The C50 does ride noticeably better than the Trek Alpha 1.5. I can't say that the Chorus is any better in actual use than the Centaur since I didn't get a chance to climb yet. Coming over the top of a climb the Chorus would allow you to ship multiple faster gears rather than the single you get with a Centaur. Again I don't think that makes any difference since Di2 only allows you to shift one gear at a time.

But I will say that I like having my lifetime bike with good components on a good frame.

I made a snotty remark about Russell's Di2 being the 10 speed which was probably uncalled for if his is reliable. The group was totally redesigned the following year because of reliability problems and a major change in the communications procedures. But if it works for him that is all that matters. Though there aren't any spares available if he does get a failure.

I got the last "medium" Chorus arm in existance since the rear deraiier normally comes with a short arm capable of shifting a maximum 29 tooth cog. They made a limited run of medium arms for the upper end rear derailleurs and I was lucky enough to get the last 11 speed. I imagine that they probably have some in 12 speed though.

On Saturday, May 28, 2022 at 3:32:52 PM UTC-5, cycl...@gmail.com wrote:
> The C50 does ride noticeably better than the Trek Alpha 1.5. I can't say that the Chorus is any better in actual use than the Centaur since I didn't get a chance to climb yet. Coming over the top of a climb the Chorus would allow you to ship multiple faster gears rather than the single you get with a Centaur. Again I don't think that makes any difference since Di2 only allows you to shift one gear at a time.
>
> But I will say that I like having my lifetime bike with good components on a good frame.
>
> I made a snotty remark about Russell's Di2 being the 10 speed which was probably uncalled for if his is reliable. The group was totally redesigned the following year because of reliability problems and a major change in the communications procedures. But if it works for him that is all that matters. Though there aren't any spares available if he does get a failure.

I am aware Shimano 7970 Di2 was not a commercial success. Partly because they introduced Di2 at the very tail end of 10 speed cassettes. Mine is a 2010 group. Shimano went to 11 speed Dura Ace in 2013. No breakage so far. I'm not too hard on components and do not break anything bicycle related. So not too many worries about replacement parts.

>
> I got the last "medium" Chorus arm in existance since the rear deraiier normally comes with a short arm capable of shifting a maximum 29 tooth cog. They made a limited run of medium arms for the upper end rear derailleurs and I was lucky enough to get the last 11 speed. I imagine that they probably have some in 12 speed though.

On Saturday, May 28, 2022 at 1:32:52 PM UTC-7, Tom Kunich wrote:
> The C50 does ride noticeably better than the Trek Alpha 1.5. I can't say that the Chorus is any better in actual use than the Centaur since I didn't get a chance to climb yet. Coming over the top of a climb the Chorus would allow you to ship multiple faster gears rather than the single you get with a Centaur. Again I don't think that makes any difference since Di2 only allows you to shift one gear at a time.
>
> But I will say that I like having my lifetime bike with good components on a good frame.
>
> I made a snotty remark about Russell's Di2 being the 10 speed which was probably uncalled for if his is reliable. The group was totally redesigned the following year because of reliability problems and a major change in the communications procedures. But if it works for him that is all that matters. Though there aren't any spares available if he does get a failure.
>
> I got the last "medium" Chorus arm in existance since the rear deraiier normally comes with a short arm capable of shifting a maximum 29 tooth cog. They made a limited run of medium arms for the upper end rear derailleurs and I was lucky enough to get the last 11 speed. I imagine that they probably have some in 12 speed though.

I was thouroughly impressed with the C50 on yeasterday's ride. While the distance and climbing were nothing to write home about, it was an real relief to return to climbing. Tuesday if there is even passing descent weather I will take a better climbing ride since there are several rides with up to twice the climbing and I can tell my legs really need it.

The latest update to the Garmin appears to have repaired the problems from the previous one but I will have to rearrange the windows so that the large window is speed and the next largest is mileage. I cannot understand why they would make and update that would change the window array but then most of the firmware that Garmin has written is pretty seriously questionable in my opinion.

On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 5:06:05 PM UTC+2, Tom Kunich wrote:
> On Saturday, May 28, 2022 at 1:32:52 PM UTC-7, Tom Kunich wrote:
> > The C50 does ride noticeably better than the Trek Alpha 1.5. I can't say that the Chorus is any better in actual use than the Centaur since I didn't get a chance to climb yet. Coming over the top of a climb the Chorus would allow you to ship multiple faster gears rather than the single you get with a Centaur. Again I don't think that makes any difference since Di2 only allows you to shift one gear at a time.
> >
> > But I will say that I like having my lifetime bike with good components on a good frame.
> >
> > I made a snotty remark about Russell's Di2 being the 10 speed which was probably uncalled for if his is reliable. The group was totally redesigned the following year because of reliability problems and a major change in the communications procedures. But if it works for him that is all that matters. Though there aren't any spares available if he does get a failure.
> >
> > I got the last "medium" Chorus arm in existance since the rear deraiier normally comes with a short arm capable of shifting a maximum 29 tooth cog.. They made a limited run of medium arms for the upper end rear derailleurs and I was lucky enough to get the last 11 speed. I imagine that they probably have some in 12 speed though.
> I was thouroughly impressed with the C50 on yeasterday's ride. While the distance and climbing were nothing to write home about, it was an real relief to return to climbing. Tuesday if there is even passing descent weather I will take a better climbing ride since there are several rides with up to twice the climbing and I can tell my legs really need it.
>
> The latest update to the Garmin appears to have repaired the problems from the previous one but I will have to rearrange the windows so that the large window is speed and the next largest is mileage. I cannot understand why they would make and update that would change the window array but then most of the firmware that Garmin has written is pretty seriously questionable in my opinion.

My experience is that no firmware update changed my data screens in any way.. Do you take your Garmin of your at a coffee stop and put it in your jerseys pocket? That can mess up the arrangement of your dat screen. I always locks my screen after the start of a ride.

Lou

On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 8:57:21 AM UTC-7, Lou Holtman wrote:
> On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 5:06:05 PM UTC+2, Tom Kunich wrote:
> > On Saturday, May 28, 2022 at 1:32:52 PM UTC-7, Tom Kunich wrote:
> > > The C50 does ride noticeably better than the Trek Alpha 1.5. I can't say that the Chorus is any better in actual use than the Centaur since I didn't get a chance to climb yet. Coming over the top of a climb the Chorus would allow you to ship multiple faster gears rather than the single you get with a Centaur. Again I don't think that makes any difference since Di2 only allows you to shift one gear at a time.
> > >
> > > But I will say that I like having my lifetime bike with good components on a good frame.
> > >
> > > I made a snotty remark about Russell's Di2 being the 10 speed which was probably uncalled for if his is reliable. The group was totally redesigned the following year because of reliability problems and a major change in the communications procedures. But if it works for him that is all that matters. Though there aren't any spares available if he does get a failure.
> > >
> > > I got the last "medium" Chorus arm in existance since the rear deraiier normally comes with a short arm capable of shifting a maximum 29 tooth cog. They made a limited run of medium arms for the upper end rear derailleurs and I was lucky enough to get the last 11 speed. I imagine that they probably have some in 12 speed though.
> > I was thouroughly impressed with the C50 on yeasterday's ride. While the distance and climbing were nothing to write home about, it was an real relief to return to climbing. Tuesday if there is even passing descent weather I will take a better climbing ride since there are several rides with up to twice the climbing and I can tell my legs really need it.
> >
> > The latest update to the Garmin appears to have repaired the problems from the previous one but I will have to rearrange the windows so that the large window is speed and the next largest is mileage. I cannot understand why they would make and update that would change the window array but then most of the firmware that Garmin has written is pretty seriously questionable in my opinion.
> My experience is that no firmware update changed my data screens in any way. Do you take your Garmin of your at a coffee stop and put it in your jerseys pocket? That can mess up the arrangement of your dat screen. I always locks my screen after the start of a ride.

It goes from the recharger to the bike and stays there until the end of the ride. Snce it is a rather complex procedure to change the screen how do you suppose that it could have been proper when I put it on the charger and changed when after it was updated and I took it out to the bike?

On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 6:24:45 PM UTC+2, Tom Kunich wrote:
> On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 8:57:21 AM UTC-7, Lou Holtman wrote:
> > On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 5:06:05 PM UTC+2, Tom Kunich wrote:
> > > On Saturday, May 28, 2022 at 1:32:52 PM UTC-7, Tom Kunich wrote:
> > > > The C50 does ride noticeably better than the Trek Alpha 1.5. I can't say that the Chorus is any better in actual use than the Centaur since I didn't get a chance to climb yet. Coming over the top of a climb the Chorus would allow you to ship multiple faster gears rather than the single you get with a Centaur. Again I don't think that makes any difference since Di2 only allows you to shift one gear at a time.
> > > >
> > > > But I will say that I like having my lifetime bike with good components on a good frame.
> > > >
> > > > I made a snotty remark about Russell's Di2 being the 10 speed which was probably uncalled for if his is reliable. The group was totally redesigned the following year because of reliability problems and a major change in the communications procedures. But if it works for him that is all that matters. Though there aren't any spares available if he does get a failure.
> > > >
> > > > I got the last "medium" Chorus arm in existance since the rear deraiier normally comes with a short arm capable of shifting a maximum 29 tooth cog. They made a limited run of medium arms for the upper end rear derailleurs and I was lucky enough to get the last 11 speed. I imagine that they probably have some in 12 speed though.
> > > I was thouroughly impressed with the C50 on yeasterday's ride. While the distance and climbing were nothing to write home about, it was an real relief to return to climbing. Tuesday if there is even passing descent weather I will take a better climbing ride since there are several rides with up to twice the climbing and I can tell my legs really need it.
> > >
> > > The latest update to the Garmin appears to have repaired the problems from the previous one but I will have to rearrange the windows so that the large window is speed and the next largest is mileage. I cannot understand why they would make and update that would change the window array but then most of the firmware that Garmin has written is pretty seriously questionable in my opinion.
> > My experience is that no firmware update changed my data screens in any way. Do you take your Garmin of your at a coffee stop and put it in your jerseys pocket? That can mess up the arrangement of your dat screen. I always locks my screen after the start of a ride.
> It goes from the recharger to the bike and stays there until the end of the ride. Snce it is a rather complex procedure to change the screen how do you suppose that it could have been proper when I put it on the charger and changed when after it was updated and I took it out to the bike?

It is a mystery to me. All I can say is that it never happened to me after a firmware update. Sometimes some settings were changed to factory default but never the data screens changed.

Lou

On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 11:02:25 AM UTC-7, Lou Holtman wrote:
> On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 6:24:45 PM UTC+2, Tom Kunich wrote:
> > On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 8:57:21 AM UTC-7, Lou Holtman wrote:
> > > On Monday, May 30, 2022 at 5:06:05 PM UTC+2, Tom Kunich wrote:
> > > > On Saturday, May 28, 2022 at 1:32:52 PM UTC-7, Tom Kunich wrote:
> > > > > The C50 does ride noticeably better than the Trek Alpha 1.5. I can't say that the Chorus is any better in actual use than the Centaur since I didn't get a chance to climb yet. Coming over the top of a climb the Chorus would allow you to ship multiple faster gears rather than the single you get with a Centaur. Again I don't think that makes any difference since Di2 only allows you to shift one gear at a time.
> > > > >
> > > > > But I will say that I like having my lifetime bike with good components on a good frame.
> > > > >
> > > > > I made a snotty remark about Russell's Di2 being the 10 speed which was probably uncalled for if his is reliable. The group was totally redesigned the following year because of reliability problems and a major change in the communications procedures. But if it works for him that is all that matters. Though there aren't any spares available if he does get a failure.
> > > > >
> > > > > I got the last "medium" Chorus arm in existance since the rear deraiier normally comes with a short arm capable of shifting a maximum 29 tooth cog. They made a limited run of medium arms for the upper end rear derailleurs and I was lucky enough to get the last 11 speed. I imagine that they probably have some in 12 speed though.
> > > > I was thouroughly impressed with the C50 on yeasterday's ride. While the distance and climbing were nothing to write home about, it was an real relief to return to climbing. Tuesday if there is even passing descent weather I will take a better climbing ride since there are several rides with up to twice the climbing and I can tell my legs really need it.
> > > >
> > > > The latest update to the Garmin appears to have repaired the problems from the previous one but I will have to rearrange the windows so that the large window is speed and the next largest is mileage. I cannot understand why they would make and update that would change the window array but then most of the firmware that Garmin has written is pretty seriously questionable in my opinion.
> > > My experience is that no firmware update changed my data screens in any way. Do you take your Garmin of your at a coffee stop and put it in your jerseys pocket? That can mess up the arrangement of your dat screen. I always locks my screen after the start of a ride.
> > It goes from the recharger to the bike and stays there until the end of the ride. Snce it is a rather complex procedure to change the screen how do you suppose that it could have been proper when I put it on the charger and changed when after it was updated and I took it out to the bike?
> It is a mystery to me. All I can say is that it never happened to me after a firmware update. Sometimes some settings were changed to factory default but never the data screens changed.
>
> Lou

Well, there is so much that is a mystery to me that I would really like to see both the schematics of the device and the firmware.