longer exists. Without significant sponsorship to cover the cost of the technology and the helicopters, it's a non-starter. The DVD sales from the first SGP final in Chile did little to offset the $250,000 cost of the helicopter used to capture the action. IIRC, the original SGP concept was professional pilots and support from the gaming industry. When that didn't pan out, the FAI got involved (amateur sport).. SGP live tracking seems to attract something over 5000 viewers, without the video feeds, which would seem to be needed to attract a public and sports network interest.
> > > > > > > > > > I’m wondering if the SSA had a hyper-razzle-dazzle video of this level, something to show off, promote gliding in U.S.
> > > > > > > > > > Send CDs out all over U.S. Sell the cool. Just pondering, the video sure did get a big wow from me.
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > R
> > > > > > > > > R-
> > > > > > > > > SSA has been marketing on social media with some short videos. Although there has yet to be a survey, there are waiting lists for training of up to a year at several soaring sites around the US. So far I haven't found a site asking for more students, however, North Florida Soaring Society has a running ad on Barnstormers.com.
> > > > > > > > > Fran
> > > > > > > > Interesting….If true…the conduit feeding members into the sport is broken or inefficient, so it seems. A Marketing Promotional Czar is needed. Take charge person…..maybe the FTX guy who sold 5 Billion$ crypto$ to knuckleheads. It’s not the product…gliding is simply not ‘out there’. Made achievable. But if schools are backed up….no sense promoting to only have people disappointed waiting.
> > > > > > > > So, the question is,,,what is needed?
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > R
> > > > > > > When people have to wait up to a year to get training, they are likely to find another interest. Growing more instructors would help as it seems to be a choke point. I had a long chat with Bob Wander recently and he suggests providing a more professional training environment is important, whether in a club or commercial operation, and something which is being done at Minnesota Soaring Club by moving some of the training away from the weekend. Instructor burn-out is also an issue to keep in mind.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Frank
> > > > > > So moving youth training away from the weekend, when that is the only time they have available, will do what? Adding new glider pilots to the sport is fundamental for the survival and growth. My observation is that they are coming from the younger age groups like in our case 13 to 25 years. This hasn't happened by mistake, but rather by design. OBTP
> > > > > The chapter I mentioned operates mostly during the summer soaring season. Soaring in WI, Minnesota, and Illinois usually commences the first part of April and a few start in early May. By the time members get their annual checks and currency out of the way, school's out and young people may be available during the week until August or September. One of the CFI-Gs involved says it allows them to give full attention to the student rather than jumping from student to student on the weekends, resulting in better progress for the student and a more productive session. Some states now have school year round. That's a different issue.
> > > > >
> > > > > Frank
> > > > Consider this, old people like the two of us have enjoyed the sport for years and have seen the decline in activity starting back in the early 80"s. I have a wonderful scrap book that depicts the exact same scenario that we see today, a bunch of elder guys sitting at the gliderport with a couple of young guys there, those guys would be myself and Scott Bingham, Burt Compton, and Eileen. Since that time glider operations have close in several place in Florida, Naples, Labelle, Arcadia, Kendall, Richards Field, Thermal Research, Indiantown, Okeechobee, North County and probably more. So, I guess we can agree that the opportunity to soar has been a contributing factor.
> > > >
> > > > Youth today is a different animal compared to what it was 45 years ago, my observation indicates that most youth would rather sit on the couch watching videos or texting with their friends, I know you get the picture, we could make an entirely new thread to discuss the youth of today in our sport, but not all is lost as we might think. The key is finding the potential individual and getting that or those individuals involved. Our club has been very successful, probably the most successful over the past few years in advancing soaring to youth members. Our dedicated youth program has been refined to meet the goal of the club to promote soaring and develop new pilots, this has taken considerable time and effort to accomplish. About or youth program, the members of our program are IMHO exceptional kids, they are great students, and goal oriented. Just last weekend a new youth member applied for application after getting the application I requested that she write us an essay about what flying glider would do toward achieving her lifetime goals. Our youth program members have NO cost involved in flying other than being required to join the SSA. We have had sponsors for kids that cover cost, you would be surprised to see what we have been given to support our youth program. Another interesting fact is that there are more girls involved in our youth program than boys, and as their tow pilot my evaluation is that they will out fly their male counterparts at this age and experience level.
> > > > We can all sit back and be armchair quarterbacks, second guess every decision yet make little or no effort to change the outcome. Being proactive and developing the correct program is key toward the future of developing new glider pilots. If you think this is impossible you may just ask R what he experienced sitting under the oak tree. OBTP
> > > Your most recent 14yo solo is not an SSA member. There are several successful programs engaging youth and a couple that have turned out 17yo tow pilots. Yes, local effort is paramount and can generate outstanding results. However, it can't be the work of one or two individuals and requires both a vision and a commitment to that long term vision on the part of the organization. Several clubs are not willing to make that commitment.
> > > Frank
> > Thanks Frank I will check on that, I do think that our program is more than one or two individuals as you have outlined, it is probably much more successful than the collegiate program, how many new glider pilots has it put forward?
> Risk management attorneys have not been kind to university soaring programs or other risk averse activities.
Thanks for bringing the membership to my attention, as of this moment Tyler is a youth member, his father the instructor is a full member. Please double check and make sure that I have the correct information. So I would assume that the collegiate program has a quantitative number of zero? OBTP

On Wednesday, November 23, 2022 at 7:54:02 PM UTC-5, Hank Nixon wrote:
> On Wednesday, November 23, 2022 at 6:31:35 PM UTC-5, Hank Nixon wrote:
> > > To R,
> > > I really don't think that a video like this would make much difference in the participation of soaring in this country. Take a look at the video, how many young people do you see ? The key to promoting soaring in this country lies at the grass roots, the young and the willing. I go to schools and talk to kids, and we get new participants. We post pictures in a local Facebook page and we get new kids interested in soaring. The target is the young, that is the largest opportunity for growth, do a youth oriented video and measure the results, you may be a bit surprised. OBTP
> > Look at this video.
> > https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bms_xmODCc4
> > UH
> And another.
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=90MLtk7jOZs
UH, we have used this video to attract young potential pilots to our program, I have show this at schools and civic events, it has created interest for our club. Just a note, this year we have been very successful with our youth program and I will share an event that makes our entire club and soaring community very proud. A young 14 year old Ava Shelly made here solo flight on her 14th birthday. I towed her every single flight that she made, Tommy her instructor and I nicknamed her the, "Goddess Of Tow", she was so rock solid that we were amazed. After her solo flights summer came and she was accepted into a program at the Naval Academy for a summer program and then headed to Miramar to work with a F-18 maintenance crew for a summer intern program. while in these programs the mentors were impressed that she had been a solo pilot in a glider. OBTP

On Wednesday, November 23, 2022 at 5:58:23 PM UTC-7, youngbl...@gmail.com wrote:
> On Wednesday, November 23, 2022 at 7:17:17 PM UTC-5, Frank Whiteley wrote:
> > On Wednesday, November 23, 2022 at 4:43:54 PM UTC-7, youngbl...@gmail.com wrote:
> > > On Wednesday, November 23, 2022 at 5:45:56 PM UTC-5, Frank Whiteley wrote:
> > > > On Wednesday, November 23, 2022 at 1:20:14 PM UTC-7, youngbl...@gmail.com wrote:
> > > > > On Tuesday, November 22, 2022 at 10:45:39 PM UTC-5, Frank Whiteley wrote:
> > > > > > On Tuesday, November 22, 2022 at 8:19:46 PM UTC-7, youngbl...@gmail.com wrote:
> > > > > > > On Tuesday, November 22, 2022 at 9:58:18 PM UTC-5, Frank Whiteley wrote:
> > > > > > > > On Tuesday, November 22, 2022 at 6:05:52 PM UTC-7, R wrote:
> > > > > > > > > On Tuesday, November 22, 2022 at 6:22:45 PM UTC-5, Frank Whiteley wrote:
> > > > > > > > > > On Tuesday, November 22, 2022 at 2:47:39 PM UTC-7, R wrote:
> > > > > > > > > > > On Tuesday, November 22, 2022 at 11:57:57 AM UTC-5, Frank Whiteley wrote:
> > > > > > > > > > > > On Tuesday, November 22, 2022 at 8:16:29 AM UTC-7, Mark Mocho wrote:
> > > > > > > > > > > > > Great video. Too bad there hasn't been much of this sort of coverage since it was made in 2006.
> > > > > > > > > > > > The web site no longer exists. Without significant sponsorship to cover the cost of the technology and the helicopters, it's a non-starter. The DVD sales from the first SGP final in Chile did little to offset the $250,000 cost of the helicopter used to capture the action. IIRC, the original SGP concept was professional pilots and support from the gaming industry. When that didn't pan out, the FAI got involved (amateur sport). SGP live tracking seems to attract something over 5000 viewers, without the video feeds, which would seem to be needed to attract a public and sports network interest.
> > > > > > > > > > > I’m wondering if the SSA had a hyper-razzle-dazzle video of this level, something to show off, promote gliding in U.S.
> > > > > > > > > > > Send CDs out all over U.S. Sell the cool. Just pondering, the video sure did get a big wow from me.
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > R
> > > > > > > > > > R-
> > > > > > > > > > SSA has been marketing on social media with some short videos. Although there has yet to be a survey, there are waiting lists for training of up to a year at several soaring sites around the US. So far I haven't found a site asking for more students, however, North Florida Soaring Society has a running ad on Barnstormers.com.
> > > > > > > > > > Fran
> > > > > > > > > Interesting….If true…the conduit feeding members into the sport is broken or inefficient, so it seems. A Marketing Promotional Czar is needed. Take charge person…..maybe the FTX guy who sold 5 Billion$ crypto$ to knuckleheads. It’s not the product…gliding is simply not ‘out there’. Made achievable. But if schools are backed up….no sense promoting to only have people disappointed waiting.
> > > > > > > > > So, the question is,,,what is needed?
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > R
> > > > > > > > When people have to wait up to a year to get training, they are likely to find another interest. Growing more instructors would help as it seems to be a choke point. I had a long chat with Bob Wander recently and he suggests providing a more professional training environment is important, whether in a club or commercial operation, and something which is being done at Minnesota Soaring Club by moving some of the training away from the weekend. Instructor burn-out is also an issue to keep in mind.
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > Frank
> > > > > > > So moving youth training away from the weekend, when that is the only time they have available, will do what? Adding new glider pilots to the sport is fundamental for the survival and growth. My observation is that they are coming from the younger age groups like in our case 13 to 25 years. This hasn't happened by mistake, but rather by design. OBTP
> > > > > > The chapter I mentioned operates mostly during the summer soaring season. Soaring in WI, Minnesota, and Illinois usually commences the first part of April and a few start in early May. By the time members get their annual checks and currency out of the way, school's out and young people may be available during the week until August or September. One of the CFI-Gs involved says it allows them to give full attention to the student rather than jumping from student to student on the weekends, resulting in better progress for the student and a more productive session. Some states now have school year round. That's a different issue.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Frank
> > > > > Consider this, old people like the two of us have enjoyed the sport for years and have seen the decline in activity starting back in the early 80"s. I have a wonderful scrap book that depicts the exact same scenario that we see today, a bunch of elder guys sitting at the gliderport with a couple of young guys there, those guys would be myself and Scott Bingham, Burt Compton, and Eileen. Since that time glider operations have close in several place in Florida, Naples, Labelle, Arcadia, Kendall, Richards Field, Thermal Research, Indiantown, Okeechobee, North County and probably more. So, I guess we can agree that the opportunity to soar has been a contributing factor.
> > > > >
> > > > > Youth today is a different animal compared to what it was 45 years ago, my observation indicates that most youth would rather sit on the couch watching videos or texting with their friends, I know you get the picture, we could make an entirely new thread to discuss the youth of today in our sport, but not all is lost as we might think. The key is finding the potential individual and getting that or those individuals involved. Our club has been very successful, probably the most successful over the past few years in advancing soaring to youth members. Our dedicated youth program has been refined to meet the goal of the club to promote soaring and develop new pilots, this has taken considerable time and effort to accomplish. About or youth program, the members of our program are IMHO exceptional kids, they are great students, and goal oriented. Just last weekend a new youth member applied for application after getting the application I requested that she write us an essay about what flying glider would do toward achieving her lifetime goals. Our youth program members have NO cost involved in flying other than being required to join the SSA. We have had sponsors for kids that cover cost, you would be surprised to see what we have been given to support our youth program. Another interesting fact is that there are more girls involved in our youth program than boys, and as their tow pilot my evaluation is that they will out fly their male counterparts at this age and experience level.
> > > > > We can all sit back and be armchair quarterbacks, second guess every decision yet make little or no effort to change the outcome. Being proactive and developing the correct program is key toward the future of developing new glider pilots. If you think this is impossible you may just ask R what he experienced sitting under the oak tree. OBTP
> > > > Your most recent 14yo solo is not an SSA member. There are several successful programs engaging youth and a couple that have turned out 17yo tow pilots. Yes, local effort is paramount and can generate outstanding results. However, it can't be the work of one or two individuals and requires both a vision and a commitment to that long term vision on the part of the organization. Several clubs are not willing to make that commitment.
> > > > Frank
> > > Thanks Frank I will check on that, I do think that our program is more than one or two individuals as you have outlined, it is probably much more successful than the collegiate program, how many new glider pilots has it put forward?
> > Risk management attorneys have not been kind to university soaring programs or other risk averse activities.
> Thanks for bringing the membership to my attention, as of this moment Tyler is a youth member, his father the instructor is a full member. Please double check and make sure that I have the correct information. So I would assume that the collegiate program has a quantitative number of zero? OBTP
If their surnames are as posted on Facebook, neither are current SSA members. Call me.

On 2022-11-23 17:31, Hank Nixon wrote:
>
>> To R,
>> I really don't think that a video like this would make much difference in the participation of soaring in this country. Take a look at the video, how many young people do you see ? The key to promoting soaring in this country lies at the grass roots, the young and the willing. I go to schools and talk to kids, and we get new participants. We post pictures in a local Facebook page and we get new kids interested in soaring. The target is the young, that is the largest opportunity for growth, do a youth oriented video and measure the results, you may be a bit surprised. OBTP
>
> Look at this video.
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bms_xmODCc4
> UH

"Contents made for kids", so I can't save it to the 'Soaring' playlist
in my YouTube. Why? What's the purpose? Advertise and limit it at the
same time? Am I missing some smart idea behind it?