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tech / rec.bicycles.tech / Re: Freedom of Information

SubjectAuthor
* Freedom of InformationTom Kunich
+* Re: Freedom of InformationTom Kunich
|+* Re: Freedom of Informationrussellseaton1@yahoo.com
||`- Re: Freedom of InformationTom Kunich
|+- Re: Freedom of InformationTom Kunich
|`* Re: Freedom of InformationJohn B.
| +* Re: Freedom of Informationrussellseaton1@yahoo.com
| |+* Re: Freedom of InformationTom Kunich
| ||`- Re: Freedom of InformationJohn B.
| |`- Re: Freedom of InformationJohn B.
| +* Re: Freedom of InformationTom Kunich
| |+* Re: Freedom of InformationFrank Krygowski
| ||`* Re: Freedom of InformationTom Kunich
| || +- Re: Freedom of InformationFrank Krygowski
| || `* Re: Freedom of InformationJohn B.
| ||  `* Re: Freedom of InformationTom Kunich
| ||   +* Re: Freedom of InformationFrank Krygowski
| ||   |+* Re: Freedom of InformationTom Kunich
| ||   ||+* Re: Freedom of InformationFrank Krygowski
| ||   |||+* Re: Freedom of InformationTom Kunich
| ||   ||||+- Re: Freedom of InformationTom Kunich
| ||   ||||`* Re: Freedom of InformationFrank Krygowski
| ||   |||| `* Re: Freedom of InformationTom Kunich
| ||   ||||  +- Re: Freedom of InformationFrank Krygowski
| ||   ||||  `- Re: Freedom of Informationrussellseaton1@yahoo.com
| ||   |||+* Re: Freedom of InformationTom Kunich
| ||   ||||+* Re: Freedom of InformationTom Kunich
| ||   |||||`- Re: Freedom of InformationJohn B.
| ||   ||||+- Re: Freedom of InformationJohn B.
| ||   ||||+* Re: Freedom of InformationJohn B.
| ||   |||||`* Re: Freedom of InformationJohn B.
| ||   ||||| `* Re: Freedom of InformationTom Kunich
| ||   |||||  `- Re: Freedom of InformationJohn B.
| ||   ||||`* Re: Freedom of InformationTom Kunich
| ||   |||| `- Re: Freedom of InformationJohn B.
| ||   |||+* Re: Freedom of Informationrussellseaton1@yahoo.com
| ||   ||||`- Re: Freedom of InformationTom Kunich
| ||   |||+- Re: Freedom of InformationJohn B.
| ||   |||+* Re: Freedom of Informationsms
| ||   ||||`* Re: Freedom of InformationTom Kunich
| ||   |||| +* Re: Freedom of Informationsms
| ||   |||| |+* Re: Freedom of InformationLou Holtman
| ||   |||| ||+- Re: Freedom of InformationTom Kunich
| ||   |||| ||+* Re: Freedom of InformationRalph Barone
| ||   |||| |||`- Re: Freedom of InformationRadey Shouman
| ||   |||| ||+- Re: Freedom of InformationJohn B.
| ||   |||| ||`* Re: Freedom of InformationFrank Krygowski
| ||   |||| || `- Re: Freedom of InformationRalph Barone
| ||   |||| |+* Re: Freedom of InformationFrank Krygowski
| ||   |||| ||`- Re: Freedom of Informationrussellseaton1@yahoo.com
| ||   |||| |`* Re: Freedom of InformationJohn B.
| ||   |||| | `- Re: Freedom of Informationsms
| ||   |||| `* Re: Freedom of InformationTom Kunich
| ||   ||||  `* Re: Freedom of Informationrussellseaton1@yahoo.com
| ||   ||||   `* Re: Freedom of Informationrussellseaton1@yahoo.com
| ||   ||||    +- Re: Freedom of Informationsms
| ||   ||||    `- Re: Freedom of Informationrussellseaton1@yahoo.com
| ||   |||`* Re: Freedom of Informationfunkma...@hotmail.com
| ||   ||| `* Re: Freedom of InformationJohn B.
| ||   |||  `* Re: Freedom of Informationfunkma...@hotmail.com
| ||   |||   `- Re: Freedom of InformationJohn B.
| ||   ||`* Re: Freedom of InformationJohn B.
| ||   || `- Re: Freedom of Informationrussellseaton1@yahoo.com
| ||   |`* Re: Freedom of InformationJohn B.
| ||   | `* Re: Freedom of InformationTom Kunich
| ||   |  +* Re: Freedom of Informationrussellseaton1@yahoo.com
| ||   |  |`- Re: Freedom of Informationsms
| ||   |  +- Re: Freedom of InformationJohn B.
| ||   |  +* Re: Freedom of Informationfunkma...@hotmail.com
| ||   |  |+* Re: Freedom of InformationTed Heise
| ||   |  ||+* Re: Freedom of Informationsms
| ||   |  |||`* Re: Freedom of InformationJames Carrington
| ||   |  ||| +- Re: Freedom of InformationFrank Krygowski
| ||   |  ||| `* Re: Freedom of Informationsms
| ||   |  |||  `- Re: Freedom of Informationsms
| ||   |  ||`* Re: Freedom of InformationTom Kunich
| ||   |  || `- Re: Freedom of InformationTed Heise
| ||   |  |+- Re: Freedom of InformationJohn B.
| ||   |  |`* Re: Freedom of Informationrussellseaton1@yahoo.com
| ||   |  | `* Re: Freedom of InformationAnotherJim
| ||   |  |  +* Re: Freedom of InformationAMuzi
| ||   |  |  |+* Re: Freedom of InformationTom Kunich
| ||   |  |  ||`* Re: Freedom of InformationAMuzi
| ||   |  |  || `- Re: Freedom of InformationTom Kunich
| ||   |  |  |`- Re: Freedom of InformationFrank Krygowski
| ||   |  |  +- Re: Freedom of Informationsms
| ||   |  |  +- Re: Freedom of InformationTom Kunich
| ||   |  |  `* Re: Freedom of InformationJohn B.
| ||   |  |   +* Re: Freedom of Informationsms
| ||   |  |   |`* Re: Freedom of InformationJohn B.
| ||   |  |   | +* Re: Freedom of Informationrussellseaton1@yahoo.com
| ||   |  |   | |`- Re: Freedom of InformationJohn B.
| ||   |  |   | `* Re: Freedom of InformationAMuzi
| ||   |  |   |  +* Re: Freedom of InformationTom Kunich
| ||   |  |   |  |`- Re: Freedom of Informationrussellseaton1@yahoo.com
| ||   |  |   |  +- Re: Freedom of InformationFrank Krygowski
| ||   |  |   |  `* Re: Freedom of InformationTom Kunich
| ||   |  |   |   `- Re: Freedom of Informationrussellseaton1@yahoo.com
| ||   |  |   `* Re: Freedom of InformationAMuzi
| ||   |  |    +- Re: Freedom of Informationrussellseaton1@yahoo.com
| ||   |  |    +- Re: Freedom of InformationJohn B.
| ||   |  |    `- Re: Freedom of InformationFrank Krygowski
| ||   |  `- Re: Freedom of InformationJohn B.
| ||   `* Re: Freedom of InformationJohn B.
| |`- Re: Freedom of InformationJohn B.
| `* Re: Freedom of InformationAMuzi
+* Re: Freedom of InformationJohn B.
`* Re: Freedom of InformationAndre Jute

Pages:123456
Re: Freedom of Information

<d15caa22-3f6f-41bd-8599-13f5ded0ec64n@googlegroups.com>

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https://www.novabbs.com/tech/article-flat.php?id=52764&group=rec.bicycles.tech#52764

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Subject: Re: Freedom of Information
From: cyclin...@gmail.com (Tom Kunich)
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 by: Tom Kunich - Sat, 26 Feb 2022 21:57 UTC

On Saturday, February 26, 2022 at 1:46:51 PM UTC-8, AMuzi wrote:
> On 2/26/2022 3:24 PM, Tom Kunich wrote:
> > On Saturday, February 26, 2022 at 11:01:50 AM UTC-8, AMuzi wrote:
> >> On 2/26/2022 11:30 AM, AnotherJim wrote:
> >>> https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/cumulative-excess-deaths-covid?time=earliest..2022-02-13&country=USA~RUS~MEX~BRA~IRN~PER
> >>>
> >>> I didn't slog through all the name calling. I just googled 'excess deaths 2020 to date' and came up with the graph in the link. (I'd put it in here, but graphics don't seem to be allowed.) There are others, and there are other data and graphics on the Our World In Data website. Don't think they have any axes they are grinding.
> >>>
> >>> Data are about in line with about 1 million covid deaths in the US so far.
> >>>
> >>> Jim
> >>>
> >> I don't know. I'm not yet ready to take a leap of faith
> >> among all the conflicting claims here but conflicting
> >> numbers are not confidence inspiring.
> >>
> >> Also this week the 20 largest US life insurers reported
> >> large numbers of excess death benefit _about half related to
> >> the Wuhan bioweapon_. Which leaves half the excess not
> >> readily explained.
> >>
> >> https://www.wsws.org/en/articles/2022/02/24/life-f24.html
> >>
> >> There are excess deaths, and in significant numbers, but how
> >> many from which causes are as yet not clear.
> >>
> >> (Insurance benefit payouts are real cash and not subject to
> >> the normal political manipulations, as public health records
> >> are)
> >
> > I will simply note that a 19% increase in deaths is 62,000 people and NOT 900,000. There's another thing at work here, the CLAIM of certain death from covid-19 allows the Life Insurance companies to increase the cost of their policies. And they have to CLAIM that there was an increase in deaths to make this acceptable to their clientele.
> >
> > The numbers that actual neutral sources have cast about have been no larger than a bad year of seasonal flu. Should this be grounds for shutting the economy down?
> >
> The set of people with a paid-up life insurance policy at
> time of death is a very small subset of humans. That said
> their numbers are quite thoroughly reported and actuarily sound.
>
> What that means I am not sure. But the life insurance
> industry thinks something unusual has happened/is happening.
> Since they have skin in the game they have concerns when
> overall rates change.

Question: have additional deaths come from the covid-19 or the vaccine itself? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MjxlvduyJyc

Re: Freedom of Information

<68bl1h9ohepiprs868a4v0k15mqtr7dk94@4ax.com>

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https://www.novabbs.com/tech/article-flat.php?id=52767&group=rec.bicycles.tech#52767

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From: slocom...@gmail.com (John B.)
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles.tech
Subject: Re: Freedom of Information
Date: Sun, 27 Feb 2022 05:47:19 +0700
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 by: John B. - Sat, 26 Feb 2022 22:47 UTC

On Sat, 26 Feb 2022 09:30:07 -0800 (PST), AnotherJim
<jmmckinley@gmail.com> wrote:

>https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/cumulative-excess-deaths-covid?time=earliest..2022-02-13&country=USA~RUS~MEX~BRA~IRN~PER
>
>I didn't slog through all the name calling. I just googled 'excess deaths 2020 to date' and came up with the graph in the link. (I'd put it in here, but graphics don't seem to be allowed.) There are others, and there are other data and graphics on the Our World In Data website. Don't think they have any axes they are grinding.
>
>Data are about in line with about 1 million covid deaths in the US so far.
>
>Jim

I find this talk of "excess deaths" as bit odd as back when the
Vietnam Fiasco was going on and the youth of America fleeing to Canada
in terror of being drafted I don't remember anyone talking about, "Oh
Poo, just look at the excess deaths".
--
Cheers,

John B.

Re: Freedom of Information

<sveej9$iq$1@dont-email.me>

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https://www.novabbs.com/tech/article-flat.php?id=52770&group=rec.bicycles.tech#52770

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From: scharf.s...@geemail.com (sms)
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles.tech
Subject: Re: Freedom of Information
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 by: sms - Sat, 26 Feb 2022 23:54 UTC

On 2/26/2022 2:47 PM, John B. wrote:

<snip>

> I find this talk of "excess deaths" as bit odd as back when the
> Vietnam Fiasco was going on and the youth of America fleeing to Canada
> in terror of being drafted I don't remember anyone talking about, "Oh
> Poo, just look at the excess deaths".

The Vietnam war resulted in 58,220 U.S. deaths, with the heaviest
involvement over a 8 year period or an average around of 7000 or so per
year. This would only barely show up in "excess deaths" though it might
have shown up in 1967, 1968, and 1969. For Covid, we've had about 1
million excess deaths in a little over two years, about 30x the peak in
Vietnam.

Re: Freedom of Information

<c0hl1h52k8q6n3vsunga9nnhabqjjvg4f9@4ax.com>

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https://www.novabbs.com/tech/article-flat.php?id=52774&group=rec.bicycles.tech#52774

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Subject: Re: Freedom of Information
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 by: John B. - Sun, 27 Feb 2022 00:37 UTC

On Sat, 26 Feb 2022 15:54:17 -0800, sms <scharf.steven@geemail.com>
wrote:

>On 2/26/2022 2:47 PM, John B. wrote:
>
><snip>
>
>> I find this talk of "excess deaths" as bit odd as back when the
>> Vietnam Fiasco was going on and the youth of America fleeing to Canada
>> in terror of being drafted I don't remember anyone talking about, "Oh
>> Poo, just look at the excess deaths".
>
>The Vietnam war resulted in 58,220 U.S. deaths, with the heaviest
>involvement over a 8 year period or an average around of 7000 or so per
>year. This would only barely show up in "excess deaths" though it might
>have shown up in 1967, 1968, and 1969. For Covid, we've had about 1
>million excess deaths in a little over two years, about 30x the peak in
>Vietnam.

My point was that while the death rate in Vietnam was high enough to
terrorize American youth to the extent that they fled the country
nobody tried to use "Excessive Deaths" to prove "Oh well, it isn't
much!" While today, with granted a much higher death rate they do.

Is because the CDC numbers have just been discovered? Or is it another
attempt, by the silly, to demonstrate that the Covid really isn't
dangerious at all.

After all I read that the first Covid death was in January 2020 and
it's been 2 years and 2 months since, so the death rate has been an
average of about 37,400 a month.

Lets see. In Vietnam actual deaths during 20 years, in combat were
47,434 or about 35 days of Covid deaths.

Note "Combat Deaths" include only those actually killed by enemy
weapons in combat and does not include those who were wounded and died
later.
--
Cheers,

John B.

Re: Freedom of Information

<0f610d76-590e-4161-902f-082b5a2d9586n@googlegroups.com>

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Date: Sun, 27 Feb 2022 00:40:56 -0800 (PST)
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Subject: Re: Freedom of Information
From: ritzanna...@gmail.com (russellseaton1@yahoo.com)
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 by: russellseaton1@yahoo - Sun, 27 Feb 2022 08:40 UTC

On Saturday, February 26, 2022 at 6:37:19 PM UTC-6, John B. wrote:
> On Sat, 26 Feb 2022 15:54:17 -0800, sms <scharf...@geemail.com>
> wrote:
> >On 2/26/2022 2:47 PM, John B. wrote:
> >
> ><snip>
> >
> >> I find this talk of "excess deaths" as bit odd as back when the
> >> Vietnam Fiasco was going on and the youth of America fleeing to Canada
> >> in terror of being drafted I don't remember anyone talking about, "Oh
> >> Poo, just look at the excess deaths".
> >
> >The Vietnam war resulted in 58,220 U.S. deaths, with the heaviest
> >involvement over a 8 year period or an average around of 7000 or so per
> >year. This would only barely show up in "excess deaths" though it might
> >have shown up in 1967, 1968, and 1969. For Covid, we've had about 1
> >million excess deaths in a little over two years, about 30x the peak in
> >Vietnam.
> My point was that while the death rate in Vietnam was high enough to
> terrorize American youth to the extent that they fled the country
> nobody tried to use "Excessive Deaths" to prove "Oh well, it isn't
> much!" While today, with granted a much higher death rate they do.

Not sure comparing Covid and Vietnam is very valid. Back in Vietnam times you could flee to Canada to avoid being drafted and potentially dying in Vietnam. But with Covid, its up in Canada too. And Vietnam too. So I don't think there are too many places on earth you can flee to and avoid Covid exposure.

>
> Is because the CDC numbers have just been discovered? Or is it another
> attempt, by the silly, to demonstrate that the Covid really isn't
> dangerious at all.
>
> After all I read that the first Covid death was in January 2020 and
> it's been 2 years and 2 months since, so the death rate has been an
> average of about 37,400 a month.
>
> Lets see. In Vietnam actual deaths during 20 years, in combat were
> 47,434 or about 35 days of Covid deaths.
>
> Note "Combat Deaths" include only those actually killed by enemy
> weapons in combat and does not include those who were wounded and died
> later.
>
> --
> Cheers,
>
> John B.

Re: Freedom of Information

<l4im1hl91t6a3omsqah8rmm429iicoblcn@4ax.com>

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From: slocom...@gmail.com (John B.)
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles.tech
Subject: Re: Freedom of Information
Date: Sun, 27 Feb 2022 16:58:39 +0700
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 by: John B. - Sun, 27 Feb 2022 09:58 UTC

On Sun, 27 Feb 2022 00:40:56 -0800 (PST), "russellseaton1@yahoo.com"
<ritzannaseaton@gmail.com> wrote:

>On Saturday, February 26, 2022 at 6:37:19 PM UTC-6, John B. wrote:
>> On Sat, 26 Feb 2022 15:54:17 -0800, sms <scharf...@geemail.com>
>> wrote:
>> >On 2/26/2022 2:47 PM, John B. wrote:
>> >
>> ><snip>
>> >
>> >> I find this talk of "excess deaths" as bit odd as back when the
>> >> Vietnam Fiasco was going on and the youth of America fleeing to Canada
>> >> in terror of being drafted I don't remember anyone talking about, "Oh
>> >> Poo, just look at the excess deaths".
>> >
>> >The Vietnam war resulted in 58,220 U.S. deaths, with the heaviest
>> >involvement over a 8 year period or an average around of 7000 or so per
>> >year. This would only barely show up in "excess deaths" though it might
>> >have shown up in 1967, 1968, and 1969. For Covid, we've had about 1
>> >million excess deaths in a little over two years, about 30x the peak in
>> >Vietnam.
>> My point was that while the death rate in Vietnam was high enough to
>> terrorize American youth to the extent that they fled the country
>> nobody tried to use "Excessive Deaths" to prove "Oh well, it isn't
>> much!" While today, with granted a much higher death rate they do.
>
>Not sure comparing Covid and Vietnam is very valid. Back in Vietnam times you could flee to Canada to avoid being drafted and potentially dying in Vietnam. But with Covid, its up in Canada too. And Vietnam too. So I don't think there are too many places on earth you can flee to and avoid Covid exposure.
>

I wasn't really comparing Covid and Vietnam. I was trying to compare
the reaction. In the case of Vietnam's people reacted with terror
while today, with an even higher number of deaths, they just shrug
their shoulders and say, "Yes, but the excessive deaths rate..."

--
Cheers,

John B.

Re: Freedom of Information

<svg9ki$bv9$2@dont-email.me>

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From: am...@yellowjersey.org (AMuzi)
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles.tech
Subject: Re: Freedom of Information
Date: Sun, 27 Feb 2022 10:41:57 -0600
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 by: AMuzi - Sun, 27 Feb 2022 16:41 UTC

On 2/26/2022 4:47 PM, John B. wrote:
> On Sat, 26 Feb 2022 09:30:07 -0800 (PST), AnotherJim
> <jmmckinley@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/cumulative-excess-deaths-covid?time=earliest..2022-02-13&country=USA~RUS~MEX~BRA~IRN~PER
>>
>> I didn't slog through all the name calling. I just googled 'excess deaths 2020 to date' and came up with the graph in the link. (I'd put it in here, but graphics don't seem to be allowed.) There are others, and there are other data and graphics on the Our World In Data website. Don't think they have any axes they are grinding.
>>
>> Data are about in line with about 1 million covid deaths in the US so far.
>>
>> Jim
>
> I find this talk of "excess deaths" as bit odd as back when the
> Vietnam Fiasco was going on and the youth of America fleeing to Canada
> in terror of being drafted I don't remember anyone talking about, "Oh
> Poo, just look at the excess deaths".
>

Despite romance and legend, only something between 20,000
and 30,000 young US men moved to Canada to evade.

--
Andrew Muzi
<www.yellowjersey.org/>
Open every day since 1 April, 1971

Re: Freedom of Information

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From: am...@yellowjersey.org (AMuzi)
Newsgroups: rec.bicycles.tech
Subject: Re: Freedom of Information
Date: Sun, 27 Feb 2022 11:00:23 -0600
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 by: AMuzi - Sun, 27 Feb 2022 17:00 UTC

On 2/26/2022 6:37 PM, John B. wrote:
> On Sat, 26 Feb 2022 15:54:17 -0800, sms <scharf.steven@geemail.com>
> wrote:
>
>> On 2/26/2022 2:47 PM, John B. wrote:
>>
>> <snip>
>>
>>> I find this talk of "excess deaths" as bit odd as back when the
>>> Vietnam Fiasco was going on and the youth of America fleeing to Canada
>>> in terror of being drafted I don't remember anyone talking about, "Oh
>>> Poo, just look at the excess deaths".
>>
>> The Vietnam war resulted in 58,220 U.S. deaths, with the heaviest
>> involvement over a 8 year period or an average around of 7000 or so per
>> year. This would only barely show up in "excess deaths" though it might
>> have shown up in 1967, 1968, and 1969. For Covid, we've had about 1
>> million excess deaths in a little over two years, about 30x the peak in
>> Vietnam.
>
> My point was that while the death rate in Vietnam was high enough to
> terrorize American youth to the extent that they fled the country
> nobody tried to use "Excessive Deaths" to prove "Oh well, it isn't
> much!" While today, with granted a much higher death rate they do.
>
> Is because the CDC numbers have just been discovered? Or is it another
> attempt, by the silly, to demonstrate that the Covid really isn't
> dangerious at all.
>
> After all I read that the first Covid death was in January 2020 and
> it's been 2 years and 2 months since, so the death rate has been an
> average of about 37,400 a month.
>
> Lets see. In Vietnam actual deaths during 20 years, in combat were
> 47,434 or about 35 days of Covid deaths.
>
> Note "Combat Deaths" include only those actually killed by enemy
> weapons in combat and does not include those who were wounded and died
> later.
>
>

Yes that's all true. Moreover in 1969 there was a huge spike
in influenza deaths:
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/5309437/

Having spent 1969 traveling America and working in several
states from Florida to California and 'engaging in intimate
contact' with some number of young ladies besides large
outdoor and indoor gatherings (not Woodstock) I had no idea.
I knew nothing of it until recently, knew no one seriously
ill then, knew of no one who had died of it. Any of you
recall the 1969 influenza?

Or put another way whet is the difference between a
'numerous deaths phenomenon' and a panic?

--
Andrew Muzi
<www.yellowjersey.org/>
Open every day since 1 April, 1971

Re: Freedom of Information

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Subject: Re: Freedom of Information
From: cyclin...@gmail.com (Tom Kunich)
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 by: Tom Kunich - Sun, 27 Feb 2022 17:53 UTC

On Sunday, February 27, 2022 at 9:00:23 AM UTC-8, AMuzi wrote:
> On 2/26/2022 6:37 PM, John B. wrote:
> > On Sat, 26 Feb 2022 15:54:17 -0800, sms <scharf...@geemail.com>
> > wrote:
> >
> >> On 2/26/2022 2:47 PM, John B. wrote:
> >>
> >> <snip>
> >>
> >>> I find this talk of "excess deaths" as bit odd as back when the
> >>> Vietnam Fiasco was going on and the youth of America fleeing to Canada
> >>> in terror of being drafted I don't remember anyone talking about, "Oh
> >>> Poo, just look at the excess deaths".
> >>
> >> The Vietnam war resulted in 58,220 U.S. deaths, with the heaviest
> >> involvement over a 8 year period or an average around of 7000 or so per
> >> year. This would only barely show up in "excess deaths" though it might
> >> have shown up in 1967, 1968, and 1969. For Covid, we've had about 1
> >> million excess deaths in a little over two years, about 30x the peak in
> >> Vietnam.
> >
> > My point was that while the death rate in Vietnam was high enough to
> > terrorize American youth to the extent that they fled the country
> > nobody tried to use "Excessive Deaths" to prove "Oh well, it isn't
> > much!" While today, with granted a much higher death rate they do.
> >
> > Is because the CDC numbers have just been discovered? Or is it another
> > attempt, by the silly, to demonstrate that the Covid really isn't
> > dangerious at all.
> >
> > After all I read that the first Covid death was in January 2020 and
> > it's been 2 years and 2 months since, so the death rate has been an
> > average of about 37,400 a month.
> >
> > Lets see. In Vietnam actual deaths during 20 years, in combat were
> > 47,434 or about 35 days of Covid deaths.
> >
> > Note "Combat Deaths" include only those actually killed by enemy
> > weapons in combat and does not include those who were wounded and died
> > later.
> >
> >
> Yes that's all true. Moreover in 1969 there was a huge spike
> in influenza deaths:
> https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/5309437/
>
> Having spent 1969 traveling America and working in several
> states from Florida to California and 'engaging in intimate
> contact' with some number of young ladies besides large
> outdoor and indoor gatherings (not Woodstock) I had no idea.
> I knew nothing of it until recently, knew no one seriously
> ill then, knew of no one who had died of it. Any of you
> recall the 1969 influenza?
>
> Or put another way whet is the difference between a
> 'numerous deaths phenomenon' and a panic?

In truth, seasonal flu in a bad year is much worse than covid-19 has been falsely reported. But the left is so out of it that if they were being stood in line and being shot, they would still vote Democrat. And with the present Democrat Party no doubt AFTER they were shot.

Re: Freedom of Information

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Subject: Re: Freedom of Information
From: ritzanna...@gmail.com (russellseaton1@yahoo.com)
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 by: russellseaton1@yahoo - Sun, 27 Feb 2022 20:51 UTC

On Sunday, February 27, 2022 at 10:41:57 AM UTC-6, AMuzi wrote:
> On 2/26/2022 4:47 PM, John B. wrote:
> > On Sat, 26 Feb 2022 09:30:07 -0800 (PST), AnotherJim
> > <jmmck...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> >> https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/cumulative-excess-deaths-covid?time=earliest..2022-02-13&country=USA~RUS~MEX~BRA~IRN~PER
> >>
> >> I didn't slog through all the name calling. I just googled 'excess deaths 2020 to date' and came up with the graph in the link. (I'd put it in here, but graphics don't seem to be allowed.) There are others, and there are other data and graphics on the Our World In Data website. Don't think they have any axes they are grinding.
> >>
> >> Data are about in line with about 1 million covid deaths in the US so far.
> >>
> >> Jim
> >
> > I find this talk of "excess deaths" as bit odd as back when the
> > Vietnam Fiasco was going on and the youth of America fleeing to Canada
> > in terror of being drafted I don't remember anyone talking about, "Oh
> > Poo, just look at the excess deaths".
> >
> Despite romance and legend, only something between 20,000
> and 30,000 young US men moved to Canada to evade.
> --
> Andrew Muzi
> <www.yellowjersey.org/>
> Open every day since 1 April, 1971

True. In modern times, Fox News has daily headlines screaming "EVERYONE is leaving California". Despite the fact that the population of California is increasing every single year. It just did not increase at a fast enough rate in the last census to keep up with the population increase in all the other states. And lost a representative.

Re: Freedom of Information

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Subject: Re: Freedom of Information
From: ritzanna...@gmail.com (russellseaton1@yahoo.com)
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 by: russellseaton1@yahoo - Sun, 27 Feb 2022 21:14 UTC

On Sunday, February 27, 2022 at 11:53:34 AM UTC-6, cycl...@gmail.com wrote:
> On Sunday, February 27, 2022 at 9:00:23 AM UTC-8, AMuzi wrote:
> > On 2/26/2022 6:37 PM, John B. wrote:
> > > On Sat, 26 Feb 2022 15:54:17 -0800, sms <scharf...@geemail.com>
> > > wrote:
> > >
> > >> On 2/26/2022 2:47 PM, John B. wrote:
> > >>
> > >> <snip>
> > >>
> > >>> I find this talk of "excess deaths" as bit odd as back when the
> > >>> Vietnam Fiasco was going on and the youth of America fleeing to Canada
> > >>> in terror of being drafted I don't remember anyone talking about, "Oh
> > >>> Poo, just look at the excess deaths".
> > >>
> > >> The Vietnam war resulted in 58,220 U.S. deaths, with the heaviest
> > >> involvement over a 8 year period or an average around of 7000 or so per
> > >> year. This would only barely show up in "excess deaths" though it might
> > >> have shown up in 1967, 1968, and 1969. For Covid, we've had about 1
> > >> million excess deaths in a little over two years, about 30x the peak in
> > >> Vietnam.
> > >
> > > My point was that while the death rate in Vietnam was high enough to
> > > terrorize American youth to the extent that they fled the country
> > > nobody tried to use "Excessive Deaths" to prove "Oh well, it isn't
> > > much!" While today, with granted a much higher death rate they do.
> > >
> > > Is because the CDC numbers have just been discovered? Or is it another
> > > attempt, by the silly, to demonstrate that the Covid really isn't
> > > dangerious at all.
> > >
> > > After all I read that the first Covid death was in January 2020 and
> > > it's been 2 years and 2 months since, so the death rate has been an
> > > average of about 37,400 a month.
> > >
> > > Lets see. In Vietnam actual deaths during 20 years, in combat were
> > > 47,434 or about 35 days of Covid deaths.
> > >
> > > Note "Combat Deaths" include only those actually killed by enemy
> > > weapons in combat and does not include those who were wounded and died
> > > later.
> > >
> > >
> > Yes that's all true. Moreover in 1969 there was a huge spike
> > in influenza deaths:
> > https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/5309437/
> >
> > Having spent 1969 traveling America and working in several
> > states from Florida to California and 'engaging in intimate
> > contact' with some number of young ladies besides large
> > outdoor and indoor gatherings (not Woodstock) I had no idea.
> > I knew nothing of it until recently, knew no one seriously
> > ill then, knew of no one who had died of it. Any of you
> > recall the 1969 influenza?
> >
> > Or put another way whet is the difference between a
> > 'numerous deaths phenomenon' and a panic?
> In truth, seasonal flu in a bad year is much worse than covid-19 has been falsely reported. But the left is so out of it that if they were being stood in line and being shot, they would still vote Democrat. And with the present Democrat Party no doubt AFTER they were shot.

https://www.cdc.gov/flu/about/burden/index.html
Go down to Figure 2 on this webpage. It shows the number of deaths from flu/influenza each year/season. Ranges from 52k dead in 2017-18 to 12k dead in 2011-12. I'd put the average flu/influenza dead at about 35k each year. Little under 100 per day.

https://covid.cdc.gov/covid-data-tracker/#datatracker-home
This is the webpage for CDC Covid tracking. It shows 944,517 deaths from Covid in about 2 years, 730 days. That averages out to 1293 dead per day from Covid. So Covid is about 13 times more deadly than flu/influenza. Math seems pretty simple to me. But I only have college degrees and a high school diploma.

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Subject: Re: Freedom of Information
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 by: John B. - Sun, 27 Feb 2022 22:45 UTC

On Sun, 27 Feb 2022 10:41:57 -0600, AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:

>On 2/26/2022 4:47 PM, John B. wrote:
>> On Sat, 26 Feb 2022 09:30:07 -0800 (PST), AnotherJim
>> <jmmckinley@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/cumulative-excess-deaths-covid?time=earliest..2022-02-13&country=USA~RUS~MEX~BRA~IRN~PER
>>>
>>> I didn't slog through all the name calling. I just googled 'excess deaths 2020 to date' and came up with the graph in the link. (I'd put it in here, but graphics don't seem to be allowed.) There are others, and there are other data and graphics on the Our World In Data website. Don't think they have any axes they are grinding.
>>>
>>> Data are about in line with about 1 million covid deaths in the US so far.
>>>
>>> Jim
>>
>> I find this talk of "excess deaths" as bit odd as back when the
>> Vietnam Fiasco was going on and the youth of America fleeing to Canada
>> in terror of being drafted I don't remember anyone talking about, "Oh
>> Poo, just look at the excess deaths".
>>
>
>Despite romance and legend, only something between 20,000
>and 30,000 young US men moved to Canada to evade.

Yes, I've read the estimates.
--
Cheers,

John B.

Re: Freedom of Information

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Subject: Re: Freedom of Information
From: frkry...@gmail.com (Frank Krygowski)
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 by: Frank Krygowski - Mon, 28 Feb 2022 01:59 UTC

On Sunday, February 27, 2022 at 8:41:57 AM UTC-8, AMuzi wrote:
>
> Despite romance and legend, only something between 20,000
> and 30,000 young US men moved to Canada to evade.

I knew one of them very, very well. We still trade letters at Christmas.

- Frank Krygowski

Re: Freedom of Information

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 by: Frank Krygowski - Mon, 28 Feb 2022 02:14 UTC

On Sunday, February 27, 2022 at 9:00:23 AM UTC-8, AMuzi wrote:
>
> Yes that's all true. Moreover in 1969 there was a huge spike
> in influenza deaths:
> https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/5309437/
>
> Having spent 1969 traveling America and working in several
> states from Florida to California and 'engaging in intimate
> contact' with some number of young ladies besides large
> outdoor and indoor gatherings (not Woodstock) I had no idea.
> I knew nothing of it until recently, knew no one seriously
> ill then, knew of no one who had died of it. Any of you
> recall the 1969 influenza?
>
> Or put another way whet is the difference between a
> 'numerous deaths phenomenon' and a panic?

Well, one difference might be the mortality data, especially at the beginning of the epidemic. The CDC
estimated one million deaths worldwide from that 1969 flu. We're at 6 million deaths from COVID
so far, and we're not done. It's too soon even for hindsight.

But especially in the beginning of COVID it seemed to be even more deadly than it is now. It looked
like it could be much worse than six times as deadly as the worst flu. I'm sure that's why Trump
decided to fast track vaccine development.

- Frank Krygowski

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 by: Tom Kunich - Wed, 2 Mar 2022 22:28 UTC

On Sunday, February 27, 2022 at 9:00:23 AM UTC-8, AMuzi wrote:
> On 2/26/2022 6:37 PM, John B. wrote:
> > On Sat, 26 Feb 2022 15:54:17 -0800, sms <scharf...@geemail.com>
> > wrote:
> >
> >> On 2/26/2022 2:47 PM, John B. wrote:
> >>
> >> <snip>
> >>
> >>> I find this talk of "excess deaths" as bit odd as back when the
> >>> Vietnam Fiasco was going on and the youth of America fleeing to Canada
> >>> in terror of being drafted I don't remember anyone talking about, "Oh
> >>> Poo, just look at the excess deaths".
> >>
> >> The Vietnam war resulted in 58,220 U.S. deaths, with the heaviest
> >> involvement over a 8 year period or an average around of 7000 or so per
> >> year. This would only barely show up in "excess deaths" though it might
> >> have shown up in 1967, 1968, and 1969. For Covid, we've had about 1
> >> million excess deaths in a little over two years, about 30x the peak in
> >> Vietnam.
> >
> > My point was that while the death rate in Vietnam was high enough to
> > terrorize American youth to the extent that they fled the country
> > nobody tried to use "Excessive Deaths" to prove "Oh well, it isn't
> > much!" While today, with granted a much higher death rate they do.
> >
> > Is because the CDC numbers have just been discovered? Or is it another
> > attempt, by the silly, to demonstrate that the Covid really isn't
> > dangerious at all.
> >
> > After all I read that the first Covid death was in January 2020 and
> > it's been 2 years and 2 months since, so the death rate has been an
> > average of about 37,400 a month.
> >
> > Lets see. In Vietnam actual deaths during 20 years, in combat were
> > 47,434 or about 35 days of Covid deaths.
> >
> > Note "Combat Deaths" include only those actually killed by enemy
> > weapons in combat and does not include those who were wounded and died
> > later.
> >
> >
> Yes that's all true. Moreover in 1969 there was a huge spike
> in influenza deaths:
> https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/5309437/
>
> Having spent 1969 traveling America and working in several
> states from Florida to California and 'engaging in intimate
> contact' with some number of young ladies besides large
> outdoor and indoor gatherings (not Woodstock) I had no idea.
> I knew nothing of it until recently, knew no one seriously
> ill then, knew of no one who had died of it. Any of you
> recall the 1969 influenza?
>
> Or put another way whet is the difference between a
> 'numerous deaths phenomenon' and a panic?

You had quoted Russell who actually believes the number distributed by the Slime Stream Media. He cried that that doctor had false numbers and look here: https://dailyexpose.uk/2022/03/01/russia-distraction-uk-gov-revealed-triple-vaccinated-account-9-in-10-covid-deaths/ Germany has identical numbers..

I am growing ever more skeptical that there were the numbers of excess deaths that are claimed. The MORTUARY businesses lost money in 20, 21 and so far in 22. That could NOT have happened if there were a million excess deaths..

Re: Freedom of Information

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Subject: Re: Freedom of Information
From: ritzanna...@gmail.com (russellseaton1@yahoo.com)
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 by: russellseaton1@yahoo - Thu, 3 Mar 2022 00:13 UTC

On Wednesday, March 2, 2022 at 4:28:48 PM UTC-6, cycl...@gmail.com wrote:
> On Sunday, February 27, 2022 at 9:00:23 AM UTC-8, AMuzi wrote:
> > On 2/26/2022 6:37 PM, John B. wrote:
> > > On Sat, 26 Feb 2022 15:54:17 -0800, sms <scharf...@geemail.com>
> > > wrote:
> > >
> > >> On 2/26/2022 2:47 PM, John B. wrote:
> > >>
> > >> <snip>
> > >>
> > >>> I find this talk of "excess deaths" as bit odd as back when the
> > >>> Vietnam Fiasco was going on and the youth of America fleeing to Canada
> > >>> in terror of being drafted I don't remember anyone talking about, "Oh
> > >>> Poo, just look at the excess deaths".
> > >>
> > >> The Vietnam war resulted in 58,220 U.S. deaths, with the heaviest
> > >> involvement over a 8 year period or an average around of 7000 or so per
> > >> year. This would only barely show up in "excess deaths" though it might
> > >> have shown up in 1967, 1968, and 1969. For Covid, we've had about 1
> > >> million excess deaths in a little over two years, about 30x the peak in
> > >> Vietnam.
> > >
> > > My point was that while the death rate in Vietnam was high enough to
> > > terrorize American youth to the extent that they fled the country
> > > nobody tried to use "Excessive Deaths" to prove "Oh well, it isn't
> > > much!" While today, with granted a much higher death rate they do.
> > >
> > > Is because the CDC numbers have just been discovered? Or is it another
> > > attempt, by the silly, to demonstrate that the Covid really isn't
> > > dangerious at all.
> > >
> > > After all I read that the first Covid death was in January 2020 and
> > > it's been 2 years and 2 months since, so the death rate has been an
> > > average of about 37,400 a month.
> > >
> > > Lets see. In Vietnam actual deaths during 20 years, in combat were
> > > 47,434 or about 35 days of Covid deaths.
> > >
> > > Note "Combat Deaths" include only those actually killed by enemy
> > > weapons in combat and does not include those who were wounded and died
> > > later.
> > >
> > >
> > Yes that's all true. Moreover in 1969 there was a huge spike
> > in influenza deaths:
> > https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/5309437/
> >
> > Having spent 1969 traveling America and working in several
> > states from Florida to California and 'engaging in intimate
> > contact' with some number of young ladies besides large
> > outdoor and indoor gatherings (not Woodstock) I had no idea.
> > I knew nothing of it until recently, knew no one seriously
> > ill then, knew of no one who had died of it. Any of you
> > recall the 1969 influenza?
> >
> > Or put another way whet is the difference between a
> > 'numerous deaths phenomenon' and a panic?
> You had quoted Russell who actually believes the number distributed by the Slime Stream Media. He cried that that doctor had false numbers and look here: https://dailyexpose.uk/2022/03/01/russia-distraction-uk-gov-revealed-triple-vaccinated-account-9-in-10-covid-deaths/ Germany has identical numbers.
>
> I am growing ever more skeptical that there were the numbers of excess deaths that are claimed. The MORTUARY businesses lost money in 20, 21 and so far in 22. That could NOT have happened if there were a million excess deaths.

Come on Tommy boy. I have told you repeatedly to proof your sources. DO NOY use nutcase right wing QAnon quack websites for support. NO ONE on earth, except the gullible idiots, believe any garbage put out by those buffoon sites. Your "Daily Expose UK" website above is one of those moron sites.

Here is a list of some of the articles on their Opinion page:
The ‘Long Covid’ Fraud
Dr Vernon Coleman: “Having Murdered thousands of Adults they’re now moving on to the Little Children”
Official data suggests Triple Vaccinated Brits are just weeks away from developing Acquired Immune Deficiency Syndrome (AIDS)
Dr Vernon Coleman discusses the Governments War on Cancer Patients
Dr Vernon Coleman exposes the cover up of Myocarditis caused by the Covid-19 Vaccines
PayPal Censors The Exposé – We urgently need your help… (Got to get a fund raising stealing attempt in there too.)
Dr Vernon Coleman: “It’s time to be terrified…” (Apparently this Dr. Vernon Coleman is a big wig for them. He writes lots of their opinions.)
Division, Distraction, Problem, Reaction, Solution…
URGENT: UK Government plans to remove Human Rights in the UK “for the greater good” and will apply reforms to the Unvaccinated
Matt Le Tissier: “I’ve never seen anything like it… It’s unbelievable how many sports players are keeling over”
The Billion Lives Covid-19 Fraud: The Vaccinated & Boosted have 3 years to live…
PayPal defunds The Exposé for reporting the facts the mainstream refuse to
Mass Formation Psychosis – It’s time to end your abusive relationship with the Government
Every single Covid-19 Vaccination is a Vote for the new Global Dictatorship
Dr Vernon Coleman – “Pfizer is the most thoroughly evil company ever created”
Dr Vernon Coleman explains the severe harm the Covid-19 Vaccines do to the Brain
Dr Vernon Coleman explains why most of the Covid-19 Vaccinated will die early
We are moving towards a society where everything is prohibited unless it is specifically allowed
Our Human Rights are under threat; so it’s time to get educated.
Fight for Freedom – In 1941 it was their turn. In 2021 it is ours.
Dr Vernon Coleman – “They have exaggerated Omicron to cover up the rising flood of Heart Attacks due to the Vaccines”

Reading the opinion page for this Daily Expose UK its amazing how many problems the Covid vaccine causes. Heart Attack, Brain damage, Global Dictatorship, Myocarditis, and AIDS. Man oh man, the Covid vaccine must be the greatest biological, chemical super weapon ever developed by man. It kills people all sorts of ways. Wow.

Apparently this Daily Expose UK is the British version of Fox News in the UK. Liars liars liars. But you keep on supporting them Tommy.

Tommy, we discussed several times in the past why the mortuary business suffered losses during 2020 and 2021. Mortuary businesses make LOTS of money by doing in ground burials and selling big stone markers and all of the other flowers and accessories that go along with burying people. BUT, and this is very important Tommy, BUT, during 2020 and 2021 there were no mass attendance funerals and burials. So the mortuary business could not sell all of their high profit margin items. Remember we banned group meetings during 2020 and 2021. Even banned people visiting hospitals while the dead were dying too. So no crowds to buy all these profitable extras when people die. The bereaved family members just had the dead cremated. Cheap, quick, and easy. So mortuary business made no money despite all the dead. They may have lost money because cremation is a loss item for them. They recover the expense of this loss leader by having big viewing ceremonies before the cremation. But this could not be done because with Covid there was no group meetings to view the body before cremation.

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