On Sun, 25 Sep 2022 22:20:55 -0000 (UTC), Roger Merriman
<roger@sarlet.com> wrote:

>Possibly the segments proximity to the dual carriageway is throwing the GPS
>tracking as the entire top 10 etc the speed for what is flat road is rather
>improbable!

Yep. Something is wrong. My guess(tm) is that there's a wheel
diameter calibration error with the Garmin Speed Sensor 2 calibration,
or rather lack of calibration. The Speed Sensor 2 is suppose to self
adjust the wheel diameter against the GPS speed so that both the GPS
speed and the Speed Sensor 2 indicated speed are identical. Set
"wheel size" to "Auto" and see if the speeds return to sanity:

"Calibrating Your Speed Sensor"
<https://www8.garmin.com/manuals-apac/webhelp/venusq/EN-SG/GUID-46334ADA-BE27-4B62-8576-5471E79ACD94-8669.html>

--
Jeff Liebermann jeffl@cruzio.com
PO Box 272 http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Ben Lomond CA 95005-0272
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

On Sun, 25 Sep 2022 17:24:41 -0700, Jeff Liebermann <jeffl@cruzio.com>
wrote:

>On Sun, 25 Sep 2022 22:20:55 -0000 (UTC), Roger Merriman
><roger@sarlet.com> wrote:
>
>>Possibly the segments proximity to the dual carriageway is throwing the GPS
>>tracking as the entire top 10 etc the speed for what is flat road is rather
>>improbable!

>Yep. Something is wrong. My guess(tm) is that there's a wheel
>diameter calibration error with the Garmin Speed Sensor 2 calibration,
>or rather lack of calibration. The Speed Sensor 2 is suppose to self
>adjust the wheel diameter against the GPS speed so that both the GPS
>speed and the Speed Sensor 2 indicated speed are identical. Set
>"wheel size" to "Auto" and see if the speeds return to sanity:
>
>"Calibrating Your Speed Sensor"
><https://www8.garmin.com/manuals-apac/webhelp/venusq/EN-SG/GUID-46334ADA-BE27-4B62-8576-5471E79ACD94-8669.html>

Tom-> If you are moving your Garmin Edge 830 between different
bicycles or changing wheels, the "wheel size" must be set to "auto" or
you will certainly get wrong speed and distance indications.

Also, it would be nice to know which bicycle you were riding when you
recorded your ride. Enter your bicycles under "My Gear":
<https://www.strava.com/settings/gear>

--
Jeff Liebermann jeffl@cruzio.com
PO Box 272 http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Ben Lomond CA 95005-0272
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

On Sun, 25 Sep 2022 18:03:04 -0700, Jeff Liebermann <jeffl@cruzio.com>
wrote:

Yet another problem.

From Tom's rides, I tried exporting the data from Strava to a GPX
file, and found that all of the rides are recording only the location
and elevation like this:
<trkpt lat="37.7012410" lon="-122.1434130">
<ele>17.6</ele>
</trkpt>
<trkpt lat="37.7014460" lon="-122.1429390">
<ele>17.8</ele>
</trkpt>
<trkpt lat="37.7016450" lon="-122.1424000">
<ele>18.2</ele>
</trkpt>

From one of my walks, a proper GPX export file should include
location, elevation and time, so that speed can be calculated. It
should look like this:
<trkpt lat="37.0840720" lon="-122.0618930">
<ele>161.3</ele>
<time>2022-08-05T16:44:11Z</time>
</trkpt>
<trkpt lat="37.0840690" lon="-122.0619110">
<ele>161.4</ele>
<time>2022-08-05T16:44:12Z</time>
</trkpt>
<trkpt lat="37.0840700" lon="-122.0619140">
<ele>161.4</ele>
<time>2022-08-05T16:44:13Z</time>
</trkpt>

My guess(tm) is that there is a setting in either Strava or the Garmin
Edge 830, that limits which GPS data is recorded. There might be a
connection between this oddity and the rather high speeds recorded,
but I can't determine that from here.

In GPX 1.0, the speed was recorded. In GPX 1.1, the speed is NOT
recorded, but can be calculated using distance divided by time:
<https://www.javawa.nl/analyser_en.html>
When I run the program on Tom's GPX file, there is no speed graph.
However, my walk GPX file properly displays the speed.

Hey Tom... please fix this.

--
Jeff Liebermann jeffl@cruzio.com
PO Box 272 http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Ben Lomond CA 95005-0272
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

Jeff Liebermann <jeffl@cruzio.com> wrote:
> On Sun, 25 Sep 2022 22:20:55 -0000 (UTC), Roger Merriman
> <roger@sarlet.com> wrote:
>
>> Possibly the segments proximity to the dual carriageway is throwing the GPS
>> tracking as the entire top 10 etc the speed for what is flat road is rather
>> improbable!
>
> Yep. Something is wrong. My guess(tm) is that there's a wheel
> diameter calibration error with the Garmin Speed Sensor 2 calibration,
> or rather lack of calibration. The Speed Sensor 2 is suppose to self
> adjust the wheel diameter against the GPS speed so that both the GPS
> speed and the Speed Sensor 2 indicated speed are identical. Set
> "wheel size" to "Auto" and see if the speeds return to sanity:
>
> "Calibrating Your Speed Sensor"
> <https://www8.garmin.com/manuals-apac/webhelp/venusq/EN-SG/GUID-46334ADA-BE27-4B62-8576-5471E79ACD94-8669.html>
>
>
To be fair others are close as well ie with improbable times so possibly
some funky world data in Garmin database or Strava.

Maybe disconnect the speed sensor for a while and see if that makes any
difference Tom?

I have same Garmin and ride off road in woods etc so are more challenging,
and to the best of my knowledge haven’t had spurious data.

Roger Merriman

On Sunday, September 25, 2022 at 2:31:23 PM UTC-7, Lou Holtman wrote:
> On Sunday, September 25, 2022 at 7:20:52 PM UTC+2, Tom Kunich wrote:
> > On Sunday, September 25, 2022 at 8:55:42 AM UTC-7, Lou Holtman wrote:
> > > On Sunday, September 25, 2022 at 5:35:33 PM UTC+2, Tom Kunich wrote:
> > > > On Sunday, September 25, 2022 at 4:57:29 AM UTC-7, Lou Holtman wrote:
> > > > > On Saturday, September 24, 2022 at 10:56:40 PM UTC+2, frkr...@gmail.com wrote:
> > > > > > On Saturday, September 24, 2022 at 1:44:54 PM UTC-7, Roger Merriman wrote:
> > > > > > > Tom Kunich <cycl...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > > > > > > On Saturday, September 24, 2022 at 7:46:22 AM UTC-7, Roger Merriman wrote:
> > > > > > > >> Tom Kunich <cycl...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > > > > > >>>
> > > > > > > >>>
> > > > > > > >>> After getting them home I pulled the Sciroccos out and mounted the tires
> > > > > > > >>> and I had forgotten just how easy it is to mount wire bead tires. Both
> > > > > > > >>> tires were mounted and inflated in 10 minutes.
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > That extra weight represents 3 ounces. While racers think that every
> > > > > > > > little bit helps real people prefer the easy on and easy off mounting of the metal bead.
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Can’t say I’ve noticed wire being any easier, neither is particularly
> > > > > > > difficult personally.
> > > > > > I'm going to take a rare opportunity to agree with Tom on something. IME wire bead tires
> > > > > > do tend to be easier to mount than kevlar bead folding tires. And the weight difference
> > > > > > is, to me, negligible.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Of course, there are tolerances on tire and rim circumference. I suppose with a rim at the
> > > > > > lower edge of the tolerance range and a folding tire at the higher end, installation might be
> > > > > > perfectly easy.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > - Frank Krygowski
> > > > > Folding tires are more difficult to mount only the first time and that is because they were folded for a long time, not because of the kevlar bead. After initial mounting they mount as easy or as difficult as wire bead tires.
> > > > >
> > > > > Lou
> > > > Typically I have never mounted Gatorskins more than once in their entire wear life.
> > > Never had a flat or had a wheel issue that needed a removal of the tire? Remarkable.
> > >
> > > Lou
> > Lou, taking your advice I went back to my Strava account and entered the Garmin data. How do I give you access to it?
> I can find you. If you didn’t make your account private I can see you ride. If not I have to ask your permission to follow you. I checked and saw you did a flat 53 km ride yesterday along the airport. Big brother is watching you now.

Watching me do what? Do a 40 km ride over 2200 feet of climbing? That doesn't show the sitting around time at the coffee shop does it:? In my Garmin file it only shows average speed and then secondarily "moving speed". And those climbing statistics are complete bullshit. Imagine someone doing over half a mile with 1/10th of a mile at as much as 40% in less than 2 minutes. Why don't you tell that to Evenepoel? I'm sure he could find a spot on the team for someone like that. That's about a kilometer at 48 kph. That's fast on an 8% climb. So if you want to believe Strava go right ahead. What sort of Big Brother is that?

On Monday, September 26, 2022 at 4:03:28 AM UTC-7, Roger Merriman wrote:
> Jeff Liebermann <je...@cruzio.com> wrote:
> > On Sun, 25 Sep 2022 22:20:55 -0000 (UTC), Roger Merriman
> > <ro...@sarlet.com> wrote:
> >
> >> Possibly the segments proximity to the dual carriageway is throwing the GPS
> >> tracking as the entire top 10 etc the speed for what is flat road is rather
> >> improbable!
> >
> > Yep. Something is wrong. My guess(tm) is that there's a wheel
> > diameter calibration error with the Garmin Speed Sensor 2 calibration,
> > or rather lack of calibration. The Speed Sensor 2 is suppose to self
> > adjust the wheel diameter against the GPS speed so that both the GPS
> > speed and the Speed Sensor 2 indicated speed are identical. Set
> > "wheel size" to "Auto" and see if the speeds return to sanity:
> >
> > "Calibrating Your Speed Sensor"
> > <https://www8.garmin.com/manuals-apac/webhelp/venusq/EN-SG/GUID-46334ADA-BE27-4B62-8576-5471E79ACD94-8669.html>
> >
> >
> To be fair others are close as well ie with improbable times so possibly
> some funky world data in Garmin database or Strava.
>
> Maybe disconnect the speed sensor for a while and see if that makes any
> difference Tom?
>
> I have same Garmin and ride off road in woods etc so are more challenging,
> and to the best of my knowledge haven’t had spurious data.
>
> Roger Merriman
If you disconnect the speed and distance sensor of course you get lower mileage because speed over distance and speed over the ground is different. There is no actual flat ground.

Tom Kunich <cyclintom@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Monday, September 26, 2022 at 4:03:28 AM UTC-7, Roger Merriman wrote:
>> Jeff Liebermann <je...@cruzio.com> wrote:
>>> On Sun, 25 Sep 2022 22:20:55 -0000 (UTC), Roger Merriman
>>> <ro...@sarlet.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Possibly the segments proximity to the dual carriageway is throwing the GPS
>>>> tracking as the entire top 10 etc the speed for what is flat road is rather
>>>> improbable!
>>>
>>> Yep. Something is wrong. My guess(tm) is that there's a wheel
>>> diameter calibration error with the Garmin Speed Sensor 2 calibration,
>>> or rather lack of calibration. The Speed Sensor 2 is suppose to self
>>> adjust the wheel diameter against the GPS speed so that both the GPS
>>> speed and the Speed Sensor 2 indicated speed are identical. Set
>>> "wheel size" to "Auto" and see if the speeds return to sanity:
>>>
>>> "Calibrating Your Speed Sensor"
>>> <https://www8.garmin.com/manuals-apac/webhelp/venusq/EN-SG/GUID-46334ADA-BE27-4B62-8576-5471E79ACD94-8669.html>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>> To be fair others are close as well ie with improbable times so possibly
>> some funky world data in Garmin database or Strava.
>>
>> Maybe disconnect the speed sensor for a while and see if that makes any
>> difference Tom?
>>
>> I have same Garmin and ride off road in woods etc so are more challenging,
>> and to the best of my knowledge haven’t had spurious data.
>>
>> Roger Merriman
> If you disconnect the speed and distance sensor of course you get lower
> mileage because speed over distance and speed over the ground is
> different. There is no actual flat ground.
>
I’m fairly sure that’s incorrect, the Garmin and indeed Strava or other
places use elevation maps ie they don’t just map the world as smooth globe!

Roger Merriman.

On Monday, September 26, 2022 at 8:01:18 AM UTC-7, Roger Merriman wrote:
> Tom Kunich <cycl...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > On Monday, September 26, 2022 at 4:03:28 AM UTC-7, Roger Merriman wrote:
> >> Jeff Liebermann <je...@cruzio.com> wrote:
> >>> On Sun, 25 Sep 2022 22:20:55 -0000 (UTC), Roger Merriman
> >>> <ro...@sarlet.com> wrote:
> >>>
> >>>> Possibly the segments proximity to the dual carriageway is throwing the GPS
> >>>> tracking as the entire top 10 etc the speed for what is flat road is rather
> >>>> improbable!
> >>>
> >>> Yep. Something is wrong. My guess(tm) is that there's a wheel
> >>> diameter calibration error with the Garmin Speed Sensor 2 calibration,
> >>> or rather lack of calibration. The Speed Sensor 2 is suppose to self
> >>> adjust the wheel diameter against the GPS speed so that both the GPS
> >>> speed and the Speed Sensor 2 indicated speed are identical. Set
> >>> "wheel size" to "Auto" and see if the speeds return to sanity:
> >>>
> >>> "Calibrating Your Speed Sensor"
> >>> <https://www8.garmin.com/manuals-apac/webhelp/venusq/EN-SG/GUID-46334ADA-BE27-4B62-8576-5471E79ACD94-8669.html>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >> To be fair others are close as well ie with improbable times so possibly
> >> some funky world data in Garmin database or Strava.
> >>
> >> Maybe disconnect the speed sensor for a while and see if that makes any
> >> difference Tom?
> >>
> >> I have same Garmin and ride off road in woods etc so are more challenging,
> >> and to the best of my knowledge haven’t had spurious data.
> >>
> >> Roger Merriman
> > If you disconnect the speed and distance sensor of course you get lower
> > mileage because speed over distance and speed over the ground is
> > different. There is no actual flat ground.
> >
> I’m fairly sure that’s incorrect, the Garmin and indeed Strava or other
> places use elevation maps ie they don’t just map the world as smooth globe!
>
> Roger Merriman.
I think that you misunderstand me Roger - the ground is up and down continuously. Elevation maps only show major changes in elevay9ion probably of 10 feet or more. The six inches up and down over 40 km adds up to a substantial difference in distance. I think that without the sensor my trip to Moraga measures about 23 miles. With the sensor it is 24.9

On Monday, September 26, 2022 at 4:49:01 PM UTC+2, Tom Kunich wrote:
> On Sunday, September 25, 2022 at 2:31:23 PM UTC-7, Lou Holtman wrote:
> > On Sunday, September 25, 2022 at 7:20:52 PM UTC+2, Tom Kunich wrote:
> > > On Sunday, September 25, 2022 at 8:55:42 AM UTC-7, Lou Holtman wrote:
> > > > On Sunday, September 25, 2022 at 5:35:33 PM UTC+2, Tom Kunich wrote:
> > > > > On Sunday, September 25, 2022 at 4:57:29 AM UTC-7, Lou Holtman wrote:
> > > > > > On Saturday, September 24, 2022 at 10:56:40 PM UTC+2, frkr...@gmail.com wrote:
> > > > > > > On Saturday, September 24, 2022 at 1:44:54 PM UTC-7, Roger Merriman wrote:
> > > > > > > > Tom Kunich <cycl...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > > > > > > > On Saturday, September 24, 2022 at 7:46:22 AM UTC-7, Roger Merriman wrote:
> > > > > > > > >> Tom Kunich <cycl...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > > > > > > >>>
> > > > > > > > >>>
> > > > > > > > >>> After getting them home I pulled the Sciroccos out and mounted the tires
> > > > > > > > >>> and I had forgotten just how easy it is to mount wire bead tires. Both
> > > > > > > > >>> tires were mounted and inflated in 10 minutes.
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > That extra weight represents 3 ounces. While racers think that every
> > > > > > > > > little bit helps real people prefer the easy on and easy off mounting of the metal bead.
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > Can’t say I’ve noticed wire being any easier, neither is particularly
> > > > > > > > difficult personally.
> > > > > > > I'm going to take a rare opportunity to agree with Tom on something. IME wire bead tires
> > > > > > > do tend to be easier to mount than kevlar bead folding tires. And the weight difference
> > > > > > > is, to me, negligible.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Of course, there are tolerances on tire and rim circumference.. I suppose with a rim at the
> > > > > > > lower edge of the tolerance range and a folding tire at the higher end, installation might be
> > > > > > > perfectly easy.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > - Frank Krygowski
> > > > > > Folding tires are more difficult to mount only the first time and that is because they were folded for a long time, not because of the kevlar bead. After initial mounting they mount as easy or as difficult as wire bead tires.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Lou
> > > > > Typically I have never mounted Gatorskins more than once in their entire wear life.
> > > > Never had a flat or had a wheel issue that needed a removal of the tire? Remarkable.
> > > >
> > > > Lou
> > > Lou, taking your advice I went back to my Strava account and entered the Garmin data. How do I give you access to it?
> > I can find you. If you didn’t make your account private I can see you ride. If not I have to ask your permission to follow you. I checked and saw you did a flat 53 km ride yesterday along the airport. Big brother is watching you now.
> Watching me do what? Do a 40 km ride over 2200 feet of climbing? That doesn't show the sitting around time at the coffee shop does it:? In my Garmin file it only shows average speed and then secondarily "moving speed". And those climbing statistics are complete bullshit. Imagine someone doing over half a mile with 1/10th of a mile at as much as 40% in less than 2 minutes.. Why don't you tell that to Evenepoel? I'm sure he could find a spot on the team for someone like that. That's about a kilometer at 48 kph. That's fast on an 8% climb. So if you want to believe Strava go right ahead. What sort of Big Brother is that?

Wow, wow, wow. I am not accusing you from anything. I just want to let you know that I can see your rides (if I want to) because that what you asked you f*cking idiot. Now you have it; I lost my temper.

Lou

On Monday, September 26, 2022 at 8:34:02 AM UTC-7, Lou Holtman wrote:
> On Monday, September 26, 2022 at 4:49:01 PM UTC+2, Tom Kunich wrote:
> > On Sunday, September 25, 2022 at 2:31:23 PM UTC-7, Lou Holtman wrote:
> > > On Sunday, September 25, 2022 at 7:20:52 PM UTC+2, Tom Kunich wrote:
> > > > On Sunday, September 25, 2022 at 8:55:42 AM UTC-7, Lou Holtman wrote:
> > > > > On Sunday, September 25, 2022 at 5:35:33 PM UTC+2, Tom Kunich wrote:
> > > > > > On Sunday, September 25, 2022 at 4:57:29 AM UTC-7, Lou Holtman wrote:
> > > > > > > On Saturday, September 24, 2022 at 10:56:40 PM UTC+2, frkr...@gmail.com wrote:
> > > > > > > > On Saturday, September 24, 2022 at 1:44:54 PM UTC-7, Roger Merriman wrote:
> > > > > > > > > Tom Kunich <cycl...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > > > > > > > > On Saturday, September 24, 2022 at 7:46:22 AM UTC-7, Roger Merriman wrote:
> > > > > > > > > >> Tom Kunich <cycl...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > > > > > > > >>>
> > > > > > > > > >>>
> > > > > > > > > >>> After getting them home I pulled the Sciroccos out and mounted the tires
> > > > > > > > > >>> and I had forgotten just how easy it is to mount wire bead tires. Both
> > > > > > > > > >>> tires were mounted and inflated in 10 minutes.
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > That extra weight represents 3 ounces. While racers think that every
> > > > > > > > > > little bit helps real people prefer the easy on and easy off mounting of the metal bead.
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > Can’t say I’ve noticed wire being any easier, neither is particularly
> > > > > > > > > difficult personally.
> > > > > > > > I'm going to take a rare opportunity to agree with Tom on something. IME wire bead tires
> > > > > > > > do tend to be easier to mount than kevlar bead folding tires. And the weight difference
> > > > > > > > is, to me, negligible.
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > Of course, there are tolerances on tire and rim circumference. I suppose with a rim at the
> > > > > > > > lower edge of the tolerance range and a folding tire at the higher end, installation might be
> > > > > > > > perfectly easy.
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > - Frank Krygowski
> > > > > > > Folding tires are more difficult to mount only the first time and that is because they were folded for a long time, not because of the kevlar bead. After initial mounting they mount as easy or as difficult as wire bead tires.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Lou
> > > > > > Typically I have never mounted Gatorskins more than once in their entire wear life.
> > > > > Never had a flat or had a wheel issue that needed a removal of the tire? Remarkable.
> > > > >
> > > > > Lou
> > > > Lou, taking your advice I went back to my Strava account and entered the Garmin data. How do I give you access to it?
> > > I can find you. If you didn’t make your account private I can see you ride. If not I have to ask your permission to follow you. I checked and saw you did a flat 53 km ride yesterday along the airport. Big brother is watching you now.
> > Watching me do what? Do a 40 km ride over 2200 feet of climbing? That doesn't show the sitting around time at the coffee shop does it:? In my Garmin file it only shows average speed and then secondarily "moving speed". And those climbing statistics are complete bullshit. Imagine someone doing over half a mile with 1/10th of a mile at as much as 40% in less than 2 minutes. Why don't you tell that to Evenepoel? I'm sure he could find a spot on the team for someone like that. That's about a kilometer at 48 kph. That's fast on an 8% climb. So if you want to believe Strava go right ahead. What sort of Big Brother is that?
> Wow, wow, wow. I am not accusing you from anything. I just want to let you know that I can see your rides (if I want to) because that what you asked you f*cking idiot. Now you have it; I lost my temper.

Settle down Lou, I'm not accusing you of anything. Didn't I send you a "friend" notice for access to my Strava? I'm saying that what I saw of that Strava sections was total bullshit and not even close to reality. Do you think that some 40 year old guy rode a kilometer including a supposed 15% of that over 30% grade in 2 minutes? The steepest part of that whole climb is 3 miles below that area where you leave Niles Canyon onto Palomares Rd. That may be 15% but it is only 35 meters long. Over the next 2 miles there are a couple of steep parts but nothing over 12%. The section they were showing is a mild climb and I would not be at all surprised if a good young rider could do it in 2 minutes. My 9 minutes only shows that I am merely slogging along after 3 miles of climbing.

I wonder where Strava could ever get the idea that there is a 40% section there;. If I feel like finding my camera I will record that spot where the 40% is claimed and you can get a good laugh. I think that the steepest parts there are a hump from where a new driveway was installed and it isn't 10%.

On Monday, September 26, 2022 at 8:52:50 AM UTC-7, Tom Kunich wrote:
> On Monday, September 26, 2022 at 8:34:02 AM UTC-7, Lou Holtman wrote:
> > On Monday, September 26, 2022 at 4:49:01 PM UTC+2, Tom Kunich wrote:
> > > On Sunday, September 25, 2022 at 2:31:23 PM UTC-7, Lou Holtman wrote:
> > > > On Sunday, September 25, 2022 at 7:20:52 PM UTC+2, Tom Kunich wrote:
> > > > > On Sunday, September 25, 2022 at 8:55:42 AM UTC-7, Lou Holtman wrote:
> > > > > > On Sunday, September 25, 2022 at 5:35:33 PM UTC+2, Tom Kunich wrote:
> > > > > > > On Sunday, September 25, 2022 at 4:57:29 AM UTC-7, Lou Holtman wrote:
> > > > > > > > On Saturday, September 24, 2022 at 10:56:40 PM UTC+2, frkr....@gmail.com wrote:
> > > > > > > > > On Saturday, September 24, 2022 at 1:44:54 PM UTC-7, Roger Merriman wrote:
> > > > > > > > > > Tom Kunich <cycl...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > > > > > > > > > On Saturday, September 24, 2022 at 7:46:22 AM UTC-7, Roger Merriman wrote:
> > > > > > > > > > >> Tom Kunich <cycl...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > > > > > > > > >>>
> > > > > > > > > > >>>
> > > > > > > > > > >>> After getting them home I pulled the Sciroccos out and mounted the tires
> > > > > > > > > > >>> and I had forgotten just how easy it is to mount wire bead tires. Both
> > > > > > > > > > >>> tires were mounted and inflated in 10 minutes.
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > That extra weight represents 3 ounces. While racers think that every
> > > > > > > > > > > little bit helps real people prefer the easy on and easy off mounting of the metal bead.
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > Can’t say I’ve noticed wire being any easier, neither is particularly
> > > > > > > > > > difficult personally.
> > > > > > > > > I'm going to take a rare opportunity to agree with Tom on something. IME wire bead tires
> > > > > > > > > do tend to be easier to mount than kevlar bead folding tires. And the weight difference
> > > > > > > > > is, to me, negligible.
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > Of course, there are tolerances on tire and rim circumference. I suppose with a rim at the
> > > > > > > > > lower edge of the tolerance range and a folding tire at the higher end, installation might be
> > > > > > > > > perfectly easy.
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > - Frank Krygowski
> > > > > > > > Folding tires are more difficult to mount only the first time and that is because they were folded for a long time, not because of the kevlar bead. After initial mounting they mount as easy or as difficult as wire bead tires.
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > Lou
> > > > > > > Typically I have never mounted Gatorskins more than once in their entire wear life.
> > > > > > Never had a flat or had a wheel issue that needed a removal of the tire? Remarkable.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Lou
> > > > > Lou, taking your advice I went back to my Strava account and entered the Garmin data. How do I give you access to it?
> > > > I can find you. If you didn’t make your account private I can see you ride. If not I have to ask your permission to follow you. I checked and saw you did a flat 53 km ride yesterday along the airport. Big brother is watching you now.
> > > Watching me do what? Do a 40 km ride over 2200 feet of climbing? That doesn't show the sitting around time at the coffee shop does it:? In my Garmin file it only shows average speed and then secondarily "moving speed". And those climbing statistics are complete bullshit. Imagine someone doing over half a mile with 1/10th of a mile at as much as 40% in less than 2 minutes. Why don't you tell that to Evenepoel? I'm sure he could find a spot on the team for someone like that. That's about a kilometer at 48 kph. That's fast on an 8% climb. So if you want to believe Strava go right ahead. What sort of Big Brother is that?
> > Wow, wow, wow. I am not accusing you from anything. I just want to let you know that I can see your rides (if I want to) because that what you asked you f*cking idiot. Now you have it; I lost my temper.
> Settle down Lou, I'm not accusing you of anything. Didn't I send you a "friend" notice for access to my Strava? I'm saying that what I saw of that Strava sections was total bullshit and not even close to reality. Do you think that some 40 year old guy rode a kilometer including a supposed 15% of that over 30% grade in 2 minutes? The steepest part of that whole climb is 3 miles below that area where you leave Niles Canyon onto Palomares Rd. That may be 15% but it is only 35 meters long. Over the next 2 miles there are a couple of steep parts but nothing over 12%. The section they were showing is a mild climb and I would not be at all surprised if a good young rider could do it in 2 minutes. My 9 minutes only shows that I am merely slogging along after 3 miles of climbing.
>
> I wonder where Strava could ever get the idea that there is a 40% section there;. If I feel like finding my camera I will record that spot where the 40% is claimed and you can get a good laugh. I think that the steepest parts there are a hump from where a new driveway was installed and it isn't 10%.

Also, maybe I sound irritated all the time because I have an email box full of scams. FedEx wants to deliver a package to me and I have to pay extra charges on it via credit card. Funny that the source of this is a person called "Bigdog" and not FedEx. I get the same sort of thing 10 times a day from wanting me to give them my password to my bank account to sending them money for one reason or another. I don't seem to be able to mark these things as SPAM since when I do, they are back a half hour later and none of my bank messages get through. So please excuse me if I always sound irritated. California no longer has any law enforcement and people drive past the street in front of my house at 60 mph. This after turning a 90 degree right followed by a 90 degree left.

Tom Kunich <cyclintom@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Monday, September 26, 2022 at 8:01:18 AM UTC-7, Roger Merriman wrote:
>> Tom Kunich <cycl...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> On Monday, September 26, 2022 at 4:03:28 AM UTC-7, Roger Merriman wrote:
>>>> Jeff Liebermann <je...@cruzio.com> wrote:
>>>>> On Sun, 25 Sep 2022 22:20:55 -0000 (UTC), Roger Merriman
>>>>> <ro...@sarlet.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Possibly the segments proximity to the dual carriageway is throwing the GPS
>>>>>> tracking as the entire top 10 etc the speed for what is flat road is rather
>>>>>> improbable!
>>>>>
>>>>> Yep. Something is wrong. My guess(tm) is that there's a wheel
>>>>> diameter calibration error with the Garmin Speed Sensor 2 calibration,
>>>>> or rather lack of calibration. The Speed Sensor 2 is suppose to self
>>>>> adjust the wheel diameter against the GPS speed so that both the GPS
>>>>> speed and the Speed Sensor 2 indicated speed are identical. Set
>>>>> "wheel size" to "Auto" and see if the speeds return to sanity:
>>>>>
>>>>> "Calibrating Your Speed Sensor"
>>>>> <https://www8.garmin.com/manuals-apac/webhelp/venusq/EN-SG/GUID-46334ADA-BE27-4B62-8576-5471E79ACD94-8669.html>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>> To be fair others are close as well ie with improbable times so possibly
>>>> some funky world data in Garmin database or Strava.
>>>>
>>>> Maybe disconnect the speed sensor for a while and see if that makes any
>>>> difference Tom?
>>>>
>>>> I have same Garmin and ride off road in woods etc so are more challenging,
>>>> and to the best of my knowledge haven’t had spurious data.
>>>>
>>>> Roger Merriman
>>> If you disconnect the speed and distance sensor of course you get lower
>>> mileage because speed over distance and speed over the ground is
>>> different. There is no actual flat ground.
>>>
>> I’m fairly sure that’s incorrect, the Garmin and indeed Strava or other
>> places use elevation maps ie they don’t just map the world as smooth globe!
>>
>> Roger Merriman.
> I think that you misunderstand me Roger - the ground is up and down
> continuously. Elevation maps only show major changes in elevay9ion
> probably of 10 feet or more. The six inches up and down over 40 km adds
> up to a substantial difference in distance. I think that without the
> sensor my trip to Moraga measures about 23 miles. With the sensor it is 24.9
>
I noticed on the commute a slight deviation in distance, but it’s a older
device or older technology I should say and it’s so slight to be marginal.

You can correct these things see here.

<https://support.strava.com/hc/en-us/articles/216919487-How-Distance-is-Calculated>

Either way some of your rides have poor data.

Roger Merriman

On Monday, September 26, 2022 at 4:14:34 PM UTC-7, Roger Merriman wrote:
> Tom Kunich <cycl...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > On Monday, September 26, 2022 at 8:01:18 AM UTC-7, Roger Merriman wrote:
> >> Tom Kunich <cycl...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >>> On Monday, September 26, 2022 at 4:03:28 AM UTC-7, Roger Merriman wrote:
> >>>> Jeff Liebermann <je...@cruzio.com> wrote:
> >>>>> On Sun, 25 Sep 2022 22:20:55 -0000 (UTC), Roger Merriman
> >>>>> <ro...@sarlet.com> wrote:
> >>>>>
> >>>>>> Possibly the segments proximity to the dual carriageway is throwing the GPS
> >>>>>> tracking as the entire top 10 etc the speed for what is flat road is rather
> >>>>>> improbable!
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Yep. Something is wrong. My guess(tm) is that there's a wheel
> >>>>> diameter calibration error with the Garmin Speed Sensor 2 calibration,
> >>>>> or rather lack of calibration. The Speed Sensor 2 is suppose to self
> >>>>> adjust the wheel diameter against the GPS speed so that both the GPS
> >>>>> speed and the Speed Sensor 2 indicated speed are identical. Set
> >>>>> "wheel size" to "Auto" and see if the speeds return to sanity:
> >>>>>
> >>>>> "Calibrating Your Speed Sensor"
> >>>>> <https://www8.garmin.com/manuals-apac/webhelp/venusq/EN-SG/GUID-46334ADA-BE27-4B62-8576-5471E79ACD94-8669.html>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>> To be fair others are close as well ie with improbable times so possibly
> >>>> some funky world data in Garmin database or Strava.
> >>>>
> >>>> Maybe disconnect the speed sensor for a while and see if that makes any
> >>>> difference Tom?
> >>>>
> >>>> I have same Garmin and ride off road in woods etc so are more challenging,
> >>>> and to the best of my knowledge haven’t had spurious data.
> >>>>
> >>>> Roger Merriman
> >>> If you disconnect the speed and distance sensor of course you get lower
> >>> mileage because speed over distance and speed over the ground is
> >>> different. There is no actual flat ground.
> >>>
> >> I’m fairly sure that’s incorrect, the Garmin and indeed Strava or other
> >> places use elevation maps ie they don’t just map the world as smooth globe!
> >>
> >> Roger Merriman.
> > I think that you misunderstand me Roger - the ground is up and down
> > continuously. Elevation maps only show major changes in elevay9ion
> > probably of 10 feet or more. The six inches up and down over 40 km adds
> > up to a substantial difference in distance. I think that without the
> > sensor my trip to Moraga measures about 23 miles. With the sensor it is 24.9
> >
> I noticed on the commute a slight deviation in distance, but it’s a older
> device or older technology I should say and it’s so slight to be marginal.
>
> You can correct these things see here.
>
> <https://support.strava.com/hc/en-us/articles/216919487-How-Distance-is-Calculated>
>
> Either way some of your rides have poor data.

Mine is getting smarter. I forgot to turn it off after the ride and the drive home on the freeway didn't register but the distance from my driveway, through my backyard and into the computer room did. This was only 0.04 miles so who cares?