Most of the people in the group I ride with are older than I am. One of them had a birthday today and we planned to have a special ride over the Richmond Bridge, down to a lunch stop then over to the Larkspur ferry and over to San Francisco where we had a choice of routes home. Ferry or rapid transit.

I woke up at 2 AM this morning with what I thought was a bout of allergy. But when I got up this morning I had what appears to be a cold and had a sharp cramp in my Gastrocnemius (the large muscle in the back lower leg).

Well, I wasn't going to expose a bunch of old farts to infections which they would surely identify as covid-19. And the latest study out of Stanford Medical School says that being vaccinated with the mRNA vaccines that most people were makes people far more likely to contract any new variant of covid-19.

How do you like those apples? Moreover, why can't you find this study on Google?

Now, while it is likely that any new variant of this corona virus will be less severe that the original Alpha and Delta variants, getting any sort of illness including the common cold is dangerous to the age group that has actually been dying from covid-19: over 50 and most dangerous to 70+ years old and with at least 8 comorbidities. This puts Jeff in that category.

Yesterday as I was picking up my car that just had a tuneup and oil change, a quarter of a block away there was some guy laying on the sidewalk in a red sleeping bag. He looked at me in my sports coat and slacks and started shouting "I hate your guts." and various other symptoms of mental illness. He wasn't close enough to see my age so I assume either I looked like his father or a police detective. One of the silent majority here sent me a posting from Jeff where he said that he hated me. I got a good laugh out of comparing him to that homeless mental case. But really I don't wish anyone health problems such as makes Jeff a cripple.

On 3/24/2022 11:53 AM, Tom Kunich wrote:
> .. And the latest study out of Stanford Medical School says that being vaccinated with the mRNA vaccines that most people were makes people far more likely to contract any new variant of covid-19.
>
> How do you like those apples? Moreover, why can't you find this study on Google?

Most likely answer? Because that "study" exists only in Tom's "memory,"
probably triggered by some anti-science allusion made by some right wing
talking head.

But I'm open to correction. Find us the study, Tom. Give a proper link
and/or citation here. Let's see what it really says.

> Yesterday as I was picking up my car that just had a tuneup and oil change, a quarter of a block away there was some guy laying on the sidewalk in a red sleeping bag. He looked at me in my sports coat and slacks and started shouting "I hate your guts." and various other symptoms of mental illness.

Yes, there are lots of people like that who probably belong in mental
institutions.

But mental institutions require tax money. How much more are you willing
to pay in taxes?

Of course, Tom, a person as brilliant as you may have a quick solution
to mental health and homelessness problems. If so, it's high time you
told the world. Withholding your solutions while constantly complaining
certainly isn't improving things.

--
- Frank Krygowski

On Thu, 24 Mar 2022 08:53:06 -0700 (PDT), Tom Kunich
<cyclintom@gmail.com> wrote:

>One of the silent majority here sent me a posting from Jeff
>where he said that he hated me.

It would seem that you are fishing for attention. I wouldn't want to
disappoint you.

As usual, you misinterpreted my intent. You have announced multiple
times in RBT that you will no longer reply to comments by the
"haters", which is your term for everyone who disagrees with your
point of view or finds discrepancies among your amazing facts. To
test whether you would actually deliver on your promise not to reply,
I declared that "I hate you". Predictably, your solemn oath to not
reply lasted a few days and subsequently returned to your normal
acerbic diatribes.

Looks like Andre first coined the term in RBT:
<https://groups.google.com/g/rec.bicycles.tech/search?q=haters%20author%3ATom%20author%3AKunich>

>I got a good laugh out of comparing him to that homeless mental
>case. But really I don't wish anyone health problems such as
>makes Jeff a cripple.

Do you consider someone a cripple because they can't ride a bicycle or
are not an athlete? Hopefully not. For the time being, I'm a
pedestrian and get adequate exercise walking and hiking (but not
cycling, running or climbing).

[ 28 minutes wasted trying to find something that would make Tom the
center of attention ]

--
Jeff Liebermann jeffl@cruzio.com
PO Box 272 http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Ben Lomond CA 95005-0272
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

On Thursday, March 24, 2022 at 8:53:08 AM UTC-7, Tom Kunich wrote:
> Most of the people in the group I ride with are older than I am. One of them had a birthday today and we planned to have a special ride over the Richmond Bridge, down to a lunch stop then over to the Larkspur ferry and over to San Francisco where we had a choice of routes home. Ferry or rapid transit.
>
> I woke up at 2 AM this morning with what I thought was a bout of allergy. But when I got up this morning I had what appears to be a cold and had a sharp cramp in my Gastrocnemius (the large muscle in the back lower leg).
>
> Well, I wasn't going to expose a bunch of old farts to infections which they would surely identify as covid-19. And the latest study out of Stanford Medical School says that being vaccinated with the mRNA vaccines that most people were makes people far more likely to contract any new variant of covid-19.
>
> How do you like those apples? Moreover, why can't you find this study on Google?
>
> Now, while it is likely that any new variant of this corona virus will be less severe that the original Alpha and Delta variants, getting any sort of illness including the common cold is dangerous to the age group that has actually been dying from covid-19: over 50 and most dangerous to 70+ years old and with at least 8 comorbidities. This puts Jeff in that category.
>
> Yesterday as I was picking up my car that just had a tuneup and oil change, a quarter of a block away there was some guy laying on the sidewalk in a red sleeping bag. He looked at me in my sports coat and slacks and started shouting "I hate your guts." and various other symptoms of mental illness. He wasn't close enough to see my age so I assume either I looked like his father or a police detective. One of the silent majority here sent me a posting from Jeff where he said that he hated me. I got a good laugh out of comparing him to that homeless mental case. But really I don't wish anyone health problems such as makes Jeff a cripple.

Usually I have been able to use Google to find printed and preprinted studies that actually show real numbers but so far Google has managed to make it nearly impossible to discover anything about that Stanford paper showing that vaccinated people are more than twice as vulnerable to new covid-19 variants than the unvaccinated. I'm still trying to find the pre-print but here is a discussion that appears to contain the information. https://lifeanddeathandallbetween.wordpress.com/2022/02/09/cell-preprint-study-reveals-catastrophic-levels-of-spike-protein-in-vaccinated/

On 3/24/2022 2:27 PM, Tom Kunich wrote:
> On Thursday, March 24, 2022 at 8:53:08 AM UTC-7, Tom Kunich wrote:
>> Most of the people in the group I ride with are older than I am. One of them had a birthday today and we planned to have a special ride over the Richmond Bridge, down to a lunch stop then over to the Larkspur ferry and over to San Francisco where we had a choice of routes home. Ferry or rapid transit.
>>
>> I woke up at 2 AM this morning with what I thought was a bout of allergy. But when I got up this morning I had what appears to be a cold and had a sharp cramp in my Gastrocnemius (the large muscle in the back lower leg).
>>
>> Well, I wasn't going to expose a bunch of old farts to infections which they would surely identify as covid-19. And the latest study out of Stanford Medical School says that being vaccinated with the mRNA vaccines that most people were makes people far more likely to contract any new variant of covid-19.
>>
>> How do you like those apples? Moreover, why can't you find this study on Google?
>>
>> Now, while it is likely that any new variant of this corona virus will be less severe that the original Alpha and Delta variants, getting any sort of illness including the common cold is dangerous to the age group that has actually been dying from covid-19: over 50 and most dangerous to 70+ years old and with at least 8 comorbidities. This puts Jeff in that category.
>>
>> Yesterday as I was picking up my car that just had a tuneup and oil change, a quarter of a block away there was some guy laying on the sidewalk in a red sleeping bag. He looked at me in my sports coat and slacks and started shouting "I hate your guts." and various other symptoms of mental illness. He wasn't close enough to see my age so I assume either I looked like his father or a police detective. One of the silent majority here sent me a posting from Jeff where he said that he hated me. I got a good laugh out of comparing him to that homeless mental case. But really I don't wish anyone health problems such as makes Jeff a cripple.
>
> Usually I have been able to use Google to find printed and preprinted studies that actually show real numbers but so far Google has managed to make it nearly impossible to discover anything about that Stanford paper showing that vaccinated people are more than twice as vulnerable to new covid-19 variants than the unvaccinated. I'm still trying to find the pre-print but here is a discussion that appears to contain the information. https://lifeanddeathandallbetween.wordpress.com/2022/02/09/cell-preprint-study-reveals-catastrophic-levels-of-spike-protein-in-vaccinated/

Ah, so your source is actually an anonymous right wing blogger who says
"I haven't actually read the paper yet..."

Gosh, how authoritative! That settles it all!

Thanks, Tom, for yet another of your contributions to medical science.
When the world leaders and world medical authorities call you for
advice, don't forget to include that nugget of pure genius.

--
- Frank Krygowski

On Thursday, March 24, 2022 at 11:27:44 AM UTC-7, Tom Kunich wrote:
> On Thursday, March 24, 2022 at 8:53:08 AM UTC-7, Tom Kunich wrote:
> > Most of the people in the group I ride with are older than I am. One of them had a birthday today and we planned to have a special ride over the Richmond Bridge, down to a lunch stop then over to the Larkspur ferry and over to San Francisco where we had a choice of routes home. Ferry or rapid transit.
> >
> > I woke up at 2 AM this morning with what I thought was a bout of allergy. But when I got up this morning I had what appears to be a cold and had a sharp cramp in my Gastrocnemius (the large muscle in the back lower leg).
> >
> > Well, I wasn't going to expose a bunch of old farts to infections which they would surely identify as covid-19. And the latest study out of Stanford Medical School says that being vaccinated with the mRNA vaccines that most people were makes people far more likely to contract any new variant of covid-19.
> >
> > How do you like those apples? Moreover, why can't you find this study on Google?
> >
> > Now, while it is likely that any new variant of this corona virus will be less severe that the original Alpha and Delta variants, getting any sort of illness including the common cold is dangerous to the age group that has actually been dying from covid-19: over 50 and most dangerous to 70+ years old and with at least 8 comorbidities. This puts Jeff in that category.
> >
> > Yesterday as I was picking up my car that just had a tuneup and oil change, a quarter of a block away there was some guy laying on the sidewalk in a red sleeping bag. He looked at me in my sports coat and slacks and started shouting "I hate your guts." and various other symptoms of mental illness. He wasn't close enough to see my age so I assume either I looked like his father or a police detective. One of the silent majority here sent me a posting from Jeff where he said that he hated me. I got a good laugh out of comparing him to that homeless mental case. But really I don't wish anyone health problems such as makes Jeff a cripple.
> Usually I have been able to use Google to find printed and preprinted studies that actually show real numbers but so far Google has managed to make it nearly impossible to discover anything about that Stanford paper showing that vaccinated people are more than twice as vulnerable to new covid-19 variants than the unvaccinated. I'm still trying to find the pre-print but here is a discussion that appears to contain the information. https://lifeanddeathandallbetween.wordpress.com/2022/02/09/cell-preprint-study-reveals-catastrophic-levels-of-spike-protein-in-vaccinated/

Remember that vaccination with mRNA vaccines for covid-19 have been found to combine with DNA cells in the liver causing high toxicity. This means that in SOME cases this can grow to high toxic levels and prove deadly. These cell lines in most people I would expect to literally kill themselves off simply because of the volume of changed cells to pre-vaccinated cells. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8180204/ But this is clear proof that the mRNA vaccines are dangerous and those are the vaccines most heavily distributed. Johnson & Johnson vaccines were developed in the original way and seem to have none of these flaws.

What all of this adds up to is that if you've been vaccinated with Pfizer or Moderna vaccines remain very alert for any symptoms of even general illness. And don't hesitate to go to your GP about it.

On Thursday, March 24, 2022 at 12:09:46 PM UTC-7, Tom Kunich wrote:
> On Thursday, March 24, 2022 at 11:27:44 AM UTC-7, Tom Kunich wrote:
> > On Thursday, March 24, 2022 at 8:53:08 AM UTC-7, Tom Kunich wrote:
> > > Most of the people in the group I ride with are older than I am. One of them had a birthday today and we planned to have a special ride over the Richmond Bridge, down to a lunch stop then over to the Larkspur ferry and over to San Francisco where we had a choice of routes home. Ferry or rapid transit.
> > >
> > > I woke up at 2 AM this morning with what I thought was a bout of allergy. But when I got up this morning I had what appears to be a cold and had a sharp cramp in my Gastrocnemius (the large muscle in the back lower leg)..
> > >
> > > Well, I wasn't going to expose a bunch of old farts to infections which they would surely identify as covid-19. And the latest study out of Stanford Medical School says that being vaccinated with the mRNA vaccines that most people were makes people far more likely to contract any new variant of covid-19.
> > >
> > > How do you like those apples? Moreover, why can't you find this study on Google?
> > >
> > > Now, while it is likely that any new variant of this corona virus will be less severe that the original Alpha and Delta variants, getting any sort of illness including the common cold is dangerous to the age group that has actually been dying from covid-19: over 50 and most dangerous to 70+ years old and with at least 8 comorbidities. This puts Jeff in that category.
> > >
> > > Yesterday as I was picking up my car that just had a tuneup and oil change, a quarter of a block away there was some guy laying on the sidewalk in a red sleeping bag. He looked at me in my sports coat and slacks and started shouting "I hate your guts." and various other symptoms of mental illness. He wasn't close enough to see my age so I assume either I looked like his father or a police detective. One of the silent majority here sent me a posting from Jeff where he said that he hated me. I got a good laugh out of comparing him to that homeless mental case. But really I don't wish anyone health problems such as makes Jeff a cripple.
> > Usually I have been able to use Google to find printed and preprinted studies that actually show real numbers but so far Google has managed to make it nearly impossible to discover anything about that Stanford paper showing that vaccinated people are more than twice as vulnerable to new covid-19 variants than the unvaccinated. I'm still trying to find the pre-print but here is a discussion that appears to contain the information. https://lifeanddeathandallbetween.wordpress.com/2022/02/09/cell-preprint-study-reveals-catastrophic-levels-of-spike-protein-in-vaccinated/
> Remember that vaccination with mRNA vaccines for covid-19 have been found to combine with DNA cells in the liver causing high toxicity. This means that in SOME cases this can grow to high toxic levels and prove deadly. These cell lines in most people I would expect to literally kill themselves off simply because of the volume of changed cells to pre-vaccinated cells. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8180204/ But this is clear proof that the mRNA vaccines are dangerous and those are the vaccines most heavily distributed. Johnson & Johnson vaccines were developed in the original way and seem to have none of these flaws.
>
> What all of this adds up to is that if you've been vaccinated with Pfizer or Moderna vaccines remain very alert for any symptoms of even general illness. And don't hesitate to go to your GP about it.

Here is a UK study that is repeating the same numbers that the Stanford study I heard (but can't find) supposedly said. https://www.theblaze.com/op-ed/horowitz-record-infections-in-super-vaxxed-uk-seniors-as-double-vaxxed-show-negative-efficacy-against-covid-death Ireland and Scotland have the highest vaccination rates in the UK, And those people are now being hospitalized and dying in large numbers: "That is straight-up negative efficacy even against death." https://www.theblaze.com/op-ed/horowitz-record-infections-in-super-vaxxed-uk-seniors-as-double-vaxxed-show-negative-efficacy-against-covid-death

To tell you the truth, as far as I can make out, Google is hiding this study. It is the latest study out of Stanford and so should have been at the very top of the page. I am now down 5 pages and haven't discovered anything but a few references to it. And I know that people like the bookkeeper are going to complain that it doesn't exist.

On Thu, 24 Mar 2022 11:27:42 -0700 (PDT), Tom Kunich
<cyclintom@gmail.com> wrote:

>Usually I have been able to use Google to find printed and preprinted studies that actually show real numbers but so far Google has managed to make it nearly impossible to discover anything about that Stanford paper showing that vaccinated people are more than twice as vulnerable to new covid-19 variants than the unvaccinated. I'm still trying to find the pre-print but here is a discussion that appears to contain the information. https://lifeanddeathandallbetween.wordpress.com/2022/02/09/cell-preprint-study-reveals-catastrophic-levels-of-spike-protein-in-vaccinated/

I had to follow three successive links from the above URL to find the
original paper. I will admit that the links were difficult to find.

This might be the original paper for which you were searching. About
half of the authors are associated with various departments at
Stanford University:
"SARS-CoV-2 vaccination washes away original antigenic sin"
<https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0092867422000769>
"Antibody breadth against viral variants is lower after infection
compared with all vaccines evaluated but improves over several
months." [1][2]

In simpler terms, your claim that "vaccinated people are more than
twice as vulnerable to new covid-19 variants than the unvaccinated" is
a contrived fabrication. The original article talks about the
"breadth" or range of different virus variants, and not about the
effectiveness of the vaccines or subsequent antibodies. After being
interpreted and re-interpreted by multiple bloggers, no wonder the
original research findings were mangled.

I haven't read the entire paper yet, but so far, I'm not finding
anything that agrees with your "twice as vulnerable" claim. Show me
the source and maybe I won't tell you what I think of your research.

[1] "Breadth" means the ability to recognize a range of viruses and
variants.
[2] "Original antigenic sin" is the immune response to the initial
exposure to the virus:
<https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Original_antigenic_sin>
[ 40 minutes down the drain on another wild goose chase ]

--
Jeff Liebermann jeffl@cruzio.com
PO Box 272 http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Ben Lomond CA 95005-0272
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

On Thu, 24 Mar 2022 13:35:14 -0700, Jeff Liebermann <jeffl@cruzio.com>
wrote:

>This might be the original paper for which you were searching. About
>half of the authors are associated with various departments at
>Stanford University:
>"SARS-CoV-2 vaccination washes away original antigenic sin"
><https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0092867422000769>
>"Antibody breadth against viral variants is lower after infection
>compared with all vaccines evaluated but improves over several
>months." [1][2]

Oops. Wrong title for article:
"Immune imprinting, breadth of variant recognition, and germinal
center response in human SARS-CoV-2 infection and vaccination"
<https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0092867422000769>
The URL and everything else was correct.
Click the "Show More", under the list of authors, under the title, for
details which include Stanford University affiliations.

--
Jeff Liebermann jeffl@cruzio.com
PO Box 272 http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Ben Lomond CA 95005-0272
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

On Thursday, March 24, 2022 at 2:09:46 PM UTC-5, cycl...@gmail.com wrote:
> Remember that vaccination with mRNA vaccines for covid-19 have been found to combine with DNA cells in the liver causing high toxicity. This means that in SOME cases this can grow to high toxic levels and prove deadly. These cell lines in most people I would expect to literally kill themselves off simply because of the volume of changed cells to pre-vaccinated cells. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8180204/ But this is clear proof that the mRNA vaccines are dangerous and those are the vaccines most heavily distributed. Johnson & Johnson vaccines were developed in the original way and seem to have none of these flaws.

Wow Tommy. You are truly a dumb moron. The citation you provided above does NOT say vaccines are dangerous. You somehow cited a study unrelated to your point. Wow times two. The citation you gave is about the effects of Covid. One of the effects is liver damage. From Covid. NOT the vaccine. But from the Covid virus itself.

"This paper provides evidence on the presence of severe acute respiratory syndrome coronavirus 2 in hepatocytes and its direct cytopathic activity, as well as the degree of liver damage due to drug toxicity, inflammation and hypoxia in COVID-19."

See Tommy, they say Covid-19 caused the liver damage. NOT the vaccine. They might also be saying the liver damage is caused by the treatment of Covid. Cut off the finger to cure the cold. Something like that. But the root cause of the liver damage is Covid.

"The conclusion of this paper is that the main causes of liver damage are direct viral aggression, coagulation dysfunction and endothelial damage, and patients with impaired liver function develop more severe forms of COVID-19 which requires special care by a multidisciplinary team that includes a hepatologist."

See again Tommy. The virus causes liver damage. And not surprisingly, the people infected with Covid are the ones who already have liver damage too. They are more susceptible and easier to infect and do worse with the virus. No surprise there.

>
> What all of this adds up to is that if you've been vaccinated with Pfizer or Moderna vaccines remain very alert for any symptoms of even general illness. And don't hesitate to go to your GP about it.

On Thursday, March 24, 2022 at 2:34:51 PM UTC-5, cycl...@gmail.com wrote:
> On Thursday, March 24, 2022 at 12:09:46 PM UTC-7, Tom Kunich wrote:
> > On Thursday, March 24, 2022 at 11:27:44 AM UTC-7, Tom Kunich wrote:
> > > On Thursday, March 24, 2022 at 8:53:08 AM UTC-7, Tom Kunich wrote:
> > > > Most of the people in the group I ride with are older than I am. One of them had a birthday today and we planned to have a special ride over the Richmond Bridge, down to a lunch stop then over to the Larkspur ferry and over to San Francisco where we had a choice of routes home. Ferry or rapid transit.
> > > >
> > > > I woke up at 2 AM this morning with what I thought was a bout of allergy. But when I got up this morning I had what appears to be a cold and had a sharp cramp in my Gastrocnemius (the large muscle in the back lower leg).
> > > >
> > > > Well, I wasn't going to expose a bunch of old farts to infections which they would surely identify as covid-19. And the latest study out of Stanford Medical School says that being vaccinated with the mRNA vaccines that most people were makes people far more likely to contract any new variant of covid-19.
> > > >
> > > > How do you like those apples? Moreover, why can't you find this study on Google?
> > > >
> > > > Now, while it is likely that any new variant of this corona virus will be less severe that the original Alpha and Delta variants, getting any sort of illness including the common cold is dangerous to the age group that has actually been dying from covid-19: over 50 and most dangerous to 70+ years old and with at least 8 comorbidities. This puts Jeff in that category.
> > > >
> > > > Yesterday as I was picking up my car that just had a tuneup and oil change, a quarter of a block away there was some guy laying on the sidewalk in a red sleeping bag. He looked at me in my sports coat and slacks and started shouting "I hate your guts." and various other symptoms of mental illness. He wasn't close enough to see my age so I assume either I looked like his father or a police detective. One of the silent majority here sent me a posting from Jeff where he said that he hated me. I got a good laugh out of comparing him to that homeless mental case. But really I don't wish anyone health problems such as makes Jeff a cripple.
> > > Usually I have been able to use Google to find printed and preprinted studies that actually show real numbers but so far Google has managed to make it nearly impossible to discover anything about that Stanford paper showing that vaccinated people are more than twice as vulnerable to new covid-19 variants than the unvaccinated. I'm still trying to find the pre-print but here is a discussion that appears to contain the information. https://lifeanddeathandallbetween.wordpress.com/2022/02/09/cell-preprint-study-reveals-catastrophic-levels-of-spike-protein-in-vaccinated/
> > Remember that vaccination with mRNA vaccines for covid-19 have been found to combine with DNA cells in the liver causing high toxicity. This means that in SOME cases this can grow to high toxic levels and prove deadly. These cell lines in most people I would expect to literally kill themselves off simply because of the volume of changed cells to pre-vaccinated cells. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8180204/ But this is clear proof that the mRNA vaccines are dangerous and those are the vaccines most heavily distributed. Johnson & Johnson vaccines were developed in the original way and seem to have none of these flaws.
> >
> > What all of this adds up to is that if you've been vaccinated with Pfizer or Moderna vaccines remain very alert for any symptoms of even general illness. And don't hesitate to go to your GP about it.
> Here is a UK study that is repeating the same numbers that the Stanford study I heard (but can't find) supposedly said. https://www.theblaze.com/op-ed/horowitz-record-infections-in-super-vaxxed-uk-seniors-as-double-vaxxed-show-negative-efficacy-against-covid-death Ireland and Scotland have the highest vaccination rates in the UK, And those people are now being hospitalized and dying in large numbers: "That is straight-up negative efficacy even against death." https://www.theblaze.com/op-ed/horowitz-record-infections-in-super-vaxxed-uk-seniors-as-double-vaxxed-show-negative-efficacy-against-covid-death
>

Tommy Tommy Tommy Tommy Tommy. I have told you multiple times that the source of your references is very important for credibility. Yet you fail to learn. Not surprisingly. Your paragraph above contains two links from "The Blaze". I did a Google search on The Blaze and came up with a Wikipedia link.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blaze_Media
"Blaze Media is an American conservative media company. It was founded in 2018 as a result of a merger between TheBlaze and CRTV LLC. The company's leadership consists of CEO Tyler Cardon and president Gaston Mooney. It is based in Irving, Texas, where it has studios and offices, as well as in Washington, D.C.

TheBlaze was a pay television network founded by Glenn Beck. CRTV LLC, which operated the Conservative Review and CRTV (Conservative Review Television), was an online subscription network."

Glenn Beck?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Glenn_Beck
"Glenn Lee Beck (born February 10, 1964) is an American conservative political commentator, conspiracy theorist, radio host, and television producer."
Conspiracy theorist?

The links you cited are about as reliable and credible and useful as a used piece of toilet paper in the septic tank.

> To tell you the truth, as far as I can make out, Google is hiding this study. It is the latest study out of Stanford and so should have been at the very top of the page. I am now down 5 pages and haven't discovered anything but a few references to it. And I know that people like the bookkeeper are going to complain that it doesn't exist.

On Thursday, March 24, 2022 at 12:34:51 PM UTC-7, Tom Kunich wrote:
> On Thursday, March 24, 2022 at 12:09:46 PM UTC-7, Tom Kunich wrote:
> > On Thursday, March 24, 2022 at 11:27:44 AM UTC-7, Tom Kunich wrote:
> > > On Thursday, March 24, 2022 at 8:53:08 AM UTC-7, Tom Kunich wrote:
> > > > Most of the people in the group I ride with are older than I am. One of them had a birthday today and we planned to have a special ride over the Richmond Bridge, down to a lunch stop then over to the Larkspur ferry and over to San Francisco where we had a choice of routes home. Ferry or rapid transit.
> > > >
> > > > I woke up at 2 AM this morning with what I thought was a bout of allergy. But when I got up this morning I had what appears to be a cold and had a sharp cramp in my Gastrocnemius (the large muscle in the back lower leg).
> > > >
> > > > Well, I wasn't going to expose a bunch of old farts to infections which they would surely identify as covid-19. And the latest study out of Stanford Medical School says that being vaccinated with the mRNA vaccines that most people were makes people far more likely to contract any new variant of covid-19.
> > > >
> > > > How do you like those apples? Moreover, why can't you find this study on Google?
> > > >
> > > > Now, while it is likely that any new variant of this corona virus will be less severe that the original Alpha and Delta variants, getting any sort of illness including the common cold is dangerous to the age group that has actually been dying from covid-19: over 50 and most dangerous to 70+ years old and with at least 8 comorbidities. This puts Jeff in that category.
> > > >
> > > > Yesterday as I was picking up my car that just had a tuneup and oil change, a quarter of a block away there was some guy laying on the sidewalk in a red sleeping bag. He looked at me in my sports coat and slacks and started shouting "I hate your guts." and various other symptoms of mental illness. He wasn't close enough to see my age so I assume either I looked like his father or a police detective. One of the silent majority here sent me a posting from Jeff where he said that he hated me. I got a good laugh out of comparing him to that homeless mental case. But really I don't wish anyone health problems such as makes Jeff a cripple.
> > > Usually I have been able to use Google to find printed and preprinted studies that actually show real numbers but so far Google has managed to make it nearly impossible to discover anything about that Stanford paper showing that vaccinated people are more than twice as vulnerable to new covid-19 variants than the unvaccinated. I'm still trying to find the pre-print but here is a discussion that appears to contain the information. https://lifeanddeathandallbetween.wordpress.com/2022/02/09/cell-preprint-study-reveals-catastrophic-levels-of-spike-protein-in-vaccinated/
> > Remember that vaccination with mRNA vaccines for covid-19 have been found to combine with DNA cells in the liver causing high toxicity. This means that in SOME cases this can grow to high toxic levels and prove deadly. These cell lines in most people I would expect to literally kill themselves off simply because of the volume of changed cells to pre-vaccinated cells. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8180204/ But this is clear proof that the mRNA vaccines are dangerous and those are the vaccines most heavily distributed. Johnson & Johnson vaccines were developed in the original way and seem to have none of these flaws.
> >
> > What all of this adds up to is that if you've been vaccinated with Pfizer or Moderna vaccines remain very alert for any symptoms of even general illness. And don't hesitate to go to your GP about it.
> Here is a UK study that is repeating the same numbers that the Stanford study I heard (but can't find) supposedly said. https://www.theblaze.com/op-ed/horowitz-record-infections-in-super-vaxxed-uk-seniors-as-double-vaxxed-show-negative-efficacy-against-covid-death Ireland and Scotland have the highest vaccination rates in the UK, And those people are now being hospitalized and dying in large numbers: "That is straight-up negative efficacy even against death." https://www.theblaze.com/op-ed/horowitz-record-infections-in-super-vaxxed-uk-seniors-as-double-vaxxed-show-negative-efficacy-against-covid-death
>
> To tell you the truth, as far as I can make out, Google is hiding this study. It is the latest study out of Stanford and so should have been at the very top of the page. I am now down 5 pages and haven't discovered anything but a few references to it. And I know that people like the bookkeeper are going to complain that it doesn't exist.

Well I finally found the study. It was at https://reader.elsevier.com/reader/sd/pii/S0092867422000769?token=AD77233E97949B9846C5D512141546CF1E3C36246363F28C4AA761F1181319EF4D8203E19E047C317562CE4A406B1658&originRegion=us-east-1&originCreation=20220324231855 This is an extremely complicated study that was led by a professor at Stanford medical school. In order to understand it completely would take perhaps days. But from what I can see from a fast scan is that if you are vaccinated with mRNA vaccines such as the one used by Pfizer, you almost immediately begin losing a specific type of immunoglobulin (antibody specific to infections) that indicates the loss of your immune system. It looks like the the liver of a person that has been vaccinated is damaged. Previous articles claiming that mRNA vaccines that are NOT supposed to bind with DNA are doing so in the liver causing massive generation of spike proteins that are the source of poison should probably be looked into more closely. This suggests that the vaccines are destroying your immune system and additional infections of the various variants worsens the condition.

As I say, this is a very complex study and there are indications of cancer and faint guessing that the damage may be from previous covid infections. I have to study this article very closely. Massive signs of lung (?) cancer in patients treated with a vaccine would be very unusual. As well as signs that taking the vaccine can produce results as the worst cases of covid-19 infection.

If this interpretation is correct there is no way it could have passed any real trials. There are so many authors of this study that you have what appears to be half of them praising the vaccines as if what they were seeing were secondary to the speed it was developed. How that could be so when there are several tumor growth factors being detected is unscientific if you ask me. But it would seem to me that if widespread tumor growth was causing the hardening of the lung tissues in vaccinated covid breakthrough infections and deaths that it would be trumpeted rather loudly by autopsies.

Anyway, I'll continue digging through this though I won't post anymore on it until I understand it all.

On Thursday, March 24, 2022 at 6:55:56 PM UTC-5, cycl...@gmail.com wrote:
> On Thursday, March 24, 2022 at 12:34:51 PM UTC-7, Tom Kunich wrote:
> > On Thursday, March 24, 2022 at 12:09:46 PM UTC-7, Tom Kunich wrote:
> > > On Thursday, March 24, 2022 at 11:27:44 AM UTC-7, Tom Kunich wrote:
> > > > On Thursday, March 24, 2022 at 8:53:08 AM UTC-7, Tom Kunich wrote:
> > > > > Most of the people in the group I ride with are older than I am. One of them had a birthday today and we planned to have a special ride over the Richmond Bridge, down to a lunch stop then over to the Larkspur ferry and over to San Francisco where we had a choice of routes home. Ferry or rapid transit.
> > > > >
> > > > > I woke up at 2 AM this morning with what I thought was a bout of allergy. But when I got up this morning I had what appears to be a cold and had a sharp cramp in my Gastrocnemius (the large muscle in the back lower leg).
> > > > >
> > > > > Well, I wasn't going to expose a bunch of old farts to infections which they would surely identify as covid-19. And the latest study out of Stanford Medical School says that being vaccinated with the mRNA vaccines that most people were makes people far more likely to contract any new variant of covid-19.
> > > > >
> > > > > How do you like those apples? Moreover, why can't you find this study on Google?
> > > > >
> > > > > Now, while it is likely that any new variant of this corona virus will be less severe that the original Alpha and Delta variants, getting any sort of illness including the common cold is dangerous to the age group that has actually been dying from covid-19: over 50 and most dangerous to 70+ years old and with at least 8 comorbidities. This puts Jeff in that category.
> > > > >
> > > > > Yesterday as I was picking up my car that just had a tuneup and oil change, a quarter of a block away there was some guy laying on the sidewalk in a red sleeping bag. He looked at me in my sports coat and slacks and started shouting "I hate your guts." and various other symptoms of mental illness. He wasn't close enough to see my age so I assume either I looked like his father or a police detective. One of the silent majority here sent me a posting from Jeff where he said that he hated me. I got a good laugh out of comparing him to that homeless mental case. But really I don't wish anyone health problems such as makes Jeff a cripple.
> > > > Usually I have been able to use Google to find printed and preprinted studies that actually show real numbers but so far Google has managed to make it nearly impossible to discover anything about that Stanford paper showing that vaccinated people are more than twice as vulnerable to new covid-19 variants than the unvaccinated. I'm still trying to find the pre-print but here is a discussion that appears to contain the information. https://lifeanddeathandallbetween.wordpress.com/2022/02/09/cell-preprint-study-reveals-catastrophic-levels-of-spike-protein-in-vaccinated/
> > > Remember that vaccination with mRNA vaccines for covid-19 have been found to combine with DNA cells in the liver causing high toxicity. This means that in SOME cases this can grow to high toxic levels and prove deadly. These cell lines in most people I would expect to literally kill themselves off simply because of the volume of changed cells to pre-vaccinated cells. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8180204/ But this is clear proof that the mRNA vaccines are dangerous and those are the vaccines most heavily distributed. Johnson & Johnson vaccines were developed in the original way and seem to have none of these flaws.
> > >
> > > What all of this adds up to is that if you've been vaccinated with Pfizer or Moderna vaccines remain very alert for any symptoms of even general illness. And don't hesitate to go to your GP about it.
> > Here is a UK study that is repeating the same numbers that the Stanford study I heard (but can't find) supposedly said. https://www.theblaze.com/op-ed/horowitz-record-infections-in-super-vaxxed-uk-seniors-as-double-vaxxed-show-negative-efficacy-against-covid-death Ireland and Scotland have the highest vaccination rates in the UK, And those people are now being hospitalized and dying in large numbers: "That is straight-up negative efficacy even against death." https://www.theblaze.com/op-ed/horowitz-record-infections-in-super-vaxxed-uk-seniors-as-double-vaxxed-show-negative-efficacy-against-covid-death
> >
> > To tell you the truth, as far as I can make out, Google is hiding this study. It is the latest study out of Stanford and so should have been at the very top of the page. I am now down 5 pages and haven't discovered anything but a few references to it. And I know that people like the bookkeeper are going to complain that it doesn't exist.
> Well I finally found the study. It was at https://reader.elsevier.com/reader/sd/pii/S0092867422000769?token=AD77233E97949B9846C5D512141546CF1E3C36246363F28C4AA761F1181319EF4D8203E19E047C317562CE4A406B1658&originRegion=us-east-1&originCreation=20220324231855 This is an extremely complicated study that was led by a professor at Stanford medical school. In order to understand it completely would take perhaps days. But from what I can see from a fast scan is that if you are vaccinated with mRNA vaccines such as the one used by Pfizer, you almost immediately begin losing a specific type of immunoglobulin (antibody specific to infections) that indicates the loss of your immune system. It looks like the the liver of a person that has been vaccinated is damaged. Previous articles claiming that mRNA vaccines that are NOT supposed to bind with DNA are doing so in the liver causing massive generation of spike proteins that are the source of poison should probably be looked into more closely. This suggests that the vaccines are destroying your immune system and additional infections of the various variants worsens the condition.
>
> As I say, this is a very complex study and there are indications of cancer and faint guessing that the damage may be from previous covid infections. I have to study this article very closely. Massive signs of lung (?) cancer in patients treated with a vaccine would be very unusual. As well as signs that taking the vaccine can produce results as the worst cases of covid-19 infection.
>
> If this interpretation is correct there is no way it could have passed any real trials. There are so many authors of this study that you have what appears to be half of them praising the vaccines as if what they were seeing were secondary to the speed it was developed. How that could be so when there are several tumor growth factors being detected is unscientific if you ask me. But it would seem to me that if widespread tumor growth was causing the hardening of the lung tissues in vaccinated covid breakthrough infections and deaths that it would be trumpeted rather loudly by autopsies.
>
> Anyway, I'll continue digging through this though I won't post anymore on it until I understand it all.

Quotes from the study you cited.

"Current SARS-CoV-2 vaccines all contain or induce the expression of antigens similar to those of the early Wuhan-Hu-1 viral isolate"

"It remains to be determined precisely how the immune system responds to mRNA and other vaccine platforms compared with SARS-CoV-2 infection."

"Several SARS-CoV-2 variants of concern with mutations in the spike gene have emerged and spread globally, with differing abilities to evade neutralizing antibody responses elicited by Wuhan-Hu-1 infection or vaccination."

"The appearance of virus variants, waning antibody levels after infection or vaccination, and breakthrough infections in previously immunized individuals indicate that periodic vaccine boosting of immunity to SARS-CoV-2 is warranted."

"Severe COVID-19 stimulates higher SARS-CoV-2-specific antibody titers than asymptomatic infection or mild illness."

"One of the positive developments amid the global calamity of the SARS-CoV-2 pandemic has been the rapid design, production, and deployment of a variety of vaccines, including remarkably effective mRNA vaccines encoding the viral spike."

"Correlates of immunological protection from SARS-CoV-2 infection following vaccination or prior infection are still under investigation."

"our findings lead to the prediction that antibodies derived from infection may provide somewhat decreased protection against virus variants compared with comparable concentrations of antibodies stimulated by vaccination."

"As additional variants of SARS-CoV-2 appear over time, individuals will acquire distinct immunological histories depending on which vaccines they received and which viral variants infected them."

"Taken together, these results underscore important differences between SARS-CoV-2 antibody responses produced by vaccination versus infection."

MY SUMMARY:
Get vaccinated!!!!!!!!! The original vaccines were based on the original Covid virus strain. Viruses change over time. New virus strains may evade the original vaccines. Getting vaccinated gives you better protection than getting infected and recovering. New vaccines will be needed to keep fighting Covid virus as it mutates over time.

I have no idea what Tommy boy was trying to proclaim by mentioning this study. Whatever it was, he is wrong of course. Get vaccinated against Covid.

On Thu, 24 Mar 2022 12:09:44 -0700 (PDT), Tom Kunich
<cyclintom@gmail.com> wrote:

>On Thursday, March 24, 2022 at 11:27:44 AM UTC-7, Tom Kunich wrote:
>> On Thursday, March 24, 2022 at 8:53:08 AM UTC-7, Tom Kunich wrote:
>> > Most of the people in the group I ride with are older than I am. One of them had a birthday today and we planned to have a special ride over the Richmond Bridge, down to a lunch stop then over to the Larkspur ferry and over to San Francisco where we had a choice of routes home. Ferry or rapid transit.
>> >
>> > I woke up at 2 AM this morning with what I thought was a bout of allergy. But when I got up this morning I had what appears to be a cold and had a sharp cramp in my Gastrocnemius (the large muscle in the back lower leg).
>> >
>> > Well, I wasn't going to expose a bunch of old farts to infections which they would surely identify as covid-19. And the latest study out of Stanford Medical School says that being vaccinated with the mRNA vaccines that most people were makes people far more likely to contract any new variant of covid-19.
>> >
>> > How do you like those apples? Moreover, why can't you find this study on Google?
>> >
>> > Now, while it is likely that any new variant of this corona virus will be less severe that the original Alpha and Delta variants, getting any sort of illness including the common cold is dangerous to the age group that has actually been dying from covid-19: over 50 and most dangerous to 70+ years old and with at least 8 comorbidities. This puts Jeff in that category.
>> >
>> > Yesterday as I was picking up my car that just had a tuneup and oil change, a quarter of a block away there was some guy laying on the sidewalk in a red sleeping bag. He looked at me in my sports coat and slacks and started shouting "I hate your guts." and various other symptoms of mental illness. He wasn't close enough to see my age so I assume either I looked like his father or a police detective. One of the silent majority here sent me a posting from Jeff where he said that he hated me. I got a good laugh out of comparing him to that homeless mental case. But really I don't wish anyone health problems such as makes Jeff a cripple.
>> Usually I have been able to use Google to find printed and preprinted studies that actually show real numbers but so far Google has managed to make it nearly impossible to discover anything about that Stanford paper showing that vaccinated people are more than twice as vulnerable to new covid-19 variants than the unvaccinated. I'm still trying to find the pre-print but here is a discussion that appears to contain the information. https://lifeanddeathandallbetween.wordpress.com/2022/02/09/cell-preprint-study-reveals-catastrophic-levels-of-spike-protein-in-vaccinated/
>
>Remember that vaccination with mRNA vaccines for covid-19 have been found to combine with DNA cells in the liver causing high toxicity. This means that in SOME cases this can grow to high toxic levels and prove deadly. These cell lines in most people I would expect to literally kill themselves off simply because of the volume of changed cells to pre-vaccinated cells. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8180204/ But this is clear proof that the mRNA vaccines are dangerous and those are the vaccines most heavily distributed. Johnson & Johnson vaccines were developed in the original way and seem to have none of these flaws.
>
>What all of this adds up to is that if you've been vaccinated with Pfizer or Moderna vaccines remain very alert for any symptoms of even general illness. And don't hesitate to go to your GP about it.

Maybe this is the reason that the U.S. leads the world in both Total
Cases - 81,537,778, almost twice the numbers of the closest challenger
and Total Deaths - 1,001,495.

In comparison, the total of all combat deaths in all the U.S. military
escapades from 1775 to 2019 seems to be 666,441
--
Cheers,

John B.

On 3/24/2022 7:55 PM, Tom Kunich wrote:
> On Thursday, March 24, 2022 at 12:34:51 PM UTC-7, Tom Kunich wrote:
>> On Thursday, March 24, 2022 at 12:09:46 PM UTC-7, Tom Kunich wrote:
>>> On Thursday, March 24, 2022 at 11:27:44 AM UTC-7, Tom Kunich wrote:
>>>> On Thursday, March 24, 2022 at 8:53:08 AM UTC-7, Tom Kunich wrote:
>>>>> Most of the people in the group I ride with are older than I am. One of them had a birthday today and we planned to have a special ride over the Richmond Bridge, down to a lunch stop then over to the Larkspur ferry and over to San Francisco where we had a choice of routes home. Ferry or rapid transit.
>>>>>
>>>>> I woke up at 2 AM this morning with what I thought was a bout of allergy. But when I got up this morning I had what appears to be a cold and had a sharp cramp in my Gastrocnemius (the large muscle in the back lower leg).
>>>>>
>>>>> Well, I wasn't going to expose a bunch of old farts to infections which they would surely identify as covid-19. And the latest study out of Stanford Medical School says that being vaccinated with the mRNA vaccines that most people were makes people far more likely to contract any new variant of covid-19.
>>>>>
>>>>> How do you like those apples? Moreover, why can't you find this study on Google?
>>>>>
>>>>> Now, while it is likely that any new variant of this corona virus will be less severe that the original Alpha and Delta variants, getting any sort of illness including the common cold is dangerous to the age group that has actually been dying from covid-19: over 50 and most dangerous to 70+ years old and with at least 8 comorbidities. This puts Jeff in that category.
>>>>>
>>>>> Yesterday as I was picking up my car that just had a tuneup and oil change, a quarter of a block away there was some guy laying on the sidewalk in a red sleeping bag. He looked at me in my sports coat and slacks and started shouting "I hate your guts." and various other symptoms of mental illness. He wasn't close enough to see my age so I assume either I looked like his father or a police detective. One of the silent majority here sent me a posting from Jeff where he said that he hated me. I got a good laugh out of comparing him to that homeless mental case. But really I don't wish anyone health problems such as makes Jeff a cripple.
>>>> Usually I have been able to use Google to find printed and preprinted studies that actually show real numbers but so far Google has managed to make it nearly impossible to discover anything about that Stanford paper showing that vaccinated people are more than twice as vulnerable to new covid-19 variants than the unvaccinated. I'm still trying to find the pre-print but here is a discussion that appears to contain the information. https://lifeanddeathandallbetween.wordpress.com/2022/02/09/cell-preprint-study-reveals-catastrophic-levels-of-spike-protein-in-vaccinated/
>>> Remember that vaccination with mRNA vaccines for covid-19 have been found to combine with DNA cells in the liver causing high toxicity. This means that in SOME cases this can grow to high toxic levels and prove deadly. These cell lines in most people I would expect to literally kill themselves off simply because of the volume of changed cells to pre-vaccinated cells. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8180204/ But this is clear proof that the mRNA vaccines are dangerous and those are the vaccines most heavily distributed. Johnson & Johnson vaccines were developed in the original way and seem to have none of these flaws.
>>>
>>> What all of this adds up to is that if you've been vaccinated with Pfizer or Moderna vaccines remain very alert for any symptoms of even general illness. And don't hesitate to go to your GP about it.
>> Here is a UK study that is repeating the same numbers that the Stanford study I heard (but can't find) supposedly said. https://www.theblaze.com/op-ed/horowitz-record-infections-in-super-vaxxed-uk-seniors-as-double-vaxxed-show-negative-efficacy-against-covid-death Ireland and Scotland have the highest vaccination rates in the UK, And those people are now being hospitalized and dying in large numbers: "That is straight-up negative efficacy even against death." https://www.theblaze.com/op-ed/horowitz-record-infections-in-super-vaxxed-uk-seniors-as-double-vaxxed-show-negative-efficacy-against-covid-death
>>
>> To tell you the truth, as far as I can make out, Google is hiding this study. It is the latest study out of Stanford and so should have been at the very top of the page. I am now down 5 pages and haven't discovered anything but a few references to it. And I know that people like the bookkeeper are going to complain that it doesn't exist.
>
> Well I finally found the study. It was at https://reader.elsevier.com/reader/sd/pii/S0092867422000769?token=AD77233E97949B9846C5D512141546CF1E3C36246363F28C4AA761F1181319EF4D8203E19E047C317562CE4A406B1658&originRegion=us-east-1&originCreation=20220324231855 This is an extremely complicated study that was led by a professor at Stanford medical school. In order to understand it completely would take perhaps days. But from what I can see from a fast scan is that if you are vaccinated with mRNA vaccines such as the one used by Pfizer, you almost immediately begin losing a specific type of immunoglobulin (antibody specific to infections) that indicates the loss of your immune system. It looks like the the liver of a person that has been vaccinated is damaged. Previous articles claiming that mRNA vaccines that are NOT supposed to bind with DNA are doing so in the liver causing massive generation of spike proteins that are the source of poison should probably be looked into more closely. This suggests that the vaccines are destroying your immune system and additional infections of the various variants worsens the condition.
>
> As I say, this is a very complex study and there are indications of cancer and faint guessing that the damage may be from previous covid infections. I have to study this article very closely. Massive signs of lung (?) cancer in patients treated with a vaccine would be very unusual. As well as signs that taking the vaccine can produce results as the worst cases of covid-19 infection.
>
> If this interpretation is correct there is no way it could have passed any real trials. There are so many authors of this study that you have what appears to be half of them praising the vaccines as if what they were seeing were secondary to the speed it was developed. How that could be so when there are several tumor growth factors being detected is unscientific if you ask me. But it would seem to me that if widespread tumor growth was causing the hardening of the lung tissues in vaccinated covid breakthrough infections and deaths that it would be trumpeted rather loudly by autopsies.
>
> Anyway, I'll continue digging through this though I won't post anymore on it until I understand it all.
I strongly suspect you'll never understand it.
But I look forward to reading you blaming Trump for putting this vaccine
development on the fast track.
--
- Frank Krygowski

On Thu, 24 Mar 2022 17:41:03 -0700 (PDT), "russellseaton1@yahoo.com"
<ritzannaseaton@gmail.com> wrote:

>On Thursday, March 24, 2022 at 6:55:56 PM UTC-5, cycl...@gmail.com wrote:
>> On Thursday, March 24, 2022 at 12:34:51 PM UTC-7, Tom Kunich wrote:
>> > On Thursday, March 24, 2022 at 12:09:46 PM UTC-7, Tom Kunich wrote:
>> > > On Thursday, March 24, 2022 at 11:27:44 AM UTC-7, Tom Kunich wrote:
>> > > > On Thursday, March 24, 2022 at 8:53:08 AM UTC-7, Tom Kunich wrote:
>> > > > > Most of the people in the group I ride with are older than I am. One of them had a birthday today and we planned to have a special ride over the Richmond Bridge, down to a lunch stop then over to the Larkspur ferry and over to San Francisco where we had a choice of routes home. Ferry or rapid transit.
>> > > > >
>> > > > > I woke up at 2 AM this morning with what I thought was a bout of allergy. But when I got up this morning I had what appears to be a cold and had a sharp cramp in my Gastrocnemius (the large muscle in the back lower leg).
>> > > > >
>> > > > > Well, I wasn't going to expose a bunch of old farts to infections which they would surely identify as covid-19. And the latest study out of Stanford Medical School says that being vaccinated with the mRNA vaccines that most people were makes people far more likely to contract any new variant of covid-19.
>> > > > >
>> > > > > How do you like those apples? Moreover, why can't you find this study on Google?
>> > > > >
>> > > > > Now, while it is likely that any new variant of this corona virus will be less severe that the original Alpha and Delta variants, getting any sort of illness including the common cold is dangerous to the age group that has actually been dying from covid-19: over 50 and most dangerous to 70+ years old and with at least 8 comorbidities. This puts Jeff in that category.
>> > > > >
>> > > > > Yesterday as I was picking up my car that just had a tuneup and oil change, a quarter of a block away there was some guy laying on the sidewalk in a red sleeping bag. He looked at me in my sports coat and slacks and started shouting "I hate your guts." and various other symptoms of mental illness. He wasn't close enough to see my age so I assume either I looked like his father or a police detective. One of the silent majority here sent me a posting from Jeff where he said that he hated me. I got a good laugh out of comparing him to that homeless mental case. But really I don't wish anyone health problems such as makes Jeff a cripple.
>> > > > Usually I have been able to use Google to find printed and preprinted studies that actually show real numbers but so far Google has managed to make it nearly impossible to discover anything about that Stanford paper showing that vaccinated people are more than twice as vulnerable to new covid-19 variants than the unvaccinated. I'm still trying to find the pre-print but here is a discussion that appears to contain the information. https://lifeanddeathandallbetween.wordpress.com/2022/02/09/cell-preprint-study-reveals-catastrophic-levels-of-spike-protein-in-vaccinated/
>> > > Remember that vaccination with mRNA vaccines for covid-19 have been found to combine with DNA cells in the liver causing high toxicity. This means that in SOME cases this can grow to high toxic levels and prove deadly. These cell lines in most people I would expect to literally kill themselves off simply because of the volume of changed cells to pre-vaccinated cells. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8180204/ But this is clear proof that the mRNA vaccines are dangerous and those are the vaccines most heavily distributed. Johnson & Johnson vaccines were developed in the original way and seem to have none of these flaws.
>> > >
>> > > What all of this adds up to is that if you've been vaccinated with Pfizer or Moderna vaccines remain very alert for any symptoms of even general illness. And don't hesitate to go to your GP about it.
>> > Here is a UK study that is repeating the same numbers that the Stanford study I heard (but can't find) supposedly said. https://www.theblaze.com/op-ed/horowitz-record-infections-in-super-vaxxed-uk-seniors-as-double-vaxxed-show-negative-efficacy-against-covid-death Ireland and Scotland have the highest vaccination rates in the UK, And those people are now being hospitalized and dying in large numbers: "That is straight-up negative efficacy even against death." https://www.theblaze.com/op-ed/horowitz-record-infections-in-super-vaxxed-uk-seniors-as-double-vaxxed-show-negative-efficacy-against-covid-death
>> >
>> > To tell you the truth, as far as I can make out, Google is hiding this study. It is the latest study out of Stanford and so should have been at the very top of the page. I am now down 5 pages and haven't discovered anything but a few references to it. And I know that people like the bookkeeper are going to complain that it doesn't exist.
>> Well I finally found the study. It was at https://reader.elsevier.com/reader/sd/pii/S0092867422000769?token=AD77233E97949B9846C5D512141546CF1E3C36246363F28C4AA761F1181319EF4D8203E19E047C317562CE4A406B1658&originRegion=us-east-1&originCreation=20220324231855 This is an extremely complicated study that was led by a professor at Stanford medical school. In order to understand it completely would take perhaps days. But from what I can see from a fast scan is that if you are vaccinated with mRNA vaccines such as the one used by Pfizer, you almost immediately begin losing a specific type of immunoglobulin (antibody specific to infections) that indicates the loss of your immune system. It looks like the the liver of a person that has been vaccinated is damaged. Previous articles claiming that mRNA vaccines that are NOT supposed to bind with DNA are doing so in the liver causing massive generation of spike proteins that are the source of poison should probably be looked into more closely.
>This suggests that the vaccines are destroying your immune system and additional infections of the various variants worsens the condition.
>>
>> As I say, this is a very complex study and there are indications of cancer and faint guessing that the damage may be from previous covid infections. I have to study this article very closely. Massive signs of lung (?) cancer in patients treated with a vaccine would be very unusual. As well as signs that taking the vaccine can produce results as the worst cases of covid-19 infection.
>>
>> If this interpretation is correct there is no way it could have passed any real trials. There are so many authors of this study that you have what appears to be half of them praising the vaccines as if what they were seeing were secondary to the speed it was developed. How that could be so when there are several tumor growth factors being detected is unscientific if you ask me. But it would seem to me that if widespread tumor growth was causing the hardening of the lung tissues in vaccinated covid breakthrough infections and deaths that it would be trumpeted rather loudly by autopsies.
>>
>> Anyway, I'll continue digging through this though I won't post anymore on it until I understand it all.
>
>Quotes from the study you cited.
>
>"Current SARS-CoV-2 vaccines all contain or induce the expression of antigens similar to those of the early Wuhan-Hu-1 viral isolate"
>
>"It remains to be determined precisely how the immune system responds to mRNA and other vaccine platforms compared with SARS-CoV-2 infection."
>
>"Several SARS-CoV-2 variants of concern with mutations in the spike gene have emerged and spread globally, with differing abilities to evade neutralizing antibody responses elicited by Wuhan-Hu-1 infection or vaccination."
>
>"The appearance of virus variants, waning antibody levels after infection or vaccination, and breakthrough infections in previously immunized individuals indicate that periodic vaccine boosting of immunity to SARS-CoV-2 is warranted."
>
>"Severe COVID-19 stimulates higher SARS-CoV-2-specific antibody titers than asymptomatic infection or mild illness."
>
>"One of the positive developments amid the global calamity of the SARS-CoV-2 pandemic has been the rapid design, production, and deployment of a variety of vaccines, including remarkably effective mRNA vaccines encoding the viral spike."
>
>"Correlates of immunological protection from SARS-CoV-2 infection following vaccination or prior infection are still under investigation."
>
>"our findings lead to the prediction that antibodies derived from infection may provide somewhat decreased protection against virus variants compared with comparable concentrations of antibodies stimulated by vaccination."
>
>"As additional variants of SARS-CoV-2 appear over time, individuals will acquire distinct immunological histories depending on which vaccines they received and which viral variants infected them."
>
>"Taken together, these results underscore important differences between SARS-CoV-2 antibody responses produced by vaccination versus infection."
>
>MY SUMMARY:
>Get vaccinated!!!!!!!!! The original vaccines were based on the original Covid virus strain. Viruses change over time. New virus strains may evade the original vaccines. Getting vaccinated gives you better protection than getting infected and recovering. New vaccines will be needed to keep fighting Covid virus as it mutates over time.
>
>I have no idea what Tommy boy was trying to proclaim by mentioning this study. Whatever it was, he is wrong of course. Get vaccinated against Covid.

On Thu, 24 Mar 2022 16:55:54 -0700 (PDT), Tom Kunich
<cyclintom@gmail.com> wrote:

>Well I finally found the study. It was at https://reader.elsevier.com/reader/sd/pii/S0092867422000769?token=AD77233E97949B9846C5D512141546CF1E3C36246363F28C4AA761F1181319EF4D8203E19E047C317562CE4A406B1658&originRegion=us-east-1&originCreation=20220324231855

Nicely done. It's exactly the same article as the link I previously
posted but from a different journal:
<https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0092867422000769>

The PDF from "Cell" journal is easier to read:
<https://reader.elsevier.com/reader/sd/pii/S1471490622000485?token=6EF4DCC9DEA6F6868A9C6718D99A97F2A99500704B1E299007A8F2C0DEE01398157D98392F9EDE4E42A1C09309CC9134&originRegion=us-east-1&originCreation=20220325025414>

>This is an extremely complicated study...

Now, there we can agree. It's way over my head. Instead of me trying
to read and understand the article, I'll just wait until you provide a
translation. Don't forget to include where you claimed it
demonstrated that:
"...Stanford paper showing that vaccinated people are more than twice
as vulnerable to new Covid-19 variants than the unvaccinated."
Thanks in advance.

--
Jeff Liebermann jeffl@cruzio.com
PO Box 272 http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Ben Lomond CA 95005-0272
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

On Thursday, March 24, 2022 at 10:02:41 PM UTC-5, jeff.li...@gmail.com wrote:
> On Thu, 24 Mar 2022 16:55:54 -0700 (PDT), Tom Kunich
> <cycl...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> >Well I finally found the study. It was at https://reader.elsevier.com/reader/sd/pii/S0092867422000769?token=AD77233E97949B9846C5D512141546CF1E3C36246363F28C4AA761F1181319EF4D8203E19E047C317562CE4A406B1658&originRegion=us-east-1&originCreation=20220324231855
> Nicely done. It's exactly the same article as the link I previously
> posted but from a different journal:
> <https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0092867422000769>
>
> The PDF from "Cell" journal is easier to read:
> <https://reader.elsevier.com/reader/sd/pii/S1471490622000485?token=6EF4DCC9DEA6F6868A9C6718D99A97F2A99500704B1E299007A8F2C0DEE01398157D98392F9EDE4E42A1C09309CC9134&originRegion=us-east-1&originCreation=20220325025414>
>
> >This is an extremely complicated study...
>
> Now, there we can agree. It's way over my head. Instead of me trying
> to read and understand the article, I'll just wait until you provide a
> translation. Don't forget to include where you claimed it
> demonstrated that:
> "...Stanford paper showing that vaccinated people are more than twice
> as vulnerable to new Covid-19 variants than the unvaccinated."
> Thanks in advance.
> --
> Jeff Liebermann je...@cruzio.com
> PO Box 272 http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
> Ben Lomond CA 95005-0272
> Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

Thanks Jeff. I replied to Tommy's posting of the Stanford paper above. I wrote I did not know what Tommy boy was trying to prove with the paper. But my summary of the paper was, Get Vaccinated!!!!!!!!! And the Covid virus mutates over time so you will likely need new vaccines in the future to protect you from Covid. Didn't seem to me the paper was too ground breaking in new knowledge. Even if it was done by Stanford according to Tommy. Pretty simple common sense. Of course sense is not too common.

On Thursday, March 24, 2022 at 9:10:51 PM UTC-5, John B. wrote:
> On Thu, 24 Mar 2022 17:41:03 -0700 (PDT), "russell...@yahoo.com"
> <ritzann...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> >On Thursday, March 24, 2022 at 6:55:56 PM UTC-5, cycl...@gmail.com wrote:
> >> On Thursday, March 24, 2022 at 12:34:51 PM UTC-7, Tom Kunich wrote:
> >> > On Thursday, March 24, 2022 at 12:09:46 PM UTC-7, Tom Kunich wrote:
> >> > > On Thursday, March 24, 2022 at 11:27:44 AM UTC-7, Tom Kunich wrote:
> >> > > > On Thursday, March 24, 2022 at 8:53:08 AM UTC-7, Tom Kunich wrote:
> >> > > > > Most of the people in the group I ride with are older than I am. One of them had a birthday today and we planned to have a special ride over the Richmond Bridge, down to a lunch stop then over to the Larkspur ferry and over to San Francisco where we had a choice of routes home. Ferry or rapid transit.
> >> > > > >
> >> > > > > I woke up at 2 AM this morning with what I thought was a bout of allergy. But when I got up this morning I had what appears to be a cold and had a sharp cramp in my Gastrocnemius (the large muscle in the back lower leg).
> >> > > > >
> >> > > > > Well, I wasn't going to expose a bunch of old farts to infections which they would surely identify as covid-19. And the latest study out of Stanford Medical School says that being vaccinated with the mRNA vaccines that most people were makes people far more likely to contract any new variant of covid-19.
> >> > > > >
> >> > > > > How do you like those apples? Moreover, why can't you find this study on Google?
> >> > > > >
> >> > > > > Now, while it is likely that any new variant of this corona virus will be less severe that the original Alpha and Delta variants, getting any sort of illness including the common cold is dangerous to the age group that has actually been dying from covid-19: over 50 and most dangerous to 70+ years old and with at least 8 comorbidities. This puts Jeff in that category.
> >> > > > >
> >> > > > > Yesterday as I was picking up my car that just had a tuneup and oil change, a quarter of a block away there was some guy laying on the sidewalk in a red sleeping bag. He looked at me in my sports coat and slacks and started shouting "I hate your guts." and various other symptoms of mental illness. He wasn't close enough to see my age so I assume either I looked like his father or a police detective. One of the silent majority here sent me a posting from Jeff where he said that he hated me. I got a good laugh out of comparing him to that homeless mental case. But really I don't wish anyone health problems such as makes Jeff a cripple.
> >> > > > Usually I have been able to use Google to find printed and preprinted studies that actually show real numbers but so far Google has managed to make it nearly impossible to discover anything about that Stanford paper showing that vaccinated people are more than twice as vulnerable to new covid-19 variants than the unvaccinated. I'm still trying to find the pre-print but here is a discussion that appears to contain the information. https://lifeanddeathandallbetween.wordpress.com/2022/02/09/cell-preprint-study-reveals-catastrophic-levels-of-spike-protein-in-vaccinated/
> >> > > Remember that vaccination with mRNA vaccines for covid-19 have been found to combine with DNA cells in the liver causing high toxicity. This means that in SOME cases this can grow to high toxic levels and prove deadly. These cell lines in most people I would expect to literally kill themselves off simply because of the volume of changed cells to pre-vaccinated cells. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8180204/ But this is clear proof that the mRNA vaccines are dangerous and those are the vaccines most heavily distributed. Johnson & Johnson vaccines were developed in the original way and seem to have none of these flaws.
> >> > >
> >> > > What all of this adds up to is that if you've been vaccinated with Pfizer or Moderna vaccines remain very alert for any symptoms of even general illness. And don't hesitate to go to your GP about it.
> >> > Here is a UK study that is repeating the same numbers that the Stanford study I heard (but can't find) supposedly said. https://www.theblaze.com/op-ed/horowitz-record-infections-in-super-vaxxed-uk-seniors-as-double-vaxxed-show-negative-efficacy-against-covid-death Ireland and Scotland have the highest vaccination rates in the UK, And those people are now being hospitalized and dying in large numbers: "That is straight-up negative efficacy even against death." https://www.theblaze.com/op-ed/horowitz-record-infections-in-super-vaxxed-uk-seniors-as-double-vaxxed-show-negative-efficacy-against-covid-death
> >> >
> >> > To tell you the truth, as far as I can make out, Google is hiding this study. It is the latest study out of Stanford and so should have been at the very top of the page. I am now down 5 pages and haven't discovered anything but a few references to it. And I know that people like the bookkeeper are going to complain that it doesn't exist.
> >> Well I finally found the study. It was at https://reader.elsevier.com/reader/sd/pii/S0092867422000769?token=AD77233E97949B9846C5D512141546CF1E3C36246363F28C4AA761F1181319EF4D8203E19E047C317562CE4A406B1658&originRegion=us-east-1&originCreation=20220324231855 This is an extremely complicated study that was led by a professor at Stanford medical school. In order to understand it completely would take perhaps days. But from what I can see from a fast scan is that if you are vaccinated with mRNA vaccines such as the one used by Pfizer, you almost immediately begin losing a specific type of immunoglobulin (antibody specific to infections) that indicates the loss of your immune system. It looks like the the liver of a person that has been vaccinated is damaged. Previous articles claiming that mRNA vaccines that are NOT supposed to bind with DNA are doing so in the liver causing massive generation of spike proteins that are the source of poison should probably be looked into more closely.
> >This suggests that the vaccines are destroying your immune system and additional infections of the various variants worsens the condition.
> >>
> >> As I say, this is a very complex study and there are indications of cancer and faint guessing that the damage may be from previous covid infections. I have to study this article very closely. Massive signs of lung (?) cancer in patients treated with a vaccine would be very unusual. As well as signs that taking the vaccine can produce results as the worst cases of covid-19 infection.
> >>
> >> If this interpretation is correct there is no way it could have passed any real trials. There are so many authors of this study that you have what appears to be half of them praising the vaccines as if what they were seeing were secondary to the speed it was developed. How that could be so when there are several tumor growth factors being detected is unscientific if you ask me. But it would seem to me that if widespread tumor growth was causing the hardening of the lung tissues in vaccinated covid breakthrough infections and deaths that it would be trumpeted rather loudly by autopsies.
> >>
> >> Anyway, I'll continue digging through this though I won't post anymore on it until I understand it all.
> >
> >Quotes from the study you cited.
> >
> >"Current SARS-CoV-2 vaccines all contain or induce the expression of antigens similar to those of the early Wuhan-Hu-1 viral isolate"
> >
> >"It remains to be determined precisely how the immune system responds to mRNA and other vaccine platforms compared with SARS-CoV-2 infection."
> >
> >"Several SARS-CoV-2 variants of concern with mutations in the spike gene have emerged and spread globally, with differing abilities to evade neutralizing antibody responses elicited by Wuhan-Hu-1 infection or vaccination."
> >
> >"The appearance of virus variants, waning antibody levels after infection or vaccination, and breakthrough infections in previously immunized individuals indicate that periodic vaccine boosting of immunity to SARS-CoV-2 is warranted."
> >
> >"Severe COVID-19 stimulates higher SARS-CoV-2-specific antibody titers than asymptomatic infection or mild illness."
> >
> >"One of the positive developments amid the global calamity of the SARS-CoV-2 pandemic has been the rapid design, production, and deployment of a variety of vaccines, including remarkably effective mRNA vaccines encoding the viral spike."
> >
> >"Correlates of immunological protection from SARS-CoV-2 infection following vaccination or prior infection are still under investigation."
> >
> >"our findings lead to the prediction that antibodies derived from infection may provide somewhat decreased protection against virus variants compared with comparable concentrations of antibodies stimulated by vaccination."
> >
> >"As additional variants of SARS-CoV-2 appear over time, individuals will acquire distinct immunological histories depending on which vaccines they received and which viral variants infected them."
> >
> >"Taken together, these results underscore important differences between SARS-CoV-2 antibody responses produced by vaccination versus infection."
> >
> >MY SUMMARY:
> >Get vaccinated!!!!!!!!! The original vaccines were based on the original Covid virus strain. Viruses change over time. New virus strains may evade the original vaccines. Getting vaccinated gives you better protection than getting infected and recovering. New vaccines will be needed to keep fighting Covid virus as it mutates over time.
> >
> >I have no idea what Tommy boy was trying to proclaim by mentioning this study. Whatever it was, he is wrong of course. Get vaccinated against Covid..
> My wife's younger sister, her daughter and grandson have recently been
> diagnosed with "covid" the sister and daughter, for sure
> have been vaccinated but I don't know about the 4 year old grandson.
> The sister reports that she felt "sick" for a day or so and is now
> feeling better and the daughter and grandson the same.
>
> Apparently the vaccination does help.
> --
> Cheers,
>
> John B.

On Thu, 24 Mar 2022 22:44:00 -0700 (PDT), "russellseaton1@yahoo.com"
<ritzannaseaton@gmail.com> wrote:

>Thanks Jeff. I replied to Tommy's posting of the Stanford paper above. I wrote I did not know what Tommy boy was trying to prove with the paper. But my summary of the paper was, Get Vaccinated!!!!!!!!! And the Covid virus mutates over time so you will likely need new vaccines in the future to protect you from Covid. Didn't seem to me the paper was too ground breaking in new knowledge. Even if it was done by Stanford according to Tommy. Pretty simple common sense. Of course sense is not too common.

Yep. That's pretty much it. The PDF version of the paper includes a
section which summarized the entire report in one sentence (or more
correctly, three sentences spliced together):
<https://pdf.sciencedirectassets.com/272196/1-s2.0-S0092867421X00074/1-s2.0-S0092867422000769/main.pdf?X-Amz-Security-Token=IQoJb3JpZ2luX2VjEOX%2F%2F%2F%2F%2F%2F%2F%2F%2F%2FwEaCXVzLWVhc3QtMSJHMEUCIFkfy9BYje4qL15GgLYKf91xFTeINu3%2FRNMU18Q5T2h8AiEAquOb7vh92W888aZMRMmVyypX3u1PUctg8ZFbu%2FIJQFAq%2BgMIbhAEGgwwNTkwMDM1NDY4NjUiDHpt8LoQ09k5lu7ItyrXAwDY8BfmXtdk1MHwhTtpZaR1%2F8qu6G0groWsO4fWiSCgxMfzU5wMcqkXgghiLQQGs0xaK08YAFFgAl271kiUEUumDX%2B2lGZ236H%2BInJx8jV9QtTzM4l5lrqOxGKMva5Y5%2FKz7ksRXRGIApdX%2FndJkMsrUv%2BWyxtYC5mz%2BxQToiFvwjf8h7JFPhBGVrWWPaG7DHEIoFvy50Ij0VNu2enoG%2B7QM5E1tXQXlG599xrOVf4klk4dIGH7QRvxg0OQqWgK5%2Fcp5oKnYK37hHAH1ZHodVY96EpopMku5DrSv%2FQhEOpYKqwBqFti4kSFqfJ02or%2BLYV%2FFqOL426TSigc%2B%2FOW2kJjoglCSCk607HBYO%2FbNMd6ICSUAx%2FA%2BoZSrF6dYNkkPCrdXEZ36xhXiL7yB0qWyXuVmQKVTNdUaZWPqF%2BsGCZvCMiZDEE%2FlsGAd9LKRL3Rxsgt5HotT%2BXFiNs8oy7osgpndsGbdp8riWkwFXTzD7G3vS%2FS9xzhUd1QpC3pVwoamhgYaQK%2Fqzq4VHaJu9yzQQlBRIcRl8VeNsoIEb0ccTf5bf4xAOOSFLOAK5h%2Fp%2BG2l8ZzC9pnz%2FgwKGiLTVCauF3FU5qaE1
wKLQSdqjRyrY64JjvNWw90GTDnl%2FWRBjqlAT%2F35xsNG1nwSeKlae%2BagP%2BCmDjkTozjNxvMbXjLpmro%2FKDl%2B7mo5zpakN4c9SUkD1Qx3lWZGLoqSzOtEfwiKZYJXTCvwY0VK3uWnxEcrqy3E34YW2L5Q8Ys3CbbL72MtY%2Bc7KSx8tlqLTWQkHiMGzTaPFSzi7kynj9nwXhjrMqEBgOSXAnSyKYap1eoDehL9fI6n0UYtPK4gLTR1PBl3tTVVY6tWA%3D%3D&X-Amz-Algorithm=AWS4-HMAC-SHA256&X-Amz-Date=20220325T062740Z&X-Amz-SignedHeaders=host&X-Amz-Expires=300&X-Amz-Credential=ASIAQ3PHCVTYVZTPZKX6%2F20220325%2Fus-east-1%2Fs3%2Faws4_request&X-Amz-Signature=624ac91f18d5f0498d2e91d2ee6fb7309f0a0a6b4015b0c3b900b15544ca948d&hash=d4dd130f1012695c10a333806ed0e11c7965220f77ca2251a5cd5c14de34a06c&host=68042c943591013ac2b2430a89b270f6af2c76d8dfd086a07176afe7c76c2c61&pii=S0092867422000769&tid=spdf-240aca11-f106-4a70-bdf7-dfcfdc52a7fa&sid=7ddad22276c9054ee96884924119ab3f445bgxrqa&type=client&ua=4c0055565c535455545e07&rr=6f15950059ef9e6e>
<https://bit.ly/3NkP4d1> shortened

"In Brief: Human antibody responses to SARS-CoV-2 differ between
vaccination and infection, with mRNA vaccination inducing more
productive lymph node GC responses and several vaccine types
stimulating IgG antibodies capable of recognizing a broader range of
viral variants."

My translation: Surviving the virus versus vaccination results in two
different immune responses. Vaccination works better because it is
effective against a wider range of variants.

Of course, nowhere in the article does it mention anything about Tom's
claim that:
"...Stanford paper showing that vaccinated people are more than twice
as vulnerable to new Covid-19 variants than the unvaccinated."

--
Jeff Liebermann jeffl@cruzio.com
PO Box 272 http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Ben Lomond CA 95005-0272
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

On Thu, 24 Mar 2022 22:47:57 -0700 (PDT), "russellseaton1@yahoo.com"
<ritzannaseaton@gmail.com> wrote:

>On Thursday, March 24, 2022 at 9:10:51 PM UTC-5, John B. wrote:
>> On Thu, 24 Mar 2022 17:41:03 -0700 (PDT), "russell...@yahoo.com"
>> <ritzann...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> >On Thursday, March 24, 2022 at 6:55:56 PM UTC-5, cycl...@gmail.com wrote:
>> >> On Thursday, March 24, 2022 at 12:34:51 PM UTC-7, Tom Kunich wrote:
>> >> > On Thursday, March 24, 2022 at 12:09:46 PM UTC-7, Tom Kunich wrote:
>> >> > > On Thursday, March 24, 2022 at 11:27:44 AM UTC-7, Tom Kunich wrote:
>> >> > > > On Thursday, March 24, 2022 at 8:53:08 AM UTC-7, Tom Kunich wrote:
>> >> > > > > Most of the people in the group I ride with are older than I am. One of them had a birthday today and we planned to have a special ride over the Richmond Bridge, down to a lunch stop then over to the Larkspur ferry and over to San Francisco where we had a choice of routes home. Ferry or rapid transit.
>> >> > > > >
>> >> > > > > I woke up at 2 AM this morning with what I thought was a bout of allergy. But when I got up this morning I had what appears to be a cold and had a sharp cramp in my Gastrocnemius (the large muscle in the back lower leg).
>> >> > > > >
>> >> > > > > Well, I wasn't going to expose a bunch of old farts to infections which they would surely identify as covid-19. And the latest study out of Stanford Medical School says that being vaccinated with the mRNA vaccines that most people were makes people far more likely to contract any new variant of covid-19.
>> >> > > > >
>> >> > > > > How do you like those apples? Moreover, why can't you find this study on Google?
>> >> > > > >
>> >> > > > > Now, while it is likely that any new variant of this corona virus will be less severe that the original Alpha and Delta variants, getting any sort of illness including the common cold is dangerous to the age group that has actually been dying from covid-19: over 50 and most dangerous to 70+ years old and with at least 8 comorbidities. This puts Jeff in that category.
>> >> > > > >
>> >> > > > > Yesterday as I was picking up my car that just had a tuneup and oil change, a quarter of a block away there was some guy laying on the sidewalk in a red sleeping bag. He looked at me in my sports coat and slacks and started shouting "I hate your guts." and various other symptoms of mental illness. He wasn't close enough to see my age so I assume either I looked like his father or a police detective. One of the silent majority here sent me a posting from Jeff where he said that he hated me. I got a good laugh out of comparing him to that homeless mental case. But really I don't wish anyone health problems such as makes Jeff a cripple.
>> >> > > > Usually I have been able to use Google to find printed and preprinted studies that actually show real numbers but so far Google has managed to make it nearly impossible to discover anything about that Stanford paper showing that vaccinated people are more than twice as vulnerable to new covid-19 variants than the unvaccinated. I'm still trying to find the pre-print but here is a discussion that appears to contain the information. https://lifeanddeathandallbetween.wordpress.com/2022/02/09/cell-preprint-study-reveals-catastrophic-levels-of-spike-protein-in-vaccinated/
>> >> > > Remember that vaccination with mRNA vaccines for covid-19 have been found to combine with DNA cells in the liver causing high toxicity. This means that in SOME cases this can grow to high toxic levels and prove deadly. These cell lines in most people I would expect to literally kill themselves off simply because of the volume of changed cells to pre-vaccinated cells. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8180204/ But this is clear proof that the mRNA vaccines are dangerous and those are the vaccines most heavily distributed. Johnson & Johnson vaccines were developed in the original way and seem to have none of these flaws.
>> >> > >
>> >> > > What all of this adds up to is that if you've been vaccinated with Pfizer or Moderna vaccines remain very alert for any symptoms of even general illness. And don't hesitate to go to your GP about it.
>> >> > Here is a UK study that is repeating the same numbers that the Stanford study I heard (but can't find) supposedly said. https://www.theblaze.com/op-ed/horowitz-record-infections-in-super-vaxxed-uk-seniors-as-double-vaxxed-show-negative-efficacy-against-covid-death Ireland and Scotland have the highest vaccination rates in the UK, And those people are now being hospitalized and dying in large numbers: "That is straight-up negative efficacy even against death." https://www.theblaze.com/op-ed/horowitz-record-infections-in-super-vaxxed-uk-seniors-as-double-vaxxed-show-negative-efficacy-against-covid-death
>> >> >
>> >> > To tell you the truth, as far as I can make out, Google is hiding this study. It is the latest study out of Stanford and so should have been at the very top of the page. I am now down 5 pages and haven't discovered anything but a few references to it. And I know that people like the bookkeeper are going to complain that it doesn't exist.
>> >> Well I finally found the study. It was at https://reader.elsevier.com/reader/sd/pii/S0092867422000769?token=AD77233E97949B9846C5D512141546CF1E3C36246363F28C4AA761F1181319EF4D8203E19E047C317562CE4A406B1658&originRegion=us-east-1&originCreation=20220324231855 This is an extremely complicated study that was led by a professor at Stanford medical school. In order to understand it completely would take perhaps days. But from what I can see from a fast scan is that if you are vaccinated with mRNA vaccines such as the one used by Pfizer, you almost immediately begin losing a specific type of immunoglobulin (antibody specific to infections) that indicates the loss of your immune system. It looks like the the liver of a person that has been vaccinated is damaged. Previous articles claiming that mRNA vaccines that are NOT supposed to bind with DNA are doing so in the liver causing massive generation of spike proteins that are the source of poison should probably be looked into more
>closely.
>> >This suggests that the vaccines are destroying your immune system and additional infections of the various variants worsens the condition.
>> >>
>> >> As I say, this is a very complex study and there are indications of cancer and faint guessing that the damage may be from previous covid infections. I have to study this article very closely. Massive signs of lung (?) cancer in patients treated with a vaccine would be very unusual. As well as signs that taking the vaccine can produce results as the worst cases of covid-19 infection.
>> >>
>> >> If this interpretation is correct there is no way it could have passed any real trials. There are so many authors of this study that you have what appears to be half of them praising the vaccines as if what they were seeing were secondary to the speed it was developed. How that could be so when there are several tumor growth factors being detected is unscientific if you ask me. But it would seem to me that if widespread tumor growth was causing the hardening of the lung tissues in vaccinated covid breakthrough infections and deaths that it would be trumpeted rather loudly by autopsies.
>> >>
>> >> Anyway, I'll continue digging through this though I won't post anymore on it until I understand it all.
>> >
>> >Quotes from the study you cited.
>> >
>> >"Current SARS-CoV-2 vaccines all contain or induce the expression of antigens similar to those of the early Wuhan-Hu-1 viral isolate"
>> >
>> >"It remains to be determined precisely how the immune system responds to mRNA and other vaccine platforms compared with SARS-CoV-2 infection."
>> >
>> >"Several SARS-CoV-2 variants of concern with mutations in the spike gene have emerged and spread globally, with differing abilities to evade neutralizing antibody responses elicited by Wuhan-Hu-1 infection or vaccination."
>> >
>> >"The appearance of virus variants, waning antibody levels after infection or vaccination, and breakthrough infections in previously immunized individuals indicate that periodic vaccine boosting of immunity to SARS-CoV-2 is warranted."
>> >
>> >"Severe COVID-19 stimulates higher SARS-CoV-2-specific antibody titers than asymptomatic infection or mild illness."
>> >
>> >"One of the positive developments amid the global calamity of the SARS-CoV-2 pandemic has been the rapid design, production, and deployment of a variety of vaccines, including remarkably effective mRNA vaccines encoding the viral spike."
>> >
>> >"Correlates of immunological protection from SARS-CoV-2 infection following vaccination or prior infection are still under investigation."
>> >
>> >"our findings lead to the prediction that antibodies derived from infection may provide somewhat decreased protection against virus variants compared with comparable concentrations of antibodies stimulated by vaccination."
>> >
>> >"As additional variants of SARS-CoV-2 appear over time, individuals will acquire distinct immunological histories depending on which vaccines they received and which viral variants infected them."
>> >
>> >"Taken together, these results underscore important differences between SARS-CoV-2 antibody responses produced by vaccination versus infection."
>> >
>> >MY SUMMARY:
>> >Get vaccinated!!!!!!!!! The original vaccines were based on the original Covid virus strain. Viruses change over time. New virus strains may evade the original vaccines. Getting vaccinated gives you better protection than getting infected and recovering. New vaccines will be needed to keep fighting Covid virus as it mutates over time.
>> >
>> >I have no idea what Tommy boy was trying to proclaim by mentioning this study. Whatever it was, he is wrong of course. Get vaccinated against Covid.
>> My wife's younger sister, her daughter and grandson have recently been
>> diagnosed with "covid" the sister and daughter, for sure
>> have been vaccinated but I don't know about the 4 year old grandson.
>> The sister reports that she felt "sick" for a day or so and is now
>> feeling better and the daughter and grandson the same.
>>
>> Apparently the vaccination does help.
>> --
>> Cheers,
>>
>> John B.
>
>I think everyone on earth except Tommy and Fox News has been saying the vaccine works/helps. Even TRUMP HIMSELF said the vaccine works!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
>

Tom Kunich wrote:
> Johnson & Johnson vaccines were developed in the original way and
seem > to have none of these flaws.

The J&J-Janssen product has other flaws and is not safe. Don't feed
your Ivermectin stato your cat, yet!

> Anyway, I'll continue digging through this
<https://doi.org/10.1016/j.cell.2022.01.018>
> though I won't post
> anymore on it until I understand it all.

The more important question is whether the pathologist authors
understood or asked everything they should have.

Sometimes, pictures can be part of a short answer, even if rbt fools
will cry ad-hominem! when they politically correctly strain to unsee a
young, inexperienced, specialist lab rat and fat guys who, at least in
2020, had big reasons personally to put more hope in fast-lane vaccines
than into getting in shape.
<https://www.houstonchronicle.com/news/nation-world/nation/article/Rare-super-coronavirus-antibodies-likely-to-15353765.php>

<https://www.achgut.com/artikel/warum_werden_corona_geimpfte_so_krank/>
Translated by www.DeepL.com/Translator:

*quote*
[....]
/Explanation for the increase of autoimmune diseases/

Germinal centers are morphologically definable zones within a lymph node
(lymphoid follicle, which are important organs of immune defense) where
IgG and IgM antibodies are produced against an antigen previously
recognized as foreign and where memory B cells accumulate to rapidly
trigger a humoral and cellular immune response when the body is
re-exposed to the known antigen. Thus, the germinal centers are the
factories of the humoral immune response by which antigen carriers are
labeled and marked for clearance or destruction. While two weeks after
vaccination, especially after the second, the SPIKE antigen disappears
from the serum and is also no longer detectable in most organs, the
SPIKE mRNA and protein persist in the germinal centers for months. This
is an important new insight.

Because this means that the body is constantly producing new SPIKE
proteins in the core area of the immune system long after vaccination,
which can continuously maintain and amplify a possible autoimmune
response due to similarity of the SPIKE antigen to the body's own
structures. This may help explain the high increase of autoimmune
diseases among vaccinees. However, SPIKE proteins produced in B cells
can also be distributed throughout the body, albeit in small doses, by
exocytosis leading to the formation of exosomes. These exosomes could
have two effects. First, like SPIKE-producing B cells themselves, they
may contribute to the stimulation of possible autoimmune responses
because antigen is repeatedly presented to the immune system through
them. Second, they may co-induce blood clotting events and cause other
toxic effects of the SPIKE protein, such as the as yet poorly understood
modulation of the immune system leading to VAIDS.

Why does the mRNA persist in the B cells and their progenitors in the
germinal centers? First, because the artificial mRNA packaged in
Pfizer/BioNTech and Moderna lipid nanoparticles contains pseudouridines
instead of uridine. These nucleosides lead to a massive increase in the
lifespan of mRNA in cells and increased translation (protein synthesis).
Perhaps they also contribute to a low elimination rate of the
transfected cells. Probably the long durability of the mRNA in the B
cells is also due to the fact that the immune system does not eliminate
these cells, which are essential for its function, although they produce
the toxic SPIKE protein. Like a Trojan horse, the mRNA seems to take up
residence in the center of the immune system and, like a smoldering
fire, continues to control the production of SPIKE proteins. The effect
is expected to last as long as the affected B lymphocyte populations are
naturally alive (at least months). I had previously always thought that
persistence of mRNA in the body was impossible, based on data from
animal studies in the context of vaccine development, but lymphoid
follicles had not been studied in these experiments. The effect
described here offers an explanation for the long-lasting toxic effects
of the vaccines. And just when it might be beginning to wear off, we are
supposed to get boosters, which will start the effect all over again in
an enhanced form.

But the authors fail to recognize these possibilities, instead writing,
"We hypothesize that the abundant SPIKE antigen in the lymphoid germinal
centers of mRNA vaccinees contributes to the higher breadth of IgG
binding of the SPIKE receptor binding domain that we see after
vaccination (...)" -- so they believe that SPIKE persistence enhances
the vaccination effect described as positive.

/The staggering weakness of the top publications/

This statement, like the entire paper by Röltgen and colleagues, reveals
a staggering weakness in this top publication in Cell. For in the study,
the authors examine the strength and breadth of IgG formation against
the vaccine antigen, the SARS-CoV-2 SPIKE protein. They show that more
and more diverse IgG antibodies are formed by vaccination than by
natural infection, although the selection of patients is sometimes
problematic, especially in the study of lymphoid follicles, where
vaccinees are compared only with severely ill patients, which are
extremely rare in SARS-CoV-2. However, the authors do not even ask
themselves what the clinical significance of IgG formation actually is
and what the price of vaccination is. Because obviously IgG formation
plays hardly any role for immunity against SARS-CoV-2. IgG are needed to
scavenge antigens in the lymphatic system and in the bloodstream or in
insterstitial tissues. But on the respiratory epithelia (mucous
membranes), where the virus resides in 99.9 percent of cases and must be
defended against, T cells and IgA are critical for defense. But these
arms of the acquired immune response are not stimulated by vaccination,
but apparently weakened. The few patients who experience significant
SARS-CoV-2 viremia have poor survival with or without vaccination
anyway. Immunization with the SPIKE protein does nothing clinically.

But instead of asking just one of these questions, the authors go to
great lengths to examine IgG, an irrelevant surrogate parameter that
says nothing about the clinical efficacy of vaccination. In doing so,
they do not even realize what an important discovery they have made by
studying the germinal centers. None of the reviewers who evaluated this
publication noticed either. Like this paper, there are currently
numerous papers in top biomedical journals. As soon as COVID is
involved, colleagues seem to be struck by a strange inability to bring
their own knowledge to bear. But reality always prevails for sure - it
is only a matter of time. Then this biggest medical scandal of all time
will have to be dealt with. Trust in medicine and science will remain
shaken for a long time.

*endquote*

--
<https://t.me/GBfreiheitsfoto/323> Ricarda Lang, co-boss of Germany's
Green Party, keen on mandatory "vaccination," evidently drinking Spezi
soda (containing phosphoric acid and 28 grams of sugar) to strengthen
her bones.

Am 25.03.2022 um 13:24 schrieb Sepp Ruf:
> Tom Kunich wrote:
> > Johnson & Johnson vaccines were developed in the original way and
> seem > to have none of these flaws.
>
> The J&J-Janssen product has other flaws and is not safe.  Don't feed
> your Ivermectin stato your cat, yet!
>
>> Anyway, I'll continue digging through this
> <https://doi.org/10.1016/j.cell.2022.01.018>
>> though I won't post
>> anymore on it until I understand it all.
>
> The more important question is whether the pathologist authors
> understood or asked everything they should have.
>
> Sometimes, pictures can be part of a short answer, even if rbt fools
> will cry ad-hominem! when they politically correctly strain to unsee a
> young, inexperienced, specialist lab rat and fat guys who, at least in
> 2020, had big reasons personally to put more hope in fast-lane vaccines
> than into getting in shape.
> <https://www.houstonchronicle.com/news/nation-world/nation/article/Rare-super-coronavirus-antibodies-likely-to-15353765.php>
>
>
>
> <https://www.achgut.com/artikel/warum_werden_corona_geimpfte_so_krank/>

'Andreas Zimmermann has a Ph.D. in science from a German University. He
is writing under a pseudonym'

So the author is writing some random bullshit on an ultra-right website
but does not want his name to be associated with his writing.

I really trust people who pretend to be scientific but refuse to give
their real names.

On 3/25/2022 2:34 AM, Jeff Liebermann wrote:
>
> Of course, nowhere in the article does it mention anything about Tom's
> claim that:
> "...Stanford paper showing that vaccinated people are more than twice
> as vulnerable to new Covid-19 variants than the unvaccinated."

I'm sure Tom will graciously post a self-correction and an apology any
minute now.

(Yes, that was sarcasm.)

--
- Frank Krygowski

On 3/25/2022 9:48 AM, Rolf Mantel wrote:
> Am 25.03.2022 um 13:24 schrieb Sepp Ruf:
>> Tom Kunich wrote:
>>  > Johnson & Johnson vaccines were developed in the original way and
>> seem > to have none of these flaws.
>>
>> The J&J-Janssen product has other flaws and is not safe.  Don't feed
>> your Ivermectin stato your cat, yet!
>>
>>> Anyway, I'll continue digging through this
>> <https://doi.org/10.1016/j.cell.2022.01.018>
>>> though I won't post
>>> anymore on it until I understand it all.
>>
>> The more important question is whether the pathologist authors
>> understood or asked everything they should have.
>>
>> Sometimes, pictures can be part of a short answer, even if rbt fools
>> will cry ad-hominem! when they politically correctly strain to unsee a
>> young, inexperienced, specialist lab rat and fat guys who, at least in
>> 2020, had big reasons personally to put more hope in fast-lane
>> vaccines than into getting in shape.
>> <https://www.houstonchronicle.com/news/nation-world/nation/article/Rare-super-coronavirus-antibodies-likely-to-15353765.php>
>>
>>
>>
>> <https://www.achgut.com/artikel/warum_werden_corona_geimpfte_so_krank/>
>
> 'Andreas Zimmermann has a Ph.D. in science from a German University.  He
> is writing under a pseudonym'
>
> So the author is writing some random bullshit on an ultra-right website
> but does not want his name to be associated with his writing.
>
> I really trust people who pretend to be scientific but refuse to give
> their real names.

To a person submerged in far-right propaganda, none of that matters.
Credentials, data, training, experience, overwhelming agreement by
scientific or medical communities mean nothing.

For them, the standard is this: Does it agree with Q-Anon? Then it must
be true!

--
- Frank Krygowski