Well, at least NASA thinks so, and expects scientific observations to resume
shortly.

https://www.ctvnews.ca/sci-tech/hubble-space-telescope-fixed-after-month-of-no-science-1.5511824

This is the best news I've heard all year.

Well, after hearing that a local computer store had some 3070 Ti video cards in
stock... and after hearing that I was eligible for a COVID-19 vaccine.

John Savard

Not really "fixed," per se. But successfully changed over to backup
hardware.

--
Terry Austin

Proof that Alan Baker is a liar and a fool, and even stupider than
Lynn:
https://www.cbp.gov/newsroom/stats/sw-border-migration

"Terry Austin: like the polio vaccine, only with more asshole."
-- David Bilek

Jesus forgives sinners, not criminals.

On Saturday, July 17, 2021 at 12:55:45 AM UTC-4, Ninapenda Jibini wrote:
> Not really "fixed," per se. But successfully changed over to backup
> hardware.

In other words they fixed the problem and the Hubble works again, for now.

W <wsnell01@hotmail.com> wrote in
news:100a9afd-e6a2-4ff6-a140-05779e07451dn@googlegroups.com:

> On Saturday, July 17, 2021 at 12:55:45 AM UTC-4, Ninapenda
> Jibini wrote:
>> Not really "fixed," per se. But successfully changed over to
>> backup hardware.
>
> In other words they fixed the problem and the Hubble works
> again, for now.
>
Only in your diseased imagination. Nothing was fixed. Very
specifically, nothing was fixed. They _gave up_ on a fix, and
switched to backup hardware. If we get another 25 years out of the
backup hardware, nobody will complain.

but you'll still be full of shit.

--
Terry Austin

Proof that Alan Baker is a liar and a fool, and even stupider than
Lynn:
https://www.cbp.gov/newsroom/stats/sw-border-migration

"Terry Austin: like the polio vaccine, only with more asshole."
-- David Bilek

Jesus forgives sinners, not criminals.

On Sunday, July 18, 2021 at 7:38:24 PM UTC-4, Ninapenda Jibini wrote:
> W <wsne...@hotmail.com> wrote in
> news:100a9afd-e6a2-4ff6...@googlegroups.com:
> > On Saturday, July 17, 2021 at 12:55:45 AM UTC-4, Ninapenda
> > Jibini wrote:
> >> Not really "fixed," per se. But successfully changed over to
> >> backup hardware.
> >
> > In other words they fixed the problem and the Hubble works
> > again, for now.
> >
> Only in your diseased imagination. Nothing was fixed. Very
> specifically, nothing was fixed. They _gave up_ on a fix, and
> switched to backup hardware. If we get another 25 years out of the
> backup hardware, nobody will complain.
>
> but you'll still be full of shit.

The Hubble wasn't working. Now it is. Its problem has been fixed. The Hubble has been fixed.

On Sunday, July 18, 2021 at 5:38:24 PM UTC-6, Ninapenda Jibini wrote:

> Only in your diseased imagination. Nothing was fixed. Very
> specifically, nothing was fixed. They _gave up_ on a fix, and
> switched to backup hardware. If we get another 25 years out of the
> backup hardware, nobody will complain.

The article in the Register referred to the Hubble as being fixed,
and so I didn't think to quibble about fine distinctions.

It is true that no _part_ of the Hubble has been repaired. However,
the Hubble as a whole, which did not function, now does function.
Switching over to a backup computer, therefore, was a way to
make a formerly non-working Hubble work.

It took some effort to make that switch properly, so that it wouldn't
lead to the Hubble still not functioning, with no ability to do anything
further to correct it.

I would say, therefore, that they did repair the Hubble, even if they
didn't repair any of the computers inside of it. Switching to a backup
computer is just a different way to fix the whole system.

John Savard

W <wsnell01@hotmail.com> wrote in
news:89261997-5daa-4554-86cc-4f5db6d55bf9n@googlegroups.com:

> On Sunday, July 18, 2021 at 7:38:24 PM UTC-4, Ninapenda Jibini
> wrote:
>> W <wsne...@hotmail.com> wrote in
>> news:100a9afd-e6a2-4ff6...@googlegroups.com:
>> > On Saturday, July 17, 2021 at 12:55:45 AM UTC-4, Ninapenda
>> > Jibini wrote:
>> >> Not really "fixed," per se. But successfully changed over to
>> >> backup hardware.
>> >
>> > In other words they fixed the problem and the Hubble works
>> > again, for now.
>> >
>> Only in your diseased imagination. Nothing was fixed. Very
>> specifically, nothing was fixed. They _gave up_ on a fix, and
>> switched to backup hardware. If we get another 25 years out of
>> the backup hardware, nobody will complain.
>>
>> but you'll still be full of shit.
>
> The Hubble wasn't working. Now it is. Its problem has been
> fixed. The Hubble has been fixed.
>
Repeating it over and over may make you feel more grown up, Yank, but
it (and you) will never not be full of shit.

--
Terry Austin

Proof that Alan Baker is a liar and a fool, and even stupider than
Lynn:
https://www.cbp.gov/newsroom/stats/sw-border-migration
(May 2019 total for people arrested for entering the United States
illegally is over 132,000 for just the southwest border.)

Vacation photos from Iceland:
https://plus.google.com/u/0/collection/QaXQkB

Quadibloc <jsavard@ecn.ab.ca> wrote in
news:b99001e5-846d-49ff-ad19-e67dd60c525fn@googlegroups.com:

> On Sunday, July 18, 2021 at 5:38:24 PM UTC-6, Ninapenda Jibini
> wrote:
>
>> Only in your diseased imagination. Nothing was fixed. Very
>> specifically, nothing was fixed. They _gave up_ on a fix, and
>> switched to backup hardware. If we get another 25 years out of
>> the backup hardware, nobody will complain.
>
> The article in the Register

Well, there's your problem.

> referred to the Hubble as being
> fixed, and so I didn't think

You never do.

> to quibble about fine distinctions.

Given that it's one of the most idiotic of the British tabloids,
it's suprising they even spelled "Hubble" right. *Did* they spell
it right?
>
> It is true that no _part_ of the Hubble has been repaired.
> However, the Hubble as a whole, which did not function, now does
> function. Switching over to a backup computer, therefore, was a
> way to make a formerly non-working Hubble work.

But not by *fixing* anything. When they fixed the mirror, they
*fixed* it. When they traded out various modules in shuttle
missions, they *fixed* it.

Or, look at it this way: Before, it had a control system and a
backup control system. Now, it only has a backup control system
doing the job of the main system.

It is *not* working as it did before.
>
> It took some effort to make that switch properly, so that it
> wouldn't lead to the Hubble still not functioning, with no
> ability to do anything further to correct it.

Which still didn't *fix* anything.
>
> I would say, therefore, that they did repair the Hubble, even if
> they didn't repair any of the computers inside of it. Switching
> to a backup computer is just a different way to fix the whole
> system.
>
I suspect the engineers at NASA who run the program would be more
inclined to agree with me than you, since they know they now have
no backup system.

--
Terry Austin

Proof that Alan Baker is a liar and a fool, and even stupider than
Lynn:
https://www.cbp.gov/newsroom/stats/sw-border-migration
(May 2019 total for people arrested for entering the United States
illegally is over 132,000 for just the southwest border.)

Vacation photos from Iceland:
https://plus.google.com/u/0/collection/QaXQkB

On Monday, July 19, 2021 at 11:52:27 AM UTC-6, Jibini Kula Tumbili Kujisalimisha wrote:

> But not by *fixing* anything. When they fixed the mirror, they
> *fixed* it. When they traded out various modules in shuttle
> missions, they *fixed* it.

They fixed the telescope by introducing additional components.

They didn't modify the primary mirror itself. Instead, they added
another mirror system, which corrected for the aberrations caused
by the mirror being wrongly parabolized.

John Savard

Quadibloc <jsavard@ecn.ab.ca> wrote in
news:8b0ad655-6ca7-4ea4-9c95-1249eb8bf3acn@googlegroups.com:

> On Monday, July 19, 2021 at 11:52:27 AM UTC-6, Jibini Kula
> Tumbili Kujisalimisha wrote:
>
>> But not by *fixing* anything. When they fixed the mirror, they
>> *fixed* it. When they traded out various modules in shuttle
>> missions, they *fixed* it.
>
> They fixed the telescope by introducing additional components.
>
> They didn't modify the primary mirror itself. Instead, they
> added another mirror system, which corrected for the aberrations
> caused by the mirror being wrongly parabolized.
>
And that was a fix.

Switching to a backup system is not a fix. It is, in fact, specific
acknowledgement that no fix for the main system is possible.

--
Terry Austin

Proof that Alan Baker is a liar and a fool, and even stupider than
Lynn:
https://www.cbp.gov/newsroom/stats/sw-border-migration
(May 2019 total for people arrested for entering the United States
illegally is over 132,000 for just the southwest border.)

Vacation photos from Iceland:
https://plus.google.com/u/0/collection/QaXQkB

On 19/07/2021 18:52, Jibini Kula Tumbili Kujisalimisha wrote:
> Quadibloc <jsavard@ecn.ab.ca> wrote in
> news:b99001e5-846d-49ff-ad19-e67dd60c525fn@googlegroups.com:
>
>> On Sunday, July 18, 2021 at 5:38:24 PM UTC-6, Ninapenda Jibini
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Only in your diseased imagination. Nothing was fixed. Very
>>> specifically, nothing was fixed. They _gave up_ on a fix, and
>>> switched to backup hardware. If we get another 25 years out of
>>> the backup hardware, nobody will complain.
>>
>> The article in the Register
>
> Well, there's your problem.
>
>> referred to the Hubble as being
>> fixed, and so I didn't think
>
> You never do.
>
>> to quibble about fine distinctions.
>
> Given that it's one of the most idiotic of the British tabloids,
> it's suprising they even spelled "Hubble" right. *Did* they spell
> it right?
>>
>> It is true that no _part_ of the Hubble has been repaired.
>> However, the Hubble as a whole, which did not function, now does
>> function. Switching over to a backup computer, therefore, was a
>> way to make a formerly non-working Hubble work.
>
> But not by *fixing* anything. When they fixed the mirror, they
> *fixed* it. When they traded out various modules in shuttle
> missions, they *fixed* it.
>
> Or, look at it this way: Before, it had a control system and a
> backup control system. Now, it only has a backup control system
> doing the job of the main system.
>
> It is *not* working as it did before.

It is working as it did before it is just that now there is no
redundancy left at all if the backup computer should fail.

It is quite an impressive feat to get it all back to an operational
state when the supervisory computer has gone AWOL.
>>
>> It took some effort to make that switch properly, so that it
>> wouldn't lead to the Hubble still not functioning, with no
>> ability to do anything further to correct it.
>
> Which still didn't *fix* anything.

It made the instrument functional again. The fault remains in the failed
unit but the backup has now taken over all its duties.
>>
>> I would say, therefore, that they did repair the Hubble, even if
>> they didn't repair any of the computers inside of it. Switching
>> to a backup computer is just a different way to fix the whole
>> system.
>>
> I suspect the engineers at NASA who run the program would be more
> inclined to agree with me than you, since they know they now have
> no backup system.

The original lasted long enough that they are probably happy to have got
it back to an operational state by any means possible. It is splitting
hairs to say that the HST is not fixed. The scope is now back in
operation which is a remarkable feat given how many other gyros and
reaction wheels are on their last legs. It had a close call in 2018:

https://www.businessinsider.com/nasa-hubble-space-telescope-gyroscope-broken-backup-problem-2018-10?r=US&IR=T

Parts fail and they bodge around the failures if they can. It is pretty
much all down to their ingenuity that it is still working at all.

--
Regards,
Martin Brown

Martin Brown <'''newspam'''@nonad.co.uk> wrote in
news:sd7cr3$1utb$1@gioia.aioe.org:

> On 19/07/2021 18:52, Jibini Kula Tumbili Kujisalimisha wrote:
>> Quadibloc <jsavard@ecn.ab.ca> wrote in
>> news:b99001e5-846d-49ff-ad19-e67dd60c525fn@googlegroups.com:
>>
>>> On Sunday, July 18, 2021 at 5:38:24 PM UTC-6, Ninapenda Jibini
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Only in your diseased imagination. Nothing was fixed. Very
>>>> specifically, nothing was fixed. They _gave up_ on a fix, and
>>>> switched to backup hardware. If we get another 25 years out
>>>> of the backup hardware, nobody will complain.
>>>
>>> The article in the Register
>>
>> Well, there's your problem.
>>
>>> referred to the Hubble as being
>>> fixed, and so I didn't think
>>
>> You never do.
>>
>>> to quibble about fine distinctions.
>>
>> Given that it's one of the most idiotic of the British
>> tabloids, it's suprising they even spelled "Hubble" right.
>> *Did* they spell it right?
>>>
>>> It is true that no _part_ of the Hubble has been repaired.
>>> However, the Hubble as a whole, which did not function, now
>>> does function. Switching over to a backup computer, therefore,
>>> was a way to make a formerly non-working Hubble work.
>>
>> But not by *fixing* anything. When they fixed the mirror, they
>> *fixed* it. When they traded out various modules in shuttle
>> missions, they *fixed* it.
>>
>> Or, look at it this way: Before, it had a control system and a
>> backup control system. Now, it only has a backup control system
>> doing the job of the main system.
>>
>> It is *not* working as it did before.
>
> It is working as it did before

Not really, no. Before, it had a main system and a backup system.
Now is only has the backup system working as the main system.

They made it work, but they didn't *fix* anything.

--
Terry Austin

Proof that Alan Baker is a liar and a fool, and even stupider than
Lynn:
https://www.cbp.gov/newsroom/stats/sw-border-migration
(May 2019 total for people arrested for entering the United States
illegally is over 132,000 for just the southwest border.)

Vacation photos from Iceland:
https://plus.google.com/u/0/collection/QaXQkB

On Tuesday, July 20, 2021 at 1:56:52 PM UTC-7, Jibini Kula Tumbili Kujisalimisha wrote:

> Not really, no. Before, it had a main system and a backup system.
> Now is only has the backup system working as the main system.
>
> They made it work, but they didn't *fix* anything.

Was it somehow broken and not working? I think it was.

Is it working now? I think it is.

What word or words would best describe what has happened between 'not working' and 'working'? Mend? Repaired? Restored? Remedied? Rectified? How about Fixed? All of these words are synonyms of each other.

Perhaps you have a different word in mind?

On Friday, July 16, 2021 at 8:47:48 PM UTC-7, Quadibloc wrote:
> Well, at least NASA thinks so, and expects scientific observations to resume
> shortly.
>
> https://www.ctvnews.ca/sci-tech/hubble-space-telescope-fixed-after-month-of-no-science-1.5511824
>
> This is the best news I've heard all year.
>
> Well, after hearing that a local computer store had some 3070 Ti video cards in
> stock... and after hearing that I was eligible for a COVID-19 vaccine.
>
> John Savard

I'm so happy, my car got fixed too!
👍😂

On Tuesday, July 20, 2021 at 10:16:39 PM UTC-6, StarDust wrote:

> I'm so happy, my car got fixed too!

On the other hand, if your cat got fixed, _that_ would be the wrong
word for what happened to Hubble...

John Savard

On Tuesday, July 20, 2021 at 8:45:55 PM UTC-6, palsing wrote:
> On Tuesday, July 20, 2021 at 1:56:52 PM UTC-7, Jibini Kula Tumbili Kujisalimisha wrote:

> > Not really, no. Before, it had a main system and a backup system.
> > Now is only has the backup system working as the main system.

> > They made it work, but they didn't *fix* anything.

> Was it somehow broken and not working? I think it was.

> Is it working now? I think it is.

> What word or words would best describe what has happened
> between 'not working' and 'working'? Mend? Repaired? Restored?
> Remedied? Rectified? How about Fixed? All of these words are
> synonyms of each other.

> Perhaps you have a different word in mind?

In another post in this thread, someone wrote "my car got fixed";
this got me thinking: if one says "my cat got fixed", that sense of
fixed doesn't describe what happened to Hubble - it wasn't
neutered.

But in any case, it's clear what semantic distinction is the basis of
the objection. No individual parts of Hubble that were malfunctioning
were restored to health or improved in their function. Instead, Hubble
as a whole was made to work by switching over to using a different
computer which was already present within it in a working state.

So no... additive remediation work... was performed. Nothing diseased
was restored to health. Only a switch to a backup system.

However, while no _part_ of Hubble got fixed, Hubble as a whole certainly
got fixed; its situation was improved from not working to working, even
though it's now without a backup system. Furthermore, the task of switching
to that backup system was *not* trivial; a single mis-step could have put
the HST beyond all hope of recovery.

Back in the days when computers were made from discrete transistors,
you could fix a computer by swapping out a bad circuit board for a good
one. Would it be less of a repair if the good circuit board was a spare
hanging in a pocket inside the computer's enclosure?

In any case, Terry Austin is a troll, and has a long career on
rec.arts.sf.written which might be worthwhile to examine.

John Savard

On 21/07/2021 03:45, palsing wrote:
> On Tuesday, July 20, 2021 at 1:56:52 PM UTC-7, Jibini Kula Tumbili Kujisalimisha wrote:
>
>> Not really, no. Before, it had a main system and a backup system.
>> Now is only has the backup system working as the main system.
>>
>> They made it work, but they didn't *fix* anything.
>
> Was it somehow broken and not working? I think it was.
>
> Is it working now? I think it is.
>
> What word or words would best describe what has happened between 'not working' and 'working'? Mend? Repaired? Restored? Remedied? Rectified? How about Fixed? All of these words are synonyms of each other.
>
> Perhaps you have a different word in mind?
>

If your computer is broke and you fire up the old unused laptop in the
cupboard to control a Meade telescope you cant say the computer is fixed.

The science instruments the computer is connected to that still work are
still working, they haven't been 'fixed' either.

palsing <pnalsing@gmail.com> wrote in
news:e6c59842-3ea3-4a79-9db7-e8d05f982269n@googlegroups.com:

> I think

I see no evidence of that.

--
Terry Austin

Proof that Alan Baker is a liar and a fool, and even stupider than
Lynn:
https://www.cbp.gov/newsroom/stats/sw-border-migration
(May 2019 total for people arrested for entering the United States
illegally is over 132,000 for just the southwest border.)

Vacation photos from Iceland:
https://plus.google.com/u/0/collection/QaXQkB

Quadibloc <jsavard@ecn.ab.ca> wrote in
news:7c9246df-141b-4912-ad08-e28c744ab8bdn@googlegroups.com:

> In any case, Terry Austin is a troll, and has a long career on
> rec.arts.sf.written which might be worthwhile to examine.
>
Physician, heal thyself.

--
Terry Austin

Proof that Alan Baker is a liar and a fool, and even stupider than
Lynn:
https://www.cbp.gov/newsroom/stats/sw-border-migration
(May 2019 total for people arrested for entering the United States
illegally is over 132,000 for just the southwest border.)

Vacation photos from Iceland:
https://plus.google.com/u/0/collection/QaXQkB

On Wednesday, July 21, 2021 at 10:15:05 AM UTC-7, Jibini Kula Tumbili Kujisalimisha wrote:
> palsing <pnal...@gmail.com> wrote in
> news:e6c59842-3ea3-4a79...@googlegroups.com:
>
> > I think
>
> I see no evidence of that.

How trollish of you...

palsing <pnalsing@gmail.com> wrote in
news:3e65d7ca-2541-41dc-93dc-b0fa0fcaa794n@googlegroups.com:

> On Wednesday, July 21, 2021 at 10:15:05 AM UTC-7, Jibini Kula
> Tumbili Kujisalimisha wrote:
>> palsing <pnal...@gmail.com> wrote in
>> news:e6c59842-3ea3-4a79...@googlegroups.com:
>>
>> > I think
>>
>> I see no evidence of that.
>
> How trollish of you...
>
And knowing that . . . you replied.

--
Terry Austin

Proof that Alan Baker is a liar and a fool, and even stupider than
Lynn:
https://www.cbp.gov/newsroom/stats/sw-border-migration
(May 2019 total for people arrested for entering the United States
illegally is over 132,000 for just the southwest border.)

Vacation photos from Iceland:
https://plus.google.com/u/0/collection/QaXQkB

On Wednesday, July 21, 2021 at 4:40:25 PM UTC-7, Jibini Kula Tumbili Kujisalimisha wrote:
> palsing <pnal...@gmail.com> wrote in
> news:3e65d7ca-2541-41dc...@googlegroups.com:
> > On Wednesday, July 21, 2021 at 10:15:05 AM UTC-7, Jibini Kula
> > Tumbili Kujisalimisha wrote:
> >> palsing <pnal...@gmail.com> wrote in
> >> news:e6c59842-3ea3-4a79...@googlegroups.com:
> >>
> >> > I think
> >>
> >> I see no evidence of that.
> >
> > How trollish of you...
> >
> And knowing that . . . you replied.

Well, that is exactly what trolls crave, right? Do you have a stiffy now?

palsing <pnalsing@gmail.com> wrote in
news:efba337e-517d-4846-800e-98016b5458c7n@googlegroups.com:

> On Wednesday, July 21, 2021 at 4:40:25 PM UTC-7, Jibini Kula
> Tumbili Kujisalimisha wrote:
>> palsing <pnal...@gmail.com> wrote in
>> news:3e65d7ca-2541-41dc...@googlegroups.com:
>> > On Wednesday, July 21, 2021 at 10:15:05 AM UTC-7, Jibini Kula
>> > Tumbili Kujisalimisha wrote:
>> >> palsing <pnal...@gmail.com> wrote in
>> >> news:e6c59842-3ea3-4a79...@googlegroups.com:
>> >>
>> >> > I think
>> >>
>> >> I see no evidence of that.
>> >
>> > How trollish of you...
>> >
>> And knowing that . . . you replied.
>
> Well, that is exactly what trolls crave,

And, knowing that . . . you replied. Says something about you. Not
someting complimentary.

right? Do you have a
> stiffy now?
>
Do you?

--
Terry Austin

Proof that Alan Baker is a liar and a fool, and even stupider than
Lynn:
https://www.cbp.gov/newsroom/stats/sw-border-migration
(May 2019 total for people arrested for entering the United States
illegally is over 132,000 for just the southwest border.)

Vacation photos from Iceland:
https://plus.google.com/u/0/collection/QaXQkB

On Wednesday, July 21, 2021 at 1:57:17 AM UTC-6, Pent wrote:

> If your computer is broke and you fire up the old unused laptop in the
> cupboard to control a Meade telescope you cant say the computer is fixed.

> The science instruments the computer is connected to that still work are
> still working, they haven't been 'fixed' either.

That's true. The computer wasn't fixed. And the telescope wasn't fixed
either, because the computer isn't a part of the telescope. So I don't think
this situation is analogous to that of the Hubble.

John Savard